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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Training Q&A => Topic started by: Rami on January 12, 2008, 03:13:28 PM
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Can I work out same muscle every other day if resting every day in between? The workouts are high intensity and high reps with low weight. I'm very sore the whole time from the workouts but is there really a reason to wait till it's gone?
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No, yo shouldn't. all muscle groups over lap. when you train chest....your also hitting tris and shoulders. and when you train anything your also hitting abs. unless your trying to bring up a lagging body part. are you thinking of the upper/lower training?? if so, your doing one or two exerise per bodypart. Then it be okay. Your doing three sets per body part at on time.
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when you do a program like HST and you train each body part 2 sets every other day....do you change those two exercises every time you work out or you do the same 2 movements every time?
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when you do a program like HST and you train each body part 2 sets every other day....do you change those two exercises every time you work out or you do the same 2 movements every time?
I rotate movement and rest completely in days between.
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Fundamentally, the answer is yes, you can train every other day.
If you are asking the question, you aren't advanced enough for the answer to be different.
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I am 45 years old and hit the weights pretty heavy...when I do legs it takes me up to a full week to recover...also when I do upper body it takes about three days or so to fully recover...I listen to my body and I try not to work out when I am in any kind of pain...only professional bodybuilders and shmoes on steroids can work out consistently through pain...the average guy has got to get huge amounts of rest in order to go on with their training...the fact is ..the heavier you lift, the more time you need to recover....so it's ironic that the stronger you get, the less you can actually work out...just listen to your body...it knows when you should work out again...the guys on here who claim to work out everyday or every 48 hours are on steroids or are lifting lighter than they should and thereby don't get the soreness which results from lifting to your full potential...
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when you do a program like HST and you train each body part 2 sets every other day....do you change those two exercises every time you work out or you do the same 2 movements every time?
Generally for HST you stick to using the same exercises for the entire duration of the 6 weeks. But i have heard of people using different exercises.
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Why do I have the feeling that Rami only works out Chest and Bi's with a rest day between workouts?
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I suppose it depends what muscle group it is - abs yes, and possibly calves but anything else, no.
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Generally for HST you stick to using the same exercises for the entire duration of the 6 weeks. But i have heard of people using different exercises.
ive never tried it but i will soon...but it just seems only doing two moves isnt enough especially for chest or back you know what im saying?
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ive never tried it but i will soon...but it just seems only doing two moves isnt enough especially for chest or back you know what im saying?
Well i just finished HST, but i did what some feel to be too much volume. I did 2 exercises for each bodypart, as for the same reason you said, i didnt feel that doing 1 exercise for back would be enough, or for chest.
Everyone responds differently. When i said im doing a higher version of HST, most said its too much, but i never felt like i was overtrained, and saw some results in just 6 weeks. Give it a go if you want, the only thing is that the workouts can start to take a long time.
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just curious how long were they taking you and were you supersetting at all or not...and you did 2 workouts for 2 sets on chest and back or everything? and what 2 do you choose for back because there is soo much area to just divide in to upper and lower is really tough...
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almost 2 hrs, probably too long. Sometimes i would start with flat bench, do a set, then do a set of inclines, then do a set of military press, all without rest, one after another. But as the weight gets heavier, you cant really do super sets, you need the rest.
I did 2 exercises for every muscle group, 2 sets per exercise:
CHEST: incline and flat bench
BACK: barbell rows and pulldowns
QUADS: squats and leg press
etc etc
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I really don't like HIT or HST because I feel you don't get enough of a workout...I go into the gym and I try to do 4 exercises, 4 sets each, 16 sets total, or sometimes I will do 20 sets total, then I leave the gym...If you kill yourself, you will not be able to recover soon enough to work out again any time soon...I try to work out 3-4 times a week...no more than that...Natural guys can't work out like those that are juiced.. ;)
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i dont know even though your doing 2 workouts for everything it still doesnt seem like enough...i am planning on trying hst pretty soon but i am skeptical...im not on juice and never will be able to lift like a juicer whatever the hell that means...my routine is pretty much 4 movements with a 5x5 except for back and legs back is like 6 movements supersetting all except for deads and rows still 5x5 and legs are 5x10 for everything it goes chest, back, legs, off, shoulder, arms, legs, off...im not too fond of spending much more then hour and 20 minutes or so at a time plus i read that your test levels start to drop alot a little over an hour...i dont know...i like it so far...
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i dont know even though your doing 2 workouts for everything it still doesnt seem like enough...i am planning on trying hst pretty soon but i am skeptical...im not on juice and never will be able to lift like a juicer whatever the hell that means...my routine is pretty much 4 movements with a 5x5 except for back and legs back is like 6 movements supersetting all except for deads and rows still 5x5 and legs are 5x10 for everything it goes chest, back, legs, off, shoulder, arms, legs, off...im not too fond of spending much more then hour and 20 minutes or so at a time plus i read that your test levels start to drop alot a little over an hour...i dont know...i like it so far...
Well for starters, it is enough. And secondly, thats weight training for you, you gotta try things to see if you like and respond to them. Give HST a go if you want, though it takes a while to set it all out. I just finished my first cycle of HST, and honestly towards the end i didn't really like it. Its a good change to the typical workout, but now ive gone back to my old training style. I might do HST again later on, but for now i need a break from HST.
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yea i wasnt trying to offend you im sure it is enough it just on paper dosnt look like enough but i will give it a go someday soon....im liking what im doing for right now..
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48 hours is not enough bottom line.
overtraining.
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Then how is it possible people progress with 48 hours?
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Saying it's not enough isn't entirely true. Some people have genetically faster recovery and can get by with less than 48 hours rest. That's just the nature of the genetic dice roll. Other people have exogenous testosterone to help them out with their genetic shortcomings ;)
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Also it has to do with age...when I was in my 20's I could recover quickly.....I was working out twice a day for five days a week....I can't do that any more....it's impossible to do at my age as a natural lifter....now you MAY be able to work out every 48 hours IF you work all of your upper body one day then two days later do lower body then continuously repeat every 48 hours....that might work, but I still could not work out like that at my age....and very few people can..it would still be overtraining for most people
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with all that being said i am still planning on trying HST out and see how it works out...
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48 hours is simply not long enough.
you need to rest 48.7581 hours.
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i still cant wrap my head around the HST program...i mean i do 20 sets in one week for chest and im supposed to believe that 9 sets over 5 days is going to spark the same amount of growth?? its taking a huge leap of believing what someone else says..
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48 hours is enough if the soreness is gone. Use that as a guide, hit the muscle once the soreness is gone either 48 or 72 hours later.
This is all controversial, there are many opinions. For example you've got the HIT types who believe that hitting a muscle more than once a week's sacrilege, then you've got others like Vince Basile who think that the best results come from working a muscle while it's still slightly sore. Best to try different approaches for a few months each and compare the effects.
I'm of the belief that recovery's key, which means waiting till the soreness is gone after which time it's good to go right back to it. Assuming as in your case that the muscles are completely rested on off days-a double-split routine can help with this.
Also keep in mind that the duration of the workout makes a difference-if the workout's fairly short but intense it should take less time to recover than a long volume workout. Long workouts aren't needed for size.
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In general, i.e. for the man trying to get big without using steroids but at the same time taking bodybuilding seriously, 48 hours is absolutely ludicrous. And I agree people are different in terms of recovery/on gear etc....
One thing that i think would be very interesting is if people on this board would take a few months in which they drastically increased their rest time between workouts, did less sets and with higher intensity. Just for an experiment. How many of you are the same size as last year, training with the same high volume, 4 days per week? Are you interested in a change? Afraid that if you don't do 20+ sets per workout you will lose your size?
You might feel strange not being in the gym so many times a week for so long, but stick with it.
Do some research on low volume/frequency, high intensity training a la mike mentzer and thank me later. Try it for four months, if anything it will give you new perspective and peace of mind.
Good luck
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DC style is similar and a lot of guys have blown up on it.
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What does Arnold's encyclopedia say? ;D
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48 hours is enough if the soreness is gone. Use that as a guide, hit the muscle once the soreness is gone either 48 or 72 hours later.
This is all controversial, there are many opinions. For example you've got the HIT types who believe that hitting a muscle more than once a week's sacrilege, then you've got others like Vince Basile who think that the best results come from working a muscle while it's still slightly sore. Best to try different approaches for a few months each and compare the effects.
I'm of the belief that recovery's key, which means waiting till the soreness is gone after which time it's good to go right back to it. Assuming as in your case that the muscles are completely rested on off days-a double-split routine can help with this.
Also keep in mind that the duration of the workout makes a difference-if the workout's fairly short but intense it should take less time to recover than a long volume workout. Long workouts aren't needed for size.
Soreness isn't an indicator of recovery.
Recovery time is a function of 'training age', training style, work capacity, nutrition, rest, and other factors. People said the guys who train with Louie Simmons couldn't possibly get stronger and recover, but they do. People cant believe that high level olympic weightlifters squat 6 times a week, but many do. Sheiko training gets people all worked up about recovery, yet somehow it's produced some of the strongest people, ever.
Some bodybuilders swear by their high volume high frequency workouts, training 6 days a week, hitting 'body parts' 2-3 times a week.
From personal experience, 48 hours is about right for a novice. Full recovery could be weeks for someone at an elite level. However, how you can still train while you are recovering as part of a well planned program. Also from personal experience, increasing work capacity reduces DOMS.
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In general, i.e. for the man trying to get big without using steroids but at the same time taking bodybuilding seriously, 48 hours is absolutely ludicrous. And I agree people are different in terms of recovery/on gear etc....
One thing that i think would be very interesting is if people on this board would take a few months in which they drastically increased their rest time between workouts, did less sets and with higher intensity. Just for an experiment. How many of you are the same size as last year, training with the same high volume, 4 days per week? Are you interested in a change? Afraid that if you don't do 20+ sets per workout you will lose your size?
You might feel strange not being in the gym so many times a week for so long, but stick with it.
Do some research on low volume/frequency, high intensity training a la mike mentzer and thank me later. Try it for four months, if anything it will give you new perspective and peace of mind.
Good luck
1/ This is only one point of view, one polar opposite, as i've already pointed out.
2/ The whole steroids argument is overplayed. Yes it does help but is only one factor, which would and should be pointed out by anyone introducing that argument.
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Soreness isn't an indicator of recovery.
Recovery time is a function of 'training age', training style, work capacity, nutrition, rest, and other factors. People said the guys who train with Louie Simmons couldn't possibly get stronger and recover, but they do. People cant believe that high level olympic weightlifters squat 6 times a week, but many do. Sheiko training gets people all worked up about recovery, yet somehow it's produced some of the strongest people, ever.
Some bodybuilders swear by their high volume high frequency workouts, training 6 days a week, hitting 'body parts' 2-3 times a week.
From personal experience, 48 hours is about right for a novice. Full recovery could be weeks for someone at an elite level. However, how you can still train while you are recovering as part of a well planned program. Also from personal experience, increasing work capacity reduces DOMS.
You're speaking in absolute terms, as if you have all the answers when in fact all you have is an opinion. Scary the way you set forth all types of rules when in fact there's nothing set in stone. No one knows for sure, definitely not you putting this stuff down in unequivocal fashion.
Bottom line as i've already pointed out: try each approach as well as any variations in between them that appeal, for a period of time of at least a few months or more each. Then decide for yourself which is best, or rotate periodically between programs that were found to be equally effective. ;D
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Did you even read my post?