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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: War-Horse on February 15, 2008, 08:19:40 AM
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Very simple. Put gas prices at $1.00 a gallon for about 2 yrs. This is how to free up the money in americans pockets. (which right now is none)
If the oil tycoons could do this temporarily, the american money would start to build.
Dropping interest rates will do noting. Giving americans a tax rebate of 3-600 dollars that they have to spend on gasoline anyway will do nothing...
discuss. 8)
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Very simple. Put gas prices at $1.00 a gallon for about 2 yrs. This is how to free up the money in americans pockets. (which right now is none)
If the oil tycoons could do this temporarily, the american money would start to build.
Dropping interest rates will do noting. Giving americans a tax rebate of 3-600 dollars that they have to spend on gasoline anyway will do nothing...
discuss. 8)
So the oil industry should subsidize fuel costs?
Are you willing to take a 50% pay cut to subsidize the economy with whatever line of work you perform?
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Very simple. Put gas prices at $1.00 a gallon for about 2 yrs. This is how to free up the money in americans pockets. (which right now is none)
If the oil tycoons could do this temporarily, the american money would start to build.
Dropping interest rates will do noting. Giving americans a tax rebate of 3-600 dollars that they have to spend on gasoline anyway will do nothing...
discuss. 8)
Oil Tycoons taking it in the rear voluntarily?
And Cheney is a liberal....
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How about cutting some of the gas taxes...many states hit u for 20 plus cents.
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How about cutting some of the gas taxes...many states hit u for 20 plus cents.
.20 wouldnt cut it.
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So the oil industry should subsidize fuel costs?
Are you willing to take a 50% pay cut to subsidize the economy with whatever line of work you perform?
Sorry. Can you explain??
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Sorry. Can you explain??
Why would we need a subsidy? Ozmo is more in line with the reality but....if ther is a way to get me or anyone spending again it would be that filling my car isnt a $100 dollar endevour (just example)
For instance if i filled my car today and it cost $12 total, I may go out and eat and see a movie tonite. But as it is i will do neither and will live on macoroni and cheese.
I think it should be regulated for awhile till we get back on our feet.
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Gas in Mo is about 2.83 right now...cut .20 from the state and thenfigure what Uncle Sam gets and maybe u can get 2 bucks per gal.
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So the oil industry should subsidize fuel costs?
Are you willing to take a 50% pay cut to subsidize the economy with whatever line of work you perform?
The oil industry is one of the most heavily subsidized industries in the US. The US pays billions to support the industry.
"The UCS study, "Money Down the Pipeline: Uncovering the Hidden Subsidies to the Oil Industry" concludes that the oil industry profits from preferential treatment in tax laws and government support. While the non-oil industries are taxed at a rate of 18 percent, the oil industry is taxed at a mere 11 percent. This reduced rate equates to $2 billion in federal corporate income tax benefits per year. They also benefit from low state and local sales tax rates on gasoline, an indirect subsidy exceeding $4 billion a year. Direct government funding of oil and motor vehicle infrastructure and services tops off at $45 billion a year. And taxpayers, not the oil industry, are left to pay the cleanup bill for oil-related health and environmental damage, which could be as high at $232 billion annually." http://www.monitor.net/monitor/10-9-95/oilsubsidy.html
That story is from 13 years ago.
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I fail to see why.....security and some other things maybe but with billions in profit.....does Uncle Sam sub Macdonalds...its the same thing....more shit that needs to be looked at.
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The American Tax Payer is subsidizing the oil companies to the tune of ~ 1 trillion dollars by helping them secure new sources of product (Iraq). A product that will only become more dear and therefore more expensive/valuable.
How about we cut the cost of gas to $1 and pay them the difference in Iraqi oil - all they have to do is go over there and start pumping it
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The oil industry is one of the most heavily subsidized industries in the US. The US pays billions to support the industry.
"The UCS study, "Money Down the Pipeline: Uncovering the Hidden Subsidies to the Oil Industry" concludes that the oil industry profits from preferential treatment in tax laws and government support. While the non-oil industries are taxed at a rate of 18 percent, the oil industry is taxed at a mere 11 percent. This reduced rate equates to $2 billion in federal corporate income tax benefits per year. They also benefit from low state and local sales tax rates on gasoline, an indirect subsidy exceeding $4 billion a year. Direct government funding of oil and motor vehicle infrastructure and services tops off at $45 billion a year. And taxpayers, not the oil industry, are left to pay the cleanup bill for oil-related health and environmental damage, which could be as high at $232 billion annually." http://www.monitor.net/monitor/10-9-95/oilsubsidy.html
That story is from 13 years ago.
Damn I didnt know that we're helping to fund the oil industry so they can screw us in the ass!! They have record profits of billions as the economy goes down the shitter and they are getting money from us to do it.
Thats it Im buying a golf cart to drive. Fuck em all.... ;D
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We give them billions of dollars a year in tax credits.
Last year the Dems attempted to repeal the credits and give them companies doing research into alternative energy sources.
The Senate Repugs put the kibosh on that and the Pres characterized the attempt to repeal the tax credits as a tax increase.
Oh yeah - the credit was equivalent to a whopping 1% of the oil companies net profits.
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How can anyone who is a repug, sleep at nite...??? Gods gonna get them for fucking the little guy. :-X
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And when the dems raise taxes..they'll be sqaushing the liittle guy...honestly my job is generally recession proof...but they have to stop all this bullshit. They also need to stop the foreign subsidies as well...they need to conduct a review and tell most folks we're not giving anymore.
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And when the dems raise taxes..they'll be sqaushing the liittle guy...honestly my job is generally recession proof...but they have to stop all this bullshit. They also need to stop the foreign subsidies as well...they need to conduct a review and tell most folks we're not giving anymore.
Raising taxes is better than the Republican mode of raising revenue--borrowing it from the red Chinese and paying back the amount with interest.
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And when the dems raise taxes..they'll be sqaushing the liittle guy...honestly my job is generally recession proof...but they have to stop all this bullshit. They also need to stop the foreign subsidies as well...they need to conduct a review and tell most folks we're not giving anymore.
You've seen above HH6 that when the dems tried to take some of the tax incentives from the oil companies....bush and admin cried out as a tax increase!!! They fuck us every direction they can!!
You agreed above that these subsidies need to be re evaluated, but the repugs scream a tax raise when the oil tycoons may lose some money from tha american taxpayers.
Literally, we are PAYING them to ruin the economy.
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You have to go back to basics with the economy.
- Need Protectionist Economic Policies....increase dramatically the tariffs on imported goods...raise prices on exported food. Prove once again to the world that the middle-classed, higher-paid worker is the superior worker and that companies should employ this line of reasoning when hiring.
- Get off the Fiat money system and make our currency actually worth something. Make our currency actually backed by a physical commodity rather than a grinning politician. Make our government run like a business, making cuts where necessary, so spending does not get out of control.
- Greatly soften the "Tough on Crime" policy and end human warehousing(we call them prisons and jails). Taking adults out of their communities causes that community to lose a contrubuting economic figure on things minor as simple possession of a controlled substance. Having a criminal record almost guarantees joblessness. Joblessness leads to hopelessness. Having well over 2 million in the prison system becomes burdonesome on the taxpayer who are forced to pay even more for corrections, increased social services, and more law enforcement.
- Trim the bureaucratic fat. We do not need a US Department of Education. It has been shown time and time again that throwing money at schools does not improve them one bit. Children in much poorer countries in much poorer educational surroundings routinely outperform their US counterparts in basic education.
- Greatly reduce or completely eliminate lobbying presence and influence on Capitol Hill. The hundreds of various identity groups(such as NAACP, ADL, Urban League, SPLC, GLAAD) and corporations do not represent even a small fraction of the American people, despite their claims. It is time to make these vultures actually do something productive. They should be there for informational purposes only, and utilized only as such.
- Stop penalizing companies to do business here in the US. Regulations, taxes, and insurance are forcing some to move overseas. Instead of deciding whether to cut or raise taxes, make the damn government learn how to spend it in the first place.
And so much more!
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You have to go back to basics with the economy.
- Need Protectionist Economic Policies....increase dramatically the tariffs on imported goods...raise prices on exported food. Prove once again to the world that the middle-classed, higher-paid worker is the superior worker and that companies should employ this line of reasoning when hiring.
- Get off the Fiat money system and make our currency actually worth something. Make our currency actually backed by a physical commodity rather than a grinning politician. Make our government run like a business, making cuts where necessary, so spending does not get out of control.
- Greatly soften the "Tough on Crime" policy and end human warehousing(we call them prisons and jails). Taking adults out of their communities causes that community to lose a contrubuting economic figure on things minor as simple possession of a controlled substance. Having a criminal record almost guarantees joblessness. Joblessness leads to hopelessness. Having well over 2 million in the prison system becomes burdonesome on the taxpayer who are forced to pay even more for corrections, increased social services, and more law enforcement.
- Trim the bureaucratic fat. We do not need a US Department of Education. It has been shown time and time again that throwing money at schools does not improve them one bit. Children in much poorer countries in much poorer educational surroundings routinely outperform their US counterparts in basic education.
- Greatly reduce or completely eliminate lobbying presence and influence on Capitol Hill. The hundreds of various identity groups(such as NAACP, ADL, Urban League, SPLC, GLAAD) and corporations do not represent even a small fraction of the American people, despite their claims. It is time to make these vultures actually do something productive. They should be there for informational purposes only, and utilized only as such.
- Stop penalizing companies to do business here in the US. Regulations, taxes, and insurance are forcing some to move overseas. Instead of deciding whether to cut or raise taxes, make the damn government learn how to spend it in the first place.
And so much more!
I agree with some of your positions--especially killing off some forms of lobbying and revamping our penal system. I disagree with the ideas of going off the fiat standard, dissolving the Dept. of Education and 'penalizing' businesses doing work in the US.
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The oil industry is one of the most heavily subsidized industries in the US. The US pays billions to support the industry.
"The UCS study, "Money Down the Pipeline: Uncovering the Hidden Subsidies to the Oil Industry" concludes that the oil industry profits from preferential treatment in tax laws and government support. While the non-oil industries are taxed at a rate of 18 percent, the oil industry is taxed at a mere 11 percent. This reduced rate equates to $2 billion in federal corporate income tax benefits per year. They also benefit from low state and local sales tax rates on gasoline, an indirect subsidy exceeding $4 billion a year. Direct government funding of oil and motor vehicle infrastructure and services tops off at $45 billion a year. And taxpayers, not the oil industry, are left to pay the cleanup bill for oil-related health and environmental damage, which could be as high at $232 billion annually." http://www.monitor.net/monitor/10-9-95/oilsubsidy.html
That story is from 13 years ago.
A tax cut is not a subsidy. It may be an unfair advantage to other business, but it is not a subsidy.
A subsidy is stealing from one business/person (collecting taxes) to give money to another.
Yes, big corporations get MANY subsidies and it is not right.
Instead of saying "Hey, lower your prices because you get government money"
People should be PROTESTING "No more government subsidies"
It's like arguing which chickens the fox (government) can eat, when it should not be in the hen house in the first place.
Anytime you use government to FORCE a business to lower prices, the average idiot thinks they are winning... You're not.
You only increase government involvement in areas that it can never manage ie: Supply/Demand, innovation, creating new product and ideas for profit.
Profit is the MAIN reason that everyone of us work. When government steals (taxes, forcing you to lower prices for your good/service), you decrease productivity and increase the incentive to skim other areas and try to get your own "free lunch.
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A tax cut is not a subsidy. It may be an unfair advantage to other business, but it is not a subsidy.
A subsidy is stealing from one business/person (collecting taxes) to give money to another.
Yes, big corporations get MANY subsidies and it is not right.
Instead of saying "Hey, lower your prices because you get government money"
People should be PROTESTING "No more government subsidies"
It's like arguing which chickens the fox (government) can eat, when it should not be in the hen house in the first place.
Anytime you use government to FORCE a business to lower prices, the average idiot thinks they are winning... You're not.
You only increase government involvement in areas that it can never manage ie: Supply/Demand, innovation, creating new product and ideas for profit.
Profit is the MAIN reason that everyone of us work. When government steals (taxes, forcing you to lower prices for your good/service), you decrease productivity and increase the incentive to skim other areas and try to get your own "free lunch.
We've been through this before I think. Taxes are not stealing. Our government is a representative democracy. We need governmental organization. That costs dollars...tax dollars. Does government overreach? Yeah sure.
You overstate the effect of taxes as a disincentive. Did the top marginal income tax rate of 91% deter american businessmen from seeking to make dollars in excess of the 91% bracket back in the 1950s? Hell no.
As long as there is profit to be made, there will be people seeking to make that profit. If some businessmen are dissuaded from producing by the tax code, then I guarantee you they will be replaced by people not so fragile. It's a simple example of the market at work.
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We've been through this before I think. Taxes are not stealing. Our government is a representative democracy. We need governmental organization. That costs dollars...tax dollars. Does government overreach? Yeah sure.
You overstate the effect of taxes as a disincentive. Did the top marginal income tax rate of 91% deter american businessmen from seeking to make dollars in excess of the 91% bracket back in the 1950s? Hell no.
As long as there is profit to be made, there will be people seeking to make that profit. If some businessmen are dissuaded from producing by the tax code, then I guarantee you they will be replaced by people not so fragile. It's a simple example of the market at work.
Agreed. Govt has to be involved in some way. Taxes are needed for this, but when tax breaks are given to corporations who have or will move overseas and leave us holding the bag...that is different.
If you show a profit of 100 billion dollars this year while the country is in a crisis because of your product (Partially) then you dont NEED the break this year.
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Repeal NAFTA...effective immediately.
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Repeal NAFTA...effective immediately.
I remember Ross Perot telling us it would ruin us. Hes right.
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Legalize recreational drugs, prostitution and impose a very heavy tax on both.
Impose a ban on labor unions that are ruining American automakers.
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Legalize recreational drugs, prostitution and impose a very heavy tax on both.
Impose a ban on labor unions that are ruining American automakers.
I think its kinda funny when they strike for $36 dollars an hour, and the company says f-off and leaves the country.... ;D
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How about cutting some of the gas taxes...many states hit u for 20 plus cents.
But gas taxes is how highway construction and maintenance is financed, minus what is syphoned off to fund unrelated things. Better to stop the syphoning and reserve gas taxes for actual road construction and maintenance.
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But gas taxes is how highway construction and maintenance is financed, minus what is syphoned off to fund unrelated things. Better to stop the syphoning and reserve gas taxes for actual road construction and maintenance.
In some states.
What really needs to happen is we need to become more ingrained in politics as in the past, as in the past in terms of our teachers from the 17th Century such as the Dutch, and use the businesses we have as a political driving force for overseas maneuvers. We need to get back to the dealings, that pocket the country instead of deals that go into the pockets of a few, W. changed the way our politics operate in the foreign country side , limiting the power to only a few corporations, instead of giving many the power to "seize" opportunity for US investment, backed by the US Justice Department.
That will be the good thing about a Hillary, or a McCain, more so Hillary since her Husband is like a senator Byrd in the fact he knows so much about past history and how to repeat it.
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Very simple. Put gas prices at $1.00 a gallon for about 2 yrs. This is how to free up the money in americans pockets. (which right now is none)
If the oil tycoons could do this temporarily, the american money would start to build.
Dropping interest rates will do noting. Giving americans a tax rebate of 3-600 dollars that they have to spend on gasoline anyway will do nothing...
discuss. 8)
legalize drugs..and tax the bloody crap out of em...
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Here's what needs to happen: People need to start spending money. They need to see the value in spending even if they don't really have 'enough' to spend, so they will, in the future, then start having enough again. I get so upset sometimes at all the people freaking out over the economy and then holding onto every last dime and eating out of tin cans. If everyone just calmed down and didn't alter their lives so much when things get a little shaky, things would never get this bad as they are now(more than a little shaky, now we're in earthquake territory!). Sorry for being so negative, I was venting.
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Here's what needs to happen: People need to start spending money. They need to see the value in spending even if they don't really have 'enough' to spend, so they will, in the future, then start having enough again. I get so upset sometimes at all the people freaking out over the economy and then holding onto every last dime and eating out of tin cans. If everyone just calmed down and didn't alter their lives so much when things get a little shaky, things would never get this bad as they are now(more than a little shaky, now we're in earthquake territory!). Sorry for being so negative, I was venting.
I don't think you have a clear understanding of what is going on in the US economy.
The spending was not a result of increased production, it was the result of home equity extraction available from housing inflation.
People were spending money they did not have, but were able to get away with it because their homes would continually increase in value.
As an investor, I knew that the housing collapse would rock this economy hard, I was expecting this well over two years ago, back when people thought housing was going to "pick up" or "turn around" by spring time.
America is broke, we have no money to spend, only that which we can borrow. The fact that our government is borrowing money to pass out as "tax rebates" is a good indicator of how broke we are.
Investors were hit hard as well. I was making 23,000 per month in passive income, only to have it reduced to 3,800 per month with a huge debt service to cover as well. I was going to quit my day job - thankfully I did not.
Huge losses to hedge funds as well. I have friends that have lost millions. This is all private investments, not stock in the stockmarket, as that is propped up by government and will come crashing back down as well, so there is more to come.
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I don't think you have a clear understanding of what is going on in the US economy.
The spending was not a result of increased production, it was the result of home equity extraction available from housing inflation.
People were spending money they did not have, but were able to get away with it because their homes would continually increase in value.
As an investor, I knew that the housing collapse would rock this economy hard, I was expecting this well over two years ago, back when people thought housing was going to "pick up" or "turn around" by spring time.
America is broke, we have no money to spend, only that which we can borrow. The fact that our government is borrowing money to pass out as "tax rebates" is a good indicator of how broke we are.
Investors were hit hard as well. I was making 23,000 per month in passive income, only to have it reduced to 3,800 per month with a huge debt service to cover as well. I was going to quit my day job - thankfully I did not.
Huge losses to hedge funds as well. I have friends that have lost millions. This is all private investments, not stock in the stockmarket, as that is propped up by government and will come crashing back down as well, so there is more to come.
Amen brother. 8)
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You are, of course, right. Sorry, I was just venting. You are right.
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You are, of course, right. Sorry, I was just venting. You are right.
Yeah, We're all frustrated. We would love it if there was an easy answer like what conservatives preach, but they have the problem wrongly identified so cannot come up with a solution.
Things will be okay, we just need to be aware of the truth of whats happening, and what to do about it.... 8)