Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: Count Grishnackh on May 17, 2008, 02:05:52 AM
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Upbringing? A sense of fulfillment and inner peace? Fear?
I have to say that alot of the Christians that I know, the ones who hit church semi-regularly, but don't run around quoting scripture, seem to fear what may happen to them if they don't. They're afraid of the alternative when they die.
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I don't know why most people accept Christ as saviour, but I do know why I did:
Peace like nobody and nothing else can give
A new heart
The Holy Spirit
Fellowship with God
Eternal Life
Treasures in Heaven
My reason was never fear, and it shouldn't be. I don't believe that most true Christians accept Jesus Christ as saviour out of fear. I'm no fan of Joel Osteen, but his church, the largest protestant church in the US, is evidence that many Christians are not followers of Jesus Christ out of fear. Joel Osteen does not preach on Hell or eternal punishment. So fear is obviously not what Osteen is using to attract multitudes to Jesus Christ.
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Do you mean joel olsten loco? from houston?
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It's "Osteen"..... you tards ::)
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Yes, I meant Joel Osteen. Sorry! ;D
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It's "Osteen"..... you tards ::)
LOL wow, we hit a nerve did we?
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Upbringing? A sense of fulfillment and inner peace? Fear?
I have to say that alot of the Christians that I know, the ones who hit church semi-regularly, but don't run around quoting scripture, seem to fear what may happen to them if they don't. They're afraid of the alternative when they die.
Aren't you the fruit who posted that "return of the northern gods" bs? What inspired you?
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Yes, I meant Joel Osteen. Sorry! ;D
thats alright, A good friend of mine goes to that church and Im not a big fan of his either more than likely b/c of the way my friend believes everthing this guy says. He takes everything he says as truth and I really dont think he has ever critcally examined his faith at all which is probably why he does that. On a side note another friend of mine told me that he is not an ordained minister/pastor, and on another side not the friend of mine who goes to his church said that he said in some interview that he reps 300 on bench, which i think is freaking hillarious.
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Flying Spaghetti Monster is disappointed in you all.
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Joel Osteen, i read his book and watched him a few times (not religious myself) but I like the guy, and i liked his book, very grounded messages that can inspire people. I feel that this guy is going to do alot of good in the world.
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The Holy Spirit makes them alive!
Ephesians 2:1,8-9
1 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
John 1:12-13
12 But to all who did receive him,
(A) who believed in his name,
(B) he gave the right
(C) to become
(D) children of God,
13 who
(E) were born,
(F) not of blood
(G) nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
Matthew 16:16-1716 Simon Peter replied,
(A) "You are
(B) the Christ,
(C) the Son of
(D) the living God."
17 And Jesus answered him,
(E) "Blessed are you,
(F) Simon Bar-Jonah! For
(G) flesh and blood has not revealed this to you,
(H) but my Father who is in heaven.
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Upbringing? A sense of fulfillment and inner peace? Fear?
I don't know why most people accept Christ as saviour, but I do know why I did:
Peace like nobody and nothing else can give
A new heart
The Holy Spirit
Fellowship with God
Eternal Life
Treasures in Heaven
My reason was never fear, and it shouldn't be. I don't believe that most true Christians accept Jesus Christ as saviour out of fear.
All of the above are reasons imo. But I agree w/loco that most of the believers I know didn't accept Christ out of fear.
Other reasons could include feelings of a need for forgiveness and research into and acceptance of bible prophecy as valid which can result in accepting the bible as truth.
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Because those religious whackos will leave you the fuck alone if you say you do (accept Christ).
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Hmm, I don't see many people in Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan accepting Christ.
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Hmm, I don't see many people in Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan accepting Christ.
Are you in the military BigJ? If so, thank you for serving!
I'm not sure what your meaning is behind your post but one reason you may not "see" a lot of people accepting Christ in those countries is that they may be secretive about it since Christianity is "considered a crime under Afghanistan's shariah laws" and "Fundamentalist Wahhabi Islam is the only expression of religion allowed in Saudi Arabia."
Apparently people are sometimes arrested and tortured etc for coverting to Christianity so some people probably aren't that vocal about it.
Christian convert faces death penalty in Afghanistan
Daniel Cooney in Kabul
The Guardian, Monday March 20 2006
Article history
www.guardian.co.uk/world/2006/mar/20/afghanistan.islam
A man could be sentenced to death after being charged with converting from Islam to Christianity, a crime under Afghanistan's shariah laws, a judge said yesterday. The trial is thought to be the first of its kind in Afghanistan and highlights a struggle between religious conservatives and reformists over what shape Islam will take four years after the fall of the Taliban.
Abdul Rahman, 41, was arrested last month after his family accused him of becoming a Christian, Judge Ansarullah Mawlavezada told Associated Press. The accused was charged with rejecting Islam.
During the one-day hearing on Thursday, the defendant allegedly confessed to converting to Christianity 16 years ago while working as a medical aid worker for an international Christian group helping Afghan refugees in the Pakistani city of Peshawar, Judge Mawlavezada said.
"We are not against any particular religion in the world. But in Afghanistan, this sort of thing is against the law," the judge said. "It is an attack on Islam." He will rule on the case within two months.
Shariah law states that any Muslim who rejects Islam should be sentenced to death, according to Ahmad Fahim Hakim, deputy chairman of the state-sponsored Afghanistan Independent Human Rights Commission. Repeated attempts to impose a jail sentence were barred.
The prosecutor, Abdul Wasi, said he had offered to drop the charges if Mr Rahman converted back to Islam, but he refused. "He would have been forgiven if he changed back. But he said he was a Christian and would always remain one," Mr Wasi said. "We are Muslims and becoming a Christian is against our laws. He must get the death penalty."
A Christian aid worker in Kabul, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said there was no reliable figure for the number of Afghan Christians. He said few admit their faith because of fear of retribution and there are no known Afghan churches. An old house in a war-wrecked suburb of Kabul serves as a Christian place of worship for expatriates. The only other churches are believed to be inside foreign embassies or on bases belonging to the US-led coalition or a NATO peacekeeping force.
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12/17/2004 10:17
saudi arabia
Saudi Christian convert arrested and jailed
http:www/asianews.it/view.php?I=en&art=2134
Jeddah (AsiaNews) – A Saudi citizen converted to Christianity has been arrested and jailed. Emad Alaabadi was taken into custody last November 29, at Hofuf, a town in eastern Saudi Arabia, but the news was reported only a few days ago by the International Christian Concern (ICC), a Washington-based human rights group. AsiaNews local sources have confirmed the report, and also say that he "is not the only Saudi Christian in jail at the moment: there are also others".
According to news obtained by ICC, other Christians – at least 3 or 4 – appear to have been arrested along with Emad. The presence of Christians in Saudi prisons had also been confirmed by Brian O'Connor, in an interview with AsiaNews. Brian Savio O'Connor is a Protestant Indian who was deported from Saudi Arabia after being tortured and held in prison for "having preached Christianity". Upon his return to India, O'Connor told AsiaNews that "there are still many other Christians that need your help in Saudi prisons".
Last November 29, Amad was intercepted by the Muttawa, Saudi religion police, while he was driving his children home from school. The police escorted them home and then took Amad to the local prison. Later he was transferred to Jeddah, were he is currently imprisoned. On December 4, he managed to contact his mother, who lives in Australia, by telephone, to let her know what had happened and where he was. The mother reported that he sounded very weak: ICC said that the Muttawa agents probably tortured the Christian-faith Amad to reconvert him to Islam.
Alaabadi is 30 years old and has 4 children. He became Christian 2 years ago, but it is not known to what denomination he belongs.
Fundamentalist Wahhabi Islam is the only expression of religion allowed in Saudi Arabia. There is no religious freedom in the country, even if Saudi officials have been tolerating the private practice of other religions. However, the Saudi religion police, the Muttawa, continues to persecute Christians in their homes where they meet to pray.
The construction of churches or chapels is not allowed in the country. Muslims make up 93.7% of the Saudi population of 21.6 million people. Christians, who are almost entirely foreigners, account for 3.7% of the population. There are 800,000 Catholics. There are no exact figures on the number of Saudi Christians. (LF)
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Everyone who accepts Jesus as saviour has the perspective that everything in the world falls underneath the importance of Jesus dieing for our sins or is by far less important, therefore people accept Jesus because they are without even one doubt convinced that it is the most important thing for them to do in their lifetime. This is the single reason why we accept, simply because it is the right thing to do from a Christians perspective. If the result brings you inner peace or happiness or causes your fear of death or hell to go away then thats Ok but those aren`t true reasons to accept the lord. Many have lived a life of torment as a Christian without complaint.
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Are you in the military BigJ? If so, thank you for serving!
I'm not sure what your meaning is behind your post but one reason you may not "see" a lot of people accepting Christ in those countries is that they may be secretive about it since Christianity is "considered a crime under Afghanistan's shariah laws" and "Fundamentalist Wahhabi Islam is the only expression of religion allowed in Saudi Arabia."
Apparently people are sometimes arrested and tortured etc for coverting to Christianity so some people probably aren't that vocal about it.
Great post, STella!
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Great post, STella!
Thanks loco! As you probably know there are some ministries that are "clandestine" for lack of a better word. And they need to be so people don't get possibly arrested and/or tortured and/or killed. :(
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Thanks loco! As you probably know there are some ministries that are "clandestine" for lack of a better word. And they need to be so people don't get possibly arrested and/or tortured and/or killed. :(
Yup:
"In more than 40 nations around the world today Christians are being persecuted for their faith. In some of these nations it is illegal to own a Bible, to share your faith Christ, change your faith or teach your children about Jesus. Those who boldly follow Christ—in spite of government edict or radical opposition—can face harassment, arrest, torture and even death. Yet Christians continue to meet for worship and to witness for Christ, and the church in restricted nations is growing."
http://www.prisoneralert.com/vompw_persecution.htm
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Yup:
"In more than 40 nations around the world today Christians are being persecuted for their faith. In some of these nations it is illegal to own a Bible, to share your faith Christ, change your faith or teach your children about Jesus. Those who boldly follow Christ—in spite of government edict or radical opposition—can face harassment, arrest, torture and even death. Yet Christians continue to meet for worship and to witness for Christ, and the church in restricted nations is growing."
http://www.prisoneralert.com/vompw_persecution.htm
Christians love being martyrs for their imaginary friend.
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Christians love being martyrs for their imaginary friend.
I do not love being a martyr, not even for Jesus. But I will be a martyr for Jesus if I have to....if I really have to.
If Christians loved being martyrs, then they wouldn't hide from those who want to kill them in those countries where they are persecuted.
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I do not love being a martyr, not even for Jesus. But I will be a martyr for Jesus if I have to....if I really have to.
If Christians loved being martyrs, then they wouldn't hide from those who want to kill them in those countries where they are persecuted.
Why hide? An eternity of delight and joy in heaven awaits them after this foul mortal coil releases them.
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Why hide? An eternity of delight and joy in heaven awaits them after this foul mortal coil releases them.
Biblical Christianity is not about accepting Christ and then dying. Biblical Christianity is about accepting Christ and then living for Christ as long as possible so that one can spread the Gospel as much as possible and save as many souls as possible. It's more about living for Christ than it is about dying for Christ.
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Biblical Christianity is not about accepting Christ and then dying. Biblical Christianity is about accepting Christ and then living for Christ as long as possible so that one can spread the Gospel as much as possible and save as many souls as possible. It's more about living for Christ than it is about dying for Christ.
This says the man whose name is crazy. :D
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This says the man whose name is crazy. :D
Yes, I am loco. ;D
But my Internet nick name has nothing to do with the truthfulness of what I posted above.
Besides, to the world, especially to people as yourself, all Christians will always be locos. ;D
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Yes, I am loco. ;D
But my Internet nick name has nothing to do with the truthfulness of what I posted above.
Besides, to the world, especially to people as yourself, all Christians will always be locos. ;D
Si, es verdad....
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Si, es verdad....
;D
For our readers
"Si, es verdad" = Yes, it's true.
Deicide likes to speak in tongues and I'm one of his interpreters. ;)
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;D
For our readers
"Si, es verdad" = Yes, it's true.
Deicide likes to speak in tongues and I'm one of his interpreters. ;)
Deseo que podría hablar mejor español pero no es bastante importante que lo aprenda. Por lo menos personalmente; Sin embargo soy seguro que habría muchas más oportunidades profesionales abiertas a mí si estudié español. Pero no tengo gusto simplemente del sonido de la lengua.
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Deseo que podría hablar mejor español pero no es bastante importante que lo aprenda. Por lo menos personalmente; Sin embargo soy seguro que habría muchas más oportunidades profesionales abiertas a mí si estudié español. Pero no tengo gusto simplemente del sonido de la lengua.
I'm impressed! You are doing very well with your Español, especially for someone who doesn't even care to learn it because he doesn't really like the sound of if. You don't like the sound of it, even when a hot Latina is speaking it to you?
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I'm impressed! You are doing very well with your Español, especially for someone who doesn't even care to learn it because he doesn't really like the sound of if. You don't like the sound of it, even when a hot Latina is speaking it to you?
He is speaking in tongues. Ever since "Deicide" got saved, he has been full of the Holy Spirit.
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He is speaking in tongues. Ever since "Deicide" got saved, he has been full of the Holy Spirit.
I see. So he's Pentecostal now. :)
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I'm impressed! You are doing very well with your Español, especially for someone who doesn't even care to learn it because he doesn't really like the sound of if. You don't like the sound of it, even when a hot Latina is speaking it to you?
No, Spanish sounds like the chattering of teeth, clack, clack, clack; however Latin American Spanish sounds infinitely better than Castillian Spanish, which is absolutely horrid.
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No, Spanish sounds like the chattering of teeth, clack, clack, clack; however Latin American Spanish sounds infinitely better than Castillian Spanish, which is absolutely horrid.
I agree. Latin Americans find the sound of Castillian Spanish to be horrid too, while Castillian Spanish speakers argue that theirs is the "proper" Spanish.
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I agree. Latin Americans find the sound of Castillian Spanish to be horrid too, while Castillian Spanish speakers argue that theirs is the "proper" Spanish.
Similar a la relación entre el inglés inglés y americano británico, el español latinoamericano es en muchos aspectos más arcaico que el español de España. Podría comenzar a hablar técnicalamente en términos fonéticos pero eso confundiría solamente. Intentaré explicar un ejemplo simplemente. El sonido particular “c” ha cambiado en posiciones entre las vocales en español de Castillia mientras que ha conservado su valor original, más viejo en español latinoamericano. El ejemplo famoso es “Barcelona”. Sabe de lo que estoy hablando.
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Similar a la relación entre el inglés inglés y americano británico, el español latinoamericano es en muchos aspectos más arcaico que el español de España. Podría comenzar a hablar técnicalamente en términos fonéticos pero eso confundiría solamente. Intentaré explicar un ejemplo simplemente. El sonido particular “c” ha cambiado en posiciones entre las vocales en español de Castillia mientras que ha conservado su valor original, más viejo en español latinoamericano. El ejemplo famoso es “Barcelona”. Sabe de lo que estoy hablando.
Si, I know what you are talking about, though you know more about the technical stuff behind it than I do. Latin Americans joke that in Spain, Superman is more like Zuperman...which in English would sound more like Thuperman. In Spain, he has a Z on his chest. It sounds as if they pronounce the "s" and "c" as "z" many times.
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Si, I know what you are talking about, though you know more about the technical stuff behind it than I do. Latin Americans joke that in Spain, Superman is more like Zuperman...which in English would sound more like Thuperman. In Spain, he has a Z on his chest. It sounds as if they pronounce the "s" and "c" as "z" many times.
Word.
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I don't know why most people accept Christ as saviour, but I do know why I did:
Peace like nobody and nothing else can give
A new heart
The Holy Spirit
Fellowship with God
Eternal Life
Treasures in Heaven
My reason was never fear, and it shouldn't be. I don't believe that most true Christians accept Jesus Christ as saviour out of fear. I'm no fan of Joel Osteen, but his church, the largest protestant church in the US, is evidence that many Christians are not followers of Jesus Christ out of fear. Joel Osteen does not preach on Hell or eternal punishment. So fear is obviously not what Osteen is using to attract multitudes to Jesus Christ.
loco, at what stage in your life did you accept Christ as your saviour?
Was it a natural progression from religious beliefs instilled during your upbringing? A traumatic or life altering experience that you had? An epiphany?
I don't think hell or eternal punishment has to be preached for even the most casual religious follower to understand that it comes with the choice. Of course fear isn't the the reason someone should be a Christian, but I think the fear of the alternative is a pretty good motivator for those without alot of true conviction.
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All of the above are reasons imo. But I agree w/loco that most of the believers I know didn't accept Christ out of fear.
Other reasons could include feelings of a need for forgiveness and research into and acceptance of bible prophecy as valid which can result in accepting the bible as truth.
STella, at what point in your life did you become a Christian? Was there any particular incident, motivating factor or perhaps an influence that played a part in your choice?
Of course if it's personal you don't have to share, but I'm curious :)
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loco, at what stage in your life did you accept Christ as your saviour?
Was it a natural progression from religious beliefs instilled during your upbringing? A traumatic or life altering experience that you had? An epiphany?
I don't think hell or eternal punishment has to be preached for even the most casual religious follower to understand that it comes with the choice. Of course fear isn't the the reason someone should be a Christian, but I think the fear of the alternative is a pretty good motivator for those without alot of true conviction.
I was at a stage in my life where everything was fine. I was about 15 years old, had everything I ever needed and most of what I wanted. Had already reached two major goals in my life.
I would say it was in part a progression from reading the book of Proverbs and putting into practice what I was reading and learning, and observing the results in my own life. It was in part a result of my parents' great example. It was in part a result of watching my oldest brother change from night to day after accepting Christ as savior. And finally, it was in part an epiphany.
Jesus himself warned people about hell, but he did not mention hell all the time or use it to scare people into accepting him. Hell should not be used to scare people into accepting Christ, only as a warning.
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STella, at what point in your life did you become a Christian? Was there any particular incident, motivating factor or perhaps an influence that played a part in your choice?
Of course if it's personal you don't have to share, but I'm curious :)
I'm unsure if I had been saved at a young age but then fell away....or if it was when I clearly remember accepting Christ as Savior as an adult. I'm pretty sure I didn't get saved until I was an adult because the change in my behavior and thinking was pretty dramatic after trusting Christ.
I eventually accepted Christ as Savior after becoming interested in end-time prophecy stuff. I had never heard of "the 2nd Coming" (that I could remember) and it was extremely interesting to me. After looking more into biblical prophecy-not only end times stuff but other things like how Jesus fits Messianic prophecies...His birth, life, death etc...- I came to accept the bible as true and Christ as Savior.
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I eventually accepted Christ as Savior after becoming interested in end-time prophecy stuff. I had never heard of "the 2nd Coming" (that I could remember) and it was extremely interesting to me.
STella, do you feel that all the prophecies have been fulfilled and rapture could take place at any moment, or do you believe there are still some that have not yet taken place?
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I was at a stage in my life where everything was fine. I was about 15 years old, had everything I ever needed and most of what I wanted. Had already reached two major goals in my life.
I would say it was in part a progression from reading the book of Proverbs and putting into practice what I was reading and learning, and observing the results in my own life. It was in part a result of my parents' great example. It was in part a result of watching my oldest brother change from night to day after accepting Christ as savior. And finally, it was in part an epiphany.
Jesus himself warned people about hell, but he did not mention hell all the time or use it to scare people into accepting him. Hell should not be used to scare people into accepting Christ, only as a warning.
I'm unsure if I had been saved at a young age but then fell away....or if it was when I clearly remember accepting Christ as Savior as an adult. I'm pretty sure I didn't get saved until I was an adult because the change in my behavior and thinking was pretty dramatic after trusting Christ.
I eventually accepted Christ as Savior after becoming interested in end-time prophecy stuff. I had never heard of "the 2nd Coming" (that I could remember) and it was extremely interesting to me. After looking more into biblical prophecy-not only end times stuff but other things like how Jesus fits Messianic prophecies...His birth, life, death etc...- I came to accept the bible as true and Christ as Savior.
Thanks for sharing :) You two aren't the only Christians on the board are you? ??? ;D
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Biblical Christianity is not about accepting Christ and then dying. Biblical Christianity is about accepting Christ and then living for Christ as long as possible so that one can spread the Gospel as much as possible and save as many souls as possible. It's more about living for Christ than it is about dying for Christ.
excellent point
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excellent point
I thought Biblical Christianity was about this:
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z25/Todesfick/l_99e9b56709a01c818e4693fa4e39a092.jpg)
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STella, do you feel that all the prophecies have been fulfilled and rapture could take place at any moment,
Yes.
Count, have you ever thought about what your reaction/thoughts would be if the rapture occurred during your lifetime?
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Yes.
Count, have you ever thought about what your reaction/thoughts would be if the rapture occurred during your lifetime?
It will be blamed on UFOs, and the stage is now being set up for that:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2897755#msg2897755
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2898320#msg2898320
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It will be blamed on UFOs, and the stage is now being set up for that:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2897755#msg2897755
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2898320#msg2898320
I always thought that too.
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Have you guys heard the theories of UFOs being not necessarily life from other planets but demonic?
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Have you guys heard the theories of UFOs being not necessarily life from other planets but demonic?
Do you have any related links to this subject; sounds interesting.
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Have you guys heard the theories of UFOs being not necessarily life from other planets but demonic?
No, but doesn't this sound a lot like it?
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2898320#msg2898320
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The Rapture? Are you guys for real? :o The rapture isn't even in the Bible and is a rather late creation of Christian nutcases.
Why do people like you reject science when it comes to your magic book and fictional fertility god and embrace it when it comes to all the amenities of life that science has granted you?
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The Rapture? Are you guys for real? :o The rapture isn't even the Bible and is a rather late creation of Christian nutcases.
Why do people like you reject science when it comes to your magic book and fictional fertility god and embrace it when it comes to all the amenities of life that science has granted you?
SILENCE
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No, but doesn't this sound a lot like it?
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=209460.msg2898320#msg2898320
Very interesting loco!
Do you have any related links to this subject; sounds interesting.
So as not to hijack The Count's thread I will make a new thread on this.
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Count, have you ever thought about what your reaction/thoughts would be if the rapture occurred during your lifetime?
Forsaken ;D
How would you feel if you were left behind with us STella?
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The Rapture? Are you guys for real? :o The rapture isn't even in the Bible and is a rather late creation of Christian nutcases.
Why do people like you reject science when it comes to your magic book and fictional fertility god and embrace it when it comes to all the amenities of life that science has granted you?
For the same reason you keep consuming dairy products and eating chicken breasts, despite the fact that guy responsible for the vaccines and processes that make them safe to consume was a Christian man (who dismantled the fictional concept known as "spontaneous generation").
And, as Loco and I have reminded you (more times than the law allows), scientific discoveries (i.e. those in archaeology) have confirmed, on multiple occasions, the existence of people and places (which were, at one point, documented almost exclusively in the Bible) that non-believers like you swore up and down didn't exist.
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Forsaken ;D
How would you feel if you were left behind with us STella?
I'd be freaked out!
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For the same reason you keep consuming dairy products and eating chicken breasts, despite the fact that guy responsible for the vaccines and processes that make them safe to consume was a Christian man (who dismantled the fictional concept known as "spontaneous generation").
And, as Loco and I have reminded you (more times than the law allows), scientific discoveries (i.e. those in archaeology) have confirmed, on multiple occasions, the existence of people and places (which were, at one point, documented almost exclusively in the Bible) that non-believers like you swore up and down didn't exist.
Total non-sequitur and totally irrelevant what he believed; he was doing science irrespective of his religious beliefs.
No Abraham, No Moses, No Exodus, Not Davidic Empire....etc...not doing too well there.
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science and religion are not at odds with each other.
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science and religion are not at odds with each other.
Exactly!!!
Total non-sequitur and totally irrelevant what he believed; he was doing science irrespective of his religious beliefs.
No Abraham, No Moses, No Exodus, Not Davidic Empire....etc...not doing too well there.
Try that again!! It's that archaeology thing again, starting with the works of Josephus. And, though I don't have it off the top of my head, Loco has displayed, on multiple occasions, the historical/archaeological find confirming the existence of King David.
As for Pasteur, he was indeed doing science. And it was his scientific workings that proved that the evolutionary tenet of spontaneous generation was a bust, much to the chagrin of materialistic/naturalistic scientists.
The overall point, of course, is there is no rejecting of science, when it relates to the Bible, despite your loaded (and woefully ill-worded) question to the contrary. Science is simply the study of natural phenomena. Simply put, it's studying God's world, using His scientific rules and principles, and discovering things that He already knows.
Christians have been charged with healing the sick, clothing the naked, feeding the hungry, etc. Scientific discoveries are simply another way to meet that end.
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I'd be freaked out!
Don't worry, we'll all still be right here on getbig.
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Don't worry, we'll all still be right here on getbig.
I think some might be missing.
I'll miss you.....and the grebra that is al ;D
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and the grebra that is al ;D
He's going to the same place you are, wherever that is. I plan on becoming stardust once again.
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For the same reason you keep consuming dairy products and eating chicken breasts, despite the fact that guy responsible for the vaccines and processes that make them safe to consume was a Christian man (who dismantled the fictional concept known as "spontaneous generation").
And, as Loco and I have reminded you (more times than the law allows), scientific discoveries (i.e. those in archaeology) have confirmed, on multiple occasions, the existence of people and places (which were, at one point, documented almost exclusively in the Bible) that non-believers like you swore up and down didn't exist.
Are you even willing to admit that Christianity and your belief are based on faith? Or do you claim that Christianity and your faith are based on fact?
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Are you even willing to admit that Christianity and your belief are based on faith? Or do you claim that Christianity and your faith are based on fact?
It's based on both, something I've mentioned multiple times before. This isn't (and never has been) an "either/or" scenario.
NEXT!!!
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It's based on both, something I've mentioned multiple times before. This isn't (and never has been) an "either/or" scenario.
NEXT!!!
Both...really? What are the facts? The single most important 'fact' is that the creator fo the universe bore himself a son in Iron Age Palestine (and not informing the rest of the world of this (China, Amazon Basin, Australia, North America, Scandinavia, etc.) and this son (who is also the creator of the universe) performed many miracles and rose bodily from the dead...if believing that is not faith, then I don't know what is.... ::)
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Both...really? What are the facts? The single most important 'fact' is that the creator fo the universe bore himself a son in Iron Age Palestine (and not informing the rest of the world of this (China, Amazon Basin, Australia, North America, Scandinavia, etc.) and this son (who is also the creator of the universe) performed many miracles and rose bodily from the dead...if believing that is not faith, then I don't know what is.... ::)
What's your point, considering that you believe in a bunch of mess that you've never seen, that has never been documented, and that CANNOT be observed or replicated (i.e., that whole spontaneous generation thing, again).
It sounds quite similar to the same philosophical woes that one George Wald had.
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What's your point, considering that you believe in a bunch of mess that you've never seen, that has never been documented, and that CANNOT be observed or replicated (i.e., that whole spontaneous generation thing, again).
It sounds quite similar to the same philosophical woes that one George Wald had.
Evolution is extremely well documented.
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Evolution is extremely well documented.
So, provide the documentation that shows the environment, that turned non-living matter (unguided and unmolested) into living matter, with sample living critters, ACTUALLY SEEN BY SCIENTISTS, THEMSELVES.
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So, provide the documentation that shows the environment, that turned non-living matter (unguided and unmolested) into living matter, with sample living critters, ACTUALLY SEEN BY SCIENTISTS, THEMSELVES.
Abiogenesis has nothing to do with evolution. You consistently fail to understand that.
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Abiogenesis has nothing to do with evolution. You consistently fail to understand that.
and science and religion arent at odds with each other something you consistenly fail to understand as well.
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and science and religion arent at odds with each other something you consistenly fail to understand as well.
No, they are at odds with each other.
Science requires dispassionate analysis, experimentation, massive peer review, observation and repeatability; you win points in science by proving yourself wrong.
Religion requires dogma, authority, doctrine and tradition; its claims cannot be analysed dispassionately; no experimentation is possible; there is no peer review of say, the doctrine of the Trinity; no one has observed anything even resembling a miracle (as they are described in the Bibical fairy tales) and those alleged miracles are not repeatable.
In summary, religion thrives on superstition, authoritarianism, tradition and dogma; science thrives on the opposite.
They are in total opposition to each other as a manner of thinking and understanding the world. (Though one could cast doubts on 'thinking and understanding' in the same sentence as religion as being oxymoronic).
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No, they are at odds with each other.
Science requires dispassionate analysis, experimentation, massive peer review, observation and repeatability; you win points in science by proving yourself wrong.
Religion requires dogma, authority, doctrine and tradition; its claims cannot be analysed dispassionately; no experimentation is possible; there is no peer review of say, the doctrine of the Trinity; no one has observed anything even resembling a miracle (as they are described in the Bibical fairy tales) and those alleged miracles are not repeatable.
In summary, religion thrives on superstition, authoritarianism, tradition and dogma; science thrives on the opposite.
They are in total opposition to each other as a manner of thinking and understanding the world. (Though one could cast doubts on 'thinking and understanding' in the same sentence as religion as being oxymoronic).
If science requires the above where exactly does evolution fit in, you can't possibly believe that evolution has been observed, experimented with or repeated for that matter
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If science requires the above where exactly does evolution fit in, you can't possibly believe that evolution has been observed, experimented with or repeated for that matter
We observe evolution within bacteria all the time. No, in real science there is no such thing as micro- and macroevolution. Other forms of observation included the fossil record, which supports many transitional forms, etc.
All you have is an ancient book, written by numerous different authors, espousing fairy tales...
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No, they are at odds with each other.
Science requires dispassionate analysis, experimentation, massive peer review, observation and repeatability; you win points in science by proving yourself wrong.
Religion requires dogma, authority, doctrine and tradition; its claims cannot be analysed dispassionately; no experimentation is possible; there is no peer review of say, the doctrine of the Trinity; no one has observed anything even resembling a miracle (as they are described in the Bibical fairy tales) and those alleged miracles are not repeatable.
In summary, religion thrives on superstition, authoritarianism, tradition and dogma; science thrives on the opposite.
They are in total opposition to each other as a manner of thinking and understanding the world. (Though one could cast doubts on 'thinking and understanding' in the same sentence as religion as being oxymoronic).
LOL you pointed out that the basis of the two are different but not how they conflict with each other???
how does believing in evolution contradict believing in God
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LOL you pointed out that the basis of the two are different but not how they conflict with each other???
how does believing in evolution contradict believing in God
Well, first tell me what you mean by 'belief in god' and I will answer the the question. I pointed out how typical religion DOES conflict with science; if you are a deist, then I see no real conflict.
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Well, first tell me what you mean by 'belief in god' and I will answer the the question. I pointed out how typical religion DOES conflict with science; if you are a deist, then I see no real conflict.
hahaha well thats a good question, i would consider myself a christian although some might not consider me one and i can see why some wouldnt b/c i can see a reasoning towards deism. But lets just say that i am a christian for all intents and purposes.
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hahaha well thats a good question, i would consider myself a christian although some might not consider me one and i can see why some wouldnt b/c i can see a reasoning towards deism. But lets just say that i am a christian for all intents and purposes.
Well, I would say this is definitely in conflict with science:
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z25/Todesfick/l_99e9b56709a01c818e4693fa4e39a092.jpg)
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Well, I would say this is definitely in conflict with science:
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z25/Todesfick/l_99e9b56709a01c818e4693fa4e39a092.jpg)
lol you keep side stepping the issue bro...
first off thats a very literal view of the happenings of the bible...again pls explain to me how believing in evolution conflicts with believing in God?????????????
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lol you keep side stepping the issue bro...
first off thats a very literal view of the happenings of the bible...again pls explain to me how believing in evolution conflicts with believing in God?????????????
Literal? That is exactly what Christianity professes. Which god do you mean? Zeus? Apollo? Odin? Tyr? Dagda?
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Abiogenesis has nothing to do with evolution. You consistently fail to understand that.
Yes, it does. Something (or Someone) is responsible for the alleged 5-billion-year-old "goo" coming to be (if you believe in evolution, that is).
That's the reason you (and most other evolutionists) duck the question. Much like George Wald, you've come to a philosophical brick wall. You can't prove scientifically that "spontaneous generation" occured. Yet, you must BELIEVE that it did. Otherwise, you are forced to concede that a supernatural act is responsible for life on this planet.
Well, first tell me what you mean by 'belief in god' and I will answer the the question. I pointed out how typical religion DOES conflict with science; if you are a deist, then I see no real conflict.
Religion does NOT conflict with science. It only conflict with your materalistic/naturalistic slant on it. Science is simply the study of natural phenomena. You can do such with the premise that there is a God (as Creationists do). Or, you can do such with the premise that there is no God (as many evolutionists do).
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Literal? That is exactly what Christianity professes. Which god do you mean? Zeus? Apollo? Odin? Tyr? Dagda?
first off, christianity says your soul will "live" forever even if you dont accept Christ, so no
second, the evil force will still be there even if you accept Christ as your lord and savior, so no
third, have you ever heard of exaggeration or a skewed viewpoint...the bible is written and translated by MAN so there for it is not likely exactly how it was thousands of years ago
Fourth, what says that God didnt create Adam as a single celled organism and that God creating Eve by using one of Adams rib wasnt that cell's reproduction of itself???
Again you side stepped the issue!
Pls explain to me how believing in evolution conflicts believing in God?