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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 02:25:08 PM

Title: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 02:25:08 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.



Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: bigmc on July 26, 2008, 02:28:14 PM
i dont give a fuck if anyone is natural or not

however,

i think the supplement industry exploits the naivety of people when they start training

by selling a myth  - which is wrong
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 02:30:00 PM
i dont give a fuck if anyone is natural or not

however,

i think the supplement industry exploits the naivety of people when they start training

by selling a myth  - which is wrong

Agreed. I have more respect for a supplemet company selling a pro steroid thats works than someone selling a magic potion that supposedly 6543% better than Dbol.  ::)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: technokc on July 26, 2008, 02:34:21 PM
I see your point and it does suck to be lied too, but such is life.  It happens all the time and people fall for far worse scams than "you can look like me if you train hard".  How many idiots fall for get rich scams, or fat guys picking up a book telling him "he too can get women by following said authors plan".

In the long run we all figure it out, I will never look like a pro, and yes, at one point I believed all the bullshit too.  I guess my point is that it helps you grow as a person, and the people who never figure it out, well, life has a way of weeding out those types doesn't it?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Method101 on July 26, 2008, 02:39:01 PM
Cartoons on TV also give younger people way too high expectations.. when i was really young i thought that i could get to look like heman just by training for years lol.
 ;D

People underestimate the diffrence drugs make, mainly because assholes like Arnold come out saying things like "I was only experimenting with steroids back in the day when they were legal, no bodybuilders use them now".
 :D
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: chris faildo on July 26, 2008, 02:42:49 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.




Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 02:45:19 PM
Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo

I was not reffering to you or anyone imparticular. I said that in my post, but maybe you didn't see that part.  It's in the first sentence. It's not alway all about Chris.  ;)    Unless you are feeling singled out for some odd reason.

Just wanted to add this: you are acutally pretty small and that is not a put down, so if you are using, it doesn't really show.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: gordiano on July 26, 2008, 02:46:20 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.





Great post, Dis. As I've said before, it's a shame so many go around making silly claims, when in most cases the "use" is obvious.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: candidizzle on July 26, 2008, 02:48:22 PM
Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo
hahahhahahahhaha


self owning    ;D    ;D


you have zero self irony, or sense of basic psychology, huh ???



 
 
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: warrior_code on July 26, 2008, 02:52:35 PM
Agreed. I have more respect for a supplemet company selling a pro steroid thats works than someone selling a magic potion that supposedly 6543% better than Dbol.  ::)

Isn't the whole point of pro bbing to sell supplements which simply don't live up to their claims? 
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 02:54:15 PM
Isn't the whole point of pro bbing to sell supplements which simply don't live up to their claims? 

For the most part, but some companies actually care about selling something that works, although they are few.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Van_Bilderass on July 26, 2008, 02:54:29 PM
Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo

Go take some more Triacana and then claim to be drug free  ::)

Pathetic.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: CT_Muscle on July 26, 2008, 02:55:39 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.





The best is when you see someone enter a contest, lets say a musclemania show. And they are clearly on the shit. This happened near me not too long ago and the guy won his class I think and not the overall. Imagine that, I would feel like the biggest loser entering a drug tested contest when I am clearly "on", only to not win  ;D

I'm sure there are lots of guys in those contests that use, but they aren't very big, which gives me the impression they aren't takin higher doses.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: warrior_code on July 26, 2008, 02:58:39 PM
For the most part, but some companies actually care about selling something that works, although they are few.

Very weird to hear it coming from a guy who is actually involved in pro bbing. 
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: whateva on July 26, 2008, 02:59:49 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.




Good post ,Disgusted
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 03:05:44 PM
Very weird to hear it coming from a guy who is actually involved in pro bbing. 

Why?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: SquatAss on July 26, 2008, 03:08:04 PM
Epic stating the obvious.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: warrior_code on July 26, 2008, 03:11:43 PM
Why?

These aspects of deception are usually in the realm of "hush hush."  Especially from those who know it.  I guess you have no stake in it either way so props.  Unfortunately, this reality transcends far more then just sports supplements.  Some people still think salicylic acid actually works in acne treatment and continue to spend their money on it::). 
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: crg on July 26, 2008, 03:13:04 PM
Michael Lockett is natural  ;)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: MAXX on July 26, 2008, 03:15:01 PM
yes, great post!

i have noticed that most of the guys that come on here on getbig and lie about their drug use is the ones that compete in muscle mania.


www.musclemania.com

drug tested federation  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Ex Coelis on July 26, 2008, 03:15:19 PM
Dennis Wolf is pretty good for a natural

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=224359.0;attach=262856;image)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 03:15:37 PM
These aspects of deception are usually in the realm of "hush hush."  Especially from those who know it.  I guess you have no stake in it either way so props.  Unfortunately, this reality transcends far more then just sports supplements.  Some people still think salicylic acid actually works in acne treatment and continue to spend their money on it::). 

I see what you mean, but like I said in my post there are a lot of pros who just don't comment. I can respect the fact that they don't try and deceive people. Now, if any pro would be asked on TV if he was a steroid user then by all means say no. No reason to admit to illegal drug use. Thanks for the props.  :)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: timfogarty on July 26, 2008, 03:29:28 PM
People underestimate the diffrence drugs make, mainly because assholes like Arnold come out saying things like "I was only experimenting with steroids back in the day when they were legal, no bodybuilders use them now".

please provide a quote.  Arnold has been rather honest about his drug use while competing, usually saying "but they were legal back then".   Not so honest about his drug use during his movie career. 
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: XXXII/LX on July 26, 2008, 03:45:05 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.





 ::) In particular.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Brutal_1 on July 26, 2008, 03:59:48 PM





A "Natural" bodybuilder: a bodybuilder that does not respond well to drugs.  ;)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: flexingtonsteele on July 26, 2008, 04:11:41 PM
I debated with myself whether to post this or not. I am not actually referring to anyone imparticular with this post although I'm sure that I am not going to make any new friends with this post. Personally I have no problems with someone using or even abusing steroids for the matter. To each his own as far as I'm concerned. The real problem that I do have is when someone who takes steroids claims to be natural. Now, I actually have no problem if Ronnie Coleman claims that he is natural. He was a cop so I can understand if he says that, but even Ronnie never went around making claims about getting to his size without drugs. He was a cop and he said he was clean and that was the end of it. I'm sure he never intended for anyone to believe him, but it needed to be said for obvious reason.

There are too many guys out there who believe just about anything that some of these guys say. It pisses me off when someone who obviously is on steroids goes around claiming that their kind of physique is attainable without drugs. When I was 18 I believed all the bullshit too. I spun my wheels for years believing that I could look like the pros without drugs. Don't get me wrong, a lot of people can look pretty damn good with training and strict dieting, but there is a limit! I am not saying that anyone should use. What I am saying is that no one should have smoke blown up their ass by being told that they can look at certain way without drugs. Can you imagine being told by your favorite bber who is on drugs, that he is drug free and if  you work hard like him  ::) you could be big like him too? I had the same thing happen to me, but fortunately for me an old and wiser friend of mine went up to this guy and pretty much tore him an new one for lying to me. He did this on the side without my knowledge but later I found out. Talk about a let down. When you are young and impressionable you tend to hang on to every word that you are hearing from your idol.

There is a lot of debate about who is natural or not on the board now. Here is a general rule of thumb to get a very good idea as to whether or not someone is using any type of hormone either over the counter or not. Go into google and search for some pics of guys who were bodybuilders before steroids where invented and there you will find your answer. Now, someone of these guys were not as lean as todays guys, but some actually were. No where will you see anyone who is close to being as big as anyone of these guys today.

The only reason I am posting this is because I actually give a shit about some of you guys on here, OK very few.  ;D I just hate to see guys have unrealistic expectations. Now, before anyone comes in here to dispute what I have said think about it first. I have been around a long time and I say as humbly as I can that I know my shit, at least enough to be able to comment on this stuff.





Very good post Jim, i myself have been delusional about whats natural or not. But after talking with you, its something that i cant lose sleep over, and ill use myself as the bar for what can be attained natural or not :)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Ex Coelis on July 26, 2008, 04:15:26 PM
I would argue that this is unnatural

Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: MP on July 26, 2008, 04:23:00 PM
I would argue that this is unnatural



Holy crap. Hopefully they are both sterilized.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: affy on July 26, 2008, 04:35:22 PM
great post man.  Im just curious.  Can you post a picture of a bodybuilder of today who you think is the absolute natural limit in terms of development.  Someone who you are 99.9% sure is natural. 

Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: knny187 on July 26, 2008, 04:41:23 PM
does natural mean "always" or "currently"?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: bodybuilder1234 on July 26, 2008, 05:12:06 PM
does natural mean "always" or "currently"?


wondering this myself

What if a guy gets on a cycle, quits then goes natural....is he considered natural?
Will his limit for muscle mass still remain despite previous steriod use?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: CalvinH on July 26, 2008, 05:12:27 PM
I'm drug free but I do love teh booze :)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Ex Coelis on July 26, 2008, 05:17:26 PM

wondering this myself

What if a guy gets on a cycle, quits then goes natural....is he considered natural?
Will his limit for muscle mass still remain despite previous steriod use?

he can be 'clean' but he will never be 'natural'
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: knny187 on July 26, 2008, 05:27:39 PM
he can be 'clean' but he will never be 'natural'

& my answer to that is....who cares?

people just need to do what makes them happy & only be concerned with what you feel or what makes you happy.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Disgusted on July 26, 2008, 05:41:36 PM
It would be almost impossible to define the term natural and the same to tell if someone is or ever has used. I have seen plenty of guy who look like crap and use. Now, it is much easier to be able to tell if someone is using.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: mazrim on July 26, 2008, 05:57:22 PM
Speaking of comparisons. Are these stats for Sandow correct? Seem a bit far-fetched having nearly 19 in. arms with relatively low bodyfat judging by his pics.
Name: Eugene Sandow

Birth Name: Friedrich Wilhelm Mueller

Date of Birth: April 25th, 1867

Place of Birth: Konigsberg, capital of East Prussia.

Height: 5'9 1/4"

Weight: 202 lbs.

Neck: 18"

Chest: 48"

Biceps: 18 1/2"

Forearms: 16 1/2"

Wrists: 7 1/2"

Waist: 30"

Hips: 42"

Quads: 26"

Knee: 14"

Calves: 18"

Ankle: 8 1/2"
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: chris2489 on July 26, 2008, 06:27:20 PM
Naturals

1926
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/unk1924.jpg)

Born May 7, 1879
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/fristensky2.gif)

1932 He stood 5 feet 5 inches and weighted 155 lbs. Chest 43", waist 31", upper arm 15 1/2". He could do deep knee bends with 300 lbs
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/000strongmanx.jpg)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: chris2489 on July 26, 2008, 06:32:47 PM
1908
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/000hackenshmidtnew.jpg)

Born in 1902
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/sigklein.jpg)

1920's
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/01Massimo.jpg)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: chris2489 on July 26, 2008, 06:36:25 PM
1924
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/alanmead24.gif)

1902
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/01staffsgtmoss.jpg)

Born in 1879
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/montesaldo.jpg)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: bigdarksnake on July 26, 2008, 07:17:20 PM
Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo


Bait n catch.........



self pwnage
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: pellius on July 26, 2008, 08:43:45 PM
If you are a regular user, train hard and follow a good diet and still don't look like much I think you are justified in lying. The humiliation is just too much.

When people say that Chris is small that may be so in regard to height and weight compared to other bodybuilders, or just the average fat American, but his muscular development is extraordinary. Truly dazzling in person. Wasn't Zane about the same proportion wise (assuming adding the 10lbs per inch of height rule)?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: JohnnyVegas on July 26, 2008, 08:54:45 PM
i dont give a fuck if anyone is natural or not

however,

i think the supplement industry exploits the naivety of people when they start training

by selling a myth  - which is wrong


No shit, having Arnold holding up a Weider can of protien powder, or Gaspari holding up the "Mega Mass 3000", as if that could ever make you into a Gaspari-a guy who juiced year round.


Weider has been sued NUMEROUS times by the FDA for false advertising and fraud. Arnold actually had to testify at one of these lawsuits, back in the 70's......
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: just_a_pilgrim on July 26, 2008, 09:37:09 PM
It would be almost impossible to define the term natural and the same to tell if someone is or ever has used. I have seen plenty of guy who look like crap and use. Now, it is much easier to be able to tell if someone is using.

I don't have a problem. Using steroids is illegal. Why admit to doing something illegal when there is no gain to be had by it?

We can talk about Morals all day. If someone is young or dumb enough to believe that a person who is juiced is natural because they say their natural, then they also are dumb enough to believe that if they say they used drugs then all it takes is drugs.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: no one on July 26, 2008, 11:24:32 PM
I was not reffering to you or anyone imparticular. I said that in my post, but maybe you didn't see that part.  It's in the first sentence. It's not alway all about Chris.  ;)    Unless you are feeling singled out for some odd reason.

Just wanted to add this: you are acutally pretty small and that is not a put down, so if you are using, it doesn't really show.


ouch!

pwned.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Cleanest Natural on July 27, 2008, 02:37:21 AM
I would argue that this is unnatural


:-X

Are these real humans ??????????????????????????????????????
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Overload on July 27, 2008, 07:01:49 AM
Great post Jim.

8)
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: HeyNow on July 27, 2008, 09:07:09 AM
 Boy, I wish all I had to worry about was if dudes in supplement ads were natural when they really might be using juice.  Who the hell cares, it's called marketing.  Get a life, you people who actually put time thinking about this natural not natural are absolutely pathetic.  Bitter losers.  Lose the chip off your shoulders you might enjoy life when you quit worrying what everyone else is doing.  GET A LIFE
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Moosejay on July 27, 2008, 09:10:40 AM
Speaking of comparisons. Are these stats for Sandow correct? Seem a bit far-fetched having nearly 19 in. arms with relatively low bodyfat judging by his pics.
Name: Eugene Sandow

Birth Name: Friedrich Wilhelm Mueller

Date of Birth: April 25th, 1867

Place of Birth: Konigsberg, capital of East Prussia.

Height: 5'9 1/4"

Weight: 202 lbs.

Neck: 18"

Chest: 48"

Biceps: 18 1/2"

Forearms: 16 1/2"

Wrists: 7 1/2"

Waist: 30"

Hips: 42"

Quads: 26"

Knee: 14"

Calves: 18"

Ankle: 8 1/2"


As an amateur Sandow officando, I will tell you that in his time everything was exaggerated.

He was, as you will know, fart of the famed 'Ziegfield Follies'.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Moosejay on July 27, 2008, 09:11:53 AM
Naturals

1926
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/unk1924.jpg)

Born May 7, 1879
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/fristensky2.gif)

1932 He stood 5 feet 5 inches and weighted 155 lbs. Chest 43", waist 31", upper arm 15 1/2". He could do deep knee bends with 300 lbs
(http://www.sandowmuseum.com/000strongmanx.jpg)

All veryt credible #'s...name?
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: musclehedz on July 27, 2008, 09:12:06 AM
Hey Disgusted, who are you talking about? Could it be me? I take it as a compliment if it is. Thanks, Faildo

Stop making a fool out of yourself. We are not mentally challenged.
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: Moosejay on July 27, 2008, 09:14:27 AM
If you are a regular user, train hard and follow a good diet and still don't look like much I think you are justified in lying. The humiliation is just too much.

When people say that Chris is small that may be so in regard to height and weight compared to other bodybuilders, or just the average fat American, but his muscular development is extraordinary. Truly dazzling in person. Wasn't Zane about the same proportion wise (assuming adding the 10lbs per inch of height rule)?

Zane used heavily.

I think Faildo does, as well
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: chris2489 on July 27, 2008, 10:31:22 AM
All veryt credible #'s...name?

There all found here: http://www.sandowmuseum.com/musclechampsone.html
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: arce377 on July 27, 2008, 01:40:56 PM
 :D
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: arce377 on July 27, 2008, 01:44:00 PM
 :D
Title: Re: Natural or not
Post by: mazrim on July 27, 2008, 02:00:50 PM
As an amateur Sandow officando, I will tell you that in his time everything was exaggerated.

He was, as you will know, fart of the famed 'Ziegfield Follies'.
Thank you. I suspected as much.