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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: Hustle Man on July 31, 2008, 03:51:36 PM

Title: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on July 31, 2008, 03:51:36 PM
What impact will this have on the Creation-evolution controversy and the believers and non-believers of getbig?

Does this mean life on other planets besides earth?


HM
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Nordic Superman on August 01, 2008, 11:02:04 AM
I believe there is life outside of the Earth and our solar system.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 01, 2008, 12:33:39 PM
What impact will this have on the Creation-evolution controversy and the believers and non-believers of getbig?

Does this mean life on other planets besides earth?


HM

All about Jebus... ::)
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: buffdnet on August 02, 2008, 10:27:41 AM

WOW deicide your getting it!
it is all about Jesus. Amen brother!

personally I think it's possible we will live
100% in space before the end times.
there has to be a reason for all of that being out there.
either that or the end times is quite a bit closer than
I imagine it may be.

Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OTHstrong on August 03, 2008, 08:11:02 PM
What impact will this have on the Creation-evolution controversy and the believers and non-believers of getbig?

Does this mean life on other planets besides earth?


HM
Their has been observations that commits hold water, in the form of ice, as well. which means nothing. Finding water on mars doesn't mean that there was once life on that planet. Since we were kids we've been programed to believe that where there is water there is life, finding watyer on a planet changes nothing.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 04, 2008, 12:16:08 AM
Their has been observations that commits hold water, in the form of ice, as well. which means nothing. Finding water on mars doesn't mean that there was once life on that planet. Since we were kids we've been programed to believe that where there is water there is life, finding watyer on a planet changes nothing.

Jebus...
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 04, 2008, 06:23:27 AM
All about Jebus... ::)
Jebus...

What are you saying here Deicide?  Are you talking about Jerusalem?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OTHstrong on August 04, 2008, 09:07:17 AM
What are you saying here Deicide?  Are you talking about Jerusalem?
No he is making fun of Jesus' name by calling him Jebus, a lot of people do this on getbig and deicide is just another followerer. On the other boards it happens when someone remembers you from the religious board, McWay gets that a lot. It is almost insulting to think this would hurt me as a christian, especially when I'm ready to even die for my saviour Jesus.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 04, 2008, 09:49:20 AM
No he is making fun of Jesus' name by calling him Jebus...

This is typical behavior of the spiritually lost, they must mock and scorn our Lord, it comes with the territory. Dust your feet off brothers/sisters because when it's all said and done every knee shall bow and call Jesus Lord! AMEN?

Romans 14:11
"As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God." (believers and un believers)
 
HM
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: wavelength on August 04, 2008, 11:40:36 AM
What impact will this have on the Creation-evolution controversy and the believers and non-believers of getbig?

Does this mean life on other planets besides earth?


HM

I don't get it. What does Ice on Mars have to do with Christian Belief?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 04, 2008, 12:42:44 PM
I don't get it. What does Ice on Mars have to do with Christian Belief?

Absolutely nothing!


And I agree with this ---->
Their has been observations that comets hold water, in the form of ice, as well. which means nothing. Finding water on mars doesn't mean that there was once life on that planet. Since we were kids we've been programed to believe that where there is water there is life, finding water on a planet changes nothing.



HM
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 05, 2008, 06:53:47 AM
No he is making fun of Jesus' name by calling him Jebus, a lot of people do this on getbig and deicide is just another followerer. On the other boards it happens when someone remembers you from the religious board, McWay gets that a lot. It is almost insulting to think this would hurt me as a christian, especially when I'm ready to even die for my saviour Jesus.

What lol? 

I wonder how they think it's an insult to call Jesus the ancient name for Jerusalem? 

Maybe Deicide is making some sort of end-times reference to Israel?



Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Colossus_500 on August 05, 2008, 07:12:12 AM
This is typical behavior of the spiritually lost, they must mock and scorn our Lord, it comes with the territory. Dust your feet off brothers/sisters because when it's all said and done every knee shall bow and call Jesus Lord! AMEN?

Romans 14:11
"As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God." (believers and un believers)
 
HM
AMEN!!!
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: youandme on August 05, 2008, 09:50:26 AM
Their has been observations that commits hold water, in the form of ice, as well. which means nothing. Finding water on mars doesn't mean that there was once life on that planet. Since we were kids we've been programed to believe that where there is water there is life, finding watyer on a planet changes nothing.

no but, finding water, NA, K, and CL, and traces of chemicals (could be contamination from landing) mean that their is in fact a form of life that was or is living on Mars.




Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OTHstrong on August 05, 2008, 11:06:16 AM
no but, finding water, NA, K, and CL, and traces of chemicals (could be contamination from landing) mean that their is in fact a form of life that was or is living on Mars.





I believe scientest, most of them anyway, are looking for ET life in the form of bacteria or a single cell ameoba, not the funny looking creatures you see in hollywood movies.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 05, 2008, 05:45:18 PM
This is typical behavior of the spiritually lost, they must mock and scorn our Lord, it comes with the territory. Dust your feet off brothers/sisters because when it's all said and done every knee shall bow and call Jesus Lord! AMEN?

Romans 14:11
"As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God." (believers and un believers)
 
HM

Is the definition of the spiritually lost someone who is not a christian?   Because it really should be the definition of a non-christian.  Spirituality is not exclusive to Christianity by definition. 
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: youandme on August 05, 2008, 09:30:58 PM
I believe scientest, most of them anyway, are looking for ET life in the form of bacteria or a single cell ameoba, not the funny looking creatures you see in hollywood movies.

uh yeah no shit sherlock
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 06, 2008, 03:34:23 AM
This is typical behavior of the spiritually lost, they must mock and scorn our Lord, it comes with the territory. Dust your feet off brothers/sisters because when it's all said and done every knee shall bow and call Jesus Lord! AMEN?

Romans 14:11
"As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to God." (believers and un believers)
 
HM

As I said before, I am still waiting for your fictional Canaanite war/storm deity to make a showing; until then, have fun crawiling on your hands and knees in imaginary worship...try Odin, he is a lot cooler.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 06, 2008, 03:50:15 AM
What lol? 

I wonder how they think it's an insult to call Jesus the ancient name for Jerusalem? 

Maybe Deicide is making some sort of end-times reference to Israel?





No, I am not and without wanting to insult you I think it utterly incomprehensible and silly that you believe these fairy tales, yet reject wholesale the fairy tales of Islam, Hinduism and various forms of polytheism...
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 06, 2008, 06:17:03 AM
No, I am not and without wanting to insult you I think it utterly incomprehensible and silly that you believe these fairy tales, yet reject wholesale the fairy tales of Islam, Hinduism and various forms of polytheism...
Why does it bother you so that I believe in the God of the Bible?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 06, 2008, 06:53:10 AM
Why does it bother you so that I believe in the God of the Bible?

Because you believe it to be absolutely true, ignoring modern scientific knowledge and in particular never studying other world religions in depth. It's the same as saying Omaha, Nebraska is the best place on earth to live and you have never left the place. More importantly, Christianity with its pretentious, all encompassing, absolutist, yet thoroughly false and absurd claims, seeks to force itself upon science, the world and young people who don't know better; it was likely verbally beaten into you as a child since you are from the Bible Belt...there are many reasons it bothers me; most of all religious monotheists just can't seem to leave other people alone and have to proselytise.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 06, 2008, 07:16:07 AM
Because you believe it to be absolutely true, ignoring modern scientific knowledge and in particular never studying other world religions in depth.

I believe science supports my belief in the bible.

It's the same as saying Omaha, Nebraska is the best place on earth to live and you have never left the place. .
I cannot remember saying any place is the best place to live on earth.  Maybe you're not saying I did and just making an analogy but the analogy does not apply to me.


Christianity with its pretentious, all encompassing, absolutist, yet thoroughly false and absurd claims, seeks to force itself upon science, the world and young people who don't know better;
How does it seek to "force itself" upon these things you list?

it was likely verbally beaten into you as a child since you are from the Bible Belt...

See, I think your tendency to presume things could have a large impact regarding why your mind seems so closed to the possibility of Christianity being true. 

No, Christianity was not beaten ito me as a child.  In fact, I'm not even sure my mom is saved or that my dad was saved.

Try not to presume things if you can help yourself.

there are many reasons it bothers me; most of all religious monotheists just can't seem to leave other people alone and have to proselytise.
Sorry but this really makes me wonder why you spend so much time here on the "RELIGION BOARD." 

You are quite free to not come here at all but yet, it seems as though you spend a large percentage of your time on getbig right here...on a RELIGION board where there are obviously Christians talking about Christianity. 

Why do you think if you are so bothered by monotheists that you come here so often where are bunch of monotheists congregate?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 06, 2008, 09:15:24 AM
Is the definition of the spiritually lost someone who is not a christian? According to the bible, Yes!  Because it really should be the definition of a non-christian.  Spirituality is not exclusive to Christianity by definition.  Pay attention


I should have said spiritually dead but being spiritually lost is synonymous with being spiritually dead.

Let me clarify.

According to certain books of the canonized 66 books otherwise known as the bible (Genesis to Revelation) specifically;
Romans 8:9b
9b Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him.

Meaning he/she is spiritually dead without Christ, carefully read Ephesians 2:1-10 as it explains the spiritual condition of someone who is not in Christ.

Ephesians 4:5
One Lord (Jesus), One faith (his faith/faithfulness), One baptism (of the Holy Spirit)

Every other faith apart from faith in Christ or reliance on Christ's faith is futile. Any other Spirit apart from the Holy Spirit gives death not life.

Galatians 2:16
know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.

Ergo, If Christ the sustainer of life is not your Lord, If Christ the sustainer of life is not your source of faith,  If you have not been baptized by the Holy Spirit/ghost you are spiritually lost/dead

The Christian faith is dependent upon what Christ has done for us not on what we can do for ourselves.

HM






Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 06, 2008, 09:22:00 AM
Water doesn't disprove God although it might disprove the bible.

They are NOT the same.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 06, 2008, 10:09:40 AM
Water doesn't disprove God although it might disprove the bible.

How so? 




They are NOT the same.
Absolutely correct
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 06, 2008, 10:17:33 AM


I should have said spiritually dead but being spiritually lost is synonymous with being spiritually dead.








READ WITH ATTENTION


In accordance to the bible....yes.   but not by definition outside of the bible.  Anything spiritual is not exclusive to the bible.

Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 06, 2008, 11:01:28 AM
READ WITH ATTENTION
In accordance to the bible....yes.   but not by definition outside of the bible.  Anything spiritual is not exclusive to the bible.

Questions for you, where do spirits come from and what is a spirit?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 06, 2008, 11:23:59 AM
How so? 

The potential of water on Mars that eventually leads to proof of life elsewhere will directly contradict the bible which effectively states that humans are all there is.

But I've never understood how the bible means anything.. it's a book written by men. 
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 06, 2008, 12:01:25 PM
Questions for you, where do spirits come from and what is a spirit?

Everything comes from God.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 06, 2008, 12:04:42 PM
Everything comes from God.

except for the bible ;D lol
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 06, 2008, 12:08:34 PM
except for the bible ;D lol

hehehehe   yep.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 06, 2008, 06:28:15 PM
The potential of water on Mars that eventually leads to proof of life elsewhere will directly contradict the bible which effectively states that humans are all there is.


I don't remember ever reading this in the bible...  Can you please give me a scripture reference or references?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 06, 2008, 06:38:22 PM
I don't remember ever reading this in the bible...  Can you please give me a scripture reference or references?

No, actually I can't and you're welcome to dispute that if you wish.  I say it as I have heard that repeatedly from bible-thumping southern evangelicals.  I don't believe it is said in the old testament as those are the only books I'm intimately familiar with (I'm Jewish).
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 07, 2008, 06:37:14 AM
No, actually I can't and you're welcome to dispute that if you wish.  I say it as I have heard that repeatedly from bible-thumping southern evangelicals.  I don't believe it is said in the old testament as those are the only books I'm intimately familiar with (I'm Jewish).

I'm pretty sure it is not in the bible anywhere, Old or New Testament.



Imo, one thing that is very detrimental to people possibly rejecting the (whole) bible as true is that they don't read it themselves and accept something some other person or people have said is in there as actually being in there when it is not.

Just because some bible-thumpers told you something was in there I wonder how long you've lived believing it and possibly repeated it as though it were a fact?  People can be mistaken and in addition some can be intentionally deceptive at times.  That's why we need to read it ourselves..... 

I've had a conversation with some Jehovah's Witnesses that were telling me about some scriptures but they were taking them completely out of context and making them mean what they wanted.  When I pointed out the context by reading the whole chapter and not only the verse, they had nothing to say other than to repeat the scripture  :-\  You have to read the whole context around the verse to glean the proper meaning.

In addition, the young JW was not aware of certain scriptures that specifically and plainly state that being "saved" is not achieved or sustained by doing good "works" but by grace through faith.   I gave her my email and she never wrote...I suppose it's possible the old lady JW w/her said it wouldn't be a good idea :-\


Brixtonbulldog, please hang around here more if you have time.  If you have other questions or beliefs that you've had about the N.T. that concern you some of us will do our best to help clarify if we can.

Also, you being intimately familiar w/the O.T. could help a lot of us learn also!  Thanks :)
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 07, 2008, 06:48:27 AM
except for the bible ;D lol

Last time I checked everything means everything so don't exclude what you disagree with (the Bible).

I know neither of you disagree with everything in the bible, true?

I think a better way to describe the defamation of the many things God has created is to point out the influence of the perversions of sinfully cursed mankind. Remember God created Lucifer as well but he went astray because of pride and he was the most beautiful of God's creations.

Thiunk about it!

Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 07, 2008, 09:43:17 AM
Last time I checked everything means everything so don't exclude what you disagree with (the Bible).

I know neither of you disagree with everything in the bible, true?

I think a better way to describe the defamation of the many things God has created is to point out the influence of the perversions of sinfully cursed mankind. Remember God created Lucifer as well but he went astray because of pride and he was the most beautiful of God's creations.

Thiunk about it!



Perversions of sinfully cursed mankind?  Please elaborate.

BTW Was Adam perfect?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 07, 2008, 12:19:29 PM
Just bloody hysterical.............. ....never ends.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 07, 2008, 12:26:31 PM
I'm pretty sure it is not in the bible anywhere, Old or New Testament.



Imo, one thing that is very detrimental to people possibly rejecting the (whole) bible as true is that they don't read it themselves and accept something some other person or people have said is in there as actually being in there when it is not.

Just because some bible-thumpers told you something was in there I wonder how long you've lived believing it and possibly repeated it as though it were a fact?  People can be mistaken and in addition some can be intentionally deceptive at times.  That's why we need to read it ourselves..... 

I've had a conversation with some Jehovah's Witnesses that were telling me about some scriptures but they were taking them completely out of context and making them mean what they wanted.  When I pointed out the context by reading the whole chapter and not only the verse, they had nothing to say other than to repeat the scripture  :-\  You have to read the whole context around the verse to glean the proper meaning.

In addition, the young JW was not aware of certain scriptures that specifically and plainly state that being "saved" is not achieved or sustained by doing good "works" but by grace through faith.   I gave her my email and she never wrote...I suppose it's possible the old lady JW w/her said it wouldn't be a good idea :-\


Brixtonbulldog, please hang around here more if you have time.  If you have other questions or beliefs that you've had about the N.T. that concern you some of us will do our best to help clarify if we can.

Also, you being intimately familiar w/the O.T. could help a lot of us learn also!  Thanks :)

Agreed.

I rarely claim to know of something in the new testament that is concrete or to have personal knowledge through reading it myself.  In this instance it's not so much a case of me repeating something that might not be there but an instance that goes to show how evangelicals, in a desperate attempt to validate their own extreme beliefs and absurdities, are actually doing more harm than good.  If it really isn't in the bible than I regret my own ignorance.

I happen to think very highly of most Christians but I keep finding myself in debates with evangelicals who attempt to change my mind about something.  After I end up humiliating them and exposing their shaky foundation they usually fall back on "Well, you should talk to my preacher.. they know how to put it into perspective."

I've never seen a Jew go around trying to convince people of our religion.  I don't know what possesses some Christians to do just that.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: wavelength on August 07, 2008, 12:38:35 PM
Can we maybe just agree on that if water was found on mars or not could not possibly change anything about the spiritual truth contained in the bible, if there is any at all, that is?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 07, 2008, 02:25:10 PM
Can we maybe just agree on that if water was found on mars or not could not possibly change anything about the spiritual truth contained in the bible, if there is any at all, that is?

No, because it very well might.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 07, 2008, 02:35:49 PM
Can we maybe just agree on that if water was found on mars or not could not possibly change anything about the spiritual truth contained in the bible, if there is any at all, that is?

Wow, best thing you have ever written, Mr. Wienerschnitzel.... ;D
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: buffdnet on August 07, 2008, 05:38:15 PM
Ive changed my name to polesmoke2
Wow, best thing you have ever written.
what made you decide  ::)
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Hustle Man on August 07, 2008, 06:49:39 PM
Perversions of sinfully cursed mankind?  Please elaborate.

BTW Was Adam perfect?

We (mankind) have perverted every aspect of life and what was entrusted to us by God. (myself included)

Read Romans 1:18-32, Romans 3:9-18 and Galatians 5:19-21a no offense is new under this sun, it's all been done before.

Adam was created perfectly but of course he sinned and we are his offspring, everyone after Adam is infected (if you will with sin). We inherited his fallen nature so we all are drawn to sin we love to sin and we love to see others sin.  
Questions for you:

What is righteousness to you?
Can you sustain it?
In your line of thinking is there even such a thing as sin?
If so who are you sinning against?
Is there a penalty for sinning?

HM

Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 07, 2008, 07:36:49 PM
We (mankind) have perverted every aspect of life and what was entrusted to us by God. (myself included)

Read Romans 1:18-32, Romans 3:9-18 and Galatians 5:19-21a no offense is new under this sun, it's all been done before.

Adam was created perfectly but of course he sinned and we are his offspring, everyone after Adam is infected (if you will with sin). We inherited his fallen nature so we all are drawn to sin we love to sin and we love to see others sin.  
Questions for you:

What is righteousness to you?
Can you sustain it?
In your line of thinking is there even such a thing as sin?
If so who are you sinning against?
Is there a penalty for sinning?

HM



entrusted to us?  who let the serpent into the garden?

How could Adam be perfect?  did he not lie and disobey God?


to answer your questions:

What is righteousness to you? common sense
Can you sustain it? yes, if i don't allow bull crap like doctrine to influence it.
In your line of thinking is there even such a thing as sin? ordering the death of women and children is sinful.   Or offering your virgin daughter to a horny sex crazed mob......amung many many others
If so who are you sinning against?  Other people and in turn you are sinning against GOD.
Is there a penalty for sinning?   I would hope there is after death  we are all 100% guaranteed to find out.   But in life there is for the most part.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 08, 2008, 01:23:36 AM
entrusted to us?  who let the serpent into the garden?

How could Adam be perfect?  did he not lie and disobey God?


to answer your questions:

What is righteousness to you? common sense
Can you sustain it? yes, if i don't allow bull crap like doctrine to influence it.
In your line of thinking is there even such a thing as sin? ordering the death of women and children is sinful.   Or offering your virgin daughter to a horny sex crazed mob......amung many many others
If so who are you sinning against?  Other people and in turn you are sinning against GOD.
Is there a penalty for sinning?   I would hope there is after death  we are all 100% guaranteed to find out.   But in life there is for the most part.

Ozmo, I have long wondered; are you a deist or some sort of alternative theist?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Nordic Superman on August 08, 2008, 02:55:46 AM
No, actually I can't and you're welcome to dispute that if you wish.  I say it as I have heard that repeatedly from bible-thumping southern evangelicals.  I don't believe it is said in the old testament as those are the only books I'm intimately familiar with (I'm Jewish).

Do you think the Jewish religious texts are truthful and ordained by God?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 08, 2008, 03:17:53 AM
Do you think the Jewish religious texts are truthful and ordained by God?

Likely not; most of 'us' Jews are secular atheists who think religion is a load of bullcrap.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Nordic Superman on August 08, 2008, 04:01:21 AM
Likely not; most of 'us' Jews are secular atheists who think religion is a load of bullcrap.

Ha ha, you have a Jewish background?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 08, 2008, 04:42:42 AM
Do you think the Jewish religious texts are truthful and ordained by God?

Probably no more than the bible is.  Maybe the commandments?  Who knows.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Butterbean on August 08, 2008, 06:38:21 AM
No, because it very well might.
In what way?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 08, 2008, 06:58:30 AM
Ha ha, you have a Jewish background?

I am 'Jewish', whatever that means.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Nordic Superman on August 08, 2008, 07:07:05 AM
I am 'Jewish', whatever that means.

I do wonder, what exactly DOES it mean?

Racially Jewish (i.e. Hebrew)? I find this hard for all the Jews of the world to claim.

Is it much in like that I was "Christian" as a child because I was Christened and my parents are both Christian?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Deicide on August 08, 2008, 07:14:33 AM
I do wonder, what exactly DOES it mean?

Racially Jewish (i.e. Hebrew)? I find this hard for all the Jews of the world to claim.

Is it much in like that I was "Christian" as a child because I was Christened and my parents are both Christian?

Genetically, the term Jewish means nothing.

But put it this way, had I been around in say Berlin of 1939, I would have been murdered for sure because of my ancestry.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: OzmO on August 08, 2008, 09:08:47 AM
Ozmo, I have long wondered; are you a deist or some sort of alternative theist?

Probably more of a deist, I guess.


Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: wavelength on August 08, 2008, 02:31:28 PM
Wow, best thing you have ever written, Mr. Wienerschnitzel.... ;D

Since there is no spiritual truth at all, right?
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: wavelength on August 08, 2008, 02:34:16 PM
No, because it very well might.

Logically, it can't. Any scientific finding is "truth" about forms. Spiritual truth by definition cannot be dependent on formal truth. So either there is none or it is not threatened.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: Brixtonbulldog on August 08, 2008, 04:37:36 PM
Logically, it can't. Any scientific finding is "truth" about forms. Spiritual truth by definition cannot be dependent on formal truth. So either there is none or it is not threatened.

Spiritual truth may be independent.  Claims in the bible, however, are open to be disputed.
Title: Re: Phoenix Mission 'Definitely' Finds Water Ice on Mars
Post by: wavelength on August 09, 2008, 12:29:08 AM
Spiritual truth may be independent.  Claims in the bible, however, are open to be disputed.

That was my point. The spiritual truth must remain untouched.
If the bible is read as a series of scientific claims only, the dispute is inevitable.