Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: NeoSeminole on November 18, 2008, 11:07:16 AM
-
Let's imagine we can rewind time. Suppose that 10 min. ago you made the conscious decision to raise your arm. If we went backwards to that exact point in time when you made the decision to raise your arm, do you believe you would make the same choice again given that every condition leading up to that moment is exactly the same? Yes or no? Also explain why.
-
Let's imagine we can rewind time. Suppose that 10 min. ago you made the conscious decision to raise your arm. If we went backwards to that exact point in time when you made the decision to raise your arm, do you believe you would make the same choice again given that every condition leading up to that moment is exactly the same? Yes or no? Also explain why.
Is this about the studies suggesting that the brain decides a few seconds before we think we decide ourselves?
-
Is this about the studies suggesting that the brain decides a few seconds before we think we decide ourselves?
no, although I have read about what you mentioned. My question is something I thought of to simplify the free will debate. You would think the answer is yes since we feel we have choice. However, I cannot think of a valid explanation for why. It's much easier to explain if the answer is no.
-
no, although I have read about what you mentioned. My question is something I thought of to simplify the free will debate. You would think the answer is yes since we feel we have choice. However, I cannot think of a valid explanation for why. It's much easier to explain if the answer is no.
The problem with this thought experiment is the "going back in time".
-
If the conditions were the same, then probably yes. If I was raising my arm to catch a waiter's attention for instance, then going back in time, my need to get him for whatever reason would be the same. Since I don't call out rudely, I'd probably act in the same way. Same for any number of other reasons. Like waving at a friend across the street, or whatever.
-
If the conditions were the same, then probably yes. If I was raising my arm to catch a waiter's attention for instance, then going back in time, my need to get him for whatever reason would be the same. Since I don't call out rudely, I'd probably act in the same way. Same for any number of other reasons. Like waving at a friend across the street, or whatever.
that's the same conclusion I reached. If this is true, then how is free will possible if the same set of conditions always lead to the same outcome? You have no choice but to follow a specific path.
-
that's the same conclusion I reached. If this is true, then how is free will possible if the same set of conditions always lead to the same outcome? You have no choice but to follow a specific path.
chaos theory would deny this. The same condition is highly probable to turn out in a certain way but not definite. There are definite degrees of correlation here that would make prediction easier.
I havent really thought much about freewill mind you. Either way it is pointless to me. If we do it has some adaptive advantage.
-
Let's imagine we can rewind time. Suppose that 10 min. ago you made the conscious decision to raise your arm. If we went backwards to that exact point in time when you made the decision to raise your arm, do you believe you would make the same choice again given that every condition leading up to that moment is exactly the same? Yes or no? Also explain why.
Seminole, the answer to the question is no. For there to be free will, more than one possible choice for every given situation is required. Just because you repeat the same set of conditions does not mean that you would make the same decision. For the same set of circumstances lead to the same decision, it would be required that the same situation triggers the same thought that leads to the decision, and this doesen't happen. A set of circumstances will lead to a varied possibilities of choices and the choice you make will depend on the probability of a given decision being the right one. In most cases, we don't really know what is the best decision to make or several decisions are equally good. Therefore.....the probability of you making any choice is random. Conversely, there are a very few situations where you will always make the same choice. For instance, when inside a burning building and when you have the easy way out of climbing down the stairs, you will always choose to climb down the stairs instead of burning alive. In this case, the same set of circumcstances will always lead to the same decision and you could say that fee will doesen't apply. However, even in this case free will may apply in the case of, say, and extremely resolute person that decides to burn to death. The extraordinary resolutness and freakish circumcstances that would require someone to make such a decision is so rare that you could say it would be impossible, but even in this situation free will could still apply. Conversely, imagine that you are in the burning building and you have the choice between jumping through the window or letting the fire consume you. I this case, there will be free will, because even though burning to death is very bad, jumping from the building is a pretty horrible death as well and different people would choose differently. Lots of people would simply not be able to throw themselves from the building and would choose to burn to death. In conclusion, free will exists because there is no given ideal solution for most situations in life, so if you repeat the same circumstances, you get different choices. Since the same circumstances gives you many possible decisions to make, and since in most cases none of the possible decisions are innately superior to the others, and since even when some decisions are clearly superior to the others you may choose not to do them for other reasons, then free will certainly exists.
SUCKMYMUSCLE