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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Soul Crusher on February 11, 2009, 10:22:56 AM
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Senate Excludes E-Verify Check on Illegal Immigrant Workers from Stimulus Package (Call, email!)
Hispanic Business ^ | 2-10-09 | Richard Kaplan
Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:38:32 PM by STARWISE
The Senate passed today a $838 billion stimulus plan that did not include E-Verify, a mechanism to check whether workers are legal immigrants or U.S. citizens.
While Senate Democrats blocked the E-Verify amendment from being voted on, the House has voted 417-2 in favor of including the worker identity checking program in its version of the stimulus package.
The fight over E-Verify, or Basic Pilot, now moves to the House-Senate conference where the differences between the two economic recovery packages will be hammered out in negotiations.
Proponents and opponents of the E-Verify measure have targeted the legislative negotiations as a key battleground over the issue.
Proponents of E-Verify say the measure is necessary to prevent newly created jobs from going to undocumented immigrant worker in the United States.
The House bill prohibits any stimulus funding from going to a company or government office that fails to use the E-Verify identity checking system. This online electronic database checks whether a person is authorized to work in the United States.
A number of groups including the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the Human Resource Initiative for a Legal Workforce, opposed the insertion of an E-Verify Measure into the bill.
The Hispanic Caucus sent a letter on Jan. 26 to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi arguing against the measure.
The caucus wrote that E-Verify would "disproportionately affect Hispanic workers and their employers . We urge you to ensure this provision is stripped from legislation."
The caucus argued that the database used to confirm the worker's status "has been widely documented as unreliable and inaccurate." They said that mistakes in the database could "result in 3.6 million workers a year being misidentified" as not authorized for employment.
In addition, "Foreign-born American citizens are 30 times more likely than native born workers to be incorrectly identified as ineligible for work."
The U.S. Chamber of Commerce too has consistently opposed a mandatory E-Verify program.
In a press release, the chamber stated that "Given the current economy, now is not the time to add more bureaucracy and billions of dollars in compliance costs to America's businesses."
Randy Johnson, the chamber's vice president on immigrant and labor issues, said, "The Chamber supports legislative initiatives to develop and implement an electronic verification system, but first we must be sure that the system is effective, efficient, and manageable under real-world conditions."
In contrast, Federation for American Immigration Reform strongly argued for including E-Verify in the final bill. Dan Stein, FAIR's president yesterday wrote: "With millions losing jobs, it would be immoral for Senate leaders to neglect vital protections for U.S. workers."
He added, "When spending nearly one trillion dollars of taxpayers' money to reinvigorate the economy, the American people expect programs such as E-Verify be not only included but made mandatory."
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So illegals should be allowed to get benefits they are not entitled to, because they might be exposed as being illegal criminals under the new system.
Wow.
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Illegals shouldn't get shit.
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Illegals shouldn't get shit.
Call your lovely Senators and thank them for the great job they did.
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Call your lovely Senators and thank them for the great job they did.
When was the last time anyone did a good job keeping illegals out?
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this is some slap bullshit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
what the fuck man. this fuckin sucks donky dick
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"While Senate Democrats blocked the E-Verify amendment from being voted on, the House has voted 417-2 in favor of including the worker identity checking program in its version of the stimulus package"
I only have two things to say:
1.Fuck the "Senate Democrats".
2.Fuck the 2 at the house that voted against it.
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"While Senate Democrats blocked the E-Verify amendment from being voted on, the House has voted 417-2 in favor of including the worker identity checking program in its version of the stimulus package"
I only have two things to say:
1.Fuck the "Senate Democrats".
2.Fuck the 2 at the house that voted against it.
yeah, thats fucked up
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yeah, thats fucked up
I seriously can't understand how these people can actually do such a thing.
Someone should make a list of who were the fuckers that voted against it and remind everyone what these people when it's time to vote them in again.
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(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1124/943507547_d1960ae902.jpg?v=0)
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When was the last time anyone did a good job keeping illegals out?
Not the point. The senate stinks.
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You guys don't seem to understand or want to believe that the Central and South American who have been "BROUGHT " to america were done so in order to bring the wages of american down and to make labor cheap and readily available in america. I hope none of you are so dumb as to believe that these people actually crossed the border and walked all the way to Maine, Washington state, Montana, New York, Chicago etc etc. 99.9 percent of them DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH yet they can navigate themselves around so easily????...hmmmmmm. There was a plan to do this and now you see it in all of its fullness. The financial collapse is orchestrated as well...all that we are seeing and the lame excuse being given to justify the massive layoffs, factory closings, business failures WERE NOT CAUSED BY A FEW HOME OWNERS WHO SUPPOSEDLY COULD NOT PAY THEIR MORTGAGE. This is a orchestrated event in order for america to wiggle its way out of the massive debt it owes the world. America is about to print over two trillion dollars and dump it into the economy, which will probably cause the Chinese to dump their two trillion of america dollars as well as cause the Saudis to dump their five trillion...this is on top of the almost 800 BILLION the feds are about to dump into the economy as a stimulus which is in addition to the 700 BILLION already being dumped...IN SHORT THE VALUE OF THE AMERICAN DOLLAR WILL BE ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS...Just like the crash of the German Mark, the Hungarian and Polish money...american dollar is next. With the dollar worthless it is easy to then give to other nations worthless "PAPER" that has a value stamped on it of 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, or more TRILLION DOLLARS...and then say...DEBT PAID!!!!. None the less this will spark the IRE of many nations and I suspect that many "ALLY" nations will attack america and put its existence to an end. In the mean time the game is being played with the masses of trying to keep order, with stimuluses, paying immigrants and giving them health benefits (whether they are legal or not) and making things seem OK right until the ball drops on the masses....
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The left wants them for votes.
The "country club" right wants them for cheap labor.
The taxpayers and American Citizens get screwed, as usual.
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The left wants them for votes.
The "country club" right wants them for cheap labor.
The taxpayers and American Citizens get screwed, as usual.
BOOM!!
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You guys don't seem to understand or want to believe that the Central and South American who have been "BROUGHT " to america were done so in order to bring the wages of american down and to make labor cheap and readily available in america. I hope none of you are so dumb as to believe that these people actually crossed the border and walked all the way to Maine, Washington state, Montana, New York, Chicago etc etc. 99.9 percent of them DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH yet they can navigate themselves around so easily????...hmmmmmm. There was a plan to do this and now you see it in all of its fullness. The financial collapse is orchestrated as well...all that we are seeing and the lame excuse being given to justify the massive layoffs, factory closings, business failures WERE NOT CAUSED BY A FEW HOME OWNERS WHO SUPPOSEDLY COULD NOT PAY THEIR MORTGAGE. This is a orchestrated event in order for america to wiggle its way out of the massive debt it owes the world. America is about to print over two trillion dollars and dump it into the economy, which will probably cause the Chinese to dump their two trillion of america dollars as well as cause the Saudis to dump their five trillion...this is on top of the almost 800 BILLION the feds are about to dump into the economy as a stimulus which is in addition to the 700 BILLION already being dumped...IN SHORT THE VALUE OF THE AMERICAN DOLLAR WILL BE ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS...Just like the crash of the German Mark, the Hungarian and Polish money...american dollar is next. With the dollar worthless it is easy to then give to other nations worthless "PAPER" that has a value stamped on it of 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, or more TRILLION DOLLARS...and then say...DEBT PAID!!!!. None the less this will spark the IRE of many nations and I suspect that many "ALLY" nations will attack america and put its existence to an end. In the mean time the game is being played with the masses of trying to keep order, with stimuluses, paying immigrants and giving them health benefits (whether they are legal or not) and making things seem OK right until the ball drops on the masses....
This does seem to be the plan.
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Senate Excludes E-Verify Check on Illegal Immigrant Workers from Stimulus Package (Call, email!)
Hispanic Business ^ | 2-10-09 | Richard Kaplan
Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2009 12:38:32 PM by STARWISE
The Senate passed today a $838 billion stimulus plan that did not include E-Verify, a mechanism to check whether workers are legal immigrants or U.S. citizens.
While Senate Democrats blocked the E-Verify amendment from being voted on, the House has voted 417-2 in favor of including the worker identity checking program in its version of the stimulus package.
The fight over E-Verify, or Basic Pilot, now moves to the House-Senate conference where the differences between the two economic recovery packages will be hammered out in negotiations.
Proponents and opponents of the E-Verify measure have targeted the legislative negotiations as a key battleground over the issue.
Proponents of E-Verify say the measure is necessary to prevent newly created jobs from going to undocumented immigrant worker in the United States.
The House bill prohibits any stimulus funding from going to a company or government office that fails to use the E-Verify identity checking system. This online electronic database checks whether a person is authorized to work in the United States.
A number of groups including the Congressional Hispanic Caucus, U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the Human Resource Initiative for a Legal Workforce, opposed the insertion of an E-Verify Measure into the bill.
The Hispanic Caucus sent a letter on Jan. 26 to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi arguing against the measure.
The caucus wrote that E-Verify would "disproportionately affect Hispanic workers and their employers . We urge you to ensure this provision is stripped from legislation."
The caucus argued that the database used to confirm the worker's status "has been widely documented as unreliable and inaccurate." They said that mistakes in the database could "result in 3.6 million workers a year being misidentified" as not authorized for employment.
In addition, "Foreign-born American citizens are 30 times more likely than native born workers to be incorrectly identified as ineligible for work."
The U.S. Chamber of Commerce too has consistently opposed a mandatory E-Verify program.
In a press release, the chamber stated that "Given the current economy, now is not the time to add more bureaucracy and billions of dollars in compliance costs to America's businesses."
Randy Johnson, the chamber's vice president on immigrant and labor issues, said, "The Chamber supports legislative initiatives to develop and implement an electronic verification system, but first we must be sure that the system is effective, efficient, and manageable under real-world conditions."
In contrast, Federation for American Immigration Reform strongly argued for including E-Verify in the final bill. Dan Stein, FAIR's president yesterday wrote: "With millions losing jobs, it would be immoral for Senate leaders to neglect vital protections for U.S. workers."
He added, "When spending nearly one trillion dollars of taxpayers' money to reinvigorate the economy, the American people expect programs such as E-Verify be not only included but made mandatory."
Wow, ...am I the only one that saw the above highlighted text, ...or did others see it, but chose not to comment?
The idea behind this stimulus package is to stimulate the economy.
If one is going to undertake such a massive undertaking, those tweaks, bugs, and glitches had better be out of the system. How would you like to be a fully LEGAL American, laid off with a mortgage, wife, kids, and mouths to feed, ...about to lose your home, only to have some bureaucratic pencil pusher tell you you are ineligible for employment anywhere because some little computer screen says so. If they couldn't get the NO-FLY list right including 5 yr olds who weren't even born on 911 on the NO-FLY list, do you think they are going to be able to keep this straight? How would you like to be one among those 3.6 million other innocent workers inappropriately precluded from working ...anywhere. How good are you at holding a sign saying "Will work for food"? Because a tiny little data entry could be all that stands between you having to do that. I can't tell you how many times people spell my name incorrectly. If some data entry operator is having a dyslexic day while entering your SSN, you could be a very unhappy camper.
For all of those who are screaming they shouldn't get diddly squat... would you turn away their business?
If you sold homes for instance, and an illegal alien from Switzerland flew in after dipping into his bank account, wanting to buy a $5 million dollar home cash. Would you say screw you I'm not selling it to you? ...Illegals have no business stimulating the American economy?
If your child was choking and needed an emergency trachiotomy to save his life, ...would you allow Pedro, the surgeon from Argentina to save his life. I have a friend named Miguel who is an airline pilot. What if you were on an plane and it was just like the scene from Airplane, and the entire flight crew, captain, pilot, co-pilot etc, are all sick from bad fish. There's a storm and they can't use the automatic pilot, ...and Sully Sullenberg is on the ground in Hawaii enjoying a much deserved R & R with his loved ones. Would you allow my friend Miguel from Mexico, a passenger on the flight, but also major airline pilot for years to take over the plane, ...or would you say "Screw him, ...he's not American, and this airline is getting stimulus money" ??? In that life or death situation... what would you do?
The left wants them for votes.
The "country club" right wants them for cheap labor.
The taxpayers and American Citizens get screwed, as usual.
"The left wants them for votes, the "country club" right wants them for cheap labor and the tax payers and American citizens get screwed as usual" ??? Hmmmm... why does that not seem quite accurate to me?
Could it be that I noticed you made a distinction within the right. There's a country club right, ...but no members of the left belong to country clubs? Is that what you're implying? Are you implying that neither the left nor the "country club" right pay taxes, ...or that they are not American citizens? Because from my perspective the taxpayers and American citizens are one and the same... along with the left and the right, country club or otherwise. Or are you simply looking for a way to segregate yourself from the hypocrisy you witness from all sides of the political spectrum?
Perhaps a more accurate way of putting it is that many American citizens are willing to exploit illegal aliens as a demographic block, while others exploit them to do overworked, underpaid, and underappreciated jobs that many Americans will not do, which they do in the most horrific conditions and environments, many Americans are content to have aliens contribute to the creation of prosperous times, while they feel they're on the way up, ...but as soon as the economy slows down, ...they're ready to toss them out with the trash disregarding whatever value they've been bringing to the table, or will continue to bring. It's amazing how quickly people's perspectives change. One day someone is a valueable much needed asset, ...a bargain in fact... but the minute the economy turns... this asset is considered a burden? {sigh} Oh well, ...one can only hope that one day people will realize everyone is in the same boat with everyone else. The boat is either going to sink or float, but to navigate through the tight areas and the choppy rapids, you're going to need all hands on deck bailing water as fast as they can, and all oars in the water rowing the boat to shore.
It's the bottom of the 9th, two out, you're up at bat, the count is 3 balls, 2 strikes. The pitcher releases from the mound, ...are you going to tell me that you'd use that moment to check the imprint on the bat to ensure it was made in Louisville? ...or are you just gonna swing the darn thing? When you're up a creek with only one paddle, ...don't bother to see whether it was "Made in America, Made in Mexico, or Made in China" before you make use of it, ...just row the boat to shore! Sheesh
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We spend more on illegals than they put it, deport them immediately. No illegal should get Medicare, Medical, Soc Security, etc because they are not citizens. Period. Maybe we should all flood into other countries and suck them dry all the while sending our money back to the US. When will people grow some balls with regards to illegals?
Seriously, just shoot them trying to come across the border. They die on the Mexico side and the only thing you have to possibly worry about is negligent discharge of a firearm....MAYBE.
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We spend more on illegals than they put it, deport them immediately. No illegal should get Medicare, Medical, Soc Security, etc because they are not citizens. Period. Maybe we should all flood into other countries and suck them dry all the while sending our money back to the US. When will people grow some balls with regards to illegals?
Seriously, just shoot them trying to come across the border. They die on the Mexico side and the only thing you have to possibly worry about is negligent discharge of a firearm....MAYBE.
Hmmmmm... Cappy, ...are you carb depleted these days? :D
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Jag you seem way to generous with other countries money....
Also, giving money to illegals isn't the solution, improving the system so none will be mistakenly identified is, but I guess it doesn't matter when the money isn't yours ah? ::)
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People with ID, driver's license or who have managed to learn fucking english wouldn't be mistaken as illegals.
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If people want to be here legally and work, then perhaps they would put into the system as much as they drain out.
Theres no excuse to support illegals coming in and lowering our wage base so that poverty continues to exist.
We need to lock all the borders and put our energy into our own country for awhile.......but no....Globalization will not let that happen.
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Jag you seem way to generous with other countries money....
Also, giving money to illegals isn't the solution, improving the system so none will be mistakenly identified is, but I guess it doesn't matter when the money isn't yours ah? ::)
Absolutely improving the system is the answer.
What I'm saying is the system in it's current state is flawed and misidentifies legal americans as illegals.
Therefore it would be a mistake to include it. You don't feed a tumour, you excise it.
It will cause too many problems, and cause too much of a bottle neck to sort things out.
A bottle neck is not what is need at this time, but a steady cash flow.
Fix it before you even consider implementing it, otherwise you'll create more problems than you solve.
We saw a similar fiasco here in Ontario in the early 90's when they tried to implement a stimulus.
They incentived businesses to hire more employees, but they didn't work the kinks out.
As a result, many of these businesses that otherwise couldn't afford to take on new hires did.
When the government didn't come through, it resulted in a nightmare. Employees found themselves not getting paid, and therefore unable to show up to work, which played havoc with many businesses, while others businesses were forced to allocate much needed resources towards meeting payrolls. The end result was more business failures than otherwise would have occurred.
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People with ID, driver's license or who have managed to learn fucking english wouldn't be mistaken as illegals.
Like the little blond haired, blue eyed 5 yr old California boy who was on the NO FLY list as a suspected terrorist. :P
{giggle} What am I thinking? The government would never screw up or make mistakes ...EVER. ::)
You noticed I didn't mention anything at all about screwing up the list of eligible voters. :P
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If people want to be here legally and work, then perhaps they would put into the system as much as they drain out.
That's the point I'm making. The people are already here, and do contribute to the economy.
Theres no excuse to support illegals coming in and lowering our wage base so that poverty continues to exist.
That's not what I'm advocating. I'm sorry if I gave that impression.
We need to lock all the borders and put our energy into our own country for awhile.......but no....Globalization will not let that happen.
You got that right. Too late to close the barn door. The horses have already gotten out.
Economies are too intertwined to disentangle them now without causing even far greater damage ... at this time.
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No prob, jag. The thread is titled "Illegal aliens" so thats more of a hardline for me than legals that actually work. ;)
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If people want to be here legally and work, then perhaps they would put into the system as much as they drain out.
Theres no excuse to support illegals coming in and lowering our wage base so that poverty continues to exist.
We need to lock all the borders and put our energy into our own country for awhile.......but no....Globalization will not let that happen.
I totally agree. We need a stimulus (spending) to go towards tight ass boarders. That would balance out the drain they put on our country economically. But i am scared of this. Im from California (7th largest economy in the world.) Boom.. The biggest part of that economy is Agriculture, not computers, not movies...Agri..A huge % of the labor force in Californias Agri are illegals that drive down the wages which inturn drives down overhead for producer which then keeps the price of lettuce cheap. If it went all legal and Juan Martinez was replaced by John Smith, the overhead would go up for Del Monte on acct of the price of labor...Del Monte isnt going to eat that, They are going to pass price on to the shcmuck who wants to make a fruit salad for the family bbq.
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I totally agree. We need a stimulus (spending) to go towards tight ass boarders. That would balance out the drain they put on our country economically. But i am scared of this. Im from California (7th largest economy in the world.) Boom.. The biggest part of that economy is Agriculture, not computers, not movies...Agri..A huge % of the labor force in Californias Agri are illegals that drive down the wages which inturn drives down overhead for producer which then keeps the price of lettuce cheap. If it went all legal and Juan Martinez was replaced by John Smith, the overhead would go up for Del Monte on acct of the price of labor...Del Monte isnt going to eat that, They are going to pass price on to the shcmuck who wants to make a fruit salad for the family bbq.
I would rather pay more for lettuce than for taxes to support these people.
We have many people who need jobs who could do this. I would rather pay more knowing that legal citizens are doing the work than illegal aliens who send the money home.
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Like the little blond haired, blue eyed 5 yr old California boy who was on the NO FLY list as a suspected terrorist. :P
{giggle} What am I thinking? The government would never screw up or make mistakes ...EVER. ::)
You noticed I didn't mention anything at all about screwing up the list of eligible voters. :P
What makes you think a blond haired, blue eyed person wouldn't be a terrorist? Islam is the fasted growing religion in the world.
Blacks and (I specifically mean African Americans) are the only people I would trust to not be suicide bombers. Only because culturally suicide is pretty rare because blacks (American) pretty much believe suicide is a straight path to hell.
Illegals shouldn't get shit and the children of illegals shouldn't be automatically granted citizenship. This issue will not ever be fully addressed because Florida, New Jersey and maybe Pennsylvania have the biggest Cuban populations and they have been abusing the US political process for years. True immigration reform would cost too many votes so the people in Arizona are screwed until mexicans start yelling "Allah Akbar" while crossing the border. :)
I would rather pay more for lettuce than for taxes to support these people.
We have many people who need jobs who could do this. I would rather pay more knowing that legal citizens are doing the work than illegal aliens who send the money home.
Amen!!
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I totally agree. We need a stimulus (spending) to go towards tight ass boarders. That would balance out the drain they put on our country economically. But i am scared of this. Im from California (7th largest economy in the world.) Boom.. The biggest part of that economy is Agriculture, not computers, not movies...Agri..A huge % of the labor force in Californias Agri are illegals that drive down the wages which inturn drives down overhead for producer which then keeps the price of lettuce cheap. If it went all legal and Juan Martinez was replaced by John Smith, the overhead would go up for Del Monte on acct of the price of labor...Del Monte isnt going to eat that, They are going to pass price on to the shcmuck who wants to make a fruit salad for the family bbq.
Very true. This is the point where capitialism begins to fall apart like a pyramid scheme. We could work for less if our costs of housing, food and other sources were kept inline. Normally supply and demand would balance the field in a free market.
But a few rich people come in and outbid you on a home in the neighborhood and all of a sudden everyone thinks their "Equity rich" and the middle class dissapear.
Greed always ruins the free market.
I realize this is off subject, but your point was well made and got me thinking. :)
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I would rather pay more for lettuce than for taxes to support these people.
We have many people who need jobs who could do this. I would rather pay more knowing that legal citizens are doing the work than illegal aliens who send the money home.
Ah haa. You are correct. So the elimination of the Income tax would offset the increase of the cost of produce (as it pertians to the average joe)
But jobs would be going to americans.. I guess thats the only upside. Because the focal point is "illegals dont pay income taxes" so if we did away with income tax and put americans to work on the strawberry fields it wouldt be any difference..oh well maybe we wont have that drain on resources...
man i dont know this shit is confusing.
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Ah haa. You are correct. So the elimination of the Income tax would offset the increase of the cost of produce (as it pertians to the average joe)
But jobs would be going to americans.. I guess thats the only upside. Because the focal point is "illegals dont pay income taxes" so if we did away with income tax and put americans to work on the strawberry fields it wouldt be any difference..oh well maybe we wont have that drain on resources...
man i dont know this shit is confusing.
No its, its that they cost us far more in excess of anything they put into the system.
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That's the point I'm making. The people are already here, and do contribute to the economy.
That's not what I'm advocating. I'm sorry if I gave that impression.
You got that right. Too late to close the barn door. The horses have already gotten out.
Economies are too intertwined to disentangle them now without causing even far greater damage ... at this time.
Bullshit, your excuse is that they are too deep in to get them out, well fucking bulllllshit.
Maybe it will cause a rough year while the transient state stabilizes but it will be much better afterwards.
And regarding the system, I prefer that people who deserve it will have to hustle through some extra paper work than giving money to illegals. You're basically saying that a doctor shouldn't do surgery to a patient because that surgery isn't 110% safe...buuullllshit, that excuse doesn't hold.
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No its, its that they cost us far more in excess of anything they put into the system.
I get that. But the fact remains that if we replace illegal with legal, are we willing to risk the reprecussions (sp) affected on wallets.
Im not defending it now and im not defending what happend, but America was built on the back of exploited peoples. Producers were able clock hella profit due the the lack of overhead.
Look at slavery.
We were able to purchase land from french and fund military on the backs of slaves. if slaves were made workers, we fuck around and be still be in negotiations with europe over Louisiana Territory.
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I get that. But the fact remains that if we replace illegal with legal, are we willing to risk the reprecussions (sp) affected on wallets.
Im not defending it now and im not defending what happend, but America was built on the back of exploited peoples. Producers were able clock hella profit due the the lack of overhead.
Look at slavery.
We were able to purchase land from french and fund military on the backs of slaves. if slaves were made workers, we fuck around and be still be in negotiations with europe over Louisiana Territory.
I know for one that I am ready to pay more knowing the legal homegrown people are doing these jobs as opposed to border jumpers.
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I know for one that I am ready to pay more knowing the legal homegrown people are doing these jobs as opposed to border jumpers.
Ok. From a patriotic sense I totally for what you are saying. But from a dollars cents standpoint, what would it cost. We are talking about 1 labor force effecting an entire industry or 2...if we could do it and somehow put some money back in joe blows pocket in order to offset the price it would be easier...
i dont know man. im just throwing stuff out. I dont know about this political shit.
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Traitors.
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Traitors.
joes?
yeah i shop there. what of it?
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I seriously can't understand how these people can actually do such a thing.
Someone should make a list of who were the fuckers that voted against it and remind everyone what these people when it's time to vote them in again.
Nothing will happen until one of those Senators or someone high up on the Pwoer and Money foodchain either gets hit by a Illegal on a DUI or a family member gets hit. Something has to happen to them before they feel it, and then "It's On"!
As a matter of fact, It seems like you get more privledges being a Illegal Immigrant than being a American Citizen.
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I know for one that I am ready to pay more knowing the legal homegrown people are doing these jobs as opposed to border jumpers.
Many people say this time and time again, ...however, in actual practice... the moment the price of something goes up, ...they're having a knipfit sending armies overseas waging war in order to get what they want as cheap as possible.
How many people said they'd be willing to pay more for gas, so long as they knew the money wasn't going to countries that want them gone... well guess what, people did pay more for their gas, ...and the wailing and the screaming could have been heard in China!
The fact is illegals have kept the state economies of Cali, Texas, Arizona and New Mexico afloat for years.
In a more just world, illegals wouldn't have to go to other countries and be exploited by large corporations. The only reason they are there is because extremely powerful interests want them there. In a perfect world, their countries would not be exploited by these same powerful interests. They would be able to stay in their country and earn a decent living for themselves and their families, not cross borders to be exploited.
Big_Mal understands the complexity of the dilemma. To skapegoat a people who have been such a valueable asset to you is not nice. It's insult on top of injury. bottom line is they ARE there, and their fortunes rest with the success or failure of the economy just like everyone else.
If I'm in a leaky boat that's taking on water, ...I'm calling for all hands on deck.
Grab those buckets and bail that water out as fast as you can,
...and I'm not about to nitpick about whether someone is a paid passenger or a stow-away.
I'm putting a bucket in his hand, and expecting him to bail water right along with the rest of us.
When the boat is safely ashore... then we will deal with his lack of a boarding pass.
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Many people say this time and time again, ...however, in actual practice... the moment the price of something goes up, ...they're having a knipfit sending armies overseas waging war in order to get what they want as cheap as possible.
How many people said they'd be willing to pay more for gas, so long as they knew the money wasn't going to countries that want them gone... well guess what, people did pay more for their gas, ...and the wailing and the screaming could have been heard in China!
The fact is illegals have kept the state economies of Cali, Texas, Arizona and New Mexico afloat for years.
In a more just world, illegals wouldn't have to go to other countries and be exploited by large corporations. The only reason they are there is because extremely powerful interests want them there. In a perfect world, their countries would not be exploited by these same powerful interests. They would be able to stay in their country and earn a decent living for themselves and their families, not cross borders to be exploited.
Big_Mal understands the complexity of the dilemma. To skapegoat a people who have been such a valueable asset to you is not nice. It's insult on top of injury. bottom line is they ARE there, and their fortunes rest with the success or failure of the economy just like everyone else.
If I'm in a leaky boat that's taking on water, ...I'm calling for all hands on deck.
Grab those buckets and bail that water out as fast as you can,
...and I'm not about to nitpick about whether someone is a paid passenger or a stow-away.
I'm putting a bucket in his hand, and expecting him to bail water right along with the rest of us.
When the boat is safely ashore... then we will deal with his lack of a boarding pass.
FUCKING GREAT ANALOGY!!!!
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FUCKING GREAT ANALOGY!!!!
Thank You!
How many times have you heard people say "I'd be willing to pay more if I knew the job was going to an American"?
Then they shop at Walmart, ...supporting Chinese manufactured goods and communism. HELLO!
Then when you mention it to them, ...they counter with, ...but it's cheaper at Walmart.
We're all in this together folks... bottom line. Don't allow yourself to get caught up in the hatred sown by others who want to scapegoat people and distract you from the real issues. If they can preoccupy your mind with anger towards their designated scapegoat long enough, ...you'll lack the clarity to figure things out, ...and that's exactly where they want you. There was a lot of things that went down over the past 8 years that sailed right by alot of people simply because they were distracted by lies and anger directed towards scapegoats.
"Guard against the impostures of pretended patriotism." --George Washington
“Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know?
For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar.” --Caesar
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Then send all the illegals to Canada.
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Then send all the illegals to Canada.
OK...that will be done as soon as the whites are sent back to Europe..... (Indians start celebrating)
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OK...that will be done as soon as the whites are sent back to Europe..... (Indians start celebrating)
And blacks sent back to Africa? Good logic.
Illegals have countries of origin. If they want to stay legally there are avenues for that, if not then they should be deported immediately.
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OK...that will be done as soon as the whites are sent back to Europe..... (Indians start celebrating)
Judi seems to believe there's no downside to illegals, LOL!
Illegals should have no right other than going the fuck home.
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Then send all the illegals to Canada.
(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/shocked.gif)
{lol} Oh Doc, ...trust me, ...you don't want that.
After the brutal cold snap we had the last few weeks, ...they'd be back in Cali in a heart beat,
...only now they'd be bringing a busload of Canadians with them once words gets out about the weather.
Not only would you never get rid of them... you'll end up with a huge influx of people all rallying for universal healthcare, same-sex marriage rights, decriminalized marijuana laws, and multi-culturalism. (http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/yippee.gif)
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And blacks sent back to Africa? Good logic.
He didn't make that analogy, and it's not a good one.
Blacks were brought here against their will, ...Europeans and illegals came willingly. big difference.
Go get yourself some carbs. ;)
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(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/shocked.gif)
{lol} Oh Doc, ...trust me, ...you don't want that.
After the brutal cold snap we had the last few weeks, ...they'd be back in Cali in a heart beat,
...only now they'd be bringing a busload of Canadians with them once words gets out about the weather.
Not only would you never get rid of them... you'll end up with a huge influx of people all rallying for universal healthcare, same-sex marriage rights, decriminalized marijuana laws, and multi-culturalism. (http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/yippee.gif)
You can put them all on welfare, LOL!
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He didn't make that analogy, and it's not a good one.
Blacks were brought here against their will, ...Europeans and illegals came willingly. big difference.
Go get yourself some carbs. ;)
They never left, much like the Europeans who were working off their debt in the "New World".
Even if you go back to the 1800s you still can't compare the illegals of today to the people coming through Ellis Island. There is a system in place for a reason and the sooner politicians start enforcing it the better this country, with states such as CA, will have a lot more money and a lot less problems. There should be no problems. You aren't legal, you don't stay. It really is that black and white.
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Judi seems to believe there's no downside to illegals, LOL!
Illegals should have no right other than going the fuck home.
(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/hmmm.gif)
That's not what I believe. Like everything there are downsides as well as an upside
And as for your second comment, ...sounds a little familiar...
Oh ya, reminds of that fuckackta quote "A Black man has no rights that any white man is obligated to respect."
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=66136.msg3708061#msg3708061 (http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=66136.msg3708061#msg3708061)
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They never left, much like the Europeans who were working off their debt in the "New World".
Even if you go back to the 1800s you still can't compare the illegals of today to the people coming through Ellis Island. There is a system in place for a reason and the sooner politicians start enforcing it the better this country, with states such as CA, will have a lot more money and a lot less problems. There should be no problems. You aren't legal, you don't stay. It really is that black and white.
Why am I not surprised that you see this in terms of black & white? ;) No... Your reasoning is the problem.
It is NOT black and white. There are infinite shades of grey and until you grasp that, it will never be worked out to yours or anyone else's satisfaction. What will happen after... will you drop a bunch of B52's on Mexico or Chile in order to get their produce, ...'cause Lord knows you wouldn't have any of your own.
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Why am I not surprised that you see this in terms of black & white? ;) No... Your reasoning is the problem.
It is NOT black and white. There are infinite shades of grey and until you grasp that, it will never be worked out to yours or anyone else's satisfaction. What will happen after... will you drop a bunch of B52's on Mexico or Chile in order to get their produce, ...'cause Lord knows you wouldn't have any of your own.
I guess it's easy to say since you don't have to pay for the illegals. If we didn't have millions of illegals to support this country would be a lot better off. We can still trade without having the crap of other nations squat here and live off the government tit.
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You can put them all on welfare, LOL!
Ya mean like the Walmart employees? :P
ps: When's the last time you caught Pagliacci? I noticed the aria in another thread.
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I guess it's easy to say since you don't have to pay for the illegals. If we didn't have millions of illegals to support this country would be a lot better off. We can still trade without having the crap of other nations squat here and live off the government tit.
(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/em/shicked.gif)
Have you forgotten who you're talking to? Dude, I'm Canadian!
We have universal healthcare, official bilingualism, and a bureaucracy that unofficially operates in 10 or 12 languages.
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Ya mean like the Walmart employees? :P
ps: When's the last time you caught Pagliacci? I noticed the aria in another thread.
Not in a while, LOL! Don't even know if it'll be one of the operas broadcast this year from the Met.
The US economy hasn't been good enough to float illegals for a long while but things won't change because of Florida so the subject isn't really worth discussing.
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Not in a while, LOL! Don't even know if it'll be one of the operas broadcast this year from the Met.
The US economy hasn't been good enough to float illegals for a long while but things won't change because of Florida so the subject isn't really worth discussing.
I'll load up a couple arias for you and PM them to ya. :D