Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: The True Adonis on March 04, 2009, 10:49:48 AM
-
I see this phrase a lot here and have struggled to even define it. Are there factions within bodybuilding that people align themselves with? Do people make trade offs, giving up something to get something? Are their compromises and litigation? Is there a campaign season? What system of rule can best be applied to the "politics of bodybuilding". What political theory is bodybuilding based off of? Who are the candidates and what are the issues?
-
I guess politics would serve to influence one thing over another? What is the motivation behind it?
-
Whatever it is, Nasser is a 'victim' of it. :)
-
I guess politics would serve to influence one thing over another? What is the motivation behind it?
All this squabbling over plastic trophies and ceramic commemorative plates. Seems like they could just Guest pose at their local Wal-Mart in the garment section and when they are done, go buy a few plates and a plastic trophy and forget the politics.
-
All this squabbling over plastic trophies and ceramic commemorative plates. Seems like they could just Guest pose at their local Wal-Mart in the garment section and when they are done, go buy a few plates and a plastic trophy and forget the politics.
Another favorite is, "you gotta pay your dues", bullshit.
-
another way to look at it...
BBing shows exist for what purpose?
1) To further the perfection of the human physique
2) To make money
Now, anytime the answer is 2, then you'll have the potential for manipulation of factors to benefit those who are making money, or, longterm sustainability of the sport itself as an earner for all parties involved.
Look at it this way... did Haney, Ronnie and Dorian deserve every Sandow? Probably not. But did it serve the sport better to have a dynasty, in terms of marketing efforts, product branding, and cult personality recognition with fans.
maybe.
-
another way to look at it...
BBing shows exist for what purpose?
1) To further the perfection of the human physique
2) To make money
Now, anytime the answer is 2, then you'll have the potential for manipulation of factors to benefit those who are making money, or, longterm sustainability of the sport itself as an earner for all parties involved.
Look at it this way... did Haney, Ronnie and Dorian deserve every Sandow? Probably not. But did it serve the sport better to have a dynasty, in terms of marketing efforts, product branding, and cult personality recognition with fans.
maybe.
People don't do anything to any noticable level unless their is a motivation to make a profit from it or it remains a hobby.
Weider for example probably cared about physical culture but liked it more because he could make a buck off it. Politics in this case could be a marketable person winning a show to promote your products verses a guy who is an introvert or fucks fruit on the side.
-
People don't do anything to any noticable level unless their is a motivation to make a profit from it or it remains a hobby.
Weider for example probably cared about physical culture but liked it more because he could make a buck off it. Politics in this case could be a marketable person winning a show to promote your products verses a guy who is an introvert or fucks fruit on the side.
There are lots of ppl who are involved with the sport because they love it. They attend shows, collect mags... it's a hobby.
There are others who are in it for profit, of course.
I think the term 'politics' involves manipulating any factors to increase either profit or longterm sustainability of sport or brand. It's a part of business.
-
Whatever it is, Nasser is a 'victim' of it. :)
lmao best post
-
if you don't schmoe you don't go
-
I was hoping someone could spill the beans on the backroom deals and actual politicking. Shouldn`t there be known agreements if this kind of stuff were taking place? Surely somebody has a story to tell if this is the case.
-
I see this phrase a lot here and have struggled to even define it. Are there factions within bodybuilding that people align themselves with? Do people make trade offs, giving up something to get something? Are their compromises and litigation? Is there a campaign season? What system of rule can best be applied to the "politics of bodybuilding". What political theory is bodybuilding based off of? Who are the candidates and what are the issues?
Yes.
-
Yes.
Haha ;D
-
Haha ;D
;D
-
I was hoping someone could spill the beans on the backroom deals and actual politicking. Shouldn`t there be known agreements if this kind of stuff were taking place? Surely somebody has a story to tell if this is the case.
I'm sure it involves getting on your knees in front of the judges...if you know what I mean..
-
This is what it means:
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3128/2603269630_6a46e98abc.jpg)
-
I see this phrase a lot here and have struggled to even define it. Are there factions within bodybuilding that people align themselves with? Do people make trade offs, giving up something to get something? Are their compromises and litigation?
Let's see, they trade off their self-respect (and anal virginity) to judges and "sponsors", they compromise their integrity everytime they open their mouths and claim their physiques were built by Muscletech, they compromise their long-term health with every additional compound they inject. Any more? ::)
-
it means this: 8)
-
it means this: 8)
Was Yates winning predetermined? Were the judges bought off? How was it orchestrated? How was the deal kept secret?
The politics involved means popular opinion influences the judges, like everyone. If there are actual deals made with predetermined winners please give an example.
-
Was Yates winning predetermined? Were the judges bought off? How was it orchestrated? How was the deal kept secret?
The politics involved means popular opinion influences the judges, like everyone. If there are actual deals made with predetermined winners please give an example.
Great post ! he can't and wont he's been called on this eons ago. he's not to sophisticated he's the moron who claims Ronnie dominated in 2001
-
So everyone claims politics but there is zero evidence of backroom deals and secret agreements?
-
Politics in bodybuilding is a load of shit and just another excuse the competitors who lost or placed lower than what they were expecting (along with the people who support them, such as family, fans and friends) use, to try and justify their feelings or placings. Bodybuilding is subjective and not objective like a running race, where he / she who reaches the line first wins. So every person has their own opinion on who should have placed where and why. And when that doesn't happen, the losers and conspiracy theorists among them scream politics.
Every single conspiracy theory and assertion about politics has been disproven in bodybuilding - saying the Mr Olympia will be awarded only to Americans or Whites or Blacks, saying that the Mr Olympia title is about establishing long-term reigns and dynasties, saying that judges are racially and ethnically biased etc etc
Judging isn't done by one person - it's done by a whole panel of people, so there goes the theory that if you aren't in a judge's good books, you will end up paying the price (the highest and lowest scores are eliminated in bodybuilding, BTW). Look at Team Nasser who scream politics as the reason why Nasser didn't win the Mr Olympia, even though there are TONS of people (including myself) who think he always got beaten by a better bodybuilder.
Team Nasser says Nasser didn't win because of race, which got disproved when he won the Arnold Classic. They say he got marked down for being Arab, when he won tons of contests and was placed as high as second place in the Mr Olympia. Nasser won and lost contests in the same year, in front of different judging panels, in different countries, just like his counterparts such as Shawn, Flex and K Lo, none of who were as dominant as Dorian or Ronnie during their reign.
Not saying there is no politics in the IFBB, just that it doesn't play a role, at least to the extent some of the people here say.
-
Every single conspiracy theory and assertion about politics has been disproven in bodybuilding
Every one? Really?
Link?
-
Every one? Really?
Link?
Haha how do you mean 'link'? There isn't a dedicated webpage that has a Q&A or 'Theory:Fact' section that lists them one by one. Mind you, I am aware of situations like the ones the WBF guys had to face when they came back to the IFBB, Sergio Oliva's situation and so on. I'm talking about the IFBB now, where the decisions don't boil down to Joe and Ben Weider (i.e individuals).
Feel free to list some theory and prove me wrong, 240 - I am only talking about contest decisions and not anything else. You won't find a single factor that doesn't have an exception or a decision that isn't subjective.
-
Every single conspiracy theory and assertion about politics has been disproven in bodybuilding
First you say there are no politics.
Not saying there is no politics in the IFBB, just that it doesn't play a role, at least to the extent some of the people here say.
Then you say it doesn't play a role.
Then you say it only plays a minor role.
I'm just trying to nail down your position.
-
Haha how do you mean 'link'? There isn't a dedicated webpage that has a Q&A or 'Theory:Fact' section that lists them one by one. Mind you, I am aware of situations like the ones the WBF guys had to face when they came back to the IFBB, Sergio Oliva's situation and so on. I'm talking about the IFBB now, where the decisions don't boil down to Joe and Ben Weider (i.e individuals).
Feel free to list some theory and prove me wrong, 240 - I am only talking about contest decisions and not anything else. You won't find a single factor that doesn't have an exception or a decision that isn't subjective.
See, IMO, if there has ever been a decision rendered based upon politics, grudges, WBF drama, etc, then yes, at some point a conspiracy did take place, and indeed the conspirac theorists are sometimes correct.
Did any WBF guy ever get a shittyplacing based upon punking the IFBB? Of course. That was politics. Whoever delivered that placing was conspiring with the other judges to deliver a result contrary to BBing judging criteria.
-
First you say there are no politics.
Then you say it doesn't play a role.
Then you say it only plays a minor role.
I'm just trying to nail down your position.
OK, I'm saying that there is politics in bodybuilding when it comes to things like contracts and such, but NOT when it comes to contest decisions, which is the only part of bodybuilding a lot of us are really interested in. Contests are judged by a panel of people and there are people who judged contests in the past who have walked away from the IFBB due to disagreements. Not a single one of them has 'blown the whistle' or talked about how they were paid or threatened or whatever to place someone higher or lower or whatever.
-
I think one of the radio programs should get a retired IFBB judge on so he can take these kind of questions.
-
Was Yates winning predetermined? Were the judges bought off? How was it orchestrated? How was the deal kept secret?
its Joe Weider's contest. and the Weiders are the IFBB.
its not hard. if they want someone to win, they are going to win.
its their contest and its that simple.
eg. a judge actually said dorian's missing arm 'made no difference'?
you really think an unbiased judge would say that?
come on. ::)
look at the Gunter ronnie fiasco. they wanted Gunter to win to stir up interest in the Olympia and it worked.
the fix was on.
-
I see this phrase a lot here and have struggled to even define it. Are there factions within bodybuilding that people align themselves with? Do people make trade offs, giving up something to get something? Are their compromises and litigation? Is there a campaign season? What system of rule can best be applied to the "politics of bodybuilding". What political theory is bodybuilding based off of? Who are the candidates and what are the issues?
hahahahah stfu... you just googled "politics" and made the "analogy" in your high school level brain ::)
oh brother what a fucking delusionite.. in the meantime: http://www.xtranormal.com/watch?e=20090304015714671
-
It means this:
There are a lot of things going on under the table wether be it money or sexual favors!
I heard it goes on a lot in figure competitions!
-
Every one? Really?
Link?
Pics or it didn't happen!
-
OK, I'm saying that there is politics in bodybuilding when it comes to things like contracts and such, but NOT when it comes to contest decisions, which is the only part of bodybuilding a lot of us are really interested in. Contests are judged by a panel of people and there are people who judged contests in the past who have walked away from the IFBB due to disagreements. Not a single one of them has 'blown the whistle' or talked about how they were paid or threatened or whatever to place someone higher or lower or whatever.
Oh, yeah... like one of the judges is going to say, "I told bodybuilder X I'd place him higher if he gave me a blowjob". ::)
And you don't think contracts come from contest placings? ::)
-
its Joe Weider's contest. and the Weiders are the IFBB.
its not hard. if they want someone to win, they are going to win.
its their contest and its that simple.
eg. a judge actually said dorian's missing arm 'made no difference'?
you really think an unbiased judge would say that?
come on. ::)
look at the Gunter ronnie fiasco. they wanted Gunter to win to stir up interest in the Olympia and it worked.
the fix was on.
I believe there's politics but not in the way we (you) think. Do you really think Joe Weider has given orders in recent years on who will win etc? How is this kept a secret with so many judges and officials having to keep their mouths shut?
Like I said, popular opinion influences the judges just like anyone. Dorian was promoted by McGough and things like this influence people (not saying that I don't think Dorian was an amazing bb, one of the best ever).
Answer this: do you think orders on who will place where come from "the top"? Do you think Arnold has looked at this years AC competitors and decided who will place where and who will absolutely not be allowed to win?
-
Simple:
If your boy wins, then the judging is fair.
If your boy loses, then it's corruption/ politics.
My boy ,Dorian, rarely lost so the judging was fair. However, politics saw Haney beat him when Doz deserved the prize ;D
-
Oh, yeah... like one of the judges is going to say, "I told bodybuilder X I'd place him higher if he gave me a blowjob". ::)
And you don't think contracts come from contest placings? ::)
Individual cases like this are possible but what about orders coming from the top? Or Muscletech contracts where Jay was guaranteed a win like Coach said and things like that?
-
the dude has a tire valve for a penis
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=268003.0;attach=307499;image)
-
Simple:
If your boy wins, then the judging is fair.
If your boy loses, then it's corruption/ politics.
My boy ,Dorian, rarely lost so the judging was fair. However, politics saw Haney beat him when Doz deserved the prize ;D
Spoken efficiently and smartly. You are a true equilizer & Terryfier.
and yes, quite the penile tire valve above.
-
A lot of the judging is pretty bad. If someone is new to the judges they'll get overlooked. If someone has a hype machine behind them then they get a good look. If you look bad in one show, the judges won't look at you as much in your next show. And other issues like bad callouts, or feeling the current Mr.O is perfection that all must be compared to. Chick mentions some of this stuff on PBW from time to time.
-
its Joe Weider's contest. and the Weiders are the IFBB.
its not hard. if they want someone to win, they are going to win.
its their contest and its that simple.
eg. a judge actually said dorian's missing arm 'made no difference'?
you really think an unbiased judge would say that?
come on. ::)
look at the Gunter ronnie fiasco. they wanted Gunter to win to stir up interest in the Olympia and it worked.
the fix was on.
Yet you're the complete moron who feels comfortable claiming Ronnie ' dominated ' in 2001 lmfao your hypocrisy knows no end. the judge said in 1994 that Dorian's bicep tear made " No overall difference " which was true because it was visible in just the front double biceps pose. you can't admit this because it doesn't fit into your beliefs
if you claim Dorian's wins were due to politics than so was every single one of Ronnies , you can't have it both ways , either they fix all contests are none , especially in 2001 when Ronnie losing both the prejudging & muscularity rounds and still wins the contest .
-
victor martinez was clear winner in 2007 and ronnie should not be in top 6 in 2008.can u call it politics or just bad judging.
-
victor martinez was clear winner in 2007 and ronnie should not be in top 6 in 2008.can u call it politics or just bad judging.
you're a myth, so we don't believe you...
-
-
Simple:
If your boy wins, then the judging is fair.
If your boy loses, then it's corruption/ politics.
My boy ,Dorian, rarely lost so the judging was fair. However, politics saw Haney beat him when Doz deserved the prize ;D
Didn't Dorian stay with Weinberger (an Olympia judge) when he was in the states for the Olympia?? ::)
I don't know about politics, but you can't say that's exactly "fair" :-\
-
I agree with Kiwiol's stand on "politics" just about 99%.
"It was political!", is simply a statement often expressed since the early 60's by competitive bodybuilders who placed less than first. It's just a way of blaming someone else for their less than anticipated performance.
And over the years "It's political!" somehow got misconstrued by family, friends, and fans to be something that it really "ain't".
Nothing underhanded or subversive about it.
Just an excuse for not winning the trophy.