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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Dos Equis on June 25, 2009, 12:54:50 PM
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What does this mean? After the last two high profile Republican dummies were outed for cheating on their wives, I heard the liberal talking point all over the media and by some on the board that call Republican philanderers "hypocrites" because they are supposedly the party of "family values." I took a look at the Democrat and Republican national platforms and they both mention "morality" and "family values," but neither really seem to have a clear definition.
For example, from the Democrat platform:
"We honor the central place of faith in our lives. Like our Founders, we believe that our nation, our communities, and our lives are made vastly stronger and richer by faith and the countless acts of justice and mercy it inspires."
It's time we stop just talking about family values and start pursuing policies that truly value families."
http://www.democrats.org/a/party/platform.html
The Republican platform mentions "family values" in the context of preserving traditional marriage:
"Because our children’s future is best preserved within the traditional understanding of marriage, we call for a constitutional amendment that fully protects marriage as a union of a man and a woman, so that judges cannot make other arrangements equivalent to it. In the absence of a national amendment, we support the right of the people of the various states to affirm traditional marriage through state initiatives.
Republicans recognize the importance of having in the home a father and a mother who are married. The two-parent family still provides the best environment of stability, discipline, responsibility, and character. Children in homes without fathers are more likely to commit a crime, drop out of school, become violent, become teen parents, use illegal drugs, become mired in poverty, or have emotional or behavioral problems. We support the courageous efforts of single-parent families to provide a stable home for their children. Children are our nation’s most precious resource. We also salute and support the efforts of foster and adoptive families.
Republicans have been at the forefront of protecting traditional marriage laws, both in the states and in Congress. A Republican Congress enacted the Defense of Marriage Act, affirming the right of states not to recognize same-sex “marriages” licensed in other states. Unbelievably, the Democratic Party has now pledged to repeal the Defense of Marriage Act, which would subject every state to the redefinition of marriage by a judge without ever allowing the people to vote on the matter. We also urge Congress to use its Article III, Section 2 power to prevent activist federal judges from imposing upon the rest of the nation the judicial activism in Massachusetts and California. We also encourage states to review their marriage and divorce laws in order to strengthen marriage.
As the family is our basic unit of society, we oppose initiatives to erode parental rights."
http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Values.htm
What exactly is the definition of "family values" from a public policy standpoint?
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Family Values are stupid, nonsense things that fool the uneducated and the religious which are synonymous and reciprocal of course.
The GOP seized on that during the Clinton years. Bad move. VERY bad move and of course the dumb public fell right for it. The GOP didn`t get the memo that human desire knows no party lines.
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Family Values are stupid, nonsense things that fool the uneducated and the religious which are synonymous and reciprocal of course.
The GOP seized on that during the Clinton years. Bad move. VERY bad move and of course the dumb public fell right for it. The GOP didn`t get the memo that human desire knows no party lines.
Really? Family Values are stupid? Then what values are cool?
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Really? Family Values are stupid? Then what values are cool?
Stupid if you are concerned about others personal lives.
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Family Values are stupid, nonsense things that fool the uneducated and the religious which are synonymous and reciprocal of course.
The GOP seized on that during the Clinton years. Bad move. VERY bad move and of course the dumb public fell right for it. The GOP didn`t get the memo that human desire knows no party lines.
What's your definition?
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What's your definition?
I don`t think it fits into a definition.
The scope and range of the whole matter is too big to define, not to mention Zeitgeist dependent which renders the entire idea amorphous and directional (always progressive).
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I don`t think it fits into a definition.
The scope and range of the whole matter is too big to define, not to mention Zeitgeist dependent which renders the entire idea amorphous and directional (always progressive).
What? What the heck does that mean?
And how can you use the phrase and call them "stupid, nonsense things that fool the uneducated and the religious" when you can't even define what they are?
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What? What the heck does that mean?
And how can you use the phrase and call them "stupid, nonsense things that fool the uneducated and the religious" when you can't even define what they are?
You asked me for my personal definition of "family values" and I gave why I don`t believe there is one.
My statement above is referencing the idiocity of america and what they conceptualize as being "family values" as if everyone shares the same norms, mores and folkways and as if all families are to be mirrored off one another.
What if you are the sole surviving member of your family and do not want children or have a wife. This family values thing is relatively new. Nobody cared that FDR had plenty of mistresses or that Eisenhower was seeing a British spy and wanted to divorce his wife, or that Warren G Harding screwed a young girl in a coat closet in the White House, or that JFK probably did the nasty with Monroe, or that Thomas Jefferson had a few black children. The list can go on and on and on, especially when you include Senators and Congressmen. Washington D.C. used to be famed for their whorehouses and politician visits from 1799 to the 20 th century.
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You asked me for my personal definition of "family values" and I gave why I don`t believe there is one.
My statement above is referencing the idiocity of america and what they conceptualize as being "family values" as if everyone shares the same norms, mores and folkways and as if all families are to be mirrored off one another.
What if you are the sole surviving member of your family and do not want children or have a wife. This family values thing is relatively new. Nobody cared that FDR had plenty of mistresses or that Eisenhower was seeing a British spy and wanted to divorce his wife, or that Warren G Harding screwed a young girl in a coat closet in the White House, or that JFK probably did the nasty with Monroe, or that Thomas Jefferson had a few black children. The list can go on and on and on, especially when you include Senators and Congressmen. Washington D.C. used to be famed for their whorehouses and politician visits from 1799 to the 20 th century.
Rewind. I asked at the start of the thread for a definition of "family values" from a public policy standpoint. You responded by calling "family values" stupid, etc. I then asked again for a definition. You then responded and said you don't have one.
Again I'll say it's pretty silly to call something stupid that you can't even define.
Now you've gone and talked specifically about family values consisting of certain "norms, mores and folkways." That must be your definition. Are you confusing yourself? lol . . .
In any event, there are many universal "norms, mores and folkways" in this country, including honesty, integrity, fidelity, etc.
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Stupid if you are concerned about others personal lives.
are you saying we shouldn't be concerned about other peoples personal lives?
do you believe the breakdown of the traditional family has no negative consequences on society?
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are you saying we shouldn't be concerned about other peoples personal lives?
do you believe the breakdown of the traditional family has no negative consequences on society?
There is no such thing as a traditional family. Unless you are fooled by sitcoms from the 50s.
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are you saying we shouldn't be concerned about other peoples personal lives?
do you believe the breakdown of the traditional family has no negative consequences on society?
I can answer that one. :)
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I can answer that one. :)
please do.
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Leave Sanford alone!
I do think it was really dangerous of him to not notify any of his staff or the lieutenant governor of his whereabouts.
Fault him on that, but don`t fault his love life.
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please do.
We're always concerned about people's personal lives in some form. I don't think that concern is what "family values" is all about.
I absolutely believe many of the pervasive problems we have in our society are due to the breakdown of the family. A two-parent household, and particularly a strong father, are most conducive to raising healthy, happy, well adjusted children.
For example, I bet if we were to walk through any prison in America we'd find the majority of prisoners did not come from a solid two-parent household.
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We're always concerned about people's personal lives in some form. I don't think that concern is what "family values" is all about.
I absolutely believe many of the pervasive problems we have in our society are due to the breakdown of the family. A two-parent household, and particularly a strong father, are most conducive to raising healthy, happy, well adjusted children.
For example, I bet if we were to walk through any prison in America we'd find the majority of prisoners did not come from a solid two-parent household.
What happens when your parents die like mine did?
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What happens when your parents die like mine did?
Or they divorce like mine did? You adapt and do the best you can in whatever situation you find yourself in. Neither of our situations changes the fact that a solid two-parent household is the ideal environment for kids.
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Leave Sanford alone!
I do think it was really dangerous of him to not notify any of his staff or the lieutenant governor of his whereabouts.
Fault him on that, but don`t fault his love life.
yes, leave sanford alone! he, though taking vows of marriage and bringing four children into the world and being a representative of his state and our country should be able to wet his wick with anyone he wants. it shouldn't affect anyone's perceptions of this man who by the way came across at his press conference as a babbling lovesick pathetic individual.
this guy doesn't have the self-control or level-headedness needed to run a state. he should resign.
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I absolutely believe many of the pervasive problems we have in our society are due to the breakdown of the family. A two-parent household, and particularly a strong father, are most conducive to raising healthy, happy, well adjusted children.
i concur.
What happens when your parents die like mine did?
sorry to hear about that true adonis. i have sincere questions about this but they may seem insensitive so i will refrain out of respect to you and your parents.
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Or they divorce like mine did? You adapt and do the best you can in whatever situation you find yourself in. Neither of our situations changes the fact that a solid two-parent household is the ideal environment for kids.
Yep
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What does this mean? After the last two high profile Republican dummies were outed for cheating on their wives, I heard the liberal talking point all over the media and by some on the board that call Republican philanderers "hypocrites" because they are supposedly the party of "family values." I took a look at the Democrat and Republican national platforms and they both mention "morality" and "family values," but neither really seem to have a clear definition.
For example, from the Democrat platform:
"We honor the central place of faith in our lives. Like our Founders, we believe that our nation, our communities, and our lives are made vastly stronger and richer by faith and the countless acts of justice and mercy it inspires."
It's time we stop just talking about family values and start pursuing policies that truly value families."
http://www.democrats.org/a/party/platform.html
The Republican platform mentions "family values" in the context of preserving traditional marriage:
"Because our children’s future is best preserved within the traditional understanding of marriage, we call for a constitutional amendment that fully protects marriage as a union of a man and a woman, so that judges cannot make other arrangements equivalent to it. In the absence of a national amendment, we support the right of the people of the various states to affirm traditional marriage through state initiatives.
Republicans recognize the importance of having in the home a father and a mother who are married. The two-parent family still provides the best environment of stability, discipline, responsibility, and character. Children in homes without fathers are more likely to commit a crime, drop out of school, become violent, become teen parents, use illegal drugs, become mired in poverty, or have emotional or behavioral problems. We support the courageous efforts of single-parent families to provide a stable home for their children. Children are our nation’s most precious resource. We also salute and support the efforts of foster and adoptive families.
Republicans have been at the forefront of protecting traditional marriage laws, both in the states and in Congress. A Republican Congress enacted the Defense of Marriage Act, affirming the right of states not to recognize same-sex “marriages” licensed in other states. Unbelievably, the Democratic Party has now pledged to repeal the Defense of Marriage Act, which would subject every state to the redefinition of marriage by a judge without ever allowing the people to vote on the matter. We also urge Congress to use its Article III, Section 2 power to prevent activist federal judges from imposing upon the rest of the nation the judicial activism in Massachusetts and California. We also encourage states to review their marriage and divorce laws in order to strengthen marriage.
As the family is our basic unit of society, we oppose initiatives to erode parental rights."
http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Values.htm
What exactly is the definition of "family values" from a public policy standpoint?
Tu what are your comments on this?
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We're always concerned about people's personal lives in some form. I don't think that concern is what "family values" is all about.
I absolutely believe many of the pervasive problems we have in our society are due to the breakdown of the family. A two-parent household, and particularly a strong father, are most conducive to raising healthy, happy, well adjusted children.
For example, I bet if we were to walk through any prison in America we'd find the majority of prisoners did not come from a solid two-parent household.
This is true and backed by many studies...
Actually T.A. "family values" have been around for a long long long time not necissarily in the form they are in right now but in some form or another yes they have.
I love how you come in here with your arrogance only to show your ignorance quit getting your info from youtube.
While paticular family values differ from person to person and culture to culture there are similarities and what one might call core values that transcend culture and time. You really dont think its a coincidence that everybody likes a book on the NY times best sellers list or that the basic plots in movies from different cultures are very similar do you? There are things called archetypes(you should look that up) and these things play to the archetypes and ring the tuning fork in us.
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This is true and backed by many studies...
Actually T.A. "family values" have been around for a long long long time not necissarily in the form they are in right now but in some form or another yes they have.
I love how you come in here with your arrogance only to show your ignorance quit getting your info from youtube.
While paticular family values differ from person to person and culture to culture there are similarities and what one might call core values that transcend culture and time. You really dont think its a coincidence that everybody likes a book on the NY times best sellers list or that the basic plots in movies from different cultures are very similar do you? There are things called archetypes(you should look that up) and these things play to the archetypes and ring the tuning fork in us.
I like this. Well said tony.
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Take the Bush "family values" for example. Criminal records galore... :-X
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Bump. JBGRAY, note the Democrat emphasis on faith and family values in their platform.
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There's no reason to be concerned about somebody else's personal life. IMO...two homos want to marry then let them. It's really not my business. Personally, I don't understand why the govt. even gets involved in marriage licenses...what business is it of theirs? Just another part of my life for them to get involved. However, the left believes in collectivism...so it's pretty hypocritical to listen to them to preach individuality.
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There's no reason to be concerned about somebody else's personal life. IMO...two homos want to marry then let them. It's really not my business. Personally, I don't understand why the govt. even gets involved in marriage licenses...what business is it of theirs? Just another part of my life for them to get involved. However, the left believes in collectivism...so it's pretty hypocritical to listen to them to preach individuality.
I think the government's involvement in public policy that promotes strong families is a good thing. Strong families are the backbone of our society.
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I think the government's involvement in public policy that promotes strong families is a good thing. Strong families are the backbone of our society.
What is your definition of a strong family?
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What is your definition of a strong family?
Ideally, a strong father who is able to provide for his wife and kids (if any), a wife who has the option to be a full-time mom if she chooses, and healthy, well adjusted kids.