Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Bast175 on July 03, 2009, 09:55:28 PM
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aminos acids, besides from protein powder?
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If you're getting lots of complete protein, I've never really understood the point of supplementing free-form amino acids. The protein you take in gets broken down into its constituent amino acids anyway. I think it's just another way for supplement-hawkers to earn coin.
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Well, non-standard amino acids (GABA for one) aren't included in protein. GABA supposedly has an immediate calming effect when supplemented.
Also I wonder if taking higher levels of BCAA's than what we get from food and supplemented protein can help with neurotransmitter deficiencies...
I will be trying this personally. I ordered 10 different products... $50.
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gaba in hight dose make u feel high as fuck and give you weird dreams.....
also how can anyone here deny the benefit of some sort of rapid release bcaa in post work out scenario??
sure its not a whole protein, but if your following protocol and having whole protein source in a sane time frame after workout, how can a bcaa NOT be beneficial from a biochemical/recovery standpoint?
necessary...maybe not....but thats not really the point of the arguement was it
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Well, non-standard amino acids (GABA for one) aren't included in protein. GABA supposedly has an immediate calming effect when supplemented.
Also I wonder if taking higher levels of BCAA's than what we get from food and supplemented protein can help with neurotransmitter deficiencies...
I will be trying this personally. I ordered 10 different products... $50.
With the extremely high amount of protein we bodybuilders eat, I seriously doubt any of us are deficient in BCAA's.
With regard to GABA, I wasn't familiar, so I read up on it:
Although chemically it is an amino acid, GABA is rarely referred to as such in the scientific or medical communities, because the term "amino acid," used without a qualifier, refers to the alpha amino acids, which GABA is not, nor is it incorporated into proteins.
So you are correct, we don't get it directly from the protein we injest. But...
Organisms synthesize GABA from glutamate using the enzyme L-glutamic acid decarboxylase and pyridoxal phosphate (which is the active form of vitamin B6) as a cofactor. This process converts glutamate, the principal excitatory neurotransmitter, into the principal inhibitory neurotransmitter (GABA).[17][18]
So it seems to me that as long as your intake of glutamate (from protein) and Vitamin B6 is sufficient, you should be good to go and have no need to supplement.
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also how can anyone here deny the benefit of some sort of rapid release bcaa in post work out scenario??
sure its not a whole protein, but if your following protocol and having whole protein source in a sane time frame after workout, how can a bcaa NOT be beneficial from a biochemical/recovery standpoint?
If you eat lots of protein, you'll have plenty of BCAA's floating around your system. You eat protein, and your body digests it and breaks it down into the amino acids that make it up, including leucine, isoleucine and valine (the branch-chain amino acids).
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With the extremely high amount of protein we bodybuilders eat, I seriously doubt any of us are deficient in BCAA's.
With regard to GABA, I wasn't familiar, so I read up on it:
So you are correct, we don't get it directly from the protein we injest. But...
So it seems to me that as long as your intake of glutamate (from protein) and Vitamin B6 is sufficient, you should be good to go and have no need to supplement.
I have had people tell me they tried GABA and they felt immediate effects from it. So if that helps me get to sleep quicker when my mind is racing on certain nights then it will be well worth trying. I figured I would try other amino acids in the process.
Also, personally I get moderate amounts of protein. I eat low calorie.
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GABA supposedly has an immediate calming effect when supplemented.
So does Xanax, and at least with that it's cheap and I know it works.
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So does Xanax, and at least with that it's cheap and I know it works.
haha, I have it actually. They say it's addictive so I don't take it often.
GABA is cheap as well.
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haha, I have it actually. They say it's addictive so I don't take it often.
On average I might take one pill 3 or 4 days out of a week, depending on how much stress I'm under on any given day. As long as you're not taking it every day or more than once a day, addiction usually isn't a problem.
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On average I might take one pill 3 or 4 days out of a week, depending on how much stress I'm under on any given day. As long as you're not taking it every day or more than once a day, addiction usually isn't a problem.
Yea, and I've never had addiction issues with anything. I just don't want to rely on something that I need to get permission to refill each month. Bullshit drug laws
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If you eat lots of protein, you'll have plenty of BCAA's floating around your system. You eat protein, and your body digests it and breaks it down into the amino acids that make it up, including leucine, isoleucine and valine (the branch-chain amino acids).
uhh...ok..we all know aminos are broken into their constituent elements...some not specifically BRANCH chain, but i digress...
my arguement was based on the benefit of bcaa supplementation SPECIFICALLY in a post workout enviroment....and the differences in muscle uptake and retention thereof...
test is made up of cholesterol, but its a hell a lot more efficient and biochemically prudent to SHOOT the shit if we wanna really get a benefit......follow me??....im getting at direct influx at the biological apex of necessity of certain aminos to kick start the recovery process...we still gonna need the constant influx of protein regadless.....
once again, will it make a HUGE difference...maybe not.....but that was not the point of the point...ya know.
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if they aren't found in natural foods, which the body have evolved to use for optimal health, chances are they're not needed, and/or are over hyped supplement junk.
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once again, will it make a HUGE difference...maybe not.....but that was not the point of the point...ya know.
With regard to supplements, I'm of the view that unless it's injectable and you need a prescription for it, it probably ain't gonna make much of a difference at all.
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With regard to supplements, I'm of the view that unless it's injectable and you need a prescription for it, it probably ain't gonna make much of a difference at all.
well...those are the better ones!!...lol....
but the reality is that a supplement is just that.....a supplement.....designed to SUPPLEMENT the holes in your nutrition or your nutrition goals.....and for THAT SPECIFIC value they do fill a gap.....necessary.....no i guess not...unless you wanna try and eat 25g creatine or some shit in your plan if that is your plan....some values of consumption from whole foods are just not realistic unless you wanna sit at home and cook and eat all day....
but hey....i knew a guy who drank wesson oil for calories....and truth be told he was big and strong as fuck!! stupid....probably...... ..healthy....i can only imagine not.....
to each their own....
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well...those are the better ones!!...lol....
but the reality is that a supplement is just that.....a supplement.....designed to SUPPLEMENT the holes in your nutrition or your nutrition goals.....and for THAT SPECIFIC value they do fill a gap.....necessary.....no i guess not...unless you wanna try and eat 25g creatine or some shit in your plan if that is your plan....some values of consumption from whole foods are just not realistic unless you wanna sit at home and cook and eat all day....
but hey....i knew a guy who drank wesson oil for calories....and truth be told he was big and strong as fuck!! stupid....probably...... ..healthy....i can only imagine not.....
to each their own....
Yes but we want to avoid supplements that don't give us noticeable results. That's what he is saying.
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well...then dont buy pretty much anything they advertize....LOL...(and i sell this shit for a living mind you)...
i never seen a supp give noticable results over a decent diet.....save for prosteroids and the like which are just pretty much otc dianabol...hehe..
BUT if you can use a supp to fix a HOLE in your diet, or nutrition, or whatever, then it becomes a noticable adjunct to that individual.....not so much because of the super mega secret formula, but just cuz you plugged the hole that was leaking your results.....
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Well, non-standard amino acids (GABA for one) aren't included in protein. GABA supposedly has an immediate calming effect when supplemented.
Also I wonder if taking higher levels of BCAA's than what we get from food and supplemented protein can help with neurotransmitter deficiencies...
I will be trying this personally. I ordered 10 different products... $50.
Great post bast and owning goatshit to no end.
GABA is great so is Tryptophan.
Tyrosine improves mental performance and also use DMAE and Vinpocetine. Make a big difference IMO.
Also fish greatly improve your positiveness.
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Great post bast and owning goatshit to no end.
GABA is great so is Tryptophan.
Tyrosine improves mental performance and also use DMAE and Vinpocetine. Make a big difference IMO.
Also fish greatly improve your positiveness.
Good info.
Here's what I ordered yesterday:
1 [Orange] Source Naturals GABA Calm Subli $4.95
1 Source Naturals GABA 750mg 45 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals 5-HTP 50mg 30 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DMAE 351mg 50 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DLPA 375mg 60 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals N-Acetyl Cysteine 600mg $4.95
1 NOW Foods DOPA Mucuna 400mg 90 capsule $9.95
1 NOW Foods L-Methionine 500mg + B6 100 ca $6.95
1 Source Naturals L-Tyrosine 500mg 50 tabl $3.95
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Good info.
Here's what I ordered yesterday:
1 [Orange] Source Naturals GABA Calm Subli $4.95
1 Source Naturals GABA 750mg 45 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals 5-HTP 50mg 30 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DMAE 351mg 50 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DLPA 375mg 60 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals N-Acetyl Cysteine 600mg $4.95
1 NOW Foods DOPA Mucuna 400mg 90 capsule $9.95
1 NOW Foods L-Methionine 500mg + B6 100 ca $6.95
1 Source Naturals L-Tyrosine 500mg 50 tabl $3.95
This is quite a brainy stack right there.
Your grey matter will love it.
Just be careful with your caffein intake if you got > 500mg on tyrosine; it can make you agitated / anxious.
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Great post bast and owning goatshit to no end.
He wasn't "owning" me, we were having a discussion, not a debate.
Also fish greatly improve your positiveness.
Then maybe you should eat more fish, fat french fag. ::)
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Then maybe you should eat more fish, fat french fag. ::)
I'm as french as you are britsh you dipshit.
and "breaking" protein don't produce every FFAA.. ::)
Get an education.
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Good info.
Here's what I ordered yesterday:
1 [Orange] Source Naturals GABA Calm Subli $4.95
1 Source Naturals GABA 750mg 45 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals 5-HTP 50mg 30 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DMAE 351mg 50 capsule $4.95
1 Source Naturals DLPA 375mg 60 tablet $5.95
1 Source Naturals N-Acetyl Cysteine 600mg $4.95
1 NOW Foods DOPA Mucuna 400mg 90 capsule $9.95
1 NOW Foods L-Methionine 500mg + B6 100 ca $6.95
1 Source Naturals L-Tyrosine 500mg 50 tabl $3.95
What site did you order this from? Nice prices.
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I'm as french as you are britsh you dipshit.
Then why the accent? Last I checked, I wasn't speaking like a brit (my ancestry isn't british anyway, you moron, it's german)
and "breaking" protein don't produce every FFAA.. ::)
Really? Then why do people who eat sufficient quantities of complete protein not end up with amino acid deficiencies? ::)
Get an education.
Mine's probably better than yours, fatfrenchfag
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I SUPPLEMENTED WITH SOME PSYLOCIBIN AND CANNABIS NEURO NUTRIENTS LAST NIGHT
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I SUPPLEMENTED WITH SOME PSYLOCIBIN AND CANNABIS NEURO NUTRIENTS LAST NIGHT
I don't like cannabis. Haven't tried psilocybin.
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I think if you are getting the standard bodybuilding 1.5 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight and not cutting carbs I don't think BCAAs make a big diff. But if you are dieting strictly they can be very useful. When I had to cut weight my drinking water always contained BCAAs which I sipped throughout the day.
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Then why the accent? Last I checked, I wasn't speaking like a brit (my ancestry isn't british anyway, you moron, it's german)
Really? Then why do people who eat sufficient quantities of complete protein not end up with amino acid deficiencies? ::)
Mine's probably better than yours, fatfrenchfag
Picless, faceless meltdown. You can't post your face on here and there are reasons.
My dad's Canadian, not French, read a fucking history book you illiterate.
Certain aminos can't be "manufactured" by the body efficiently, hence supplementing = rasing levels for effect (tryptophan), but who am I talking to, you've never seen the inside of a fucking gym. ::)
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I don't like cannabis. Haven't tried psilocybin.
most canabis is way way way too strong. get some shitty weed, like some of the left overs on the bottom of a bag of stress. you can get it for dirt cheap. thats the stuff to smoke. absolutely no anxiety or paranoia...just a very chill relaxing state. not overwhelming a all.
psylocibin connects you with the heavens. you just need to eat enough and wait 40 minutes.
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Picless, faceless meltdown. You can't post your face on here and there are reasons.
My dad's Canadian, not French, read a fucking history book you illiterate.
Certain aminos can't be "manufactured" by the body efficiently, hence supplementing = rasing levels for effect (tryptophan), but who am I talking to, you've never seen the inside of a fucking gym. ::)
the body fucking sucks ass at developing 191 sequence amino acids..
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most canabis is way way way too strong. get some shitty weed, like some of the left overs on the bottom of a bag of stress. you can get it for dirt cheap. thats the stuff to smoke. absolutely no anxiety or paranoia...just a very chill relaxing state. not overwhelming a all.
psylocibin connects you with the heavens. you just need to eat enough and wait 40 minutes.
yea i get the chilled state but it's not worth having to smoke to me.
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I SUPPLEMENTED WITH SOME PSYLOCIBIN AND CANNABIS NEURO NUTRIENTS LAST NIGHT
At least that had a real effect, unlike commercial "supplements".
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the body fucking sucks ass at developing 191 sequence amino acids..
;D ... how about 192's & 193's ? ;D
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At least that had a real effect, unlike commercial "supplements".
Fuckoff gimmick, no one cares about your little "positions" on the "industry"... ::) ::) ::)
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My dad's Canadian, not French, read a fucking history book you illiterate.
Explains why you speak like a fuccking lumberjack. Anyway "fatfrenchcanadianfag" just doesn't flow, so we're sticking with FFF.
Certain aminos can't be "manufactured" by the body efficiently, hence supplementing = rasing levels for effect (tryptophan), but who am I talking to, you've never seen the inside of a fucking gym. ::)
The only amino acids required by the human body that cannot be manufactured by the human body are the 8 essential amino acids: phenylalanine, valine, threonine, tryptophan, isoleucine, methionine, leucine, and lysine. Some amino acids are conditionally essential (arginine, cysteine, glycine, glutamine, histidine,tyrosine, and a couple more I can't think of offhand). These can be manufactured by the human body but in certain situations can be deficient. However, ALL of these can be supplied with a diet adequate in complete protein. Supplementation with free-form aminos is a waste of money.
And as for seeing the inside of a gym, are you trying to say being a gym rat makes one an expert in protein metabolism? I know you're smarter than that. ::)
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The only amino acids required by the human body that cannot be manufactured by the human body are the 8 essential amino acids: phenylalanine, valine, threonine, tryptophan, isoleucine, methionine, leucine, and lysine. Some amino acids are conditionally essential (arginine, cysteine, glycine, glutamine, histidine,tyrosine, and a couple more I can't think of offhand). These can be manufactured by the human body but in certain situations can be deficient. However, ALL of these can be supplied with a diet adequate in complete protein. Supplementation with free-form aminos is a waste of money.
while every amino acid besides the essential amino acids can be made by the body to fill in deficeincies...the human body isnt going to produce any more than what it needs for basal demands. and certain amino acids can have effects once you rach certain levels of them in the body...levels above and beyond the basic needs of the body.
for example... glucose can be manufactured by the body. but your body will never manufcature enough glucose to cause a big spike in insulin which will cause you to feel drowsy. the only wya to get that level of glucose is to supplement with it.
and liek glucose, certain amino acids can be manufatured, but the body wont manufcature huge amounts uneccesarily .....your body wont give you a huge whopping dose of tryptophan just because you want it too. youll have to supplement wiht it in order to get high enough levels for it to have an effect.
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while every amino acid besides the essential amino acids can be made by the body to fill in deficeincies...the human body isnt going to produce any more than what it needs for basal demands. and certain amino acids can have effects once you rach certain levels of them in the body...levels above and beyond the basic needs of the body.
for example... glucose can be manufactured by the body. but your body will never manufcature enough glucose to cause a big spike in insulin which will cause you to feel drowsy. the only wya to get that level of glucose is to supplement with it.
So what "effects" are you looking for? Are you advocating using amino acids essentially as recreational drugs? In most cases, effects produced by certain free-form aminos can be had far more efficiently with pharmaceutical products. Someone talked about GABA and tryptophan possibly producing a relaxing effect... fuck that, take a benzo. Others try to use arginine or even glutamine to "release GH"... fuck that, inject GH if you want GH. And so on...
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So what "effects" are you looking for? Are you advocating using amino acids essentially as recreational drugs? In most cases, effects produced by certain free-form aminos can be had far more efficiently with pharmaceutical products. Someone talked about GABA and tryptophan possibly producing a relaxing effect... fuck that, take a benzo. Others try to use arginine or even glutamine to "release GH"... fuck that, inject GH if you want GH. And so on...
well certainly i think certain aminos can have certain effects, in a healthier, more natural, and possibly cheaer way than by taking a pharmaceutical drug.
personally i ould probably take the precription drug route though ;D
but this idea also applies to amino acids and metabolism/protein synthesis/protein breakdown. for example consuming extra leucine, or extra bcaa... can have different effects than just consuming whol proteins alone.
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personally i ould probably take the precription drug route though ;D
Case closed. ;D
I look at it this way... at least with pharma products I know what I'm getting, and all it costs me is my insurance co-pay. With supps you pay big money for items with dubious quality control, often with dubious science behind them, and even in a situation where something is actuallu proven to have an effect, it's usually far less efficient or effective than a pharmaceutical equivalent.
C'mon, Levrone and Kamali are "supplement manufacturers". Do you really trust great scientific minds like those to make something you're going to put in your body?
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Case closed. ;D
I look at it this way... at least with pharma products I know what I'm getting, and all it costs me is my insurance co-pay. With supps you pay big money for items with dubious quality control, often with dubious science behind them, and even in a situation where something is actuallu proven to have an effect, it's usually far less efficient or effective than a pharmaceutical equivalent.
C'mon, Levrone and Kamali are "supplement manufacturers". Do you really trust great scientific minds like those to make something you're going to put in your body?
You're wrong and you know it sweety.
Why rely on suppressive pharmas substance to elevate / fix your mood when you can take supplements who will allow the body to produce their own, take GABA for example vs Paxil... ::)
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You're wrong and you know it sweety.
Why rely on suppressive pharmas substance to elevate / fix your mood when you can take supplements who will allow the body to produce their own, take GABA for example vs Paxil... ::)
No, I'm not wrong. But if you want to spend your money on snake oil I'm not stopping you, FFF.
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No, I'm not wrong. But if you want to spend your money on snake oil I'm not stopping you, FFF.
LOL, you are.
Go on Paxil for a couple of weeks and stop cold turkey one day.....
These "drugs" aren't shutting down the body at all... ::)
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LOL, you are.
Go on Paxil for a couple of weeks and stop cold turkey one day.....
These "drugs" aren't shutting down the body at all... ::)
Seconded.....Goatboy,..... youv'e been taking Xany 3-4 times a week...for how long?
If it is for more than a few weeks that shit has got it's hooks in you and you don't even know it.
Like A23 says just stop taking them and tell us how you feel. ;D
Xanax is a nasty drug to come off of
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GroinK and Gothboy = both drug addicts.
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Seconded.....Goatboy,..... youv'e been taking Xany 3-4 times a week...for how long?
If it is for more than a few weeks that shit has got it's hooks in you and you don't even know it.
Like A23 says just stop taking them and tell us how you feel. ;D
Xanax is a nasty drug to come off of
LOL goat is a xanaxoreliantphobe? LOL, explains a lot...
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LOL goat is a xanaxoreliantphobe? LOL, explains a lot...
Gothboy = also married to a muslim whore named Tracy.
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Gothboy = also married to a muslim whore named Tracy.
Whoooaaa... are you serious?
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Whoooaaa... are you serious?
Yes.
He claims that she looks like an "All American Girl".
::)
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Yes.
He claims that she looks like an "All American Girl".
::)
I'm sure she does... ::)... sounds like someone is trying to convince themselves...
Wow, quite pathetic for a guy in a multi ethnic relationship to rely on so many racist ideologies and even bash other people's wife because she doesn't "look" "all American Girl"... ::) ::)
Oh brother the irony; no wonder he hasn't posted a pic in 10yrs... ::)
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I'm sure she does... ::)... sounds like someone is trying to convince themselves...
Wow, quite pathetic for a guy in a multi ethnic relationship to rely on so many racist ideologies and even bash other people's wife because she doesn't "look" "all American Girl"... ::) ::)
Oh brother the irony; no wonder he hasn't posted a pic in 10yrs... ::)
He has posted 2 pics that Debussey = aware of. One of a little wound or something on his hand, and one of his tie.
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He has posted 2 pics that Debussey = aware of. One of a little wound or something on his hand, and one of his tie.
For the record, I've got nothing against anonymity; thing is, by staying anonymous you give away some rights; such as to obsessivley go overboard on the bashing... unless you put up. >:(
in 10years, a tie and a watch.. whoaaa... I'm sure the guy "lifts"... ::)..
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He has posted 2 pics that Debussey = aware of. One of a little wound or something on his hand, and one of his tie.
Debuprinex= aware of everything on Getbig
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For the record, I've got nothing against anonymity; thing is, by staying anonymous you give away some rights; such as to obsessivley go overboard on the bashing... unless you put up. >:(
in 10years, a tie and a watch.. whoaaa... I'm sure the guy "lifts"... ::)..
That's what I said dude...If you are going to be a known attack dog, you have to put your chips in the middle as well
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Debuprinex= aware of everything on Getbig
Not at all.
Debussey stays away for long periods. This is just a short return after the new 10feetindiameter anal probe with rasberry taste had a malfunction and slingshot Debussey down to earth.
The aliens "DebussBot" will locate Debussey and bring it in for further testing soon enough though >:(
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Debuprinex= aware of everything on Getbig
debuominpresence = scarry :o
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debuominpresence = scarry :o
You were the originator of the "Debussey = omnipresent" thing.
Unfortunately, Debussey = far from omnipresent.
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Not at all.
Debussey stays away for long periods. This is just a short return after the new 10feetindiameter anal probe with rasberry taste had a malfunction and slingshot Debussey down to earth.
The aliens "DebussBot" will locate Debussey and bring it in for further testing soon enough though >:(
Rasberry?
hey at least they are making an effort, right?
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Rasberry?
hey at least they are making an effort, right?
They have got this crazy idea that this perverse form of aromatherapy stimulates the natural lubrication of the asshole for maximum anal probe milage >:(
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You were the originator of the "Debussey = omnipresent" thing.
Unfortunately, Debussey = far from omnipresent.
Just very smart? People as low as 140's IQ have been known to have extra sensorial capabilities...
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Just very smart? People as low as 140's IQ have been known to have extra sensorial capabilities...
What about morons with a 52IQ? :'(
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Whoooaaa... are you serious?
No, he's not serious. My wife's mother was born in Iran, raised in Europe, and moved to America where she married a Caucasian American man. My wife was born and raised in Connecticut, and neither she nor anyone in her immediate family are "Muslim". But because of the 1/2 Persian heritage, Debussey and others go on with the "muslim" joke.
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No, he's not serious. My wife's mother was born in Iran, raised in Europe, and moved to America where she married a Caucasian American man. My wife was born and raised in Connecticut, and neither she nor anyone in her immediate family are "Muslim". But because of the 1/2 Persian heritage, Debussey and others go on with the "muslim" joke.
Awww...whats a matter, getting mad at people making things up that arent true?
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No, he's not serious. My wife's mother was born in Iran, raised in Europe, and moved to America where she married a Caucasian American man. My wife was born and raised in Connecticut, and neither she nor anyone in her immediate family are "Muslim". But because of the 1/2 Persian heritage, Debussey and others go on with the "muslim" joke.
Stop with this horseshit George. Tracy = a muslim whore.
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Awww...whats a matter, getting mad at people making things up that arent true?
Bob, looks like 'george' is over justifying himself. We have struck a nerve.
You married a muslim woman yet remain a racist and having trouble dealing with it.
post your pic, it'll make you feel better :-*
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Bob Chick, I read on bodybuilding.com that all the top pros do not go to sleep at night unless they have an IV drip delivering some Muscletech proteins and amino acids straight into their blood streams. Is this true? :P