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Anger in Europe as Barack Obama 'scraps missile defence shield'
Telegraph (U.K.) ^ | September 17, 2009
Posted on Thursday, September 17, 2009 8:26:47 AM by Schnucki
Reports that US President Barack Obama is to scrap plans to deploy a missile defence shield in Poland and the Czech Republic have provoked anger in Europe.
The Wall Street Journal reported that the US is to shelve the plan, which was first mooted by the Bush administration and has been a source of friction with Russia ever since.
The move would be a cause of celebration in Moscow but of real concern to Eastern European countries which have looked to Washington for support against their former imperial master Russia. The US has said the shield is to guard against attacks by rogue states, such as Iran.
The former Czech prime minister, Mirek Topolanek, said: "This is not good news for the Czech state, for Czech freedom and independence. It puts us in a position wherein we are not firmly anchored in terms of partnership, security and alliance, and that's a certain threat."
The Polish deputy foreign minister, Andrzej Kremer, saidthat Warsaw had heard from different sources there were "serious chances" the anti-missile system would not be deployed.
Russian officials said they did not want to immediately comment on media reports that cited unidentified US officials.
"We are waiting for confirmation of these reports," a source in Russia's foreign ministry said. "In principle, such a development would help the development of our bilateral relations with the United States."
The newspaper said the decision followed a review ordered by Mr Obama. He called the current Czech prime minister Jan Fischer on Wednesday night to discuss missile defence.
Mr Obama, who is due to meet the Russian prime minister Dmitry Medvedev next week in New York, says he wants better ties with Russia so that the two former Cold War foes can co-operate on Afghanistan and reduce the risk of nuclear proliferation.
(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...
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I wonder what we got in return for throwing our friends under the bus?
Answer - NOTHING.
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This is a stupid move, eveyone bitches about our nuclear arsenal, it costs a hell of a lot to maintain ICBM's. With the missle defense system in which is designed to stop ICBM's, we could have reduced out arsenal and only have to worry about the maintenance of the defense system which would have be considerably cheaper. The only reason this was done was to appease Russia.
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Nile Gardiner
Nile Gardiner is a Washington-based foreign affairs analyst and political commentator. He appears frequently on American and British television and radio, including Fox News Channel, CNN, BBC, Sky News, and NPR. Barack Obama surrenders to Russia on Missile Defence
By Nile Gardiner World Last updated: September 17th, 2009
34 Comments Comment on this article
I blogged a couple of weeks ago that the Obama administration was about to abandon its plans for Third Site missile defence installations in Poland and the Czech Republic. I wrote then that “if enacted, this would represent a huge turnaround in American strategic thinking on a global missile defence system, and a massive betrayal of two key US allies in eastern and central Europe. Such a move would significantly weaken America’s ability to combat the growing threat posed by Iran’s ballistic missile program, and would hand a major propaganda victory to the Russians.”
It now looks as though the president has surrendered to Russian demands to kill off Third Site. Michael Goldfarb at The Weekly Standard is reporting that:
“According to reliable sources, Obama administration officials are on their way to Poland and the Czech Republic to deliver very bad news. The administration intends to cancel completely the missile defense sites that had been promised to these governments by the previous administration.”
Goldfarb also links to a post by leading defence expert Gary Schmitt, who writes:
“Guess who’s coming to dinner (in Warsaw)? Four senior Obama officials, including Under Secretary of State for Arms Control Ellen Tauscher and Assistant Secretary of Defense for International Security “Sandy” Vershbow, are apparently in the air right now on their way to Poland. Why? If the Washington hot rumor mill is right, to deliver the news to the Poles and then the Czechs that the administration has decided not to go forward with a missile defense system for Europe and the United States against the budding missile threat from Iran.”
This is bad news for all who care about the US commitment to the transatlantic alliance and the defence of Europe as well as the United States. It represents the appalling appeasement of Russian aggression and a willingness to sacrifice American allies on the altar of political expediency. A deal with the Russians to cancel missile defence installations sends a clear message that even Washington can be intimidated by the Russian bear.
What signal does this send to Ukraine, Georgia and a host of other former Soviet satellites who look to America and NATO for protection from their powerful neighbour? The impending cancellation of Third Site is a shameful abandonment of America’s friends in eastern and central Europe, and a slap in the face for those who actually believed a key agreement with Washington was worth the paper it was written on.
Tags: Barack Obama, missile defence, Russia
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Jimmy Carter must love this. He will no longer be seen as the weakest and worst president ever.
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Is anyone surprised? We have played this game with Russia before and the results were the same. Russian thinking, F.P. and outlook is much different than ours.
Oh well, I'm sure Obama will charm the pants off of Czar Putin and his lap dog Medvdev, I good speech, some good handshakes and, WHAM, all is right again.
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Is anyone surprised? We have played this game with Russia before and the results were the same. Russian thinking, F.P. and outlook is much different than ours.
Oh well, I'm sure Obama will charm the pants off of Czar Putin and his lap dog Medvdev, I good speech, some good handshakes and, WHAM, all is right again.
I wonder if obama will look into Medvedevs' soul?
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no one really gives a shit ;)
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Why should USA spend money on military in OTHER countries?
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Dude the cold war is over. Russia isn't that big of a threat right now. Iran is and intelligence says the medium and short range missiles are what they'll use so they're building a defense system to cope with that. No selling out what so ever, just updating the ever changing plans as needed. I'm surprised you even question a cost cutting move these days considering you question everything being spent in America why would you have no problem with money being spent protecting land no one has interest in.
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Dude the cold war is over. Russia isn't that big of a threat right now. Iran is and intelligence says the medium and short range missiles are what they'll use so they're building a defense system to cope with that. No selling out what so ever, just updating the ever changing plans as needed. I'm surprised you even question a cost cutting move these days considering you question everything being spent in America why would you have no problem with money being spent protecting land no one has interest in.
Actually, we need to pare down our costs and Europe needs to start paying its own way.
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Actually, we need to pare down our costs and Europe needs to start paying its own way.
Then why make it an issue? Shouldn't you be happy he's scraped it? Or are you that blinded by hate for your african master?
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Then why make it an issue? Shouldn't you be happy he's scraped it? Or are you that blinded by hate for your african master?
Its an issue because its an issue thats in the news and is discussed worldwide today.
My "hatred" for the things obama is pushing is not "blind". i am well aware and have my eyes wide open as to what he is doing.
If it were Hillary and she were pushing cap & tax, card check, etc, I would feel the same way.
By the way, was Obama born in Kenya as you allude to?
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Once again Barry is an epic failure. He just sold out the Czechs and Poles for no good reason. KC ur an idiot...stick to whatever it is u do. Russia isn't a direct threat to the Us but its a threat to regional stability in the Caucus region...what do those folks have a ton of.....OIL. Further the countries there are all either backed by the US or the Russians. The Russians are talking about selling an air defense package to Iran, that Israel said would without a doubt cause them to wack Iran, before its up and running. Barry will continue to keep the foreign policy blinders on as long as he can push his liberal agenda. The stupidty of KC's statement is legion.
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He just sold out the Czechs and Poles for no good reason.
give me a break. Let europe build its own shit. Do you think if russia was fighting 2 wars, would build a missile shield in mexico? We dont fucking need the trouble right now. LET EUROPE BUILD ITS OWN SHIT.
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Jimmy Carter must love this. He will no longer be seen as the weakest and worst president ever.
;D ;D ;D
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Once again Barry is an epic failure. He just sold out the Czechs and Poles for no good reason. KC ur an idiot...stick to whatever it is u do. Russia isn't a direct threat to the Us but its a threat to regional stability in the Caucus region...what do those folks have a ton of.....OIL. Further the countries there are all either backed by the US or the Russians. The Russians are talking about selling an air defense package to Iran, that Israel said would without a doubt cause them to wack Iran, before its up and running. Barry will continue to keep the foreign policy blinders on as long as he can push his liberal agenda. The stupidty of KC's statement is legion.
Do you consider his doubling down on Afghanistan part of his "liberal agenda"?
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He's not doubling down...yet. The Dems don't want to add more troops and I'm not sure that more troops are the answer, however if Gen McCrystal needs them, then Obama should provide them.
2nd....ah this isn't about Europe. First off u don't bail on ur allies especially when they've stuck their necks out. U don't back down from the Russians, especially without getting anything, and unless we're getting cooperation on Iran, we just got played, again. Based on the debate here, u guys don't understand the strategic goals and 2nd and 3rd order affects of this. This is wayy beyond "let europe build it" things don't work like that. If we don't...Europe will never. U want to continue to gas up ur car....then this shit is important. It all builds on each other...everything is connected.
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Maybe that's the point HH6. Maybe Obama will see an oil crisis as the way to get cap & trade and his other "green" dreams through that are currently bogged down in the Senate.
Again, Obama used the phrase "transform America and change the world" today in that speech. He said that once before right before the election and it always creeped me out.
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2nd....ah this isn't about Europe. First off u don't bail on ur allies especially when they've stuck their necks out. U don't back down from the Russians, especially without getting anything, and unless we're getting cooperation on Iran, we just got played, again. Based on the debate here, u guys don't understand the strategic goals and 2nd and 3rd order affects of this. This is wayy beyond "let europe build it" things don't work like that. If we don't...Europe will never. U want to continue to gas up ur car....then this shit is important. It all builds on each other...everything is connected.
it will only lead to a pissing match and russia scraping arms control negotiations with us. What will happen then...russia flexing its muscle while we're fighting 2 wars and in a economic shithole. Yea sounds fuckin awesome to me man...as long as we dont come off as pussies ::) We dont need it right now. Gas shortages...gimme a break. Last time i checked canada is doing just fine.
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Well what I'm talking about is the eventual deployment of US combat troops to the region to deal with whatever happens there. I'm not pulling this out of my ass, we're practicing and preparing contingency operations for the Caucuses region now. There is so much oil in Azerbijian that is bubbles out of the ground in places.
2 ur view is beyond short sighted. The Russians have zero leverage beyond what we need them for in Iran and they've already not doing what we need em to do. Its obvious that this isn't ur thing. I'd say study or read on whats going on in Armenia, Georgia and Azerbaijan. Thats the next problem area and thats where this is all tied to. This is not about Europe defending themselves, they can't. This is about US power projection as botha hedge against Russian meddling in that region and defense against Iran to some extent. Again this is all tiued togther.
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2 ur view is beyond short sighted. The Russians have zero leverage beyond what we need them for in Iran and they've already not doing what we need em to do. Its obvious that this isn't ur thing. I'd say study or read on whats going on in Armenia, Georgia and Azerbaijan. Thats the next problem area and thats where this is all tied to. This is not about Europe defending themselves, they can't. This is about US power projection as botha hedge against Russian meddling in that region and defense against Iran to some extent. Again this is all tiued togther.
russia has already linked the missile defense to the arms control agreement. Who cares if they can or cant afford it. We dont need the drama right now. My guess is the highest comand not just obama agrees and theyre doing how they see fit. get over it
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Well what I'm talking about is the eventual deployment of US combat troops to the region to deal with whatever happens there. I'm not pulling this out of my ass, we're practicing and preparing contingency operations for the Caucuses region now. There is so much oil in Azerbijian that is bubbles out of the ground in places.
2 ur view is beyond short sighted. The Russians have zero leverage beyond what we need them for in Iran and they've already not doing what we need em to do. Its obvious that this isn't ur thing. I'd say study or read on whats going on in Armenia, Georgia and Azerbaijan. Thats the next problem area and thats where this is all tied to. This is not about Europe defending themselves, they can't. This is about US power projection as botha hedge against Russian meddling in that region and defense against Iran to some extent. Again this is all tiued togther.
I think in the end it's going to have to be handled diplomatically. Russia already established the tenor by driving it's troops deep into Georgia while Bush and the missile defense program were in full swing. Azerbaijan has some serious human rights issues still confronting it which will inevitably cause problems with support over here.
I think we need the missile defense system more along the NATO lines of an attack against one is an attack against all. Or as you put it, diplomatic clout. But, as for us actually deploying to that region, it just seems unlikely to me. That may change in future, just now it seems the more realistic solution is diplomacy.
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the 'only' problem with the article is that the two leaders of Poland and Czech republic are positive towards the decision.
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the 'only' problem with the article is that the two leaders of Poland and Czech republic are positive towards the decision.
Thats not what i read at all Hedge. In fact, i read the opposite.
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::)
Actually the reason it was trashed is because Iran is developing short and medium range missiles much faster than their long range missile that Bush anticipated. Has nothing to do directly with Russia except for forcing them to accept responsibility for any troubles from Iran that may befall their territories. Obama is still establishing a short and medium range missile defense system.
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WASHINGTON (AP) — President Barack Obama's decision to scrap a Bush-era missile intercept system in Europe was based largely on a new U.S. intelligence assessment that Iran's effort to build a nuclear-capable long-range missile would take three years to five years longer than originally thought, U.S. officials said Thursday.
The new assessment asserts Iran is unlikely to have a nuclear-capable intercontinental ballistic missile until 2015 to 2020, a U.S. government official familiar with the report told The Associated Press. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because the report remains classified.
Previous intelligence assessed that Iran would have an ICBM capable of menacing Europe and the United States sometime between 2012 and 2015, another U.S. government official said.
The assessment changed because Iran has not been conducting the kind of observable development and testing that would be expected to accompany a robust long-range missile program, the second official said.
The new assessment was contained in a classified May 2009 National Intelligence Estimate. The secret report is called "Foreign Ballistic Missile Development and Threat Through 2020." National Intelligence Estimates contain the consensus judgment of all 16 American intelligence agencies about critical national security issues.
Obama on Thursday abruptly canceled a long-planned missile shield for Eastern Europe, replacing the Bush-era project that was strongly opposed by Russia with a plan the president contended would better defend against a growing threat of Iranian missiles.
The United States no longer will seek to erect a missile base and radar site in Poland and the Czech Republic, virtually on Russia's doorstep. President George W. Bush contended that the missile base was needed to shoot down any Iranian missile if it ever developed one with adequate range to threaten the United States or Europe. The U.S. already has a similar missile site and radar in Alaska.
The ability of the missile intercept system to reliably shoot down an enemy ICBM has not yet been proven in tests that simulate real-world conditions.
The new Obama plan would deploy systems designed to shoot down short- and medium-range missiles, with construction in phases to begin around 2011. Systems to counter longer-range missiles would be in place around 2020.
The Obama administration said the shift is a common sense answer to the evolution of both the threat and the U.S. understanding of it. Iran has not shown that it is close to being able to lob a long-range missile, perhaps with a nuclear warhead, at U.S. allies in Europe.
The May report and associated analysis represents the second major revision of U.S. intelligence on Iran's weapons in two years. In 2007, a national intelligence estimate said Iran had in 2003 halted work on the design of a nuclear weapon for at least several years.
The key judgments of that report were released publicly.
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Today Russia announced that they won't go ahead with the plans of adding military power to Kaliningrad - the Russian area inside Poland.
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Today Russia announced that they won't go ahead with the plans of adding military power to Kaliningrad - the Russian area inside Poland.
Wow so it's resolved that issue. Great. Good move it is. Just more hating going on from 333.
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Wow so it's resolved that issue. Great. Good move it is. Just more hating going on from 333.
We sold out our allies to appease Putin??? - Yeah I m sure that is great to you.
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Polish Prime Minister, Peeved Over Missile Shield Reversal, Rejects Call from Clinton
Fox News ^ | 09/18/09
Posted on Friday, September 18, 2009 12:07:22 PM by TigerLikesRooster
Polish Prime Minister, Peeved Over Missile Shield Reversal, Rejects Call from Clinton
Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk insisted Thursday the United States and Poland remain close allies even after President Obama's decision to drop plans for a missile defense shield in the Eastern European country, but it's apparently not a sentiment he felt Wednesday night.
FOXNews.com
Friday, September 18, 2009
The United States and Poland remain close allies despite President Obama's decision to drop plans for a missile defense shield in the Eastern European country, Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk insisted Thursday.
But Tusk may have felt differently Wednesday night, when he got a phone call to tell him about Obama's decision, which would be announced the following day.
Tusk told Polish radio that he did not want to speak with Obama on Wednesday night because he wanted to "properly prepare for the discussion."
But Politico.com reported Friday that it wasn't Obama on the line -- that Tusk actually rejected a call from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton -- who called him to detail the plan -- because as a head of government, he thought he should hear from Obama directly.
"Hillary called -- and the reason he turned it down was because of protocol," one of two U.S.-based sources close to the Polish government told Politico.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
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Our allies? What has Poland done for the US? It's an ally because during the cold war they were against soviet Russia. Soviet Russia is now no longer a threat nor is Russia. Just paranoid people thinking they are. They don't need a defense system because no one cares to invade or attack Poland, simple as that.
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No we didn't.
We didn't sell anyone out. We focused more on the more immediate crisis is short-medium range missiles than the long range missile they are incapable of producing at this stage.
The new Obama plan would deploy systems designed to shoot down short- and medium-range missiles, with construction in phases to begin around 2011. Systems to counter longer-range missiles would be in place around 2020.
It pays to actually read the facts behind something before attempting to fear monger the issue.
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I guess my paranoia over this admn gets the best of me sometimes. :o :o :o :o :o :o
Seriously, I think the GE thing is more to the truth in this than anything else since Obama is getting GE in there with Russia for new contracts.
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Basically Russia didn't want the defense shield that close to their borders.
Obama found out that Iran can't launch missile that far right now anyway and told Russia "HAHA sucks to be you, you the only one they can bomb now." And decided to focus the defense on the stoppage of weapon capablities that Russia currently had at the moment.
Now Russia will have to either take a harder stance on Iran or they will come crawling back for our help when Iran gives them the finger.
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Iran's not going to give them the finger because they need Russia's air defense platforms. Russia wants Iranian gas and loves to poke at the West. Russia was no threat in Kalingrad, that made no difference. Barry needs Russia as a barganing chip against Iran, we need a hell of alot more from Russia then agreeing to not garrison 3rd rate military units close to the Polish border. We sold out an ally. Barry could care less about Iran, until Israel does its best to make it a smoking crater. This solidifies Barry as another Carter. Unless Russia agree's to massive sanctions against Iran, and does not deliver that ADA system, then we've lost again at the hands of the appeaser in chief.
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Good points HH6. If we get something out of this (sanctions against Iran from Russia) then it may have been worth it. Otherwise, we went back on an agreement already made with allies.
kc, you think Russia isn't a threat to anyone? Ask the Georgians. Czechoslovakia was under communist rule until the Velvet Revolution in 1989. Not that long ago. I admire Russians, they are typically strong people who are very nationalistic. As far as international decisions, their gov does what is best for Russia...I don't think we can say that anymore.
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Yes it was brilliant move ::) And then to announce it on Sept 17, that was well thought out ::)
Anyone wanna guess what happened on Sept 17 1939
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Russia has it's agenda. It is no longer a super power but doesn't want to seem like "girly men".
I'm more concerned about relations with China, all the manufacturing, all the revenue, all the people.
China needs oil, Russia has it, if Russia helps US with China(who financially owns this country) this will work out to our advantage.
keep your friends close, keep your enemies even closer.
Sandra
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I'm sorry. But I just don't recognize the description of 'anger' in Europe due to the decision by Obama to back off the missiles.
even the allies in NATO are positive.
Why push to spend to build up military resources in ANOTHER country?
How much military resources are Poland spending up in Alaska to protect USA from Russia?
How many military bases does Czech Republic have in Florida to defend USA from Cuba and Venezuela?
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How many military bases does Czech Republic have in Florida to defend USA from Cuba and Venezuela?
haha... :-\ ??? :P
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Why push to spend to build up military resources in ANOTHER country?
The ideas presented at the time of inception were (I'm not arguing the merits):
A. To protect Europe from a long range missile from a country such as Iran.
B. To foster a strategic political and military alliance with Poland.
C. To help solidify Poland's inclusion into NATO.
D. (Not publicized so I'm just guessing, no proof) Serve as an intelligence gathering point.
How much military resources are Poland spending up in Alaska to protect USA from Russia?
How many military bases does Czech Republic have in Florida to defend USA from Cuba and Venezuela?
Do you really not know who needs to protect who from whom? Do you really think Russia, Cuba, and Venezuela are a threat to the U.S.?
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Re European Anger, I don't understand - repubs usually don't give a stuff what the world thinks of them - so why start now?