Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: NaturalWonder83 on September 21, 2009, 01:07:35 PM
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he should at least wear a belt if he's gonna pause at the bottom like that. he's just ASKING for a hernia...imo
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he should at least wear a belt if he's gonna pause at the bottom like that. he's just ASKING for a hernia...imo
what do u mean ???
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Wouldn't say they're that heavy - still good form though.
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what do u mean ???
all the intra-abdominal pressure caused from hoisting the weight up from that position, each and every rep. to work the muscle effectively, you should only be working with the top 80% of the movement anyway, always keeping a slight bend on the elbows, esp at the bottom. it is far more effective because you dont lose tension on the muscle at the bottom, like he demonstrates here each time. Also, I think the straight bar sucks for curls, especially heavy ones. Too much pressure on the wrists IMO..very awkward movement.
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all the abdominal pressure caused from hoisting the weight up from that position. to work the muscle effectively, you should only be working with the top 80% of the movement anyway, always keeping a slight bend on the elbows. It is far more effective because you dont lose tension on the muscle at the bottom, like he demonstrates here each time. Also, I think the straight bar sucks. Too much pressure on the wrists IMO..very awkward movement.
ok i see.thank u for the explanation
so what do u like instead of barbell curls?
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Thats really really good form imo.
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ok i see.thank u for the explanation
so what do u like instead of barbell curls?
The EZ bar, because it isolates the biceps much better, and puts the joints in a more natural angle. Having said that though..not all EZ bars are created equal. Some of them suck, the newer ones especially. Gimme an old-school one. :)
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Isn't that "only" 135.
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he should at least wear a belt if he's gonna pause at the bottom like that. he's just ASKING for a hernia...imo
But since when belt has prevented hernias? Belt = easy fix. Not a real answer.
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But since when belt has prevented hernias? Belt = easy fix. Not a real answer.
true but i also mentioned adjustments in form as well. I was saying to use a belt if hes going to keep working with THAT form.
His abdomnal wall is eventually going to tear at that rate, heavy weights or not. A belt will prevent it or delay it at least.
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anybodys thats ever done a good bulk should be able to curl or swing 185 and throw up 135 like nobodys buisness
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cut the bullshit on hernias ::)
only roiders tend to get shit like thaat, i understand some natties get them too, you can get a hernia or pull your back from picking up a penny off the ground
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anybodys thats ever done a good bulk should be able to curl or swing 185 and throw up 135 like nobodys buisness
I agree. The thing is though, there are so many clueless curl monkeys who don't know how to train that as soon as someone curls a decent weight people think he is genetic marvel.
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The EZ bar, because it isolates the biceps much better, and puts the joints in a more natural angle. Having said that though..not all EZ bars are created equal. Some of them suck, the newer ones especially. Gimme an old-school one. :)
you need to learn about about anatomy before you give out free advice.
the EZ bar is counter productive to biceps movements as it rotates the wrist and results in less biceps recruitment.
the idea for biceps involvement is to have the body of the bi do most of the movement, without involving secondary groups like the forearms. having the wrist not fully pronated means that the forearms are more involved.
the straight bar is far superior to EZ curl bar except for a small range of movement where it becomes uncomfortable due to it not being able to move with the arc and therefore placing some awkwardness on the wrists.
however its far more effective if used, and by far the most effective is dumb bells as you get the best of both worlds, as long as you pronate the hand through the ROM.
hope this helps.
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cut the bullshit on hernias ::)
only roiders tend to get shit like thaat, i understand some natties get them too, you can get a hernia or pull your back from picking up a penny off the ground
for once we agree. this bit about hernias is just BS. the guy dont need a belt repping like that. his form is sound, the weight isnt too heavy for him.
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true but i also mentioned adjustments in form as well. I was saying to use a belt if hes going to keep working with THAT form.
His abdomnal wall is eventually going to tear at that rate, heavy weights or not. A belt will prevent it or delay it at least.
you really think that "competitors" in your title gives you right to make dumb ass comments like you actually understand how to train the human body dont you?
some of the crap you're writing is hilarious. quite entertaining actually.
but unfortunately propagates the stereotype of the moron BB. i picture you as a steroid using monkey see monkey do who reads flex (for the pictures as you couldnt be reading it properly otherwise you wouldnt make such comments) and copies everything someone bigger does. am i right?
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all the intra-abdominal pressure caused from hoisting the weight up from that position, each and every rep. to work the muscle effectively, you should only be working with the top 80% of the movement anyway, always keeping a slight bend on the elbows, esp at the bottom. it is far more effective because you dont lose tension on the muscle at the bottom, like he demonstrates here each time. Also, I think the straight bar sucks for curls, especially heavy ones. Too much pressure on the wrists IMO..very awkward movement.
i cant help myself.
if you want to give advice, make sure it's sound.
first off, the top 80% is completre BS. in a free weight exercise, much of the force is gone at about the 70% up position as the moment (the horizontal distance from the pivot to the weight) is very small.
The "weight" that the muscle sees, is in fact, the moment. This is the case for EVERY exercise. So, the maximum moment in every exercise is the position where the weight is at a max from the pivot- where it is perpendicular to gravity.
So, if you want to maximse your energy, you need to be working about the max moment..say 30% each side, maybe 35%. i.e. no rest at the top, no rest at the bottom.
the problem is that this is very intense. Rest pause- which is a type of what this guy is doing, is completely fine. Also, as he swings to bring the bar up from the position of least mechanical advantage (where the weight is in line or behind the pivot AND against gravity), then this is considered ok also. Arnold built some very nice biceps using this form intuitively.
Now, the exception to this is with cables. You need to think of what "plane" the weight is coming from with them.
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you really think that "competitors" in your title gives you right to make dumb ass comments like you actually understand how to train the human body dont you?
some of the crap you're writing is hilarious. quite entertaining actually.
but unfortunately propagates the stereotype of the moron BB. i picture you as a steroid using monkey see monkey do who reads flex (for the pictures as you couldnt be reading it properly otherwise you wouldnt make such comments) and copies everything someone bigger does. am i right?
Wow, I've really gotten under your skin havent I? :o calm down Gloria..sounds like you may have an inferiority complex with the 'competitor stars'. Its ok grasshopper, you will get there someday ;)
I'm only giving advice based on my own personal preferences, injuries, experiences in the 14 years I've been training as a natural bodybuilder. :) Not everything can be learned in a anatomy textbook, sweetheart :-*...some will disagree w me...but take it or leave it! As you said earlier.. my advice is 'free' .. so your feelings shouldnt be hurt too bad. :-[ :'(
BTW..Tell me how someone with the name 'disco-stu' should be giving out training advice ???
<---(epic overuse of smileys--meltdown)
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Wow, I've really gotten under your skin havent I? :o calm down Gloria..sounds like you may have an inferiority complex with the 'competitor stars'. Its ok grasshopper, you will get there someday ;)
I'm only giving advice based on my own personal preferences, injuries, experiences in the 14 years I've been training as a natural bodybuilder. :) Not everything can be learned in a anatomy textbook, sweetheart :-*...some will disagree w me...but take it or leave it! As you said earlier.. my advice is 'free' .. so your feelings shouldnt be hurt too bad. :-[ :'(
BTW..Tell me how someone with the name 'disco-stu' should be giving out training advice ???
What do you think about weighted chins for a biceps exercise?
I been doing alot of those lately, just trying to get some gains in strength.
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i cant help myself.
if you want to give advice, make sure it's sound.
first off, the top 80% is completre BS. in a free weight exercise, much of the force is gone at about the 70% up position as the moment (the horizontal distance from the pivot to the weight) is very small.
The "weight" that the muscle sees, is in fact, the moment. This is the case for EVERY exercise. So, the maximum moment in every exercise is the position where the weight is at a max from the pivot- where it is perpendicular to gravity.
So, if you want to maximse your energy, you need to be working about the max moment..say 30% each side, maybe 35%. i.e. no rest at the top, no rest at the bottom.
the problem is that this is very intense. Rest pause- which is a type of what this guy is doing, is completely fine. Also, as he swings to bring the bar up from the position of least mechanical advantage (where the weight is in line or behind the pivot AND against gravity), then this is considered ok also. Arnold built some very nice biceps using this form intuitively.
Now, the exception to this is with cables. You need to think of what "plane" the weight is coming from with them.
your missing my original point, dipshit ???
his form is good, I never said it wasnt..& this might be great for working the biceps, as we all have our own way of doing things.. however, the abdominal strain and pressure this is causing will lead to a abdominal wall tear. wearing a belt may prevent this, IMO
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What do you think about weighted chins for a biceps exercise?
I been doing alot of those lately, just trying to get some gains in strength.
me personally, only do chins as a back excercise, and they are not weighted. I very seldom feel bicep fatigue from this. It could work, but I wouldnt know.
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you need to learn about about anatomy before you give out free advice.
the EZ bar is counter productive to biceps movements as it rotates the wrist and results in less biceps recruitment.
the idea for biceps involvement is to have the body of the bi do most of the movement, without involving secondary groups like the forearms. having the wrist not fully pronated means that the forearms are more involved.
the straight bar is far superior to EZ curl bar except for a small range of movement where it becomes uncomfortable due to it not being able to move with the arc and therefore placing some awkwardness on the wrists.
however its far more effective if used, and by far the most effective is dumb bells as you get the best of both worlds, as long as you pronate the hand through the ROM.
hope this helps.
thanks for helping me prove my point about the straight bar... also for chiming in about how to do dumbell curls, even though we are discussing barbell curls... ::)
a fucking genius you are! 8)
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:D
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HAHA!
I didn't even watch the clip but the Title had me cracking up!
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LMAO @ ol' ironsides ;D
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I like "Pheasent under Glass" myself... ;D
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I like "Pheasent under Glass" myself... ;D
haha, thx. posted it on my FB page..
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haha, thx. posted it on my FB page..
Link?
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http://www.new.facebook.com/rhonda.rydell?ref=name
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OFF-Topic:
"Rydell" - Swedish relatives?
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OFF-Topic:
"Rydell" - Swedish relatives?
VERY GOOD! Yes Swedish...also Larsson.. half Finnish too.
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Not a bad recombination at all!
Good gene-pool! :)
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The EZ bar, because it isolates the biceps much better, and puts the joints in a more natural angle. Having said that though..not all EZ bars are created equal. Some of them suck, the newer ones especially. Gimme an old-school one. :)
i wouldnt say the ez bar isolates the bicep bette, it hits the brachialis more effectively, but not the bicep as a whole. barbell is more effective for the bulk of the bicep, as far as biomechanics is concerned.
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your missing my original point, dipshit ???
his form is good, I never said it wasnt..& this might be great for working the biceps, as we all have our own way of doing things.. however, the abdominal strain and pressure this is causing will lead to a abdominal wall tear. wearing a belt may prevent this, IMO
You don't have a fucking clue. If you think puny 135 barbell curls are going to cause an abdominal wall tear what would
a 500lb squat or deadlift would do to you? I think we can both agree that there would be greater abdominal pressure
with those movements right? I mean after all, you're a personal trainer. Oh wait, I forgot...you guys don't know shit either. If anything he might strain his lower back if he was doing the barbell curls/power cleans that I see guys doing in the gym. I do think you have good taste for a chick...Love almost any Martin Scorcese, Francis Ford Coppola, Stanley Kubrick film. Love Clint Eastwood, Robert DeNiro, Al Pacino, to name a few. How many girls do you meet who say they love Marty, Bobby and Al. Don't worry you're a female personal trainer I don't expect you to know anything about training. Just keep training those fatties with your balls and all the other garbage you guys use. More horizontal push ups on the smith machine fatty.
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Look, if my advice based on my own personal experience and the experience of others i train around doesnt mean shit to you all, thats ok w me. Ive seen it happen more times than I care to though. When your doing those heavy curls (doesnt even have to be that heavy) straining and hoisting that dead weight up from the bottom..then you feel a 'pop' just above your navel, and then a sharp pain that wont go away & gets worse, .. u can literally feel the split in your abdominal wall w ur finger..dont come whining to me. ::) --all I'm saying is that wearing a belt during heavy curls will help prevent this. Last f*cking time I'm gonna say it :D (some of you, I hope you go and learn this the hard way, sooner the better ;D)
Now, all you 'certified personal trainers' in here can go back to studying your anatomy charts & your ACE books.
Hope this helps! :D
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i wouldnt say the ez bar isolates the bicep bette, it hits the brachialis more effectively, but not the bicep as a whole. barbell is more effective for the bulk of the bicep, as far as biomechanics is concerned.
I hear you, but it is the un-natural and painful position of the wrists that concerns me. It is worse in some people more than others. The joint pain and possible injury and aggravation isnt worth it.
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I hear you, but it is the un-natural and painful position of the wrists that concerns me. It is worse in some people more than others. The joint pain and possible injury and aggravation isnt worth it.
ez bar sure is easy on the wrist, it depends on how wide you grip the bar if the barbell style is gonna be a problem.
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ez bar sure is easy on the wrist, it depends on how wide you grip the bar if the barbell style is gonna be a problem.
the shape of the bar too, where it bends..it seems most of the newer ones are designed to look shiny & pretty rather than be functional.
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Insomnia knows her stuff, you better get used to it little tits.
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Insomnia knows her stuff, you better get used to it little tits.
Thank you, Mars.
btw, your avatar is disturbing..
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Thank you, Mars.
btw, your avatar is disturbing..
i'm still not convinced that women can actually be politically conservative.... just like I'm not convinced that they actually care about football (they don't even pretend with baseball for the most part0
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VERY GOOD! Yes Swedish...also Larsson.. half Finnish too.
You do know that Swedes are complete morons (jævla skitstøvler hele gjengen!) and that Finns are primitive fucks? :D
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Wow, I've really gotten under your skin havent I? :o calm down Gloria..sounds like you may have an inferiority complex with the 'competitor stars'. Its ok grasshopper, you will get there someday ;)
I'm only giving advice based on my own personal preferences, injuries, experiences in the 14 years I've been training as a natural bodybuilder. :) Not everything can be learned in a anatomy textbook, sweetheart :-*...some will disagree w me...but take it or leave it! As you said earlier.. my advice is 'free' .. so your feelings shouldnt be hurt too bad. :-[ :'(
BTW..Tell me how someone with the name 'disco-stu' should be giving out training advice ???
<---(epic overuse of smileys--meltdown)
the only reason people like yuourself get under my skin is that there's a whole load of your types around- and a major proportion of them post here.
my handle has nothing to do with whtehr i should or could give advice, however my 25 years training and sports science degree says that you are a moron.
thats why. oh, and the fact that what i wrote can be tracked down to be actually correct- factual, on the internet under the scrutiny of not only monkey BB's, but also experts whereas, yours is easily argued away by a gym monkey.
you can get together with your groupies and spoon each other if that makes you feel good.
still doesnt change the fact that you are dishing out crap advice for free... thats the bit that really shits me.
the guy in the video's doing everything right and you rag on him..
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The idea behind the EZ bar is that is does not compromise the elbow joints as much as a straight bar. The EZ Curl bar is useful for any exercise that puts excessive pressure on the wrists or elbows.
If you are curling a straight bar with heavy weights, or weights that may be too heavy for you, the tension on the biceps is minimized and is placed elsewhere. This "elsewhere" would be the wrist and elbow joints. The elbow joint does not just move the arm straight up and down. If the wrists are supinated, the elbow travels upward and away from the body in its natural path of direction. A straight bar with heavy weights will force the arms to move straight up and down, taking away from the natural directional preference of the elbow joint. The joints of the elbows are then "compromised" and forced to do something that is unnatural and dangerous.
When you are young and full of cum... I mean test and D-bol, you won't notice. When you get older and you've stuck to your straight arm heavy bar curls, your elbows will be lettin' you know fo sho.
(http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x263/timeamajorova/elbow2.png)
One of you bastages is gonna be crowned the next training board mod... I can see it now.
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I hear you, but it is the un-natural and painful position of the wrists that concerns me. It is worse in some people more than others. The joint pain and possible injury and aggravation isnt worth it.
more bullshit.
there's only a small portion of the ROM that puts the wrist in a mechanically disadvantageous position. not the entire ROM. Also, it can be exacerbated by the spacing of the hands. Work within those restrictions and your'e fine. The total time spent in that uncomfortable position does not outweigh the limitsations of using an EZ curl bar, which is most definitely an arm builder, but its split across biceps and brachs.
the only natural movement is using DB or handles with cables, and even then the cables apply too much weight throughout the ROM.
as Nautilus always said- there is a CAM for every single individual.
i love how anyone who hasnt got any formal qualifications always goes for the "books" insult. OK, so how do we understand how the body works without books then?...or anything for that matter?... do we dig up corpses?...its not 1735 you know!
there's a thing called - not reinventing the wheel..it means that we learn from fact that others have discovered. There is a difference in that we dont learn from other's speculation and guesswork..which is what "experience" is unless it is structured.
you really need to learn to question your assumptions and conclusions more thoroughly and not just rely on what you think..as its often wrong. you need to combine your experience with research, and then test to make sure that you actually do understand it.
shall i go on schooling you sweetie?
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the only reason people like yuourself get under my skin is that there's a whole load of your types around- and a major proportion of them post here.
my handle has nothing to do with whtehr i should or could give advice, however my 25 years training and sports science degree says that you are a moron.
thats why. oh, and the fact that what i wrote can be tracked down to be actually correct- factual, on the internet under the scrutiny of not only monkey BB's, but also experts whereas, yours is easily argued away by a gym monkey.
you can get together with your groupies and spoon each other if that makes you feel good.
still doesnt change the fact that you are dishing out crap advice for free... thats the bit that really shits me.
the guy in the video's doing everything right and you rag on him..
Shit, how old are you? ;D
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The idea behind the EZ bar is that is does not compromise the elbow joints as much as a straight bar. The EZ Curl bar is useful for any exercise that puts excessive pressure on the wrists or elbows.
If you are curling a straight bar with heavy weights, or weights that may be too heavy for you, the tension on the biceps is minimized and is placed elsewhere. This "elsewhere" would be the wrist and elbow joints. The elbow joint does not just move the arm straight up and down. If the wrists are supinated, the elbow travels upward and away from the body in its natural path of direction. A straight bar with heavy weights will force the arms to move straight up and down, taking away from the natural directional preference of the elbow joint. The joints of the elbows are then "compromised" and forced to do something that is unnatural and dangerous.
When you are young and full of cum... I mean test and D-bol, you won't notice. When you get older and you've stuck to your straight arm heavy bar curls, your elbows will be lettin' you know fo sho.
(http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x263/timeamajorova/elbow2.png)
One of you bastages is gonna be crowned the next training board mod... I can see it now.
exactly. which is why the straight bar is fine for a limited ROM as it fits into that "path".
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Shit, how old are you? ;D
do you need help?
surely you can work it out...i would have to be over 40, right?
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do you need help?
surely you can work it out...i would have to be over 40, right?
You did not answer the question.
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I know there aren't many "roto-bars" out there anymore, but they allow you to turn your hands in a supinating action against resistance as you do the exercise.
The more weight you use, the greater the resistance as you turn your hands. If you were to do the exercise correctly the biceps would be doubly taxed, not only in the portion of flexion, but also in the action of supination.
I would also assume that maintaining as much thoracic and intra-abdominal pressure would help hold your spine in place, which in turn, would help keep you from cheating.
Everyone I see curling uses momentum to get the weight up. You'd be better off leaning against a wall and keeping your elbows stationary.
There is this one dude at my gym that is about 6 feet tall and about 150 lbs. soakin' wet. He cheat curls 135 lbs. regularly. I'm waiting for his back to break or for him to fall backwards when he tries to reverse-press the weight at the top of the rep. His joints are already turning to shit just because of the way he lets the weight drop. His elbows are probably like a worn out U-joint by now.
Another year (or less) and he won't even be able to whack off...
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His joints are already turning to shit just because of the way he lets the weight drop. His elbows are probably like a worn out U-joint by now.
Another year (or less) and he won't even be able to whack off...
You're like a walking MRI machine. Awesome!
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the guy is impressive
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You're like a walking MRI machine. Awesome!
Yep, I can see right through you...
Now, go get your liver, kidneys and brain checked. You've got tumors.
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The idea behind the EZ bar is that is does not compromise the elbow joints as much as a straight bar. The EZ Curl bar is useful for any exercise that puts excessive pressure on the wrists or elbows.
If you are curling a straight bar with heavy weights, or weights that may be too heavy for you, the tension on the biceps is minimized and is placed elsewhere. This "elsewhere" would be the wrist and elbow joints. The elbow joint does not just move the arm straight up and down. If the wrists are supinated, the elbow travels upward and away from the body in its natural path of direction. A straight bar with heavy weights will force the arms to move straight up and down, taking away from the natural directional preference of the elbow joint. The joints of the elbows are then "compromised" and forced to do something that is unnatural and dangerous.
When you are young and full of cum... I mean test and D-bol, you won't notice. When you get older and you've stuck to your straight arm heavy bar curls, your elbows will be lettin' you know fo sho.
(http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x263/timeamajorova/elbow2.png)
One of you bastages is gonna be crowned the next training board mod... I can see it now.
good post! thank you for taking the time. :)