Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: Necrosis on November 04, 2009, 08:28:54 PM
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not sure how this will fly but i get a shit ton of pm's about various things. So, is there anyone with health concerns, interesting supplements, body composition problems etc that they would like answered(ill try my best). Give me a day or two to respond. help is appreciated but i think alot of posters on here have very intelligent questions and this is a thread with will entice discussion on those topics. If it fails, oh well. :D i wont accept questions from haidar ;D.
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Ha-ha...
This is code for “Montague, please stop fu**ing PM'ing me every other week."
;)
Okay, I’ll start…
Necrosis:
I’m interested in your opinion of raw (uncooked) extra virgin olive oil used as a dietary supplement (in much the same way fish oils/EFA’s are incorporated).
Our absentee comrade Midnite Rambo suggested its use a couple of years ago, and I’ve recently begun drinking about 1½ TBSP at night and/or mornings.
Here’s the article:
http://food.yahoo.com/blog/beautyeats/8039/5-reasons-why-olive-oil-is-the-ultimate-healthy-fat (http://food.yahoo.com/blog/beautyeats/8039/5-reasons-why-olive-oil-is-the-ultimate-healthy-fat)
Here’s the original thread:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=143962.0 (http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=143962.0)
Anyway, how would you rate its benefits compared to other healthy fats/oils?
Thanks.
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Ha-ha...
This is code for “Montague, please stop fu**ing PM'ing me every other week."
;)
Okay, I’ll start…
Necrosis:
I’m interested in your opinion of raw (uncooked) extra virgin olive oil used as a dietary supplement (in much the same way fish oils/EFA’s are incorporated).
Our absentee comrade Midnite Rambo suggested its use a couple of years ago, and I’ve recently begun drinking about 1½ TBSP at night and/or mornings.
Here’s the article:
http://food.yahoo.com/blog/beautyeats/8039/5-reasons-why-olive-oil-is-the-ultimate-healthy-fat (http://food.yahoo.com/blog/beautyeats/8039/5-reasons-why-olive-oil-is-the-ultimate-healthy-fat)
Here’s the original thread:
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=143962.0 (http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=143962.0)
Anyway, how would you rate its benefits compared to other healthy fats/oils?
Thanks.
:D
good question.
decent article i didnt see any references however they are a little off on some things. For one Oleic acid (the main fatty acid w-9) in olive oil has been shown to be a predictor in breast cancer via erthythrocyte membrane saturation. More studies are needed and i haven't researched it extensively but i dont think of it as one of the more powerful anti-oncogenic "supplements". There are studies showing otherwise however, i would suggest it is anti-oncogenic and poses not threat in that regard. The article is a nice summary.
it sure does lower blood pressure, its great for that. However, the article didnt mention that oleic acid (i skimmed it, forgive me if i missed it) is the main player in its hypotensive effects.
Oleic acid content is responsible for the reduction in blood pressure induced by olive oil
S. Terés*, G. Barceló-Coblijn*, M. Benet*, R. Álvarez*, R. Bressani†, J. E. Halver‡,§, and P. V. Escribá*,§
+ Author Affiliations
*Laboratory of Molecular Cell Biomedicine, Department of Biology, Institut Universitari d'Investigacions en Ciències de la Salut, University of the Balearic Islands, Carretera de Valldemossa Km 7.5, E-07122 Palma de Mallorca, Spain;
†Centro de Ciencia y Tecnología de Alimentos, Instituto de Investigación, University of Guatemala, Guatemala City, Guatemala; and
‡School of Aquatic and Fishery Sciences, University of Washington, Seattle, WA 98195
Contributed by J. E. Halver, August 1, 2008 (received for review June 17, 2008)
Abstract
Numerous studies have shown that high olive oil intake reduces blood pressure (BP). These positive effects of olive oil have frequently been ascribed to its minor components, such as α-tocopherol, polyphenols, and other phenolic compounds that are not present in other oils. However, in this study we demonstrate that the hypotensive effect of olive oil is caused by its high oleic acid (OA) content (≈70–80%). We propose that olive oil intake increases OA levels in membranes, which regulates membrane lipid structure (HII phase propensity) in such a way as to control G protein-mediated signaling, causing a reduction in BP. This effect is in part caused by its regulatory action on G protein-associated cascades that regulate adenylyl cyclase and phospholipase C. In turn, the OA analogues, elaidic and stearic acids, had no hypotensive activity, indicating that the molecular mechanisms that link membrane lipid structure and BP regulation are very specific. Similarly, soybean oil (with low OA content) did not reduce BP. This study demonstrates that olive oil induces its hypotensive effects through the action of OA.
I think this is one of the key uses for olive oil besides the other potentially beneficial constituents. Heart health is majorly important for males especially and olive oil is a very good anti-hypertensive. Combined with cq10 it should be a good stack for the stressed out. Also, it may have effects on memory like the article stated, more research is needed to further tease apart confounding variables though, but i imagine it will be found to have a strong neuroprotective effect. It seems to inhibit cholestrogenesis in glia, the clean up cells if you will of the CNS. One of the possible mechanisms.
Dement Geriatr Cogn Disord. 2009 Oct 30;28(4):357-364. [Epub ahead of print]
Olive Oil and Cognition: Results from the Three-City Study.
Berr C, Portet F, Carriere I, Akbaraly TN, Feart C, Gourlet V, Combe N, Barberger-Gateau P, Ritchie K.
INSERM U888, Université Montpellier 1, Montpellier, France.
Background: Olive oil is a major component of the Mediterranean diet suggested to be beneficial to counteract Alzheimer's disease. Aim of the Study: Our objective was to examine the association between olive oil use, cognitive deficit and cognitive decline in a large elderly population. Methods: We followed 6,947 subjects with a brief baseline food frequency questionnaire and repeated cognitive tests. Olive oil intake was categorized as none (22.7%), moderate (use for cooking or dressing, 39.9%) and intensive (use for both cooking and dressing, 37.4%). Associations between olive oil and cognitive outcomes were examined taking into account socio-economic factors, health behaviors, health measures and other dietary intakes. Results: Participants with moderate or intensive use of olive oil compared to those who never used olive oil showed lower odds of cognitive deficit for verbal fluency and visual memory. For cognitive decline during the 4-year follow-up, the association with intensive use was significant for visual memory (adjusted OR = 0.83, 95% CI: 0.69-0.99) but not for verbal fluency (OR = 0.85, 95% CI: 0.70-1.03) in multivariate analysis. Conclusions: This olive oil-cognition association needs to be confirmed by further studies. However, our findings already shed light on the potential importance of olive oil in the Mediterranean diet and on its beneficial effects on health. Copyright © 2009 S. Karger AG, Basel.
When replacing saturated fats in the diet it certainly effects lipid profiles and it is associated with lower Cardiovascular disease in the southern mediterranean countries.
-Your dosage is right on, it may cause loose stools if you havent already dealth with that and most studies showed that 2 tbsps were the sweet spot for cardio health. I would definitely keep up the usage of it, but it should be used in conjunction with fish oil, it cannot replace it. I beleive the body can make it de novo via delta 9 desaturase--enzyme could be wrong here havent reviewed this in years. I still rank fish oil higher it terms of effect, but olive oil is right up there.
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Your dosage is right on, it may cause loose stools if you havent already dealth with that and most studies showed that 2 tbsps were the sweet spot for cardio health. I would definitely keep up the usage of it, but it should be used in conjunction with fish oil, it cannot replace it. I beleive the body can make it de novo via delta 9 desaturase--enzyme could be wrong here havent reviewed this in years. I still rank fish oil higher it terms of effect, but olive oil is right up there.
Okay, thanks.
I’ve broken away from fish oil for a little while now (I’m not even sure why).
I’ve read a little about the Mediterranean Diet & how some of those people will actually down shots of olive oil with their meals.
Those folks are in amazingly good health, but again, they’re also consuming ass-loads of fish.
It’s good to know that olive oil is a wise addition, but I can see I will be starting with fish oil use again very soon.
Thank you for the info and your insight.
Side Bar: the only time I noticed stool abnormalities was the first day I took the oil with my morning coffee. That was also the last day I did as much.
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Round #2:
Amino acids are crucial to muscle development & preservation, and it’s imperative that you consume them in some form.
Many schools of thought on their use:
1.) Some people feel they are only necessary to add when “cutting.”
2.) Some believe that if you’re already eating an adequate diet and/or using a good quality whey mix, then at least your BCAA requirements are met, and that further supplementation is pointless.
3.) Others – including Milos – claim that SPECIFIC aminos, combos, & timing are much more important than simply general protein consumption. And that goes for building, maintaining, and dieting.
I happen to side more with Milos since it is a fact that different aminos have different physiological effects on the body – hence the reason something like whey is superior to soy for building muscle.
What would Necrosis recommend in the way of amino acid use?
And that includes essential, non-essential, branched chain, etc…
What to take,
How much,
When,
With what,
Best sources,
What adjustments should be made based on goals as well as training & eating habits?
I would love to hear your thoughts on this, as I know they will be based on solid facts rather than marketing.
Thanks.
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In most of the studies, besides the ones for scivation blends perform no better then supplementing aminos. However, i agree with you as aminos taken individually have effects that you may want to elicit. For example leucine has shown the ability to increase protein synthesis on a dose basis, a positive correlation that is. Now could you get the same thing with a whey protein with a high leucine content? YES. However, in whey other aminos compete for finite transporters which will hinder absorption and will cause some wastage via gluconeogenesis, the urea cycle and what not. For example, leucine competes with tryptophan for a co transporter if you take leucine alone you avoid this problem and reap all the benefits. If you take the same amount of leucine from whey with all the other aminos you get competition which will have a different outcome. 1. less leucine is utilized, less is absorbed, more is wasted. So in order to get the benefits of leucine from whey the leucine content would theotretically have to be much higher.
I like supplementing leucine, it lowers the post workout tryptophan increase which results in fatigue and gives me mental stamina. A product called the size from avantlabs had it right, leucine, creatine, ip6 etc.
im not a huge fan of other aminos besides tyrosine for raw materials for dopamine and norepinephrine production. For people like me or others using stimulants alot, it also has a stimulating effect in high doses.
Arginine may have an effect on GH pulsation, along with causing some vasodialation. That property is overstated, however, it does increase fullness and combates stim dick to some degree.
glutamine is garbage.
I would disagree with milos to some degree, i think high protein around workouts is good but protein is more important the single amino acid supplementation unless you are skewing each meal. IE drinking high dose leucine with meals would be highly beneficial on top of high protein.
I would use leucine when exercising period, no particular time. That and creatine are staples in my diet, i drink the size with most meals.
sorry for the scattered post, but im re reading your questions and find im missing some shit. Some aminos are better for muscular size for sure as per your example of whey vs soy. I have a lecture on protein you might find interesting, perhaps ill send it to you. Its very simplistic and easy to read.
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Pm question
"Thanks for the reply...
I will be using a carb cycling approach starting with 150g Monday-Wednesday 300g Thursday & Friday, 400g Saturday, and 50g on Sunday
I would be most interested in what you felt would be the most beneficial, not looking to put out a ton of money, but am willing to purchase what would actually provide me with the best results.
I am not adverse to stims, unless you feel that they would raise cortisol to the point that muscle would waste away.
I have the 1-T & Sustain Alpha from Primordial Performance that I have not used."
basically asking what to take to help diet, or aid in fat loss. I will answer this tonight, or later in the day dude, i didnt forget about ya homes :D.
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In most of the studies, besides the ones for scivation blends perform no better then supplementing aminos. However, i agree with you as aminos taken individually have effects that you may want to elicit. For example leucine has shown the ability to increase protein synthesis on a dose basis, a positive correlation that is. Now could you get the same thing with a whey protein with a high leucine content? YES. However, in whey other aminos compete for finite transporters which will hinder absorption and will cause some wastage via gluconeogenesis, the urea cycle and what not. For example, leucine competes with tryptophan for a co transporter if you take leucine alone you avoid this problem and reap all the benefits. If you take the same amount of leucine from whey with all the other aminos you get competition which will have a different outcome. 1. less leucine is utilized, less is absorbed, more is wasted. So in order to get the benefits of leucine from whey the leucine content would theotretically have to be much higher.
I like supplementing leucine, it lowers the post workout tryptophan increase which results in fatigue and gives me mental stamina. A product called the size from avantlabs had it right, leucine, creatine, ip6 etc.
im not a huge fan of other aminos besides tyrosine for raw materials for dopamine and norepinephrine production. For people like me or others using stimulants alot, it also has a stimulating effect in high doses.
Arginine may have an effect on GH pulsation, along with causing some vasodialation. That property is overstated, however, it does increase fullness and combates stim dick to some degree.
glutamine is garbage.
I would disagree with milos to some degree, i think high protein around workouts is good but protein is more important the single amino acid supplementation unless you are skewing each meal. IE drinking high dose leucine with meals would be highly beneficial on top of high protein.
I would use leucine when exercising period, no particular time. That and creatine are staples in my diet, i drink the size with most meals.
sorry for the scattered post, but im re reading your questions and find im missing some shit. Some aminos are better for muscular size for sure as per your example of whey vs soy. I have a lecture on protein you might find interesting, perhaps ill send it to you. Its very simplistic and easy to read.
Thank you.
And yes - when you have time, please send me the lecture. I would love to read through it.
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Pm question
"Thanks for the reply...
I will be using a carb cycling approach starting with 150g Monday-Wednesday 300g Thursday & Friday, 400g Saturday, and 50g on Sunday
I would be most interested in what you felt would be the most beneficial, not looking to put out a ton of money, but am willing to purchase what would actually provide me with the best results.
I am not adverse to stims, unless you feel that they would raise cortisol to the point that muscle would waste away.
I have the 1-T & Sustain Alpha from Primordial Performance that I have not used."
basically asking what to take to help diet, or aid in fat loss. I will answer this tonight, or later in the day dude, i didnt forget about ya homes :D.
i generally like the carb cycling approach first outlined by twinpeaks way back in the day. Basically a high, med, no carb cycle with certain foods allowed and eating as many carbs as needed within the guidelines. I can supply the article if you like but just a quick search of carb cycling should bring it up. It removes the counting and geusswork and makes the diet easier, i have used it with success.
now as for supplementation im not going to beat around the bush your best bet is ephedrine and caffeine combined the old stand by. this is super cheap and is a great systemic fat burner. On the days in which you are very low on cals carbs appetite suppression is key, nicorette could be used here with a little caffeine. 2-4 mgs is enough to provide an increase in BMR and appetite suppression. you could do this everyday or only on the days when you need to get hunger under control. Addiction should not be an issue as the addiciton issue with cigarettes is related to the speed in which nicotine reaches the blood and subsequently leaves causing harsh peaks and valleys along with a much higher dosing of a heavy smoker. 2mgs a day was shown to have none to mild withdrawals.
I would also suggest eviscerate or napalm, topical fat burners, placed on your trouble areas combined with your systemic fat burner this will be a potent combo, they are great products also. Green tea is another thing i am fond of along with fish oil for body composition. That would be the thing i would use and is not overly expensive. You could add stuff for cortisol support, but it may be expensive, if you want to go this route i suggest suppress-c.
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Okay, here’s one:
I’m a big fan of the Vince Gironda & Rheo Blair principles.
Both men instructed their clients to add eggs to their protein drinks.
Vince suggested raw eggs.
Blair recommended eggs dropped in boiling water for about 30 seconds.
Conflicting information has generated controversy over the issues of safety & nutrient absorption of raw egg consumption.
At the same time, it’s hard to argue with the results that the 1960’s Venice Beach crowd enjoyed.
My question:
With the current information out there, what is your opinion on the safety & effectiveness of eating raw – undercooked eggs?
Thanks.
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Okay, here’s one:
I’m a big fan of the Vince Gironda & Rheo Blair principles.
Both men instructed their clients to add eggs to their protein drinks.
Vince suggested raw eggs.
Blair recommended eggs dropped in boiling water for about 30 seconds.
Conflicting information has generated controversy over the issues of safety & nutrient absorption of raw egg consumption.
At the same time, it’s hard to argue with the results that the 1960’s Venice Beach crowd enjoyed.
My question:
With the current information out there, what is your opinion on the safety & effectiveness of eating raw – undercooked eggs?
Thanks.
didn't forget about this, however, had a couple exams i will give you a better response tommorrow if i find any conflicting information. Raw eggs contain avidin which can bind biotin a b vitamin (water soluble vitamin), causing reduce levels of this b vitamin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avidin
however, biotin is produced by intestinal bacteria de novo so i highly doubt you will cause deficiency with normal levels of raw egg eating, i am thinking 2-4 eggs a day here. I have no data to back this up at the moment and i highly doubt there is any solid data on the amounts. I would also be concerned of possible salmonella infection which while usually self limiting is quite shitty with its symptoms and course, it can be fatal as well. Salmonella also needs a low infective dose, although most eggs would have little to none to begin with, it is a risk however.
So i see two potential negatives and so far no benefits, i mean eggs are a great source of protein dont get me wrong, but slightly cooking them for go's the possible bacterial infection and has minimal impact on protein degradation. I do not see any good reason to eat raw eggs apart from either buying a blended protein with egg in it, or cooking the eggs to sunnyside up, scrambled. I doubt you will see any tangible benefits and once you contract salmonella you will agree the risk is not worth it. The risk is very small as is the concern of avidin but they are there and i do not see them outweighing the benefits.
Just buy some matrix protein :D :D ;D
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No need to apologize.
I know you’re busy this time of year.
As always, I appreciate your time & info.
Thanks for the response, and thanks for starting this thread.
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HUGE NEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ???!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 :'( OMG 2012!!!!!!!11
with the recent outpouring of questions in this thread i will have to let everyone know that i am writing exams next week, 10 in 5 days :D, and then going home for christmas. I will be slow to answer any questions, this thread was meant for more of a archive of already asked questions so it doesnt matter.
post them up if you want and ill give em a whirl or any of the other mods.
Again anything you ask via pm to a mod of this board is a fair question for this thread to lessen the repitition of questions.
AGAIN, EXCEPT HAIDAR.
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necrosis what do you think about protein intake. 2g gram per kilo(roughly 1 gram per lb) highest possibly supported by science?
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necrosis what do you think about protein intake. 2g gram per kilo(roughly 1 gram per lb) highest possibly supported by science?
yes its an old standard recommendation but i would say its probably a good idea to eat even more than that...probably up to 1.5 gram per lbs/day as a natural and even more when dieting (depending on how harsh the diet is). hormonized bodybuilders can go even higher.
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yes its an old standard recommendation but i would say its probably a good idea to eat even more than that...probably up to 1.5 gram per lbs/day as a natural and even more when dieting (depending on how harsh the diet is). hormonized bodybuilders can go even higher.
I will get to you question candi, i could answer but id rather form a proper response to your question.
Appreciate the response here, if you could try to support you statements with facts and research. Please.
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Hey Nec,
Put down your Christmas cookies & eggnog for a minute. And quit playing with your candy cane while dreaming about Santa’s bald elf – I have a question.
We’ve all read how important/vital muscle glycogen replenishment is for growth & repair.
However, lots of people report great results using the “Anabolic Diet” and other similar protocols.
Hell, even back in the 60’s gurus like Gironda and Blair advocated the high protein/high fat/extremely low carb diets for building muscle.
Here’s my question:
Following diets such as those mentioned above, on what is the body relying for recovery “fuel?”
Are amino acids a more important part of the equation than originally thought?
Or, does a biological mechanism like gluconeogenesis provide the muscles with sufficient glycogen/glucose levels?
And since GNG generates glucose from amino acids, could we then say that glucose is the most important “end result” factor in muscle repair?
Primarily, I’m interested in why exactly the super low carb diets work so well.
Thanks,
Happy Holidays!
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Hey Nec,
Put down your Christmas cookies & eggnog for a minute. And quit playing with your candy cane while dreaming about Santa’s bald elf – I have a question.
We’ve all read how important/vital muscle glycogen replenishment is for growth & repair.
However, lots of people report great results using the “Anabolic Diet” and other similar protocols.
Hell, even back in the 60’s gurus like Gironda and Blair advocated the high protein/high fat/extremely low carb diets for building muscle.
Here’s my question:
Following diets such as those mentioned above, on what is the body relying for recovery “fuel?”
Are amino acids a more important part of the equation than originally thought?
Or, does a biological mechanism like gluconeogenesis provide the muscles with sufficient glycogen/glucose levels?
And since GNG generates glucose from amino acids, could we then say that glucose is the most important “end result” factor in muscle repair?
Primarily, I’m interested in why exactly the super low carb diets work so well.
Thanks,
Happy Holidays!
no sweat, i have exam left then travel on the 22nd then ill get to responding to you guys (tbombz and you). This weeks been a real bitch, nine exams in five days :o
eggnog is definitely anabolic though :D
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eggnog is definitely anabolic though :D
Good enough for me!
:D
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no sweat, i have exam left then travel on the 22nd then ill get to responding to you guys (tbombz and you). This weeks been a real bitch, nine exams in five days :o
A kindly "bump" when you have some time, friend.
:)
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A kindly "bump" when you have some time, friend.
:)
sorry dude, forgot all about this i just arrived home in T dot. Going to class, will answer tonight.
Thanks for the reminder.
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Master. . .
WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKEN US!?!?!?
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Hey Nec,
Put down your Christmas cookies & eggnog for a minute. And quit playing with your candy cane while dreaming about Santa’s bald elf – I have a question.
We’ve all read how important/vital muscle glycogen replenishment is for growth & repair.
However, lots of people report great results using the “Anabolic Diet” and other similar protocols.
Hell, even back in the 60’s gurus like Gironda and Blair advocated the high protein/high fat/extremely low carb diets for building muscle.
Here’s my question:
Following diets such as those mentioned above, on what is the body relying for recovery “fuel?”
Are amino acids a more important part of the equation than originally thought?
Or, does a biological mechanism like gluconeogenesis provide the muscles with sufficient glycogen/glucose levels?
And since GNG generates glucose from amino acids, could we then say that glucose is the most important “end result” factor in muscle repair?
Primarily, I’m interested in why exactly the super low carb diets work so well.
Thanks,
Happy Holidays!
seems like i have had an epic fail here. Ketogenic diets are definitely good for fat loss as some recent research and old obviously link insulin release to adipocity, however fats especially if natural provide cholesterol for steroidogenesis and hormone production, not to mention raw materials for eicosanoids whicn have a diverse effect on hormones and anabolism.
you are looking at two sides of the coin here, glycogen stores provide the muscle with fuel to contract, while amino acids provide the materials to build muscle, or repair better yet. So one can theoretically have lower levels of glycogen and still build muscle under the right hormonal milieu. Now you can use odd chain fatty acids, lactate, glycerol for fuel for glucose substrates besides aminos (some aminos cannot be deaminated), aminos are usually the last thing used, as proteins are paramount to the body.
Gluconeogenesis definitely provides the body with enough glycogen(if it didnt, you would be dead) but its not optimal, however, the better homormal milieu and the re-feeds with cholesterol while insulin sensitivity is high may offset this. Usually these diets have a re-feed period to take advantage of sensitization and downregulation that occurs without constant glucose in take. Trace carbs from veggies etc help as well.
the reason they are so good for fat loss is related to insulin, it is a the key player here.
Hopefully that answered your question, i may have gone to in depth but i tried to answer all of the questions.
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necrosis what do you think about protein intake. 2g gram per kilo(roughly 1 gram per lb) highest possibly supported by science?
that is usually the upper limit, however, we have seen that specific hormonal advantages occur with levels around this level and possible higher. On top of that protein is hard to store as fat due to the various enzymatic conversions needed and its use as pretty much everything in the body from dna to muscle. Its needed for tissue repair, so having your diet high in protein is obviously better for lean gains.
i would agree with you at the moment that there is no need to go much higher then the level you stated. I will however, comb through the lit tomorrow and see what i find.
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seems like i have had an epic fail here. Ketogenic diets are definitely good for fat loss as some recent research and old obviously link insulin release to adipocity, however fats especially if natural provide cholesterol for steroidogenesis and hormone production, not to mention raw materials for eicosanoids whicn have a diverse effect on hormones and anabolism.
you are looking at two sides of the coin here, glycogen stores provide the muscle with fuel to contract, while amino acids provide the materials to build muscle, or repair better yet. So one can theoretically have lower levels of glycogen and still build muscle under the right hormonal milieu. Now you can use odd chain fatty acids, lactate, glycerol for fuel for glucose substrates besides aminos (some aminos cannot be deaminated), aminos are usually the last thing used, as proteins are paramount to the body.
Gluconeogenesis definitely provides the body with enough glycogen(if it didnt, you would be dead) but its not optimal, however, the better homormal milieu and the re-feeds with cholesterol while insulin sensitivity is high may offset this. Usually these diets have a re-feed period to take advantage of sensitization and downregulation that occurs without constant glucose in take. Trace carbs from veggies etc help as well.
the reason they are so good for fat loss is related to insulin, it is a the key player here.
Hopefully that answered your question, i may have gone to in depth but i tried to answer all of the questions.
Thank you.
As always, very much appreciated.
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Dear Smokes,
I figured this thread was overdue for a good bumping...
What are your thoughts on Conjugated Linoleic Acid as a lipid catabolist?
The 3-letter character limit makes it difficult to search on here.
Anyway, CLA supposedly targets abdominal fat, specifically - not sure of the mechanisms through which it allegedly does that, but…
My buddy included it during his contest prep a few years ago, but he used it with a bunch of other stuff, and I’m curious how it stands on its own.
I seem to remember you mentioning a while back that sesamin was an excellent stim-free fat burner.
I don't want to go the caffeine/ephedra route for long, so I'm looking for something that could be used before, after, (and possibly) during that.
So, how about it?
What can I do to help get ready for bikini season...
...besides NOT wearing one?
Thanks.
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Dear Smokes,
I figured this thread was overdue for a good bumping...
What are your thoughts on Conjugated Linoleic Acid as a lipid catabolist?
The 3-letter character limit makes it difficult to search on here.
Anyway, CLA supposedly targets abdominal fat, specifically - not sure of the mechanisms through which it allegedly does that, but…
My buddy included it during his contest prep a few years ago, but he used it with a bunch of other stuff, and I’m curious how it stands on its own.
I seem to remember you mentioning a while back that sesamin was an excellent stim-free fat burner.
I don't want to go the caffeine/ephedra route for long, so I'm looking for something that could be used before, after, (and possibly) during that.
So, how about it?
What can I do to help get ready for bikini season...
...besides NOT wearing one?
Thanks.
I've been thinking about this question for awhile :D ;D
The short is that it appears to have beneficial effects on body composition but the data is very mixed. Some studies show it has inflammatory and insulin dysregulatory effects.
My not so informed opinion as the data is so confounded is that its not worth the money and could possibly hurt you in the long run.
HEAT from avant labs or whoever is selling it now is a good fat free fat burner. If you cant find it i will get you a link, its good for mood elevation as well.
i would apologize for the time it took for me to answer this but it is so ridiculous that it's pointless ;D
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I've been thinking about this question for awhile :D ;D
The short is that it appears to have beneficial effects on body composition but the data is very mixed. Some studies show it has inflammatory and insulin dysregulatory effects.
My not so informed opinion as the data is so confounded is that its not worth the money and could possibly hurt you in the long run.
HEAT from avant labs or whoever is selling it now is a good fat free fat burner. If you cant find it i will get you a link, its good for mood elevation as well.
i would apologize for the time it took for me to answer this but it is so ridiculous that it's pointless ;D
Ha-ha…
No need to apologize; I appreciate the answer.
Have you personally used it?
Yes, please send me a link.
I'd love to check it out, and neither of my usual suppliers carries it.
It’s good to have you back.
You’re a breath of fresh air around here!
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Ha-ha…
No need to apologize; I appreciate the answer.
Have you personally used it?
Yes, please send me a link.
I'd love to check it out, and neither of my usual suppliers carries it.
It’s good to have you back.
You’re a breath of fresh air around here!
Thanks
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/genomyx/heat-stack-90-caps.html
i have never personally used CLA but have used heat only for mood elevation mostly. I am usually stimed out daily lol. I have always combined it with stimulants, but the ingredients do have scientific backing.
cheers!
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Thanks
http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/genomyx/heat-stack-90-caps.html
i have never personally used CLA but have used heat only for mood elevation mostly. I am usually stimed out daily lol. I have always combined it with stimulants, but the ingredients do have scientific backing.
cheers!
Good stuff.
So, Genomyx makes it now; that must be why I couldn’t find it under Avant when searching.
Looks like an impressive formula.
I’m also still considering trying Scivation’s sesamin product: http://www.allstarhealth.com/f/scivation-sesamin.htm
The more I read about it, the more I’m liking it.
Thanks, again!!
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Good stuff.
So, Genomyx makes it now; that must be why I couldn’t find it under Avant when searching.
Looks like an impressive formula.
I’m also still considering trying Scivation’s sesamin product: http://www.allstarhealth.com/f/scivation-sesamin.htm
The more I read about it, the more I’m liking it.
Thanks, again!!
its good stuff, however it can deplete glycogen levels and cause some fatigue and flatness. Nothing major as glycogen depletion is common during diets.