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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: 240 is Back on November 18, 2009, 10:27:03 AM
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1) I will repeal it.
2) I don't like it but I'll keep it.
3) I think it's a good idea.
Whatever candiadate the GOP chooses - doesn't he/she have a tough spot? Either piss off those people who hate obamacare, or piss off a lot of people who are couting on free healthcare. No candidate could ever say he'll repeal medicare or social security - How could someone say they'll stop universal healthcare?
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1) I will repeal it.
2) I don't like it but I'll keep it.
3) I think it's a good idea.
Whatever candiadate the GOP chooses - doesn't he/she have a tough spot? Either piss off those people who hate obamacare, or piss off a lot of people who are couting on free healthcare. No candidate could ever say he'll repeal medicare or social security - How could someone say they'll stop universal healthcare?
240 - 2010 is far more important than anything.
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240 - 2010 is far more important than anything.
intrade says 90% chance Dems retain senate, and 65% chance the Dems retain house. Definitely moving in the GOp's direction though.
I was hoping to get your answer to this Q.
How would a Mitt say obamacare is bad - if he did it himself?
How could a Pawlenty or Palin tell 30+ millino uninsured voters (who are counting on health insurance a year later) that they aren't getting it?
I think if O wins it, we all keep it.
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Its not a mistake that this all starts in 2013..after Barry either wins or looses. AP poll 43% against...41 for. Barry is also below 50% approval by another poll...
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Its not a mistake that this all starts in 2013..after Barry either wins or looses. AP poll 43% against...41 for. Barry is also below 50% approval by another poll...
exactly - He can claim all the praise for it - before we see how potentially bad it is, a year later. by them his job is safe.
hh6, do you think any Gop candidate could promise to repeal it? Or will they just have to grit teeth and say they support it?
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exactly - He can claim all the praise for it - before we see how potentially bad it is, a year later. by them his job is safe.
hh6, do you think any Gop candidate could promise to repeal it? Or will they just have to grit teeth and say they support it?
I think a GOP renegade, or dare I say Rogue, who campaigns on ending this chaos will gain massive popularity.
240 - I have posted endless articlesa on how bad this is. EVEN THE DEAN OF HARVARD MEDICAL SCHOOL SAID IT SUCKS!
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I think a GOP renegade, or dare I say Rogue, who campaigns on ending this chaos will gain massive popularity.
240 - I have posted endless articlesa on how bad this is. EVEN THE DEAN OF HARVARD MEDICAL SCHOOL SAID IT SUCKS!
You still didn't answer my Q. I agree with all this.
But IF it passes, how would any GOP candidate address it?
If they crapped on it in 2009, would they still crap on it in 2012?
Would they tell voters they will remove their healthcare, right as they march to the booths?
Or IF obama passes this, he wins, and it's permanent? Will anyone promise to "undo" something that hasn't started yet? (especially if ppl have been paying taxes on it for 3 years)
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They can't say they will repeal it without fear of raising the poor black vote backlash and costing them the election.
They can't say they will keep it without fear of alienating their own party and being labeled McCain Lite and thus, losing the election.
Their only hope is to claim to work out imperfections in the plan that allows it to be more self sustaining and not a burden for the rest of the country to support. Which will be impossible to implement, but that is the only chance they have.
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Under the current climate..as people think now..they could run on a repeal ticket. We can't afford this crap now and that won't change by 2013. The 2010 elections will tell people all they need to know. Reid is down double digits to his most likely challenger.
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This isn't about 2010. This is about how the GOP candidate will address (or ignore) an issue that you all keep whining about now.
Running on a repeal ticket is risky at most as Administrations rarely - if ever - actually undo anything that was done by the Administration before them.
If they promise to kill it as a central theme of their campaign platform, it could bite them in the ass from the moderate voters who support it.
If they ignore it or act to keep it, it will bite them in the ass from their own moderates and core party members who hate it.
As a campaign issue, it is a Lose/Lose situation for the GOP.
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You still didn't answer my Q. I agree with all this.
But IF it passes, how would any GOP candidate address it?
If they crapped on it in 2009, would they still crap on it in 2012?
Would they tell voters they will remove their healthcare, right as they march to the booths?
Or IF obama passes this, he wins, and it's permanent? Will anyone promise to "undo" something that hasn't started yet? (especially if ppl have been paying taxes on it for 3 years)
240 - the GOP , provided it plays its cards right, can win massively. The tax hikes go into effect immediately and people wont be getting any benefit whatsoever. The costs are insane and we already have backlash over the mammogram issue.
The UE is going to keep going up as Barry refuses to shed himself of his leftist garbage. He is a disaster. Even my father, who hated bush was telling me last night how fearful he is of this admn. My dad is regular guy and said this admn is a complete disaster.
The economy is getting worse 240 not better. The libs on this board attack me daily, but I have forgot more economic and basic knoweldge than these clowns can ever hope to know. Businesses will not hire anyone with the fear of higher health costs and energy taxes. There will be zero job growth through 2012, especially if they let the bush ttax cuts expire.
The GOP needs a sober authoritative, common sense, normal values, person up there. My girl can be that person but is not there now. She has talent like no other and with some work, can and might be that person. Romney is a no go for me over the health care mess. Huckster also is a joke.
240 - I am not kidding, we are heading for bad times ahead and there is no end in sight with what this admn is doing.
The GOP needs to shed itself of the RINOS and connect with regular normal people again.
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great points lurker.
like hh6 said, it would have to be a repeal platform - which could be reallllly risky. Imagine obama saying "I just want every son and daughter in america to not have to worry about healthcare like so many of you have..."
What will the GOp candidate say?
I think obama has them where he wants them - if this passes.
(Same way with the trial - what if KSM is found guilty, sentenced before election day? Will the repub candidate propose we just keep them locked up, and not put them to death? Talk about soft on terror. they gotta get behind O)
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Yup...look at Virginia...and Lurker....getting taxed to death by a marxist isn't whining. Dump the Rino's...tell the evangelicals that while they can sit on their hands because candidate A isn't some uber religious nut or is a mormon...or they can then enjoy 4 years of ultra leftwing policies, gays, religious attacks..over secularization..and further erosion of basic family values. I don't like Palin at all....i was glad she fired up the base but she can't communicate to save her life.
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Yup...look at Virginia...and Lurker....getting taxed to death by a marxist isn't whining. Dump the Rino's...tell the evangelicals that while they can sit on their hands because candidate A isn't some uber religious nut or is a mormon...or they can then enjoy 4 years of ultra leftwing policies, gays, religious attacks..over secularization..and further erosion of basic family values. I don't like Palin at all....i was glad she fired up the base but she can't communicate to save her life.
If the bible belt feels they are paying for abortions under ObamaCare - the churches will turn people out like no other.
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240 this trial will drag out forever..and greatly damage our intell community. Further...its about the economy. Barry can't for the life of him tie healthcare reform to the economy in any positive way if people aren't working. The plan destroys the ability of small businesses to rehire..or expand. It erodes medicare which many depend on and it calls for fines and taxes plus possible jail time. The Repubs will work to block this bill as will many moderate dems. The House bill will not be remotely the final bill..and they've pushed it off until 2010.
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240 - the GOP , provided it plays its cards right, can win massively. The tax hikes go into effect immediately and people wont be getting any benefit whatsoever. The costs are insane and we already have backlash over the mammogram issue.
The UE is going to keep going up as Barry refuses to shed himself of his leftist garbage. He is a disaster. Even my father, who hated bush was telling me last night how fearful he is of this admn. My dad is regular guy and said this admn is a complete disaster.
The economy is getting worse 240 not better. The libs on this board attack me daily, but I have forgot more economic and basic knoweldge than these clowns can ever hope to know. Businesses will not hire anyone with the fear of higher health costs and energy taxes. There will be zero job growth through 2012, especially if they let the bush ttax cuts expire.
The GOP needs a sober authoritative, common sense, normal values, person up there. My girl can be that person but is not there now. She has talent like no other and with some work, can and might be that person. Romney is a no go for me over the health care mess. Huckster also is a joke.
240 - I am not kidding, we are heading for bad times ahead and there is no end in sight with what this admn is doing.
The GOP needs to shed itself of the RINOS and connect with regular normal people again.
His question was about Obamacare. The above epic rant-on you gave us addressed everything BUT Obamacare. Just like your last posts did.
Apparently you either can't understand the simple question he is asking or you just don't have an answer you can give and instead post about something completely off topic. What is it?
Is it really that hard to read something and reply in a way related to the topic being discussed? It isn't for the rest of us. Why is it so hard for you? Epic whining like this without relevant nature to the topic is why no one takes you seriously.
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and Lurker....getting taxed to death by a marxist isn't whining.
And the topic of this thread isn't about being taxed to death. It is about the GOP 2012 stance on Obamacare.
A bunch of rocket scientists you Repubs aren't.
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LOL... lots of subject changing here - I was just curious if the GOp candidate will be forced to embrace it if/once it's law. Nobody wants to answer that. heck, I even gave 1,2,3 options :)
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And the topic of this thread isn't about being taxed to death. It is about the GOP 2012 stance on Obamacare.
A bunch of rocket scientists you Repubs aren't.
ObamaCare is about health care, taxes, etc.
Look, when the Dean of Harvard Medical School says this thing sucks balls, you know it must really be a disaster.
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ObamaCare is about health care, taxes, etc.
Look, when the Dean of Harvard Medical School says this thing sucks balls, you know it must really be a disaster.
Did the Dean of Harvard Medical School say what the GOP 2012 campaign platform stance on Obamacare would be? If so, could you post it. So you can have a half way answer that is half way related to what this thread is about.
The only disaster I am seeing here is your repeated showcasing of what must be an epic ADHD disorder.
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Did the Dean of Harvard Medical School say what the GOP 2012 campaign platform stance on Obamacare would be? If so, could you post it. So you can have a half way answer that is half way related to what this thread is about.
The only disaster I am seeing here is your repeated showcasing of what must be an epic ADHD disorder.
The dems hold all the power and are doing a perfect job of messing up all on their own withou tthe GOP> Why should the GOP get involved in a total Dem meltdown and disaster?
2010 comes before 2012 in case you didnt know. Next year is going to be a tsunami for the GOP like you wont believe when UE goes to 12.5% and gas to $4.00 a gallon.
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LOL... lots of subject changing here - I was just curious if the GOp candidate will be forced to embrace it if/once it's law. Nobody wants to answer that. heck, I even gave 1,2,3 options :)
I don't know what is so hard about it. Heck, I answered and gave a best case scenario on what the GOP could do to handle it.
I don't get it. You ask a simple questions and the conservatives on board simply can not give a relative answer. Even the wrong answer is ok, if it is related to the topic being discussed.
The only logical conclusion can be:
A) They did not understand the simple question. (Palinitis)
B) They understood it, but yet could not articulate an answer to it.
C) They had an answer but God told them not to give it.
*shrugs*
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::) ::)
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1) I will repeal it.
2) I don't like it but I'll keep it.
3) I think it's a good idea.
Whatever candiadate the GOP chooses - doesn't he/she have a tough spot? Either piss off those people who hate obamacare, or piss off a lot of people who are couting on free healthcare. No candidate could ever say he'll repeal medicare or social security - How could someone say they'll stop universal healthcare?
He will run against it,BUT once the wheels are in motion ITS DONE!!!Name one government program that has EVER been stopped once its in MOTION OR PART OF THE SYSTEM.Thats why they have to stop it NOW!!!
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He will run against it,BUT once the wheels are in motion ITS DONE!!!Name one government program that has EVER been stopped once its in MOTION OR PART OF THE SYSTEM.Thats why they have to stop it NOW!!!
Its DOA. The Dean of Harvard Medical School came out today and said ObamaCare is a mess and disaster. What elese do you need to know.
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He will run against it,BUT once the wheels are in motion ITS DONE!!!
I think you're right about it being a 'done deal' if it passes.
So you think - even though he/she will have no power to stop it - the candidate will still risk alienating potential voters by telling Americans "I dont want 40 mil of you to have free health care"?
I'm thinking they'll do what is politically correct and avoid it, saying "it coud be better, but I would never take away healthcare from 40 mil people..."
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I think you're right about it being a 'done deal' if it passes.
So you think - even though he/she will have no power to stop it - the candidate will still risk alienating potential voters by telling Americans "I dont want 40 mil of you to have free health care"?
I'm thinking they'll do what is politically correct and avoid it, saying "it coud be better, but I would never take away healthcare from 40 mil people..."
Its not free!
240 - I have posted some very good articles on this matter. Have you read any of them?
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yeah, and I'm convinced obamacare is going to have some added benefit of keeping the companies honest, but will be a clusterfvck, welfare state that obama is obviously builidng to keep the dems in office.
(What person getting free healthcare, welfare, foodstamps, or benefits is going to vote for a Repub who wants to end that?)
This argument is about "what position the GOp 2012 challenger will take".
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The only position will be:
"Are you better off than you were 4 years ago?"
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I think you're right about it being a 'done deal' if it passes.
So you think - even though he/she will have no power to stop it - the candidate will still risk alienating potential voters by telling Americans "I dont want 40 mil of you to have free health care"?
I'm thinking they'll do what is politically correct and avoid it, saying "it coud be better, but I would never take away healthcare from 40 mil people..."
I think it will be framed more like "This bill is going to explode the deficit,have you waiting in lines like at the DMV,you will have less choice etc.
I think he will try to impose some sort of tax incentive to health care providers so they are able to attempt to compete with the public option.Or mandate that the public option fall under the same rules as private companies.
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Have you read any of them?
Have you even read the question he was asking? Because you haven't yet even discussed anything related to this topic.
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I think we've hit it Lurker..u just want to hear the GOP challenger say that free handouts is ok..anything short of that isn't ok to u hand-out loving libs.
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BUT once the wheels are in motion ITS DONE!!!
This is true.
Once implemented it will never be revoked. Only modified (Repub) or enhanced (Dem).
If it is a done deal, in 2012 the Repubs are going to find themselves in a Catch 22 situation that is going to hurt any and every candidate running that year from the POTUS nominee all the way down to the county dog catcher. They can't say they are for it and they can't say they are against it. Which is why they need to be getting the GOP version of their healthcare plan out there to garner interest before the elections.
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I think we've hit it Lurker..u just want to hear the GOP challenger say that free handouts is ok..anything short of that isn't ok to u hand-out loving libs.
You are an idiot only relying on assumptions about what someone else thinks in an effort to make your point. Since that is irrelevant to what my posted opinion on it is, that makes your entire statement - just like yourself - irrelevant as well.
Nice try, but FAIL. Come back play again sometime.
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When ur posts provide facts on anything u just let me know. U debate skills are poor and u have no experience with any of the topics we discuss....u want free shit, move. 3 has answered the question..ur to friggen stupid to realize it. Much like ur idiot douchbag president...ur failing.
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When ur posts provide facts on anything u just let me know. U debate skills are poor and u have no experience with any of the topics we discuss....u want free shit, move. 3 has answered the question..ur to friggen stupid to realize it. Much like ur idiot douchbag president...ur failing.
I have already answered it. If your intellect wasn't subpar to the level of a dying fruitfly you would have already noticed that. But since you haven't, you can sit on the sidelines while the rest of us discuss what the topic of this thread is about.
Dumbing down simple sentences for a mental midget like you isn't really on my agenda today. Maybe mommy can help you.
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I'm not the one asking ur opinion...u don't count so I could care less. 240 asked the question..u whined like a typical lib bitch and 3 explained it to u..case closed.
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I'm not the one asking ur opinion...u don't count so I could care less. 240 asked the question..u whined like a typical lib bitch and 3 explained it to u..case closed.
You have just proven you are either inbred, on drugs, or just stupid beyond normal means. Or a combination of all three.
Reading obviously isn't a skill you have mastered yet. Good thing for you there isn't an IQ standard for military admissions.
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This is true.
Once implemented it will never be revoked. Only modified (Repub) or enhanced (Dem).
If it is a done deal, in 2012 the Repubs are going to find themselves in a Catch 22 situation that is going to hurt any and every candidate running that year from the POTUS nominee all the way down to the county dog catcher. They can't say they are for it and they can't say they are against it. Which is why they need to be getting the GOP version of their healthcare plan out there to garner interest before the elections.
You may be right,but I think the public is really going to be pissed off by then.The bill will be totally disected by then and people will see that its a real disaster and they are going to be pissed the dems rammed it through.
However,by then ANYTHING could happen.We may be at war with Iran,the dollar could collapse,or someone could invent a new fuel and bring it to market and America will dominate the world and Obama may get the title og "GOD".Its too far away to know.
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You may be right,but I think the public is really going to be pissed off by then.The bill will be totally disected by then and people will see that its a real disaster and they are going to be pissed the dems rammed it through.
However,by then ANYTHING could happen.We may be at war with Iran,the dollar could collapse,or someone could invent a new fuel and bring it to market and America will dominate the world and Obama may get the title og "GOD".Its too far away to know.
How about this Billy - many doctors can retire or leave practice by that time.
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How about this Billy - many doctors can retire or leave practice by that time.
Its a very very bad bill.We are going to cram millions more on health care rolls with an incredible deficit of doctors.Once again,the post office lost 3 billion last year with a product everyone needs-stamps.Can you imagine what hospitals will loose with government health insurance.They loose millions now with medicaid and medicare.
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You may be right,but I think the public is really going to be pissed off by then.The bill will be totally disected by then and people will see that its a real disaster and they are going to be pissed the dems rammed it through.
However,by then ANYTHING could happen.We may be at war with Iran,the dollar could collapse,or someone could invent a new fuel and bring it to market and America will dominate the world and Obama may get the title og "GOD".Its too far away to know.
But the question is, what percentage is going to be pissed off more. The ones that hate Obamacare or the ones who hate the people trying to take "their stuff away" from them? Because whatever group that gets pissed off the most and is the largest is going to determine the election outcome again.
Instead of it coming down to the moderate vote again this year, it is going to come down to the haterate vote. If you hate free health care or if you hate having it taken away from you is going to be the deciding factor.
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But the question is, what percentage is going to be pissed off more. The ones that hate Obamacare or the ones who hate the people trying to take "their stuff away" from them? Because whatever group that gets pissed off the most and is the largest is going to determine the election outcome again.
Instead of it coming down to the moderate vote again this year, it is going to come down to the haterate vote. If you hate free health care or if you hate having it taken away from you is going to be the deciding factor.
This is off topic. At my business group this morning which is about 50/50 lib/con there was universal disgust over the KSM decision.
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But the question is, what percentage is going to be pissed off more. The ones that hate Obamacare or the ones who hate the people trying to take "their stuff away" from them? Because whatever group that gets pissed off the most and is the largest is going to determine the election outcome again.
Instead of it coming down to the moderate vote again this year, it is going to come down to the haterate vote. If you hate free health care or if you hate having it taken away from you is going to be the deciding factor.
Again,your right,but the way its breaking now,the independants hate it,obviously the republicans hate it,thats a pretty big block.If the country is in about the same position as it is now,high unemployment,etc. will the blacks be as fired up to vote,will hispanics come out to vote.Remember they dont implement it until 2013,so no one will know what they are gaining or losing yet.
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yeah, and I'm convinced obamacare is going to have some added benefit of keeping the companies honest, but will be a clusterfvck, welfare state that obama is obviously builidng to keep the dems in office.
(What person getting free healthcare, welfare, foodstamps, or benefits is going to vote for a Repub who wants to end that?)
This argument is about "what position the GOp 2012 challenger will take".
FFFFFFFFFFFFAAAAAAAAAAAA AAIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLLL LLLLL