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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 11:36:10 AM

Title: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 11:36:10 AM
I got this from an industry insider!!!!  INSIDER Q:

Quote
MUSCLEMAG's price is about $5,000 per page but you can get them cheaper.  It's the same price for MD.  FLEX is about $10,000 per page but you can get them for close to half.  Muscle & Fitness costs $20,000 but you can get them for maybe $12,000.  They are very expensive.  I don't know what to tell you about the ads, it's very tricky.  From what I've gathered the ads are more for the retailers to know about your products than the actual consumer unless you're running ten pages per ad.  If you're going to do it I would for sure do the small ones on the back of the magazine.

I believe the ads which are 1/3 or 1/6 of the page at the back of MD are $700.  Not sure which of those two sizes is that price, but that was in 2007.  I guess more prominent earlier ads cost more while smaller ads towards the end of the magazine cost less.

Peter McGough said that MD's circulation was only around 30,000.  John Romano disputed this but showed no evidence at all to refute it.  Now that he is no longer with MD perhaps he will give us the real figure.  ;D

Is there really any money in magazines or is it an industry just barely staying afloat?  A lot of mainstream magazines like Newsweek are suffering huge losses right now.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: emn1964 on November 28, 2009, 11:42:39 AM
Print is a dying medium.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: tendonitis on November 28, 2009, 11:46:11 AM
What is FLEX and Muscle & Fitness' circulation per month?
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 11:48:18 AM
I got this from an industry insider!!!!  INSIDER Q:

I believe the ads which are 1/3 or 1/6 of the page at the back of MD are $700.  Not sure which of those two sizes is that price, but that was in 2007.  I guess more prominent earlier ads cost more while smaller ads towards the end of the magazine cost less.

Peter McGough said that MD's circulation was only around 30,000.  John Romano disputed this but showed no evidence at all to refute it.  Now that he is no longer with MD perhaps he will give us the real figure.  ;D

Is there really any money in magazines or is it an industry just barely staying afloat?  A lot of mainstream magazines like Newsweek are suffering huge losses right now.


That's nothing.... You should see what it cost to buy radio and tv nationally.  Btw, do not advertise bb products in print.  The market is over-saturated.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 11:52:06 AM
Print is a dying medium.

It depends on how you look at it.  I never liked print, because advertising is frequency based.  Imo, print only works for established brands that are trying to stay top of mind, or for special offers that run in the short term.  Print is essential in a branding campaign or for a complete media mix, but I'd never use it for a lesser known company, or to build a brand from the ground up.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 11:54:55 AM

That's nothing.... You should see what it cost to buy radio and tv nationally.  Btw, do not advertise bb products in print.  The market is over-saturated.

Very interesting.  I was thinking of advertising my website in MD to attract people to my forums where they can participate in open source discussions.  Discuss.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 12:03:49 PM
Very interesting.  I was thinking of advertising my website in MD to attract people to my forums where they can participate in open source discussions.  Discuss.

Don't do it, and here's why: 1.) BB mag's have no credibility, because of the over-saturation (300 pages of ads) and the outlandish claims of 99% of their advertisers.  2.) Advertising works on frequency (especially if you're trying to get consumers to do something) and imo, print is best suited for established companies who want to stay top of mind, or as part of a complete media mix that uses alternative vehicles as the main supports of the campaign.  You might as well light your money on fire if you want to buy real estate in the back of one of those mags.  No one reads that shit, and you're going to devalue your brand by sticking your name next to all those gimmicks and snake oil peddlers who advertise back there.

I assume that you don't have a lot of cash.  PM me and i'll help you structure an advertising plan that will work for you.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 12:16:02 PM
Don't do it, and here's why: 1.) BB mag's have no credibility, because of the over-saturation (300 pages of ads) and the outlandish claims of 99% of their advertisers.  2.) Advertising works on frequency (especially if you're trying to get consumers to do something) and imo, print is best suited for established companies who want to stay top of mind, or as part of a complete media mix that uses alternative vehicles as the main supports of the campaign.  You might as well light your money on fire if you want to buy real estate in the back of one of those mags.  No one reads that shit, and you're going to devalue your brand by sticking your name next to all those gimmicks and snake oil peddlers who advertise back there.

I assume that you don't have a lot of cash.  PM me and i'll help you structure an advertising plan that will work for you.


This is a very well thought out and this explanation makes sense.  It is now totally understandable that MuscleTech puts which ad spreads in each magazine.

The part on my not having a lot of cash is incorrect though.  ;D  I am willing to spend whatever it takes to get my forum visitors up.  But the key is that regardless of cost, I want a return on my investment!
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: BB on November 28, 2009, 12:16:33 PM
I'm not sure how it is now, but many of the older magazines never really made huge money, the value was in the ability to pimp associated products that the magazine had a piece of, like supplements, etc.... For instance, York Barbell, who owned Strength & Health and the original Muscular Development ran them for very little money or operated at a loss. But it was the ability to hawk barbells and supplements in them that kept them around.

Peary Rader's Ironman was always on the edge for a lot of years, but Rader was a decent man with a lot of irons in the fire, so he was able to keep it going.

Muscle Media was EAS's propaganda wing.

I always heard the Weider magazines did the best out of bunch.

 
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 12:28:52 PM
This is a very well thought out and this explanation makes sense.  It is now totally understandable that MuscleTech puts which ad spreads in each magazine.

The part on my not having a lot of cash is incorrect though.  ;D  I am willing to spend whatever it takes to get my forum visitors up.  But the key is that regardless of cost, I want a return on my investment!

Trust me my man, when I say a lot of cash, I'm talking what the big boys spend in print each year.  It's hundreds of thousands, and that's just print. I'm not saying that you can't create a successful print campaign to grow your business, but imo, there are much better options out there for what you are trying to do. The bigger companies are known and use print as part of a complete media mix.  Print in the big mags is not cost effective for what you are trying to do.  PM me.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: IronMagazine.com on November 28, 2009, 12:37:27 PM
I got this from an industry insider!!!!  INSIDER Q:

I believe the ads which are 1/3 or 1/6 of the page at the back of MD are $700.  Not sure which of those two sizes is that price, but that was in 2007.  I guess more prominent earlier ads cost more while smaller ads towards the end of the magazine cost less.

Peter McGough said that MD's circulation was only around 30,000.  John Romano disputed this but showed no evidence at all to refute it.  Now that he is no longer with MD perhaps he will give us the real figure.  ;D

Is there really any money in magazines or is it an industry just barely staying afloat?  A lot of mainstream magazines like Newsweek are suffering huge losses right now.

I used to pay $1,000 for a full page remnant ad in MD, and it was towards the very back of the mag, that was 2-3 years ago, I don't advertise in there anymore.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Special Ed on November 28, 2009, 01:01:19 PM
Both Jorge Betancourt (Betancourt Nutrition) and Chris Mason (At Large Nutrition) have publicly commented on what a huge waste of money advertising in MD was. Between the two of them, they picked up about three new customers.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: wes on November 28, 2009, 01:05:19 PM
Who buys these mags these days to even see an ad ?
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Mr Nobody on November 28, 2009, 01:13:30 PM
Who buys these mags these days to even see an ad ?
Mostly schomes I assume.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 01:19:45 PM
Both Jorge Betancourt (Betancourt Nutrition) and Chris Mason (At Large Nutrition) have publicly commented on what a huge waste of money advertising in MD was. Between the two of them, they picked up about three new customers.

I respect Jorge a lot as he seems to know what he is doing so I won't rule out what he said.  His thread on the subject is here:

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=107421.0
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: TRIX on November 28, 2009, 01:21:01 PM
$10,000 a page? What the hell. You'd have to be a complete idiot to pay that. MD has 200 full page ads + smaller ones on other pages (banners)
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 01:26:42 PM
Both Jorge Betancourt (Betancourt Nutrition) and Chris Mason (At Large Nutrition) have publicly commented on what a huge waste of money advertising in MD was. Between the two of them, they picked up about three new customers.

Of course, how the fuck can you advertise in a magazine saturated by your competition, filled with brands that have been around forever; all while lacking the ability to generate the proper frequency needed to drive people to your product, website, whatever.  Print in large magazines is for established brands who have short term offers or that are trying to execute 360 marketing campaigns (hitting consumers with many different forms of media) and have the budget to drop on multiple forms of media.  Online, TV, print, radio, events - etc.  It's also good for companies who want to stay top of mind with consumers, that already have a large market share in the industry.  Translation, people know who they are and they are constantly reminding them of their presence or showing them new products.  The trust is already there.

To be fair, advertising is an art, and you can have a great vehicle that hits your target demographic, but your message could be shit or your call to action could be weak.  There are so many factors that go into successful advertising campaigns that have nothing to do with the media vehicle.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: timfogarty on November 28, 2009, 01:39:05 PM
if you're going to advertise in a bb mag, do it in one of the alternates, like Reps or Planet Muscle.  might have lower circulation, but your ad won't be competing with hundreds of others

(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/re/re0403.jpg)

(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/plan/plan1205.jpg)
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 01:40:11 PM
Of course, how the fuck can you advertise in a magazine saturated by your competition, filled with brands that have been around forever; all while lacking the ability to generate the proper frequency needed to drive people to your product, website, whatever.  Print in large magazines is for established brands who have short term offers or that are trying to execute 360 marketing campaigns (hitting consumers with many different forms of media) and have the budget to drop on multiple forms of media.  Online, TV, print, radio, events - etc.  It's also good for companies who want to stay top of mind with consumers, that already have a large market share in the industry.  Translation, people know who they are and they are constantly reminding them of their presence or showing them new products.  The trust is already there.

To be fair, advertising is an art, and you can have a great vehicle that hits your target demographic, but your message could be shit or your call to action could be weak.  There are so many factors that go into successful advertising campaigns that have nothing to do with the media vehicle.

^^ This sounds like good advice from someone in the know!
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Ex Coelis on November 28, 2009, 01:46:50 PM
I bought a copy of MD in Beirut
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 01:52:21 PM
if you're going to advertise in a bb mag, do it in one of the alternates, like Reps or Planet Muscle.  might have lower circulation, but your ad won't be competing with hundreds of others

(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/re/re0403.jpg)

(http://musclememory.com/magCovers/plan/plan1205.jpg)

And make sure you have a compelling offer that focuses on how your product or service will benefit the consumer.  Lastly, the most cirtical thing is to not give up to soon. Advertising takes time.  You should be consistent for a MINIMUM of 24 weeks before forming an opinion on whatever it is that you are doing.  Thats not to say not to tweak things along the way, but it takes time to build frequency and cause a consumer to act.  Staying top of mind is the name of the game.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Special Ed on November 28, 2009, 02:16:00 PM
Of course, how the fuck can you advertise in a magazine saturated by your competition, filled with brands that have been around forever; all while lacking the ability to generate the proper frequency needed to drive people to your product, website, whatever.  Print in large magazines is for established brands who have short term offers or that are trying to execute 360 marketing campaigns (hitting consumers with many different forms of media) and have the budget to drop on multiple forms of media.  Online, TV, print, radio, events - etc.  It's also good for companies who want to stay top of mind with consumers, that already have a large market share in the industry.  Translation, people know who they are and they are constantly reminding them of their presence or showing them new products.  The trust is already there.

To be fair, advertising is an art, and you can have a great vehicle that hits your target demographic, but your message could be shit or your call to action could be weak.  There are so many factors that go into successful advertising campaigns that have nothing to do with the media vehicle.
Well said. Cost-effective advertising can be tricky. That's why God invented media planners.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Mr Nobody on November 28, 2009, 02:16:27 PM
I bought a copy of MD in Beirut
I Samir Bannout still there?
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: body88 on November 28, 2009, 02:21:04 PM
Well said. Cost-effective advertising can be tricky. That's why God invented media planners.

And ad agencies  :)
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Ex Coelis on November 28, 2009, 02:24:43 PM
Is Samir Bannout still there?

I did not run into him

odds are I saw some of his cousins, though
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Tre on November 28, 2009, 02:25:51 PM
Mostly schmoes I assume.

Schmoes get much more bang for their buck at musclegallery.com.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Bobby on November 28, 2009, 02:36:59 PM
This is a very well thought out and this explanation makes sense.  It is now totally understandable that MuscleTech puts which ad spreads in each magazine.

The part on my not having a lot of cash is incorrect though.  ;D  I am willing to spend whatever it takes to get my forum visitors up.  But the key is that regardless of cost, I want a return on my investment!

another getbig millionaire ::)
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: timfogarty on November 28, 2009, 03:15:09 PM
another getbig millionaire ::)

yet the donate button remains untouched despite his promise for grabbing content from my site.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Ex Coelis on November 28, 2009, 03:20:20 PM
yet the donate button remains untouched despite his promise for grabbing content from my site.

I fear that if money gets tight you'll be forced into "straight 4 pay"
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 04:13:39 PM
Well said. Cost-effective advertising can be tricky. That's why God invented media planners.

Yes, that is true.  I just noticed an ad for Betancourt Nutrition on page 55 of the January 2010 MD.  It looks like Jorge has reconsidered the effectiveness of advertising there.

another getbig millionaire ::)

Give me two years.  On that note, being philanthropic while building wealth is silly - once you have a lot of wealth you have more to give away.  Ironic that being "greedy" actually creates an opportunity for an individual to give much more back.  Which I will do once I reach my goals.  I am just happy to have my freedom and not be in PRISON thanks to Special Ed.

Where I live, a million dollars would be a lot of money.  Enough to live comfortably for the rest of your life simply off interest in a guaranteed investment fund.  Is a million dollars even a lot of money in a lot of US states?  My city has the most affordable housing in Canada and a $50,000 property investment will yield $800 a month in rent.  Property is cheap and rent is high so there is opportunity for real estate investments here.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: polychronopolous on November 28, 2009, 04:16:44 PM
Matt C - Any plans to launch your own supplement line?
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 04:31:34 PM
yet the donate button remains untouched despite his promise for grabbing content from my site.

The content on your site is not copyrighted and can't be since it would be the equivalent to copyrighting trivia.  I put a link to your site on every page on my website [although the forum links were recently removed when I switched skins but will be back soon].  I also use your affiliate links in my forum where possible, although again, a lot of those links were purged when I updated the skin.  I can't calculate how much revenue the contest results pages generated for me over the years because I was never specifically tracking it.

I am doing very well now, I'll admit that.  But only because of the low cost of living where I live.  It's kind of like my strength: in any gym I walk into in town I am one of the strongest guys there.  In virtually any gym in a bigger city, I would be nothing close to the strongest people there.

The liquidity I have right now is backing two properties I recently acquired.  My bodybuilding website has definitely paid off for me, but it is only a portion of what I do.  My goal is to get revenue up slightly and only babysit it from that point forward.

What you should do Tim, is forward me a banner ad for your website to put on my site for you.  Those kinds of ads run for around $25 or more each and if I give you the space for no cost, it is definitely throwing something back your way.
Title: Re: Bodybuilding magazine advertising costs.
Post by: Matt C on November 28, 2009, 05:27:52 PM
I fear that if money gets tight you'll be forced into "straight 4 pay"

Are you saying that I hate benders?  ???