Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: doozejooze on April 02, 2010, 07:37:30 AM
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Went to a SCAN (sports, cardiovascular, and nutrition) conference in San Diego on Monday and one of the key note speakers inferred that bodybuilding could be an eating disorder. This doctor works with athletes out of Texas and sees extreme cases of over and underconsumptive malnutrition among them. Also the term 'orthorexia nervosa' was discussed. This is an extreme obsession (is that redundant?) With eating healthy foods.
What do you guys think?
BTW, he had pictures of all the Ms. Olympias up as well as a picture of Roland Cziurlock (sp?) From an old cover of MD
Deuce On!
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I dont see how natural bodybuilding could be considered that, some of the diets posted on here by members are extremely healthy.
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I've said this before, and I will say it again. In order for something to meet the criteria for a disorder, one specific criteria has to be met according to the DSM-IV-TR:
C. The symptoms cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
If you answer yes to this question due to your current bodybuilding diet, then, yes, I would say its a disorder. If you answer no, then, no, you don't have a disorder.
Diagnosing is not black-and-white. Just because you follow a certain diet or eating regimen that doesn't automatically make it a disorder. It's not that simple!
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Hes looking for a reason to come up with the siphon up some grant money really. Academics are really good at doing this.
However, by normal standards that people eat by, having only 4-8 things in your diet for 4 months at a time could be 'disordered eating' by the definitions i recall from the classroom.
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Those are Fuk&*n awesome points you guys bring up. I would love for there to have been more discussion on this. The Dr. Was just suggesting it. Probably trying to drum up support for future monies like you mentioned. I thought it was interesting at how many over weight people like bodybuilding so they can continue to eat large quantities. Is exercising a good alternative to conditioning better eating habits?
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No because it's a means to an end.
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Went to a SCAN (sports, cardiovascular, and nutrition) conference in San Diego on Monday and one of the key note speakers inferred that bodybuilding could be an eating disorder. This doctor works with athletes out of Texas and sees extreme cases of over and underconsumptive malnutrition among them. Also the term 'orthorexia nervosa' was discussed. This is an extreme obsession (is that redundant?) With eating healthy foods.
What do you guys think?
BTW, he had pictures of all the Ms. Olympias up as well as a picture of Roland Cziurlock (sp?) From an old cover of MD
Deuce On!
so going out, partying, eatina shit from outside and drinking is not a disorder huh?
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so going out, partying, eatina shit from outside and drinking is not a disorder huh?
Actually that's not an disorder, because it's the norm.
Doctor's are stupid, well fuck yes i have the eating disorder to have healthy meals and avoid shitty processed food on most occasions. I am also above the BMI that is healthy for my height.... So that must mean that i am fat or close to death... ::) ::)
Oh and all those supplements like "protein" they will cause cancer and erectile dysfunction. ::) ::)
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All good points. But when it gets to a point like SF1900 pointed out..."Impairment of social, occupational and other endeavors." Is it a disorder? The missed Thanksgivings, birthdays, family gatherings, the missed lunches with co-workers so you can squeeze in meal #4? I don't know, just asking. Maybe we should develop a more hyper-vigilance when it comes to our diets and how we view food. Anyone see Food Inc.? Good movie. Totally true movie?
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All good points. But when it gets to a point like SF1900 pointed out..."Impairment of social, occupational and other endeavors." Is it a disorder? The missed Thanksgivings, birthdays, family gatherings, the missed lunches with co-workers so you can squeeze in meal #4? I don't know, just asking. Maybe we should develop a more hyper-vigilance when it comes to our diets and how we view food. Anyone see Food Inc.? Good movie. Totally true movie?
For me personally, i often bring my own food along. At first, people look at you like you're crazy, but then it's ok.
I'm not anal about my food, i also enjoy a good meal at a restaurant.
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Me too Donk! I love food (currently 30 lbs overweight) my BMI is about 26% usually 18.5 to 24.9 is considered normal I guess. I was 20% in the Army. Anyway, I follow bodybuilding and go to the shows, its just so coincidental that bodybuilders don't have to resolve real issues with food, merely redirect and focus quantities and types to adjust to the drugs or training. Natural bodybuilders may be another story but do you know any natties that are obsessed with food. These ??????'s are mainly about food issues.
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http://www.dr-moosburger.at/pub/pub010.pdf
Bodybuilding ist kein Sport, wie viele meinen. Es ist eine Lebensphilosophie, die überhaupt nichts mit Fitness zu tun hat, sondern im Grunde krankhaft ist. Krankhaft deswegen, weil es sich um eine Zwangsstörung handelt, ähnlich einer Essstörung wie der Anorexie oder Bulimie. Der “Philosophie“ des Bodybuilding liegt ein übersteigerter Narzissmus zugrunde, der von einer muskeldysmorphen Störung (sog. Muskeldysmorphie, nicht gleichzusetzen mit Muskeldysmorphophobie) gekennzeichnet ist - unabhängig davon, ob man Bodybuilding wettkampfmäßig betreibt oder “nur für sich“. Die Muskeldysmorphie kann man als “Muskelsucht“ übersetzen. Man nennt sie neuerdings auch Bigorexie (quasi als Gegenstück zur Anorexie), Frau Prof. Mangweth geht in Ihrem Buchbeitrag noch näher darauf ein.
Das, was Bodybuilder beim “Wettkampf“ auf der Bühne aufführen, das sog. “Posen“, sprich das Zur-Schaustellen ihrer Muskulatur, ist nichts als eine (wie ich finde, lachhafte) Show muskelsüchtiger Freaks, deren Mittelpunkt ihrer Lebensinteressen im Querschnitt und in der Definition ihrer Muckis liegt. Alles andere ist zweitrangig - soziale Kontakte, Beruf und sogar die Familie. Mit einem noch akzeptablen Narzissmus (Ich nenne es “gesunde Eitelkeit“) hat das nichts mehr zu tun. Vielmehr ist es eine schwere Zwangsstörung.
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http://www.dr-moosburger.at/pub/pub010.pdf
Bodybuilding ist kein Sport, wie viele meinen. Es ist eine Lebensphilosophie, die überhaupt nichts mit Fitness zu tun hat, sondern im Grunde krankhaft ist. Krankhaft deswegen, weil es sich um eine Zwangsstörung handelt, ähnlich einer Essstörung wie der Anorexie oder Bulimie. Der “Philosophie“ des Bodybuilding liegt ein übersteigerter Narzissmus zugrunde, der von einer muskeldysmorphen Störung (sog. Muskeldysmorphie, nicht gleichzusetzen mit Muskeldysmorphophobie) gekennzeichnet ist - unabhängig davon, ob man Bodybuilding wettkampfmäßig betreibt oder “nur für sich“. Die Muskeldysmorphie kann man als “Muskelsucht“ übersetzen. Man nennt sie neuerdings auch Bigorexie (quasi als Gegenstück zur Anorexie), Frau Prof. Mangweth geht in Ihrem Buchbeitrag noch näher darauf ein.
Das, was Bodybuilder beim “Wettkampf“ auf der Bühne aufführen, das sog. “Posen“, sprich das Zur-Schaustellen ihrer Muskulatur, ist nichts als eine (wie ich finde, lachhafte) Show muskelsüchtiger Freaks, deren Mittelpunkt ihrer Lebensinteressen im Querschnitt und in der Definition ihrer Muckis liegt. Alles andere ist zweitrangig - soziale Kontakte, Beruf und sogar die Familie. Mit einem noch akzeptablen Narzissmus (Ich nenne es “gesunde Eitelkeit“) hat das nichts mehr zu tun. Vielmehr ist es eine schwere Zwangsstörung.
LOL!!! Geil.
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Hahaha, I don't speak German and I laughed. Crankshaften und solgar vitamin handywipin'....What? Awesome post!
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Patrick Bateman can eat 1000 situps in one sitting
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Patrick Bateman can eat 1000 situps in one sitting
I believe in taking care of myself, in a balanced diet, and a rigorous exercise routine. In the morning, when my face is a lil puffy, I put on an icepack while I do my stomach crunches, I can do a 1000 now.
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I believe in taking care of myself, in a balanced diet, and a rigorous exercise routine. In the morning, when my face is a lil puffy, I put on an icepack while I do my stomach crunches, I can do a 1000 now.
That's the spirit, i don't think you could say Patrick Bateman has a disorder. ;D
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All good points. But when it gets to a point like SF1900 pointed out..."Impairment of social, occupational and other endeavors." Is it a disorder? The missed Thanksgivings, birthdays, family gatherings, the missed lunches with co-workers so you can squeeze in meal #4? I don't know, just asking.Maybe we should develop a more hyper-vigilance when it comes to our diets and how we view food. Anyone see Food Inc.? Good movie. Totally true movie?
It is very contextual. If it doesn't bother the people in your life, and they support your endeavors, then, no, I'd say it is not a problem. However, if it does both the people in your life, and your about to lose your job and get divorced, then, yes, I'd say its a problem. This is why I stated earlier that diagnosing someone is not black-and-white.
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http://www.dr-moosburger.at/pub/pub010.pdf
Bodybuilding ist kein Sport, wie viele meinen. Es ist eine Lebensphilosophie, die überhaupt nichts mit Fitness zu tun hat, sondern im Grunde krankhaft ist. Krankhaft deswegen, weil es sich um eine Zwangsstörung handelt, ähnlich einer Essstörung wie der Anorexie oder Bulimie. Der “Philosophie“ des Bodybuilding liegt ein übersteigerter Narzissmus zugrunde, der von einer muskeldysmorphen Störung (sog. Muskeldysmorphie, nicht gleichzusetzen mit Muskeldysmorphophobie) gekennzeichnet ist - unabhängig davon, ob man Bodybuilding wettkampfmäßig betreibt oder “nur für sich“. Die Muskeldysmorphie kann man als “Muskelsucht“ übersetzen. Man nennt sie neuerdings auch Bigorexie (quasi als Gegenstück zur Anorexie), Frau Prof. Mangweth geht in Ihrem Buchbeitrag noch näher darauf ein.
Das, was Bodybuilder beim “Wettkampf“ auf der Bühne aufführen, das sog. “Posen“, sprich das Zur-Schaustellen ihrer Muskulatur, ist nichts als eine (wie ich finde, lachhafte) Show muskelsüchtiger Freaks, deren Mittelpunkt ihrer Lebensinteressen im Querschnitt und in der Definition ihrer Muckis liegt. Alles andere ist zweitrangig - soziale Kontakte, Beruf und sogar die Familie. Mit einem noch akzeptablen Narzissmus (Ich nenne es “gesunde Eitelkeit“) hat das nichts mehr zu tun. Vielmehr ist es eine schwere Zwangsstörung.
Exactly.
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Awesome contribution SF1900, thank you for that insight. What would it mean as far as a clinical stand point for bodybuilding to be seen as an eating disorder?
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The missed Thanksgivings, birthdays, family gatherings, the missed lunches with co-workers so you can squeeze in meal #4?
You don't have to be strictly regimented 100% of the time, but if you're serious about competing and want to do it at the pro level, you have to do what it takes. Missing social engagements so you can go to the gym or stick to your diet isn't a disorder - it's a voluntary, informed choice of an adult who chooses to prioritize their lifestyle over what are less important choices for their particular person.
And that's why their physique stands out when they go to one of those gatherings occasionally. Anyone who works towards a goal knows it takes a lot of hard work and discipline to get to the top, or even to a reasonable level of achievement. Their doing so is what makes them different from the average person.
In today's political environment and culture, mediocrity is enshrined (see reality TV, for example) and anything extreme in terms of talent or characteristics is immediately diagnosed as a disorder or a problem that needs to be rectified or at least addressed ::)
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You don't have to be strictly regimented 100% of the time, but if you're serious about competing and want to do it at the pro level, you have to do what it takes. Missing social engagements so you can go to the gym or stick to your diet isn't a disorder - it's a voluntary, informed choice of an adult who chooses to prioritize their lifestyle over what are less important choices for their particular person.
And that's why their physique stands out when they go to one of those gatherings occasionally. Anyone who works towards a goal knows it takes a lot of hard work and discipline to get to the top, or even to a reasonable level of achievement. Their doing so is what makes them different from the average person.
In today's political environment and culture, mediocrity is enshrined (see reality TV, for example) and anything extreme in terms of talent or characteristics is immediately diagnosed as a disorder or a problem that needs to be rectified or at least addressed ::)
In any political environment and culture, men strutting around to weird music, all oiled up and thonged will look strange. That's just reality.
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In any political environment and culture, men strutting around to weird music, all oiled up and thonged will look strange. That's just reality.
Everything like a sport or a (sub)cult or even a cultural trend like tattooing or piercing is "strange" to the eyes of an outsider who doesn't understand what they're seeing. Bodybuilding isn't normal, for sure, but I don't think it's strange either.
Things could be done differently in terms of presentation or judging, but no one is going to take the initiative or be successful if they do, probably because the existing system isn't broken, the gay aspect of it notwithstanding ;D
Anyway, I wasn't just referring to just bodybuilding being misunderstood by the majority - anyone who is obsessed with something they love working on is seen as someone who needs help and people often try to talk them out of it / being so odd and eccentric. You know what I'm talking about.
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Everything like a sport or a (sub)cult or even a cultural trend like tattooing or piercing is "strange" to the eyes of an outsider who doesn't understand what they're seeing. Bodybuilding isn't normal, for sure, but I don't think it's strange either.
Things could be done differently in terms of presentation or judging, but no one is going to take the initiative or be successful if they do, probably because the existing system isn't broken, the gay aspect of it notwithstanding ;D
Anyway, I wasn't just referring to just bodybuilding being misunderstood by the majority - anyone who is obsessed with something they love working on is seen as someone who needs help and people often try to talk them out of it / being so odd and eccentric. You know what I'm talking about.
Hmmm
nah, it's still weird as fuck ;D
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"Why the quotation marks?"
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Everything like a sport or a (sub)cult or even a cultural trend like tattooing or piercing is "strange" to the eyes of an outsider who doesn't understand what they're seeing. Bodybuilding isn't normal, for sure, but I don't think it's strange either.
Things could be done differently in terms of presentation or judging, but no one is going to take the initiative or be successful if they do, probably because the existing system isn't broken, the gay aspect of it notwithstanding ;D
Anyway, I wasn't just referring to just bodybuilding being misunderstood by the majority - anyone who is obsessed with something they love working on is seen as someone who needs help and people often try to talk them out of it / being so odd and eccentric. You know what I'm talking about.
Exactly, if WL was right, holding a net on a stick in your hand and hitting a small yellow ball back and forth is a disorder as well.
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In any political environment and culture, men strutting around to weird music, all oiled up and thonged will look strange. That's just reality.
Not stranger than 22 sweating proles in shorts and knee high socks on a turf chasing a ball.
What you consider as "strange" has been forced on you by society. You consider as "normal" what the majority considers as "normal", as simple as that.
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Exactly, if WL was right, holding a net on a stick in your hand and hitting a small yellow ball back and forth is a disorder as well.
Not stranger than 22 sweating proles in shorts and knee high socks on a turf chasing a ball.
What you consider as "strange" has been forced on you by society. You consider as "normal" what the majority considers as "normal", as simple as that.
Bingo
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What about the fixation on foods in particular? Of course other individuals in sports have fantastic diets and regimented eating plans, but no other magazine in any sport devotes as much space, research, and prose to food and food science as does bodybuilding. Put on muscle diet, strip fat diet, the 5 must have foods. The industry seems to generate around eating as opposed to other sports. This is not a discussion exactly on how strange the industry is or the sport, more a question of the validity of the statement about bodybuilders having eating disorders. Obviously, not a black and white conclusive question.
P.S. Hot dog eating contests excluded from this discussion
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Exactly, if WL was right, holding a net on a stick in your hand and hitting a small yellow ball back and forth is a disorder as well.
weird isn't bad it's just weird
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It can be. Imo it needs to be looked at in the context of the individual, like most illnesses
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it's only a disorder if it's your life and you have no chance of getting paid for it
E
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Interview female competitive bodybuilders and note the number who have eating disorders in their backgrounds (before starting bodybuilding). ;)
Lots of OCD types in general gravitate towards bb.
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Awesome contribution SF1900, thank you for that insight. What would it mean as far as a clinical stand point for bodybuilding to be seen as an eating disorder?
Thanks. What do you mean "as far as a clinical standpoint for bodybuilding to be seen as an eating disorder?" Do you mean what criteria would it have to meet? Or how would symptoms looks?
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We are all impaired, that's why we are here on this forum.
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Thanks again SF, yes, "What criteria would have to be met?" Would there be anything new or different? VonBild- had a good point (whether true or not) that history of eating disorders or OCD might be rampant in the pasts of many bodybuilders. If there is found to uniformity amongst BBers as to other disorders than might that make a profile of sorts that will allow health care professionals approach the 'eating disorder?' Meaning-(I guess) turning to bodybuilding is a unique and rare reaction to a disorder, if it really is one. Example- don't people that have eating disorders usually shun crowds and group experiences as opposed to bodybuilders that seek and crave attention and acceptance!
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Thanks again SF, yes, "What criteria would have to be met?" Would there be anything new or different? VonBild- had a good point (whether true or not) that history of eating disorders or OCD might be rampant in the pasts of many bodybuilders. If there is found to uniformity amongst BBers as to other disorders than might that make a profile of sorts that will allow health care professionals approach the 'eating disorder?' Meaning-(I guess) turning to bodybuilding is a unique and rare reaction to a disorder, if it really is one. Example- don't people that have eating disorders usually shun crowds and group experiences as opposed to bodybuilders that seek and crave attention and acceptance!
Well, they would definitely be diagnosed with Body Dysmorphic disorder. Also, I think a lot bodybuilders might have symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder and OCD. So, instead of shunning crowds, they have to be the focus of attention. Obviously, underlying issues such as depression, low self-esteem can all be part of the picture.