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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: lesaucer on May 12, 2010, 11:11:04 PM
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So I have been thinking about the best way to use aas for some time, and this is what I think that would be the best
if you take a look at kevin levrone, who have been a top tier bber for 10 years and now he still look like hes 25-30 at 41 yo... he is probably the only one who seriously shrink down after a contest, and 5-6 months precontest, goes fullblown and explode and finish 2nd at mr.olympia... abuse of anything you will have sides, moderate and you will most likely be alright. levrone may have used insane amounts of aas preparing for the olympia, but after that, he was off or low dose cruising, playing music for half the year.
So what do you think that is worst, somebody who use huge amount of aas and then take a 6 months break and let his body relax, or a gym rat who use half the amount of aas, year round. or somebody whos doing roller coaster ride to his body by going 3 months on, 3 off, 3 on, 3 off??
I really think that 6 months on, 6months off is the best way to cycle, let your body relax, refresh receptors,etc.. I am going to try this. go on, then off for 6 months, then go back on with more compounds, peptides, in conjunction with muscle memory, fresh and healthy body, and hardcore motivation, I really believe thats what makes top tier physique, while staying healthy with minimal sides.
Fullblown.
(http://www.fitnesspont.hu/mass-shop/picture_gallery//Kevin_Levrone/Levrone_56.jpg)
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You should look into ALR's cycling...
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its not about mega dosing half the year.
kevin had muscle memory thats why he could take time off.
its about consistancy, in all facets.. training, drugs, eating...
you can try cycling 6 on/6 off and see if you like it. i doubt you will be satisfied. and most people dont get much out of mega dosing.. higher doses dont work much better than moderate doses... and they can even make you feel like shit at times which could even impede progrss if it effected your training..
in the end i think most people HAVE to learn things on their own, the hard way... by lots of mistakes on the road of trial and error. or you could just heed the advice of those who know what theyr talkin about. (if only it was so easy to tell)
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its not about mega dosing half the year.
kevin had muscle memory thats why he could take time off.
its about consistancy, in all facets.. training, drugs, eating...
you can try cycling 6 on/6 off and see if you like it. i doubt you will be satisfied. and most people dont get much out of mega dosing.. higher doses dont work much better than moderate doses... and they can even make you feel like shit at times which could even impede progrss if it effected your training..
in the end i think most people HAVE to learn things on their own, the hard way... by lots of mistakes on the road of trial and error. or you could just heed the advice of those who know what theyr talkin about. (if only it was so easy to tell)
x2 good post..
And when kevin was competing he never went off just cruised and then grew into shows.
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the only way that would work is if u use mega doses of GH
with test tren mast eq :D
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the only way that would work is if u use mega doses of GH
with test tren mast eq :D
+ Slin 8)
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"lesaucier"....
How about this:
4weeks high androgens
4weeks peptides (HGH-slin-HCG)
Repeat...
This way you don't burn you receptors and in constant state of anabolism...
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"lesaucier"....
How about this:
4weeks high androgens
4weeks peptides (HGH-slin-HCG)
Repeat...
This way you don't burn you receptors and in constant state of anabolism...
how bout this
8 weeks androgens+peptides
repeat...
:P
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how bout this
8 weeks androgens+peptides
repeat...
:P
Doesn't no bridging scares you?
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"lesaucier"....
How about this:
4weeks high androgens
4weeks peptides (HGH-slin-HCG)
Repeat...
This way you don't burn you receptors and in constant state of anabolism...
nope, gotta go all out in the beginning with every compounds and moderate dose until week 6- 8, because then myostatin levels are higher, so you need to up it to high dose to keep progressing. bottom line is gotta smack your body and do most of your gains before myostatin levels gets high, which is around 2 months after you started
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Doesn't no bridging scares you?
body doesnt naturally bridge does it? anabolic hormones arent dangerous..
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body doesnt naturally bridge does it? anabolic hormones arent dangerous..
Agreed... never thougth of beating the body's race to raise myostatin to preserve homeostasis... is this proven and measured or forums falacy?
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Agreed... never thougth of beating the body's race to raise myostatin to preserve homeostasis... is this proven and measured or forums falacy?
Mol Cell Endocrinol. 2009 Apr 10;302(1):26-32. Epub 2009 Jan 21. Links
Measurement of myostatin concentrations in human serum: Circulating concentrations in young and older men and effects of testosterone administration.
Lakshman KM, Bhasin S, Corcoran C, Collins-Racie LA, Tchistiakova L, Forlow SB, St Ledger K, Burczynski ME, Dorner AJ, Lavallie ER.
Section of Endocrinology, Diabetes, and Nutrition, Boston University School of Medicine, Boston Medical Center, 670 Albany Street, Boston, MA 02118, United States.
Methodological problems, including binding of myostatin to plasma proteins and cross-reactivity of assay reagents with other proteins, have confounded myostatin measurements. Here we describe development of an accurate assay for measuring myostatin concentrations in humans. Monoclonal antibodies that bind to distinct regions of myostatin served as capture and detector antibodies in a sandwich ELISA that used acid treatment to dissociate myostatin from binding proteins. Serum from myostatin-deficient Belgian Blue cattle was used as matrix and recombinant human myostatin as standard. The quantitative range was 0.15-37.50 ng/mL. Intra- and inter-assay CVs in low, mid, and high range were 4.1%, 4.7%, and 7.2%, and 3.9%, 1.6%, and 5.2%, respectively. Myostatin protein was undetectable in sera of Belgian Blue cattle and myostatin knockout mice. Recovery in spiked sera approximated 100%. ActRIIB-Fc or anti-myostatin antibody MYO-029 had no effect on myostatin measurements when assayed at pH 2.5. Myostatin levels were higher in young than older men (mean+/-S.E.M. 8.0+/-0.3 ng/mL vs. 7.0+/-0.4 ng/mL, P=0.03). In men treated with graded doses of testosterone, myostatin levels were significantly higher on day 56 than baseline in both young and older men; changes in myostatin levels were significantly correlated with changes in total and free testosterone in young men. Myostatin levels were not significantly associated with lean body mass in either young or older men. CONCLUSION: Myostatin ELISA has the characteristics of a valid assay: nearly 100% recovery, excellent precision, accuracy, and sufficient sensitivity to enable measurement of myostatin concentrations in men and women.
PMID: 19356623 [PubMed - in process]
Contrary to what they were expecting to see, it seems that by day 56 myostatin levels were much higher. So in week 8 it was causing LBM gains to stall, you know, like we know they do. But here's the good news. By the end of the study in week 20 they were back to baseline.
The moral of the story is to do 8 week cycles or increase dose before week 8 or stay on.
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Mol Cell Endocrinol. 2009 Apr 10;302(1):26-32. Epub 2009 Jan 21. Links
The moral of the story is to do 8 week cycles or increase dose before week 8 or stay on.
Good stuff My Merovigian brother.
This pretty much destroys ALR's theories...
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so you're saying if we want to stay on forever to up doses every 2 months ???
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Agreed... never thougth of beating the body's race to raise myostatin to preserve homeostasis... is this proven and measured or forums falacy?
myostatin.. increases after 8 weeks, returns to baseline after 20 weeks.. thats pretty much the short and simple version of all the science done on myostatin and testosterone treatment..
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Obviously it doesn't matter. The pros don't seem to have problems making continuous gains and I don't think they are doing 8 weeks on, 20 weeks off. It is also clear that you can't keep adding to the dose every 8 weeks, or you would soon be using astronomical amounts. May as well ignore this and press on.
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sgt spar i didnt mean it takes 20 weeks of steroids... i meant that after 20 weeks of being on steroids that myostatin returns to normal..... so steroids always work fine, but during weeks 8-20 myostatin is increased..
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sgt spar i didnt mean it takes 20 weeks of steroids... i meant that after 20 weeks of being on steroids that myostatin returns to normal..... so steroids always work fine, but during weeks 8-20 myostatin is increased..
So the body just gives up trying to fight to stay in homeostasis? How about Cortisol?
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So the body just gives up trying to fight to stay in homeostasis? How about Cortisol?
you know i am not an expert... i can only relate what current science has revealed.. reasons for a mysotatin jump during weeks 8-20.. i have no idea..
as for cortisol, really a non-issue for AAS using bodybuilder/athletes.. whatever miniscue cortisol would get released, should be pretty quickly rendered ineffective because of the great amount of androgens competing for cortisol receptors.. however some steroids can even increase cortisoL..
as far as im concerned, theres no reason to believe cycling is necessary.. since personal experience and the testimonies of many, many top professional bodybuilders and "seasoned vets" in general have all said that the best way is low/moderate dose continuously..
also, i know mega dosing doesnt work much better, if any at all, than just a good dose.. so it makes sense to me that the only way to get huge is long term consistancy with drugs training and to a lesser extent diet
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sgt spar i didnt mean it takes 20 weeks of steroids... i meant that after 20 weeks of being on steroids that myostatin returns to normal..... so steroids always work fine, but during weeks 8-20 myostatin is increased..
Gotcha.
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So when on say forever, blast for up to 20 weeks, then cruise back to lower dose? Is that what you're getting at?
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So when on say forever, blast for up to 20 weeks, then cruise back to lower dose? Is that what you're getting at?
IMO blast and cruise is ineffective... much better to just stay on a medium dose..
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you know i am not an expert... i can only relate what current science has revealed.. reasons for a mysotatin jump during weeks 8-20.. i have no idea..
as for cortisol, really a non-issue for AAS using bodybuilder/athletes.. whatever miniscue cortisol would get released, should be pretty quickly rendered ineffective because of the great amount of androgens competing for cortisol receptors.. however some steroids can even increase cortisoL..
as far as im concerned, theres no reason to believe cycling is necessary.. since personal experience and the testimonies of many, many top professional bodybuilders and "seasoned vets" in general have all said that the best way is low/moderate dose continuously..
also, i know mega dosing doesnt work much better, if any at all, than just a good dose.. so it makes sense to me that the only way to get huge is long term consistancy with drugs training and to a lesser extent diet
I'm starting to think the same more and more..
One last sticky point: SHGB (Sex Hormone-Binding Globulin)... it eventually increases progressively.. eventually rendering even "higher doses" decreasingly effective. How to control it?
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well first of all you need is shgbbg a bad thing??? hormones bound to shbg remain un metabolised and stay in circulation a whole lot longer than unbound hormones. not only that, but there is a protein called megalin on shbg that may allow bound hormones to interact with the AR receptor... if this is the case, shbg is actually a very positive thing.. not a negative one.
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i think we're putting way too much thought into this
i mean
more doses = bigger
less dose = smaller
???
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What would be considered a moderate to low doseage?
300 test and 300 eq, etc.?