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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: the_steevo_uk on July 15, 2010, 07:10:38 AM
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Seriously why does being native american give you a carte blanche to fuck with other countries rules...sorry i'll rephrase the entire world's rules? I understand they're Uroquois and their identity is important to them, but seriously they're American and Canadian, you cant just turn up in Britain with a Handwritten document and expect to get let in. Every other person living in Canada and the USA has a freakin electronic passport and applies for work visas in the proper format.
They're saying its a race issue now, please gimme a fucking break, I dont give a damn who you are, you can come in if you follow the rules. Until the Uroquois declare an independent state then they cant use this documentation to travel to other people's countries. I just don't understand why they think it's one rule for them and one rule for everyone else. I'm very sorry about their history but this is the 21st century and what Buffalo Bill did to them is sort of immaterial now.
read below
From BBC
Officials told the team they would be granted a visa at immigration only with documents considered valid by the UK, including US or Canadian passports.
The announcement came after the US cleared them to travel at the behest of Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.
The team says using other passports would be an attack on their identity.
The Iroquois Confederacy of six Indian nations oversees tribal land that stretches from upstate New York into the Canadian province of Ontario.
The UK's decision not to accept the confederacy's travel documents came a day before the opening day at the Lacrosse World Championships in Manchester, during which the Iroquois team were due to play England.
Only hours earlier, team members born within US borders had been granted a "one-time-only waiver" by the state department at the request of Mrs Clinton allowing them to make the trip without US passports.
The team, which ranks fourth in the world in lacrosse, has always travelled on the confederacy's documents as an expression of their Iroquois identity, but US officials had said they do not meet new, stricter passports standards.
"There was flexibility there to grant this kind of one-time waiver given the unique circumstances of this particular trip," state department spokesman PJ Crowley told reporters in Washington on Wednesday.
An example of the Iroquois passport
The Canadian-born players were also experiencing problems obtaining leave to travel from Ottawa when British officials spoke to the team.
Federation of International Lacrosse spokesman Ron Balls said in a statement on the championship website on Wednesday that the Iroquois team would forfeit their opening game if it did not arrive on time.
The Iroquois helped invent lacrosse, as early as 1,000 years ago.
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The Iroquois helped invent lacrosse, as early as 1,000 years ago.
So, if you’re a decendant of Benjamin Franklin, do you expect a pass on your electric bill?
Why don’t they just get those guys passports like EVERYONE ELSE?
More and more, racism is being cried without any merit to do so.
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No you are NOT right to be pissed off... Post is a waste of time and puts you in a bad light
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So, if you’re a decendant of Benjamin Franklin, do you expect a pass on your electric bill?
Why don’t they just get those guys passports like EVERYONE ELSE?
More and more, racism is being cried without any merit to do so.
You mean Tesla who invented the AC power system used practically around the world.
Benjamin Franklin only found out how easy it is to LIE and how long it will last.
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No you are NOT right to be pissed off... Post is a waste of time and puts you in a bad light
would you care to explain why?
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You mean Tesla who invented the AC power system used practically around the world.
Benjamin Franklin only found out how easy it is to LIE and how long it will last.
Nobody “invented” electricity - including Tesla.
Franklin was one person who discovered it and invented an APPLICATION for it, as did Tesla, Edison, and a whole host of ancient Greeks, Phoenicians, Parthians and Mesopotamians.
Try answering the legitimate question in my thread.
Why do you seem to be in such favor of waivers for certain people to fly and enter other countries?
Nobody needs “special permission” if they follow the same rules everyone else does to do it the right way.
Did my comment about those who wrongfully cry racism hit a nerve with you?
Well, I’m open to the fact that maybe they’re not wrong.
Maybe the team IS being discriminated against based on race/ethnicity/identity.
The team says using other passports would be an attack on their identity.
Perhaps you could explain how requiring a standard passport for entrance into a country is “an attack on anyone’s identity.”
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would you care to explain why?
Dammit!
Your selfish ass expecting everyone to adhere to the same protocols you are required to follow DOES put you in a bad light.
;)
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On the face of it i totally agree. They should be using passport documentation just like everyone else. However, there are underlying issues here which perhaps need to be addressed. Not least of which is birth certification. I'm not sure about this reservation but many do not have birth certification or normal identification. There is just no need for it, they live, work and play on their tribal lands and when leaving probably could not get a passport even if they tried. Their system of ID in this instance would, to me anyway, seem like a plausible idea.
Perhaps the real issue here is the need to inform and get ID to native Americans so that if they wish, they can leave the country and we don't have a repeat of this.
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Perhaps the real issue here is the need to inform and get ID to native Americans so that if they wish, they can leave the country and we don't have a repeat of this.
Excellent point!
But, until those provisions are met, I can't and don't consider the UK's stance to be inappropriate.
What would be inappropriate is making concessions & accomodations in national security policy based on someone's ethnicity.
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Excellent point!
But, until those provisions are met, I can't and don't consider the UK's stance to be inappropriate.
What would be inappropriate is making concessions & accomodations in national security policy based on someone's ethnicity.
Precisely, it's about keeping standards...if native americans can waltz in, then what about basques, berbers, maoris, aborigini's, amazonian indians, tibetans...would seem a little unfair for them to get a leg up and all those persecuted ethnicities to not get one.
If they lack the documentation then there must be some way of getting a passport for them that would at least cover the irregularities.
but the point seems a little secondary which is that they dont want US or canada passports because of their ethnic identity, not for problems to do with lack of information. To me that's simply not good enough a reason to make an exemption.
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I’m still waiting for the explanation concerning how your original post is a waste of time and puts you in a bad light.
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I find this amazing given the fact that Britain welcomes terrorists, jihadists and other harbingers of hate with open-arms but now they're upset over a piece of paper. Doesn't get any more ridiculous than that.
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I’m still waiting for the explanation concerning how your original post is a waste of time and puts you in a bad light.
Likewise...amusing isn't it. Had a mate of mine disagree with me over this, his only point was to say I was filled with hate and racist. When I asked him to actually bring up a point that made mine invalid, or simply a legal reason as to why I was not right, he simply said the same thing again...when people name call there is generally no reason to think they actually have a valid point.
Bezerk we dont welcome jihadists, we spend a lot of time getting rid off them. Besides half the jihadists in britain grew up here, not much you can do about that, can't expel your own citizens.
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Likewise...amusing isn't it. Had a mate of mine disagree with me over this, his only point was to say I was filled with hate and racist. When I asked him to actually bring up a point that made mine invalid, or simply a legal reason as to why I was not right, he simply said the same thing again...
Quotidian.
when people name call there is generally no reason to think they actually have a valid point.
If they could prove you wrong, they would.
At least some are creative enough to spin & deflect.
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Why do you seem to be in such favor of waivers for certain people to fly and enter other countries?
Nobody needs “special permission” if they follow the same rules everyone else does to do it the right way.
Did my comment about those who wrongfully cry racism hit a nerve with you?
Well, I’m open to the fact that maybe they’re not wrong.
Maybe the team IS being discriminated against based on race/ethnicity/identity.
Perhaps you could explain how requiring a standard passport for entrance into a country is “an attack on anyone’s identity.”
I’m still waiting for the explanation concerning how [the] original post is a waste of time and puts [the op] in a bad light.
These are not rhetorical questions.
Of course, if Samson is incapable of providing an objective and rational explanation in response to the above questions, we can correctly presume that either there are none, or (s)he simply lacks the mental acumen to formulate them.