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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Straw Man on August 24, 2010, 08:05:07 AM
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one of those few times when I'm in agreement with Ron Paul and he makes many of the same points that I have on this site over the last few days
http://www.ronpaul.com/2010-08-20/ron-paul-sunshine-patriots-stop-your-demagogy-about-the-nyc-mosque/
Ron Paul to Sunshine Patriots: Stop Your Demagogy About The NYC Mosque!
Congressman Ron Paul today released the following statement on the controversy concerning the construction of an Islamic Center and Mosque in New York City:
Is the controversy over building a mosque near ground zero a grand distraction or a grand opportunity? Or is it, once again, grandiose demagoguery?
It has been said, “Nero fiddled while Rome burned.” Are we not overly preoccupied with this controversy, now being used in various ways by grandstanding politicians? It looks to me like the politicians are “fiddling while the economy burns.”
The debate should have provided the conservative defenders of property rights with a perfect example of how the right to own property also protects the 1st Amendment rights of assembly and religion by supporting the building of the mosque.
Instead, we hear lip service given to the property rights position while demanding that the need to be “sensitive” requires an all-out assault on the building of a mosque, several blocks from “ground zero.”
Just think of what might (not) have happened if the whole issue had been ignored and the national debate stuck with war, peace, and prosperity. There certainly would have been a lot less emotionalism on both sides. The fact that so much attention has been given the mosque debate, raises the question of just why and driven by whom?
In my opinion it has come from the neo-conservatives who demand continual war in the Middle East and Central Asia and are compelled to constantly justify it.
They never miss a chance to use hatred toward Muslims to rally support for the ill conceived preventative wars. A select quote from soldiers from in Afghanistan and Iraq expressing concern over the mosque is pure propaganda and an affront to their bravery and sacrifice.
The claim is that we are in the Middle East to protect our liberties is misleading. To continue this charade, millions of Muslims are indicted and we are obligated to rescue them from their religious and political leaders. And, we’re supposed to believe that abusing our liberties here at home and pursuing unconstitutional wars overseas will solve our problems.
The nineteen suicide bombers didn’t come from Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Iran. Fifteen came from our ally Saudi Arabia, a country that harbors strong American resentment, yet we invade and occupy Iraq where no al Qaeda existed prior to 9/11.
Many fellow conservatives say they understand the property rights and 1st Amendment issues and don’t want a legal ban on building the mosque. They just want everybody to be “sensitive” and force, through public pressure, cancellation of the mosque construction.
This sentiment seems to confirm that Islam itself is to be made the issue, and radical religious Islamic views were the only reasons for 9/11. If it became known that 9/11 resulted in part from a desire to retaliate against what many Muslims saw as American aggression and occupation, the need to demonize Islam would be difficult if not impossible.
There is no doubt that a small portion of radical, angry Islamists do want to kill us but the question remains, what exactly motivates this hatred?
If Islam is further discredited by making the building of the mosque the issue, then the false justification for our wars in the Middle East will continue to be acceptable.
The justification to ban the mosque is no more rational than banning a soccer field in the same place because all the suicide bombers loved to play soccer.
Conservatives are once again, unfortunately, failing to defend private property rights, a policy we claim to cherish. In addition conservatives missed a chance to challenge the hypocrisy of the left which now claims they defend property rights of Muslims, yet rarely if ever, the property rights of American private businesses.
Defending the controversial use of property should be no more difficult than defending the 1st Amendment principle of defending controversial speech. But many conservatives and liberals do not want to diminish the hatred for Islam–the driving emotion that keeps us in the wars in the Middle East and Central Asia.
It is repeatedly said that 64% of the people, after listening to the political demagogues, don’t want the mosque to be built. What would we do if 75% of the people insist that no more Catholic churches be built in New York City? The point being is that majorities can become oppressors of minority rights as well as individual dictators. Statistics of support is irrelevant when it comes to the purpose of government in a free society—protecting liberty.
The outcry over the building of the mosque, near ground zero, implies that Islam alone was responsible for the 9/11 attacks. According to those who are condemning the building of the mosque, the nineteen suicide terrorists on 9/11 spoke for all Muslims. This is like blaming all Christians for the wars of aggression and occupation because some Christians supported the neo-conservatives’ aggressive wars.
The House Speaker is now treading on a slippery slope by demanding a Congressional investigation to find out just who is funding the mosque—a bold rejection of property rights, 1st Amendment rights, and the Rule of Law—in order to look tough against Islam.
This is all about hate and Islamaphobia.
We now have an epidemic of “sunshine patriots” on both the right and the left who are all for freedom, as long as there’s no controversy and nobody is offended.
Political demagoguery rules when truth and liberty are ignored.
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Just lost my support in 2012.
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Yet another turd throwing around "islamophobia" to support their foolhardy argument. Not that it matters, Ron Paul has always sucked.
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is religion discrimination allowed to be a factor in cosideration of zoning issues and building permits?
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is religion discrimination allowed to be a factor in cosideration of zoning issues and building permits?
Hoo boy, another Blacken. ::)
Where in the Constitution does it say that someone can build a house of worship anywhere and anytime they feel like it? There are dozens of religious groups who have had their building plans for their own house of worships denied that would love to know.
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Hoo boy, another Blacken. ::)
Where in the Constitution does it say that someone can build a house of worship anywhere and anytime they feel like it? There are dozens of religious groups who have had their building plans for their own house of worships denied that would love to know.
http://www.buyacampground.com/legal/legal/files/page14_2.jpg
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Yet another turd throwing around "islamophobia" to support their foolhardy argument. Not that it matters, Ron Paul has always sucked.
you don't like someones post,you insult them. does any one else see this pattern ???
what part of the Ron Paul article is not true ???
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LOL but if i recall you were against his son even wanting to talk about individual business owners rights if they wanted to discriminate certain clientel?
cant have it one way or the other....
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http://www.buyacampground.com/legal/legal/files/page14_2.jpg
That's not the Constitution.
That's a nice pic. How does that explain the countless religious groups who have had their building plans for various houses of worship denied by the government? ::)
you don't like someones post,you insult them. does any one else see this pattern ???
what part of the Ron Paul article is not true ???
Are you following me around now? We get it, you can post a youtube clip.
Ironic coming from you. You've never once actually argued anything. You either post youtube clips or sling insults.
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I don't know maybe its just me, but how many times do I have to post the 1st amendment?
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. "
Can't seem to find anything about the right to build a house of worship in there.
The link you posted is not the constitution, just more nanny state BS.
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I don't know maybe its just me, but how many times do I have to post the 1st amendment?
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. "
Can't seem to find anything about the right to build a house of worship in there.
The link you posted is not the constitution, just more nanny state BS.
Exactly. Not a single person has refuted that yet. They either spin it (like with that link) or change the topic.
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what part of the Ron Paul article is not true ???
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Well what do you expect? Someone to actually read the constitution? Its just easier to believe all the propaganda out there. So here we are yet again, misinformation and feel good PC crap.
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what part of the Ron Paul article is not true ???
LOL do you agree that ppl should be able to discriminate others if their business is not publicly owned?
b/c the crux of his argument is the rights of private property owners...
Im sure you got in on his son and bashed him for even wanting to discuss the idea...
but now youre ok with it... ;)
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Just because something may be legally right does not make it right.
And as more details come out about this mess, the less support it gets. Whether its the dubious funding, the lack of any transparency, the hideous wife, the proximity to GZ, etc.
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As usual Ron Paul speaks and most Americans are too stupid to realize or understand his point. Who the fuck cares if the mosque is right next door to site or 300 miles from it? Does it really matter? I mean my god there are more fucking important things to worry about. The Founding Fathers probably wouldn't have given two shits about a mosque opening next door to where 9/11 happened. And many Americans probably have no fucking clue that Muhammad is emblazoned on the US Supreme Court building.
In 1997, the Council on American-Islamic Relations requested that the Supreme Court remove the image of Muhammad from the marble frieze of the façade. While appreciating the fact that Muhammad was included in the court's pantheon of 18 prominent lawgivers of history, CAIR noted that Islam discourages depictions of Muhammad in any artistic representation. CAIR also objected that the prophet was shown with a sword, reinforcing long-held stereotypes of Muslims as intolerant conquerors. Chief Justice William Rehnquist rejected the request to sandblast Muhammad, saying the artwork "was intended only to recognize him, among many other lawgivers, as an important figure in the history of law; it is not intended as a form of idol worship." The court later added a footnote to tourist materials describing the frieze, calling it a "a well-intentioned attempt by the sculptor to honor Muhammad."[13]
America is the most free country in the world and our government exists to protect liberty and uphold the Consitution. Not decide if a mosque can be built on private property or not. If people want to lambast the Muslim community for having the balls to put the mosque next to 9/11 go for it and I agree. But the government has a lot more fucking important things ot worry about. I mean if people are so up in arms over this shit why don't they just protest to kick all muslims out of the US. I mean why stop with a mosque? Get rid of them all. :'( You fags sit here and whine about the melting pot...........well what the fuck did you expect?
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As usual Ron Paul speaks and most Americans are too stupid to realize or understand his point. Who the fuck cares if the mosque is right next door to site or 300 miles from it? Does it really matter? I mean my god there are more fucking important things to worry about. The Founding Fathers probably wouldn't have given two shits about a mosque opening next door to where 9/11 happened. And many Americans probably have no fucking clue that Muhammad is emblazoned on the US Supreme Court building.
In 1997, the Council on American-Islamic Relations requested that the Supreme Court remove the image of Muhammad from the marble frieze of the façade. While appreciating the fact that Muhammad was included in the court's pantheon of 18 prominent lawgivers of history, CAIR noted that Islam discourages depictions of Muhammad in any artistic representation. CAIR also objected that the prophet was shown with a sword, reinforcing long-held stereotypes of Muslims as intolerant conquerors. Chief Justice William Rehnquist rejected the request to sandblast Muhammad, saying the artwork "was intended only to recognize him, among many other lawgivers, as an important figure in the history of law; it is not intended as a form of idol worship." The court later added a footnote to tourist materials describing the frieze, calling it a "a well-intentioned attempt by the sculptor to honor Muhammad."[13]
America is the most free country in the world and our government exists to protect liberty and uphold the Consitution. Not decide if a mosque can be built on private property or not. If people want to lambast the Muslim community for having the balls to put the mosque next to 9/11 go for it and I agree. But the government has a lot more fucking important things ot worry about. I mean if people are so up in arms over this shit why don't they just protest to kick all muslims out of the US. I mean why stop with a mosque? Get rid of them all. :'( You fags sit here and whine about the melting pot...........well what the fuck did you expect?
i think this is the best post on the subject from this board
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LOL do you agree that ppl should be able to discriminate others if their business is not publicly owned?
b/c the crux of his argument is the rights of private property owners...
Im sure you got in on his son and bashed him for even wanting to discuss the idea...
but now youre ok with it... ;)
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
They only agree with it when it suits their agenda. It's pretty ironic given how much leftist outrage there was over the business discrimination issue when it involved blacks.
i think this is the best post on the subject from this board
I think it's funny that you read Kazan's post yet you're ignoring it because you're incapable of refuting it. Just another one in a long line of them.
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Just because something may be legally right does not make it right.
And as more details come out about this mess, the less support it gets. Whether its the dubious funding, the lack of any transparency, the hideous wife, the proximity to GZ, etc.
Yeah and government has no fucking business dictating what is morally or ethically righ or in other words politically correct. Their entire point of existence is to enforce the law and uphold the constitution. So like I said.......who gives a fuck if a mosque goes up against the site of 9/11. It might be poor taste and disrepsectful.........bu t it's none of the government's business. It's not illegal. What do you fags want the government to do? Sign a law saying no mosque can be put up next to ground zero ever again? ::) I mean fuck that part of NYC has a huge Arab community anyways. Why don't you go through the neighborhood and kick them all out? Hell it's like me going into a fucking Mexican neighborhood and telling them not to open up a taco shop. Duh........Maybe we should sign a law saying no Arabs/Muslims should ever live within 1 mile of ground zero? How about that?
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The government exists to protect liberty and the constitution, I hope you didn't type that with a strait face. The government has been wiping its ass with the constitution since the civil war. Yeah there may be more important things to worry about, but if said government was protecting the constitution the country wouldn't be in the fucking mess it is. Oh and on a side note fuck the Muslim community, I don't give a fuck what they think they are entitled to.
Oh and why would a homo call others "fags" with the intention of insulting them?
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Yeah and government has no fucking business dictating what is morally or ethically righ or in other words politically correct. Their entire point of existence is to enforce the law and uphold the constitution. So like I said.......who gives a fuck if a mosque goes up against the site of 9/11. It might be poor taste and disrepsectful.........bu t it's none of the government's business. It's not illegal. What do you fags want the government to do? Sign a law saying no mosque can be put up next to ground zero ever again? ::)
I have not wanted once the govt to ban these people from their rights, provided of course they comply with all the laws etc.
What I did hope was that the Imam show a bit of decency, but I guess that looks like it is not going to happen.
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Yeah and government has no fucking business dictating what is morally or ethically righ or in other words politically correct. Their entire point of existence is to enforce the law and uphold the constitution. So like I said.......who gives a fuck if a mosque goes up against the site of 9/11. It might be poor taste and disrepsectful.........bu t it's none of the government's business. It's not illegal. What do you fags want the government to do? Sign a law saying no mosque can be put up next to ground zero ever again? ::)
Again, if you had done any reading on this proposed mosque, then you would know that there are plenty of legal issues that need to be resolved before it can be built. For starters, they only 50% of the site that they think they're building the mosque on. Unless Con Edison plans on gifting them the other 50%, they have no legal right to touch that property. Secondly, their funding is subject to review and has to meet legal requirements. Terrorist organizations and individuals who are tied to terrorist organizations are not allowed to fund projects, mosques, business or anything else in this country. If it turns out that the people leading this mosque project are financing it through these groups, then that would be illegal and these people would then be subjected to a criminal investigation.
The list goes on.
The government exists to protect liberty and the constitution, I hope you didn't type that with a strait face. The government has been wiping its ass with the constitution since the civil war. Yeah there may be more important things to worry about, but if said government was protecting the constitution the country wouldn't be in the fucking mess it is. Oh and on a side note fuck the Muslim community, I don't give a fuck what they think they are entitled to.
Oh and why would a homo call others "fags" with the intention of insulting them?
;D
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Yeah and government has no fucking business dictating what is morally or ethically righ or in other words politically correct. Their entire point of existence is to enforce the law and uphold the constitution. So like I said.......who gives a fuck if a mosque goes up against the site of 9/11. It might be poor taste and disrepsectful.........bu t it's none of the government's business. It's not illegal. What do you fags want the government to do? Sign a law saying no mosque can be put up next to ground zero ever again? ::) I mean fuck that part of NYC has a huge Arab community anyways. Why don't you go through the neighborhood and kick them all out? Hell it's like me going into a fucking Mexican neighborhood and telling them not to open up a taco shop. Duh........Maybe we should sign a law saying no Arabs/Muslims should ever live within 1 mile of ground zero? How about that?
thissssssssssssss
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I have not wanted once the govt to ban these people from their rights, provided of course they comply with all the laws etc.
What I did hope was that the Imam show a bit of decency, but I guess that looks like it is not going to happen.
3000 "Americans" were killed on 9/11 and probably 50,000+ Arabs/Muslims have been killed in the wars over the last 10 years. Get the fuck over it. Life goes on. The world moves on. Some of you sound like the old fucking codgers who fought in WWII who still hate the Germans and the Japs. If you want to do something about Muslims and fanatical fucking terrorists get out of their countries and quit exploiting their oil.
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The nurse has commanded it, so let it be so! ::)
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If you want to do something about Muslims and fanatical fucking terrorists get out of their countries and quit exploiting their oil.
Where do you come up with this shit? exploiting their oil, last time I checked oil was sold on the stock market.
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thissssssssssssss
This is the simpletons' argument. Not one person has argued that point and it is a StrawMan argument concocted by the left against a
non-existent boogeyman.
The argument is that SHOULD the Imam build it there if his goal is to so call "build bridges", while the site itself is a burial ground to 3000 NY'ers at the hands of Islam inspired killers.
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If you want to do something about Muslims and fanatical fucking terrorists get out of their countries and quit exploiting their oil.
makes sense, maybe we don't want to stop the terrorists, maybe the goal is to encourage them? ???
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Again, if you had done any reading on this proposed mosque, then you would know that there are plenty of legal issues that need to be resolved before it can be built. For starters, they only 50% of the site that they think they're building the mosque on. Unless Con Edison plans on gifting them the other 50%, they have no legal right to touch that property. Secondly, their funding is subject to review and has to meet legal requirements. Terrorist organizations and individuals who are tied to terrorist organizations are not allowed to fund projects, mosques, business or anything else in this country. If it turns out that the people leading this mosque project are financing it through these groups, then that would be illegal and these people would then be subjected to a criminal investigation.
The list goes on.
;D
LOL........so then what's the problem? If the law is enforced like it should be the mosque will not go up. What are you worried about? Ooops......unless our corrupt government does not enforce the law like the didn't enforce the existing regulation on Wallstreet causing our economic collapse.
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Where do you come up with this shit? exploiting their oil, last time I checked oil was sold on the stock market.
That's just semantics. ::)
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Where do you come up with this shit? exploiting their oil, last time I checked oil was sold on the stock market.
haha you're a fucking idiot dude. Do the fucking research. Oil sold on the market? You've obviously never heard of Mohammed Mossadeq and Operation Ajax have you? ::)
Or maybe you heard about Italy's Enrico Mattei? PROBABLY NOT!
The CIA at the behest of the "seven sisters" and the American Anglo oil companies have been toppling entire governments to secure oil resources all over the world. ::)
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haha you're a fucking idiot dude. Do the fucking research. Oil sold on the market? You've obviously never heard of Mohammed Mossadeq and Operation Ajax have you? ::)
Or maybe you heard about Italy's Enrico Mattei? PROBABLY NOT!
The CIA at the behest of the "seven sisters" and the American Anglo oil companies have been toppling entire governments to secure oil resources all over the world. ::)
Let me guess, giving all those Iraqi oil wells to the Chinese was all part of that sinister CIA plot. ::)
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Let me guess, giving all those Iraqi oil wells to the Chinese was all part of that sinister CIA plot. ::)
I didnt say shit about Iraqi oil dipshit. But if you want to go there we can. I mentioned Operation Ajax and Enrico Mattei.....the latter I guaranfuckingtee you've have no clue about. ::) Countries go to war for oil that's the point. And America and the British have been exploiting middle eastern countries and people for their oil for the last 100 years. It's fact. Hence Operation Ajax and the overthrow of a democratically elected President who wanted to nationalize Iranian oil supplies. That's also the reason why Iran is so fucked up. See we as a country make one mess by trying to clean up another. It's been like that for 50 years.
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I didnt say shit about Iraqi oil dipshit. But if you want to go there we can. I mentioned Operation Ajax and Enrico Mattei.....the latter I guaranfuckingtee you've have no clue about. ::) Countries go to war for oil that's the point. And America and the British have been exploiting middle eastern countries and people for their oil for the last 100 years. It's fact. Hence Operation Ajax and the overthrow of a democratically elected President who wanted to nationalize Iranian oil supplies. That's also the reason why Iran is so fucked up. See we as a country make one mess by trying to clean up another. It's been like that for 50 years.
I don't give a fuck about what went on in 1953. We're talking about the here and now, slick. Referencing events from 1/2 a century ago does not make your argument stronger nor does it prove anything.
The CIA this, the CIA that. The CIA is part of a sinister plot to get more oil for China! ::)
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haha you're a fucking idiot dude. Do the fucking research. Oil sold on the market? You've obviously never heard of Mohammed Mossadeq and Operation Ajax have you? ::)
Or maybe you heard about Italy's Enrico Mattei? PROBABLY NOT!
The CIA at the behest of the "seven sisters" and the American Anglo oil companies have been toppling entire governments to secure oil resources all over the world. ::)
I do plenty of research perhaps you should do the same, I am also speaking about now not 50 years ago, but hey if you want to go there. Perhaps you should check into the significance of the naming of the "community center" the Cordoba Mosque, but then in typical left wing fashion you will give me the old get the fuck over it speech.
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So what. He's wrong.
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In addition conservatives missed a chance to challenge the hypocrisy of the left which now claims they defend property rights of Muslims, yet rarely if ever, the property rights of American private businesses.
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those are RP's words and it would have been better if he gave an example so we could evaluate what he is referring to
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I do plenty of research perhaps you should do the same, I am also speaking about now not 50 years ago, but hey if you want to go there. Perhaps you should check into the significance of the naming of the "community center" the Cordoba Mosque, but then in typical left wing fashion you will give me the old get the fuck over it speech.
Revisionist history will tell you that Cordoba, Spain was a utopia where Muslims, Christians and Jews lived in harmony and sang songs together. In reality, Christians and Jews were treated like shit and subjected to countless injustices and atrocities.
It probably kills leftists to have to live with knowing that the Moors were eventually driven out of Europe. One would think Europe would have learned its lesson then and not subject themselves to the same shit all over again.
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I do plenty of research perhaps you should do the same, I am also speaking about now not 50 years ago, but hey if you want to go there. Perhaps you should check into the significance of the naming of the "community center" the Cordoba Mosque, but then in typical left wing fashion you will give me the old get the fuck over it speech.
Smack down - KAZAN style.
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I don't give a fuck about what went on in 1953. We're talking about the here and now, slick. Referencing events from 1/2 a century ago does not make your argument stronger nor does it prove anything.
The CIA this, the CIA that. The CIA is part of a sinister plot to get more oil for China! ::)
It's called blowback dumbshit. Most of the problems in the middle east area direct result of the shit we did in the lat 50 years. And sad thing is we haven't learned from our mistakes. While the US is busy gutting itself in worthless wars fighting a boogey man enemy countries like China are minding their own business and getting stronger. We'll talk again in a year. ::)
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I do plenty of research perhaps you should do the same, I am also speaking about now not 50 years ago, but hey if you want to go there. Perhaps you should check into the significance of the naming of the "community center" the Cordoba Mosque, but then in typical left wing fashion you will give me the old get the fuck over it speech.
Then why the fuck are you bringing up something that happened 500+ years ago????????
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MuscleMcMannus brings up some good points but some of you are thinking too much with your emotions,. I remember when some board members s were defending Rand Paul and his arguement over private property rights and you gave blacken a hard time when he tried to attack Rands stance BUT now you guys are doing the same thing blacken did when the roles are reversed. It seems like some folks on this board only think certain rules apply when it benefits their ideas and thoughts on the subject. You cant have it both ways.
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I brought up this scenerio in another thread but no one responded. I'd like to know what some of you think.
Does it not work in Americas favor to have the mosque built where they want it if it is proven later that it is being used to perpetuate fanatical anti American sentiment?
Then the people can say, "See, we were tolerant and let them build a mosque here and they used it for ill intentions so fuck you all, we're taking a wrecking ball to it and now the world can see that there was an ulterior motive for having it here." If that was really the case it would solidify the belief most anti Muslim groups have with others around the world that may not intially share that belief about the followers of Islam.
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Then why the fuck are you bringing up something that happened 500+ years ago????????
I rest my case
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I brought up this scenerio in another thread but no one responded. I'd like to know what some of you think.
Does it not work in Americas favor to have the mosque built where they want it if it is proven later that it is being used to perpetuate fanatical anti American sentiment?
Then the people can say, "See, we were tolerant and let them build a mosque here and they used it for ill intentions so fuck you all, we're taking a wrecking ball to it and now the world can see that there was an ulterior motive for having it here." If that was really the case it would solidify the belief most anti Muslim groups have with others around the world that may not intially share that belief about the followers of Islam.
I guess you would have to decide if it is better to be re-active or pro-active. Me I like to be pro-active
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I have always said Ron Paul sucks and doesnt belong in the White House. Glad to see some of you are finally starting to come to your senses.
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Alot of this wont matter when everyone is staring into empty tin cups.
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I guess you would have to decide if it is better to be re-active or pro-active. Me I like to be pro-active
Do you believe that building this mosque would cause Americans harm?
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MuscleMcMannus brings up some good points but some of you are thinking too much with your emotions,. I remember when some board members s were defending Rand Paul and his arguement over private property rights and you gave blacken a hard time when he tried to attack Rands stance BUT now you guys are doing the same thing blacken did when the roles are reversed. It seems like some folks on this board only think certain rules apply when it benefits their ideas and thoughts on the subject. You cant have it both ways.
the thing is that the crux of both arguments is the same...
blacken was against it when rand said it but is now all of a sudden for it?
I agree if its legal then they should be able to build it, lets not let the idea that this is meant to build bridges etc...go over though. That is just plain not true this is meant to provoke anger and is an intentionally hurtful move.
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It's called blowback dumbshit. Most of the problems in the middle east area direct result of the shit we did in the lat 50 years. And sad thing is we haven't learned from our mistakes. While the US is busy gutting itself in worthless wars fighting a boogey man enemy countries like China are minding their own business and getting stronger. We'll talk again in a year. ::)
Muslims have been at war with each other and their neighbots far longer than the us has been in existence. Blaming America for everything under the sun is just the latest excuse the violent savages.
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the thing is that the crux of both arguments is the same...
blacken was against it when rand said it but is now all of a sudden for it?
I agree if its legal then they should be able to build it, lets not let the idea that this is meant to build bridges etc...go over though. That is just plain not true this is meant to provoke anger and is an intentionally hurtful move.
Thanks for responding in a respectfull manner as I can understand what a touchy subject this has become. I really havent followed all the links to this Imam and shit because I really think a lot of the facts are being blurred with emotions that run deep.
I think the country has a lot more to worry about in terms of the economy anyway.
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Thanks for responding in a respectfull manner as I can understand what a touchy subject this has become. I really havent followed all the links to this Imam and shit because I really think a lot of the facts are being blurred with emotions that run deep.
I think the country has a lot more to worry about in terms of the economy anyway.
yesh yesh, your a cool dude and you use alot of verifiable facts to base your stances so I gots lots of respects for yous ;D
I agree I dont like the idea of it b/c to me this is an intentional move to piss ppl off covered by a "building bridges" but at the end of the day there is alot more important ish to worry about in my mind.
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Just because something may be legally right does not make it right.
The consitution is a legal document - not a moral document.
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The consitution is a legal document - not a moral document.
Where in the Constitution does it say that they have the right to build a house of worship anywhere and anytime they feel like it?
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Where in the Constitution does it say that they have the right to build a house of worship anywhere and anytime they feel like it?
nowhere.
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The consitution is a legal document - not a moral document.
LOL the constitution was created by ppl and ammended by ppl in accordance alot of times with their morality...
it may not written in legal terms but the reasoning behind it is very much tied to morality...