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Getbig Main Boards => General Topics => Topic started by: Army of One on June 27, 2011, 09:19:52 AM
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Religion of Peace....oh wait this is in the USA!
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Outcry in America as pregnant women who lose babies face murder charges
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2011/6/24/1308936562019/Fetus-US-criminals-007.jpg)
Rennie Gibbs is accused of murder, but the crime she is alleged to have committed does not sound like an ordinary killing. Yet she faces life in prison in Mississippi over the death of her unborn child.
Gibbs became pregnant aged 15, but lost the baby in December 2006 in a stillbirth when she was 36 weeks into the pregnancy. When prosecutors discovered that she had a cocaine habit – though there is no evidence that drug abuse had anything to do with the baby's death – they charged her with the "depraved-heart murder" of her child, which carries a mandatory life sentence.
Gibbs is the first woman in Mississippi to be charged with murder relating to the loss of her unborn baby. But her case is by no means isolated. Across the US more and more prosecutions are being brought that seek to turn pregnant women into criminals.
"Women are being stripped of their constitutional personhood and subjected to truly cruel laws," said Lynn Paltrow of the campaign National Advocates for Pregnant Women (NAPW). "It's turning pregnant women into a different class of person and removing them of their rights."
Bei Bei Shuai, 34, has spent the past three months in a prison cell in Indianapolis charged with murdering her baby. On 23 December she tried to commit suicide by taking rat poison after her boyfriend abandoned her.
Shuai was rushed to hospital and survived, but she was 33 weeks pregnant and her baby, to whom she gave birth a week after the suicide attempt and whom she called Angel, died after four days. In March Shuai was charged with murder and attempted foeticide and she has been in custody since without the offer of bail.
In Alabama at least 40 cases have been brought under the state's "chemical endangerment" law. Introduced in 2006, the statute was designed to protect children whose parents were cooking methamphetamine in the home and thus putting their children at risk from inhaling the fumes.
Amanda Kimbrough is one of the women who have been ensnared as a result of the law being applied in a wholly different way. During her pregnancy her foetus was diagnosed with possible Down's syndrome and doctors suggested she consider a termination, which Kimbrough declined as she is not in favour of abortion.
The baby was delivered by caesarean section prematurely in April 2008 and died 19 minutes after birth.
Six months later Kimbrough was arrested at home and charged with "chemical endangerment" of her unborn child on the grounds that she had taken drugs during the pregnancy – a claim she has denied.
"That shocked me, it really did," Kimbrough said. "I had lost a child, that was enough."
She now awaits an appeal ruling from the higher courts in Alabama, which if she loses will see her begin a 10-year sentence behind bars. "I'm just living one day at a time, looking after my three other kids," she said. "They say I'm a criminal, how do I answer that? I'm a good mother."
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion, in which conservative prosecutors are chipping away at hard-won freedoms by stretching protection laws to include foetuses, in some cases from the day of conception. In Gibbs' case defence lawyers have argued before Mississippi's highest court that her prosecution makes no sense. Under Mississippi law it is a crime for any person except the mother to try to cause an abortion.
"If it's not a crime for a mother to intentionally end her pregnancy, how can it be a crime for her to do it unintentionally, whether by taking drugs or smoking or whatever it is," Robert McDuff, a civil rights lawyer asked the state supreme court.
McDuff told the Guardian that he hoped the Gibbs prosecution was an isolated example. "I hope it's not a trend that's going to catch on. To charge a woman with murder because of something she did during pregnancy is really unprecedented and quite extreme."
He pointed out that anti-abortion groups were trying to amend the Mississippi constitution by setting up a state referendum, or ballot initiative, that would widen the definition of a person under the state's bill of rights to include a foetus from the day of conception.
Some 70 organisations across America have come together to file testimonies, known as amicus briefs, in support of Gibbs that protest against her treatment on several levels. One says that to treat "as a murderer a girl who has experienced a stillbirth serves only to increase her suffering".
Another, from a group of psychologists, laments the misunderstanding of addiction that lies behind the indictment. Gibbs did not take cocaine because she had a "depraved heart" or to "harm the foetus but to satisfy an acute psychological and physical need for that particular substance", says the brief.
Perhaps the most persuasive argument put forward in the amicus briefs is that if such prosecutions were designed to protect the unborn child, then they would be utterly counter-productive: "Prosecuting women and girls for continuing [a pregnancy] to term despite a drug addiction encourages them to terminate wanted pregnancies to avoid criminal penalties. The state could not have intended this result when it adopted the homicide statute."
Paltrow sees what is happening to Gibbs as a small taste of what would be unleashed were the constitutional right to an abortion ever overturned. "In Mississippi the use of the murder statute is creating a whole new legal standard that makes women accountable for the outcome of their pregnancies and threatens them with life imprisonment for murder."
Miscarriage of justice
At least 38 of the 50 states across America have introduced foetal homicide laws that were intended to protect pregnant women and their unborn children from violent attacks by third parties – usually abusive male partners – but are increasingly being turned by renegade prosecutors against the women themselves.
South Carolina was one of the first states to introduce such a foetal homicide law. National Advocates for Pregnant Women has found only one case of a South Carolina man who assaulted a pregnant woman having been charged under its terms, and his conviction was eventually overturned. Yet the group estimates there have been up to 300 women arrested for their actions during pregnancy.
In other states laws designed to protect children against the damaging effects of drugs have similarly been twisted to punish childbearers."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jun/24/america-pregnant-women-murder-charges
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"Women are being stripped of their constitutional personhood and subjected to truly cruel laws," said Lynn Paltrow of the campaign National Advocates for Pregnant Women (NAPW). "It's turning pregnant women into a different class of person and removing them of their rights."
What about the unborn babies rights? Stupid girl.
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I bet she's against abortion
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Murder, no, but if they can prove beyond doubt that her coke-snorting killed the child, then I've no probs with the little bitch doing some time.
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Murder, no, but if they can prove beyond doubt that her coke-snorting killed the child, then I've no probs with the little bitch doing some time.
I agree. Along time.
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the word murder in this kind of things is not right.
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snorting coke did not kill this baby.
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Hoes should need a license to breed
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15 and pregnant, probably a black girl right? ::)
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Women really want us to treat them like dogs. No responsibilities, no duties but every god damn right they want! What kind of life is that for a human?
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Religion of Peace....oh wait this is in the USA!
"
Outcry in America as pregnant women who lose babies face murder charges
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2011/6/24/1308936562019/Fetus-US-criminals-007.jpg)
Rennie Gibbs is accused of murder, but the crime she is alleged to have committed does not sound like an ordinary killing. Yet she faces life in prison in Mississippi over the death of her unborn child.
Gibbs became pregnant aged 15, but lost the baby in December 2006 in a stillbirth when she was 36 weeks into the pregnancy. When prosecutors discovered that she had a cocaine habit – though there is no evidence that drug abuse had anything to do with the baby's death – they charged her with the "depraved-heart murder" of her child, which carries a mandatory life sentence.
Gibbs is the first woman in Mississippi to be charged with murder relating to the loss of her unborn baby. But her case is by no means isolated. Across the US more and more prosecutions are being brought that seek to turn pregnant women into criminals.
"Women are being stripped of their constitutional personhood and subjected to truly cruel laws," said Lynn Paltrow of the campaign National Advocates for Pregnant Women (NAPW). "It's turning pregnant women into a different class of person and removing them of their rights."
Bei Bei Shuai, 34, has spent the past three months in a prison cell in Indianapolis charged with murdering her baby. On 23 December she tried to commit suicide by taking rat poison after her boyfriend abandoned her.
Shuai was rushed to hospital and survived, but she was 33 weeks pregnant and her baby, to whom she gave birth a week after the suicide attempt and whom she called Angel, died after four days. In March Shuai was charged with murder and attempted foeticide and she has been in custody since without the offer of bail.
In Alabama at least 40 cases have been brought under the state's "chemical endangerment" law. Introduced in 2006, the statute was designed to protect children whose parents were cooking methamphetamine in the home and thus putting their children at risk from inhaling the fumes.
Amanda Kimbrough is one of the women who have been ensnared as a result of the law being applied in a wholly different way. During her pregnancy her foetus was diagnosed with possible Down's syndrome and doctors suggested she consider a termination, which Kimbrough declined as she is not in favour of abortion.
The baby was delivered by caesarean section prematurely in April 2008 and died 19 minutes after birth.
Six months later Kimbrough was arrested at home and charged with "chemical endangerment" of her unborn child on the grounds that she had taken drugs during the pregnancy – a claim she has denied.
"That shocked me, it really did," Kimbrough said. "I had lost a child, that was enough."
She now awaits an appeal ruling from the higher courts in Alabama, which if she loses will see her begin a 10-year sentence behind bars. "I'm just living one day at a time, looking after my three other kids," she said. "They say I'm a criminal, how do I answer that? I'm a good mother."
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion, in which conservative prosecutors are chipping away at hard-won freedoms by stretching protection laws to include foetuses, in some cases from the day of conception. In Gibbs' case defence lawyers have argued before Mississippi's highest court that her prosecution makes no sense. Under Mississippi law it is a crime for any person except the mother to try to cause an abortion.
"If it's not a crime for a mother to intentionally end her pregnancy, how can it be a crime for her to do it unintentionally, whether by taking drugs or smoking or whatever it is," Robert McDuff, a civil rights lawyer asked the state supreme court.
McDuff told the Guardian that he hoped the Gibbs prosecution was an isolated example. "I hope it's not a trend that's going to catch on. To charge a woman with murder because of something she did during pregnancy is really unprecedented and quite extreme."
He pointed out that anti-abortion groups were trying to amend the Mississippi constitution by setting up a state referendum, or ballot initiative, that would widen the definition of a person under the state's bill of rights to include a foetus from the day of conception.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jun/24/america-pregnant-women-murder-charges
Bwahahahahahahah!!@!!! this bitch is 15... LOL
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Not murder - free her.
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Murder, no, but if they can prove beyond doubt that her coke-snorting killed the child, then I've no probs with the little bitch doing some time.
Well said my friend. Couldn't have helped for fuck sakes.
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Not murder - free her.
Like society really needs these types of rejects ??!
let's see:
15
4..3 kids
coke habit
probably will be pregnant again by the end of the month..
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Murder, no, but if they can prove beyond doubt that her coke-snorting killed the child, then I've no probs with the little bitch doing some time.
Not a child or even a baby but a fetus - HUGE difference.
Bwahahahahahahah!!@!!! this bitch is 15... LOL
The one with 3 kids is Kimbrough, not the 15 year old Gibbs referenced in the beginning of the article.
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Not a child or even a baby but a fetus - HUGE difference.
Bad argument. Are you a father? Not being a prick but with that logic if a man stabs or shoots a pregnant woman in the stomach and kills the fetus then there should be no charges for the act on the fetus???
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Bad argument. Are you a father? Not being a prick but with that logic if a man stabs or shoots a pregnant woman in the stomach and kills the fetus then there should be no charges for the act on the fetus???
And on the flip side, going by what you say, anyone who gets an abortion is guilty of murder.
Why not start arresting women who smoke or drink while pregnant, since that doesn't exactly help the "baby"? Where do you draw the line and who decides?
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And on the flip side, going by what you say, anyone who gets an abortion is guilty of murder.
I knew that one was coming. And I am for leglized abortion in the event of rape or if the fetus is extremely sickly or HIV/AIDS related. It is such a grey area that can be argued a 100 ways. My son-in-law's sister had a crack baby and I seen it shortly after she was born. I will never forget that site. I also served on a jury where the parents let their kid die because of their religous beliefs. So my view is a little warped. Here is the case I was a juror on:
http://www.rickross.com/reference/firstborn/firstborn27.html
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(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/06/27/article-2008603-0CBCC84E00000578-477_224x634.jpg)
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And on the flip side, going by what you say, anyone who gets an abortion is guilty of murder.
Why not start arresting women who smoke or drink while pregnant, since that doesn't exactly help the "baby"? Where do you draw the line and who decides?
Good counter point.
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I knew that one was coming. And I am for leglized abortion in the event of rape or if the fetus is extremely sickly or HIV/AIDS related. It is such a grey area that can be argued a 100 ways. My son-in-law's sister had a crack baby and I seen it shortly after she was born. I will never forget that site. I also served on a jury where the parents let their kid die because of their religous beliefs. So my view is a little warped. Here is the case I was a juror on:
http://www.rickross.com/reference/firstborn/firstborn27.html
Cool, like you say, it can be argued a hundred ways and in fact, has been done to death here before, pardon the pun. IMO, the woman who is carrying is basically playing host and her rights supercede that of her partner's and the fetus' WHILE she is pregnant.
That link you posted is sad. I'd say that couple was more stupid than malicious.
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This issue is a legal minefield- difficult to prove beyond doubt that cocaine killed the baby.If you can prove it was she will most likely plead diminished responsibility and manslaughter at best.
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Cool, like you say, it can be argued a hundred ways and in fact, has been done to death here before, pardon the pun.
That link you posted is sad. I'd say that couple was more stupid than malicious.
That trial pretty much screwed up the whole jury. I have kept in contact with a couple of them. The first day they send the picture of the dead blue baby around. I was in seat #1 and the defendants were right next to me. I looked over at them and gave them a look of hate. They knew they were already fucked! The couple ended up getting 1 year work release to be served alternately so they could be at home with their other 2 kids. What we (the jury) the jury was not told was the reason we had to keep taking breaks was so the mother on trial could breastfeed her newborn baby. I guess these assholes just recycle them like they are nothing.
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yawn....non-story. happens in the hood every day
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Not a child or even a baby but a fetus - HUGE difference.
Are you really that stupid? Wait..... :-\
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at 36 weeks, that child could survive outside the womb and probably without any help from machines, example.
She is 15, obviously should be held accountable for her actions but I'm not quite sold on murder charges, unless it can be directly linked to the stillborn. Obviously doing bumps while preggo isn't to bright.
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Are you really that stupid? Wait..... :-\
No, but your mom is, for not swallowing you ;D
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So the liberals on this forum do not follow the simplest logic.
Let me break it down NICE AND SLOW
IF
YOU
ABUSE
DRUGS
AND
YOU
ARE
CARRYING A CHILD, OF ANY LEVEL OF DEVELOPMENT
YOU
MUST
BE
HELD
ACCOUNTABLE
FOR
YOUR
ACTIONS
OTHERWISE
PEOPLE
WILL
DO
WHATEVER THE FUCK THEY WANT
AND HURT THE INNOCENT
I
CAN
NOT
MAKE
THAT
ANY
SIMPLER
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Mike, so what about women that have a few cigs or a few glasses of wine during pregnancy. We know it's not good for either but MANYYYYY women have had healthy babies while doing so.
So what if (yes not likely) she had a few toots and that was it during the pregnancy. Or a woman that has a glass of wine before she knew that she was pregnant or for arguments sake in the last month. Baby was born still born. What then
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Mike, so what about women that have a few cigs or a few glasses of wine during pregnancy. We know it's not good for either but MANYYYYY women have had healthy babies while doing so.
So what if (yes not likely) she had a few toots and that was it during the pregnancy. Or a woman that has a glass of wine before she knew that she was pregnant or for arguments sake in the last month. Baby was born still born. What then
Exactly. This girl was probably not doing an 8-ball a day. I have gotten more amped up on dietary supplements than coke. I dont agree with doing drugs while pregnant. Very selfish move but murder is going way overboard and I bet she will get out of it once the defense brings in doctors that say the toxicity levels were not high enough to kill.
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fukin coke whore slut at 15yrs of age
wtf is going on there
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at 36 weeks, that child could survive outside the womb and probably without any help from machines, example.
She is 15, obviously should be held accountable for her actions but I'm not quite sold on murder charges, unless it can be directly linked to the stillborn. Obviously doing bumps while preggo isn't to bright.
Obviously you're a pro, only users know that kind of lingo.
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Murder, no, but if they can prove beyond doubt that her coke-snorting killed the child, then I've no probs with the little bitch doing some time.
isn't murder and killing the child the same thing though? :-\
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Can't be murder unless she had intent, possibly manslaughter and I'm not even sure that is a good idea.
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Mike, so what about women that have a few cigs or a few glasses of wine during pregnancy. We know it's not good for either but MANYYYYY women have had healthy babies while doing so.
So what if (yes not likely) she had a few toots and that was it during the pregnancy. Or a woman that has a glass of wine before she knew that she was pregnant or for arguments sake in the last month. Baby was born still born. What then
Not one of the girls I have been friends with for years had even one drink or one cigarrette while pregnant. Sorry, I do not hang with fucking human scum.
If you are adult enough to say "i want to keep this baby" then you have a responsibility to yourself as well as your unborn child to do EVERYTHING in your power to ensure that childs safety and health while being brought into this shitty world.
The same line of irresponsible thinking you are displaying has led to a society where unwed mothers are popping out kids at 15 out of wedlock and snorting lines of cocaine again, at 15 years old, and not giving a shit.
How the FUCK can you, as a mother, defend this womans actions for even one fucking second? Stop obsessing over whether this is murder or manslaughter, and let's back up to the part where the mother IS FIFTEEN AND PREGNANT, AND WORSE YET SNORTING COCAINE.
The fuck is wrong with this country? You all need your priorities checked. I am sorry liberalism has worn you all down and robbed you of most of your morality, this country might not be worth saving or worrying about after all...
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Not one of the girls I have been friends with for years had even one drink or one cigarrette while pregnant. Sorry, I do not hang with fucking human scum.
If you are adult enough to say "i want to keep this baby" then you have a responsibility to yourself as well as your unborn child to do EVERYTHING in your power to ensure that childs safety and health while being brought into this shitty world.
The same line of irresponsible thinking you are displaying has led to a society where unwed mothers are popping out kids at 15 out of wedlock and snorting lines of cocaine again, at 15 years old, and not giving a shit.
How the FUCK can you, as a mother, defend this womans actions for even one fucking second? Stop obsessing over whether this is murder or manslaughter, and let's back up to the part where the mother IS FIFTEEN AND PREGNANT, AND WORSE YET SNORTING COCAINE.
The fuck is wrong with this country? You all need your priorities checked. I am sorry liberalism has worn you all down and robbed you of most of your morality, this country might not be worth saving or worrying about after all...
Where am I condoning or stating people I hang with it do smoke or drink? Teenagers have sex, DO I condone that NO, but it is what it is. Who am I to pass judgement on anyone. I don't nor will.
I honestly, until it correlates to the the stillborn birth. If they can correlate her abuse to the stillborn, then yes that is murder because that fetus can survive outside the womb on its own at 36 weeks
I'd venture to think she had no or very limited prenatel care, THEY would catch that cocaine in a second.
Obviously you're a pro, only users know that kind of lingo.
really, bumps, scoops and lines was quite the lingo or used to be in the nj/nyc area in early 2000's
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Well this English celebrity whore called jordan used coke, drank lots during pregnancy and look how her child turned out
Blind, spastic, obese and another thing which I wont mention or il be banned again
If the stupid little bastard wasnt so funny to look at she should be charged with endangering his life during pregnancy
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I know a girl I went to hs with. 5 healthy kids and one with down syndrome, she didn't drink or do anything.
I'm not saying women should do these things, OF COURSE they Shouldn't. If you can't stop partying, their are other options.
As soon as I found out I was preggo, stopped smoking that instant. Didn't pick it up till after I was done breastfeeding.
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Downs are different, thats an extra chromasome, nothing the mother can do
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Well this English celebrity whore called jordan used coke, drank lots during pregnancy and look how her child turned out
Blind, spastic, obese and another thing which I wont mention or il be banned again
If the stupid little bastard wasnt so funny to look at she should be charged with endangering his life during pregnancy
Hahaha, classy bitch! the kid looks like beetlejuice's from howard stern
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Always liked this one. ;D
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Religion of Peace....oh wait this is in the USA!
"
Outcry in America as pregnant women who lose babies face murder charges
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion
(http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2011/6/24/1308936562019/Fetus-US-criminals-007.jpg)
Rennie Gibbs is accused of murder, but the crime she is alleged to have committed does not sound like an ordinary killing. Yet she faces life in prison in Mississippi over the death of her unborn child.
Gibbs became pregnant aged 15, but lost the baby in December 2006 in a stillbirth when she was 36 weeks into the pregnancy. When prosecutors discovered that she had a cocaine habit – though there is no evidence that drug abuse had anything to do with the baby's death – they charged her with the "depraved-heart murder" of her child, which carries a mandatory life sentence.
Gibbs is the first woman in Mississippi to be charged with murder relating to the loss of her unborn baby. But her case is by no means isolated. Across the US more and more prosecutions are being brought that seek to turn pregnant women into criminals.
"Women are being stripped of their constitutional personhood and subjected to truly cruel laws," said Lynn Paltrow of the campaign National Advocates for Pregnant Women (NAPW). "It's turning pregnant women into a different class of person and removing them of their rights."
Bei Bei Shuai, 34, has spent the past three months in a prison cell in Indianapolis charged with murdering her baby. On 23 December she tried to commit suicide by taking rat poison after her boyfriend abandoned her.
Shuai was rushed to hospital and survived, but she was 33 weeks pregnant and her baby, to whom she gave birth a week after the suicide attempt and whom she called Angel, died after four days. In March Shuai was charged with murder and attempted foeticide and she has been in custody since without the offer of bail.
In Alabama at least 40 cases have been brought under the state's "chemical endangerment" law. Introduced in 2006, the statute was designed to protect children whose parents were cooking methamphetamine in the home and thus putting their children at risk from inhaling the fumes.
Amanda Kimbrough is one of the women who have been ensnared as a result of the law being applied in a wholly different way. During her pregnancy her foetus was diagnosed with possible Down's syndrome and doctors suggested she consider a termination, which Kimbrough declined as she is not in favour of abortion.
The baby was delivered by caesarean section prematurely in April 2008 and died 19 minutes after birth.
Six months later Kimbrough was arrested at home and charged with "chemical endangerment" of her unborn child on the grounds that she had taken drugs during the pregnancy – a claim she has denied.
"That shocked me, it really did," Kimbrough said. "I had lost a child, that was enough."
She now awaits an appeal ruling from the higher courts in Alabama, which if she loses will see her begin a 10-year sentence behind bars. "I'm just living one day at a time, looking after my three other kids," she said. "They say I'm a criminal, how do I answer that? I'm a good mother."
Women's rights campaigners see the creeping criminalisation of pregnant women as a new front in the culture wars over abortion, in which conservative prosecutors are chipping away at hard-won freedoms by stretching protection laws to include foetuses, in some cases from the day of conception. In Gibbs' case defence lawyers have argued before Mississippi's highest court that her prosecution makes no sense. Under Mississippi law it is a crime for any person except the mother to try to cause an abortion.
"If it's not a crime for a mother to intentionally end her pregnancy, how can it be a crime for her to do it unintentionally, whether by taking drugs or smoking or whatever it is," Robert McDuff, a civil rights lawyer asked the state supreme court.
McDuff told the Guardian that he hoped the Gibbs prosecution was an isolated example. "I hope it's not a trend that's going to catch on. To charge a woman with murder because of something she did during pregnancy is really unprecedented and quite extreme."
He pointed out that anti-abortion groups were trying to amend the Mississippi constitution by setting up a state referendum, or ballot initiative, that would widen the definition of a person under the state's bill of rights to include a foetus from the day of conception.
Some 70 organisations across America have come together to file testimonies, known as amicus briefs, in support of Gibbs that protest against her treatment on several levels. One says that to treat "as a murderer a girl who has experienced a stillbirth serves only to increase her suffering".
Another, from a group of psychologists, laments the misunderstanding of addiction that lies behind the indictment. Gibbs did not take cocaine because she had a "depraved heart" or to "harm the foetus but to satisfy an acute psychological and physical need for that particular substance", says the brief.
Perhaps the most persuasive argument put forward in the amicus briefs is that if such prosecutions were designed to protect the unborn child, then they would be utterly counter-productive: "Prosecuting women and girls for continuing [a pregnancy] to term despite a drug addiction encourages them to terminate wanted pregnancies to avoid criminal penalties. The state could not have intended this result when it adopted the homicide statute."
Paltrow sees what is happening to Gibbs as a small taste of what would be unleashed were the constitutional right to an abortion ever overturned. "In Mississippi the use of the murder statute is creating a whole new legal standard that makes women accountable for the outcome of their pregnancies and threatens them with life imprisonment for murder."
Miscarriage of justice
At least 38 of the 50 states across America have introduced foetal homicide laws that were intended to protect pregnant women and their unborn children from violent attacks by third parties – usually abusive male partners – but are increasingly being turned by renegade prosecutors against the women themselves.
South Carolina was one of the first states to introduce such a foetal homicide law. National Advocates for Pregnant Women has found only one case of a South Carolina man who assaulted a pregnant woman having been charged under its terms, and his conviction was eventually overturned. Yet the group estimates there have been up to 300 women arrested for their actions during pregnancy.
In other states laws designed to protect children against the damaging effects of drugs have similarly been twisted to punish childbearers."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jun/24/america-pregnant-women-murder-charges
OMG that is disgusting! The baby wasn't even real yet, disgusting to charge this living human being with murder, what bullshit, can't believe it, sounds like conservatism at work.
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that was a child IMO. 36 weeks can live outside the womb without any assistance. It will be hard for murder if there is no link between the coke and still birth of child.
Again not condoning what she did, she should pay but on what charges time will tell
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theres 300 million americans
fucking rabbits
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at the point in which you decide to keep the child, you should do everything in your power to make sure that child is taken care of while you have complete control.
like someone mentioned murder is generally with intent or in the process of committing another crime.
i think if she does get convicted and if there is a connection she sure as shit should as an adult it will be for manslaughter.
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at the point in which you decide to keep the child, you should do everything in your power to make sure that child is taken care of while you have complete control.
like someone mentioned murder is generally with intent or in the process of committing another crime.
i think if she does get convicted and if there is a connection she sure as shit should as an adult it will be for manslaughter.
Until you make the decision to keep it or abort it or adoption. Just stay healthy until that decision is made.
Yes, I agree, tried as an adult
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Until you make the decision to keep it or abort it or adoption. Just stay healthy until that decision is made.
Yes, I agree, tried as an adult
Agreed, this way you can at least have the decency to abort a healthy baby.
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Agreed, this way you can at least have the decency to abort a healthy baby.
or if you end up keeping it, you havent harmed it...::)
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Agreed, this way you can at least have the decency to abort a healthy baby.
well, I'm pro choice so if my posts offend anyone, well I won't apologize.
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Next thing you know congress will pass a law that your baby will need to be tested to see if it's healthy enuff to be aborted. ::)
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so, their are documented cases of not knowing their preggo for 9 whole months, (I can't fathom that, but ok). So if she didn't know, drank and smoked cigs, both legal and baby was born still born, then what (this is just for argument sake).
Yes, their is a difference between knowing and not knowing.
Here's another scenerio. A woman drinks the first 2 months of pregnancy but fetus is born with fetal alcholol syndrome, what should be done.
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so, their are documented cases of not knowing their preggo for 9 whole months, (I can't fathom that, but ok). So if she didn't know, drank and smoked cigs, both legal and baby was born still born, then what (this is just for argument sake).
Yes, their is a difference between knowing and not knowing.
Here's another scenerio. A woman drinks the first 2 months of pregnancy but fetus is born with fetal alcholol syndrome, what should be done.
Hey as long as you can kill healthy fully deveoped babies thru a process called abortion then so what if these other things occur and for the record I'm not pro anything.
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Hey as long as you can kill healthy fully deveoped babies thru a process called abortion then so what if these other things occur and for the record I'm not pro anything.
That's different. I will clarify. I personally am not a fan of killing anything that can live outside the womb on it's own. I think the 12 week cutoff point is what should be allowed for terminating a pregnancy. I never stated nor think I eluded the point she should of terminated the pregnancy at 36 weeks.
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this left wingers are getting worse. they are basically saying that it was alright for the mother to snort coke during her pregnancy...well its not alright. she should get something for it. not sure if a life sentence fits the crime but she should get something
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Not a child or even a baby but a fetus - HUGE difference.
The one with 3 kids is Kimbrough, not the 15 year old Gibbs referenced in the beginning of the article.
Actually at 24 wks. it can survive outside the womb so technically it IS a baby
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Actually at 24 wks. it can survive outside the womb so technically it IS a baby
dude it is a baby when it is born period, they should allow women who are pregnant to abort 24 hours before if they have regret. Don't want another welfare baby or unwanted kid in this world, and besides the thing getting aborted wouldn't feel a thing.
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Why stop there?
If during the actual birth the mother changes her mind, she should be able to strangle the baby with piano wire that is provided by one of the nurses in the OR.
Women should have the right to smoke, drink and use drugs up until the moment that the baby starts to exit the birth canal ( or when the doctor first slices open mom if there is a C section).
Partial birth abortion is also a fine idea.
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Why stop there?
If during the actual birth the mother changes her mind, she should be able to strangle the baby with piano wire that is provided by one of the nurses in the OR.
Women should have the right to smoke, drink and use drugs up until the moment that the baby starts to exit the birth canal ( or when the doctor first slices open mom if there is a C section).
Partial birth abortion is also a fine idea.
I would stop there because 24 hours seems reasonable. Women have the right to do whatever they want with their bodies while they are pregnant, if they plan to abort the kid, who cares, and if they have it, they will feel guilty for what they did if the kid ends up fucked up.
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I recently got a fat chick pregnant.
All I can say is thank god for the uk's relaxed abortion laws.
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Next you will be charged if you don't take a prenatal vitamin?
How about if your kid dies from a disease when you didn't vaccinate them (as people do now because of religious beliefs)?
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Negligent homicide at the very least.
This is disgusting.
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No one in this thread goes far enough. There should be state sanctioned stomach stompings for all pregnant women that don't want to give birth regardless of age or how far along the pregnancy is.
Unborn children don't deserve rights. Only animals, rivers and inanimate objects like trees should be protected.
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No one in this thread goes far enough. There should be state sanctioned stomach stompings for all pregnant women that don't want to give birth regardless of age or how far along the pregnancy is.
Unborn children don't deserve rights. Only animals, rivers and inanimate objects like trees should be protected.
Well done.