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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Soul Crusher on July 07, 2011, 03:30:17 PM
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Six months after the shooting in Tucson that killed six people and wounded Rep. Gabrielle Giffords, D-Ariz., the Obama administration has yet to move on new gun control legislation.
That could change soon.
White House spokesman Jay Carney said a special task force has been "working through these complex issues, and we expect to have some more specific announcements in the near future."
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"The president directed the attorney general to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common-sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting Second Amendment rights," Carney said.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/20...
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Now that's funny, they are going to preach to the law abiding citizen about common sense? Where was this common sense when they thought operation fast and furious/gun runner was being proposed. They must think we are all mushrooms, keep us in the dark and feed us shit ::)
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http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/2011/07/obama-aide-gun-legislation-in-near-future/1?csp=34news
Bring it on Zero - Midterms in 2010 will be nothing compared to the destruction you and your communist traitor ilk face in 2012.
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240?
240?
240?
240?
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I'm sure he'll be along shortly to inform us that this is for our own good ::)
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I'm putting this out here 100 percent.
If the White house makes any announcements about taking away my rights to own firearms... I absolutely PROMISE to vote for WHOEVER the Republican nomination is.
I don't give a goddam how stupid they may be.
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240 said Obama would NEVER try to touch the 2nd amendment.
Fail #859789759 from Getbig's Nostradamus.
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When he first got elected, I didn't think he would either, however, recently I've changed my stance.
I think he is certainly trying to make a push for eroding 2nd amendment rights and of all of the rights we have, I find that one the most important to be honest.
If need be, you should always be able to take up arms against oppression and the 2nd amendment lets us do that.
If Obama really does try to mess with it, I will not help to re-elect him... guaranteed.
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Ever since the gunwalker shit started coming out I, like 333, hypothesized that this entire endeavor was conducted to go after the 2nd amendment and everything I've seen since then only makes it look more like that's the case.
The typical douche bags on CNN were throwing around the need for the AWB because of the "flow of weapons" last week....all while not mentioning Gunwalker a SINGLE time.
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Ever since the gunwalker shit started coming out I, like 333, hypothesized that this entire endeavor was conducted to go after the 2nd amendment and everything I've seen since then only makes it look more like that's the case.
The typical douche bags on CNN were throwing around the need for the AWB because of the "flow of weapons" last week....all while not mentioning Gunwalker a SINGLE time.
It is disgusting.
We are in agreement... When I first heard about gunwalker, I too was worried... and the more things are revealed, the worse it looks.
I think it's grounds for treason.
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Now its expanding to hondurus!
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Yeah - where is vince - straw - blackass - benny - mal - 240 - etc to defend this crap?
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show me the legislation.
this is nothing more than floating an idea to gauge public response.
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Normal dudes like Tu now see this guy for what he is....240 look at his record. He has never ever ever stood for 2nd Amendment rights. A special task force..... Hey douchebag constitutional scholar dude....we have the founding fathers, there's your fucking task force. They wrote this thing called the Constitution...now praise god and pass the 5.56.
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I'm reposting because 240 doesn't get facts. This is your Presidents' history on guns. Its a big quacking duck dude...forget it. If u want examples of unarmed populaces look at Nazi Germany...u want to attend Obama rallies with burning torches, drive a friggen matchbox electric car and work for a "fair" wage under his lordship be my guest. I'll be in the woods wrapped in my don't tread on me flag with the other gun nuts plotting his overthrow.
1) In 1996, then Illinois state Senator Obama answered a gun control questionnaire. He wrote that he supported a complete ban on the manufacture, sale, and possession of handguns and “assault weapons,” and also supported mandatory waiting periods and background checks. During the 2008 campaign, candidate Obama denied ever filling out the questionnaire, despite the fact that it was completed in his handwriting. FactCheck.org confirmed that he had, in fact, filled out the questionnaire. [source A]
(2) In 1998, Mr. Obama expressed his support for a complete ban on the sale or transfer of all semi-automatic firearms. He supported increasing state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms — this in Illinois, one of the only two states that to this day bans concealed carry. [source A]
(3) The 1998 Joyce Foundation annual report revealed that Mr. Obama was a member of its board of directors. The Joyce Foundation is one of the largest sources of funding for anti-gun groups and for anti-gun “research.” [source 7]
(4) In 1999, the Chicago Defender reported that Mr. Obama wanted to ban the resale of police issued firearms, even for the purpose of buying new equipment. [source 4]
(5) In 1999, Mr. Obama endorsed a 500% increase in the federal excise tax on firearms and ammunition. This was obviously intended to increase the price of gun ownership so drastically as to make it unaffordable for most Americans. [source 4]
(6) In 1999, Mr. Obama supported a proposal to ban gun stores within five miles of a school or park. This was a reasonable sounding scheme that would have had the effect of banning nearly every gun store in America. [source 8]
(7) In 1999, the Chicago Defender also reported that Mr. Obama favored mandatory firearm training for all gun owners and a ban on gun ownership for everyone under 21. [source 4]
( In 2000, Mr. Obama cosponsored a bill that limited firearm purchases to one per month. The bill failed. He also voted against allowing citizens to violate local weapon bans where self-defense was involved. [source A]
(9) In 2004, Mr. Obama voted for an Illinois Senate bill that allowed retired law enforcement officers to carry concealed weapons. While this might seem to be at odds with every political stance he had taken on the issue, it was later revealed that at the time he was fighting his Republican opponent for the endorsement of the Fraternal Order of Police. His support for the bill was almost certainly cynical political pandering rather than an indication of any appreciation for police officers or for the rights of gun owners. [source A]
(10) In a 2004 Illinois Senate debate with Alan Keyes, Mr. Obama said: “I think it is a scandal that this president [Bush] did not authorize a renewal of the assault weapons ban.” [source A]
(11) In 2005, Mr. Obama voted in the U.S. Senate to ban nearly all rifle ammunition in common civilian use. [source 3]
(12) Mr. Obama opposes four of the five Supreme Court justices who affirmed an individual right to keep and bear arms. He said he would not have voted for Scalia or Thomas and voted against the confirmation of Alito and Chief Justice Roberts. [source 1]
(13) Mr. Obama voted to allow lawsuits against firearm manufacturers for the acts of third parties beyond their knowledge or control. Such suits were designed to destroy the domestic firearms industry. [source 2]
(14) Mr. Obama has consistently opposed right to carry laws. [source 6]
(14) A 2007 report revealed that Mr. Obama supported a ban on standard capacity magazines. [source 9]
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-future-of-obamas-stealth-gun-control/2/
(15) A 2008 report revealed that Mr. Obama was in favor of mandatory micro-stamping, a scheme which would significantly increase the cost of new firearms while simultaneously establishing a massive registry. Despite uniform scientific evidence that the scheme does not and cannot work, efforts to impose it continue today. [source 10]
(16) In 2008, ABC News reported Mr. Obama’s support for gun bans in major cities including Chicago and Washington, D.C. [source 5]
(17) Mr. Obama’s 2008 campaign website indicated his support for the repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment, which prohibits information on gun traces collected by the ATF from being used in nuisance lawsuits against firearm dealers and manufacturers. This too is a battle anti-gun forces continue to fight. [source 11]
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240 = Obama c0cksucker. You'll have to forgive him as he gets a little tipsy taking four to five loads off the face every day.
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HH,
what legislation has obama approved SINCE TAKING OFFICE to hinder our gun rights?
Cause he rep'd shitbag ILL and chicago, a bastion of anti-gun prickery.
i live in FL. What has he done to steal my gun rights since Jan 20, 2009? Anything?
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HH,
what legislation has obama approved SINCE TAKING OFFICE to hinder our gun rights?
Cause he rep'd shitbag ILL and chicago, a bastion of anti-gun prickery.
i live in FL. What has he done to steal my gun rights since Jan 20, 2009? Anything?
So you will wait for him to do it?
Honestly dude... come on... You have to see that this is a design.
When the administration DOES finally start talking about reducing gun rights, will you admit that we were snowed (me included) finally?
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HH,
what legislation has obama approved SINCE TAKING OFFICE to hinder our gun rights?
Cause he rep'd shitbag ILL and chicago, a bastion of anti-gun prickery.
i live in FL. What has he done to steal my gun rights since Jan 20, 2009? Anything?
Dude, wake the fuck up, when he was running for POTUS the chicago hand gun ban case was being heard in the SCOTUS. Obama would not take a position on it when asked. He is as anti-gun as they comes. Besides why would anyone in their right mind move from Hawaii to Illinois?
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lol so will i wait for him to do it?
yes, IF he signs gun control legislation into law, I will happily admit I was wrong.
So far, though, if you compare their FIRST TERMS - Bush allowed brady bill for 90% of his term, and Obama enacted any kind of AWB or BB for just about 75% of his already.
So yes, I see this as nothing more than testing the waters and giving the anti-gun pricks a reason to donate ;) Oh, you do know that obama is shaking the far-left dem trees this month, right? 2 mil in philly in one night? lol! The far left suckers are buying into it.
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Shame on you.
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Obama to unveil new Gun Control Measures
thetruthaboutguns ^ | 7/7/11 | Farago
Posted on July 8, 2011 4:48:57 PM EDT by pabianice
“Half a year after the shooting of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-Ariz.), the Obama administration is set to release a series of reforms to the current gun law, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said on Thursday.” The Huffington Post may not be rubbing its hands in glee, but they’re not offering any analysis of this move, either. Here’s the short version: Barak Obama has lost his base. Or his mind. Or both . . .
Alienating pro-gun independents in a fruitless effort to end-run Congress on gun control (the edicts will supposedly take the form of executive orders) may please the far left, but it’s nearasdammit political suicide. Wait. Hear that? Cha-ching! That’s the sound of the NRA cash register struggling to process tens of millions of dollars in contributions as its members hit the hustings.
Here’s the official WH announcement:
“The president directed the Attorney General to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting Second Amendment rights,” Carney said at Thursday’s briefing. “That process is well underway at the Department of Justice with stakeholders on all sides working through these complex issues and we expect to have more specific announcements in the near future.”
The Department of Justice? Carney’s kidding, right? The same federal agency that stands accused of conducting a major and ongoing cover-up of a gun-related program gone horribly wrong (the ATF’s literally fatal Gunwalker misegos) is going to draft regulations to control firearms sales? That’s insane.
As for “all stakeholders” having their say on these new regs, wrong. The gun rights side of the “debate” didn’t get a look in. The NRA boycotted the White House “gun summit” and Obama officials never responded to TTAG’s request for a seat at the table. (Can you believe it?)
The HuffPo reckons All the President’s Men will nibble The HuffPo reckons All the President’s Men will nibble away at existing laws rather than jump off the cliff marked “renew the assault weapons ban.”
The end result, one source close to the discussions said, was a package of reforms “not huge in scope.” They are largely expected to mirror the topics covered in the president’s op-ed. Gun control advocates have pushed for more, including legislation that would limit the size of magazines — such as the 32-round clip that Giffords’ shooter used — or a bill that would force private sellers to conduct background checks at gun shows — which may have prevented the Virginia Tech shooter from obtaining his firearms.
Maybe. Actually not. Mr. Cho bought his firearms at a gun dealer. (I guess the HuffPo’s Internet connection was down at the time of writing.)
All this—what this is—will occur “in the near future.” In other words, probably not at all. Any attempt to limit magazine capacity with a federal fiat will enrage, alienate and energize the President’s generally sleepy pro-gun followers. And not in a good way.
If this is a trial balloon, it’s holier than Benedetto XVI.
TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; Click to Add Topic
KEYWORDS: banglist; batfe; guncontrol; obama; Click to Add Keyword
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1 posted on July 8, 2011 4:48:58 PM EDT by pabianice
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To: pabianice
The “gun show loophole” fix is pure registration. It is nothing less than the requirement that every gun transfer be conducted through a dealer.
Get it throught the house Obamao,, i wanna see you try.
2 posted on July 8, 2011 4:54:34 PM EDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office)
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To: pabianice
Here’s the short version: Barak Obama has lost his base. Or his mind. Or both . . .
Hussein never had much of a mind to loose in the first place. His filthy socialist left will never leave him. They will bitch a lot but vote for him.
3 posted on July 8, 2011 4:55:55 PM EDT by blasater1960 (Deut 30, Psalm 111...the Torah and the Law, is attainable past, present and forever.)
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To: blasater1960
“Here’s the short version: Barak Obama has lost his base. Or his mind. Or both . . . “
You can’t lose what you don’t have.
4 posted on July 8, 2011 4:58:29 PM EDT by WKUHilltopper (And yet...we continue to tolerate this crap...)
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To: DesertRhino
He is already trying to make all interstate transactions FFL to FFL by having the ATF lean heavily on dealers to not accept guns from non-FF holders. It is pure intimidation by the BATF
5 posted on July 8, 2011 5:00:02 PM EDT by BobinIL
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To: DesertRhino
Get it throught the house Obamao,, i wanna see you try.
der 0berFuhrer Hussein 0bama will merely issue a decree and along with his legion of corrupt judges, Holder and the criminals at ATF, it will be enforced as law. He don't need no stinkin' House of Representatives.
6 posted on July 8, 2011 5:03:53 PM EDT by The Sons of Liberty (Psalm 109:8 Let his days be few and let another take his office. - Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin)
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To: pabianice
They are all collectively thinking "What the hell is he saying?"
7 posted on July 8, 2011 5:06:57 PM EDT by b4its2late ("Pray for Obama. Psalm 109:8")
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To: pabianice
Obama to unveil new Gun Control Measures
I agree. Something has to be done about the Oboma administration shipping arms to the worlds criminal drug dealers.
Oh wait. He's taking about taking rights away from us average American citizens again, isn't he? He's only going to allow criminal foreign drug dealers to be publicly funded and armed, right?
I feel safer already - NOT !!!!
8 posted on July 8, 2011 5:09:37 PM EDT by concerned about politics ("Get thee behind me, Liberal")
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To: The Sons of Liberty
Exactly. That’s the country we’re living in right now. No such thing as the Constitution, law enforcement, separation of powers, or checks and balances. Money by fiat. Rule by fiat. That’s where we’re at.
9 posted on July 8, 2011 5:10:05 PM EDT by butterdezillion
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To: pabianice
...Obama administration is set to release a series of reforms to the current gun law....
And he gets this legislative power how, exactly? He just appropriates it?
I can´t believe the slew of cowards we elected to the House. Elections matter, eh? Like hell.
10 posted on July 8, 2011 5:11:32 PM EDT by onedoug (If)
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To: pabianice
measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting Second Amendment rights,
Like the ATF not forcing dealers to sell guns to people they suspect are criminals? That would be a step in the right direction.
11 posted on July 8, 2011 5:11:46 PM EDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: butterdezillion
In other words, we are closer to a revolution then a few years ago.
12 posted on July 8, 2011 5:12:50 PM EDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: All
Here’s another story on this:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/obama-expected-boost-gun-safety-executiv
13 posted on July 8, 2011 5:14:17 PM EDT by Sun (Pray that God sends us good leaders. Please say a prayer now.)
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To: pabianice
But since now the “fast and furious” scandal has broken out, this will blow things up to sky high.
14 posted on July 8, 2011 5:14:21 PM EDT by Biggirl ("Jesus talked to us as individuals"-Jim Vicevich/Thanks JimV!)
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To: onedoug
Obama administration is set to release a series of reforms to the current gun law....
The "president" (or current commie dictator) can't write law. Congress has to write the laws.
15 posted on July 8, 2011 5:15:11 PM EDT by concerned about politics ("Get thee behind me, Liberal")
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To: pabianice
Forgetting the 2nd Amendment for just a moment, under what authority can the President unilaterally ban magazines over a certain capacity? Doesn't there have to be, you know, an actual BILL passed by Congress that he then signs before this (abomination) becomes law of the land?
Now, of course, I don't propose to forget the rights protected by the 2nd Amendment - such bans are outright restrictions on the right to keep and bear arms. Such an Executive Order or regulations would wind up in court very quickly, and there'd be a Temporary Restraining Order slapped on to prevent enforcement until the courts could get a look.
Oh, and let's say that all of this passes muster - how is this enforced? We all know the answer...someone goes to jail. Now, who would that be? Mainly middle class and upper middle class people, the backbone of the economy. Go to jail on what is likely to be a federal felony charge, and you can NEVER hold a federal job, work as a federal contractor, get a security clearance or a bond, etc. - i.e. your future economic prospects are significantly dampened. This is, in addition to being an outright assault (pun intended) on our rights, but also an attack on the economic prospects of those likely to oppose Obama and the Dems (oh, and let's not forget that you'd lose your right to vote in most states).
FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO. FUBO.
16 posted on July 8, 2011 5:20:25 PM EDT by Ancesthntr (Bibi to Odumbo: Its not going to happen.)
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To: onedoug
Sounds like a personal problem to me.
I am actually pretty satisfied with my representative, Blackburn.
Or as Tonto said when he and the Lone Ranger were surrounded by Indians, “What do you mean WE white man?”
17 posted on July 8, 2011 5:20:41 PM EDT by fireforeffect (A kind word and a 2x4, gets you more than just a kind word.)
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To: pabianice
“Gun control advocates have pushed for more, including legislation that would limit the size of magazines — such as the 32-round clip that Giffords’ shooter used—”
keep wondering if Giffords’ shooter’s gun was one of the ones that ‘walked’
18 posted on July 8, 2011 5:24:47 PM EDT by famousdayandyear
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To: fireforeffect
And what exactly is Blackburn doing to light a fire under the rest of the bums?
19 posted on July 8, 2011 5:24:56 PM EDT by onedoug (If)
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To: pabianice
It was a 33 round magazine, not a clip and not 32 rounds, but who’s counting?
Glad I bought some before they get outlawed.
20 posted on July 8, 2011 5:27:26 PM EDT by Clint N. Suhks (Liz Cheney/Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: The Sons of Liberty
This regime is already operating outside the boundaries set by the Constitution and the rule of law. From their point of view: why stop now?
We’ve already said “NO!” to 0bamacare - the monsters final solution for the young and the old.
We’ve already said “NO!” to bailouts, tax increases and the further confiscatio nof what belongs to us.
We’re at the point where the only “NO!” they’ll understand will be the one coming at them at muzzle velocity.
21 posted on July 8, 2011 5:30:33 PM EDT by Noumenon ("One man with courage is a majority." - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: pabianice; Biggirl
He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:
For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:
For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.
22 posted on July 8, 2011 5:33:44 PM EDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: pabianice
Time to get that shitty former NFL football washout Ray Schoenke off the floor of whatever bar he's currently sleeping in and parade him and his phony 'American Hunters and Shooters Association (AHSA)' around like the Obama campaign did in 2008 to fool gun owners into thinking Obama wasn't going to take their guns and bibles away.
"Hi! I'm former Washington Redskin Ray Schoenke, and if you're an outdoorsman like me, I want to talk with you a moment about Barack Obama!"
Nobody but a handful of ex-BATFE agents were executives in that phony organization, and there was never any membership numbers produced.
It wasn't even a few months after the 2008 elections ended that the 'AHSA' website went offline permanently and the domain name 'www.huntersandshooters.o rg' is now being parked at one of those fly-by-night website hosting services that buys up old expired Internet top-level DNS names.
See for yourself:
http://www.huntersandshooters.org/
23 posted on July 8, 2011 5:36:18 PM EDT by The KG9 Kid
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To: DTogo
GREAT pic!!!! VERY appropriate. I’m a major LOTR fan.
24 posted on July 8, 2011 5:43:09 PM EDT by Wonder Warthog
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To: DesertRhino
I bet he’s thinking he can bypass Congress. Again.
25 posted on July 8, 2011 5:46:13 PM EDT by Little Ray (Best Conservative in the Primary; AGAINST Obama in the General.)
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To: DesertRhino
Exactamundo! As I posted on another thread on this suject:
Let’s Translate the Bovine excrement and gains some insights on what the National Socialist Democrats have in store for US:
Quoting Obama: “
Most gun owners know that the word ‘commonsense’ isn't a code word for ‘confiscation,”
Translation: This is just a step toward my ultimate goal of confiscation, but I’m trying to sucker punch your sense of logic with a falsehood that is 180 degrees out of phase with my true intentions.
Quoting the National Socialists some more:
If it does, perhaps a look at the president's op-ed issued the day before Carney's remarks will offer insight as to what kind. “The National Instant Criminal Background Check System is the filter that's supposed to stop the wrong people from getting their hands on a gun. Bipartisan legislation four years ago was supposed to strengthen this system, but it hasn't been properly implemented,” he noted.
[Isn’t it nice of them to telegraph their true intentions? But how do they define ‘stop the wrong people’?]
Translation: We can’t implement our ultimate goal of grabbing your guns without a couple of intermediate steps, namely having Feral Government oversight on every gun transfer. Therefore we’re going to pretend to protect your rights while we incrementally take them away.
Having governmental control of how you buy and sell private property will get you used to the idea of getting our permission in owning a gun and it will facilitate grabbing them later on after we rescind that permission (Registration).
26 posted on July 8, 2011 6:01:52 PM EDT by Voice of Reason88 ( Freedom is never lost all at once - Edmund Burke)
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To: Wonder Warthog
The parallels are becoming uncanny. As previosuly posted, 2012 is coming down to will the GOP candidate have the courage and fortitude to cast the "One Ring" into the fire of the Constitution, or be seduced by it's power yet again?
Or will We the People be required to march on and destroy Mordor-on-the-Potomac?
27 posted on July 8, 2011 6:02:30 PM EDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: pabianice
28 posted on July 8, 2011 6:07:18 PM EDT by Dick Bachert (The 2012 election is coming. Seems we have MORE TRASH TO REMOVE!)
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To: pabianice
BTW USA today has similar article (Curious they're all coming out right now..)
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2011-07-08-obama-gun-control-safety-giffords_n.htm
Note the passage:
Whatever is proposed is not expected to involve legislation or take on major issues like banning assault weapons but could include executive action to strengthen the background check system or other steps.
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Oh no 240 barry's the greatest ever!
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Obama expected to take 'executive action' on 'gun safety'
GOPUSA.com ^ | July 8, 2011 | Erica Werne
Posted on July 8, 2011 8:20:10 PM EDT by Iam1ru1-2
WASHINGTON (AP) - Six months after Rep. Gabrielle Giffords was shot, the White House is preparing to propose some new steps on gun safety, though they're likely to fall short of the bold measures activists would like to see.
Spokesman Jay Carney said that the new steps would be made public "in the near future." He didn't offer details, but people involved in talks at the Justice Department to craft the new measures said they expected to see something in the next several weeks. Whatever is proposed is not expected to involve legislation or take on major issues, like banning assault weapons, but could include executive action to strengthen the background check system or other steps.
"The president directed the attorney general to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common-sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting Second Amendment rights," Carney said Thursday. "That process is well under way at the Department of Justice, with stakeholders on all sides working through these complex issues, and we expect to have some more specific announcements in the near future."
Anti-gun groups have been disappointed to see no action so far from President Barack Obama, who supported tough gun control measures earlier in his career but fell largely silent upon becoming president. Some activists were using the opportunity of the six-month anniversary of the Giffords shooting on Friday to speak up.
The shooting rampage in Tucson, Ariz., killed six people and wounded more than a dozen others, including Giffords. Two months later, Obama wrote an opinion piece in Giffords' local paper, the Arizona Daily Star, calling for "sound and effective steps" to keep guns out of the hands of criminals, including strengthening background checks. So far the president has done nothing and administration officials have signaled that no major steps should be expected, given the climate in Congress against gun legislation of any kind.
That's not stopping activists from pushing Obama. The group Mayors Against Illegal Guns, headed by Boston Mayor Thomas Menino and New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, sent Obama a letter calling him to act.
"To prevent the next Tucson, we need a comprehensive background check system, which is what the president called for in April," said the director of the mayors' group, Mark Glaze. "That said, there are many steps the president can take on his own authority, without new laws, that could make a very real difference."
The group's suggestions included enforcing reporting laws that could have stopped the Tucson shooter from getting a weapon.
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Government
Obama Executive Orders Impose New Gun Rules
Posted on July 12, 2011 at 6:51am by Buck Sexton
The Blaze reported on the low-key plans of the Obama administration to increase the penalties for certain gun law violations, and add steps to the background checks for legal gun ownership.
Today the administration’s plans are beginning to come into effect. Through an Executive Order, the Obama administration is implementing new restrictions on the sale of certain weapons in border states, and increasing the penalties for violating certain firearms laws.
Fox News is reporting on the purpose of the gun control executive orders:
“In an effort to stem the illicit flow of weapons into Mexico, the Justice Department announced Monday that all gun shops in four Southwest border states will be required to alert the federal government to frequent buyers of high-powered rifles.
Under the new policy, federal firearms licensees in Texas, California, Arizona and New Mexico must report purchases of two or more of some types of rifles by the same person in a five-day span. The requirement applies to purchases of semi-automatic rifles that have detachable magazines and a caliber of greater than .22.
ATF estimates it will generate 18,000 reports a year. ATF will retain the information and if no investigative leads have been realized after two years, it will be purged.”
The Daily Beast seems to have the inside track on more Executive Orders, however, claiming recent conversations with administration officials. TDB says the upcoming Executive Orders will have more impact than what Fox outlines above, including:
“A national electronic system designed to make background checks for handgun buyers simpler and faster, leaving an electronic paper trail. [And] Tougher sentencing guidelines for straw buyers that Holder’s department pushed through procedural hoops at the U.S. Sentencing Commission earlier this year.”
The Executive Orders come in the middle of the “Fast and Furious” scandal currently plaguing the administration. Already, there is talk on Capitol Hill of a cover-up at the highest levels of government, and it appears to some that the administration was feeding the lethal problem of firearms trafficking it ostensibly intended to address with “Fast and Furious.”
The question remains- if these Executive Orders are ‘common sense’ measures as the administration claims, why not let Congress enact them as laws? And if they are minor tweaks to existing law as others claim, are they necessary at all?
As background, here is a short clip of then-candidate Obama in 2008 on gun control. He agrees that the second amendment means…something, but beyond that, the details get hazy.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/obama-executive-orders-impose-new-gun-rules
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Hmmmm sounds unconstitutional, I'm sure the NRA is watching this bullshit with great interest
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240 said Obama would NEVER try to touch the 2nd amendment.
Fail #859789759 from Getbig's Nostradamus.
"The president directed the attorney general to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common-sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting 2nd amendment rights," Carney said."
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"The president directed the attorney general to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common-sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting 2nd amendment rights," Carney said."
obama could come in to 240's house and take all his guns and 240 would kneepad obama
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"The president directed the attorney general to form working groups with key stakeholders to identify common-sense measures that would improve American safety and security while fully respecting 2nd amendment rights," Carney said."
And how exactly are they going to do that I believe the 2nd amendment uses the words shall not be infringed upon. As far as I'm concerned having to get a FOID card in IL is infringing.
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I'm not a fan of Obama. I think he sucks as president. But attempting to be as fair minded as possible, I can't take his published statement of getting stakeholders together to discuss how to make americans safer while respecting the 2nd amendment is evidence he plans on taking my guns.
He may attempt something down the road, I don't have a crystal ball, but it would be unfair of me to use that statement as evidence when it clearly isnt.
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I'm not a fan of Obama. I think he sucks as president. But attempting to be as fair minded as possible, I can't take his published statement of getting stakeholders together to discuss how to make americans safer while respecting the 2nd amendment is evidence he plans on taking my guns.
He may attempt something down the road, I don't have a crystal ball, but it would be unfair of me to use that statement as evidence when it clearly isnt.
It really doesn't matter, the fact is the 2nd amendment says what it says and some BS end around trying to usurp the constitution because the left doesn't like guns is unacceptable. The government doesn't care about the safety of Americans as evidence I present operation fast and furious/gun runner. They know they have a snowballs chance in hell of amending the constitution, so they keep trying to do it unconstitutionally.
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I'm not a fan of Obama. I think he sucks as president. But attempting to be as fair minded as possible, I can't take his published statement of getting stakeholders together to discuss how to make americans safer while respecting the 2nd amendment is evidence he plans on taking my guns.
He may attempt something down the road, I don't have a crystal ball, but it would be unfair of me to use that statement as evidence when it clearly isnt.
great point man.
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great point man.
::) ::)
hear no evil see no evil
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::) ::)
hear no evil see no evil
Do you see evil in every statement? If you do, that may be a problem. IT may be worse than not seeing evil in anything. I believe there is a middle ground. Based on the statement Obama made that has this threads panties all in a bunch, there is nothing there, sorry.
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Obama Executive Order Cannot Legally Enact Rifle-Reporting Law
Ammoland.com ^ | 14 July, 2011 | Alan Korwin
PHOENIX, AZ --(Ammoland.com)- Effort to Bypass Congress Is Illegitimate, Experts Say Similar Laws Have Required Bills, Open Debate and Recorded Votes. The news Media is Asleep at the Wheel, Reporting Without Questioning. The Firearm Owners Protection Act Bans Such Proposals Altogether and Congress has Already Rejected Reporting for Long Guns.
If this stands up, limits on power fall apart — Is that the true goal of Project Gunrunner?
The effort by the Obama administration to establish new gun law by executive order is not a legal method for enacting law in the United States, according to Alan Korwin, a national expert on gun law and author of nine books on the subject. Other experts agree that such a measure requires an act of Congress, and cannot legitimately be implemented by executive order, as Mr. Obama is attempting to do.
“We already have rapid-reporting requirements for multiple firearm sales, for handguns,” Mr. Korwin notes, “and this required Congress to draft and enact a statute, which became federal law 18 U.S.C. §923(g). It’s not legal to create another similar law for long guns without Congress,” Korwin says.
When that law was changed to allow reporting of multiple handgun sales to local authorities, in addition to federal officials, that also required federal law, which was passed as part of the Brady bill. Congress had an opportunity to include long guns in those reporting requirements, and rejected it. Congress is the only entity with legitimate power to change that, Korwin and other experts say.
According to knowledgeable observers, a firearms bill like this would not make it through Congress, since the House is firmly in pro-gun-rights Republican hands. This may explain Obama’s effort to sidestep Congress and attempt to enact a gun law by decree instead of due process and open transparent deliberation.
“Mr. Obama knows such a bill would have no chance of passage in the current Congress. His attempt to avoid Congress is an affront to all Americans, regardless of where they stand on the gun-rights issue,” said Larry Pratt, executive director of Gun Owners of America. “Apparently the president is a fan of former Clinton advisor Paul Begala’s approach to government: “Stroke of the pen, law of the land. Kinda cool!”
A president who attempts to pass laws on his own is dangerous to the nation.
“If the administration can get away with this and enact new law without Congress, there is no practical limit on presidential exercise of power, a truly frightening development,” says Philip Van Cleave, a civil-rights activist and president of the Virginia Citizens Defense League. “Even attempting to grab such power is a tyrannical act,” Van Cleave says.
No justification or rational is known that would allow such action regarding rifle sales, when the essentially same law for handguns required a bill and proper passage. This goes even one step further than Obama’s federal health care law, which then Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi said we would have to pass to learn what’s in it. That at least used Congress for an appearance of legitimacy, this bypasses Congress completely.
Equal treatment under the law would also be defeated by the move, since the attempt singles out dealers in only four states — California, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas. One gun dealer, who refused to be identified, pointed out that this will force Mexico’s deadly vicious drug cartels to make their illegal straw purchases in the other 46 states.
Nevada, Utah, Colorado and Oklahoma are the next closest states to the Mexican border, and could conceivably see an uptick in the sales Obama claims he is trying to thwart. Those states would be under no obligation to report multiple sales, though licensed dealers are typically vigilant and report sales that seem suspicious, if for no other reason than to protect their licenses to operate.
“The whole scheme is preposterous,” says Kim Grady, a board member and national coordinator for Second Amendment Sisters. “Federal agents were the ones smuggling guns into Mexico in the first place, to bolster the numbers Mr. Obama, Hillary Clinton and Eric Holder were loudly promoting to build support for more gun control — even after their numbers were exposed as false,” Ms. Grady notes.
“The ATF-managed straw sales sales were repeatedly reported to ATF officials, who ignored the information. Now dealers will be required to do what they were already doing, to the rogue agency that ignored them? This has nothing to do with gun control, and everything to do with control.”
If a new law is needed, Grady said, it’s one to imprison federal agents who cooperate in gun smuggling, not more paperwork for honest and conscientious licensed business people.
According to ATF, the new edict will generate 18,000 reports in a year. It is unknown where the staff and money to handle such a load will come from, or how the information will be used. FOPA specifically bans collecting this information in any sort of federal facility.
According to Charles Heller, the newly appointed executive director of Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership, “The ultimate aim of all regulations like the one in this executive order, is to make it so difficult for private citizens to own and shoot a gun, that they no longer bother to do so. This is EXACTLY what the Declaration of Independence, whose anniversary we just celebrated, refers to as ‘sending forth agents to eat out our substance.’”
Heller notes that, “In the recent Gunrunner debacle, the Obama administration attempted to pad the statistics of ‘crime guns’ going to Mexico from the U.S. This is a violation of several U.S. laws, committed by law enforcement agents who failed to refuse illegal orders. The solution is simple and straightforward — disarm the agents and decertify the agency as a law enforcement organization. Remove their badges, and give them business cards like any other bureaucrats. Turn them from jack-boots into gumshoes.”
According to published reports, Obama promised action on gun restrictions to long-time anti-rights activist Sarah Brady, saying they would come “under the radar,” after he got things properly positioned. It defies imagination to suggest that Project Gunrunner, and the Fast and Furious smuggling crimes were just fronts that had nothing to do with padding the numbers, gun smuggling, or even building political support for gun control.
“If that was just a smokescreen, all arranged so Mr. Obama could begin enacting gun law by decree instead of through Congress, now that would be one slick pre-planned political stratagem,” said author Korwin, adding, “I can’t believe he’s that clever, but it sure looks like he’s getting that result.”
The NRA has promised a lawsuit to fight the administration’s decree, about the only action short of impeachment that can be taken if a president acts outside the law. That case would be heard in federal courts, which operate under Obama’s Justice Dept. and AG Eric Holder, which have in the past mysteriously dismissed cases they did not like. Voter intimidation by a black panther in Philadelphia, for example, disappeared, even though the club-wielding perp was caught on videotape.
BACKGROUNDER
As early as Dec. 17, 2010, the National Shooting Sports Foundation reported that an effort was underway to create rifle-reporting requirements:
“An editorial in today’s Washington Post discussed the recent decision by ATF to require federally licensed firearms retailers along the Southwest border to report multiple sales, or other dispositions, of most semi-automatic rifles. Specifically this would impact semi-automatic rifles that are larger than .22 caliber, capable of accepting a detachable magazine and are purchased by the same individual within five consecutive business days.
“Though the Post supports this ill-advised proposal, it did acknowledge the legitimacy surrounding one of industry’s objections:
“When reports of its plan surfaced, the administration came under immediate attack from the gun rights lobby. The National Shooting Sports Foundation, the firearms industry trade association, argued that the administration lacked the legal authority to demand data on rifles and shotguns. It has a point: While Congress authorized the ATF to collect information on handgun sales, it declined to extend the requirement to long guns. A court is likely to be asked to decide whether demand letters may be used to shake loose this information ?” http://www.nssfblog.com/atf-to-require-multiple-sales-reports-for-long-guns/
NSSF continues to oppose multiple sales reporting of semi-automatic rifles. Such reporting requirements will actually make it more difficult for licensed retailers to help law enforcement as traffickers modify their illegal schemes to circumvent the reporting requirement. Traffickers will go further underground, hiring more people to buy their firearms. This will make it much harder for retailers to identify and report suspicious behavior to law enforcement. http://www.nssfblog.com/more-on-atf-multiple-sales-reporting/
NSSF would also like to remind all members of industry, sportsmen and gun owners to voice their concerns by doing the following:
* Call the Office of Management and Budget, Office of Information and Regulation Affairs, Department of Justice, Desk Officer at (202) 395-6466. * E-mail Barbara A. Terrell, ATF, Firearms Industry Programs Branch at Barbara.Terrell@atf.gov * Call your Senators and Representative: United States Capitol Switchboard: 202-224-3121
The NSSF reports that, “According to ATF, the average age of a firearm recovered in the United States is 11 years old. In Mexico it’s more than 14 years old. This demonstrates that criminals are not using new guns bought from retailers in the states.”
Congress, when it enacted multiple sales reporting for handguns, could have required multiple sales of long guns — it specifically chose not to.
The Washington Post reported on Dec. 17 of last year that, “The plan (to register rifles) by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives revives a proposal that has languished at the Justice Department and in the Obama administration for several months, according to people with knowledge of the proposal… The idea of such a requirement is so controversial to many gun owners that administration officials proceeded cautiously for fear of provoking the National Rifle Association, sources said.”
The paper quoted Ted Novin, a spokesman for the National Shooting Sports Foundation, who noted the timing after the election and said, “This is an ill-considered proposal and one that ATF does not have the legal authority to unilaterally impose.”
The Post also quoted NRA chief lobbyist Chris Cox, “This administration does not have the guts to build a wall (on the border), but they do have the audacity to blame and register gun owners for Mexico’s problems,” Cox said. “NRA supports legitimate efforts to stop criminal activity, but we will not stand idle while our Second Amendment is sacrificed for politics.”
The original idea, says the Post, was to label the operation as an emergency, and have ATF issue a “demand letter” to 8,500 dealers in the four border states requiring the new reports to a centralized federal facility.
When the NRA got wind of the idea back then, it warned its four million members in a “grassroots alert” that the administration might try to go around Congress to get such a plan enacted as an executive order or rule.
“Emergency approval would last six months, after which the requirement would end unless other action were taken, the draft states,” according to the Post. That time is now up and Obama has seen fit to attempt to continue the operation, in defiance of law and with disregard for Congress. http://tinyurl.com/6c37t97
>From the Firearm Owners Protection Act 18 USC §926 Rules and regulations
“The Attorney General may prescribe only such rules and regulations as are necessary to carry out the provisions of this chapter…
(3)… No such rule or regulation prescribed after the date of the enactment of the Firearms Owners’ Protection Act (1986) may require that records required to be maintained under this chapter or any portion of the contents of such records, be recorded at or transferred to a facility owned, managed, or controlled by the United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof, nor that any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or dispositions be established.”
This is a special report from The Uninvited Ombudsman, Alan Korwin, author of the Page Nine newsmedia watchblog. http://www.gunlaws.com/PageNineIndex.htm
Alan Korwin Bloomfield Press “We publish the gun laws.” 4848 E. Cactus, #505-440 Scottsdale, AZ 85254 602-996-4020 Phone 602-494-0679 Fax 1-800-707-4020 Orders http://www.gunlaws.com alan@gunlaws.com Call, write, fax or click for free full-color catalog (This is our address and info as of Jan. 1, 2007)
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