Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: suckmymuscle on August 12, 2011, 07:49:56 AM
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I have decided to do these "lectures" because I am tired of bodybuilders screwing up their training and then don't understand why they don't gain. I first explained why and how you should split your training http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=390663.0, and now I will explain how you should perform aerobics to maximize fat loss.
I have seen dudes performing aerobics too fast in the belief that doing it faster burns more calories, and I have seeen dudes barely walking on the belief that slower aerobics maximizes fat burning. Both are wrong.
Yep, when you run/pedal faster, you do burn more calories for the same amount of time performing an aerobic exercise, but you burn more glycogen than fat. Why? Because fats have to be first broken down and taken to the liver to be convered into ketones by a process called glycogenolosis. This is a slow process. If your run/pedal too fast, there is no time for the body to perform this, so it will resort to the muscles' stored glycogen to get the energy it needs. If you perform aerobics even faster, like if your sprint, there is no time for the body to use even glycogen, so it will use adenosine triphosphate instead. If you walk, you'll always burn fat, but if you walk too slow the amount of fat burned will be very small. The ideal for maximum fat burning is too perform the exercise with an intensity that will be at the very upper rang of using fat as energy right on the edge of where the body starts using glycogen.
So, as you can see, whether the body uses fat, glycogen or ATP to move depends on how fast you move it. Beneath 65% maximum intensity(walking to fast walking), the body uses fat, between 65% to 90%(running) or so it uses glycogen, and above 90% effort it uses adenosine triphosphate, which can be released as energy immediately.
To maximize fat burning, find what your 100% maximum sprinting speed and heart rate is, then try to walk at 65% of that speed for as long as you can. At first, you will only be able to handle this for 40 minutes, but eventually you should be able to handle up to two hours. Doing more than two hours of aerobics even at this low intensity increases glucocorticoid levels, so it is not adviced...
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I have decided to do these "lectures" because I am tired of bodybuilders screwing up their training and then don't understand why they don't gain. I first explained why and how you should split your training http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=390663.0, and now I will explain how you should perform aerobics to maximize fat loss.
I have seen dudes performing aerobics too fast in the belief that doing it faster burns more calories, and I have seeen dudes barely walking on the belief that slower aerobics maximizes fat burning. Both are wrong.
Yep, when you run/pedal faster, you do burn more calories for the same amount of time performing an aerobic exercise, but you burn more glycogen than fat. Why? Because fats have to be first broken down and taken to the liver to be convered into ketones by a process called glycogenolosis. This is a slow process. If your run/pedal too fast, there is no time for the body to perform this, so it will resort to the muscles' stored glycogen to get the energy it needs. If you perform aerobics even faster, like if your sprint, there is no time for the body to use even glycogen, so it will use adenosine triphosphate instead. If you walk, you'll always burn fat, but if you walk too slow the amount of fat burned will be very small. The ideal for maximum fat burning is too perform the exercise with an intensity that will be at the very upper rang of using fat as energy right on the edge of where the body starts using glycogen.
So, as you can see, whether the body uses fat, glycogen or ATP to move depends on how fast you move it. Beneath 65% maximum intensity(walking to fast walking), the body uses fat, between 65% to 90%(running) or so it uses glycogen, and above 90% effort it uses adenosine triphosphate, which can be released as energy immediately.
To maximize fat burning, find what your 100% maximum sprinting speed and heart rate is, then try to walk at 65% of that speed for as long as you can. At first, you will only be able to handle this for 40 minutes, but eventually you should be able to handle up to two hours. Doing more than two hours of aerobics even at this low intensity increases glucocorticoid levels, so it is not adviced...
SUCKMYMUSCLE
What about the thermogenic benefits of boosted metabolic rate after intense anaerobic activity? a la Interval Training for example; I think it has been shown that calorie usage is more important whether you use fat in an aerobic sense or not.
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(http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/50413_4183448399_351244_n.jpg)
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What about the thermogenic benefits of boosted metabolic rate after intense anaerobic activity? a la Interval Training for example; I think it has been shown that calorie usage is more important whether you use fat in an aerobic sense or not.
There is some evidence that performing extremely brutal aerobic exercise, like running at 90% of your sprinting speed for as long as you can, often results in a metabolic rate about 10% greater for a couple hours after you stop doing it than moderate exercise. This is not as effective as performing aerobic exercise at 65% for fat burning for many reasons:
- The fat burning that you get from a 10% increased metabolism that you get from intense aerobic exercise for a couple hours after you stop training is less than what you gain from performing moderate aerobic.
- You are not able to perform extremely intense aerobic exercise for long, so the total amount of calories you burn is less than what you burn from a session of moderate aerobic exercise and most of the calories burnt will come from glycogen and not fat.
- Intense aerobic exercise causes a sharp increase in glucocorticoid levels which hampers fat loss and increases muscle loss.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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your first good post. congrats bro
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your first good post in the last five minutes. congrats bro
I agree. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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post up a pic sport.
you've been talking the talk. let's see if you walk it, or if you just another fat windbag who knows everything but looks like shit, much like our own true Adonis and fat panda.
I doubt there is one person on GB whos physical identity being known would bring great pleasure to many other than myself being exposed. in fact ive gone thru great lengths to protect against that. that being said, if you post up a pic, I'll post up mine.
that's how certain I am you are just another internet know it all who in real life looks like shit.
now, kindly fuck off.
yours truly
no one
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post up a pic sport.
you've been talking the talk. let's see if you walk it, or if you just another fat windbag who knows everything but looks like shit, much like our own true Adonis and fat panda.
I doubt there is one person on GB who physical identity being know would bring great pleasure to many other than myself being exposed. in fact ive gone thru great lengths to protect against that. that being said, if you post up a pic, I'll post up mine.
that's how certain I am you are just another internet know it all who in real life looks like shit.
now, kindly fuck off.
yours truly
no one
I think that even the picture of the Tsar Bomba, the biggest nuke ever, is not enough to describe the size of this meltdown, but since there is no bigger nuke, I'll post it anyway.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Sorry, SMM, but fats are not broken down by glycogenolysis. Google it if you want.
Greetings from Dr Dutch (who had to learn all this stuff by heart at the doctor school)
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suckmanmuscle is an idiot. I owned him 2 years ago over the topic of gluconeogenesis.
for a genius he's pretty fucking stupid.
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I think that even the picture of the Tsar Bomba, the biggest nuke ever, is not enough to describe the size of this meltdown, but since there is no bigger nuke, I'll post it anyway.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
that's what I thought.
thanks for playing.
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Sorry, SMM, but fats are not broken down by glycogenolysis. Google it if you want.
Greetings from Dr Dutch (who had to learn all this stuff by heart at the doctor school)
Ik hou van jou alltijd!
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Sorry, SMM, but fats are not broken down by glycogenolysis. Google it if you want.
Greetings from Dr Dutch (who had to learn all this stuff by heart at the doctor school)
But I really like the Tzarbomba pic !!
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post up a pic sport.
you've been talking the talk. let's see if you walk it, or if you just another fat windbag who knows everything but looks like shit, much like our own true Adonis and fat panda.
I doubt there is one person on GB whos physical identity being known would bring great pleasure to many other than myself being exposed. in fact ive gone thru great lengths to protect against that. that being said, if you post up a pic, I'll post up mine.
that's how certain I am you are just another internet know it all who in real life looks like shit.
now, kindly fuck off.
yours truly
no one
In a thread once this guy "suckmymuscle" kept arguing that its harder to perform decline barbell press than incline. Anyone with even minimal weightlifting experience knows incline is harder, yet he kept stubbornly arguing against this. Proof that he does not have much or any weightlifting experience.
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I propose another avatar for SMM instead of the gorilla..
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Sorry, SMM, but fats are not broken down by glycogenolysis. Google it if you want.
Greetings from Dr Dutch (who had to learn all this stuff by heart at the doctor school)
I am sorry. I meant lipolysis. How does this change the validity of my argument ??? You are missing the forest for the trees.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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suckmanmuscle is an idiot. I owned him 2 years ago over the topic of gluconeogenesis.
for a genius he's pretty fucking stupid.
No, you didn't. You corrected my spelling. I wrote gluconogenesis instead of gluconeogenesis. Don't be a liar. It doesen't really matter because English is not my first language and yet I committ at least 10 X less spelling mistakes than you. If I am not a genius, then that speaks volumes about how stupid you are since I am clearly smarter than you. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I have decided to do these "lectures" because I am tired of bodybuilders screwing up their training and then don't understand why they don't gain. I first explained why and how you should split your training http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=390663.0, and now I will explain how you should perform aerobics to maximize fat loss.
I have seen dudes performing aerobics too fast in the belief that doing it faster burns more calories, and I have seeen dudes barely walking on the belief that slower aerobics maximizes fat burning. Both are wrong.
Yep, when you run/pedal faster, you do burn more calories for the same amount of time performing an aerobic exercise, but you burn more glycogen than fat. Why? Because fats have to be first broken down and taken to the liver to be convered into ketones by a process called glycogenolosis. This is a slow process. If your run/pedal too fast, there is no time for the body to perform this, so it will resort to the muscles' stored glycogen to get the energy it needs. If you perform aerobics even faster, like if your sprint, there is no time for the body to use even glycogen, so it will use adenosine triphosphate instead. If you walk, you'll always burn fat, but if you walk too slow the amount of fat burned will be very small. The ideal for maximum fat burning is too perform the exercise with an intensity that will be at the very upper rang of using fat as energy right on the edge of where the body starts using glycogen.
So, as you can see, whether the body uses fat, glycogen or ATP to move depends on how fast you move it. Beneath 65% maximum intensity(walking to fast walking), the body uses fat, between 65% to 90%(running) or so it uses glycogen, and above 90% effort it uses adenosine triphosphate, which can be released as energy immediately.
To maximize fat burning, find what your 100% maximum sprinting speed and heart rate is, then try to walk at 65% of that speed for as long as you can. At first, you will only be able to handle this for 40 minutes, but eventually you should be able to handle up to two hours. Doing more than two hours of aerobics even at this low intensity increases glucocorticoid levels, so it is not adviced...
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahaha ha!
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Coach,...would you say that it is a good idea to get a cardio monitor and use it to regulate how hard you work,...gradually increasing the heart rate and length of exercise in small managable bites,...to prevent injury but also to help sustain interest,...if something hurts needlessly it destroys interest in doing the thing.
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I believe there is plenty of evidence that shows the same things- that you need either very moderate or very intense cardio, anything in between is a waste.
I had to drop intense cardio because as a natty my CNS was FRIED after a week of it along with weight training. Not to mention for 6 weeks straight I could not sleep more than an hour or two in a row at night. I suspect increased cortisol being the culprit. Took me almost a week of no cardio and easy lifting to get my body back on track, and I definitely lost muscle in the process.
SMM if I do cardio in the AM fasted, what HR should I shoot for? I like to do about 45 minutes and this does NOT include my warm up and cool down. THose are separate. Also I do like to take a good thermogenic, if that matters.
Would you recommend some BCAA's before doing my AM cardio? Also, to accelerate fat loss, would it be OK to add in a PM session of cardio after I finish my weight training workout?
Lastly, I did a sick hike last sunday up Mission Peak. It's in fremont, ca. You can google. It took me 2.5 hours of steep incline to get up and 50 minutes to get back down. Do you think for a guy dieting to do a show in nov it's cool to do this maybe once a week, or every other week or will I be losing muscle? I was pretty devastated the rest of the day! It was crazy intense. Unsure if it led to fat loss though I suspect it would have to? What do you think? Maybe Coach can chime in.
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When it comes to MAX fatloss, with regard to cardio and weight training- would you think it makes a big difference to not ingest carbs after working out? For example, say I am low carb dieting-take in most of my daily carbs in meals 1 and my pre-workout meal ONLY. Theory being by taking in zero carbs after I lift my body's GH output will be maximized and FFA utilization will be dramatically ramped up. Then when I go to do my fasted cardio next morning, I should be burning MAX bodyfat. You agree/disagree and why?
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I had to drop intense cardio because as a natty my CNS was FRIED after a week of it along with weight training.
WTF were you doing for "intense cardio" for it to fry you THAT quickly?!?!?
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gayer than a bodybuilding "lecture"
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Coach,...would you say that it is a good idea to get a cardio monitor and use it to regulate how hard you work,...gradually increasing the heart rate and length of exercise in small managable bites,...to prevent injury but also to help sustain interest,...if something hurts needlessly it destroys interest in doing the thing.
We make good use of monitors with our fighters we also test for VO2 max in some situations. But in team situations, for obvious reasons it's not feasible. As for gradually increasing, of course EVERYTHING should be done in a progression. Long cardio sessions do very little for fat burning except while doing the exercise, after the exercise ends so does the fat burning not only that it's muscle wasting. Suckmymuscle never defined "aerobic" and I particularly don't think he knows it's an energy system and means 'with oxygen' (physiology 101) so he's using the aerobic word loosely. For bodybuiding purposes, there is no reason to build aerobic capacity, ESPECIALLY FOR NATTYS, too much research out there that shows intense intervals is not only muscle sparring but fat burning even after the exercise has stopped.
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Sorry, SMM, but fats are not broken down by glycogenolysis. Google it if you want.
Greetings from Dr Dutch (who had to learn all this stuff by heart at the doctor school)
lol another SMM fail
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Ik hou van jou alltijd!
You love him?
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For some reason people seem to think that you can somehow "choose" your energy pathway.
Surely our anatomy is the same, but our reactions to a multiplicity of variables are much different, one from the other.
Your body will always use a combination of energy pathways, not just one. Much is dependent on what kind of energy it has a surplus of, and also what you have taught it (homeostasis) to do over a period of time.
If muscle burns energy while working and while at rest, why not spend your time in MHR and build as much muscle as possible? If "aerobics" which uses oxygen exclusively burns mostly fat, how would you expect this to happen while your largest muscle groups are operating on carbohydrate and "anaerobically" (without oxygen)??
If lactic acid is built up and truly is NOT a waste by-product and is in fact used again as an energy source, why not continue to work closer to MHR?
"Cardio" is also a misnomer. You can go in and out of many energy pathways during exercise and the only folks who are TRULY operating "aerobically" are going to be the ones that are always standing around talking.
I obviously don't buy into the whole Aerobic Exercise thingy.
I say: create a caloric deficit by educating yourself on nutrients, how AND WHEN they are utilized. Then, decide if you want to be a *thin-fatty* or a bodybuilder.
Does anyone here actually understand why victims of concentration camps (supposedly) died of starvation? Is this even possible? If so, why?
And while youre' at it, would a concentration camp victim have more fat on him/her than an aerobic freak, or less? How about a competition "ready" bodybuilder? More ~ or ~ less fat? And why?
Energy pathways are much too complicated to understand just by reading about them.
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For some reason people seem to think that you can somehow "choose" your energy pathway.
Surely our anatomy is the same, but our reactions to a multiplicity of variables are much different, one from the other.
Your body will always use a combination of energy pathways, not just one. Much is dependent on what kind of energy it has a surplus of, and also what you have taught it (homeostasis) to do over a period of time.
If muscle burns energy while working and while at rest, why not spend your time in MHR and build as much muscle as possible? If "aerobics" which uses oxygen exclusively burns mostly fat, how would you expect this to happen while your largest muscle groups are operating on carbohydrate and "anaerobically" (without oxygen)??
If lactic acid is built up and truly is NOT a waste by-product and is in fact used again as an energy source, why not continue to work closer to MHR?
"Cardio" is also a misnomer. You can go in and out of many energy pathways during exercise and the only folks who are TRULY operating "aerobically" are going to be the ones that are always standing around talking.
I obviously don't buy into the whole Aerobic Exercise thingy.
I say: create a caloric deficit by educating yourself on nutrients, how AND WHEN they are utilized. Then, decide if you want to be a *thin-fatty* or a bodybuilder.
Does anyone here actually understand why victims of concentration camps (supposedly) died of starvation? Is this even possible? If so, why?
And while youre' at it, would a concentration camp victim have more fat on him/her than an aerobic freak, or less? How about a competition "ready" bodybuilder? More ~ or ~ less fat? And why?
Energy pathways are much too complicated to understand just by reading about them.
Your energy systems should play a vital role in proper training protocol (exercise selection, recovery, etc) if the program is designed properly each energy system should come into play. The problem is that most people (not you because I think you do) don't get it and most have no clue on how to properly design a program.
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WTF were you doing for "intense cardio" for it to fry you THAT quickly?!?!?
Stairmaster intervals holding 15lb dumbells. 1/1 ratio I started resting for 2 min with 1 min on the stairmaster, progressed to 1 min stairmaster 1 min walking and would go about 20 minutes straight. Speed 12 at my fastest. VERY intense (try it). In addition working out with weights much longer than I needed to (have since cut back) and also was doing nearly an hour fasted steady state in the morning. It was too much...I didn't really feel overtrained, then woke up one day and WHAM I couldn't lift anything, couldn't think, I felt like crap. This lasted for weeks till I wised up, then recovery took a few days.
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You love him?
Sure, everybody loves the Dutch..