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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Hugo Chavez on August 19, 2011, 11:28:46 AM
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from the police-as-art-critics dept
Apparently the police in Long Beach, California, have a policy that says if a police officer determines that a photographer is taking photos of something with "no apparent esthetic value," they can detain them. This revelation came after photographer Sander Roscoe Wolff was taking the following photo:
cont...
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110815/23584515540/police-say-they-can-detain-photographers-if-their-photographs-have-no-apparent-esthetic-value.shtml
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Welcome to America... ::)
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Note to self...
if you videotape a cop beating someone,
hit 'send' and send it to your home email before they start whooping your ass.
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detaining fine art photographers lol... This is a strange new low even for cops.
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Note to self...
if you videotape a cop beating someone,
hit 'send' and send it to your home email before they start whooping your ass.
HAHA!!
Unless the cop is beating a bodybuilder, there's certainly no apparent esthetic value!
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9/11 anniversary is approaching. What we KNOW about terrorists is that they often case targets prior to attacking. So if a cop sees someone taking photographs of a location that isn't ordinarily photographed, it may be in our best interest for him to put down the donut and check it out. Someone taking pictures of a major bridge may be and probably will be perfectly innocent. Doesn't hurt to stop and ask him what's up. Their concern is not that someone is taking a photograph, but that someone may be in the early stages of gathering intel on a possible target. Or....we could just tell cops not to bother with any of that.. we'll probably be okay
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9/11 anniversary is approaching. What we KNOW about terrorists is that they often case targets prior to attacking. So if a cop sees someone taking photographs of a location that isn't ordinarily photographed, it may be in our best interest for him to put down the donut and check it out. Someone taking pictures of a major bridge may be and probably will be perfectly innocent. Doesn't hurt to stop and ask him what's up. Their concern is not that someone is taking a photograph, but that someone may be in the early stages of gathering intel on a possible target. Or....we could just tell cops not to bother with any of that.. we'll probably be okay
Good post.
How about we just outlaw pictures altogether? Then the terrorists can't use them.
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Good post.
How about we just outlaw pictures altogether? Then the terrorists can't use them.
Finally! Someone with some common sense!
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from the police-as-art-critics dept
Apparently the police in Long Beach, California, have a policy that says if a police officer determines that a photographer is taking photos of something with "no apparent esthetic value," they can detain them. This revelation came after photographer Sander Roscoe Wolff was taking the following photo:
cont...
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110815/23584515540/police-say-they-can-detain-photographers-if-their-photographs-have-no-apparent-esthetic-value.shtml
I like that picture. What were the cops even worried about, that they would blow that condemned building up or what?
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Finally! Someone with some common sense!
WTF... :-\
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I like that picture. What were the cops even worried about, that they would blow that condemned building up or what?
Is that what it was? A condemned building?
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Just guessing. My point was that it doesn't look like some kind of terrorist target anyway.
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Is that what it was? A condemned building?
yes, detained over photographing junk.
That is the photograph he was detained for lol
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Plus, look how stupid this is? They're basically saying they'll detain you and check you out if you're photographing shit nobody cares about. Ok, that's kind of the opposite from what Agnostic just said. tourists take pictures of the shit that would be targeted by terrorists. These cops will check you out if you're not doing that and are off photographing fire hydrants or some shit lol...
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Just guessing. My point was that it doesn't look like some kind of terrorist target anyway.
Turns out it was a refinery...
In the article I found it says "for taking pictures of a refinery".. Then the Chief comments on it.
"If an officer sees someone taking pictures of something like a refinery,” says [Police Chief Jim McDonnell], “it is incumbent upon the officer to make contact with the individual.” McDonnell went on to say that whether said contact becomes detainment depends on the circumstances the officer encounters.
McDonnell says that while there is no police training specific to determining whether a photographer’s subject has “apparent esthetic value,” officers make such judgments “based on their overall training and experience” and will generally approach photographers not engaging in “regular tourist behavior.”
I'm trying to get worked up over this... just cant seem to do it...
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I know that around my city there are water treatment plants, and various other things that are on a list of places to be on a higher level of alert around. It stands to reason if someone is taking photos of something like that.. a place and or thing not normally of interest to visitors but could be of intererest to terrorist, we would be derelict in our duties NOT to look into it. Agree?
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LOL, I think the picture is of this abandoned oil refinery in long beach.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/edsel12/4279663734/
If he were taking pictures of an active oil refinery that close, he would have needed permission to be on the property and there would be something to actually charge him with, right?
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LOL, I think the picture is of this abandoned oil refinery in long beach.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/edsel12/4279663734/
If he were taking pictures of an active oil refinery that close, he would have needed permission to be on the property and there would be something to actually charge him with, right?
I don't know how close you have to be with lenses these days but if they were on the property of an abandoned refinery, they would require the same permission.
I guess my point is this, cops or at least cops I work with don't care about someone taking pictures of benign things like the article tries to make it out. We really have other things we could be doing like eating, or visiting our buddies or beating jay walkers (said in jest because I know that is what a lot of people think thats all we do. ) It was likely a security concern when all the facts are known
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I know that around my city there are water treatment plants, and various other things that are on a list of places to be on a higher level of alert around. It stands to reason if someone is taking photos of something like that.. a place and or thing not normally of interest to visitors but could be of intererest to terrorist, we would be derelict in our duties NOT to look into it. Agree?
Agree.
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I think we should all be arrested for talking about the picture.
Hope you boys are cool with the slammer.
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I think we should all be arrested for talking about the picture.
Hope you boys are cool with the slammer.
:)
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I want the government to intrude, and trample all my freedom so they can keep me safe!!!!
Fucking cowards.......
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I honestly didn't think anyone on getbig would even try to defend this.
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I don't know how close you have to be with lenses these days but if they were on the property of an abandoned refinery, they would require the same permission.
I guess my point is this, cops or at least cops I work with don't care about someone taking pictures of benign things like the article tries to make it out. We really have other things we could be doing like eating, or visiting our buddies or beating jay walkers (said in jest because I know that is what a lot of people think thats all we do. ) It was likely a security concern when all the facts are known
if that's the case, then why not just charge him with criminal tresspass or some shit? It seems like that's the first reason for detaining or arresting someone. This place doesn't look maintained so I think it's the abandoned refinery. If he did take it from off of the property, lol.
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I honestly didn't think anyone on getbig would even try to defend this.
Probably due to your lack of information. I understand. But the deal is, there are times when someone photographing something rises to the level that an inquiry is prudent. If you cannot understand this in this day and age, that's okay too. We'll watch over you anyway
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if that's the case, then why not just charge him with criminal tresspass or some shit? It seems like that's the first reason for detaining or arresting someone. This place doesn't look maintained so I think it's the abandoned refinery. If he did take it from off of the property, lol.
Well, let's recap. There are people on here up in arms because the cop detained the photographer to determine what was going on. That's a horrible thing to do.. but it would be OK if the cop had then arrested the photographer for trespassing?
I'm not sure of all the facts, and call me crazy, but I don't have an issue with a cop who sees someone photographing a refinery asking what's going on. And if it is as abandoned and secluded as we're being led to believe, it is likely the cop was there on a call of a suspicious person and not just tooling by..
Anyhoo, there are a lot of things to get upset about cops doing, this probably isn't one of them.
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I think we should all be arrested for talking about the picture.
Hope you boys are cool with the slammer.
I agree, I'll gladly spend some time in jail if it keeps us safe from TERRORISM!!!
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Anyone with a camera should rot in jail, period. Why give the enemy any ammunition?
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why the hell would a terrorist need to take pictures? You can google multiple pics of about anything major anyway and google earth is there for the rest. At some point don't we need to ask if it's better to live free or live in fear? No fear kinda died after 9/11... why? Nobody said freedom was safe.
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Anyone with a camera should rot in jail, period. Why give the enemy any ammunition?
Good point! What say you Agnostic?
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At some point don't we need to ask if it's better to live free or live in fear? Nobody said freedom was safe.
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-Benjamin Franklin
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why the hell would a terrorist need to take pictures? You can google multiple pics of about anything major anyway and google earth is there for the rest. At some point don't we need to ask if it's better to live free or live in fear? No fear kinda died after 9/11... why? Nobody said freedom was safe.
http://www.infragard.net/
Watch out for these guys, the ultimate snoops and very dangerous...
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why the hell would a terrorist need to take pictures? You can google multiple pics of about anything major anyway and google earth is there for the rest. At some point don't we need to ask if it's better to live free or live in fear? No fear kinda died after 9/11... why? Nobody said freedom was safe.
You have been reported.
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http://www.infragard.net/
Watch out for these guys, the ultimate snoops and very dangerous...
is that a privatized portion of DHS or something?
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You have been reported.
;D probably a long time ago lol... My file size probably doubled for being gimmicky and changing my screen name to Hugo Chavez :D
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Good point! What say you Agnostic?
hear hear!! Rot I say!
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hear hear!! Rot I say!
rot ???
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why the hell would a terrorist need to take pictures? You can google multiple pics of about anything major anyway and google earth is there for the rest. At some point don't we need to ask if it's better to live free or live in fear? No fear kinda died after 9/11... why? Nobody said freedom was safe.
Seriously?
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;D probably a long time ago lol... My file size probably doubled for being gimmicky and changing my screen name to Hugo Chavez :D
Save a good spot in the unmarked cube van for me. ;D
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Anyone with a camera should rot in jail, period. Why give the enemy any ammunition?
rot...
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Seriously?
I dunno, I'm not a terrorist. Why would they need pics of shit that's all over the net and you can google earth? You tell me?
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hear hear!! Rot I say!
haha ;D
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is that a privatized portion of DHS or something?
No, business and energy interests teaming up with the FBI, basically an extra branch of the FBI and the FBI has given them full authority to use deadly force at any time they think it appropriate and there are thousands of chapters.
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No, business and energy interests teaming up with the FBI, basically an extra branch of the FBI and the FBI has given them full authority to use deadly force at any time they think it appropriate and there are thousands of chapters.
We're coming upon the 10th anniversary of 9/11. We need these people to protect us! If you're not doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about you dumb lib!!!!!!!!!!!
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We're coming upon the 10th anniversary of 9/11. We need these people to protect us! If you're not doing anything wrong you have nothing to worry about you dumb lib!!!!!!!!!!!
Indeed.
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No, business and energy interests teaming up with the FBI, basically an extra branch of the FBI and the FBI has given them full authority to use deadly force at any time they think it appropriate and there are thousands of chapters.
so it's a private association with the FBI with the licence to kill... That's nice lol...
A place for laid off blackwater types to get a job haha...
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No, business and energy interests teaming up with the FBI, basically an extra branch of the FBI and the FBI has given them full authority to use deadly force at any time they think it appropriate and there are thousands of chapters.
do you have some info on their authority to use deadly force? I just wanna make sure that's correct.
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do you have some info on their authority to use deadly force? I just wanna make sure that's correct.
We may not agree on a lot, but I do like that you don't take everything said on face value
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do you have some info on their authority to use deadly force? I just wanna make sure that's correct.
You should read through this.
http://whitewraithe.wordpress.com/infragard-private-sector-spy-program/
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We may not agree on a lot, but I do like that you don't take everything said on face value
thanks, I've fucked up plenty and it usually comes back to bite you at some point so I try to make sure the facts are right. doing the mod thing kinda got me in that habbit too.
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You should read through this.
http://whitewraithe.wordpress.com/infragard-private-sector-spy-program/
thanks, intersting shit for sure.
I found the origin of the story:
http://web.archive.org/web/20090318122516/http://progressive.org/mag_rothschild0308
The FBI denied it all and here is the follow up response from the author:
http://www.progressive.org/mag_wx030108
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9/11 anniversary is approaching. What we KNOW about terrorists is that they often case targets prior to attacking. So if a cop sees someone taking photographs of a location that isn't ordinarily photographed, it may be in our best interest for him to put down the donut and check it out. Someone taking pictures of a major bridge may be and probably will be perfectly innocent. Doesn't hurt to stop and ask him what's up. Their concern is not that someone is taking a photograph, but that someone may be in the early stages of gathering intel on a possible target. Or....we could just tell cops not to bother with any of that.. we'll probably be okay
The brain wash runs deep in you.
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thanks, intersting shit for sure.
I found the origin of the story:
http://web.archive.org/web/20090318122516/http://progressive.org/mag_rothschild0308
The FBI denied it all and here is the follow up response from the author:
http://www.progressive.org/mag_wx030108
True or not, the FBI would never admit to anything like that.
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True or not, the FBI would never admit to anything like that.
The guy does a pretty good job calling them out in his rebuttal to the FBI, so at this point I don't doubt it. Still all this comes down to one unknown whistleblower so who knows. My faith isn't exactly with the FBI knowing their history lol...
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The guy does a pretty good job calling them out in his rebuttal to the FBI, so at this point I don't doubt it. Still all this comes down to one unknown whistleblower so who knows. My faith isn't exactly with the fbi knowing their history lol...
Personally I find it scary enough that such an organisation exists in the first place...
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Personally I find it scary enough that such an organisation exists in the first place...
yea. I didn't even know about this shit until you mentioned it. the whole thing is a little WTF.
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Threads like this make wonder where the line is or should be drawn.
The cops just asked the photographer a couple of questions and people are acting as though it's some huge civil rights violation? Really?
I mean REALLY? When a cop asks you some questions it's like the kings boot at your neck?
I suppose this could also be the cops fault too. The entire blue wall and their constant need to issue citations for the most minute infractions.
Fuck I'm a waffle.
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Threads like this make wonder where the line is or should be drawn.
The cops just asked the photographer a couple of questions and people are acting as though it's some huge civil rights violation? Really?
I mean REALLY? When a cop asks you some questions it's like the kings boot at your neck?
I suppose this could also be the cops fault too. The entire blue wall and their constant need to issue citations for the most minute infractions.
Fuck I'm a waffle.
get some coffee and then come back to the forum. It'll be better ;D
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Threads like this make wonder where the line is or should be drawn.
The cops just asked the photographer a couple of questions and people are acting as though it's some huge civil rights violation? Really?
I mean REALLY? When a cop asks you some questions it's like the kings boot at your neck?
I suppose this could also be the cops fault too. The entire blue wall and their constant need to issue citations for the most minute infractions.
Fuck I'm a waffle.
Skip! I'm a little surprised at you... Sounded like some common sense in your response up there... I may just have to make a call to some friends and cancel that hit... hope it's not too late.
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Threads like this make wonder where the line is or should be drawn.
The cops just asked the photographer a couple of questions and people are acting as though it's some huge civil rights violation? Really?
I mean REALLY? When a cop asks you some questions it's like the kings boot at your neck?
I suppose this could also be the cops fault too. The entire blue wall and their constant need to issue citations for the most minute infractions.
Fuck I'm a waffle.
Not a waffle at all. Just using common sense.