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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Straw Man on May 23, 2012, 11:38:43 AM
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why am I not suprised
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/trayvon-martin-shooting-witnesses-change-stories-ahead-zimmerman-133743219.html
Four witnesses in the Trayvon Martin case have changed their stories, some "in ways that may damage" George Zimmerman, the Orlando Sentinel reports.
According to records released last week in the second-degree murder case, the witnesses—all of them neighbors—were interviewed multiple times by police and special prosecutors about what they saw on Feb. 26, the night Zimmerman fatally shot Martin in Sanford, Fla.
Four days after the shooting, one woman told police she "saw two guys running" and then "a fistfight. Just fists. I don't know who was hitting who." But on March 20, she told investigators she saw just one person.
"I couldn't tell you if it was a man, a woman, a kid, black or white," the woman, "Witness 2," said. "I couldn't tell you because it was dark and because I didn't have my contacts on or glasses. I just know I saw a person out there."
Another witness, who was initially interviewed on March 20, said she saw two people on the ground immediately after the shooting but was not sure who was on top.
But in another interview with investigators six days later, the paper reported, she was sure: It was Zimmerman on top.
"I know after seeing the TV of what's happening, comparing their sizes, I think Zimmerman was definitely on top because of his size," the woman, "Witness 12," said.
A third witness, "Witness 6," told police on the night of the shooting that he saw a black man on top of a lighter-skinned man "just throwing down blows on the guy, MMA-style." He said the lighter-skinned man was calling for help. Interviewed later by investigators, he said he was not sure who was calling for help, and was not sure any punches were thrown.
A fourth witness also interviewed on the night of the shooting said he heard the shooting, ran outside, and saw Zimmerman standing with "blood on the back of his head." According to "Witness 13," Zimmerman told him that Martin "was beating up on me, so I had to shoot him."
A month later, the same witness described Zimmerman's demeanor: "[It was] not like 'I can't believe I just shot someone!' It was more like, 'Just tell my wife I shot somebody,' like it was nothing."
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How does that damage Zimmerman? If anything, their testimonies are unreliable and they get tossed. The prosecution has little else to make their case.
Had they gone for manslaughter, they might have a shot. But, Murder 2? I doubt it.
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How does that damage Zimmerman? If anything, their testimonies are unreliable and they get tossed. The prosecution has little else to make their case.
Had they gone for manslaughter, they might have a shot. But, Murder 2? I doubt it.
I didn't say it damaged Zimmerman nor did I ever say they would get 2nd degree murder
It just shows that these stories change and will probably keep changing right up until trial
people of this board have attempted to argue that if one witness saw Martin on top of Zimmerman than the entire case should be dismissed and we should all apologize for doubting Zimmerman
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How does that damage Zimmerman? If anything, their testimonies are unreliable and they get tossed. The prosecution has little else to make their case.
Had they gone for manslaughter, they might have a shot. But, Murder 2? I doubt it.
Agree. Doesn't hurt him. It actually hurts the prosecution. What reliable witness do they have who will support a murder charge?
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sounds like a lot of police telling people what they say.
And the more witnesses (that saw zimm on bottom) getting tossed, the WORSE for his cause.
Cause when you get it down to ZERO people saying who was on who... all you have is a dead kid and a guy who thought he broke into his house and pursuied him 2 blocks.
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It's a shame that racist inciters have resorted to putting pressure on those witnesses. Disgusting.
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It's a shame that racist inciters have resorted to putting pressure on those witnesses. Disgusting.
how do you know it wasn't the police or racists inciters who originally forced the witnesses to create their original stories
reality is that witnesses change their stories ALL THE TIME
and when they get on the stand and start getting questioned they'll probably change them again
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Agree. Doesn't hurt him. It actually hurts the prosecution. What reliable witness do they have who will support a murder charge?
how do witnesses who once lended support to Zimmermans claims and now do not support his claims help the prosecution ?
how does that work exactly
this creates more doubt that Zimmerman is telling the truth
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how do witnesses who once lended support to Zimmermans claims and now do not support his claims help the prosecution ?
how does that work exactly
this creates more doubt that Zimmerman is telling the truth
great points.
without witnesses saying zimmerman was getitng his ass kicked, his goose is cooked.
now people are celebrating the witnesses being discredited? now I'm starting to understand the level of dumbshittery that fell for herman cain's lies too. I mean, "maybe he really did do nothing inappropriate for 43 years".... who the fck doesn' thave a bullshit detector?
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how do you know it wasn't the police or racists inciters who originally forced the witnesses to create their original stories
reality is that witnesses change their stories ALL THE TIME
and when they get on the stand and start getting questioned they'll probably change them again
This.
Witness' rarely ever keep the same story up until trial.
Human nature, overthinking, trying to hard to remember.
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great points.
without witnesses saying zimmerman was getitng his ass kicked, his goose is cooked.
now people are celebrating the witnesses being discredited? now I'm starting to understand the level of dumbshittery that fell for herman cain's lies too. I mean, "maybe he really did do nothing inappropriate for 43 years".... who the fck doesn' thave a bullshit detector?
I didnt read anywhere where he lost the witness who had him getting his ass kicked, just the one that "couldnt really tell, but after seeing the TV it had to have been Zimmerman on top".
Lulz.
FYI, those witness' will get torn apart by the defense for switching their story. Thats why it will help the prosecution.
They'll tear them up with their original statements and discredit the holy fuck out of them.
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I didnt read anywhere where he lost the witness who had him getting his ass kicked, just the one that "couldnt really tell, but after seeing the TV it had to have been Zimmerman on top".
Read it again:
A third witness, "Witness 6," told police on the night of the shooting that he saw a black man on top of a lighter-skinned man "just throwing down blows on the guy, MMA-style." He said the lighter-skinned man was calling for help. Interviewed later by investigators, he said he was not sure who was calling for help, and was not sure any punches were thrown.
I think a witness saying Trayvon was punching Zimmerman MMA style would be the PERFECT witness for the defense.
But you don't, huh? Um, okay!
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A third witness, "Witness 6," told police on the night of the shooting that he saw a black man on top of a lighter-skinned man "just throwing down blows on the guy, MMA-style." He said the lighter-skinned man was calling for help. Interviewed later by investigators, he said he was not sure who was calling for help, and was not sure any punches were thrown.
On another note, wow... Zimmerman getting his ass kicked by a 158 pound teenager... raining blows on him...
That shit is just embarassing. He brings shame on neighborhood waatchmen everywhere. He loses his man card. Punked by 158 pounds. Shit, man. Get him a little ballerina tutu to wear to the joint. If he's getting asswhooped by 158 pounds now, he's in for a little surprise if he sees jail time. He better be taking kung fu now, just in case.
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Read it again:
A third witness, "Witness 6," told police on the night of the shooting that he saw a black man on top of a lighter-skinned man "just throwing down blows on the guy, MMA-style." He said the lighter-skinned man was calling for help. Interviewed later by investigators, he said he was not sure who was calling for help, and was not sure any punches were thrown.
I think a witness saying Trayvon was punching Zimmerman MMA style would be the PERFECT witness for the defense.
But you don't, huh? Um, okay!
Im thinking the Defense is going to tear him a new asshole, is he lying in the begining? Is he lying now? What changed his mind? Why isnt he sure anymore? Is it because he cant remember clearly? Or is it because he saw the child-like face the media paraded around on the news for months afterwards?
Because generally what is written down, is the gospel. If they change it, they lost all credibility in a court of law.
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Im thinking the Defense is going to tear him a new asshole, is he lying in the begining? Is he lying now? What changed his mind? Why isnt he sure anymore? Is it because he cant remember clearly? Or is it because he saw the child-like face the media paraded around on the news for months afterwards?
Because generally what is written down, is the gospel. If they change it, they lost all credibility in a court of law.
Agree. A witness changing his or story doesn't help the prosecution because the witness loses credibility. And the prosecution has the burden of proof.
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Im thinking the Defense is going to tear him a new asshole, is he lying in the begining? Is he lying now? What changed his mind? Why isnt he sure anymore? Is it because he cant remember clearly? Or is it because he saw the child-like face the media paraded around on the news for months afterwards?
Because generally what is written down, is the gospel. If they change it, they lost all credibility in a court of law.
the prosecution would LOVE for this witness to lose all credibility in a court of law.
He practically hands the defense an acquittal.
But 33 doesn't think this witness helps the defense. I dunno why. Maybe he just overlooked this particular witness.
Beach bum said that too --
Agree. Doesn't hurt him. It actually hurts the prosecution. What reliable witness do they have who will support a murder charge?
I don't understand what you guys are saying- this witness practically CLEARS zimmerman. Bad guy was raining blows "mma style"? Holy shit, that's gold for the defense.
But BB agrees with 333386 that this witness being impeached somehow "hurts the prosecution".
How, bb?
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the prosecution would LOVE for this witness to lose all credibility in a court of law.
He practically hands the defense an acquittal.
But 33 doesn't think this witness helps the defense. I dunno why. Maybe he just overlooked this particular witness.
Beach bum said that too --
I don't understand what you guys are saying- this witness practically CLEARS zimmerman. Bad guy was raining blows "mma style"? Holy shit, that's gold for the defense.
But BB agrees with 333386 that this witness being impeached somehow "hurts the prosecution".
How, bb?
Cause theyll push that his original statement was correct and that he changed it after watching TV for months and forgetting details, thats why Police take statements THE NIGHT OF.
They'll move to keep his original statement and throw out anything different he has to say, because he either is misremembering or flat out changed his story because of outside influences (Which could very well be real, people are being threatened by others that dont think Trayvon was innocent.).
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great points.
without witnesses saying zimmerman was getitng his ass kicked, his goose is cooked.
now people are celebrating the witnesses being discredited? now I'm starting to understand the level of dumbshittery that fell for herman cain's lies too. I mean, "maybe he really did do nothing inappropriate for 43 years".... who the fck doesn' thave a bullshit detector?
I'm not aware the witnesses are being discarded or that anyone is celebrating
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Cause theyll push that his original statement was correct and that he changed it after watching TV for months and forgetting details, thats why Police take statements THE NIGHT OF.
They'll move to keep his original statement and throw out anything different he has to say, because he either is misremembering or flat out changed his story because of outside influences (Which could very well be real, people are being threatened by others that dont think Trayvon was innocent.).
So to be clear - you think it's better for the defense (as 33 and BB claimed) that a witness gave 2 versions of the story -
instead of just one version that has zimmerman getting his ass whooped?
???
I don't get that. Somehow the jury would rather trust a flipflopper who doesn't remember, over a guy with golden "raining MMA blows on zimmerman" statement?
Is this just yall skipping reading this witness, and just assuming? Cause to me, this witness is awesome for the defense. Him suddenly not remembering hurting the prosecution? WTF? He practically walks zimm out of the courtroom haha. Now he's just another dude who can't remember shit.
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I'm not aware the witnesses are being discarded or that anyone is celebrating
getbiggers who love zimmerman are saying things like
Agree. Doesn't hurt him. It actually hurts the prosecution.
Doesn't make sense. This guy is excellent for zimmerman - and if he can't remember who hit who, he's worthless on the stand. TeamZImm has to be punching walls with this guy no longer useful.
How does it hurt the prosecution, beach bum?
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getbiggers who love zimmerman are saying things like
Doesn't make sense. This guy is excellent for zimmerman - and if he can't remember who hit who, he's worthless on the stand. TeamZImm has to be punching walls with this guy no longer useful.
How does it hurt the prosecution, beach bum?
Bums comment makes no sense
but then Bum also said Zimmerman was "correct" in profiling Martin and that makes no sense either
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On another note, wow... Zimmerman getting his ass kicked by a 158 pound teenager... raining blows on him...
That shit is just embarassing. He brings shame on neighborhood waatchmen everywhere. He loses his man card. Punked by 158 pounds. Shit, man. Get him a little ballerina tutu to wear to the joint. If he's getting asswhooped by 158 pounds now, he's in for a little surprise if he sees jail time. He better be taking kung fu now, just in case.
Floyd Mayweather weighs 158 lb. So, that really isn't an issue.
Besides, Zimmerman doesn't look to be much bigger, anyway. People must keep thinking that Zimmerman is big, because of the media circulating those 2005 mugshots, where he's chubby.
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Floyd Mayweather weighs 158 lb. So, that really isn't an issue.
Besides, Zimmerman doesn't look to be much bigger, anyway. People must keep thinking that Zimmerman is big, because of the media circulating those 2005 mugshots, where he's chubby.
we still dont know if zimmerman really got MMA'd.
Trayvon had one mark on one knuckle, right? Weird for a big fight.
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On another note, wow... Zimmerman getting his ass kicked by a 158 pound teenager... raining blows on him...
That shit is just embarassing. He brings shame on neighborhood waatchmen everywhere. He loses his man card. Punked by 158 pounds. Shit, man. Get him a little ballerina tutu to wear to the joint. If he's getting asswhooped by 158 pounds now, he's in for a little surprise if he sees jail time. He better be taking kung fu now, just in case.
Except for that little tidbit about Trayvon having what, 4-6 inches on Zimmerman? ::)
17 years old is a grown man. We've all seen the pictures of these black college football recruits and most of them look like they're pushing 40.
Then again, it's funny that a big pussy like you, who won't leave your house without a gun, is talking about someone losing a fight as embarrassing.
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Then again, it's funny that a big pussy like you, who won't leave your house without a gun, is talking about someone losing a fight as embarrassing.
LMFAO. Now that's a slap of truth.
240, endlessly calling this guy a bitch, is too much of a pussy to leave his mom's house without a gun.
This needs stickied.
Post of the fucking week.
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LMFAO. Now that's a slap of truth.
240, endlessly calling this guy a bitch, is too much of a pussy to leave his mom's house without a gun.
This needs stickied.
Post of the fucking week.
I'm mid 30s, 185 to 190 pounds, I wrestled and did some TKD in high school and SDSI since. I dont claim to be a ninja but I think I at least hold my own in situations.
zimmerman, of course, could not. but then again, he's an obama voter, he beats women, and shoves LEO. He's a bitch from square one.
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I'm mid 30s, 185 to 190 pounds, I wrestled and did some TKD in high school and SDSI since. I dont claim to be a ninja but I think I at least hold my own in situations.
zimmerman, of course, could not. but then again, he's an obama voter, he beats women, and shoves LEO. He's a bitch from square one.
Jesus Christ do you ever quit with your bullshit?
Shoved a LEO, you fucking idiot, a LEO plainclothes attacked his friend and he reacted not knowing it was a LEO.
FFS.
As for the woman, its not even clear that ever fucking happened.
Obama voter? Who gives a fuck.
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Shoved a LEO, you fucking idiot, a LEO plainclothes attacked his friend and he reacted not knowing it was a LEO.
link to the circumstances here?
A plainclothes law enforcement officer "ATTACKED" his friend? Link? Did the officer lose his badge? And why did zimmerman get alcohol counseling for it? He was underage and drinking at the time? Yikes.
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link to the circumstances here?
A plainclothes law enforcement officer "ATTACKED" his friend? Link? Did the officer lose his badge? And why did zimmerman get alcohol counseling for it? He was underage and drinking at the time? Yikes.
It was at a bar. Everyone was drunk.
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he beats women
This kid never tells the truth. lol
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It was at a bar. Everyone was drunk.
Link? or are you just winging it?
I didn't know it was okay to strike a person, as long as you were drunk. Sweet.
Link?
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•In 2005, Zimmerman, then 20, was arrested and charged with “resisting officer with violence” and “battery of law enforcement officer,” both which are third-degree felonies. The charge was reduced to “resisting officer without violence” and then waived when he entered an alcohol education program. Contemporaneous accounts indicate he shoved an officer who was questioning a friend for alleged underage drinking at an Orange County bar.
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/27/10894561-zimmerman-accused-of-domestic-violence-fighting-with-a-police-officer?lite
From MSNBC. This is the officers story.
Other reports have people saying he didnt know it was a cop until after he got in a shoving match.
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•In 2005, Zimmerman, then 20, was arrested and charged with “resisting officer with violence” and “battery of law enforcement officer,” both which are third-degree felonies. The charge was reduced to “resisting officer without violence” and then waived when he entered an alcohol education program. Contemporaneous accounts indicate he shoved an officer who was questioning a friend for alleged underage drinking at an Orange County bar.
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/27/10894561-zimmerman-accused-of-domestic-violence-fighting-with-a-police-officer?lite
From MSNBC. This is the officers story.
Other reports have people saying he didnt know it was a cop until after he got in a shoving match.
I thought his friend was ATTACKED> He was questioned, then?
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Sounds like even back then, he was the kind of guy to throw himself into a violent situation without clear information.
Crazy how history repeats itself.
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I thought his friend was ATTACKED> He was questioned, then?
The account I read, which im not going to sift google for 1 hit in the middle of 5000 from liberal rags, said that a plainclothes cop came in and grabbed his buddy and started to get rough, and Zimmerman shoved the dude not knowing who he was. The cop then tried to charge him for resisting officer with violence.
Which he pleaded not guilty, and it was dropped down more than once because the officer was full of shit and the prosecution wouldnt be able to get it to stick, and totally dropped when he agreed to alcohol counseling.
I gave you a fucking MSNBC article assuming you would be able to figure out that if a place that wants to see Zimmerman burns reported only this, that you may wonder what they left out.
I guess thats what I get for assuming you actually arent a moron.
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I'm mid 30s, 185 to 190 pounds, I wrestled and did some TKD in high school and SDSI since. I dont claim to be a ninja but I think I at least hold my own in situations.
zimmerman, of course, could not. but then again, he's an obama voter, he beats women, and shoves LEO. He's a bitch from square one.
You can hold your own?
HAHAHAHA...yeah, nothing says you can hold your own like packing a piece everytime you go out.
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You can hold your own?
HAHAHAHA...yeah, nothing says you can hold your own like packing a piece everytime you go out.
it's weird. Many people who may commit violent crimes don't like to havee kung fu matchups. They like to stab, shoot, or fight in numbers.
If someone comes at me punching, I use my hands and feet to get the hell outta there.
If someone comes at me with deadly force, I have a gun for that.
I think only a fool would leave any possible weapons off the table.
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The account I read, which im not going to sift google for 1 hit in the middle of 5000 from liberal rags, said that a plainclothes cop came in and grabbed his buddy and started to get rough, and Zimmerman shoved the dude not knowing who he was. The cop then tried to charge him for resisting officer with violence.
Which he pleaded not guilty, and it was dropped down more than once because the officer was full of shit and the prosecution wouldnt be able to get it to stick, and totally dropped when he agreed to alcohol counseling.
I gave you a fucking MSNBC article assuming you would be able to figure out that if a place that wants to see Zimmerman burns reported only this, that you may wonder what they left out.
I guess thats what I get for assuming you actually arent a moron.
Ah, well, if his dad's a judge and this case was that flimsy, it's very odd he pleaded down and didn't have it outright dismissed. Wasnt this the incident that cost him his college dream of the whole law enforcement major thing?
I dunno, it's a stretch to just assume he was being the hero, and he's the victim. And he's the victim against a crazy woman who charged him with violence. And he's the victim against trayvon. You know, after a while, a pattern emerges of this guy always being the hero but always getting in trouble for trying to save the day. Either he's the unluckiest guy in America, or he's an angry busybody who just explodes at times. Pattern definitely clear here - and when we see what the defense already admitted will be some daming thigns from his past we haven't heard yet... gulp!
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Where the hell do you get him being a complete victim? No one is arguing that but your retarded ass. Are you incapable of realizing things dont fall neatly into 2 catagories, right and wrong, villian and victim? No situation is he the "victim", especially not the one where he attacked a plainclothes. Its called "gray" areas, thats what the LAW is for. Thats why we dont convict on MORALITY.
Are you really that immature?
Oh, I keep forgetting, you are.
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Where the hell do you get him being a complete victim? No one is arguing that but your retarded ass. Are you incapable of realizing things dont fall neatly into 2 catagories, right and wrong, villian and victim? No situation is he the "victim", especially not the one where he attacked a plainclothes. Its called "gray" areas, thats what the LAW is for. Thats why we dont convict on MORALITY.
Are you really that immature?
Oh, I keep forgetting, you are.
he was being a hero when he got involved with a cop shaking down his friend buying alcohol underage?
he was being a victim was accused of domestic violence by fiance
he was being a victim when trayvon attacked him
In all of these cases, the oh-so-cruel justic system attacks poor bobby zimmerman.
Reminds me of when all those on-so-mean women all lied about herman cain. All that smoke, but no fire, no way. He's innocent. Well, except for he wasn't, was he.