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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: SF1900 on January 16, 2013, 10:38:45 AM
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http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=257362
The following is a list, provided by the White House, of executive actions President Obama plans to take to address gun violence.
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.
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Just so much bullshit, seems to me he wants to consolidate people's backgrounds into an easily accesible database, get more people into the healthcare database... and everything else is window dressing.
My GF has a seven year old.....ever since the day of the shooting, The town has had a cop in front of her school...no bills, votes, mandates...they just did the smart fucking thing.
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::)
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Let me save the US govt some money on this:
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
Answer - mentally disturbed psychos on a bucket load of drugs.
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I don't have a problem with these 23 things, many are just clarifications or restatements of things currently happening.
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Since he's going.against the oath of the US, going against the constitution and being an illegal act in itself, here should be no reason why we just can't keep doing what we've been doing. Just like he thinks he's the president, he can go Fuck himself.
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Guns are a pretty big part of gun violence.
UK violent crime stats don't disprove this basic point.
I've never heard of 20+ kids being mass-murdered with a knife or fist in a western country?
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Since he's going.against the oath of the US, going against the constitution and being an illegal act in itself, here should be no reason why we just can't keep doing what we've been doing. Just like he thinks he's the president, he can go Fuck himself.
You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
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Guns are a pretty big part of gun violence.
UK violent crime stats don't disprove this basic point.
I've never heard of 20+ kids being mass-murdered with a knife or fist in a western country?
So because of a few psychos you're going to penalize the entire.country? If the school wouldhave been armed, the shooter would have been stopped before hand.
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(http://www.irononsticker.com/images/2012/09/18/Desert%20Eagle.jpg)
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You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
First amendment is no longer needed. ::)
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You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
Nope.
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You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
He does nothing within.the law.
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Just so much bullshit, seems to me he wants to consolidate people's backgrounds into an easily accesible database, get more people into the healthcare database... and everything else is window dressing.
My GF has a seven year old.....ever since the day of the shooting, The town has had a cop in front of her school...no bills, votes, mandates...they just did the smart fucking thing.
You must get stopped daily carrying around those 21" guns. ::)
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You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
No, unless it is something totally unconscionable like slavery or suffrage, it shouldn't be altered.
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New York, the murder capital of the USA. KID KILLERS at that.
In 2009, the highest number of reported abortions occurred in New York (119,996)
http://www.abort73.com/abortion_facts/us_abortion_statistics/
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So because of a few psychos you're going to penalize the entire.country? If the school wouldhave been armed, the shooter would have been stopped before hand.
Bwahaha , arming people has already led to shootings.
But you think arming even more people won't?
I don't mean to sound disrespectful but this is what the rest of the world finds so funny. "let's make the next massacre a free for all bloodbath!" Remember these psychos only reveal themselves as such when the shooting starts. Give every teacher a gun and you're just upping the odds.
You have more guns than other civilised countries and more mass shootings. So our answer is .....more more more guns. Cool!
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Bwahaha , arming people has already led to shootings.
But you think arming even more people won't?
I don't mean to sound disrespectful but this is what the rest of the world finds so funny. "let's make the next massacre a free for all bloodbath!" Remember these psychos only reveal themselves as such when the shooting starts. Give every teacher a gun and you're just upping the odds.
You have more guns than other civilised countries and more mass shootings. So our answer is .....more more more guns. Cool!
As an non American, I say "speak for yourself". Civilized countries have been gripped by dictatorships and HORROR has ensued for the population. 10's of millions killed. DWARFING what has happened in the USA.
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First amendment is no longer needed. ::)
Not what I meant, genius. ::) ::) Think a little more deeply about the statement.
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As an non American, I say "speak for yourself". Civilized countries have been gripped by dictatorships and HORROR has ensued for the population. 10's of millions killed. DWARFING what has happened in the USA.
Dang I meant to write your haha. I wouldn't say France, Germany, Spain, England, Italy etc have any genocides going on right now.
And if there was a word war III I don't see how students and teachers with handguns are going to help influence things either way? You don't have to ditch your nukes to irradicate one shitty part of the system. People used to think abolishing slavery would undermine the constitution and fuck up the whole constitution. Then progress, development, civilised thought etc prevailed.
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Political window dressing. Carry on.
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Dang I meant to write your haha. I wouldn't say France, Germany, Spain, England, Italy etc have any genocides going on right now.
And if there was a word war III I don't see how students and teachers with handguns are going to help influence things either way? You don't have to ditch your nukes to irradicate one shitty part of the system. People used to think abolishing slavery would undermine the constitution and fuck up the whole constitution. Then progress, development, civilised thought etc prevailed.
nah bro the constitution is solid, there is never a need to change. Unless is slavery, woman's rights, umm gay rights now? umm gun laws now...
Why is the US full of morons? what is the education system like. You have coach up there claiming he is not president or what he is doing is illegal, meanwhile he has signed the fewest executive orders in modern history.
The fucking stupidity.
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Dang I meant to write your haha. I wouldn't say France, Germany, Spain, England, Italy etc have any genocides going on right now.
And if there was a word war III I don't see how students and teachers with handguns are going to help influence things either way? You don't have to ditch your nukes to irradicate one shitty part of the system. People used to think abolishing slavery would undermine the constitution and fuck up the whole constitution. Then progress, development, civilised thought etc prevailed.
Every one of those countries you mentioned are fucked bad in one way or another. MUCH worse than the US so comparing those countries is ridiculous. Obama is desperately trying to make us like Europe for what ever reason without any authority.
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None of these would have done anything to prevent the angry young loony with a gun shootings. Brings industry nicely into the surveillance game tho.
Mfw the NRA and the ACLU picket 1600 side by side.
(http://insidejimmydevioushead.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/thrilling-cinema-thursday-1.jpg?w=430)
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nah bro the constitution is solid, there is never a need to change. Unless is slavery, woman's rights, umm gay rights now? umm gun laws now...
Why is the US full of morons? what is the education system like. You have coach up there claiming he is not president or what he is doing is illegal, meanwhile he has signed the fewest executive orders in modern history.
The fucking stupidity.
It is illegal dimwit. This asshole because he THINKS he's president, is beyond the law and can write it on his own with no consent as he see fit. Even the president (according to the CONSTITUTION) has rules and laws to follow.
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Not what I meant, genius. ::) ::) Think a little more deeply about the statement.
Your statement is as fucking stupid as the majority of your posts are. If one amendment should be altered as time changes, then they'll eventually make the argument that every amendment can be altered.
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Which of these do you support, which do you think are wrong?
The following is a list, provided by the White House, of executive actions President Obama plans to take to address gun violence.
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.
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I have heard a lot about obama coming for assault weapons, hig-cap mags, etc.
Are these changes disguised under one of these numbers? Vaguely written in somewhere? that's what I suspect.
it appears the NRA has supported many or most of these. "Place an SRO officer at every school" was their #1 talking point, and Obama adopted it!
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It is illegal dimwit. This asshole because he THINKS he's president, is beyond the law and can write it on his own with no consent as he see fit. Even the president (according to the CONSTITUTION) has rules and laws to follow.
it is well within his rights and has been enacted a record low amount of times in his tenure. Meaning Bush did this more, Reagan also.
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I have heard a lot about obama coming for assault weapons, hig-cap mags, etc.
Are these changes disguised under one of these numbers? Vaguely written in somewhere? that's what I suspect.
it appears the NRA has supported many or most of these. "Place an SRO officer at every school" was their #1 talking point, and Obama adopted it!
Please stop talking. He wants the AWB ban reinstated and he wants high capacity magazines banned. The only reason he isn't going to get it is because of Congress. That does not change the fact that he's trying to get them banned and has indicated he plans to use what's left of his campaign network to get it.
You claimed he would never come after the guns. You lied.
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It is illegal dimwit. This asshole because he THINKS he's president, is beyond the law and can write it on his own with no consent as he see fit. Even the president (according to the CONSTITUTION) has rules and laws to follow.
Bush fucking dwarfs everyone in number of executive orders, dude smashes everyone by a country mile, he made so many EO's that they don't fit on one page of text.
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Please stop talking. He wants the AWB ban reinstated and he wants high capacity magazines banned. The only reason he isn't going to get it is because of Congress. That does not change the fact that he's trying to get them banned and has indicated he plans to use what's left of his campaign network to get it.
You claimed he would never come after the guns. You lied.
how is any of that "coming after your guns"
you'll still have guns when all is said and done and I expect Obama will try to get an AWB and ban on high capacity magazines and if he does it won't effect your life one single bit
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Your statement is as fucking stupid as the majority of your posts are. If one amendment should be altered as time changes, then they'll eventually make the argument that every amendment can be altered.
haha, the majority of my posts? I rarely make posts pertaining to a specific side. I just post what is out there in the news. People can make what they want of it. As for my other posts, most of them are trolling. Keeps it interesting. I actually have no stake in the gun debate. I post these articles, as well as most of my posts, because of the reaction it gets.
Other than that, I really do not try too hard to make such a great statement on GB. But hey, if making awesome posts on GB makes you feel proud, more power to you.
As for altering the constitution, your statement may be true. People may alter one amendment, thus creating a snowball effect where all other amendments become altered. However, I would like to think that, for the most part, this would not be the case. Then again, politicians are not logical or rationale people, soo......
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how is any of that "coming after your guns"
you'll still have guns when all is said and done and I expect Obama will try to get an AWB and ban on high capacity magazines and if he does it won't effect your life one single bit
240 said that Obama would never so much as broach the idea of gun control. He has. And the only reason he's not getting what he wants is that thankfully the Dems do not control all of Congress.
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240 said that Obama would never so much as broach the idea of gun control. He has. And the only reason he's not getting what he wants is that thankfully the Dems do not control all of Congress.
ok - well I don't have all of Robs posts memorized
You might want to hold off on saying Obama is not getting what he wants until he actually tries to do something
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Which of these do you support, which do you think are wrong?
The following is a list, provided by the White House, of executive actions President Obama plans to take to address gun violence.
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.
I see nothing on this list that should bother anyone
kind of nuts that we haven't had anyone in charge at the ATF for something like 6 years now
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The NRA actually supported many of those 23 things. it's more about getting current law enforced, keeping guns outta the hands of bad guys.
If obama was banning high-caps and rifles with exec order, I'd be screaming louder than anyone. But he didn't do that.
I believe Reagan, Bush2, Clinton, and many other presidents have WANTED bands on high-caps and Assault rifles... Wanting it and passing it into law are two very different things. I *want* to bone jessica alba on a daily basis. Probably won't happen.
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I have always said that politically, going after guns of americans will sink any political career.
An incumbent POTUS doesn't have to worry bout that, but house and senate members sure do.
I didn't think Obama would go after guns - and in these exec orders, he did not.
I'll ask again - with what items on that list do yall have a problem with?
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Which of the 23 do you guys disagree with?
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While there are a few things on this list that might do some good (the ones regarding mental health) there's nothing on here that will that has anything to do with assault weapons as they are out of the reach of executive order and must go through congress which won't happen.
We'll see how it all plays out but hopefully I can finish my AR build now and buy some fucking ammo.
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240, do you have the actual list? These are not worded like executive orders.
and start posting links please.
Some of the stuff looks silly to me... Like directing the CDC to redirect their time/funds toward this? Oh yea, that makes sense lol ::)
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Dang I meant to write your haha. I wouldn't say France, Germany, Spain, England, Italy etc have any genocides going on right now.
And if there was a word war III I don't see how students and teachers with handguns are going to help influence things either way? You don't have to ditch your nukes to irradicate one shitty part of the system. People used to think abolishing slavery would undermine the constitution and fuck up the whole constitution. Then progress, development, civilised thought etc prevailed.
Maybe you should look at some history books and read what happened in Vietnam and Afghanistan. Even bolt action rifles proved to be really good weapons against Armies turned into local Police overnight..
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240, do you have the actual list? These are not worded like executive orders.
and start posting links please.
Some of the stuff looks silly to me... Like directing the CDC to redirect their time/funds toward this? Oh yea, that makes sense lol ::)
Lol this shit reads like it was scribbled down on a napkin at 2 in the morning last night
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Lol this shit reads like it was scribbled down on a napkin at 2 in the morning last night
yea, it kinda reads like a shopping list lol..
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how is any of that "coming after your guns"
you'll still have guns when all is said and done and I expect Obama will try to get an AWB and ban on high capacity magazines and if he does it won't effect your life one single bit
how is any of that "coming after your guns"
you'll still have guns when all is said and done and I expect Obama will try to get an AWB and ban on high capacity magazines and if he does it won't effect your life one single bit
Lmfao so you agree that Obama wants an Awb but you disagree that he wants our guns?
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Lmfao so you agree that Obama wants an Awb but you disagree that he wants our guns?
correct
you'll have plenty of other guns available to you if they put through a AWB
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Reagan, Carter and Ford all signed this letter supporting the 1994 AWB :(
Bush2 supported it. Clinton enacted it. Obama supported it. Romney signed one for mass that was even stricter.
At least obama is a very polarizing figure... a president romney might actually pushing for an AWB now... and many repubs would vote with him. At least with obama behind it, we know it'll probably never reach House floor for a vote, as repubs are vowing to destroy it.
Obama will get his 23 little actions, but i'm sure GOP House keeps this bill from ever seeing senate much less obama's desk.
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I have heard a lot about obama coming for assault weapons, hig-cap mags, etc.
Are these changes disguised under one of these numbers? Vaguely written in somewhere? that's what I suspect.
it appears the NRA has supported many or most of these. "Place an SRO officer at every school" was their #1 talking point, and Obama adopted it!
This is classic playing the fence by Obama. All of these things simply enforce laws that are currently in place. He had to do something to keep the hippy go free free anti gun crackaloos happy, but couldn't do anything substantial because he knows it would be deemed unconstitutional. He needs congress to make laws... the president cannot make laws for all those who think he can do whatever he wants.
And nothing substantial will get through congress either probably. The libtards will grandstand and blame the republicans for wanting to kill kids etc. right out of the play book. But in the mean time, voting to take away firearms is INSTANT LOSS of your seat in either the house or the senate, so no votes will even take place. Typical liberal nonsense... use a tragedy that happened under Obama and make it the republicans fault.
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correct
you'll have plenty of other guns available to you if they put through a AWB
He still wants to ban certain guns that ppl own and like.
You don't feel that coming after guns that ppl own is taking their guns?
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This is classic playing the fence by Obama. All of these things simply enforce laws that are currently in place. He had to do something to keep the hippy go free free anti gun crackaloos happy, but couldn't do anything substantial because he knows it would be deemed unconstitutional. He needs congress to make laws... the president cannot make laws for all those who think he can do whatever he wants.
And nothing substantial will get through congress either probably. The libtards will grandstand and blame the republicans for wanting to kill kids etc. right out of the play book. But in the mean time, voting to take away firearms is INSTANT LOSS of your seat in either the house or the senate, so no votes will even take place. Typical liberal nonsense... use a tragedy that happened under Obama and make it the republicans fault.
good points. Obama gets to pacify his base with rhetoric. nothing changes.
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This is classic playing the fence by Obama. All of these things simply enforce laws that are currently in place. He had to do something to keep the hippy go free free anti gun crackaloos happy, but couldn't do anything substantial because he knows it would be deemed unconstitutional. He needs congress to make laws... the president cannot make laws for all those who think he can do whatever he wants.
And nothing substantial will get through congress either probably. The libtards will grandstand and blame the republicans for wanting to kill kids etc. right out of the play book. But in the mean time, voting to take away firearms is INSTANT LOSS of your seat in either the house or the senate, so no votes will even take place. Typical liberal nonsense... use a tragedy that happened under Obama and make it the republicans fault.
lol @ "crackaloos"
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He still wants to ban certain guns that ppl own and like.
You don't feel that coming after guns that ppl own is taking their guns?
No, I don't
why do you keep asking me the same question
Are my answers hard to understand
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No, I don't
why do you keep asking me the same question
Are my answers hard to understand
yes they are hard to understand b/c they arent consistant or logical...
in your mind taking one of my guns isnt coming for my gun...
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The 1st time a doctor attempts to ask me about the firearms in my home, I'm going to ask him how many black strap-on dildos are tucked away in his wifes closet.
Sorry Doc, unless I'm diagnosed with some sort of serious mental condition, the firearms in my home are none of your fucking business.
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yes they are hard to understand b/c they arent consistant or logical...
in your mind taking one of my guns isnt coming for my gun...
you previously said GUNS and now it "gun"
if there is an AWB you'll still be able to have GUNS
are you just pretending to play dumb or is there something more going on here?
Lmfao so you agree that Obama wants an Awb but you disagree that he wants our guns?
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The 1st time a doctor attempts to ask me about the firearms in my home, I'm going to ask him how many black strap-on dildos are tucked away in his wifes closet.
Sorry Doc, unless I'm diagnosed with some sort of serious mental condition, the firearms in my home are none of your fucking business.
hahah yea, Im going to look them straight in the eye and tell them thats none of their business.
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you previously said GUNS and now it "gun"
if there is an AWB you'll still be able to have GUNS
are you just pretending to play dumb or is there something more going on here?
LOL what about the "assault weapons" I own, if they try to confiscate that do you believe they are coming after my guns?
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LOL what about the "assault weapons" I own, if they try to confiscate that do you believe they are coming after my guns?
not unless they leave with all your guns and even then you can still buy more of whatever is still legal
how about you stop bothering me with your nonsense
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it is well within his rights and has been enacted a record low amount of times in his tenure. Meaning Bush did this more, Reagan also.
I don't know why you keep calling others stupid, when you're clearly the idiot.
For the type of EO being discussed, it's never been challenged on it's constitutionality so it's anyone's guess as to whether the President has the authority.
Secondly, you're talking as the quantity has any relevance. It doesn't.
As long as the EO's apply to matters of the Executive and don't run into potential constitutional conflicts, the President can issue a million. Or he can issue none.
Qty is irrelevant.
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Which of the 23 do you guys disagree with?
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
I don't care for this one. I pay a doctor to perform a service. I pay him for his experieince and talent...not to be my daddy and ask me about "guns in my home". It's a slippery slope from that to doctors being required to tell a gov agent that I have guns in my home.
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16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
I don't care for this one. I pay a doctor to perform a service. I pay him for his experieince and talent...not to be my daddy and ask me about "guns in my home". It's a slippery slope from that to doctors being required to tell a gov agent that I have guns in my home.
all is say is "does not prohibit"
it doesn't say they are required to do so or that you are required to answer
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You dont think the constitution should be altered as times change?
Human nature doesn't change, so why should we change a document designed to protect us from exactly that?
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all is say is "does not prohibit"
it doesn't say they are required to do so or that you are required to answer
why would doctors ever even ask about guns in a home?
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why would doctors ever even ask about guns in a home?
I can think of at least a few reason
doesn't surprise me at all that you can't even think of one
par for the course
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why would doctors ever even ask about guns in a home?
I don't understand that either, unless it's a mental health doctor and their patient has some sort of severe mental issue. Groink is right, seems like they are trying to make it easier to create a database of firearms owners.
The other one that bothers me is them trying to get everyone to offer up their data to go into the Federal background check program... Is that program only for firearms, or is that the same program that employers access when they're screening potential employees?
If its the latter, that seems extremely wrong.
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I can think of at least a few reason
doesn't surprise me at all that you can't even think of one
par for the course
go straight ahead and lay them on us straw
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I don't understand that either, unless it's a mental health doctor and their patient has some sort of severe mental issue. Groink is right, seems like they are trying to make it easier to create a database of firearms owners.
The other one that bothers me is them trying to get everyone to offer up their data to go into the Federal background check program... Is that program only for firearms, or is that the same program that employers access when they're screening potential employees?
If its the latter, that seems extremely wrong.
why don't we already have a base of firearm owners ?
I doubt reminding doctors that that are not prohibited from asking about guns has anything to do with creating a database (let's hope not because it would be a ridiculously stupid way of doing so)
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go straight ahead and lay them on us straw
person is being treated for depression
person is on mood altering drugs
small kids in the home
kids with specific issues (like the shooter in CT)
person has a history of alcohol or drug abuse
that took about ten seconds
I'm sure there are many more
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why don't we already have a base of firearm owners ?
I doubt reminding doctors that that are not prohibited from asking about guns has anything to do with creating a database (let's hope not because it would be a ridiculously stupid way of doing so)
b/c ppl will use it to single out gun owners....
now please enlighten us as to why a doctor would want/need to ask you about guns in your house?
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why don't we already have a base of firearm owners ?
Because it's no ones business if I have a firearm in my home.
And what possible reason could they have for reminding doctors that its not prohibited to ask about firearms, unless they want them to be making notes? Seriously, why even bring it up unless they have some reason that they want doctors to be asking people about firearms? It's none of their fucking business.
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Because it's no ones business if I have a firearm in my home.
And what possible reason could they have for reminding doctors that its not prohibited to ask about firearms, unless they want them to be making notes? Seriously, why even bring it up unless they have some reason that they want doctors to be asking people about firearms? It's none of their fucking business.
sure it is
and again, no one is saying doctors are required to ask about them
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Number #10
Wonder if they'll include when then government loses weapons as well.
Who knows...might happen...someday...aroun d Mexic...oh wait...
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person is being treated for depression
person is on mood altering drugs
small kids in the home
kids with specific issues (like the shooter in CT)
person has a history of alcohol or drug abuse
that took about ten seconds
I'm sure there are many more
all the things you named are addressed by mental health professionals, not physicians....
why would your average everyday physician need to ask you about guns in your house?
You could also make the same arguments about asking them about owning a car.....seeing as cars kill more ppl with drunk driving than guns shouldnt that be more of a concern?
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sure it is
and again, no one is saying doctors are required to ask about them
Really? Why? Why is it anyones business what is in my home if I'm a responsible and mentally stable adult?
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all the things you named are addressed by mental health professionals, not physicians....
why would your average everyday physician need to ask you about guns in your house?
You could also make the same arguments about asking them about owning a car.....seeing as cars kill more ppl with drunk driving than guns shouldnt that be more of a concern?
who do you think writes prescriptions and many doctors (GP's) talk to their clients about drugs, alcohol, depression etc..
spare me the lame arguments about cars
why not just stick with hammers if you want to make dumb arguments
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Really? Why? Why is it anyones business what is in my home if I'm a responsible and mentally stable adult?
in order to keep track of gun ownership
we keep track of lots of other stuff and there is nothing in the Constitution saying we can't keep track of who owns guns
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in order to keep track of gun ownership
we keep track of lots of other stuff and there is nothing in the Constitution saying we can't keep track of who owns guns
Well sir, you can go fuck yourself. It's no ones business if I own a firearm or not, it's called privacy. As I said in another thread, how many black strap on dildos are in your wifes closet? Oh, wait, thats none of my business, right?
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who do you think writes prescriptions and many doctors (GP's) talk to their clients about drugs, alcohol, depression etc..
spare me the lame arguments about cars
why not just stick with hammers if you want to make dumb arguments
yes mental health professionals prescribe medicine for depression, alcohol etc...GP's do not!!!
you have to be diagnosed, a GP does not have the ability to diagnose someone with depression.
the care argument holds just as much water as your gun arguments brainchild
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Well sir, you can go fuck yourself. It's no ones business if I own a firearm or not, it's called privacy. As I said in another thread, how many black strap on dildos are in your wifes closet? Oh, wait, thats none of my business, right?
you sound like a man all out of arguments
we keep track of who own cars don't we
why is that not a violation of your privacy
we keep track of medical devices and I'm sure plenty of other stuff
where is the outrage about your privacy being violated
Doesn't the public have a right to know who in their community is stockpiling deadly weapons
Why do you think you privacy is more important than public safety
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in order to keep track of gun ownership
we keep track of lots of other stuff and there is nothing in the Constitution saying we can't keep track of who owns guns
HAHAHAH epic misunderstanding of the constitution...
The constitution lays out what powers the federal govt has, everything else is left to the states.
The constitution is not meant as a jumping board for govt power but a limit to, those powers not enumerated in the constitution to the federal govt are left to the states.
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Who Can Prescribe Antidepressants?
Medical doctors (practitioners whose name is followed by MD or DO) have the ability to prescribe medications, including antidepressant drugs. Many people see their general physician, family physician or internist to discuss symptoms of depression and get a prescription for antidepressants. Physician's assistants (PA) may also prescribe these medications.
Read more: What Kind of Doctors Can Prescribe Depression Medication? | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/facts_5575909_kind-can-prescribe-depression-medication.html#ixzz2IBmwbliZ
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Who Can Prescribe Antidepressants?
Medical doctors (practitioners whose name is followed by MD or DO) have the ability to prescribe medications, including antidepressant drugs. Many people see their general physician, family physician or internist to discuss symptoms of depression and get a prescription for antidepressants. Physician's assistants (PA) may also prescribe these medications.
Read more: What Kind of Doctors Can Prescribe Depression Medication? | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/facts_5575909_kind-can-prescribe-depression-medication.html#ixzz2IBmwbliZ
good to know, this is part of the problem in our mental health system.
This should be the tenant of the gun violence reduction legislation. These ppl should be seeing qualified mental health professionals not GP's. This is like taking your car to the car wash and having them look at your engine.
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you sound like a man all out of arguments
we keep track of who own cars don't we
why is that not a violation of your privacy
we keep track of medical devices and I'm sure plenty of other stuff
where is the outrage about your privacy being violated
Doesn't the public have a right to know who in their community is stockpiling deadly weapons
Why do you think you privacy is more important than public safety
Not out of arguments, just not wasting anymore time discussing such things when we both know that nothing either of us says is going to change our opinions, so why bother? To me, you sound like an insane man, perfectly ok with letting the government into your house, which I am not ok with.
I've learned long ago that arguing with you is like arguing with a wall, so now I just say my peace and let it go.
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Nope.
The bill of rights, including the 2nd are all changes to the consitution. So clearly it does get changed as time goes along.
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Not out of arguments, just not wasting anymore time discussing such things when we both know that nothing either of us says is going to change our opinions, so why bother? To me, you sound like an insane man, perfectly ok with letting the government into your house, which I am not ok with.
I've learned long ago that arguing with you is like arguing with a wall, so now I just say my peace and let it go.
that stems from him not understanding the constitution....
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person is being treated for depression
person is on mood altering drugs
small kids in the home
kids with specific issues (like the shooter in CT)
person has a history of alcohol or drug abuse
that took about ten seconds
I'm sure there are many more
The problem with this line of reasoning is that it makes people guilty before they've committed a crime. You can have all those "disorders" and a firearm in the house and NEVER break the law. But those "risks" thrown into a computer database being perused by a beauracrat could end you up on a list that compromises your liberties.
Maybe you think the government can be trusted with those type of powers and information but I don't.
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Nothing the president put forth today would have prevented the school shooting.
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HAHAHAH epic misunderstanding of the constitution...
The constitution lays out what powers the federal govt has, everything else is left to the states.
The constitution is not meant as a jumping board for govt power but a limit to, those powers not enumerated in the constitution to the federal govt are left to the states.
feel free to show me where in the Constitution it says the government is prohibited from keeping track of firearms or anything else
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Merrian Webster's definition of "Straw Man"
1
: a weak or imaginary opposition (as an argument or adversary) set up only to be easily confuted
2
: a person set up to serve as a cover for a usually questionable transaction
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I don't have a problem right now, but I'm waiting for the full draft to be picked apart to see if anything is hidden in there. Also, we have to see how his administration carries out these directives, they might be trying to lull gun owners into feeling safe. Executive orders wouldn't effect much aside from firearms imports, but if they can stack the ATF in their favor, they could slowly change things through reclassifications, etc......
Right now, they know they don't have enough support for wide spread measures, so they are probably hanging back. The big gun control battle is shaping up in the individual states, I guarantee we'll see a lot of Democrat controlled states adopt NY style gun control measures.
Also they might also be waiting to see if they can tilt the Scotus. Many of the Supreme Court Justices are very old and close to retirement. Right now, it is only a tiny bit pro 2nd amendment. If the democrats can gain control of those seats, it gets a whole lot rougher to challenge any new gun laws.
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Merrian Webster's definition of "Straw Man"
1
: a weak or imaginary opposition (as an argument or adversary) set up only to be easily confuted
2
: a person set up to serve as a cover for a usually questionable transaction
Basic Republican strategy which is why I chose the name
You'll see it used often where the "defender" takes the topic at hand and changes it to something else and then argues against the changed topic or "straw man" and pretends he/she is arguing against the original topic
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feel free to show me where in the Constitution it says the government is prohibited from keeping track of firearms or anything else
AGAIN understand the CONSTITUTION!!!
the constitution lays out what the federal govt can do, anything not enumerated to the federal govt is left to the state govt.
I dont have to show you where it says it cant, you have to show us where it says it can BRAINCHILD!!!
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O-POFS is not my president - not now - not ever
Fuck obama
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AGAIN understand the CONSTITUTION!!!
the constitution lays out what the federal govt can do, anything not enumerated to the federal govt is left to the state govt.
I dont have to show you where it says it cant, you have to show us where it says it can BRAINCHILD!!!
are you fucking serious
watch the government made a national registry of all gun owners
nothing stopping them - not even your fucking retarded beliefs about The Constitution
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are you fucking serious
watch the government made a national registry of all gun owners
nothing stopping them - not even your fucking retarded beliefs about The Constitution
O-HITLER is not my president not now not ever.
F you and F him
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The problem with this line of reasoning is that it makes people guilty before they've committed a crime. You can have all those "disorders" and a firearm in the house and NEVER break the law. But those "risks" thrown into a computer database being perused by a beauracrat could end you up on a list that compromises your liberties.
Maybe you think the government can be trusted with those type of powers and information but I don't.
guilty of what?
all it says it that they are not prohibited from asking about guns
that's it
no requirement to ask
no requirement to document
no requirement to answer
this is not a way to track guns (and if it were it would suck)
It's most likely nothing more than remind doctors they can bring up the topic if they think it's a potential health concern to the patient
frankly I'm stunned we don't already keep track of every single gun in this country already
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O-HITLER is not my president not now not ever.
F you and F him
he is most definitely your President
hopefully Cuomo's new gun laws will include a way that the public can report potentially mentally damaged people who own guns
I will look forward to pointing them in your direction
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are you fucking serious
watch the government made a national registry of all gun owners
nothing stopping them - not even your fucking retarded beliefs about The Constitution
Im dead serious you moron, Im not saying they cant brain child Im saying that simply b/c I cant show where it says they cant doesnt mean they can...
Even if the constitution doesnt say they cant isnt enough brainchild, once again the constitution outlines the power of the federal govt anything not specifically given to the federal govt. is left to the states.
is this seriously the first time youve heard this?
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he is most definitely your President
hopefully Cuomo's new gun laws will include a way that the public can report potentially mentally damaged people who own guns
I will look forward to pointing them in your direction
Coke to my address and try to disarm me you communist pofs.
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Constitutional arguments aside, the directives and other gun control initiatives is nothing more than an emotional response to a tragic shooting devoid of logic and reasoning. It exists simply to placate the bent out of shape gun control masses and talking media heads.
These new directives will not affect violent crime rates or even criminal acts committed with a gun. Ownership and/or "proliferation" of guns have little to nothing to do with violent crime rates. To the normal American, it just seems an obvious answer........the same thinking people have in believing that more police patrolling in their vehicles reduces crime (it doesn't). Violent crime rates are concentrated primarily within inner city minority groups, who unsurprisingly, have the lowest rates of gun ownership. There are many reasons why violent crimes happen(poverty, education, family structure, etc..), however, gun control laws do little to affect it.
The largest school massacre occurred in 1927...from a guy using dynamite. What if Adam Lanza did not have access to his mother's legally acquired guns? What if the Virginia Tech shooter did not have guns? What if James Holmes did not have guns? Maybe nothing, or perhaps they'd use homemade explosives, molotov cocktails, or a chemical weapon, all of which are relatively easy and cheap to make.
Violent crime rates have continued to fall in the past few decades across the US and again....it has nothing to do with gun control. Even that idiot Guiliani tried to take claim for the crime decreases in NYC while he was mayor....his initiatives did shit but the statistics went in his favor.
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who do you think writes prescriptions and many doctors (GP's) talk to their clients about drugs, alcohol, depression etc..
AH i see the connection now... .dude says he is dreaming about shooting up someplace... it's nice if the docs can ask "well, do you have any guns?"
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Well sir, you can go fuck yourself. It's no ones business if I own a firearm or not, it's called privacy.
Direct marketing databases already know who owns firearms and have a pretty good inference how many and what kind...
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For what's it's worth, the "can doctors ask that?" debate has been around for a long time. It was an optional question that was recommended by a few medical organizations, another was about private pool ownership. If you answered yes, it was usually met with a speech and pamphlets on safety, etc...... Most old school doctors never bothered.
It faded away, and then came back when veterans were returning from the war, as they were worried about suicides, etc.....
Some states like Florida introduced bills to stop it, and that scared doctors off from asking it.
This new recommendation is just a restatement of something going on for years.
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For what's it's worth, the "can doctors ask that?" debate has been around for a long time. It was an optional question that was recommended by a few medical organizations, another was about private pool ownership. If you answered yes, it was usually met with a speech and pamphlets on safety, etc...... Most old school doctors never bothered.
It faded away, and then came back when veterans were returning from the war, as they were worried about suicides, etc.....
Some states like Florida introduced bills to stop it, and that scared doctors off from asking it.
This new recommendation is just a restatement of something going on for years.
Why is it a doctor's perogative to ask me about "health issues in my home related to guns"? A home health issue would be asbestos in the walls or contaminated drinking water. These are conditions that could contribute to a diagnosis of a medical condition...which is WHAT IM PAYING THE FUCKING DOCTOR FOR!
My argument is that it's a slippery slope that will more than likely be a gateway to more government intrusion into your private life...under the guise of "doing what is best for you".
If a doctor asks about guns, do they ask about kitchen knives, or gardening tools, or if I own a car, or how many bottles of wine do I have, any exposed electrical equipment, violent video games, what kind of dogs I have, do I have a bathtub, big rocks, sharp sticks, etc. It's a scam to collect and centralize people's private lives into a government database.
If you give them an inch they will take everything you have. Just ask the Indians....