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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Training Q&A => Topic started by: Borracho on December 17, 2005, 07:31:08 AM
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You always hear that exercises like pullovers will help expand your rib cage.
My question is what the hell does this mean and what are its advantages?
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(http://www.seanfitzgerald.com/images%20framesets/irisimages/places/sandrock/500x/tumbleweed.jpg)
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with a bigger ribcage you would be thicker, wider and be able to put on more mass i guess
wether it's actually possible, at least if youre allready fullgrown i dont know
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with a bigger ribcage you would be thicker, wider and be able to put on more mass i guess
wether it's actually possible, at least if youre allready fullgrown i dont know
The ribcage isnt just bone but cartilige (think its cartilige) as well, been a while since i have done any anatomy. I guess maybe this could be a little flexible?
I have a pretty big ribcage for my build and have done db pullovers for years, was that a factor? Dunno.
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the advantage is that with a huge ribcage you look insane on side shots especially the side chest....look at guys like arnold or katz
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The rib cage cannot be expanded.....it is all genetics .....
All the old muscle mags had articles on how to make it bigger-but it was all hype to sell magazines....sort of like how "breathing squats" made your upper body bigger........hahaha.... ....
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There are a lot of myths in bodybuilding and I guess this is just another one. Thanks for the input guys.
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I think pullovers done early in life when you first start lifting can cause some rib cage expansion. The cartilage I think can maybe be stretched over time. But I think genetics has the majority say so in this issue. Mike Katz has a huge rib cage.
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To clear some things up....
The ribs are connected to the sternum by several inches (just how many depends on the individual) of cartilage. Under said cartilage lies various muscular structures, including but not limited to the intercostals and the serratus. These muscles can stretch and expand, causing the pliable cartilage to adapt to a very minor degree of expansion. Pullovers indeed allow for this, however, and more importantly, the effects of the exercise allow for the APPEARANCE of an "expanded rib cage". Take that for what it's worth.
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With due respect to the old timer 619Rules: Heavy forced breathing squats can make the upper body, as well as the lower body, larger. A very fine method of gaining rapid muscular weight for football players and other athletes. Ten to fifteen muscular pounds seems to be the average gain with-in two months or so, usually less time. Reps are done with-in the range of 20 or so. If you also pay attention to rib box expansion at a younger age (24-24 seems to be the mark off point) while the cartilage is still in a state of flux and has not harded into firm boney material, the possibility of rib box growth is present. Pullovers (either straight or bent arm) in higher rep sets after doing a heavy set of sets can have a remarkable affect of adding inches to the chest. 2" to 3''s are not out of the question over a short period of time, if the trainee is young enought. Even using pullovers in regular workouts can strenghted the muscle/rib attachments giving a fuller and higher feel to the chest of older trainee's. Good Luck.
Side Bar: The surf does meet the turf in old Del Mar, almost.
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With due respect to the old timer 619Rules: Heavy forced breathing squats can make the upper body, as well as the lower body, larger. A very fine method of gaining rapid muscular weight for football players and other athletes. Ten to fifteen muscular pounds seems to be the average gain with-in two months or so, usually less time. Reps are done with-in the range of 20 or so. If you also pay attention to rib box expansion at a younger age (24-24 seems to be the mark off point) while the cartilage is still in a state of flux and has not harded into firm boney material, the possibility of rib box growth is present. Pullovers (either straight or bent arm) in higher rep sets after doing a heavy set of sets can have a remarkable affect of adding inches to the chest. 2" to 3''s are not out of the question over a short period of time, if the trainee is young enought. Even using pullovers in regular workouts can strenghted the muscle/rib attachments giving a fuller and higher feel to the chest of older trainee's. Good Luck.
Side Bar: The surf does meet the turf in old Del Mar, almost.
No such thing as "Breathing Squats" making the upper body bigger-just a myth to sell magazines.
Please post a scientific study that has documented such results as you claim and I will eat my words.......
The "Surf Meets The Turf" is the Del Mar logo.......but I had to steal it b/c it is so cool....and it fit nto my byline.....plus that is the only beach I go to these days ;D
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No such thing as "Breathing Squats" making the upper body bigger-just a myth to sell magazines.
Please post a scientific study that has documented such results as you claim and I will eat my words.......
The "Surf Meets The Turf" is the Del Mar logo.......but I had to steal it b/c it is so cool....and it fit nto my byline.....plus that is the only beach I go to these days ;D
I heard you were a "regular" at Blacks Beach
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I heard you were a "regular" at Blacks Beach
OK...a Blacks Beach story for Knny187....since he seems to like the "dark side" of the San Diego nude beaches.............
There is a guy in San Diego named Mark Dayton that used to compete about 15-20 years ago-back in the 80's....anyway Mark could get ripped to shreds.....shredded wheat-with veins everywhere....so he had a hot GF and they used to hit Blacks Beach and la out nude.....
and for those who are not from San Diego, Blacks Beach is about 90+% gay men.......
So back to the story...Mark and his GF are hanging out and catching some rays when a gay guy walks right up to them with a camera and starts snapping pictures of Mark in the buff.....and this is no ordinary camera-it has an automatice winder on it so you can snap pictures as fast as you can push the button.........bad move.......
Mark tells the guy he needs the film, this guy is a black dude (and very gay) and says hell no.......at which point Mark gets up-grabs the guy, then grabs the camera out of his hands........ then Mark yanks out all the film...........tells the guy to beat it....
True story! ;D ;D I have a god story about mission beach too.....have to save that one for later.......
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OK...a Blacks Beach story for Knny187....since he seems to like the "dark side" of the San Diego nude beaches.............
There is a guy in San Diego named Mark Dayton that used to compete about 15-20 years ago-back in the 80's....anyway Mark could get ripped to shreds.....shredded wheat-with veins everywhere....so he had a hot GF and they used to hit Blacks Beach and la out nude.....
and for those who are not from San Diego, Blacks Beach is about 90+% gay men.......
So back to the story...Mark and his GF are hanging out and catching some rays when a gay guy walks right up to them with a camera and starts snapping pictures of Mark in the buff.....and this is no ordinary camera-it has an automatice winder on it so you can snap pictures as fast as you can push the button.........bad move.......
Mark tells the guy he needs the film, this guy is a black dude (and very gay) and says hell no.......at which point Mark gets up-grabs the guy, then grabs the camera out of his hands........ then Mark yanks out all the film...........tells the guy to beat it....
True story! ;D ;D I have a god story about mission beach too.....have to save that one for later.......
I didn't know you were black.
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Not that theres anything wrong with that.
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Rules....why did we want to know that story?
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Rules....why did we want to know that story?
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Knny-you brought up Blacks Beach.....so I figured you woud like that one.....
I didn't know you were black.
Hahaha.........thank you for the compliment......actually it is a real hike to get into and out of Blacks Beach...and I have never been there.
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Knny-you brought up Blacks Beach.....so I figured you woud like that one.....
Hahaha.........thank you for the compliment......actually it is a real hike to get into and out of Blacks Beach...and I have never been there.
It's called a cliff
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It's called a cliff
Hahhahaahhahaha.......and it is one big cliff at that!
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Back in the day....alot of people would think it was a cool place to go....until they actually went there.
Then they would see the queers & out of shape naked fat people.
Why the hell would fat people want to be naked?
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was it mark or mike dayton. mike was pretty well known back then.
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was it mark or mike dayton. mike was pretty well known back then.
No-not Mike Dayton......Mike ss from Nor Cal and competed n the 60's and 70's and won some big shows...
It was Mark Dayton who was a very good BBer out of San Diego.....he won some shows.........he could get super ripped.........great guy.
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It's an old training myth that managed to survive through the years. That clown Ellington Darden has been a big proponent of "ribcage expansion" exercises. What a joke.
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The ribcage isnt just bone but cartilige (think its cartilige) as well, been a while since i have done any anatomy. I guess maybe this could be a little flexible?
I have a pretty big ribcage for my build and have done db pullovers for years, was that a factor? Dunno.
The db pullovers are definately a big factor.
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DUMBELL PULLOVERS EXPAND THE CARTALAGE BETWEEN YOUR RIBS MAKING FOR A BIGGER RIBCAGE BUT YOU HAVE TO START DOING THEM YOUNG FOR IT TO WORK. LIKE BEFORE 20 YEARS OLD. IT REALLY WORKED FOR ME.
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Breathing Squats are a bitch to do! I usually get a head ache when I try to do them.
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*Repeat* The rib cage CAN NOT be expanded EVER!! I don't care what Arnold has said. The sooner u get this through your skull, the sooner you'll stop doin pullovers.
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JPM, if you were following a heavy breathing squat routine, would u do the actual heavy breathing squats more than once in the week????
I was thinking of doing them either twice (then bb hacks on 3rs day), or doing them on Monday and doin regular 3 sets of 6 squats on Wednesday followed by bb hacks on friday????
davie
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*Repeat* The rib cage CAN NOT be expanded EVER!! I don't care what Arnold has said. The sooner u get this through your skull, the sooner you'll stop doin pullovers.
YOURE WRONG. YOU CAN STRETCH THE CARTILAGE BETWEEN YOUR RIBS MAKING FOR A BIGGER RIBCAGE. IT WORKED FOR ME.
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THE ANSWER::::::: Do them and find out for yourself!!!! End every leg workout for the next 6 weeks with 20 rep BALLS TO THE FLOOR FULL SQUATS<<< Fuck breathing Squats, if you do these right , you'll be breathing like a runaway train anyway, just do them.>>> supersetted with 15 -20 rep Across Bench Db pullovers. Pour it on!!! All or nothing!!!! 1 to 2 sets will do the trick. Take before and after photos doing side chest shots and measurements.
You will be bigger and better. With more depth to your side shots. You have nothing to loose and everything to gain.
Man up, and get in the Squat rack and find out what your made of.
XS
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I like going ass to the floor, but isn't it bad for your knees?
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SUPAMIKEY: no it's not . It's more of a flexibility factor than anything else. Getter' done.
XS
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Sorry guys--you can not expand your ribcage by doing pullovers. Doesn't matter at what age you started doing them, either.
Those of you who have large ribcages were lucky enough to be blessed with that trait, and if you also happened to have performed pullovers you are attributing the exercise to your success. They may have assissted in giving you greater muscular detail around that nice big thorax, however. Personally, I've always included pullovers as part of my back training.
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Sorry guys--you can not expand your ribcage by doing pullovers. Doesn't matter at what age you started doing them, either.
SORRY FREAKFEST--YOU CAN EXPAND THE CARTILAGE BETWEEN YOUR RIBS MAKING FOR A LARGER RIBCAGE, IT DOES MATTER WHAT AGE YOU START DOING THEM AT, BEFORE YOUR CARTILAGE FUSES, WHICH IS BEFORE 20 OR SO. YOU HAVE TO DO THEM FREEWIGHT THOUGH AND DIP YOUR HIPS FOR A BIGGER STRETCH, SORRY THAT YOU HAVE A SMALL RIBCAGE FREAK AND THAT YOURE TOO OLD TO CHANGE THE SIZE OF IT, BUT HEY, THATS HOW THE DICE ROLL.
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When people say expanding the rib cage I don't think they mean making your chest dimensions bigger or whatnot. There are short muscles between your ribs and doing heavy lying dumbell pullovers uses them. You have to go deep though (touch the floor with the dumbell) and use enough weight that the sticking point of most resistance is pretty low, like 8 inches off the floor, certainly before horizontal. Just keep the elbow pretty straight and go not to high in the reps, it is a good all around every other week.
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SORRY THAT YOU HAVE A SMALL RIBCAGE FREAK AND THAT YOURE TOO OLD TO CHANGE THE SIZE OF IT, BUT HEY, THATS HOW THE DICE ROLL.
Actually, XXL, I have a very large ribcage, as does my father, my twin brother and my older brother. I have fairly extensive knowledge about the basic science of cartilage, especially in terms of growth and development, and have published several articles on related topics. Suffice it to say, that the Heuter-Volkmann principle (i.e.that cartilage actually decreases growth when exposed to an applied load, and increases growth when unloaded) by itself offers a very simple explanation of why the growth for which you seek explanation just doesn't occur.
Again, I am not doubting that you have a very impressive thorax. I am only saying that you have it based more on deoxyribonucleic acid than pullovers.
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Hey XXL; that's Checkmate for the Freak...game over.
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I can certainly understand the principle of the Heuter-Volkmann argument but it (H-V) can not explain, under real conditions, the bone remodeling issue. Woff's law of change in bone remodeling/adapting of bone structure may give a truer opposite result with regards to Epiphyseal pressure in a more realistic state. Of course both these studies were in regard to mature adults not younger subjects around or below the age of 22 years or so. Any younger subject is still in the state of flux with regard to cartilage ( in this period, a soft state) and there may be, but I am not aware of such, research on these matters conducted on younger persons.
Pullovers, either straight or bentarm, can have a positive influence on the rib box (and muscle/ligaments, inserts/attachments) expansion both outward and upward when the said trainee is still with-in the required younger age limit, where the potentional for growth is at it's highest. Two inches, or so, seems to be the mean average chest/rib box improvement after a period of time. This affect has even helped older trainee's reach a state of better flexability and strenghtening the muscle attachments around the chest/rib box it's self, which can give a fuller feeling to this area. Which inturn give a much more impressive looking chest.
As XS said, "Do them and find out for yourself". Pullovers are best done right after a set of high rep squats, Dl', cleans, etc. The idea is to take advantage of the heavy, high chest breathing produced by those demanding compound exercises. Using a medium weight (either straight or bent armed) and going for a full stretch, breathing deeply, for 20 reps can be very rewarding . Two sets of 20 rep squats should be well enought to set up some very good gains in the long run. But you can also do pullovers after a regular chest workout, affects the shoulder girdle very well. One of my favorite upper body mass builders is the bent arm DB pullover. Not only insuring a flexable rib box but also hitting the pec's, lat's, triceps & abs strongly. I use heavy weights for 7-12 reps usually.
Too bad so many men who want to make superior gains, yet avoid some exercises because they "think" they will not get results. And yet some of these guy's spend hours in a gym doing endless set after set, four to six times a weeks, getting little or no results for their efforts. Seems like their doing manuel labor rather than working out. With BB'ing, we all have to give just about any method, system, exercise or whatever a fair try and than cast your negative or positive judgement on it afterwards. Everything has to be proven with each one of us on a seperate bases. Good Luck.