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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: syntaxmachine on July 08, 2013, 11:56:02 PM
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Most college Marxists move on, but it seems like Libertarians hold on to their fantasy forever.
Provisional hypothesis: They move on upon acquiring the ability to grow a beard on their face and not just their neck. Sadly, this day never arrives for some men and they are left beating off onto their dog-eared copies of Atlas Shrugged using Astroglide bought with Koch money.
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Yes, libertarians should definitely be spit on on sight. Fortunately enough for the rest of us who are not Real Life Diaper Babies, they're generally too stunted and twitchy to peddle their dogshit outside of internet forums.
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Most college Marxists move on, but it seems like Libertarians hold on to their fantasy forever.
Provisional hypothesis: They move on upon acquiring the ability to grow a beard on their face and not just their neck. Sadly, this day never arrives for some men and they are left beating off onto their dog-eared copies of Atlas Shrugged using Astroglide bought with Koch money.
In your opinion, what is libertarianism? No wiki quotes please. Btw, I'm not libertarian.
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There are aspects of libertarianism I like such as many of its positions on social liberties but I find its far to rigid. For many dissatisfied with the current political parties, libertarianism is a default position. It is the new independent. Rarely do people who profess to be libertarian actually understand what libertarianism entails. All they know is, it's not democrat or republican.
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As opposed to what?
If anything - I find as I get older the typical left vs right thing no longer applies.
For me its freedom of the individual to pursue his desires and be left the fuck alone to the greatest extent possible vs. the collectivist idealogy of grouping everyone together and having shared rights obligations etc.
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What's wrong with being a libertarian?
Yes, it's a far fetched ideal that really never existed, nor can exist in modern times, but the idea of minimizing government control to the basics isn't bad at all.
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As opposed to what?
If anything - I find as I get older the typical left vs right thing no longer applies.
For me its freedom of the individual to pursue his desires and be left the fuck alone to the greatest extent possible vs. the collectivist idealogy of grouping everyone together and having shared rights obligations etc.
Damn liar...as much as you go on about Obama, when it's been a generation worth of greedy political "pimps" as you like to call them.
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Damn liar...as much as you go on about Obama, when it's been a generation worth of greedy political "pimps" as you like to call them.
Obama is a communist collectivist piece of garbage and slime - hope that helps.
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Can someone explain libertersomething in simple language?
Is is RonPaulism?
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Can someone explain libertersomething in simple language?
Is is RonPaulism?
There are a few strains with varying opinions on issues but this is the basics of the basics
Individualism
Property rights
Taxes are coercive
Deregulation
Free market advocates
Privatization
The thing to keep in mind is many of these positions sound great before they are implemented.
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Obama is a communist collectivist piece of garbage and slime - hope that helps.
Obama is a politician. Nothing more. Calling him all those names may feel nice. But, in the end all it does is rile you up. Call a snake a snake, or a duck a duck, it's nothing more than what it is.
Fact of the matter is, we can't (you and I or all of us collectively) cannot change Washington. Washington must change Washington.
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Formidable string of trolls from syntaxmachine today.
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There are a few strains with varying opinions on issues but this is the basics of the basics
Individualism
Property rights
Taxes are coercive
Deregulation
Free market advocates
Privatization
The thing to keep in mind is many of these positions sound great before they are implemented.
Thanks!
There are pros and cons to everything - individualism for example only works if there's a common ground in respect and intellectual capacity.
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Most college Marxists move on, but it seems like Libertarians hold on to their fantasy forever.
Provisional hypothesis: They move on upon acquiring the ability to grow a beard on their face and not just their neck. Sadly, this day never arrives for some men and they are left beating off onto their dog-eared copies of Atlas Shrugged using Astroglide bought with Koch money.
rofl!!
neck beards ....
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Thanks!
There are pros and cons to everything - individualism for example only works if there's a common ground in respect and intellectual capacity.
The more radical fringes like anarcho-capitalism, which there are also several statins of, seem a tad bit unrealistic and based almost entirely on presupposition and wishful thinking.
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BUT BUT BUT Von Mises said the state is bad!
http://www.midnimo.com/2013/08/02/somalia-somalia-once-again-plagued-by-violence/
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Obama is a politician. Nothing more. Calling him all those names may feel nice. But, in the end all it does is rile you up. Call a snake a snake, or a duck a duck, it's nothing more than what it is.
Fact of the matter is, we can't (you and I or all of us collectively) cannot change Washington. Washington must change Washington.
Exactly. It's like getting angry at "reality TV" actors.
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BUT BUT BUT Von Mises said the state is bad!
http://www.midnimo.com/2013/08/02/somalia-somalia-once-again-plagued-by-violence/
anarchy versus libertarianism
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A real Libertarian believes that the federal government should live within the constitution i.e protect freedom and regulate interstate commerce and that is it. The states and municipalities should govern in accordance with their constitutions/charters, whatever they maybe (free health care, $30 an hour minimum wage whatever the people want). I have found especially in today's give me stuff for free, no one is responsible society, (accept white males), you cant have guns or sugar society; more people are maturing and understanding freedom and growing into Libertarianism not out. Let me know when you want to grow up and take care of yourself and not let the government do it for you.
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Can a so called libertarian still call him/herself a libertarian if they've used the American governments Bankruptcy court to "start over"?
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A real Libertarian believes that the federal government should live within the constitution i.e protect freedom and regulate interstate commerce and that is it. The states and municipalities should govern in accordance with their constitutions/charters, whatever they maybe (free health care, $30 an hour minimum wage whatever the people want). I have found especially in today's give me stuff for free, no one is responsible society, (accept white males), you cant have guns or sugar society; more people are maturing and understanding freedom and growing into Libertarianism not out. Let me know when you want to grow up and take care of yourself and not let the government do it for you.
Excellent post!
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A real Libertarian believes that the federal government should live within the constitution i.e protect freedom and regulate interstate commerce and that is it. The states and municipalities should govern in accordance with their constitutions/charters, whatever they maybe (free health care, $30 an hour minimum wage whatever the people want). I have found especially in today's give me stuff for free, no one is responsible society, (accept white males), you cant have guns or sugar society; more people are maturing and understanding freedom and growing into Libertarianism not out. Let me know when you want to grow up and take care of yourself and not let the government do it for you.
Most libertarians are fair weather followers. Yes, they want more freedom and personal accountability -- but only when things are going their way. Snoman makes a good point: everyone wants safety nets when they need them. Libertarians just don't seem to have enough empathy/foresight to realize it may be them that need it one day.
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Can a so called libertarian still call him/herself a libertarian if they've used the American governments Bankruptcy court to "start over"?
Exactly. Bankruptcy should result in indentured servitude, not an abnegation of debt, i.e. of personal responsibility.
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Many aspects of libertarianism are appealing to me but others aspects are repellent. Libertarianism is often presented as a rational economic and political philosophy or the natural next step in societal development. In reality it's an untested theory based upon a great deal of presumption and wishful thinking.
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They are ideologues that put their plan into action. They've taken it too far. There is left extreme and right extreme. Neither is right. Balance is right. This two party system is a reason why we are where we are.
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you know what the funny thing about the Internet is? With all the information, misinformation people are seemingly more ignorant (arrogantly ignorant) and misinformed than ever before. And the media plays upon this...
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you know what the funny thing about the Internet is? With all the information, misinformation people are seemingly more ignorant (arrogantly ignorant) and misinformed than ever before. And the media plays upon this...
I think those who were already ignorant may be worse off with internet access, but I'm not sure more people are overall.
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I'm a Libertarian ;D
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its just as much a pipe dream as communism is.
you know he "real" communism" thats supposed to be established by means of socialism.where did that lead to state monoply capitalism.
its jst too ridiculous to even think about them, they both are just pipe dreams.
also, theres no best system, and rebooting or restarting wont work, cuba tries bit capitalism now, and it dont work so well for them.
all ppl can do is work and modyfy the current system as good as possible.
She would have been a fool not to take what was being offered anyway. Governmental manipulation, constantly overstepping their bounds is what caused the treatment she needed to be unaffordable in the first place. Should she have taken a stand (that wouldn't have made a damn bit of difference) and died because of it?
Doesn't mean she's not right. I'm against the continued devaluation and manipulation of our currency, doesn't mean I'm going to shoot myself in the foot and trade in my US Dollars.
The point is, government meddling is the reason we really need social safety nets in the first place. Imagine all that private charities could accomplish with the funds we throw away on Obama phones alone. On top of that, most libertarians are realistic, and don't take a hardline stance against all "safety nets".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward%E2%80%93Piven_strategy
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If we just starved the huge evil beast (USG), got it out of the picture, and let private corporate interests dictate economic policy even further than they already do, everything would be OK.
(http://visualeconsite.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/section_1-5.gif)
Monstrous beast is monstrous
(http://www.aimlesslychasing.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/corporate-profits-employment.png)
Evil government forcing "employers" to profit, everything is gov fault Ron told me so
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Most Libertarians I've spoken to aren't absolute in their beliefs and are realistic and just want less government intervention and more personal freedom without replacing the entire system.
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WATCH: Wikileaks founder Julian Assange praises young libertarians
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Jack Hunter-
"Every story I read attacking libertarian-conservatism, libertarian-Republicanism, libertarian-populism, left-libertarianism or any other liberty subset, simply reminds me that we're making a dent. Few would attack otherwise."
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Fiscally conservative, socially liberal, what's not to like?
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We need more libertarian thinking in the US. The government is larger and more intrusive then ever, wanting to parent us and getting involved in military strikes/wars that we shouldn't be involved in. We should learn from our US forefathers.
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You're thinking of extreme libertarians...just like the extremes of any party, it gets wacky.
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whats their representative stance on syria intervention?
The Tea Party isn't Libertarian, all though they might think they are. They're mostly probably religious lunatics and big government neoconservatives like Sean Hannity.
Libertarians are overwhelmingly opposed to intervention in Syria. What are your thoughts on intervening galeniko?
???
Why are you so pro-centralized government? ???
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The Tea Party isn't Libertarian, all though they might think they are. They're mostly probably religious lunatics and big government neoconservatives like Sean Hannity.
Libertarians are overwhelmingly opposed to intervention in Syria. What are your thoughts on intervening galeniko?
???
Why are you so pro-centralized government? ???
Yeah, Tea Party are too religious for the Libertarians, they don't mix on social issues. Also, L tend to be more isolationist militarily, which I don't think flies with the TP.
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Yeah, Tea Party are too religious for the Libertarians, they don't mix on social issues. Also, L tend to be more isolationist militarily, which I don't think flies with the TP.
Yes!!
I think most Libertarians are generally realistic too though, and realize that threats to our country or allies have to be taken care of.
They just have no interest in waging war for natural resources and strategic positioning on behalf of other countries. :-X
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The only true government is self-government. Everything else is force.
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so, no police force or army?
whod make sure everyone has clean water?
uhm,banks?no govt supervision?
the law, would it exist?in what form?
You cannot have a police state without police. Why is it my business that everyone has clean water...rather a man should clean his water because it's in his best interest to prosper not because a bureaucrat or religious cleric dictates theft and force of my property for their moral vision.
I understand that freedom is scary and most, like yourself, obviously are not ready for it...probably because you're not American.
In the meantime however, keep your taxes off my property.
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so, no police force or army?
whod make sure everyone has clean water?
uhm,banks?no govt supervision?
the law, would it exist?in what form?
Libertarians are not Anarchists.
They believe in having a state, with an army, police etc
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hey OP! stop being such a freedom hater!
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Gay Rights: A Libertarian Approach
Ralph Raico - 1975
The Libertarian Party was decades ahead of the pack on gay rights. In this essay, Ralph Raico examines the libertarian case for gay rights and describes how that case was expressed in the Party’s positions.
The object of this essay is to assert one very simple principle as entitled to govern absolutely the dealings of society with the individual in the way of compulsion and control… . The principle is that the sole end for which mankind are warranted, individually or collectively, in interfering with the liberty of action of any of their number is self-protection… . His own good, either physical or moral, is not a sufficient warrant… . Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign.
Read more: http://www.libertarianism.org/publications/essays/gay-rights-libertarian-approach
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Libertarians just want the federal government to follow the constitution i.e. National Defense and Interstate Commerce and leave everything else alone. If a state or a town wants to have Welfare system a department of education or anything else and their own charter/constitution allows it and the people vote for it then feel free, but I dont need a bunch of people who have nothing to do with me (congress) telling me how to live.
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As opposed to what?
If anything - I find as I get older the typical left vs right thing no longer applies.
For me its freedom of the individual to pursue his desires and be left the fuck alone to the greatest extent possible vs. the collectivist idealogy of grouping everyone together and having shared rights obligations etc.
That could be the definition of a right Conservative when you said, "For me its freedom of the individual to pursue his desires and be left the fuck alone to the greatest extent possible."
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That could be the definition of a right Conservative when you said, "For me its freedom of the individual to pursue his desires and be left the fuck alone to the greatest extent possible."
Too bad the republicans in DC have sold us out.
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The reason why the endless money printing and stimulus hasn't spurred the sought after economic growth can be found in this Mises quote:
“There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved.”
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Most Libertarians I've spoken to aren't absolute in their beliefs and are realistic and just want less government intervention and more personal freedom without replacing the entire system.
This.
I was liberal as a youth, became a moderate Repub at 30, conservative when Ronnie became Pres, then an Independant at 60; followed by my awakening at 70 and registered Libertarian.
No "outgrow here" more like enlightenment.
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Ex-MTV VJ, Lisa Kennedy Montgomery: "If Rick Santorum and Rachel Maddow are both gunning for you, it probably means you’re on the right track."
Kennedy on her new libertarian news show --
http://insidetv.ew.com/2013/12/09/kennedy-mtv-vj-libertarian-show/
Lisa Kennedy Montgomery is best known to a generation as, simply, Kennedy — the hip MTV VJ who helped introduce America to Nirvana and Soundgarden on Alternative Nation, mimed oral sex on a mic during the 1994 VMAs — while standing next to Rudy Giuliani, no less — and eventually came out as a die-hard Republican. (In a ’94 Vanity Fair profile, she even declared her ardent love for former vice president Dan Quayle.)
Nearly 20 years later, the 41-year-old mother of two has left her wild-child past behind for a career as a writer, radio host, and Fox Business contributor. But while her political views haven’t really changed, the way she labels herself has: Kennedy now identifies as a libertarian. Her next project, a Fox Business roundtable called The Independents, will allow Kennedy and her co-hosts, Matt Welch and Kmele Foster, to tackle news from an angle that, in her mind, is both tough to find on TV and absolutely vital. “The reason our show exists is because the idea of a two-party system has failed,” she tells EW.
Hours before her new show’s big premiere, Kennedy called us up to chat about the evolution of her political views, what she’s hoping to achieve with The Independents, the glory days of MTV — and her thoughts on Miley’s infamous VMA performance.
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I'm a dedicated anti populist centrist. All these wings are just mentally unbalanced. No matter how right wing or left wing your government is, there's a general max and min amount countries can get by on. Income tax levels are generally pretty even across westernized countries. The far bigger concern is how efficient the spending of the tax dollar is. Both right and left seem to fail the second they get overly focused on pleasing the people or get influenced by a corrupting factor.
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Very annoying fad indeed, like any other. It's appeal is psychologically interesting: it's something easy to get behind (who doesn't want freedom?); it's 'safe' because it's ideas appeal to both right and left so very oppose the philosophical basis; it appeals to anti-establishment sentiments (yea! fuck the system!); it may be personally liberating as it offers a worldview that may be personally appealing; it has a lot of apologists that write in its favor so there is a lot of 'intellectual backing' to the philosophy, etc. etc.
In other words it's appeal is not unlike a religious belief system ;D
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The far bigger concern is how efficient the spending of the tax dollar is. Both right and left seem to fail the second they get overly focused on pleasing the people or get influenced by a corrupting factor.
There's no changing that, it's the nature of the beast. The solution is massive tax cuts, take away governments ability to be so inefficient, let people take care of themselves with their money.
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ObamaCare = game over for liberals, lefitsts, socialists, commies, etc
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There's no changing that, it's the nature of the beast. The solution is massive tax cuts, take away governments ability to be so inefficient, let people take care of themselves with their money.
Yes because private has been proven to be so efficient for society ::)
Like seriously how fucking gullible are you. Privatization only ever works when it's contained by a strong government force. If you don't contain it by some emotional reasoning your gonna loose out on all those potential benefits.
It's not 1950 time has proven that a balanced approach is a necessity. Most supposed questions of left and right wing have been answered for us.
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Property is Liberty
Property is Theft
Property is Impossible
Without private property there can be no private life.
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There's no changing that, it's the nature of the beast. The solution is massive tax cuts, take away governments ability to be so inefficient, let people take care of themselves with their money.
What does the historical record indicate about the effects of large tax cuts on the US's fiscal situation?
I don't know what the last two conjuncts in your statement mean, so I can't comment any further.