Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Vince B on February 12, 2014, 07:17:37 PM
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
He is a fool. I would have loved to train at your gym with some of your unique machines.
Vince, what was your training and diet like when you were in your top form and would you still do the same if you could have done it all over again?
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I agree with TTA and would have a plethora of questions for you. I respect your place in bodybuilding history and also believe you unequivocally earned your forum stars.
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I think vince with his experience does have a lot of knowledge to share maybe he should train a getbigger virtually so people can see what he is able to do.
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
What would you have had Milos do to get his triceps bigger?
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maybe they just don't want to die under the machine of your 'creation'
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I've always stated that if Vince Basile truly had the forum to teach the upper level competitors of bodybuilding his theories of hypertrophy then drugs in this sport would largely be a thing of the past within the next 5 years or so.
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If your such.a great teacher u can teach us through telling us.
I'm.being serious I'd like to know some.things. mainly arms. Maybe some back too.
U can post links to videos to show depth of squat or drawings etc or just use words. Is really like to hear. But whenever someone ask u never go into detail.
U instead always say how u offered to bring this up for free n help this guy but u never tell us how.
Id like to try a protocol myself.
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- "I walked out from Bodybuilding alive....cant say I'm a fool " ;D
WoooSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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Vince, can U give us 5-10 names of yours pupils who where at the least Mr.Australia winners since 1975 :)
Name any professional sport club/organization in Australia which employed U as mr.muscle coach.
Have U ever work for the Australian Institute of Sports :)
OBW, U a not the only 1 gym owner (or co-owner) on this site.
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I have the full library of Vince's publications.
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(http://cs312830.vk.me/v312830706/8337/MOepKVTHRiQ.jpg)
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He is a fool. I would have loved to train at your gym with some of your unique machines.
Vince, what was your training and diet like when you were in your top form and would you still do the same if you could have done it all over again?
TA, I would train vastly differently now. Larry Scott contributed the most to hypertrophy training in the sixties. That was a brutally painful way to train. Especially if you were drug free. Most of us didn't get maximum size. Arms stopped at about 17 1/2" cold. Few guys in those days had legitimate 18 inch arms. I could pump mine to 18 3/4 but they still weren't 18 cold even off season. Not that we called our bulking up that.
The breakthrough for me came in 1998 or 99 when I tried to get my arms larger than ever. I succeeded but encountered injuries in elbows and achilles tendons. My arms were finally 18 inches cold and calves about 18 1/4. Darn those injuries. Now I know better and don't have elbows on pads. Neither do I do any ballistic heel raises for calves.
What I had to discover.....for myself was a feedback mechanism that accompanied rapid hypertrophy. Well, it will be rapid if you eat enough food. Many young guys don't consume enough calories and therefore don't grow much bigger. When you think about it most of the big guys in all gyms are looking the same. Plateaus hit all of us sooner or later. Well, that is what we all thought. We all knew that if we haven't trained for a while or did something different or unusual we ended up sore the next few days. I embraced that phenomenon and wondered what would happen if I employed it for building larger muscles. How come we don't get very sore after we get accustomed to training? Why doesn't DOMS appear? Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness. We even came up with strategies to avoid getting DOMS. By doing so we missed what I consider to be the most important factor in hypertrophy training....maximum hypertrophy training, that is.
Take biceps. When was the last time you experienced DOMS after training biceps? Most guys almost never get them sore. Well, consider this, what if you trained your biceps in a fashion that resulted in DOMS for several days? My belief is those biceps would immediately grow bigger and you could measure the difference with a tape. Perhaps 1/10th of an inch in one day. Retrain the biceps every 3rd day for 30 days and you should gain an inch in size. Well, you will if you include DOMS training for your triceps. I advise doing super sets for biceps followed by triceps. The key here is to warm up thoroughly taking each set to the limit. 40 or more reps of the first set and then add a plate and continue. When you reach a weight that allows only 20 reps then stay at that weight and try to do another 5 or 6 sets with the same weight. If you try to do sets of 10 reps two things happen. After the third set you won't be able to do as many reps. You will be down to something like 70%. 6 or 7 reps are not enough for hypertrophy because you start cheating and you fail to get a maximum pump. So if you start your final effective sets at 20 reps you will be down to 12 or 14 reps soon enough but will always be over 10 reps. Keeping the reps about 15 helps to pump up the muscle and that is important for hypertrophy. Larry Scott discovered that if he could pump his arms bigger than ever he would grow them. So we can accept that this is true because Larry found out the hard way about 50 years ago. I agree with that finding. Not just any old pumping but doing so with sufficiently heavy resistances. It is the set after set after set with a heavy enough resistance that induces hypertrophy. You can reduce this to a time under tension formula. The time accumulates over those final 6 sets and the intensity is sufficient to induce hypertrophy.
There are better exercises that are effective. However, effectiveness has to be tempered by safety considerations. The muscles will grow rapidly but connective tissue is still vulnerable. Trying to put an inch on the arms in a short time is not impossible but it can be dangerous. DOMS training is best for perhaps a couple of weeks then take a break and train something else in that fashion. The muscles won't shrink if you work nearby muscles. After two weeks hit the arms again for another two weeks. You really have to be safe because once damage to connective tissue occurs it seems to persist....perhaps for years and even decades. You have to avoid tearing muscles at all costs. Never to heavy deadlifts or anything else to demonstrate strength. 10 reps should be the minimum for bodybuilders. Doing less reps can help you get stronger, etc., but this really is ego training to impress others. Forget seeing how much you can bench and squat. Don't do powerlifting or arm wrestling. Both are too dangerous for bodybuilders.
One of the things that amuses me is that bodybuilders absolutely believe they must train all muscles each week or those muscles not trained will atrophy. This is not true but that is what just about everyone believes. When I was doing only arms for a month my whole upper body grew. I found this out by accident. When you think about it you cannot train arms hard and not recruit adjoining muscles. You cannot train back without training arms. What most muscleheads don't realize is that they do way too much and this prevents hypertrophy. It is much better targetting one or two muscle groups at a time. Do triceps and lat pulldowns to the top of the chest. Narrow grip and strict. Your whole upper body will grow. No worries about that at all.
Photo below taken in Kamloops, BC, in summer of 1969. No steroids what so ever. My Dad was an amazing guy. He grew up in Southern Italy and had poor nutrition. He was only 5-2.
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Just for the record. There are some blokes on Getbig that I will not respond to...ever again. One of those nasty blokes lives in Sydney. They can ask all they like but I will never reply or react to them.
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
nobody gives a shit what you say you can do.
why?
because most humans have eyes and ears.
we LOOK at you and see you LOOK like a pile of dogshit.
what would you do if some guy who lives in a wooden shed, offers advice on building your dream home? you'd laugh in his face.
why? because it's insulting that somebody like you.. somebody who looks like you.. would think they (you) can help anybody with bodybuilding.
if you actually LOOKED the part, you'd have people ASKING for your help, instead of having to go around looking for people who will waste 45seconds of their lives to listen to you tell them how good you are, despite looking like a fat, old pedophile.
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Photo below taken in Kamloops, BC, in summer of 1969. No steroids what so ever. My Dad was an amazing guy. He grew up in Southern Italy and had poor nutrition. He was only 5-2.
I'd hope "no steroids" would be painfully obvious to most people with an IQ greater than their age.
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I am posting here for Adam and a few other serious guys who want to learn what I have to say. For the know-it-all muscleheads why even post if you haven't anything constructive to add.
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looking good
so long story short the discovery was high volume training for arms
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looking good
so long story short the discovery was high volume training for arms
You missed at least half of what he wrote. High volume training was not the same as high-rep training....
NN
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Just because your are old dosent mean you are clever and know. How do u know that u know? Stupid guys also get older. Some people think they know and should learn others. I totlly recejt people who try to be a volontair educator for others. But I like to talk to people who dosent talk very much but achive great things.
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Just because your are old dosent mean you are clever and know. How do u know that u know? Stupid guys also get older. Some people think they know and should learn others. I totlly recejt people who try to be a volontair educator for others. But I like to talk to people who dosent talk very much but achive great things.
It takes a clever person to fathom what you are getting at. I know what I know from the results. It works.
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looking good
so long story short the discovery was high volume training for arms
I wonder why I bother trying to explain a theory. If that is all you got out of what I wrote then we are both wasting our time.
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Bodybuilding attracts the insecure. It's a sub culture of a sport. In this subculture you see what can only be described as a bunch of misfits. In order to feel good about them self they have to put down others.
How much of lunatic do you have to be to risk health to inject drugs bought from a drug dealer in order to look like a man? It's all temporary. These guys that think they are so knowledgeable about training would never post a picture 6 months clean. They know the truth but they lie to them self. It's rationalization.
Who spends thousands of dollars for a decade of trying to look buff? So they can walk the mall to impress the simpletons who are impressed with steroid physiques? In the end due to health, finance or arrest they go off. Then they spend their life with a bent up picture in their wallet of how they use to look. Any guy who has been around this game long enough knows how many times this story is repeated.
So are most bodybuilders fools? So many are. They spend all their young lives pursuing the drug life style when they should have been pursuing a career. Then they find them self 40 years old with two decades of cycling on and off doing the yo yo of muscles on and muscles off.
This site makes me laugh but it also makes me sad seeing the character of many members who claim to be interested in weight training. They really show case what many call generation nothing. A generation of under achievers who believe some one is responsible for their lot in life and look to the government to make it right.
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I am posting here for Adam and a few other serious guys who want to learn what I have to say. For the know-it-all muscleheads why even post if you haven't anything constructive to add.
Great pic thanks for posting it... I always read your threads.
WoooSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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Hello Vince,
A thin line indeed between having to train causing just enough microtrauma, resulting in DOMS , and having workouts resulting in connective tissue injuries/inflammation.
Would like to know your opinion on whether it is necessary to keep increasing the load, especially when you mention waiting longer before targetting specific muscle group again. Is Repeated Bout Effect less important in your described way of training?
Thanks,
André, The Hague, Netherlands.
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I competely understand what you wrote about how the arms are used while training upper body. I would greatly appreciate you pm'ing me some BB training info. my wife is interested in moving into BB from powerlifting.
my youtube channel is nasht5
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^ never mind that, I want to know how she disappears at the end :o
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Most people who post here probably not have a college degrees Vince, but they do have a MUCH better physique that you do.
Philosophize all you want, but it's true.
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optical illusion, lol. The cable machine is very close to a mirror. you can see my elbow in the mirror, she is standing to my right as I record her reflection in the mirror.
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this comes to mind(maybe?).
(http://i.imgur.com/Wqb5h48.jpg)
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
You have 57 years of nothing, Basile....nothing. Your training methods are outdated, you're completely out of shape, you refuse to debate me in a live chat for Getbig, and quite frankly you should spend your remaining years enjoying life on the beach rather than arguing on the internet.
A guy who refuses your help?? You honestly shouldn't be surprised.
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You have 57 years of nothing, Basile....nothing. Your training methods are outdated, you're completely out of shape, you refuse to debate me in a live chat for Getbig, and quite frankly you should spend your remaining years enjoying life on the beach rather than arguing on the internet.
A guy who refuses your help?? You honestly shouldn't be surprised.
I would pay good money
to hear you and basille go at it
get him on your radio show
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You have 57 years of nothing, Basile....nothing. Your training methods are outdated, you're completely out of shape, you refuse to debate me in a live chat for Getbig, and quite frankly you should spend your remaining years enjoying life on the beach rather than arguing on the internet.
A guy who refuses your help?? You honestly shouldn't be surprised.
He arguably looks better on his worst day than you on your best
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Vince's "knowledge" is completely useless for any bodybuilder. He is completely out of touch with reality when it comes to training and advancing a bb.
He actually thinks a pro bb will improve a bodypart such as the triceps by not doing rope pushdowns and by doing extensions behind the neck instead.
And let's not forget Vince's claim that pro bb's wouldn't need any drugs if they only sought his training advice instead.
He knows nothing of any use.
Him and Goodrum = soulmates. Both equally delusional.
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Hello Vince,
A thin line indeed between having to train causing just enough microtrauma, resulting in DOMS , and having workouts resulting in connective tissue injuries/inflammation.
Would like to know your opinion on whether it is necessary to keep increasing the load, especially when you mention waiting longer before targetting specific muscle group again. Is Repeated Bout Effect less important in your described way of training?
Thanks,
André, The Hague, Netherlands.
.
Good question and worthy of a reply. I was interested in some of the findings that Hypertrophy Specific Training claimed. According to them, maximum hypertrophy would require perhaps 8 hours training in one day. If that is true then no sensible person could sustain that protocol. Thus, what is the point at which near maximum hypertrophy is stimulated? When you look at what so many to the top pros are doing and have done over the past 50 years one thing stands out. Lots of sets. The typical protocol is to do several exercises per body part and do each for several sets. If you add these up it means they are doing anywhere from 9 to 25 or so sets per muscle group. A few extremists did even more sets perhaps as many as 50. However, there seems to be a point beyond which you get diminished returns. In other words, if you get a good result from X then doing 2 times X is not going to result in two times the growth.
It would be extremely difficult to determine exactly how much training is required by everyone and then average it out and use that as a target. Instead of doing something that cumbersome I do something completely different. I go to the state induced the next day. That is the key to DOMS training. You try to make your muscles quite sore. The kind of soreness that persists for several days. You don't want to generate acute, painful soreness that restricts any kind of training. You have to avoid damaging the connective tissue. I am certain the muscles themselves will be okay from just about any kind of hypertrophy training. Once you accept the feedback as a guide to hypertrophy it makes all the difference in the world. If you didn't induce sufficient DOMS then you have to return to the gym the next day and try something else. It is as simple as that. If any workouts fail to deliver those target DOMS you have to repeat a workout and try something different. In this way, sustaining the DOMS, it should be possible to grow larger from each workout. That is what I found so I am confident it will work for others.
The theory is simple but the technology applying it is where the problems occur. Some people cannot put sufficiently intense mechanical tension on the target muscle. You have to do this over and over and over and have that intense mechanical tension accumulate. Waste products accumulate. Eventually hypertrophy is triggered and that should be enough. It usually takes over an hour to do the arms properly. Perhaps up to two hours for larger muscles. The total amount of severe, intense mechanical tension in a muscle to generate hypertrophy is probably less than two minutes. It might be the last rep or two in a set to failure. It isn't necessary to do extra stuff beyond failure because more sets with the same resistance will deliver the stimulus.
About progression re resistance and maximum hypertrophy. Well, at the beginning of any programs there will be a rapid increase in strength. This cannot continue indefinitely for obvious reasons. However, the aim is to try to lift heavier weights for the same number of reps. Again, plateaus will appear and progress slows. That is when novelty comes to the rescue. It takes a good mind to be able to figure out new things to do. Many top guys have people smarter than themselves tell them what to do. There are some superior exercises and some that no bodybuilder should do.
The repeated bout effect is to be avoided. That is why we aim to keep the muscles in a state of DOMS. Once the muscle recovers it will take a much more intense workout to stimulate further hypertrophy.
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Stop bullshitting Basile. You said you would destroy me if we were to debate and I'm just telling you to back it up. Are you going to be a coward all of your life or do you want to pick the judges for the debate.
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About that theory of hypertrophy...
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Stop bullshitting Basile. You said you would destroy me if we were to debate and I'm just telling you to back it up. Are you going to be a coward all of your life or do you want to pick the judges for the debate.
Melvin, why should I help your radio show get more listeners when you insult me? No thanks, you get what you deserve and you deserve what you get.
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Stop bullshitting Basile. You said you would destroy me if we were to debate and I'm just telling you to back it up. Are you going to be a coward all of your life or do you want to pick the judges for the debate.
Goodrum would beat the piss out of Basile in a debate.
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nobody gives a shit what you say you can do.
why?
because most humans have eyes and ears.
we LOOK at you and see you LOOK like a pile of dogshit.
what would you do if some guy who lives in a wooden shed, offers advice on building your dream home? you'd laugh in his face.
why? because it's insulting that somebody like you.. somebody who looks like you.. would think they (you) can help anybody with bodybuilding.
if you actually LOOKED the part, you'd have people ASKING for your help, instead of having to go around looking for people who will waste 45seconds of their lives to listen to you tell them how good you are, despite looking like a fat, old pedophile.
You are a fucking idiot so i guess you would not take boxing advice from freddy roach or basketball advice from phil jackson because they dont look the part they are old, manny and the basketball team should get somebody who looks the part and they would do better, get some common sense you dumbfuck.
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What would you have had Milos do to get his triceps bigger?
he is a tool head that is why Milos and that other fella through it on his face.he still thinks he is an expert.sir dont make a fool out of yourself going around offering people free advise.
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some pretty damn good football coaches never played the game and some great coaches were never good players... just something to think about.
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher.
So you decided against the chance of having a much sought-after and highly paid job to instead teach kids how to run round a track?
::)
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vince your days on earth are soon numbered youre old as fuck.
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Vince's "knowledge" is completely useless for any bodybuilder. He is completely out of touch with reality when it comes to training and advancing a bb.
He actually thinks a pro bb will improve a bodypart such as the triceps by not doing rope pushdowns and by doing extensions behind the neck instead.
And let's not forget Vince's claim that pro bb's wouldn't need any drugs if they only sought his training advice instead.
He knows nothing of any use.
Him and Goodrum = soulmates. Both equally delusional.
They both are, but Goodrum's delusions are of galactic proportions. Have you seen what he looked like when he got onstage?
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Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
Woah, hold the phone. You mean to tell me this bodybuilder was approached by a decrepit obese old man, and DECLINED his help in increasing his muscularity!? The nerve of this meathead!
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lay down your training theories basille. give us the exact split routine with exercise lists not just this vague waffle you always post.
if your theories work you will go down as a legend; the fat, sexually deviant version of vince gironda.
what you basille?
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I competely understand what you wrote about how the arms are used while training upper body. I would greatly appreciate you pm'ing me some BB training info. my wife is interested in moving into BB from powerlifting.
my youtube channel is nasht5
your wife looks like king alex brah. tell her to tone down the test dosage.
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Melvin, why should I help your radio show get more listeners when you insult me? No thanks, you get what you deserve and you deserve what you get.
I didn't want you up there anyway but you started yapping off at the mouth so much that I gave you the opportunity....to which I'm not surprised that you are chickening out, you crusty old yellow bastard.
Don't fucking bother me about it again if you're not going to back up your talk.
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imagine if vince actually went on the goodrum show...i would like to listen to this!
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You know, before I went to university I knew I could be a doctor, architect, lawyer, engineer or anything I desired. What did I end up studying? Philosophy! Everyone is an expert in philosophy! I had one fool tell me that he had a philosophy, too. "What is your philosophy, Armando?" "Well, he said, when I eat, I eat and when I sleep, I sleep!" Brilliant for sure, because who can refute that? The trouble is that philosophy is completely empty and useless.
So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher. Then a gym owner. Well, lo and behold, everyone was an expert in exercise and nutrition. The two fields I specialized in and no one recognizes my training and long experience. Even here on Getbig everyone is an expert. I well remember telling Milos Sarcev that I could help him get bigger triceps. Well, that didn't go over well and he was quite annoyed at me. He said that he has tried everything and nothing worked. Well, I told him, he hasn't tried what I advocate. Anyway, we eventually sorted that out but I never did get to explain what I had in mind. I offered to help Luke Wood build his arms bigger but he never showed up at my gym to see what I could do for him. I guess he figured if Milos couldn't get them bigger than no one else could.
Today I saw a guy who was definitely a bodybuilder. I talked to him because he came into a place that I was at. I told him he was a bodybuilder and he told me he was competing soon. I noticed the typical weak arms in that depleted state and told him to come and see me because I could help him get bigger triceps. He told me point blank he didn't want my help! I wasn't charging him. I had nothing to gain. I couldn't believe he said that. What is it with muscleheads? Most are too darn thick to even know what is good advice and what is nonsense. I have 57 years experience and these guys aren't interested in what I have to say. Amazing and very disappointing.
That is why I say most bodybuilders are fools. I don't have to mention stuff like the belief that free weights are better than machines. Nor do I have to tell them that they are ingesting way too much protein. Nope, they already know everything.
Have you ever considered that maybe you don't know as much as you think you do??? From your posts you seem to be very bitter about your life's work and the things that you "could have done" but didn't do..
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(http://i61.tinypic.com/4khgdj.jpg)
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You are a fucking idiot so i guess you would not take boxing advice from freddy roach or basketball advice from phil jackson because they dont look the part they are old, manny and the basketball team should get somebody who looks the part and they would do better, get some common sense you dumbfuck.
ahh.. I see the dumbfuck everybody hates (you) replied to my post...
you senseless fucking moron. do you see freddy roach and phil running around offering help to people who aren't asking for it?
no... but you're too clueless to realize that you fucking dicksucking son of a no-teeth meth whore.
did you grow up huffing gas? you have the social skills of a child-rape victim.
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I would pay good money
to hear you and basille go at it
get him on your radio show
Yes I would pay actual money to listen to this.
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Melvin, why should I help your radio show get more listeners when you insult me? No thanks, you get what you deserve and you deserve what you get.
You sent a pizza to the guy's hotel room, for Pete's sake, but you can't chat with him for his silly show?
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Good question and worthy of a reply. I was interested in some of the findings that Hypertrophy Specific Training claimed. According to them, maximum hypertrophy would require perhaps 8 hours training in one day. If that is true then no sensible person could sustain that protocol. Thus, what is the point at which near maximum hypertrophy is stimulated? When you look at what so many to the top pros are doing and have done over the past 50 years one thing stands out. Lots of sets. The typical protocol is to do several exercises per body part and do each for several sets. If you add these up it means they are doing anywhere from 9 to 25 or so sets per muscle group. A few extremists did even more sets perhaps as many as 50. However, there seems to be a point beyond which you get diminished returns. In other words, if you get a good result from X then doing 2 times X is not going to result in two times the growth.
It would be extremely difficult to determine exactly how much training is required by everyone and then average it out and use that as a target. Instead of doing something that cumbersome I do something completely different. I go to the state induced the next day. That is the key to DOMS training. You try to make your muscles quite sore. The kind of soreness that persists for several days. You don't want to generate acute, painful soreness that restricts any kind of training. You have to avoid damaging the connective tissue. I am certain the muscles themselves will be okay from just about any kind of hypertrophy training. Once you accept the feedback as a guide to hypertrophy it makes all the difference in the world. If you didn't induce sufficient DOMS then you have to return to the gym the next day and try something else. It is as simple as that. If any workouts fail to deliver those target DOMS you have to repeat a workout and try something different. In this way, sustaining the DOMS, it should be possible to grow larger from each workout. That is what I found so I am confident it will work for others.
The theory is simple but the technology applying it is where the problems occur. Some people cannot put sufficiently intense mechanical tension on the target muscle. You have to do this over and over and over and have that intense mechanical tension accumulate. Waste products accumulate. Eventually hypertrophy is triggered and that should be enough. It usually takes over an hour to do the arms properly. Perhaps up to two hours for larger muscles. The total amount of severe, intense mechanical tension in a muscle to generate hypertrophy is probably less than two minutes. It might be the last rep or two in a set to failure. It isn't necessary to do extra stuff beyond failure because more sets with the same resistance will deliver the stimulus.
About progression re resistance and maximum hypertrophy. Well, at the beginning of any programs there will be a rapid increase in strength. This cannot continue indefinitely for obvious reasons. However, the aim is to try to lift heavier weights for the same number of reps. Again, plateaus will appear and progress slows. That is when novelty comes to the rescue. It takes a good mind to be able to figure out new things to do. Many top guys have people smarter than themselves tell them what to do. There are some superior exercises and some that no bodybuilder should do.
The repeated bout effect is to be avoided. That is why we aim to keep the muscles in a state of DOMS. Once the muscle recovers it will take a much more intense workout to stimulate further hypertrophy.
Great advice. I have run into a lot of the same conclusions with my 25+ years of training. How much protein do you think is necessary per pound of bodyweight? .5?
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I`d like to see Vince lay out the arm routine as he wants it to be performed.
It`s a bit hard for my dumb ass to understand completely how he wants it to be done.
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ahh.. I see the dumbfuck everybody hates (you) replied to my post...
you senseless fucking moron. do you see freddy roach and phil running around offering help to people who aren't asking for it?
no... but you're too clueless to realize that you fucking dicksucking son of a no-teeth meth whore.
did you grow up huffing gas? you have the social skills of a child-rape victim.
You claim that if he looked the part people would take advice from him so I proved you wrong, you owned yourself without any help from me, you have the IQ level of a retard on LSD.
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Hard to believe after 70 years of training that someone would still think DOMS is in any way related to muscle growth.
protip, if you thrashed your arms hard enough to tear muscle fibers and cause DOMS then you'll have created inflammation, and fluid will cause temporary swelling.
hope that helps.
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You claim that if he looked the part people would take advice from him so I proved you wrong, you owned yourself without any help from me, you have the IQ level of a retard on LSD.
read the whole thing.
"owned"? what kind of adult uses terms like that? do you live your life on message boards? what's next? "meltdown"? are you a recovering meth addict?
if he actually looked the part he, maybe people would seek out his advice, instead of him begging people to listen to him.
we see people like him, and most likely you, in the gym all the time.. running around looking for somebody to listen to him give his free advice.. somebody to listen to him. usually some little newbie who doesn't know any better.
fucking losers.
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Vince never improved his arms after doing those shows. How come? He knows how to gain a quarter inch each workout. Why in the hell would he not do the routine himself... decades went by with no results after those Dianabol cycles.
Has no pupils either. Not one single example of him working his magic.
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I listened and it helped. I used to put as much weight as I could on the triceps pushdown and heave my body up and down, then Lee Haney, 6X Mr. Olympia at the time came up to me laughing and moved the pin up, told me to step back, tuck in my elbows and try now. it was epic.
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vince your days on earth are soon numbered youre old as fuck.
Everyone has numbered days remaining. Hope this helps.
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Hard to believe after 70 years of training that someone would still think DOMS is in any way related to muscle growth.
protip, if you thrashed your arms hard enough to tear muscle fibers and cause DOMS then you'll have created inflammation, and fluid will cause temporary swelling.
hope that helps.
It is always refreshing to see the advice of a true authority. Hypertrophy is partly inflammation. The trick is to keep most of that swelling. That is where increasing the resistance helps. There is research that shows that DOMS is accompanied by remodelling, ie, hypertrophy.
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You sent a pizza to the guy's hotel room, for Pete's sake, but you can't chat with him for his silly show?
Keith sent pizzas to Goodrum, not me. I don't trust that buffoon. He has no integrity so why should I expose myself to his lies and bullshit?
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Great advice. I have run into a lot of the same conclusions with my 25+ years of training. How much protein do you think is necessary per pound of bodyweight? .5?
Protein ingestion by bodybuilders is excessive. If you eat extra food for the calories you will get sufficient protein. There is no need for any such supplements in a balanced diet.
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I`d like to see Vince lay out the arm routine as he wants it to be performed.
It`s a bit hard for my dumb ass to understand completely how he wants it to be done.
I have given sufficient information here for others to try the theory. Part of the problem is most gyms don't have the triceps device I would recommend.
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I have given sufficient information here for others to try the theory. Part of the problem is most gyms don't have the triceps device I would recommend.
Would you go as far as to say the only gym that would buy your equipment would be owned by Shitzo??
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I listened and it helped. I used to put as much weight as I could on the triceps pushdown and heave my body up and down, then Lee Haney, 6X Mr. Olympia at the time came up to me laughing and moved the pin up, told me to step back, tuck in my elbows and try now. it was epic.
I see videos of some of the pros doing triceps pressdowns. Amazing that they benefit from that exercise. It is effective up to a certain size and afterwards doesn't do much. I think the problem is the elbows can move and when heavier weights are used the elbows move and so the effectiveness evaporates. Also, the triceps need resistance in the last 15 degrees of extension and the pressdowns are not ideal here. That is why putting your arms in a position beside your head is superior.
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Would you go as far as to say the only gym that would buy your equipment would be owned by Shitzo??
Don't be a FW here, thanks. I don't sell any gym equipment to other gyms.
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(http://i61.tinypic.com/4khgdj.jpg)
Regardless of all the brutal wars they've fought over the years, when it came time to pose the respect was always there.
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I don't sell any gym equipment to other gyms.
Speaking somewhat of this, I have a genuine admiration for your metal working skill. Where you formally educated in the trade or did you learn it as a hobbyist?
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Speaking somewhat of this, I have a genuine admiration for your metal working skill. Where you formally educated in the trade or did you learn it as a hobbyist?
I had a welder show me how to weld with those metal rods. Now I can do Tig and Mig welding. I built my biceps-supinator all by myself. I balked at the idea and it took me a few years to actually proceed. In the end I was pleased with my invention.
I made something that Arthur Jones never conceived or built. So I am self-taught. I read welding manuals and other publications that helped fitting and turning. I eventually acquired enough machines for an engineering factory.
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I had a welder show me how to weld with those metal rods. Now I can do Tig and Mig welding. I built my biceps-supinator all by myself. I balked at the idea and it took me a few years to actually proceed. In the end I was pleased with my invention.
I made something that Arthur Jones never conceived or built. So I am self-taught. I read welding manuals and other publications that helped fitting and turning. I eventually acquired enough machines for an engineering factory.
Thanks for the answer, I always admire when someone takes an idea that's been roaming around in their head and turns it into something physical.
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Thanks for the answer, I always admire when someone takes an idea that's been roaming around in their head and turns it into something physical.
O brother you must be well liked when yo gotta be a bassile guy.... Hahaha ::)
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Keith sent pizzas to Goodrum, not me. I don't trust that buffoon. He has no integrity so why should I expose myself to his lies and bullshit?
Ah, my mistake.
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I see videos of some of the pros doing triceps pressdowns. Amazing that they benefit from that exercise. It is effective up to a certain size and afterwards doesn't do much. I think the problem is the elbows can move and when heavier weights are used the elbows move and so the effectiveness evaporates. Also, the triceps need resistance in the last 15 degrees of extension and the pressdowns are not ideal here. That is why putting your arms in a position beside your head is superior.
superior in what way? in which angle? overhead extention? skull crusher? 45deg skull crusher?
please tell me WHAT muscle then, is causing the weight/bar to travel down.. and if there's no resistance at the last 15 degrees of extension, why? does gravity cease to exist during that movement?
pressdowns have their place.. saying one movement is "superior" to another illustrates WHY nobody gives a fuck what you say about training.
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I haven't even bothered to read any of you other posts in this thread, but I suspect they're ALL full of the same type of non-sense... which shows exactly why nobody respects ANYTHING you have to say related to bodybuilding.
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read the whole thing.
"owned"? what kind of adult uses terms like that? do you live your life on message boards? what's next? "meltdown"? are you a recovering meth addict?
if he actually looked the part he, maybe people would seek out his advice, instead of him begging people to listen to him.
we see people like him, and most likely you, in the gym all the time.. running around looking for somebody to listen to him give his free advice.. somebody to listen to him. usually some little newbie who doesn't know any better.
fucking losers.
I have never understood the whole "owned" thing - that's friggin gay as hell. I would say that these guys would never talk like that in real life - but I imagine when they toolbags convene they say a lot of shit that would seem odd to most. You have to truly be a sad dude to enjoy headgames 100% anonymously on a message board and the glory of your day is when a fellow douche give you the coveted "you owned him man !!!! Or pwned whatever the fuck that means
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I have never understood the whole "owned" thing - that's friggin gay as hell. I would say that these guys would never talk like that in real life - but I imagine when they toolbags convene they say a lot of shit that would seem odd to most. You have to truly be a sad dude to enjoy headgames 100% anonymously on a message board and the glory of your day is when a fellow douche give you the coveted "you owned him man !!!! Or pwned whatever the fuck that means
Agree, "owned" is gay as fuck. So is "Lol."
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Agree, "owned" is gay as fuck. So is "Lol."
I was thinking of insulting you but judging by your username you already have some self esteem issues, i will give you props for telling us what you are like though.
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I was thinking of insulting you but judging by your username you already have some self esteem issues, i will give you props for telling us what you are like though.
Insulting me about what?
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I haven't even bothered to read any of you other posts in this thread, but I suspect they're ALL full of the same type of non-sense... which shows exactly why nobody respects ANYTHING you have to say related to bodybuilding.
You seem to have a hard on for vince if you have any sexually repressed feelings you can let them out because this is getbig after all.
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Insulting me about what?
I was going to own you but i think since you have a looks problem i will leave you alone.
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I was going to own you but i think since you have a looks problem i will leave you alone.
Ah, it's about "owned." Fair enough.
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"So I didn't pursue a career in philosophy but became a PE teacher"
hahahahahahahahaa....... no wait....hahahahahahahaha haa....."career in philosophy"...hahahahahahahah
whats a philosophy career pay these days? hahahahahahaha....cant breathe......hahahahhaha a
PE teacher!!!! hahahahahahahahahahahaha oh shit.....hahahahahahahah ahaha
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Hmmmmmmmmmm....
Quite elaborate. "Tautology," one might say.
Problem: Verbose, as in "diarrhea of the mouth"
Summary: One good photo?
Kinesiology score: "0"
Physiology score: "0"
Why someone would actually have the energy and time to write up something so elaborate, equivalent to that of a dog chasing its tail is beyond me....
Beyond words ~
Good times.
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.
Good question and worthy of a reply. I was interested in some of the findings that Hypertrophy Specific Training claimed. According to them, maximum hypertrophy would require perhaps 8 hours training in one day. If that is true then no sensible person could sustain that protocol. Thus, what is the point at which near maximum hypertrophy is stimulated? When you look at what so many to the top pros are doing and have done over the past 50 years one thing stands out. Lots of sets. The typical protocol is to do several exercises per body part and do each for several sets. If you add these up it means they are doing anywhere from 9 to 25 or so sets per muscle group. A few extremists did even more sets perhaps as many as 50. However, there seems to be a point beyond which you get diminished returns. In other words, if you get a good result from X then doing 2 times X is not going to result in two times the growth.
It would be extremely difficult to determine exactly how much training is required by everyone and then average it out and use that as a target. Instead of doing something that cumbersome I do something completely different. I go to the state induced the next day. That is the key to DOMS training. You try to make your muscles quite sore. The kind of soreness that persists for several days. You don't want to generate acute, painful soreness that restricts any kind of training. You have to avoid damaging the connective tissue. I am certain the muscles themselves will be okay from just about any kind of hypertrophy training. Once you accept the feedback as a guide to hypertrophy it makes all the difference in the world. If you didn't induce sufficient DOMS then you have to return to the gym the next day and try something else. It is as simple as that. If any workouts fail to deliver those target DOMS you have to repeat a workout and try something different. In this way, sustaining the DOMS, it should be possible to grow larger from each workout. That is what I found so I am confident it will work for others.
The theory is simple but the technology applying it is where the problems occur. Some people cannot put sufficiently intense mechanical tension on the target muscle. You have to do this over and over and over and have that intense mechanical tension accumulate. Waste products accumulate. Eventually hypertrophy is triggered and that should be enough. It usually takes over an hour to do the arms properly. Perhaps up to two hours for larger muscles. The total amount of severe, intense mechanical tension in a muscle to generate hypertrophy is probably less than two minutes. It might be the last rep or two in a set to failure. It isn't necessary to do extra stuff beyond failure because more sets with the same resistance will deliver the stimulus.
About progression re resistance and maximum hypertrophy. Well, at the beginning of any programs there will be a rapid increase in strength. This cannot continue indefinitely for obvious reasons. However, the aim is to try to lift heavier weights for the same number of reps. Again, plateaus will appear and progress slows. That is when novelty comes to the rescue. It takes a good mind to be able to figure out new things to do. Many top guys have people smarter than themselves tell them what to do. There are some superior exercises and some that no bodybuilder should do.
The repeated bout effect is to be avoided. That is why we aim to keep the muscles in a state of DOMS. Once the muscle recovers it will take a much more intense workout to stimulate further hypertrophy.
Excellent post, interesting ideas.
Vince is unusually lucid in this thread
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lol @ "it usually takes over an hour to do the arms properly".
fucking retarded.
absolute nonsense.
there's a reason nobody comes to you for advice. they probably overhear you talking to somebody else, spouting off this crap and tell their friends what a fucking idiot you are. "dude, you should've seen this fatassed old man in the gym... talking to the front desk girl and pointing out the guys with the best physiques in the gym and saying 'they're doing it wrong, the're all a bunch of fools. if only they'd listen to me, they'd be great'."
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nm
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lol @ "it usually takes over an hour to do the arms properly".
fucking retarded.
absolute nonsense.
there's a reason nobody comes to you for advice. they probably overhear you talking to somebody else, spouting off this crap and tell their friends what a fucking idiot you are. "dude, you should've seen this fatassed old man in the gym... talking to the front desk girl and pointing out the guys with the best physiques in the gym and saying 'they're doing it wrong, the're all a bunch of fools. if only they'd listen to me, they'd be great'."
Have to agree, a bit deluded ... and bitter. Even if he was right, I would never spend a fucking hour on arms. 2-3 body parts (trained intensely) < 30 mins. Good enough is good enough, I says.
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(http://i61.tinypic.com/4khgdj.jpg)
—a bastille built in 1840 to entertain captured pirates—
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You criticized him. Of course he says no. I would never walk up to a guy and say ,your arms look weak. Let me help you...You are lucky he didn't hit you.
someone could take it the wrong way. Seriously