Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Royalty on August 31, 2014, 10:07:15 PM
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On paper, this might not be a scientifically proven fact, but it does seem to be somewhat valid.
I remember years ago, Mike Quinn said that steroids caused him to age prematurely.
I've recently seen 3 heavy roid users that simply looked old and weathered. Greying, Balding. Heavy wrinkles. Their body fat seemed to be higher. They didn't look happy either. They looked worn out. Their youth has left them.
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You play, you pay.
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On paper, this might not be a scientifically proven fact, but it does seem to be somewhat valid.
I remember years ago, Mike Quinn said that steroids caused him to age prematurely.
I've recently seen 3 heavy roid users that simply looked old and weathered. Greying, Balding. Heavy wrinkles. Their body fat seemed to be higher. They didn't look happy either. They looked worn out. Their youth has left them.
Key word there is "heavy" roid users. Use of anything heavy will hurt you.
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Key word there is "heavy" roid users. Use of anything heavy will hurt you.
I've gotta agree with that...heavy drinkers, heavy smokers, heavy roid users etc...
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Key word there is "heavy" roid users. Use of anything heavy will hurt you.
Do you have the delusion that your light dosing ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
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Key word there is "heavy" roid users. Use of anything heavy will hurt you.
How about weights.. "coach" .. does using it causes premature ecjac aging of the cardiovascular system? Seems like you shrank quite a bit the last few years. Have you had to reajust your golf clubs accordingly?
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a lot of things speed up aging process
for instance, i was on 4chan yesterday and that got me feeling old and confused
then i watched the mtv video awards and i had not heard any of the singers and that made me feel really old.
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Agree, i was chatting with a lad in the gym yesterday who told me her had been on gear since he was 16, i though he was about 29/30 and in fact he told me he was 21. I was genuinely shocked as I'm pretty good at gauging ages.
By the time he's my age(45) he'll be either dead or look like he's in his fucking 60's
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You are correct. Its pretty simple.
Steroids massively increase IGF-1. Which in turns rapidly increases cell division. Cells have a limited number of divisions, eventually you get to the end faster.
Additionally faster cell division has been linked to other health issues such as cancer as more errors are introduced when the body focuses on division rather than repair.
This is one of the reasons why fasting is popular, as its believed, but not proven yet in humans, that fasting reduces levels of IGF-1 and slows cell turnover and increases cell repair.
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if that is true then what about the use of HRT and GH for longevity?
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you make it sound like speeding up the aging process is a bad thing
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if that is true then what about the use of HRT and GH for longevity?
What about it specifically?
HRT and GH are pushed by American quacks as anti-aging, all it does is improve your bodies outside cosmetic appearance, fuller muscles, improved muscle mass and physical strength. It is improving your physical performance and appearance. It is in no way anti-aging in terms of the your internal organs nor lowering your rate of cell division.
The improved appearance, along with other benefits of GH and HRT on joints, will certainly give the user at the clinic the impression he has improved in terms of libido, strength, well being, but this is just a temporary lift. His internals have not benefited whatsoever, if anything they have taken a hit.
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from 250mg test every 10 days and 1-2iu of growth a day? What if they didnt have optimal levels of test or growth hormone, that could lead to problems itself.
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You are correct. Its pretty simple.
Steroids massively increase IGF-1. Which in turns rapidly increases cell division. Cells have a limited number of divisions, eventually you get to the end faster.
Additionally faster cell division has been linked to other health issues such as cancer as more errors are introduced when the body focuses on division rather than repair.
This is one of the reasons why fasting is popular, as its believed, but not proven yet in humans, that fasting reduces levels of IGF-1 and slows cell turnover and increases cell repair.
Very interesting!
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You are correct. Its pretty simple.
Steroids massively increase IGF-1. Which in turns rapidly increases cell division. Cells have a limited number of divisions, eventually you get to the end faster.
Additionally faster cell division has been linked to other health issues such as cancer as more errors are introduced when the body focuses on division rather than repair.
This is one of the reasons why fasting is popular, as its believed, but not proven yet in humans, that fasting reduces levels of IGF-1 and slows cell turnover and increases cell repair.
fuck
we gonna die soon
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Sure there are cases where TRT or GH is prescribed for genuine low testosterone levels, although it is still far more common in the US than the rest of the world. In Europe the jury is still out on testosterone replacement and in the medical community they have not even agreed a clear benchmark figure for what a low testosterone level is. TRT brings its own risks and introducing TRT is only going to lower a patients testosterone levels even further. It may be better to attempt to look at ways to boost a patients own natural testosterone levels, especially if they have multiple lifestyle issues that can be addressed, ie lack of exercises, poor diet, high stress. Again the jury is still out, but there is more evidence coming out that steroids affect the structure of the heart itself (more than just thickening of the arteries) leading to reduced efficiency and possible risk of sudden death syndrome. The question has to be asked is TRT going to put the patient at risk of different medical condition.
From a anti-aging perspective, a lot of the literature suggests lower levels of testosterone are better for longevity (not necessarily better for your mental wellbeing or physical performance). Phytoestrogens can have positive benefits to men in terms of longevity. One of the reasons women live longer than men is because of the protective effects that estrogen has on the cardiovascular system.
Nobody really knows what the effect of low dose TRT will have.
Certainly recreational use of large amounts of steroids, will massively increase IGF-1. The whole bodybuilding lifestyle is based around achieving this. Eat large amounts of calories and especially protein, which again has been shown to increase IGF-1, this is what we want and what we need to build bigger muscles. But there is a trade off which is the increased cell division.
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Very interesting!
Yes it is, the research into fasting is very interesting and looking like the best anti-aging option out there.
Although its not going to be practical for most bodybuilders, for the casual bodybuilder, who has an interest in their health they should consider including some fasting element into their program.
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Sure there are cases where TRT or GH is prescribed for genuine low testosterone levels, although it is still far more common in the US than the rest of the world. In Europe the jury is still out on testosterone replacement and in the medical community they have not even agreed a clear benchmark figure for what a low testosterone level is. TRT brings its own risks and introducing TRT is only going to lower a patients testosterone levels even further. It may be better to attempt to look at ways to boost a patients own natural testosterone levels, especially if they have multiple lifestyle issues that can be addressed, ie lack of exercises, poor diet, high stress. Again the jury is still out, but there is more evidence coming out that steroids affect the structure of the heart itself (more than just thickening of the arteries) leading to reduced efficiency and possible risk of sudden death syndrome. The question has to be asked is TRT going to put the patient at risk of different medical condition.
From a anti-aging perspective, a lot of the literature suggests lower levels of testosterone are better for longevity (not necessarily better for your mental wellbeing or physical performance). Phytoestrogens can have positive benefits to men in terms of longevity. One of the reasons women live longer than men is because of the protective effects that estrogen has on the cardiovascular system.
Nobody really knows what the effect of low dose TRT will have.
Certainly recreational use of large amounts of steroids, will massively increase IGF-1. The whole bodybuilding lifestyle is based around achieving this. Eat large amounts of calories and especially protein which again has been shown to increase IGF-1, this is what we want and what we need to build bigger muscles. But there is a trade off which is the increased cell division.
sounds exotic
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Yes it is, the research into fasting is very interesting and looking like the best anti-aging option out there.
Although its not going to be practical for most bodybuilders, for the casual bodybuilder, who has an interest in their health they should consider including some fasting element into their program.
Its getting popular here. There is a diet which promotes eating under 500 calories for two days out of seven.
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my dad does that more around 700 cals
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if that is true then what about the use of HRT and GH for longevity?
Because those doses are aimed at creating similar hormone levels to a 21 year old.
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The body has evolved over centuries to go long spells without a meal.
As long as we have access to water, it presents no short term issue.
I think the body and mind functions at it's sharpest when deprived slightly - perhaps it's "hunter" mode kicking in.
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Its getting popular here. There is a diet which promotes eating under 500 calories for two days out of seven.
I'm sure more evidence will come to prove it works, because it addresses issues at the very most basic level of how our body works, going beyond just IGF-1 related issues.
When we eat we age a little bit, when we breath we age a little bit. This is because every time we eat and our body breaks down the food to convert to energy, oxygen molecules are released into our system. Oxygen is a free radical and it goes off an damages structures in our body, every small bit of damage over time builds up and leads to aging. Eating a diet rich in anti-oxidants will help address this by mopping up the free oxygen molecules...or just dont eat...and dont breathe either ;D
By reducing the number, amount and frequency of meals you reduce the amount of oxygen molecules that are being released and simply reduce the potential for oxidative damage to occur in the body.
You can probably see the issue with the typical bodybuilders diet, eating vast amounts of food, which in turns means vast amounts of free radicals being released into the body as the food is converted to energy. Unless your eating a massive amount of anti-oxidants with each meal, this long term over consumption of food will increase the aging process as well.
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im 49 yrs old n im on TRT and never felt better in my life,energy,sex drive,zest for life ect r all in full effect,id rather live to 70 feeling like this than to live to 80 felling like shit like i was before i went on TRT, QUALITY over QUANTITY always. so if im shortening my life some yrs thats ok,none of us get outta here alive anyway
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I'm sure more evidence will come to prove it works, because it addresses issues at the very most basic level of how our body works, going beyond just IGF-1 related issues.
When we eat we age a little bit, when we breath we age a little bit. This is because every time we eat and our body breaks down the food to convert to energy, oxygen molecules are released into our system. Oxygen is a free radical and it goes off an damages structures in our body, every small bit of damage over time builds up and leads to aging. Eating a diet rich in anti-oxidants will help address this by mopping up the free oxygen molecules...or just dont eat...and dont breathe either ;D
By reducing the number, amount and frequency of meals you reduce the amount of oxygen molecules that are being released and simply reduce the potential for oxidative damage to occur in the body.
You can probably see the issue with the typical bodybuilders diet, eating vast amounts of food, which in turns means vast amounts of free radicals being released into the body as the food is converted to energy. Unless your eating a massive amount of anti-oxidants with each meal, this long term over consumption of food will increase the aging process as well.
Yes I recall reading about studies suggesting that people who eat less live longer.
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I have noticed this forever. I have no scientific proof except for observation. Guys do seem to age using steroids. How many guys in their 20's and 30's look older than their years? You have guys in their 30's looking like they are in their late 40's.
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I have noticed this forever. I have no scientific proof except for observation. Guys do seem to age using steroids. How many guys in their 20's and 30's look older than their years? You have guys in their 30's looking like they are in their late 40's.
i hear u oldtimer n i see that also,but i think thats from ABUSING the testosterone. im 49 n been using test since i was 17 off n on and alot of people tell me i look 35,i guess its genetics also tho. ive seen some of my freinds who abuse alcohol look like they r 75 :osame with smoking,like someone else said, anything in excess,even food can make u look older than u r
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Not always the case: Serge Nubret at 70.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=373792.0;attach=410828)
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Not always the case: Serge Nubret at 70.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=373792.0;attach=410828)
i dont think he used them in large amounts
plus black people age ver well
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I haven't touched any drugs and barely drink yet have aged pretty horribly over the past decade (16-26). It's genetics that play the biggest role in everything.
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@gracie - looking great for 94 :D
Thought you were late 20ies/early 30ies. Your mind is still young.
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gee i wonder what happens when you fast, i bet you have twice the energy! might as well fast all the time!!!!
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Tren abusers are the worst. Long in the tooth and looking 45+ by the end of their 20s.
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i dont think he used them in large amounts
plus black people age ver well
Indeed, not a good example. The main cause of facial aging is UV exposure. Black people have the most melanin in their skin which gives them natural UV protection, Indians and other ethnicity with darker skin also benefit. White people have the least, with blondes and finally redheads, having almost none.
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@gracie - looking great for 94 :D
Thought you were late 20ies/early 30ies. Your mind is still young.
;D
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if that is true then what about the use of HRT and GH for longevity?
Hey potato eater, you're in over your head.
Of course you were in over your head when they taught 2+2=4.
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Speeding up the aging process is not why most people take steroids.
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Try running straight ethanol in the family passenger van and see what it does to the engine. Of course, it runs great for a little while.
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Do you have the delusion that your light dosing ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
And what ever made you think that I was EVER heavy user...especially now. Instead of you bullshit comments, how about backing it up. Twat
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How about weights.. "coach" .. does using it causes premature ecjac aging of the cardiovascular system? Seems like you shrank quite a bit the last few years. Have you had to reajust your golf clubs accordingly?
WTF are you talking about???
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What about it specifically?
HRT and GH are pushed by American quacks as anti-aging, all it does is improve your bodies outside cosmetic appearance, fuller muscles, improved muscle mass and physical strength. It is improving your physical performance and appearance. It is in no way anti-aging in terms of the your internal organs nor lowering your rate of cell division.
The improved appearance, along with other benefits of GH and HRT on joints, will certainly give the user at the clinic the impression he has improved in terms of libido, strength, well being, but this is just a temporary lift. His internals have not benefited whatsoever, if anything they have taken a hit.
Respectfully, I went over this years ago and while I agree with some of your assessments, I disagree thats all it does and it goes much deeper than that. Remember what aging is, it's the breakdown of cells, decrease of test levels, etc.
http://www.lef.org/protocols/male_reproductive/male_hormone_restoration_01.htm
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i think its more the type of compound, the amounts, dietary considerations and lifestyle pursuits in general that lead to the aging rather than the 'steroids' themselves.
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I think prepping for a show will do it. Look at the guys on stage.
Tren, mast, winny and the hardening drugs will do it.
And the sunken eyes and thin skin from dieting.
Everyone is different but remember those photos of trey brewer? Jeez
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All genetics. Jay did an excellent job with aging.
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All genetics. Jay did an excellent job with aging.
Yeah, Jay always did look youthful. Plus he never lost his hair.
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I'm guessing that many people taking Chinese powders are definitely speeding up the aging process.
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On paper, this might not be a scientifically proven fact, but it does seem to be somewhat valid.
I remember years ago, Mike Quinn said that steroids caused him to age prematurely.
I've recently seen 3 heavy roid users that simply looked old and weathered. Greying, Balding. Heavy wrinkles. Their body fat seemed to be higher. They didn't look happy either. They looked worn out. Their youth has left them.
Arnie is living proof of this. Premature severe height loss, and overall mummification of his entire body.
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Look no further than the two new pros justin compton and Aaron Clarke , two guys who are 24/25 but look 40's
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Respectfully, I went over this years ago and while I agree with some of your assessments, I disagree thats all it does and it goes much deeper than that. Remember what aging is, it's the breakdown of cells, decrease of test levels, etc.
http://www.lef.org/protocols/male_reproductive/male_hormone_restoration_01.htm
I would agree that there will be some benefits, whether they are worth the potential risks depends on each individual situation. In terms of aging, yes cells breakdown, or they are destroyed, that is part of the aging process, but as we know cells have a finite life and in most cases a finite number of replications, so taking something that accelerates this process is effectively speeding up aging.
The HRT and TRT community promote these drugs as if they were a fountain of youth and that they have longevity benefits. In my opinion this is incorrect. They alleviate and address signs and symptoms of aging and contribute to improved feelings of wellness in the user. Yes they can have positive effects, but they are not actually "anti-aging".
I am not against hormones either for bodybuilding purposes or medical conditions, if people want to use them that's fine, my point relates more to people who take them thinking they are getting a "free meal". There will be a "cost" on their health it might be small it might be big, we don't know, but for most people there will be one.
In terms of the HRT and TRT, I wonder how many clinics try to prescribe lifestyle, diet and exercises routines to address patients symptoms before they prescribe TRT, not many I imagine.
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What about it specifically?
HRT and GH are pushed by American quacks as anti-aging, all it does is improve your bodies outside cosmetic appearance, fuller muscles, improved muscle mass and physical strength. It is improving your physical performance and appearance. It is in no way anti-aging in terms of the your internal organs nor lowering your rate of cell division.
The improved appearance, along with other benefits of GH and HRT on joints, will certainly give the user at the clinic the impression he has improved in terms of libido, strength, well being, but this is just a temporary lift. His internals have not benefited whatsoever, if anything they have taken a hit.
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HGH, when not abused, has been proven to extend life...
Grow Young With HGH written by Ron Klatz is an excellent read-
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i think its more the type of compound, the amounts, dietary considerations and lifestyle pursuits in general that lead to the aging rather than the 'steroids' themselves.
Coming from the late 40's "bro" with no kids, old leathery orange skin and totally obsessed with his appearance to the point of not pulling out of the garage unless a copious amount of illegal short esters are freely flowing in his bloodstream.
Your 50's, which are just around the corner, will be a miserable time... hope it was all worth it, unlikely as you seem sooooo fucking bitter toward happy folks and just a miserable human being...
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Coming from the late 40's "bro" with no kids, old leathery orange skin and totally obsessed with his appearance to the point of not pulling out of the garage unless a copious amount of illegal short esters are freely flowing in his bloodstream.
Your 50's, which are just around the corner, will be a miserable time... hope it was all worth it, unlikely as you seem sooooo fucking bitter toward happy folks and just a miserable human being...
actually his 50's will be good times
he's used to being alone and will not seek truelove
just keep pumping weights and whores
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actually his 50's will be good times
he's used to being alone and will not seek truelove
just keep pumping weights and whores
I'm sure he is.. and he won't "stand out" either...
Like Sammy said...
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I'm sure he is.. and he won't "stand out" either...
Like Sammy said...
uhm what are you trying to say?
hookers dont mind you're old ugly and bald
just give them coins
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uhm what are you trying to say?
hookers dont mind you're old ugly and bald
just give them coins
That worked out pretty good for you. I'm sure your life is fulfilled with happiness.
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That worked out pretty good for you. I'm sure your life is fulfilled with happiness.
NO YOU ARE WRONG SO WRONG
you see my life was perfect when i was patronizing hookers and i was single
it all turned to shit when i got a girlfriend (but the raw pussy was so nice tho so so nice aw man)
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NO YOU ARE WRONG SO WRONG
you see my life was perfect when i was patronizing hookers and i was single
it all turned to shit when i got a girlfriend (but the raw pussy was so nice tho so so nice aw man)
You're trolling too hard... funny... but also sad...
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Anyone who says different is trying to justify their drug abuse.
chinese toys kill children.
chinese food kills dogs.
Somehow chinese drugs are good for you?
???
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Yeah, Jay always did look youthful. Plus he never lost his hair.
yes and he tanned alot in tanning beds.... very few wrinkles
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Alex the Russian kid has not been affected yet.
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On paper, this might not be a scientifically proven fact, but it does seem to be somewhat valid.
I remember years ago, Mike Quinn said that steroids caused him to age prematurely.
I've recently seen 3 heavy roid users that simply looked old and weathered. Greying, Balding. Heavy wrinkles. Their body fat seemed to be higher. They didn't look happy either. They looked worn out. Their youth has left them.
Na no they don't
You can run 1350 mg EQ with 1400 mg tren ace with a gram of test and the hgh will keep you in check and the slin will keep your blood sugar ok in synergy w the hgh which obviously works in symmetry with first and foremost testttttt
Ya tren ace gives you the boxer face
And EQ gives you leathery skin
Here's the deal tho: if you're born with good hair genetics no AAS takes ur hair away
I've ran 4 gram weekly cycles and I have man dime hair literally Elvis Presley level shit goin on
And the skin issues and exaggerated angles in face given by EQ and tren ace,
Respectively (or the acne and bloat and redness high test w no hgh can give) all go away if you are smart and pull a Phil Heath squared though
Meaning you cruise a good
Solid 6 months of the year on low test hrt doses and live healthy ish and if you can afford even 2 iu of true GH amazing for your skin
But it's bullshit that steroids age U
Look at Arnold at 32 look at Heath at 32 they look 30
. The abusets like Ruhl and Kai look awful . They didn't do it right