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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: NarcissisticDeity on August 30, 2015, 06:02:03 AM
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Lee's turn to shit on Phil Heath LMAO ;D Phil taking a beating from the Pros
The guys Lee thinks are better than Phil Heath , Kevin Levrone , Chris Cormier , Flex Wheeler , ;D
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Correct again, i love Priest! ;D Dillett circa 1993-1994, in another galaxy compared to Phildo physique wise, goes without saying... But he wouldn't beat him in a contest, Dillett didn't give a fuck about kissing the right asses and posing... But yeah, all of them from the 90s are better than The Shrimp...
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Apples and oranges, or in this case: bloofy insulin bloat compared to Godzilla genetics.
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Apples and oranges, or in this case: bloofy insulin bloat compared to Godzilla genetics.
Oh yes, i would add "bloofy insulin bloat of a little girl-like structure"...
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:o
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::) ::) ::)
(http://api.ning.com/files/oQPIqV17Snv52RlHo0z-1Uq62PIqzVA4XYe*6MJ*i33AQxvyDgy93eYCnV563C16y6WU9wgDNCmG8EGPA0DIDieAUmCR6x85/pdillet2xk5.jpg?width=550&height=413)(http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/attachments/professional-muscle-forum/62725d1369933123-big-ramy-takes-ny-pro-phil-back.jpg)
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::) ::) ::)
Phil wins A pose :D congrats
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(http://s23.postimg.org/bm6jhxxnv/Screen_Shot_2015_08_30_at_12_14_12_PM.png)(http://s14.postimg.org/pya7tnk0h/Screen_Shot_2015_08_30_at_12_14_55_PM.png)
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Lee's turn to shit on Phil Heath LMAO ;D Phil taking a beating from the Pros
The guys Lee thinks are better than Phil Heath , Kevin Levrone , Chris Cormier , Flex Wheeler , ;D
Maybe Levrone and early Wheeler. By 1998, Wheeler no longer looked perfect. Definitely not Cormier.
All of this is sort of moot, though. Dillett was a pro-bodybuilder , as was Priest and neither carved out a legacy like Phil has ::)
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Phil wins A pose :D congrats
::) ::) ::)
(https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRR6ZZWptGsjmKG3CAG2pOw9-9mMsFRHhAO4ylv3M9_o4cCURsJ)(http://musclemecca.com/imported-images/2012/03/546603_327039477360066_181157761948239_9-1.jpg)
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Che trolling and always taking the opposite opinion of everyone else.
What's new? :D :D :D :D
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Maybe Levrone and early Wheeler. By 1998, Wheeler no longer looked perfect. Definitely not Cormier.
All of this is sort of moot, though. Dillett was a pro-bodybuilder , as was Priest and neither carved out a legacy like Phil has ::)
A legacy of being the best in a mediocre field? Phil would have been left for dead in the 90s He's the best of his generation , not his fault his competition isn't spectacular. But this only shows how the sport's digressed instead of progressed.
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taking the opposite opinion of everyone else.
What's new? :D :D :D :D
::) ::)
How many Olympias did Paul win ?
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::) ::)
How many Olympias did Paul win ?
How many did Flex win? How many did Levrone win? How many did Shawn Ray win? But Phil has a Sandow doesn't mean he's better , how many Olympias would Phil have if he competed in the 1990s? The same as them , none.
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, none.
How do you know?
(http://beastmotivation.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/1384147_601822343189727_822176618_n1.jpg)
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;D
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How do you know?
Because they level of competition was much higher
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::) ::)
How many Olympias did Paul win ?
Depends if youre looking at it in absolute or relative terms.
From an absolute perspective, yes, Phil is better than Dillet, if you go by Olympia wins.
But from a relative perspective, taking into consideration, era, drug use today compared to back then, etc, its not so "cut and dry."
Either way, youre still trolling by taking the opposite opinion of what everyone else thinks. You do it in practically every thread. :D :D :D I am onto you, Che!! ;) :D :D ;D ;D
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Because they level of competition was much higher
How do you know ?
(http://www.bodybuilding.com/contest_media/18292/110/d/img_94011316241641.jpg)(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/125/images/Kevin_Levrone_photo136.jpg)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=442010.0;attach=485714;image)(http://musclemecca.com/imported-images/2013/04/vlcsnap00015-1.jpg)
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How do you know ?
I see what you did there lol How do I know? Easy I have two eyes Look Ma NO gut
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Depends if youre looking at it in absolute or relative terms.
From an absolute perspective, yes, Phil is better than Dillet, if you go by Olympia wins.
But from a relative perspective, taking into consideration, era, drug use today compared to back then, etc, its not so "cut and dry."
Either way, youre still trolling by taking the opposite opinion of what everyone else thinks. You do it in practically every thread. :D :D :D I am onto you, Che!! ;) :D :D ;D ;D
::)
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I see what you did there lol How do I know? Easy I have two eyes Look Ma NO gut
Great comparison ::)
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::)
epic come back :D :D
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epic come back :D :D
::)
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Because they level of competition was much higher
It really wasn't, though. There were some guys who had some great years, but they all had flaws. Cormier was was beaten by Cutler. Dorian looked awful. Ronnie looked pregnant at most of his olympias and only had four abs. Levrone is the only one who looked great for the entirety of his career.
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It really wasn't, though. There were some guys who had some great years, but they all had flaws. Cormier was was beaten by Cutler. Dorian looked awful. Ronnie looked pregnant at most of his olympias and only had four abs. Levrone is the only one who looked great for the entirety of his career.
All things considered , in the 80s and 90s there was a deeper field of competition and a lot more guys came in SHAPE , now you're lucky if 3-4 guys are in " shape " and the in " shape " today pales in comparison to the conditions guys were in back then
These guys are amateurs and they're all in better shape than todays pros
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Sorry Phil 275lbs with a waist smaller than 205lb Shawn Ray
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phil is just all bis and tris nothing else..
paul was a giant he had that freak factor.. he also had bigger legs than philsulin
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All things considered , in the 80s and 90s there was a deeper field of competition and a lot more guys came in SHAPE , now you're lucky if 3-4 guys are in " shape " and the in " shape " today pales in comparison to the conditions guys were in back then
These guys are amateurs and they're all in better shape than todays pros
Look at that picture. Newman, Francois and Long each competed for what, 3 years?! That's exactly what I'm saying. I just looked up Francois's competitive history and he placed first in a string of contests. He beat Flex at the '95 ASC, but the best Francois doesn't beat the best Heath.
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LOL, good job comparing an awful back shot of Dillett in 2006 when he was old and 20% of what he was, for sure on much less stuff, with Heath at his absolute best under better lighting... Everyone knows that Dillett couldn't pose from his back, worse than front and side, but still let's see some pics from his 1993-1994 shows compared to The Shrimp... Not that it would matter anyway, it's standing togheter where it would be really funny, 6'1 superfreak wide as a house against 5'9 narrow puffy girl who's dwarfed by average joes... Phildo could only dream of having that silhouette from the ASC 1993...
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It really wasn't, though. There were some guys who had some great years, but they all had flaws. Cormier was was beaten by Cutler. Dorian looked awful. Ronnie looked pregnant at most of his olympias and only had four abs. Levrone is the only one who looked great for the entirety of his career.
What? Many tend to believe Cutler was gifted his wins over Cormier. Cormier had the more complete physique, and better back detail. Cutler is famous for having less detail, a wrinkly lower back, and aesthetically unpleasing.
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Look at that picture. Newman, Francois and Long each competed for what, 3 years?! That's exactly what I'm saying. I just looked up Francois's competitive history and he placed first in a string of contests. He beat Flex at the '95 ASC, but the best Francois doesn't beat the best Heath.
LMAO Francois would MURDER Heath NO contest. He has EVERYTHING Heath does and NO gut and eons better conditioning
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LMAO Francois would MURDER Heath NO contest. He has EVERYTHING Heath does and NO gut and eons better conditioning
Francois-flat biceps, wide waist, weak upper chest. Phil wins that back shot.
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LMAO Francois would MURDER Heath NO contest. He has EVERYTHING Heath does and NO gut and eons better conditioning
Haha ,Phil is destroying Francois in that comparison ,thanks ND
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What? Many tend to believe Cutler was gifted his wins over Cormier. Cormier had the more complete physique, and better back detail. Cutler is famous for having less detail, a wrinkly lower back, and aesthetically unpleasing.
I don't disagree, but my point with that comparison was that Cormier wasn't guaranteed to beat Cutler and Heath's physique is better than Cutler's. Ridiculous to say Heath would have been lost among 90s competition.
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Francois-flat biceps, wide waist, weak upper chest. Phil wins that back shot.
You just exposed what you know ::) wide waist LMAO weak upper chest flat biceps? ::) You're dead wrong on every single point
Everyone one of your points debunked in 4 pictures. You're just trolling now
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:)
" Wide waist "
" Weak Upper chest "
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Yeah, everyone was better than Phil :o
(http://muscletime.com/index.php?view=image&format=raw&type=img&id=37068&option=com_joomgallery&Itemid=202)(http://npcnewsonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/500100.jpg)
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Yeah, everyone was better than Phil :o
Stand the two side-by-side and you see Phil what he is , a narrow insulin glazed donut
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Stand the two side-by-side and you see Phil what he is , a narrow insulin glazed donut
Thanks again ND .
Phil destroying Francois in that comparison, BTW the only pics that matter are the ones on stage doing the same pose, not gym pics , shadows .....................etc
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Thanks again ND .
Phil destroying Francois in that comparison, BTW the only pics that matter are the ones on stage doing the same pose, not gym pics , shadows .....................etc
On Stage? Gotta it ;)
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:)
" Wide waist "
" Weak Upper chest "
Um, yeah. ::)
(http://www.ambal.ru/12683394161.jpg)
(http://www.bodybuilding-pics.com/139/images/Mike_Francois_52.jpg)
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4042/4535085278_41332806fb_z.jpg)
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On Stage? Gotta it ;)
Side vs back ::) I win ,thanks for playing ND
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what did phil do or say to cause his peers to criticize him so much? Good grief.
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Um, yeah. ::)
I gave your opinion and honest shot , but you're either a troll or just blind either way you're wrong.
I'm still laughing at weak chest , wide waist and flat biceps :D
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Not one pic of Francois posted on this page shows a better physique than Heath. He definitely doesn't murder him. And, yeah, wide waist , flat biceps. ::)
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I gave your opinion and honest shot , but you're either a troll or just blind either way you're wrong.
I'm still laughing at weak chest , wide waist and flat biceps :D
This is really just you posting pics of Mike Francois now. Seriously, none of this pics "murder" Phil Heath.
If you photoshopped Phil's head on these pics and posted them, people would be wondering what happened.
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Side vs back ::) I win ,thanks for playing ND
You win already ::) biggest gut try and find a Francois gut pic , I'll be waiting ;)
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This could never be matched by Philsulin .
WooSHHHH
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This could never be matched by Philsulin .
WooSHHHH
One of the all time great bodybuilding shots
... but the thing is, it couldn't be matched by the any of the guys who were regularly beating him in the 90s, either. When comparing eras, people always filter out inconvenient reality and just leave in choice bits of nostalgia. Phil couldn't be competitive with the 90s guys because they all looked like they did in their best pics for 15 years straight. ::)
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Phil leans so fucking far back into his BDB it has hard to make an accurate comparison. Francois definitely kills him on the RLS though. Brutalized.
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Francois was considered a 2nd tier pro back in the day. Don't forget that.
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Stepping ahead of the line wouldn't cut it against Freakenstein. Phil Cheath would have to straddle the head judge to appear half as wide Paul Dillet doing a side chest backstage.
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Francois was considered a 2nd tier pro back in the day. Don't forget that.
Francois won his first 4 contests after going pro: Chicago Pro, Night of Champions, Arnold Classic and San Jose Pro. Flex Wheeler came in 2nd to him at the Arnold Classic.
He looked great, but none of the pictures posted in this thread destroy Heath. Most are not as good as Heath. And he only competed for 3 years.
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Everyone is forgetting the one simple fact that the amount of drugs Phil is on when compared to Francois in the early 90's is HUGELY different.
Yet, despite all the drugs in today's times, the pros of today still do not wipe the floor with guys from the 90's.
Just look at Francois and Heath. Francois pretty much holds his own, yet, is not using a lot of the stuff Phil does.
What does that say about today vs. pros back in the day? :-\ :-\
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Everyone is forgetting the one simple fact that the amount of drugs Phil is on when compared to Francois in the early 90's is HUGELY different.
Yet, despite all the drugs in today's times, the pros of today still do not wipe the floor with guys from the 90's.
Just look at Francois and Heath. Francois pretty much holds his own, yet, is not using a lot of the stuff Phil does.
What does that say about today vs. pros back in the day? :-\ :-\
"Hard work doesn't beat talent when talent works hard" - Phelicia Heath ;D
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Everyone is forgetting the one simple fact that the amount of drugs Phil is on when compared to Francois in the early 90's is HUGELY different.
Yet, despite all the drugs in today's times, the pros of today still do not wipe the floor with guys from the 90's.
Just look at Francois and Heath. Francois pretty much holds his own, yet, is not using a lot of the stuff Phil does.
What does that say about today vs. pros back in the day? :-\ :-\
Francois retired due to failing health after 3 years of competing. Do you really think his responsible drug use had nothing to do with it?
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Francois retired due to failing health after 3 years of competing. Do you really think his responsible drug use had nothing to do with it?
Again, its just one example. You have to look at the OVERALL picture. Guys in the 90's, on AVERAGE, used less drugs and looked just as good, if not better than the guys today. Its not even debatable. More complicated drugs and more drugs in general are available today. Science has advanced tremendously in the last 20-30 years
You can't point to individual cases to back up your assertions. Thats like saying, John Doe smoked 3 packs of cigs a day, thus its okay to smoke. ::) ::)
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"Hard work doesn't beat talent when talent works hard" - Phelicia Heath ;D
lolz. Too bad it doesn't apply to him. :D :D
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Again, its just one example. You have to look at the OVERALL picture. Guys in the 90's, on AVERAGE, used less drugs and looked just as good, if not better than the guys today. Its not even debatable. More complicated drugs and more drugs in general are available today. Science has advanced tremendously in the last 20-30 years
You can't point to individual cases to back up your assertions. Thats like saying, John Doe smoked 3 packs of cigs a day, thus its okay to smoke. ::) ::)
In the picture posted that started this discussion ALL of the guys that went pro retired after about 3 years because of failing health: Don Long, Dennis Newman and Mike Francois. See a trend, here?
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=579072.0;attach=645475;image)
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In the picture posted that started this discussion ALL of the guys that went pro retired after about 3 years because of failing health: Don Long, Dennis Newman and Mike Francois. See a trend, here?
It doesn't matter.
The drugs today are more powerful and more advanced. Thus, guys today have a better advantage of getting big and looking better compared to the guys in the early 90's. And even with advanced technology, advanced supplementation, and advanced drugs, advanced scientific knowledge and understanding of nutrition, they still don't look as good or better than the guys in the early 90's.
See a trend, here?
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It doesn't matter.
The drugs today are more powerful and more advanced. Thus, guys today have a better advantage of getting big and looking better compared to the guys in the early 90's. And even with advanced technology, advanced supplementation, and advanced drugs, advanced scientific knowledge and understanding of nutrition, they still don't look as good or better than the guys in the early 90's.
See a trend, here?
Guys today have a better advantage even though you say they look worse. And guys in the past used way less drugs even though health problems were way more common.
Yes, I do see a trend. ::)
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Guys today have a better advantage even though you say they look worse. And guys in the past used way less drugs even though health problems were way more common.
Yes, I do see a trend. ::)
That's the issue: Despite having a more advantage, guys today, on AVERAGE looks worse than the guys in the 90's. I mean, all you have to do is look at the constant bloated guts of today.
And its hard to say health problems were way worse back then. We will see what happens when Phil, Big Ramy, and Kai retire. Since I am talking about the current crop of pros within the last 5-10 years, many are still competing. Lets see how they hold up as they continue down the line.
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Dillett was his boy...I believe these two used to be Room mates
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Paul wins all day no contest
Levine flex Paul Nasser Cormier better than Phil by far
All the alone gym shots of Phil means nada....
Worst Mr o after Dickerson physique wise
Throw his shitty feminine emotional attitude in there
Worst Mr o period (pun intended)
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That's the issue: Despite having a more advantage, guys today, on AVERAGE looks worse than the guys in the 90's. I mean, all you have to do is look at the constant bloated guts of today.
And its hard to say health problems were way worse back then. We will see what happens when Phil, Big Ramy, and Kai retire. Since I am talking about the current crop of pros within the last 5-10 years, many are still competing. Lets see how they hold up as they continue down the line.
No, the point is that the guys in the 90s were obviously using a ton of drugs. If you want to make the argument that the drugs now are more powerful, that's one thing, but even then, the size of the guys from that time is comparable to the size of the majority of today's pros and Phil usually grows into a show. So, at best, drug disparity is a moot point. Phil has a better physique than Francois.
Phil's pro career has already exceeded the length of the careers of the guys in that picture combined. He's already competed as a pro longer than Wheeler.
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LMAO Francois would MURDER Heath NO contest. He has EVERYTHING Heath does and NO gut and eons better conditioning
Agree Francois was very underatted
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It doesn't matter.
The drugs today are more powerful and more advanced. Thus, guys today have a better advantage of getting big and looking better compared to the guys in the early 90's. And even with advanced technology, advanced supplementation, and advanced drugs, advanced scientific knowledge and understanding of nutrition, they still don't look as good or better than the guys in the early 90's.
See a trend, here?
Are they fuck...
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No, the point is that the guys in the 90s were obviously using a ton of drugs. If you want to make the argument that the drugs now are more powerful, that's one thing, but even then, the size of the guys from that time is comparable to the size of the majority of today's pros and Phil usually grows into a show. So, at best, drug disparity is a moot point. Phil has a better physique than Francois.
Phil's pro career has already exceeded the length of the careers of the guys in that picture combined. He's already competed as a pro longer than Wheeler.
Like him or not, PHil will have longevity as I'm sure he goes off cycle or just cruises, it's obvious and the smart thing to do. Takes the safe approach in the gym also.
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That's the issue: Despite having a more advantage, guys today, on AVERAGE looks worse than the guys in the 90's. I mean, all you have to do is look at the constant bloated guts of today.
And its hard to say health problems were way worse back then. We will see what happens when Phil, Big Ramy, and Kai retire. Since I am talking about the current crop of pros within the last 5-10 years, many are still competing. Lets see how they hold up as they continue down the line.
I think the people look far worse today and what's even worse is when they stop competing they will either shrink back to nothing or get fat and bloated. ??? I am especially interested to see what will happen to this current crop of insulin users health wise.
I think you're already seeing clues as people aren't able to compete as much as they did before and not look a mess. Also not sure how long careers are these days. Seems like a lot of the old guard is hanging on...so maybe there was more longevity back in the day.
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The drugs today are more powerful and more advanced. Thus, guys today have a better advantage of getting big and looking better compared to the guys in the early 90's.
Bullshit
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Paul Dillet had no back... you ain't shit as a profesional bb if half your body is missing, literally!
He had crazy shoulder width and looked unbeatable just standing there but question is if he got gift placings with that horrible symmetry/proportion.
Plus... Dillet was real bloofy too, look at his back and especially delts from behind, talk about marshmellow [sic].
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Lower back + glutes = Heath victory every time I'm afraid. That's pure judging criteria, not my opinion. Dillet was awesome, but got beat by Ray et al. Rubbish rear double bi means you can't be Mr O. Also Dillet was (xomparitively) soft and watery. And a whack poser. Utterly incredible genetics though, imagine Yates' brain in his body!
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Are they fuck...
K.
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Stand the two side-by-side and you see Phil what he is , a narrow insulin glazed donut
Kai owning phil in that back shot
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Everyone is forgetting the one simple fact that the amount of drugs Phil is on when compared to Francois in the early 90's is HUGELY different.
insulin and gh yes, anabolics and androgens no. They took huge amount back then to. Its a general misconception that people took much less roids back then but its not true
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In the picture posted that started this discussion ALL of the guys that went pro retired after about 3 years because of failing health: Don Long, Dennis Newman and Mike Francois. See a trend, here?
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=579072.0;attach=645475;image)
Yep. Add in momo and muntzer dying and flex having problems, a long with matarazzzo, and a handful of others from that era
Only difference between now and back then is the higher dosaging of gh and insulin
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It doesn't matter.
The drugs today are more powerful and more advanced.
WTF?
Please explain
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WTF?
Please explain
yeah please explain this, i would rather say that the drugs today are less potent then before cause now its 99% ug shit and not real pharmacy stuff
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insulin and gh yes, anabolics and androgens no. They took huge amount back then to. Its a general misconception that people took much less roids back then but its not true
That's what I meant. More stuff is available. .......insulin and gh.
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That's what I meant. More stuff is available. .......insulin and gh.
Serious question: if you look at today's guys and feel they look worse across the board than guys from the relatively recent past, but when you compare the two groups there seems to be less of a health epidemic,isn't it reasonable to hypothesize that the modern set of guys might be using LESS potent drugs? I mean, we know that it doesn't really come down to ALL of the current guys training like pussies while all of the old school guys trained balls to the wall. We have multiple examples of video evidence proving that's not the case. Isn't it possible that modern guys have backed off of that type of protocol because the risk/reward ratio is just too dicey, even for a bunch of professional beauty pageant contestants playing russian roulette for a plastic trophy?
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Serious question: if you look at today's guys and feel they look worse across the board than guys from the relatively recent past, but when you compare the two groups there seems to be less of a health epidemic,isn't it reasonable to hypothesize that the modern set of guys might be using LESS potent drugs? I mean, we know that it doesn't really come down to ALL of the current guys training like pussies while all of the old school guys trained balls to the wall. We have multiple examples of video evidence proving that's not the case. Isn't it possible that modern guys have backed off of that type of protocol because the risk/reward ratio is just too dicey, even for a bunch of professional beauty pageant contestants playing russian roulette for a plastic trophy?
The problems back then were mainly diuretics which could kill you fast , abuse of steroids would take years. I highly doubt guys today are taking less gear just less diuretics. Diuretics were for guys who were last minute and needed to drop water quickly .
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The problems back then were mainly diuretics which could kill you fast , abuse of steroids would take years. I highly doubt guys today are taking less gear just less diuretics. Diuretics were for guys who were last minute and needed to drop water quickly .
You've stated that 90s bodybuilders looked better than current, right? Do you think it's that they were simply genetically superior? Do you think that the top 80s and 90s guys would look pretty much the same if they were competing now?
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Dillett was an absolute freak, but had several glaring flaws, the most notable of course being his back. Phil is actually much better than people give him credit for. However, people generally have a dislike of his online persona, in addition to having a lack of respect for his training style and his perceived over reliance on drugs. Frankly speaking, I'm not sure I care for him much due to these factors either, but it's hard to deny his genetic aptitude and success thus far. The caliber of competition today is far below that of the 90's, but if Shawn Ray could place well back in the day, I suspect Phil at his best would place well also, even though he would not win.
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You've stated that 90s bodybuilders looked better than current, right? Do you think it's that they were simply genetically superior? Do you think that the top 80s and 90s guys would look pretty much the same if they were competing now?
Genetically superior? That's a good question. I don't think so per sa. I think guys today rely more on drugs than on training and I think the advent of machines have changed physiques as well. Obviously insulin combined with GH have reeked havoc and obscured definition , and density
I think guys with great genetics will probably go into more mainstream sports because let's face it bodybuilding doesn't pay worth the shit and it's to time intensive.
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Genetically superior? That's a good question. I don't think so per sa. I think guys today rely more on drugs than on training and I think the advent of machines have changed physiques as well. Obviously insulin combined with GH have reeked havoc and obscured definition , and density
I think guys with great genetics will probably go into more mainstream sports because let's face it bodybuilding doesn't pay worth the shit and it's to time intensive.
So, someone like Vince Taylor- I think he had one of the best physiques of the pre-millenium superstars. But he was renowned for training light, even in comparison to non-bodybuilders- doesn't he seem to exemplify all that is wrong with current bodybuilders. IMO, he looked as good as anyone competing at the time.
Are there any current bodybuilders that you think would have done well in previous eras? Genetics and conditioning, or even just genetics?