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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: dalkiel on March 06, 2006, 11:56:19 PM
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I've started using ephedrine with coffee as part of my cutting phase. I'm new to this so any advice will be appreciated. I've read somewhere that I should use 30mg of eph but I don't feel a thing unless i take 90mg (3tabs). I generally take them with coffee 45-1hr before my workout. I haven't experienced any great workouts while using eph so i wonder if I'm doing something wrong. My intensity level is about the same. I've read somewhere that eph ceases to be effective after 20 days or so since the body adapts to it.
Any suggestions/comments.
Thanks in advance
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I've started using ephedrine with coffee as part of my cutting phase. I'm new to this so any advice will be appreciated. I've read somewhere that I should use 30mg of eph but I don't feel a thing unless i take 90mg (3tabs). I generally take them with coffee 45-1hr before my workout. I haven't experienced any great workouts while using eph so i wonder if I'm doing something wrong. My intensity level is about the same. I've read somewhere that eph ceases to be effective after 20 days or so since the body adapts to it.
Any suggestions/comments.
Thanks in advance
Take 25 mgs of ephedrine with 200mgs of caffeine 3 x a day. I guess you can drink a cup of cofee since a cup has about 200mgs but I would go with the pills since the dosages will be more accurate.
Don't worry if you don't feel all wired of this amount cause It doesn't mean that its not working. I'm the same way, it doesn't jack me up either. And wrt to adaptation to ephedrine that only occurs with the stimulant effect not with the thermogenic effect......that only increases with time. I beleive you're thinking about clenbuterol.
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I find if I take the 25/200 EC combo as soon as I wake up on an empty stomach then shower by the time I'm ready for breakfast I have a mild buzz but it doesn't last long. When I take it again later in the day I feel nothing but that doesn't mean my body temp isn't higher.
I've been taking it for two months during the winter while I'm not able to walk or ride my bike to work. Lately I've been getting headaches every single day and I'm wondering if it's due to the EC? I'm sure there could be other causes but I have read ephedrine can cause headaches.
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I've been taking it for two months during the winter while I'm not able to walk or ride my bike to work. Lately I've been getting headaches every single day and I'm wondering if it's due to the EC? I'm sure there could be other causes but I have read ephedrine can cause headaches.
I've been taking it for about 6 weeks now and I only get headaches when I don't take it.
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And wrt to adaptation to ephedrine that only occurs with the stimulant effect not with the thermogenic effect......that only increases with time.
Exactly.
If you're looking to get the stimulant effect back from ephedrine, try adding 1-3 grams of L-Tyrosine to your EC stack.
A few months ago I began adding in 1.5 grams L-Tyrosine to my EC stack, and I'd say it works very well in bringing back the "kick".
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Exactly.
If you're looking to get the stimulant effect back from ephedrine, try adding 1-3 grams of L-Tyrosine to your EC stack.
A few months ago I began adding in 1.5 grams L-Tyrosine to my EC stack, and I'd say it works very well in bringing back the "kick".
Unfortunately, I never get that kick off the ec stack. Do you think if I add L-Tyrosine it can help me feel wired?
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Unfortunately, I never get that kick off the ec stack. Do you think if I add L-Tyrosine it can help me feel wired?
It should help, yes. I'm a long-time user of ephedrine, and I got to the point where it didn't do anything as far as being a stimulant. Adding in the L-Tyrosine has helped. I've seen other people report the same thing. You might also have to play around with the dose of the L-Tyrosine as well in order to reach the desired effect.
If I'm not mistaken, it has to do with the fact that using ephedrine lowers catecholamine levels (catecholamines being primarily ephinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine), and L-Tyrosine is a precursor to those particular neurotrasmitters.
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It should help, yes. I'm a long-time user of ephedrine, and I got to the point where it didn't do anything as far as being a stimulant. Adding in the L-Tyrosine has helped. I've seen other people report the same thing. You might also have to play around with the dose of the L-Tyrosine as well in order to reach the desired effect.
If I'm not mistaken, it has to do with the fact that using ephedrine lowers catecholamine levels (catecholamines being primarily ephinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine), and L-Tyrosine is a precursor to those particular neurotrasmitters.
Thanks for the info.
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It takes around 90mg of eph for me to get buzzed but that might be overkill. I've read that combining asprin with Eph and cofee is a potent tool for cutting fat. Thus far I haven't added asprin yet. One thing eph does is cause cramping when i do ab work.
Bor - I'll try the 30mg+200mg of coffee routine and see how it works. Presently I'm trying to lose the fat around my waist and love handles (who isn't). My X frame is ruined thanks to the extra cushion I've developed. Getting old is tough. Any other suggestions?
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It takes around 90mg of eph for me to get buzzed but that might be overkill. I've read that combining asprin with Eph and cofee is a potent tool for cutting fat. Thus far I haven't added asprin yet. One thing eph does is cause cramping when i do ab work.
Bor - I'll try the 30mg+200mg of coffee routine and see how it works. Presently I'm trying to lose the fat around my waist and love handles (who isn't). My X frame is ruined thanks to the extra cushion I've developed. Getting old is tough. Any other suggestions?
haven't added aspirin and you've experienced cramping? Hmmmmmmmmmmm :o ::)
I don't understand why the "anti-aspirin" theme around here ::)
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haven't added aspirin and you've experienced cramping? Hmmmmmmmmmmm :o ::)
I don't understand why the "anti-aspirin" theme around here ::)
Aspirin {salicyclic acid acetate} and it's naturally occurring methyl ester (methyl salicylate)-- found in the leaves of Gaultheria procumbrens and on the bark of Betula lenta-- have long been used as analgesics, anti-inflammatories, antipyretics and recently as anti-coagulants. The "A" portion of ECA, aspirin has been thought of potentiating the thermogenic and lipolytic properties of both ephedrine and caffeine. Recent research seems to contradict this however. At a study at The University of London's Department of Nutrition and Dietetics, 40 women (20 non-obese and 20 obese) were given either ephedrine and caffeine (30 mg and 100 mg) or ephedrine, caffeine and aspirin (30 mg, 100 mg, and 300 mg) post prandially (1050 kJ liquid meal). Using indirect calorimetry, observations were made in all groups every 30 minutes for 160 minutes. There was no significant differences between the groups that received aspirin and the groups that did not. We conclude that aspirin does not potentiate the acute thermic effect of ephedrine and caffeine.6
In another study conducted at King's College in London, it was demonstrated that aspirin does not potentiate the thermogenic response to ephedrine in lean women and only slightly so in obese women.7 The increase seen in this study represented a 1.2 kcal per hour increase in metabolism for lean women and a 2.4 kcal per hour increase in metabolism in obese women over use of ephedrine alone, which over an entire week, would represent less than one ounce of bodyweight. We feel that this is insignificant.7
Based on these two studies, we feel that aspirin and its analogs do not play a substantial role in inducing or increasing thermogenesis and/or lipolysis but they do have the potential to induce SAEs when consumed over long periods of time (e.g. ulceration of the stomach and increases in bleeding times). Therefore, we feel that aspirin and it's analogs should not be used in any thermogenic/lipolytic stack.
6) Horton TJ, Geissler CA. Post-prandial Thermogenesis with Ephedrine, Caffeine and Aspirin in Lean, Predisposed Obese and Non-obese women. Int J Obes Relat Metab Disorder, 1996 Feb;20(2):91-95.
7) Horton TJ, Geissler CA. Aspirin Potentiates the Effect of Ephedrine on the Thermogenic Response to a Meal in Obese but not Lean Women. Int J Obes, 1991 May;15(5):359-366.
Most of the arguements that people make for aspirin state that aspirin extends the thermogenic effects of ephedrine by inhibiting the enzyme cyclooxygenase and therefore decreasing prostaglandin synthesis (why aspirin is an anti-inflammatory). This helps combat one of ephedrine's effects. Ephedrine stimulates the release of norepinephrine, which stimulates the release of adenosine and the synthesis of prostaglandins by the activated tissue. Since aspirin inhibits the synthesis of prostaglandins (1), it is believed it enhances the effect of norepinephrine (the reason why caffeine is included in the stack to combat adenosine). By increasing the amount of norepinephrine one would expect to increase lipolysis. Caffeine achieves this, however in actual studies aspirin as yet to prove the same. One can only hypothesize on why aspirin's effect on prostaglandins does not effect lipolysis.
There have been no studies that I am aware of that show that an ECA stack is more effective than an EC stack. The only studies that have been proven to work are when an ECA stack has been done in a study against a placebo. Couple this information with the effects aspirin has on the stomach (nausea, heartburn, and sometimes bleeding ulcers) one could conclude that the most effective stack would be just Ephedrine and Caffeine.
1. Rawson ES, Clarkson PA. Ephedrine as an ergogenic aid. Performance-enhancing Substances in Sport and Exercise. Ed Bahrke MS, Yesalis CE. Human Kinetics. 2002.
Go ahead and use aspirin if you want but I'm not gonna risk it.
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Good post, Borracho. Aspirin is not needed.
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Go ahead and use aspirin if you want but I'm not gonna risk it.
I don't understand...what risk?! ??? When doctors are prescribing it for it's health benefits to the average joe, i'm not sure it's there is much of a risk ::)
Who cares about health anyways, it's all about looks...we're bodybuilders right :-X 8)
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Good post, Borracho. Aspirin is not needed.
Good post, Blake.
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I don't understand...what risk?! ??? When doctors are prescribing it for it's health benefits to the average joe, i'm not sure it's there is much of a risk ::)
I changed my mind. I'm gonna add 325 mgs of aspirin to my ec stack cause obviously its been proven to enhance the fat burning effect greatly.
::)
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Yes Borracho, I do believe you're catching on now. ::) Cause the ONLY reason why a doctor would ever prescribe anything is for fat loss ::)
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Hey dickface, what we're talking about here is use of the ec stack as a fat burner. I'm not against using aspirin occasionally and I'll even use it when I've got the odd headache. Chronic use on the other hand I would avoid. Even if they say it'll decrease chances of heart attacks, I'm sure theres better and healthier alternatives. But this is not what we're talking about anyways. And btw, I'm not gonna post links to potential dangers of continual aspirin use just for you. The info is out there if you care to inform yourself.
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I've started using ephedrine with coffee as part of my cutting phase. I'm new to this so any advice will be appreciated. I've read somewhere that I should use 30mg of eph but I don't feel a thing unless i take 90mg (3tabs). I generally take them with coffee 45-1hr before my workout. I haven't experienced any great workouts while using eph so i wonder if I'm doing something wrong. My intensity level is about the same. I've read somewhere that eph ceases to be effective after 20 days or so since the body adapts to it.
Any suggestions/comments.
Thanks in advance
Get your ephedrine and mix it Iodine crystals, and powdered striking pads from match boxes. Then, put in a little ater and heat it up for a day or two. After this is done, filter it and put some lye into the yellow liquid you obtained from the filtering, until the solution is strongly alkaline. Then, put more water into it and put a few drops of muriatic acid until the solution has neutral PH. After this is done, put in some toluene or ether and shake it up. Let the layers separate and extract the water layer. Evaporate the water and dry the crystals up. Rub it with some acetone until it's pale white. Trust me...what you have now is MUUUUUUUUUUCH better than ephedrine. What you now have is the stuff of dreams...four times more potent than the benzedrine pills your grandpa took in the 1950's. Enjoy. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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If I can get all those ingredients over the counter I'm seriuosly gonna cook some of this shit up.
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i always use meth to cut up for contets.. ;D
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If I can get all those ingredients over the counter I'm seriuosly gonna cook some of this shit up.
You...can. :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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i always use meth to cut up for contets.. ;D
And I always use meth to cut up my Ritalin, and to cut off my drunkeness ;D...so I can keep drinking. :D ;D ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Hi again
Bor - maybe you can help me out with this- anyone else? - suggestions/comments are welcome.
Should i be taking eph every day during the cutting phase? I'm currently swamped with work and am not able to get to the gym as much as I like to. I take creatine maybe twice a week-once a day along with coffee 30-1hr prior to a workout.
It's also not easy to get in a good meal after eph. After a workout I can get in a protein shake but have no appetite for a followup meal. Any suggestions
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Should i be taking eph every day during the cutting phase?
Yes.
I take creatine maybe twice a week-once a day along with coffee 30-1hr prior to a workout.
I don't use creatine myself but I'm pretty sure if you are you should be taking it everyday. I remember reading somewhere that creatine on a diet might affect fat loss.....though very minimally. If creatine helps you maintain intensity then forget I even mentioned that.
It's also not easy to get in a good meal after eph. After a workout I can get in a protein shake but have no appetite for a followup meal. Any suggestions
Whats the problem?
You're dieting and you're not hungry.................. .for now. Give it a few weeks and tell me you're still not hungry. Right now just focus on gradual fat loss by not starving yourself.
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but I don't feel a thing unless i take 90mg (3tabs).
good luck with your heart problem if you keep that up any amount of time. WAAAAAAY too much ephedrine....just because you donT feel it doesnt mean its not working. ::) 25 eph/ 200 caff/ and add some aspirin to thin the blood if you want.
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good luck with your heart problem if you keep that up any amount of time. WAAAAAAY too much ephedrine....just because you donT feel it doesnt mean its not working. ::) 25 eph/ 200 caff/ and add some aspirin to thin the blood if you want.
Uh oh, Borracho did you read this?! :o :o :o
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Go ahead and use aspirin if you want but I'm not gonna risk it.
hmmmm. iteresting read. thank bor....
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Bor- I should have typed epehedrine instead of creatine.I was concerned because the time I would really need to stack up on food (after a good workout) I'm not able to -apart from a protein shake.
Wes- Yeah- I figured I'm probably overdoing it - hence the questions I had/have.After 90mg I can feel my heart pumping and a slight buzz. More doesnt always equate better. I'm down to 30mg tab and a cup of coffee.
Thanks for all the advice guys.
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heres a couple products that cut out all the hassle of mixing and matching shit to get ur stack.
http://www.supplementdirect.com/?PHPSESSID=f3c8672e3c927d70d408dc07ad09de0b&content=2§ion=&search_type=store&field=lipodrene
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another newbie question - should eph be taken on an emptystomache or full? I try to get at least a snack 30-45 min prior to taking it
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if any of you are afraid to use asprin, or if you have stomach problems from asprin use, then switch to white willow bark. it's the natural herb form of asprin, but without the stomach problems such as ulcers.
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Get your ephedrine and mix it Iodine crystals, and powdered striking pads from match boxes. Then, put in a little ater and heat it up for a day or two. After this is done, filter it and put some lye into the yellow liquid you obtained from the filtering, until the solution is strongly alkaline. Then, put more water into it and put a few drops of muriatic acid until the solution has neutral PH. After this is done, put in some toluene or ether and shake it up. Let the layers separate and extract the water layer. Evaporate the water and dry the crystals up. Rub it with some acetone until it's pale white. Trust me...what you have now is MUUUUUUUUUUCH better than ephedrine. What you now have is the stuff of dreams...four times more potent than the benzedrine pills your grandpa took in the 1950's. Enjoy. ;)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Is this just basically meth, or at least something really close to it?
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yeah, i believe it is a recipe for crystal meth. Desoxyephedrine. Simply a reduction reaction, acutally. Whatch out for explosions though, that's the tricky part.
Peace
D
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this thread motivated me to take a aspirin along with my coffee and cigaret supply.i want to get ripped. men i switched from omega 3/6/9 to fishoil omega 3. Damn that shit is disgusting it makes me sick, the flawour in your mouth is unbearable. quick question, if you se ephedrine are you still a natural? is it wise to use ephedrine while you re on a antidepressant?
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should you use creatine while dieting?
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this thread motivated me to take a aspirin along with my coffee and cigaret supply.i want to get ripped. men i switched from omega 3/6/9 to fishoil omega 3. Damn that shit is disgusting it makes me sick, the flawour in your mouth is unbearable. quick question, if you se ephedrine are you still a natural? is it wise to use ephedrine while you re on a antidepressant?
get enteric coated fish oil.