Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: affeman on February 13, 2016, 09:50:57 AM
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Watched an Interview with an accomplished german amater BB these days who considers himself as a supplement "guru" for many years.
The guy claimed that Whey Protein is still the "gold standard" for all proten powders. The biggest BS scam product to steal money from clueless idiots nowadays is the trendy "Beef Protein".
If the powder sold in tubes was legit protein extracted from lean quality beef
a) one tube wouldn't cost 40 bucks but rather several 100s of dollars (not affordable for average Joe)
b) the protein would taste so bad that you'd puke after every single sip.
What's sold as "Beef Protein" in tubes is pure garbage, collagenic protein and slaughterhouse waste with no biological value what-so-ever.
Is that true? Has Kai lied to us? :'(
(http://cdn3.bigcommerce.com/s-hqsm9l/product_images/uploaded_images/musclemeds-carnivor-protein-kai-greene-ptsupps-pt-supplements.png?t=1422592895)
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Watched an Interview with an accomplished german amater BB these days who considers himself as a supplement "guru" for many years.
The guy claimed that Whey Protein is still the "gold standard" for all proten powders. The biggest BS scam product to steal money from clueless idiots nowadays is the trendy "Beef Protein".
If the powder sold in tubes was legit protein extracted from lean quality beef
a) one tube wouldn't cost 40 bucks but rather several 100s of dollars (not affordable for average Joe)
b) the protein would taste so bad that you'd puke after every single sip.
What's sold as "Beef Protein" in tubes is pure garbage, collagenic protein and slaughterhouse waste with no biological value what-so-ever.
Is that true? Has Kai lied to us? :'(
(http://cdn3.bigcommerce.com/s-hqsm9l/product_images/uploaded_images/musclemeds-carnivor-protein-kai-greene-ptsupps-pt-supplements.png?t=1422592895)
Yes, the vast majority of "beef protein" is nothing more than of the collagen kind (bones, skin, etc).
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Yes, the vast majority of "beef protein" is nothing more than of the collagen kind (bones, skin, etc).
Hahhahaa, this industry has no shame whatsoever, they even found a way to capitalize on slaughterhouse waste. Throw this in a blender and sell the powder for 40 bucks to completely clueless idiots as high quality "Beef Protein" :D
(http://www.occupyforanimals.net/uploads/7/7/3/5/7735203/__8003780.jpg)
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Any protein that makes outrageous claims from any source including pepto pro is blowing smoke up your ass.
I used 100% concentrate for years and years and did great even on just that. All the water retention claims are bullshit too, they just say that to push their stuff and people are dumb enough to listen.
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They are all collagen. Yes the biological value is zero, but only because there is close to zero tryptophan. But if you eat other sources of protein, like all do, collagen can be a good protein source, you get your tryptophan elsewhere. If you only ate collagen for protein you would die but that is just a hypothetical... there was one old study with a weight loss powder where some participants died because that was all they ate.
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They are all collagen. Yes the biological value is zero, but only because there is close to zero tryptophan, you get your tryptophan elsewhere. But if you eat other sources of protein, like all do, they can be a good protein source. If you only ate collagen for protein you would die but that is just a hypothetical... there was one old study with a weight loss powder where some participants died because that was all they ate.
???
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They are all collagen. Yes the biological value is zero, but only because there is close to zero tryptophan. But if you eat other sources of protein, like all do, collagen can be a good protein source, you get your tryptophan elsewhere. If you only ate collagen for protein you would die but that is just a hypothetical... there was one old study with a weight loss powder where some participants died because that was all they ate.
I ask supplement shop employees "Can muscle be built from collagen-protein?" when bored.
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???
Can't find the study right now but it was some super low calorie weight loss diet for morbodly obese people in the 70's where the sole source of protein was bovine collagen. Some died, and from memory it wsa thought one problem was that the protein wasn't "complete", as in lacking tryptophan which is an essential amino.
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Can't find the study right now but it was some super low calorie weight loss diet for morbodly obese people in the 70's where the sole source of protein was bovine collagen. Some died, and from memory it wsa thought one problem was that the protein wasn't "complete", as in lacking tryptophan which is an essential amino.
Was not sure if you were trolling but feel you're not now. Wow, they must have had some crushed family members as it's a pitiful way to die.
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Was not sure if you were trolling but feel you're not now. Wow, they must have had some crushed family members as it's a pitiful way to die.
yep i read about this too. lyle mcdonald mentions it in his ketogenic book, but im too lazy to look up the reference
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I ask supplement shop employees "Can muscle be built from collagen-protein?" when bored.
hope ur joking....thats a dick move man. they just working
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Just another way the fraudulent supplement industry reinvents itself. First it was all about milk protein, then it was all about egg protein being the perfect protein, then a return to cheap whey protein (cheese/milk), and now beef protein which as someone pointed out is made from the waste (bones, scraps, cartilage) that isn't good enough to make hot dogs or stuff sausages with.
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hope ur joking....thats a dick move man. they just working
I ask if they recommend a cartilage containing supplement. Expecting the employees of a supplement store to know something about diet, nutrition, and their products isn't unreasonable.
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I ask if they recommend a cartilage containing supplement. Expecting the employees of a supplement store to know something about diet, nutrition, and their products isn't unreasonable.
why dont you call out the manufacturer with a loaded question/condescending question, instead of the guy making 10 an hour to support his family/life? does it make you feel good doing that? your probably trolling me , and i got suckered.
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why dont you call out the manufacturer with a loaded question/condescending question, instead of the guy making 10 an hour to support his family/life? does it make you feel good doing that? your probably trolling me , and i got suckered.
Oh c'mon, the person working their should be able to answer basic questions on the stuff.
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why dont you call out the manufacturer with a loaded question/condescending question, instead of the guy making 10 an hour to support his family/life? does it make you feel good doing that? your probably trolling me , and i got suckered.
The manufacturer already knows it's bullshit.
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Oh c'mon, the person working their should be able to answer basic questions on the stuff.
true, but its a dick question and uneseccary especially since the customer (kaje) already knows the answer. hes just trolling an employee. the employee is just clocking in an out to make a living. just kind of reminds me of teenagers who prank a drive thru fastfood worker and throw drinks back in their face or some shit. damn im still being trolled here lol, i can sense it. no one in real life is could be that dickish to a stranger.
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true, but its a dick question and uneseccary especially since the customer (kaje) already knows the answer. hes just trolling an employee. the employee is just clocking in an out to make a living. just kind of reminds me of teenagers who prank a drive thru fastfood worker and throw drinks back in their face or some shit. damn im still being trolled here lol, i can sense it. no one in real life is could be that dickish to a stranger.
It's not trolling at all. It's making sure the person is not blowing smoke up his ass.
Your drive through example is funny, lol, but hold no value in this one man!
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My God Kai looks disgusting in that ad. Only in the twisted modern BB world can that be an effective advertisement.
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Don't ever open a supp store Mr Thong...
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true, but its a dick question and uneseccary especially since the customer (kaje) already knows the answer. hes just trolling an employee. the employee is just clocking in an out to make a living. just kind of reminds me of teenagers who prank a drive thru fastfood worker and throw drinks back in their face or some shit. damn im still being trolled here lol, i can sense it. no one in real life is could be that dickish to a stranger.
If you thought 2+2=5 and I said "2+2=4", am I a dick?
I'm simply correcting misinformation. Right or wrong: Employees in places like that are viewed as experts. They should be held to a standard of having some basic product knowledge.
People go in with specific needs, allergies, dietary restrictions, etc... and expect competent help.
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According to the ingredients list it consists of only about 66% protein.
That's really low.
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Holy fuck is that guy annoying. Is there such a thing as non-irritating YT fitness personality? I can only think of Jerry Ward, but his videos have started to suck lately...
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If you thought 2+2=5 and I said "2+2=4", am I a dick?
I'm simply correcting misinformation. Right or wrong: Employees in places like that are viewed as experts. They should be held to a standard of having some basic product knowledge.
People go in with specific needs, allergies, dietary restrictions, etc... and expect competent help.
Nah, they just a trolling with those concerns!
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Whey protein is the water runoff when cheese is made. It's no miracle either. Just stick to eating real food.
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Whey protein is the water runoff when cheese is made. It's no miracle either. Just stick to eating real food.
If eating real food 5-6 times a day is a possibility...
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According to the ingredients list it consists of only about 66% protein.
That's really low.
I used to get this guy who'd come in the store with a calculator to calculate the %'s thinking it was the end all be all way of telling which is the best.
if there's like 6 grams of carbs or more, it really lowers the % of protein, but does that really make it "no good?"
Those who think the higher % protein will save them from their physique troubles is the better deal are not really seeing the big picture of this...
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I used to get this guy who'd come in the store with a calculator to calculate the %'s thinking it was the end all be all way of telling which is the best.
if there's like 6 grams of carbs or more, it really lowers the % of protein, but does that really make it "no good?"
Those who think the higher % protein will save them from their physique troubles is the better deal are not really seeing the big picture of this...
Of course.
But 66% is really really low.
Apart from that I don't want to know what the rest consists of...
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Of course.
But 66% is really really low.
Apart from that I don't want to know what the rest consists of...
Dosen't casein have low protein % also?
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Dosen't casein have low protein % also?
What I mean, or let's say was trying to point out:
It is sold as protein.
So one might think it is high in protein content.
Other supplement companies put like 80-90+ % protein content (per serving) on the table.
Even those that also sell beef protein.
This one is just particular low at 66%.
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What I mean, or let's say was trying to point out:
It is sold as protein.
So one might think it is high in protein content.
Other supplement companies put like 80-90+ % protein content (per serving) on the table.
Even those that also sell beef protein.
This one is just particular low at 66%.
But did you check the label and the carb/fat content?
If you were to do the numbers with a weight gainer, the protein % would be real low, but does not mean the actual protein is low quality.... They add the carbs to make it taste much better but sadly some only see the protein % and think it's no good.
But hell, I hate Kai and hope this stuff is crap..
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But did you check the label and the carb/fat content?
If you were to do the numbers with a weight gainer, the protein % would be real low, but does not mean the actual protein is low quality.... They add the carbs to make it taste much better but sadly some only see the protein % and think it's no good.
But hell, I hate Kai and hope this stuff is crap..
Yes, I checked the ingredients.
Otherwise I couldn't come up with 66% (actually 63,2% they changed serving size) real protein content.
8g of carbs, no fat.
I wonder what's actually in there but I don't really want to know LOL.
I think it is crap.
But see for yourself:
(http://supplementreviews.com/images/product_reviews/large/a3c9a04e7719d4ae06694f44fa51e25c_1.jpg)
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So there's 4.8 gr of "we don't know"
But I don't know enough about this to comment any further, just know the stuff was on sale in the clearance section at on online store and I was not interested in this gimmicky shit at all.
And no way would I ever put a container of anything with Kai's face on it on my counter.
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The Real Scoop on Beef Protein Powders (http://content.tigerfitness.com/scoop-beef-protein-powders/)
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The Real Scoop on Beef Protein Powders (http://content.tigerfitness.com/scoop-beef-protein-powders/)
The author uses what he "thinks" to prove facts. On a forum, I can accept that,but something in a link needs to be stronger than what he says. Something along the line of "Beef protein manufacturers are likely just piling the unwanted parts of a cow onto some conveyor belt of gore"
How factual is that, really?
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Muscle meds claim they get the beef from cows in Sweden? Oh, man, some top notch humour right there. Anyone have proof of this?
And how stupid of them to say creatine and glutamine in protein powders reduces the quantity of protein.
Ok, by a MERE LITTLE bit as they only but a MERE LITTLE bit. Fuck man... Is anyone out there able to think for themselves, just a little these days?
Tiger Fitness huh? I'll remember that name...
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The author uses what he "thinks" to prove facts. On a forum, I can accept that,but something in a link needs to be stronger than what he says. Something along the line of "Beef protein manufacturers are likely just piling the unwanted parts of a cow onto some conveyor belt of gore"
How factual is that, really?
I liked the parts where he mentions it's not actual beef.
Knowing the supplement industry it should be clear they sell you overpriced crap hiding behind merketing bs and lies.
Of course there are a few exceptions.
If properly analyzed it will be no different from gelatin I guess.
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the irony of 'ritch' criticizing others' rational faculties... ::)
dude, you are a simpleton. the fact that you even bother scrutinizing supplements after decades of lifting attests to this...
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Muscle meds claim they get the beef from cows in Sweden? Oh, man, some top notch humour right there. Anyone have proof of this?
And how stupid of them to say creatine and glutamine in protein powders reduces the quantity of protein.
Ok, by a MERE LITTLE bit as they only but a MERE LITTLE bit. Fuck man... Is anyone out there able to think for themselves, just a little these days?
Tiger Fitness huh? I'll remember that name...
Yes, there is cows in Sweden, I have seen them with my own eyes while I was driving to Norway.. ;D
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yep i read about this too. lyle mcdonald mentions it in his ketogenic book, but im too lazy to look up the reference
^^
This is a good link... http://www.livestrong.com/article/499587-the-last-chance-diet/ (http://www.livestrong.com/article/499587-the-last-chance-diet/)
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I stopped using powders years ago when I realised I looked/performed the same without them. The only thing they're good for is convenience; even then you've got to clean out the shakers which never seem to smell normal again even after numerous washes.
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I'm in Sweden and awhile back a friend ordered a 25kg bag of Proliant Hydrobeef from the US which we split. Now I read on their site that it's made in Sweden. LOL, wtf :D
Anyway, the fact that collagen/gelatin is disgusting when you think about what it is and how it is made is no real argument against the "effectiveness" of the protein itself.
Just like the fact that whey is historically a waste product is no argument against the usefulness of whey.
Gelatin is a wonderful easily digested and light powder. Yes it's low in EAA's but it may be useful as a part of your diet nonetheless.
The marketing is deceitful for sure, it's not powdered steak as they make it sound like.
And powders ARE real food... what's fake about them?
If whey isn't food then I guess things like cheese/cottage cheese aren't either.
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^^
This is a good link... http://www.livestrong.com/article/499587-the-last-chance-diet/ (http://www.livestrong.com/article/499587-the-last-chance-diet/)
Yes. the big one with collagen based protein was Linn's Last Chance Diet - http://archives.chicagotribune.com/1984/06/28/page/412/article/very-low-calorie-diets-are-very-high-risk (http://archives.chicagotribune.com/1984/06/28/page/412/article/very-low-calorie-diets-are-very-high-risk) . Fun fact, Linn was both responsible for the wide scale success and later decline of Twinlab in the 70's. Their main product was the protein shake that was similar to what Linn used with his diet, and when the diet came under scrutiny, Twinlab lost tons of sales. A few years later, they'd jump full steam into the bodybuilding market though.
A fun little read on old diets can be found here - http://books.google.com/books?id=uFMRtml5sA4C&pg=PA85&lpg=PA85&dq=robert+linn+last+chance+diet+collagen&source=bl&ots=4WFa-Iqw13&sig=jpeXB1bRmkAgOyU5IPwoH4LqtOA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjZg7b99PbKAhVMWz4KHYM6AxAQ6AEIPTAE#v=onepage&q=robert%20linn%20last%20chance%20diet%20collagen&f=false .
Start on page 83.
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If eating real food 5-6 times a day is a possibility...
Eat when you're hungry, and you don't need huge amounts of protein.
Protein Powder is all bullshit built up over many years so it seems like gospel now to believe you need heaps of food or protein. I can't believe the supplement industry keeps going so well on complete bullshit but it's just one lie after another and people don't know what to believe since everyone's just out to sell their own version of shit.
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Eat when you're hungry, and you don't need huge amounts of protein.
Protein Powder is all bullshit built up over many years so it seems like gospel now to believe you need heaps of food or protein. I can't believe the supplement industry keeps going so well on complete bullshit but it's just one lie after another and people don't know what to believe since everyone's just out to sell their own version of shit.
Words straight out of the mouth of Lee Haney to me when I worked out in his gym in Atlanta years ago.
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Eat when you're hungry, and you don't need huge amounts of protein.
Protein Powder is all bullshit built up over many years so it seems like gospel now to believe you need heaps of food or protein. I can't believe the supplement industry keeps going so well on complete bullshit but it's just one lie after another and people don't know what to believe since everyone's just out to sell their own version of shit.
The 5-6 meals a day silliness isn't feasible to anyone with a job or a life. The supp industry knew this and had the answer: eat 3 meals a day and supplement with 3 expensive protein shakes.
That said, the industry deserves a bit of a pass, as it would be illegal for them to to sell the products that would really make a dramatic difference.
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Somewhere in the cobwebbed recesses of my mind I seem to recall reading that Steve Reeves used sheets of gelatin in some way..? Maybe in an article in MMI by Vince G (Gironda not the other one)
Also, in the late 80's/early 90's weren't there products containing 'bovine orchic extract'? As if eating bull balls had a magic effect on test levels :D (or at least that was the inference)
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Somewhere in the cobwebbed recesses of my mind I seem to recall reading that Steve Reeves used sheets of gelatin in some way..? Maybe in an article in MMI by Vince G (Ironi not the other one)
Also, in the late 80's/early 90's weren't there products containing 'bovine orchic extract'? As if eating bull balls had a magic effect on test levels :D (or at least that was the inference)
IIRC Reeves had some condition or illness which the gelatin helped.
Vince Gironda was big on the ball extracts. He was an idiot with a lot of the things he believed.
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Per TrueNutrition:
https://truenutrition.com/blog/beef-protein-isolate/
The Beef Protein Isolate is unlike any other protein powder on the market. Beef flesh is first boiled down in huge vats to produce a nutrient-enriched liquid containing incredibly high amounts of each of the essential and branched chain amino acids. This liquid form is then skimmed to have all fat and carbohydrate content removed, leaving a protein concentration of over 98% aminos left in the remaining material. From here, the liquid beef aminos undergo a spray-drying process in order to create the finished powder product.
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the irony of 'ritch' criticizing others' rational faculties... ::)
dude, you are a simpleton. the fact that you even bother scrutinizing supplements after decades of lifting attests to this...
Don't you have to go make yourself throw up so you don't look to fat you diseased sack of shit?
you contribute NOTHING here, no informative posts, nothing funny other than being a skinny ass loser.
Bye now.
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have to thank Phil Hernon and DC for starting this garbage a decade a go with LBA's
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have to thank Phil Hernon and DC for starting this garbage a decade a go with LBA's
In before "phil is one of the good guys" responses...
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"BEEF" protein is no joke..
THE BEEF
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They are all collagen. Yes the biological value is zero, but only because there is close to zero tryptophan. But if you eat other sources of protein, like all do, collagen can be a good protein source, you get your tryptophan elsewhere. If you only ate collagen for protein you would die but that is just a hypothetical... there was one old study with a weight loss powder where some participants died because that was all they ate.
This was back in the 70's. There was a liquid beef amino I believe that came to be a fad and some people used nothing but this thinking that was all that was needed. It wasn't the lack of tryptophan that killed them but the pure lack of calories and fat.
If I remember correctly they died from fatal heart arrhythmias.
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"BEEF" protein is no joke..
THE BEEF
You know what's weird - I know he was quite pugnacious, but I can't help wondering what happened to him - did he died? :'( Or just log off? ...
(where's Set It Up when you need him to trace obituaries... :P)
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"BEEF" protein is no joke..
THE BEEF
He had a funny gimmick with the whole "beef" thing.
Wonder what booty is doing today?
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This was back in the 70's. There was a liquid beef amino I believe that came to be a fad and some people used nothing but this thinking that was all that was needed. It wasn't the lack of tryptophan that killed them but the pure lack of calories and fat.
If I remember correctly they died from fatal heart arrhythmias.
I remember that stuff. It was the most vile disgusting stuff ever sold for bodybuilders. I think people died because they were using almost exclusively that junk to lose weight. It didn't taste like beef but it tasted like something you shouldn't be drinking. It came in bottles and it was liquid. You had it by the spoonful.
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I remember that stuff. It was the most vile disgusting stuff ever sold for bodybuilders. I think people died because they were using almost exclusively that junk to lose weight. It didn't taste like beef but it tasted like something you shouldn't be drinking. It came in bottles and it was liquid. You had it by the spoonful.
Thankfully never tried that|(!) Funny how the body just knows sometime. There was only one time I actually threw up from a supplement - it was called something like 'liquid liver' (nice - can anyone else from the UK remember who made it?)
As soon as I swallowed it I knew it was coming back out... :-X :P
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Don't you have to go make yourself throw up so you don't look to fat you diseased sack of shit?
you contribute NOTHING here, no informative posts, nothing funny other than being a skinny ass loser.
Bye now.
again the irony: you have the same disease
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I remember that stuff. It was the most vile disgusting stuff ever sold for bodybuilders. I think people died because they were using almost exclusively that junk to lose weight. It didn't taste like beef but it tasted like something you shouldn't be drinking. It came in bottles and it was liquid. You had it by the spoonful.
This stuff was red and I can still taste it. :( I thought I would get huge but once my mom found out people dieded she took what was left away from me. :'(
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WHey proteins are perfect for human consumption.
Mothers milk is 80/20 whey / casein IIRC :)
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That shit is so nasty. I've had a sample packet of Carnivor. Took one smell/sip and died.
THE BEEF
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You know what's weird - I know he was quite pugnacious, but I can't help wondering what happened to him - did he died? :'( Or just log off? ...
(where's Set It Up when you need him to trace obituaries... :P)
Vaguely recall it had something to do with the beef, THE BEEF had with chaos and wes(I think those were the two)...he was temp banned or just left?
I ain't for sure though..
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He had a funny gimmick with the whole "beef" thing.
Wonder what booty is doing today?
"THE BEEF's" use of THE BEEF and how he conversed in the third person was funny..as for booty-no idea.
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The Great Mike Matarazzo used to eat 25lbs of beef daily, and look what happened to him.
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Vaguely recall it had something to do with the beef, THE BEEF had with chaos and wes(I think those were the two)...he was temp banned or just left?
I ain't for sure though..
He tangled with coach the most? Ringing him at work and stuff. But once his real identity & pics came out he was never the same, and he'd talked about serious health problems... S'pose we'll never know... ???
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He tangled with coach the most? Ringing him at work and stuff. But once his real identity & pics came out he was never the same, and he'd talked about serious health problems... S'pose we'll never know... ???
I must have missed that part!
But calling people at work or shit like that is crossing the line.
THE BEEF!!!
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THE BEEF!!!
:D LONG LIVE THE BEEF!!!!
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:D LONG LIVE THE BEEF!!!!
You can ban him, but his spirit continues to live!!!
THE BEEF!