Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Palumboism on April 06, 2017, 01:03:34 PM
-
Will the Cadillac, Lincoln, Chrysler, and Buick brands still exist ten years from now?
-
Where Will Cadillac Be A Decade From Now?
By Timothy Cain on April 6, 2017
Cadillac is in a curious state.
Cadillac is making headway in China, a market which accounted for slightly more than half of Cadillac’s global volume in the first-quarter of 2017. But sales in Cadillac’s home market continue to slide. U.S. volume has fallen by a fifth over the last decade and has decreased in two of the last three years, falling to a four-year low in 2016.
Long gone are the days when Cadillac could sell new vehicles in America at the same rate as Mercedes-Benz, BMW, or Lexus. Indeed, Cadillac is well back of Audi now, as well. To put an exclamation point on Cadillac’s difficulties, little ol’ Infiniti — also historically reliant on the U.S. market and rather weak globally — outsold Cadillac by a margin of more than 40 percent in March.
How will Cadillac fare in the U.S. market in 2027? Or even in 2021?
Infiniti isn’t the only premium brand attempting to take over territory in the United States while Cadillac struggles. Acura, with its own difficulties, isn’t far behind Cadillac. Lincoln is trending in the opposite direction, up 9 percent so far this year. Jaguar-Land Rover is up 21 percent in 2017 and is quickly catching up to Cadillac in total volume.
Today, Cadillac isn’t the top-selling luxury brand in America. It doesn’t rank second or third or fourth, either. Indeed, Cadillac isn’t even inside the top five now.
Where will Cadillac be a decade from now, or even five years from now? Behind Genesis, Maserati, and Alfa Romeo, too?
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2017/04/qotd-will-cadillac-decade-now/#more-1546241 (http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2017/04/qotd-will-cadillac-decade-now/#more-1546241)
-
They'll still be here. I still see geo metros and oldsmobiles on the road.
Why do you ask, are their numbers down, or just to expensive?
-
Cars have been shit since the early 90s. Pretty much all cars. :-\
-
Cadillac's V-series cars seem to offer great track performance and luxury but overall Cadillac's prices still seem relatively high if they want to compete with the big players in the segment.
Buick oddly enough is selling most of its cars in China: in 2015 80% of Buick's sales were in China and only 18% in the US.
-
I like the good old Cadillac
-
Cars have been shit since the early 90s. Pretty much all cars. :-\
I love my Jeep Wrangler :)
-
They'll still be here. I still see geo metros and oldsmobiles on the road.
Why do you ask, are their numbers down, or just to expensive?
Yes, their numbers are down, but also I don't see these brands being relevant to anyone.
2016 Sales
Mercedes Benz
374,541
Lexus
331,228
BMW
313,174
Chrysler
231,972
Buick
229,631
Audi
210,213
Cadillac
170,006
Acura
161,360
Infinite
138,293
Lincoln
111,724
-
American cars bother me. They come out with sensational concept cars. Super cool, then the actual production version is a complete 180 from it. Not sure why they refuse to put out cars with nice lines.
I had a ford rental and the dash panel was not aligned with the door panel. Shit like this bothers me about American cars. Just laziness.
-
Cars have been shit since the early 90s. Pretty much all cars. :-\
Simple explanation for that: earth went flat around that time.
-
American cars bother me. They come out with sensational concept cars. Super cool, then the actual production version is a complete 180 from it. Not sure why they refuse to put out cars with nice lines.
I had a ford rental and the dash panel was not aligned with the door panel. Shit like this bothers me about American cars. Just laziness.
X2. We are destroying ourselves.
-
They'll still be here. I still see geo metros and oldsmobiles on the road.
Why do you ask, are their numbers down, or just to expensive?
Mercury
1938-2011
Plymouth
1928-2001
Oldsmobile
1897-2004
Pontiac
1926-2010
Saturn
1985-2010
Hummer
1992-2010
-
Cars have been shit since the early 90s. Pretty much all cars. :-
garage doors, as well... interestingly enough.
-
Yes, their numbers are down, but also I don't see these brands being relevant to anyone.
2016 Sales
Mercedes Benz
374,541
Lexus
331,228
BMW
313,174
Chrysler
231,972
Buick
229,631
Audi
210,213
Cadillac
170,006
Acura
161,360
Infinite
138,293
Lincoln
111,724
Cadillac and Lincoln are divisions of GM and Ford, so they're doing okay as stand alone brands compared to all of Chrysler, BMW, Audi....
However as said American based car companies ate destroying their self from within. You can't charge luxury price for below average quality. Once a brand is damaged it takes a tremendous amount of effort to turn it around, unfortunately I can't think of a company that has been able to successfully turn the ship around.
It will be interesting to see what the future holds.
-
Of course they do. Lincolns are basically ford models with a few upgrades. Caddys are nice and have a loyal fan base.
-
Lincoln will never be more than tarted up Ford at this rate.
Cadillac mechanically has shown real promise....ctsv is world class.
Problem lies in pricing structure. GM prices ATS, CTS, CT6 at parity with BMW / Lexus / MB etc...
Additionally there are roughly 4x the number of Cadillac dealerships in the US compared to German & Japanese luxury storefronts. This cheapens the brand and makes quality control nearly impossible for GM to oversee for premium dealership experience.....something they haven't historically done a good job at compared to their competition.
I am pulling for Cadillac, they have an uphill battle.
-
Lincoln will never be more than tarted up Ford at this rate.
Cadillac mechanically has shown real promise....ctsv is world class.
Problem lies in pricing structure. GM prices ATS, CTS, CT6 at parity with BMW / Lexus / MB etc...
Additionally there are roughly 4x the number of Cadillac dealerships in the US compared to German & Japanese luxury storefronts. This cheapens the brand and makes quality control nearly impossible for GM to oversee for premium dealership experience.....something they haven't historically done a good job at compared to their competition.
I am pulling for Cadillac, they have an uphill battle.
Caddys usually are cheaper then Euro because their Dealerships are always having sales
-
No cars have a future.
-
Lincoln will never be more than tarted up Ford at this rate.
Cadillac mechanically has shown real promise....ctsv is world class.
Problem lies in pricing structure. GM prices ATS, CTS, CT6 at parity with BMW / Lexus / MB etc...
Additionally there are roughly 4x the number of Cadillac dealerships in the US compared to German & Japanese luxury storefronts. This cheapens the brand and makes quality control nearly impossible for GM to oversee for premium dealership experience.....something they haven't historically done a good job at compared to their competition.
I am pulling for Cadillac, they have an uphill battle.
Of the four brands I think Cadillac's in the best shape and Chrysler's in the worst shape. Chrysler only has two models the 300 and the Pacifica mini van.
As you said, a Lincoln is just a tarted up Ford, but the same can be said of Buick and Chrysler. Buick's are just tarted up Chevrolet's and Chrysler's are just tarted up Dodges. Buick's so delusional they believe Lexus is their direct competitor.
My frustration is watching all these once great brands being driven into the ground. Nobody aspires to own a Lincoln, Buick, or Chrysler. At the same time, upstarts like Genesis are coming in and succeeding.
Before GM pulled the plug on Oldsmobile Bob Lutz described it as a damaged brand. All four of these brands are damaged and they've been trying to fix them for thirty years.
-
Case in point, the Buick Encore. This is the Cadillac Cimarron all over again. Does anybody look at this and think it's a luxury car. What it ends up doing is cheapening and damaging the brand.
(https://cnet4.cbsistatic.com/img/RCuOlkJdINljjoDMp5ZYb-3SKJA=/970x0/2017/01/04/3dbb8d84-d33f-4387-8b55-a5edd9150fab/2017-buick-encore-008.jpg)
-
Of the four brands I think Cadillac's in the best shape and Chrysler's in the worst shape. Chrysler only has two models the 300 and the Pacifica mini van.
As you said, a Lincoln is just a tarted up Ford, but the same can be said of Buick and Chrysler. Buick's are just tarted up Chevrolet's and Chrysler's are just tarted up Dodges. Buick's so delusional they believe Lexus is their direct competitor.
My frustration is watching all these once great brands being driven into the ground. Nobody aspires to own a Lincoln, Buick, or Chrysler. At the same time, upstarts like Genesis are coming in and succeeding.
Before GM pulled the plug on Oldsmobile Bob Lutz described it as a damaged brand. All four of these brands are damaged and they've been trying to fix them for thirty years.
And who damaged the brands? Americans did, those 60-70ish.
-
And who damaged the brands? Americans did, those 60-70ish.
Regulations did as well as a rising birth rate. I would have been happy if all cars still looked like 59 Cadillacs.
We could have whatever we wanted if people did not procreate and ruin the standard of everything. :D
-
And who damaged the brands? Americans did, those 60-70ish.
Are you calling Cadillac's, Buick's, Lincoln's, and Chrysler's old man cars.
Just because there are a few 80 year old's driving Cadillac's down in Florida does not make them old man cars. ;D
(http://davidsclassiccars.com/images/full/1994-cadillac-fleetwood-brougham-sedan-4-door-57l-1-owner-since-new-2.jpg)
That's what I'm talking about, the management at these companies have had thirty years to shake to old man image. They could have released cars that appeal to a younger demographic. Instead they released the Fleetwood Brougham and Buick Roadmaster.
-
Are you calling Cadillac's, Buick's, Lincoln's, and Chrysler's old man cars.
Just because there are a few 80 year old's driving Cadillac's down in Florida does not make them old man cars. ;D
(http://davidsclassiccars.com/images/full/1994-cadillac-fleetwood-brougham-sedan-4-door-57l-1-owner-since-new-2.jpg)
That's what I'm talking about, the management at these companies have had thirty years to shake to old man image. They could have released cars that appeal to a younger demographic. Instead they released the Fleetwood Brougham and Buick Roadmaster.
THAT Cadillac is better than any current cars pretty much.
Sorry, the "new" styling of cars sucks. With a few exceptions of course.
-
Are you calling Cadillac's, Buick's, Lincoln's, and Chrysler's old man cars.
Just because there are a few 80 year old's driving Cadillac's down in Florida does not make them old man cars. ;D
(http://davidsclassiccars.com/images/full/1994-cadillac-fleetwood-brougham-sedan-4-door-57l-1-owner-since-new-2.jpg)
That's what I'm talking about, the management at these companies have had thirty years to shake to old man image. They could have released cars that appeal to a younger demographic. Instead they released the Fleetwood Brougham and Buick Roadmaster.
blacks drive these and grandma
-
Are you calling Cadillac's, Buick's, Lincoln's, and Chrysler's old man cars.
Just because there are a few 80 year old's driving Cadillac's down in Florida does not make them old man cars. ;D
(http://davidsclassiccars.com/images/full/1994-cadillac-fleetwood-brougham-sedan-4-door-57l-1-owner-since-new-2.jpg)
That's what I'm talking about, the management at these companies have had thirty years to shake to old man image. They could have released cars that appeal to a younger demographic. Instead they released the Fleetwood Brougham and Buick Roadmaster.
"younger" demographics RUIN everything.
Have fun in your shitbox electric smart green energy self driving tendie-mobile.
-
Will the Cadillac, Lincoln, Chrysler, and Buick brands still exist ten years from now?
Chrysler maybe not, the rest: yes. China loves them
Odd: SUVs....but Cadillac only has two models.....how many GM managers have been asleep over the past years??
Tesla now is the number one premium high tech American brand. And this really pissed off all the old and often corrupt / criminal managers at FoMoCo and GM :-)
-
Case in point, the Buick Encore. This is the Cadillac Cimarron all over again. Does anybody look at this and think it's a luxury car. What it ends up doing is cheapening and damaging the brand.
(https://cnet4.cbsistatic.com/img/RCuOlkJdINljjoDMp5ZYb-3SKJA=/970x0/2017/01/04/3dbb8d84-d33f-4387-8b55-a5edd9150fab/2017-buick-encore-008.jpg)
Agree this vehicle is questionable at best. Reminds me a little bit of those late 90s GM minivans that looked like dust busters cross bred with a Pontiac Aztec.
-
I'll take cadi and Lincoln over BMW,Mercedes and Audi anyday.
-
Drove one just like this for a few years. It had a 460 V8 in it. When I put the pedal to the floor I swear I could actually see the gas gauge indicator moving toward E. These are very expensive to fix/maintain.
(http://www.classiccarstodayonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/1977-Lincoln-Mark-V-Bill-Blass-aaaaa.jpg)
-
Drove one just like this for a few years. It had a 460 V8 in it. When I put the pedal to the floor I swear I could actually see the gas gauge indicator moving toward E. These are very expensive to fix/maintain.
(http://www.classiccarstodayonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/1977-Lincoln-Mark-V-Bill-Blass-aaaaa.jpg)
In 4x4 aplications, these engines use half a gallon per minute, at WOT in the dunes.
-
In 4x4 aplications, these engines use half a gallon per minute, at WOT in the dunes.
:o
-
In 4x4 aplications, these engines use half a gallon per minute, at WOT in the dunes.
About 8-9 MPG. Gas tank was huge, probably 25-30 gallon capacity.
-
THAT Cadillac is better than any current cars pretty much.
Sorry, the "new" styling of cars sucks. With a few exceptions of course.
If the Fleetwood was still offered today, who would buy it?
-
Agree this vehicle is questionable at best. Reminds me a little bit of those late 90s GM minivans that looked like dust busters cross bred with a Pontiac Aztec.
This is Buick's best selling model and it's based on the Chevrolet Trax. :-\
(http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/5/2016/02/2017-Chevrolet-Trax-front-three-quarter-e1455217439405.jpg?interpolation=lanczos-none&fit=around%7C660%3A438)
-
The Pacifica is Chrysler's best selling model and accounts for over half it's sales. It doesn't exactly scream aspirational.
(http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/383/669/0/S3836690/slug/l/01-2017-chrysler-pacifica-fd-1.jpg)
-
Of course they do. Lincolns are basically ford models with a few upgrades. Caddys are nice and have a loyal fan base.
Alan Mulally, Ford's previous CEO, wanted to shut Lincoln down, but Mark Fields asked him not to because he could turn it around. Lincoln only sells 100,000 cars a year. That barely justifies developing one model let alone an entire brand.
-
If the Fleetwood was still offered today, who would buy it?
Me.
-
The Pacifica is Chrysler's best selling model and accounts for over half it's sales. It doesn't exactly scream aspirational.
(http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-global/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/750x422/quality/95/http://www.blogcdn.com/slideshows/images/slides/383/669/0/S3836690/slug/l/01-2017-chrysler-pacifica-fd-1.jpg)
The bigger misstep here was changing the name from Town & Country to Pacifica.
The Town & Country name had lots of brand equity with this customer base. The Pacifica on the other hand was a formerly unreliable and generic early 00s wagon/SUV that was sh#tcanned years ago. Many Chrysler dealers were not happy with the name change.
-
I'll take cadi and Lincoln over BMW,Mercedes and Audi anyday.
Hahaha! Spoken like a true guido.
And the answer to the OP's question is no.
-
Hahaha! Spoken like a true guido.
And the answer to the OP's question is no.
respect your elders gimmick
-
Are you calling Cadillac's, Buick's, Lincoln's, and Chrysler's old man cars.
Just because there are a few 80 year old's driving Cadillac's down in Florida does not make them old man cars. ;D
(http://davidsclassiccars.com/images/full/1994-cadillac-fleetwood-brougham-sedan-4-door-57l-1-owner-since-new-2.jpg)
That's what I'm talking about, the management at these companies have had thirty years to shake to old man image. They could have released cars that appeal to a younger demographic. Instead they released the Fleetwood Brougham and Buick Roadmaster.
Baby Boomers are the ones that wanted huge, under powered, boat like riding, non cars American luxury cars. These were the traditionalists.The yuppie Baby boomers went German, Italian, British, Swedish.
The Germans were fast, luxurious, reliable, boxy...
Also, the beancounters at American companies as well as management didn't ok innovative ideas, didn't take into account the Euros, but assume that Americans would buy what they gave them. So, they didn't change.
Next thing you know, the Euros (Germans) produce great handling luxury cars. And now, the Germans are the players when it comes to luxury, all because the Americans failed to adapt.
-
Alan Mulally, Ford's previous CEO, wanted to shut Lincoln down, but Mark Fields asked him not to because he could turn it around. Lincoln only sells 100,000 cars a year. That barely justifies developing one model let alone an entire brand.
New models could really increase Lincoln sales, look at the recent new Volvos for example
I think Porsche now makes over 200,000 cars per year, Tesla around 100,000 units
-
Baby Boomers are the ones that wanted huge, under powered, boat like riding, non cars American luxury cars. These were the traditionalists.The yuppie Baby boomers went German, Italian, British, Swedish.
The Germans were fast, luxurious, reliable, boxy...
Also, the beancounters at American companies as well as management didn't ok innovative ideas, didn't take into account the Euros, but assume that Americans would buy what they gave them. So, they didn't change.
Next thing you know, the Euros (Germans) produce great handling luxury cars. And now, the Germans are the players when it comes to luxury, all because the Americans failed to adapt.
Don't forget Lexus is number 2 in sales after Mercedes in the US, they are usually first or second every year for sales in America
-
New models could really increase Lincoln sales, look at the recent new Volvos for example
I think Porsche now makes over 200,000 cars per year, Tesla around 100,000 units
Only if Lincoln builds off a stand alone dedicated platform, preferably rear wheel drive and big V8 power with 4 doors and above average handling. It would act as a "halo" model that would lend credibility to Lincoln and over time would benefit Lincoln as a brand. The current line up of warmed over Fords is thinly veiled.
The new Continental being based off Ford Fusion platform does not have pedigree for improving the perception of the brand.
-
New models could really increase Lincoln sales, look at the recent new Volvos for example
I think Porsche now makes over 200,000 cars per year, Tesla around 100,000 units
Porsche was better when they handmade everything
-
Drove one just like this for a few years. It had a 460 V8 in it. When I put the pedal to the floor I swear I could actually see the gas gauge indicator moving toward E. These are very expensive to fix/maintain.
(http://www.classiccarstodayonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/1977-Lincoln-Mark-V-Bill-Blass-aaaaa.jpg)
:P
-
The Town & Country name had lots of brand equity with this customer base. The Pacifica on the other hand was a formerly unreliable and generic early 00s wagon/SUV that was sh#tcanned years ago. Many Chrysler dealers were not happy with the name change.
The crossover/SUV can save all four of these brands. The flagships of Cadillac and Lincoln are the Escalade and the Navigator.
XT5 and the Escalade are the two things Cadillac is doing right.
(https://cms.kelleybluebookimages.com/content/dam/kbb-editorial/make/cadillac/xt5/2017/02-2017-cadillac-xt5.jpg/jcr:content/renditions/cq5dam.web.1280.1280.jpeg)
-
Love nondescript jellybeans. ::)
-
2018 Buick Enclave
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_U4dveWOOzY/WO1qqXICIfI/AAAAAAASa1w/F6Sq5qo5mBQqj6d_F21yhXTpVBTXPPHYgCLcB/s1600/2018-Buick-Enclave-4555.jpg)
-
2018 Buick Enclave
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-aVAbOjF0hwM/WO1qkOuiEgI/AAAAAAASa1Q/izdj_0iYD949h_KvYM7sqdZDuZWn9-S0gCLcB/s1600/2018-Buick-Enclave-2.jpg)
2018 Lincoln Navigator
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-8iIYLd8BVtc/WO2oXrCl6yI/AAAAAAASbBU/HY_VvpkwgxwIKeTNR20DGmkWH3GtuEiEACLcB/s1600/2018-Lincopln-Navigator-12.jpg)
-
Keep the Jelly Beans coming!
(https://www.candylandstore.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Screen-Shot-2016-09-06-at-10.12.02-PM.png)
-
Keep the Jelly Beans coming!
(https://www.candylandstore.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Screen-Shot-2016-09-06-at-10.12.02-PM.png)
Post a modern car that isn't triangle, rounded, or boxy
-
Post a modern car that isn't triangle, rounded, or boxy
Thats my entire point. Modern cars suck! They are all Jellybeans with little to no styling variance.
Morgan makes some great cars in 2017 though!
2017 Morgan Aero 8
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS_3uGWhhEcRykIQ7HEGjsmbMo5VdqQc_qRKthquDU5DH8B94Pr)
2017 Morgan Plus 8
(http://cdn.carshowroom.com.au/media/21234124/2015-morgan-plus-8.jpg.ashx?w=760&h=428&scale=both&bgcolor=000000&mode=crop&format=jpg&quality=74&progressive=true&encoder=freeimage)
2017 Morgan Roadster
(http://www.mirocars.com/wp-content/uploads/2017-Morgan-Roadster.jpg)
Morgan Aero Coupe
(http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-shared/dims3/GLOB/legacy_thumbnail/800x450/format/jpg/quality/85/http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2013/06/xcar-morgan-aero-coupe-628.jpg)
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/7YM324CGOsE/maxresdefault.jpg)
(https://www.morgan-motor.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/bfi_thumb/AC-104-w19201-2yolhro9897me5onko2i2o.jpg)
-
8)
(https://ag-spots-2017.o.auroraobjects.eu/2017/03/12/morgan-aeromax-coupe-c635612032017172519_1.jpg)
-
Rumors are Ford wanna Bring back the Gran Torino and do what dodge did with the Challenger