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Why are gays fascinated with Mike Mentzer? is it the mustache? ???
Why are gays fascinated with Mike Mentzer? is it the mustache? ???
It's the 'stache, plus the stern manner. The gays, especially in the 70's were into the blue collar rough trade thing.
Still not in the top 100 gayest threads on Getbig. ;D
I’ll have to disagree with this. The circling and pointing to his cock is some high-level faggottry
Did Mentzer ever get any injuries with his training style?
Either way, he looked genuinely strong.
He was a trainwreck in the 90ies. Just watch his video on youtube where he trains the German gaylord "Markus". Even if his overall rough look was due to stimulant abuse it seemed that his back was done for from the weights.
Disclaimer:take your anti depressants before watching this video
I remember MM2k tried to help him out in the early 90's, and one of the funnier bones of contention was the reporting ( with pictures ) of his breakfast which was 1/2 dozen donuts, black coffee, and few cigarettes. Mentzer hated his public seeing him like that, and it got sour quickly.MM2K was a great magazine and I signed up for a 2 year subscription before issue #1 was released. Bill Phillips really spun the bullshit well and convinced me creatine, vanadyl sulphate and Metrx would turn me into a super human! Didn't happen of course but Duchaine's Ultimate Orange (the original) kicked ass! I almost had a psychotic episode the first time I took that shit.
MM2K was a great magazine and I signed up for a 2 year subscription before issue #1 was released. Bill Phillips really spun the bullshit well and convinced me creatine, vanadyl sulphate and Metrx would turn me into a super human! Didn't happen of course but Duchaine's Ultimate Orange (the original) kicked ass! I almost had a psychotic episode the first time I took that shit.
Didn't happen of course but Duchaine's Ultimate Orange (the original) kicked ass! I almost had a psychotic episode the first time I took that shit.
He was a trainwreck in the 90ies. Just watch his video on youtube where he trains the German gaylord "Markus". Even if his overall rough look was due to stimulant abuse it seemed that his back was done for from the weights.
Disclaimer:take your anti depressants before watching this video
Looking back this is the one natural/otc supplement I wish we could have back. I remember grumbling at the price, but once I tired it, there was nothing like it.Didn't the original have something illegal like meth in it?
[ Invalid YouTube link ]youre telling me no woman in two piece bikini wasnt available for a rock video in the 80s?
Didn't the original have something illegal like meth in it?
Mike's mistake was taking all that speed he took to "be productive". It fucked him up physically and mentally. That coupled with his loss to Arnold and his subsequent inability to get over, if not "around" that, destroyed him.
Arnold took his earlier loss to Zane and used it to his benefit. Same with his loss to Sergio. After the '80 Olympia Mike just went south and when he couldn't go any deeper, began to dig. He had every right to complain but instead he wound up bitching. And in the process, became one.
I still employ his H.I.T in my training. As for the OP's "topic"? FTN. ;D
Yeah, forgot about ephedrine. Remember the aspirin, caffeine and ephedrine stack?
Nail, Hammer machine, Head :)Bullshit! His training methods were and are shit. Not one shred of evidence that HIT is superior to any other style of training. Mentzer was entertaining but not nearly as smart as he or anyone else thought.
I knew Mike and I liked him. He was a smart man, even if he was given to doing very stupid things (e.g., starting smoking in the nuthouse because his friends and idols Casey, Art Jones and Ayn Rand were smokers). And for all of the shit his training methods receive, it's obvious a majority of his critics are too damned stupid to get beyond pathetic appeals to ridicule.
That said, Mike's ideas about training went seriously downhill in the last six or seven years of his life. He became convinced that overtraining was this boogeyman that would set in (no pun intended) the very *second* someone did the absolute minimum to "stimulate growth," thus requiring a week between minimalist workouts. His reasoning was severely flawed, and it is sad his methods are remembered for that instead of his earlier great ideas about training.
Nail, Hammer machine, Head :)
I knew Mike and I liked him. He was a smart man, even if he was given to doing very stupid things (e.g., starting smoking in the nuthouse because his friends and idols Casey, Art Jones and Ayn Rand were smokers). And for all of the shit his training methods receive, it's obvious a majority of his critics are too damned stupid to get beyond pathetic appeals to ridicule.
That said, Mike's ideas about training went seriously downhill in the last six or seven years of his life. He became convinced that overtraining was this boogeyman that would set in (no pun intended) the very *second* someone did the absolute minimum to "stimulate growth," thus requiring a week between minimalist workouts. His reasoning was severely flawed, and it is sad his methods are remembered for that instead of his earlier great ideas about training.
his routine he used from the 70's is great and very effectiveBetter than Zane, Arnold, Scott and Pearl's training programs?
his routine he used from the 70's is great and very effective
Bullshit! His training methods were and are shit. Not one shred of evidence that HIT is superior to any other style of training. Mentzer was entertaining but not nearly as smart as he or anyone else thought.
The positive thing about the Mentzer video is that the reps are done slow and controlled which really seems to stress the muscle.
In contrast I read that fast negatives do damage the fibers the most but it's kinda hard to gauge what to believe. Vince and his bicep-cyborg approach are trying to be scientific but I would like to see a huge number of people visiting him, training according to his principles and then presenting their progress... otherwise it's all theory that sounds great.
Mike's mistake was taking all that speed he took to "be productive". It fucked him up physically and mentally. That coupled with his loss to Arnold and his subsequent inability to get over, if not "around" that, destroyed him.
Arnold took his earlier loss to Zane and used it to his benefit. Same with his loss to Sergio. After the '80 Olympia Mike just went south and when he couldn't go any deeper, began to dig. He had every right to complain but instead he wound up bitching. And in the process, became one.
I still employ his H.I.T in my training. As for the OP's "topic"? FTN. ;D
mr scott i do h.i.t training as well.of course i make sure i am thoroughly warmed up , training all out without a warm up can get you hurt, i think this is the misconception alot of people get with one all out set.But he built most of his mass with volume as stated before. After he trained with Jones he seemed to go downhill fast. He used meth to cut and used a stupid 800 calorie a day diet with almost no sleep. He burned out only a few years after Heavy Duty and looked like shit the rest of his life. With his genetics he could have done benches and curls with light weights and looked great into old age.
mikes routines in the 70's i think were the best.
But he built most of his mass with volume as stated before. After he trained with Jones he seemed to go downhill fast. He used meth to cut and used a stupid 800 calorie a day diet with almost no sleep. He burned out only a few years after Heavy Duty and looked like shit the rest of his life. With his genetics he could have done benches and curls with light weights and looked great into old age.
I respectfully disagree that he built most of his mass with volume. He started quite young, working out with a pair of powerlifters his dad knew. Mike said they weren't volume training, but it certainly wasn't HIT either. They lifted in a garage three times a week, working toward big numbers on the basics. He said he could bench and squat 350 and 500 respectively when he was only 15.Volume and HIT can build a great physique but HIT guys get injured and burnout. Haney, Zane, Arnold, Scott, Pearl, Ray, etc, etc,etc all trained volume and never had any torn muscles or serious injuries. Why train balls to the wall (whether volume or HIT) and destroy your body like Platz, Mentzer, Coleman and Yates did? As Lee Haney said, "stimulate don't annihilate!"
After that, by 18 or so, he WAS doing high volume. He also said he was still progressing, but not as fast as when he powerlifted.
I agree he would have grown doing almost anything worthwhile. I also say volume doesn't suck (produced waaaaay too many good bodybuilders), and I concur that Mike was wrong about many things. My main objection to guys saying "Heavy Duty sucks" is mostly rooted in how one defines "Heavy Duty." Some strawmander it to silly extremes; e.g., one set to failure with no acclimation sets once every time the planet's align just so :). There were many routines he swore by that weren't that radical, especially after Dorian came along.
Volume and HIT can build a great physique but HIT guys get injured and burnout. Haney, Zane, Arnold, Scott, Pearl, Ray, etc, etc,etc all trained volume and never had any torn muscles or serious injuries. Why train balls to the wall (whether volume or HIT) and destroy your body like Platz, Mentzer, Coleman and Yates did? As Lee Haney said, "stimulate don't annihilate!"
I respectfully disagree that he built most of his mass with volume. He started quite young, working out with a pair of powerlifters his dad knew. Mike said they weren't volume training, but it certainly wasn't HIT either. They lifted in a garage three times a week, working toward big numbers on the basics. He said he could bench and squat 350 and 500 respectively when he was only 15.
After that, by 18 or so, he WAS doing high volume. He also said he was still progressing, but not as fast as when he powerlifted.
I agree he would have grown doing almost anything worthwhile. I also say volume doesn't suck (produced waaaaay too many good bodybuilders), and I concur that Mike was wrong about many things. My main objection to guys saying "Heavy Duty sucks" is mostly rooted in how one defines "Heavy Duty." Some strawmander it to silly extremes; e.g., one set to failure with no acclimation sets once every time the planet's align just so :). There were many routines he swore by that weren't that radical, especially after Dorian came along.
Looking at these pictures and studying the business end of Mike's wiener has me thinking he was not circumcised. I thought he was Jewish.
J
He was a trainwreck in the 90ies. Just watch his video on youtube where he trains the German gaylord "Markus". Even if his overall rough look was due to stimulant abuse it seemed that his back was done for from the weights.
Disclaimer:take your anti depressants before watching this video
The positive thing about the Mentzer video is that the reps are done slow and controlled which really seems to stress the muscle.I agree with the negative aspect of training.......you can always slowly lower more weight than you can raise/lift so more muscle damage will occur.
In contrast I read that fast negatives do damage the fibers the most but it's kinda hard to gauge what to believe. Vince and his bicep-cyborg approach are trying to be scientific but I would like to see a huge number of people visiting him, training according to his principles and then presenting their progress... otherwise it's all theory that sounds great.
He died shortly after that was filmed, so yeah.
I agree with the negative aspect of training.......you can always slowly lower more weight than you can raise/lift so more muscle damage will occur.
Just my opinion of course.........I`m no Vince Basile!
actually mike died the night that was filmed and i believe ray two days laterI've always wondered if Ray committed suicide after Mike died as his best friend and brother were gone which also meant no kidney that he needed.
That mofo never benched and squatted 350 and 500 at 15. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
His and his brother’s squats were mile-high and performed in power cages with the safety rails set. Partial reps in the extreme. I’ve heard them described by folks who were THERE.
At 15, Mike would have sat on his heels with 500 ... and never came back up with the bar still on his back.
It’s like the nonsense that Arnold could press 500.
At his most gassed, he was good for a few reps in the early 400s.
Anyway, I digress ...
I met Mike in the mid-nineties and he was totalled. All fucked up.
I've always wondered if Ray committed suicide after Mike died as his best friend and brother were gone which also meant no kidney that he needed.
Honestly?It would be a rare event for brothers to die a couple days apart if suicide wasn't involved. Of course the family might never admit it as to not demonize Ray.
I did not know Ray, but I strongly suspect he did commit suicide after Mike died. How he did it is the real question: by refusing further dialysis treatment? Something more, like ingestion of pills? The executrix of their estate doesn't want to talk about it.
I've always wondered if Ray committed suicide after Mike died as his best friend and brother were gone which also meant no kidney that he needed.
Looking at these pictures and studying the business end of Mike's wiener has me thinking he was not circumcised. I thought he was Jewish.all of the 3 stooges were Jewish
J
Mentzer was not Jewish.
American doctors apparently used to circumsise all male babies. Don't know if they still do.
Mentzer built most of (if not all) of his mass on steroids. ;D He was no more a mesomorph than a great many other men out there. ;D We need only look at Phildo Heath to know that steroids work wonders on the genetically pathetic.
Having said what I believe to be true I should also like to state that I think his 70s Heavy Duty routines are his best and will produce the most results for the most men that give them an honest try. I personally train between 2 and 4 times a week. I have Mike's last book and gave that a serious try a few years ago.
Ouch.
I was sore for days. No make that two weeks. I trained once every week or two and I went at it like a madman. Fully warmed up I would for example train back thus - Close grip palms up pull downs to UTTER failure via forced reps, drop sets and negatives (if I could find someone crazy enough to train with me) followed immediately by barbell rows and then (maybe) deadlifts. That's it.
The same workout included biceps. Barbell curls with a 2.5" thick bar. A single drop set that included forced and negative reps toward the end. Again, I could only do the forced and negative reps if someone was training with me. Few wanted to. When training alone I would do rest/pause for my final reps on everything.
Rest. And lots of it. And I HURT. I also got a brutal pump that seemed to last for hours.
I did not get stronger every workout. I did not go up in reps every workout. I did not truly expect to because I am older now and a natural wussy! Gradually I did get bigger and stronger and view this type of training along the same lines as "Dinosaur Training" (which I also think highly of). There are times when I will do sets of 50 reps on biceps and triceps for example for up to 5 to 10 sets but usually no more than a couple sets each. There's also times when I just walk out or never go to the gym or to the weights I have in my garage.
Mentzer used to write about the "cornucopia" of drugs the "champions" were on and how they made recovery much quicker and better. This is the difference between us and them. Drugs. I learned that truth from Robbie Robinson over 40 years ago in the original Gold's. He was quite honest about it as were pretty much all of them.
If how you train works for you then great! There's nothing wrong with volume training if it works for you. I used to train twice a day, six days a week. It didn't work for me but I was stoooopid and believed the Weider BS Principals. ;D
drugs help alot especially in growth and recovery , if anyoen disagrees they are full of shit. and like bob said "the finishing touch" bwa ha ha more like the "crutch" every pro needs and then some.
Mentzer built most of (if not all) of his mass on steroids. ;D He was no more a mesomorph than a great many other men out there. ;D We need only look at Phildo Heath to know that steroids work wonders on the genetically pathetic.Dinosaur Training wrecked my joints and took me years to recover from but it is very effective for strength. Brooks Kubik is naturally very large so it worked well for him.
Having said what I believe to be true I should also like to state that I think his 70s Heavy Duty routines are his best and will produce the most results for the most men that give them an honest try. I personally train between 2 and 4 times a week. I have Mike's last book and gave that a serious try a few years ago.
Ouch.
I was sore for days. No make that two weeks. I trained once every week or two and I went at it like a madman. Fully warmed up I would for example train back thus - Close grip palms up pull downs to UTTER failure via forced reps, drop sets and negatives (if I could find someone crazy enough to train with me) followed immediately by barbell rows and then (maybe) deadlifts. That's it.
The same workout included biceps. Barbell curls with a 2.5" thick bar. A single drop set that included forced and negative reps toward the end. Again, I could only do the forced and negative reps if someone was training with me. Few wanted to. When training alone I would do rest/pause for my final reps on everything.
Rest. And lots of it. And I HURT. I also got a brutal pump that seemed to last for hours.
I did not get stronger every workout. I did not go up in reps every workout. I did not truly expect to because I am older now and a natural wussy! Gradually I did get bigger and stronger and view this type of training along the same lines as "Dinosaur Training" (which I also think highly of). There are times when I will do sets of 50 reps on biceps and triceps for example for up to 5 to 10 sets but usually no more than a couple sets each. There's also times when I just walk out or never go to the gym or to the weights I have in my garage.
Mentzer used to write about the "cornucopia" of drugs the "champions" were on and how they made recovery much quicker and better. This is the difference between us and them. Drugs. I learned that truth from Robbie Robinson over 40 years ago in the original Gold's. He was quite honest about it as were pretty much all of them.
If how you train works for you then great! There's nothing wrong with volume training if it works for you. I used to train twice a day, six days a week. It didn't work for me but I was stoooopid and believed the Weider BS Principals. ;D
American doctors apparently used to circumsise all male babies. Don't know if they still do.
How about them being "just the finishing crutch' then..? ;)
Mike's penis taking the verbal HITs like a Weider sponsored champion.Are you saying weider sponsored "athletes" were required to preform kynodesme?