Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: cephissus on March 19, 2019, 03:12:11 PM
-
Age: 32
Serum test: 480 ng/dl
Free test: 7.71 ng/dl (ml? not sure)
The doctor thought I was too young for TRT and prescribed some stuff to raise endogenous test:
DHEA: 10mg ED
Clomid: 25mg ED
HCG: 500 IU 2x/wk
It's $180/month -- I think straight test was $99/month at this place.
I think the "standard" reference range he showed me was 200-900 but his preferred range is 700-1200. I told him I came in for shitty mood (mood swings, depression) and exercise (weak muscle sensation, pumps), which is true, but since I'm already nearly 500 I'm not sure how much bumping it up would do.
But od course I want real expert opinion, so I'm here to ask what getbig thinks! :D
-
You need to get your shit together first.
-
Fuck paying double for that shite when test is more effective and half the price
-
no humping and no pumping eh
-
Test cypionate 250mg/ml is less than 50 bucks when u go the UGL route.
It's not like your buying Primo and getting God knows what. It's Test--any halfway decent lab would never fake that. The raws are too basic and inexpensive to procure.
And HCG 5000 IU amp is prob about 40 bucks.
Dunno about DHEA tho
-
Be careful with the dhea. Dont go overboard. I like it better than proviron. Your cock will be very happy. You can buy dhea on Amazon for pennies. Make sure you get the sublingual kind.
-
Be careful with the dhea. Dont go overboard. I like it better than proviron. Your cock will be very happy. You can buy dhea on Amazon for pennies. Make sure you get the sublingual kind.
Hmmm, who would've thought LittleracistJ would be a drug addict? Typical.
-
Age: 32
Serum test: 480 ng/dl
Free test: 7.71 ng/dl (ml? not sure)
The doctor thought I was too young for TRT and prescribed some stuff to raise endogenous test:
DHEA: 10mg ED
Clomid: 25mg ED
HCG: 500 IU 2x/wk
You gonna get bitch tits and be a weepy pussy boy now.
-
Hmmm, who would've thought LittleracistJ would be a drug addict? Typical.
True - He only buys from Black Dealers Though 😂😂😂
-
Hmmm, who would've thought LittleracistJ would be a drug addict? Typical.
Yes using dhea made me into a drug addict ::)
-
Test cypionate 250mg/ml is less than 50 bucks when u go the UGL route.
It's not like your buying Primo and getting God knows what. It's Test--any halfway decent lab would never fake that. The raws are too basic and inexpensive to procure.
And HCG 5000 IU amp is prob about 40 bucks.
Dunno about DHEA tho
Fuck UG shit. You're right about the content as far as materials and cost, but who the hell knows how or where it was brewed?
OP take your blood work to another TRT clinic or best case to a regular dr. that someone from your gym recommends. These TRT clinics that prescribe based on a "plan", "level", "tier", "membership" are mostly all bullshit and walking a fine line legality wise. There's a popular one in FL that does telemed that I can not find an actual medical doctor's license or even legit medical article or news story about. He's just got a phd. and is a past wife beater.....that's the news story I could find. Seems on the up and up right? ::)
You fucked yourself by mentioning muscle pumps or however you worded it. You're being put on that shit to see if your natural test comes back. If you were trying to game the system post cycle.....you lost.
-
I believe you are too young for TRT. Your body can still recover from whatever you have done in the past.
-
Clomid is used for men to raise their sperm count when infertility is a problem. It's used for a brief time. Studies found it increases brain cancer. Doc had me on it and it works amazing to raise testosterone. He was part of a urology practice. When I saw another doctor in the practice he was furious he prescribed it and told me about increased risk of brain cancer. Next time I went to schedule an appointment with the original doctor he was gone from the practice. I miss clomid. For me it was a drastic increase.
-
Clomid is used for men to raise their sperm count when infertility is a problem. It's used for a brief time. Studies found it increases brain cancer. Doc had me on it and it works amazing to raise testosterone. He was part of a urology practice. When I saw another doctor in the practice he was furious he prescribed it and told me about increased risk of brain cancer. Next time I went to schedule an appointment with the original doctor he was gone from the practice. I miss clomid. For me it was a drastic increase.
Typical GetBigger All Drugs 😂😂😂👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
It don’t do much for Me - Sustanon & Enathate Work for Me.
Yep I’m All Drugs. 😂👍🏻
-
Clomid is used for men to raise their sperm count when infertility is a problem. It's used for a brief time. Studies found it increases brain cancer. Doc had me on it and it works amazing to raise testosterone. He was part of a urology practice. When I saw another doctor in the practice he was furious he prescribed it and told me about increased risk of brain cancer. Next time I went to schedule an appointment with the original doctor he was gone from the practice. I miss clomid. For me it was a drastic increase.
Be careful with this advise. You’ll knock up every girl you touch.
-
Please throw the clomid in the trash
-
Please throw the clomid in the trash
I've known people prescribed clomid, worked a little, but felt like absolute shite. Not worth it.
-
What about the test level? Is 500 to let's say 1000 a big difference ???
-
One shot of Test Cyp every 7 days will bring your levels to over 1200.
-
What about the test level? Is 500 to let's say 1000 a big difference ???
So I mentioned the protocol I was on, and how it's progressed to where I'm at now in the Italian Lifter's over 40 thread. Quick recap (all Test E and I'm just going off memory) 200mg/wkly = 987, felt decent. 400mg/bi-weekly = 646, mood all over the place and felt like shit for all but 3-5 days out of 14. Current as of 12-31-18 300mg/wkly = 1348, cha-muthafuckin-ching! Have several health issues I've been dealing with for 2 decades that are not juice related in any way, but I feel the best I've felt in 10+ years and that has been getting more improved since feb.
I want to post my bloodwork, but I don't know how. I keep everything in spreadsheets, and use "economic" formula for percent change in value. My dr. was alarmed by my test level, and told me when we switched to 300 he was comfortable at 1200 total test. When his nurse called to set me up to come in and go over she said he was not happy about my RBC either. I put the spreadsheet together, and went in ready to fight. I said I know you want to talk about my test levels, but I want you to look at these things first because I'm even in shock. ALL of my cholesterol levels were high, high risk, or very high risk (except HDL is low)......they always have been on or off.
Between my last bloodwork in december at 400/bi-weekly and bloodwork two weeks ago at 300/wkly ELEVEN things got better. Every cholesterol and my tri's are all normal (except HDL went from 38 to 36....I attribute that to adding in Anastrozole, and he agreed. My RBC that he was concerned about actually went down .5. Here's the kicker.....Not only did I not train from 2-9 through 3-9 (except for 2x weights and 2x cardio), from the super bowl til then I ate like complete fucking shit. I said "this is crazy, it goes against everything even I believed from my reading...can you please explain this?" He said, "I have no clue. That makes no sense at all, and goes against everything I was taught in med school about steroids" (He's a gp, not an endo or trt specialist) He then said, "so I guess you just want to stay where you're at?" I smiled, and said "yes please" 8)
So the short answer to your question is that research shows that no real trt benefits begin until at least 800ngs/dl is reached. What my results show FOR ME, is that there is an insane difference between 987 and 1348.....and I got healthier.
Question to all.....does anyone know a reputable national chain/research company that pays for blood donations? If I'm going to go get vampired every 3 months, I might as well get a free dinner or two out of it?
-
Scariest thing about unmonitorized TRT is the gradual blood thickening and all the imbalances in health that come with it.
-
Thanks myt1, really interesting! What was your test before going on any protocol? How did you feel at your "natural level"?
-
I've known people prescribed clomid, worked a little, but felt like absolute shite. Not worth it.
Would Nolvadex be better?
-
You gonna get bitch tits and be a weepy pussy boy now.
From the HCG alone?
-
Age: 32
Serum test: 480 ng/dl
Free test: 7.71 ng/dl (ml? not sure)
The doctor thought I was too young for TRT and prescribed some stuff to raise endogenous test:
DHEA: 10mg ED
Clomid: 25mg ED
HCG: 500 IU 2x/wk
It's $180/month -- I think straight test was $99/month at this place.
I think the "standard" reference range he showed me was 200-900 but his preferred range is 700-1200. I told him I came in for shitty mood (mood swings, depression) and exercise (weak muscle sensation, pumps), which is true, but since I'm already nearly 500 I'm not sure how much bumping it up would do.
But od course I want real expert opinion, so I'm here to ask what getbig thinks! :D
The cost you quoted for both TRT and doctor prescribed supplements seems very high. A scale of 700 - 1200 is a better choice. Most recommendations for test levels are too low, IMO.
Supplements have side effects too, but they are likely to be less intense. The effectiveness of Clomid on men is debatable. It is not FDA approved for use in men. DHEA and HCG can be purchased online and are not expensive. Check out ReliableRXPharmacy, https://www.reliablerxpharmacy.com/hcg.html. I've bought from them for years with no problems. If you go the TRT route and have health insurance which covers testosterone, it isn't expensive. My co-pay is around $50. for a 10ML, 200 MG per ML vial, which lasts me three months. Syringes are inexpensive. Some pharmacies require a prescription for them, some don't. Mine doesn't.
-
From the HCG alone?
You can get gyno from HCG alone, depends on the dose.
-
The cost you quoted for both TRT and doctor prescribed supplements seems very high. A scale of 700 - 1200 is a better choice. Most recommendations for test levels are too low, IMO.
Supplements have side effects too, but they are likely to be less intense. The effectiveness of Clomid on men is debatable. It is not FDA approved for use in men. DHEA and HCG can be purchased online and are not expensive. Check out ReliableRXPharmacy, https://www.reliablerxpharmacy.com/hcg.html. I've bought from them for years with no problems. If you go the TRT route and have health insurance which covers testosterone, it isn't expensive. My co-pay is around $50. for a 10ML, 200 MG per ML vial, which lasts me three months. Syringes are inexpensive. Some pharmacies require a prescription for them, some don't. Mine doesn't.
Thanks prime. Do you think 480 is too low for someone my age?
Edit:
Also, does anyone know anything about "free test"? The doc explained that sex hormone binding globulin determines how much test is available. My SHBG was pretty high, so I'm guessing 7.81 pg/ml free T is low, even if 480 ng/dl serum T isn't that bad in itself.
Edit 2:
Hmm, looks like the reference range for free T is about 30 - 170 pg/dl, and it should be about 1-2.5% total test. pg/ml is one tenth ng/dl, so .78 ng/dl free T... Which way lower than 4.8 ng/dl (1%).
-
Thanks prime. Do you think 480 is too low for someone my age?
sounds low to me, i remember being a little over 800 when i was 36
E
-
Dave is having a discussion on this here -
I can’t post YouTube vids ( for some reason ) from my iPad. It is worth watching.
J
-
Thanks myt1, really interesting! What was your test before going on any protocol? How did you feel at your "natural level"?
No prob!
Read the other thread I referenced as I laid out mostly everything about my journey with finding the right dr. and getting on trt, but I will address this question here for you.
I just checked my spreadsheets of the stuff I kept from years ago (only 3 of them, and only one was tested for total test)... I don't know what my total test was before I got on HRT. My gp at the time was part of a large nation med chain and he had no clue what he was doing. He tested free test, and it was only 74 I think (no spreadsheet for that one) In 2012 after taking an extended break, and wanting to resume the dr. I found that knew what he was doing made me test first to cover his ass. I was 311, and in both instances I felt like my free test was at 74, and later my total test was at 311...... which is a polite way of saying fucking horrible!
-
The cost you quoted for both TRT and doctor prescribed supplements seems very high. A scale of 700 - 1200 is a better choice. Most recommendations for test levels are too low, IMO.
Supplements have side effects too, but they are likely to be less intense. The effectiveness of Clomid on men is debatable. It is not FDA approved for use in men. DHEA and HCG can be purchased online and are not expensive. Check out ReliableRXPharmacy, https://www.reliablerxpharmacy.com/hcg.html. I've bought from them for years with no problems. If you go the TRT route and have health insurance which covers testosterone, it isn't expensive. My co-pay is around $50. for a 10ML, 200 MG per ML vial, which lasts me three months. Syringes are inexpensive. Some pharmacies require a prescription for them, some don't. Mine doesn't.
Great post.....although I'm shocked you can buy HCG online with no script???? WTF? It's a drug. Is that a U.S. site, and 100% legit with the bac water and product needing to be mixed?
As for your scale you gave, I agree with that number range, but a person is stuck with the suggested range the lab the dr. sends it to uses. The lab company mine goes to suggests 285-950....that's retarded IMO :P The problem with that scale is that those ranges are very old and demographics were very different way back then. Most blacks and hispanics probably have peak natural levels over 1200. That's why they'll fuck all these fat pigs, and are so effective at reproducing. (no racist) And those levels were a range of guys from like late teens to their late 70's from what I've read. So some kid who's 20 goes in with half the real normal range for someone his age which is likely 1000+, and he gets told everything is just fine..."you're perfectly normal son" ::)
Cyp which Prim is on is a lot cheaper than the Test E I'm on. I pay $64-67 depending on the pharmacy for only a 5ML bottle. I actually know the cash price for both without insurance at all pharms including CVS and WalMart is usually about 115-140 for 10 mls of Cyp, and about 125-135 for Test Enanthate. If you're using a real dr. and not one of those clinics that "compounds their own" *cough* FUCKING BULLSHIT *cough* you should have your script called into walmart as you can go to goodrx.com and get a copay coupon that should make it close to what Prime and I pay for our differing types of test respectively.
Oh, and just by chance.... I happened to have called CVS to find out how much pins and syringes were a couple hours ago as I'm running low. 18 guage bd 3cc syringe (to draw) = $.26/each. 23 guage 1 inch BD needle only (switch the needle to shoot.....18 is gonna hurt!) = $.18/each
For those asking for info, HTH! Good luck!
-
Thanks prime. Do you think 480 is too low for someone my age?
Edit:
Also, does anyone know anything about "free test"? The doc explained that sex hormone binding globulin determines how much test is available. My SHBG was pretty high, so I'm guessing 7.81 pg/ml free T is low, even if 480 ng/dl serum T isn't that bad in itself.
Edit 2:
Hmm, looks like the reference range for free T is about 30 - 170 pg/dl, and it should be about 1-2.5% total test. pg/ml is one tenth ng/dl, so .78 ng/dl free T... Which way lower than 4.8 ng/dl (1%).
You're hormone bloods should include the following. Total testosterone, free testosterone, shbg, FREE TESTOSTERONE%, a psa, estradiol, and DHEA and IGF-1 is optional. Free test range is 47-240 IIRC. The 47 number I'm certain of as being the low when I was first tested since I was at those numbers flipped...74, and I am 100% positive the upper end was above 200.
Free test is what you're body is actually using. That is the diesel fuel you need buddy. The range you posted is just their range.....although I will say whoever you're using has some very low end values. Free test percent is something you want to focus on. Range should be 2-3%, with "optimal" NOT "ideal"...being 2.5 to 3% I was dead on at 3% these last labs.
-
Great post.....although I'm shocked you can buy HCG online with no script???? WTF? It's a drug. Is that a U.S. site, and 100% legit with the bac water and product needing to be mixed?
As for your scale you gave, I agree with that number range, but a person is stuck with the suggested range the lab the dr. sends it to uses. The lab company mine goes to suggests 285-950....that's retarded IMO :P The problem with that scale is that those ranges are very old and demographics were very different way back then. Most blacks and hispanics probably have peak natural levels over 1200. That's why they'll fuck all these fat pigs, and are so effective at reproducing. (no racist) And those levels were a range of guys from like late teens to their late 70's from what I've read. So some kid who's 20 goes in with half the real normal range for someone his age which is likely 1000+, and he gets told everything is just fine..."you're perfectly normal son" ::)
Cyp which Prim is on is a lot cheaper than the Test E I'm on. I pay $64-67 depending on the pharmacy for only a 5ML bottle. I actually know the cash price for both without insurance at all pharms including CVS and WalMart is usually about 115-140 for 10 mls of Cyp, and about 125-135 for Test Enanthate. If you're using a real dr. and not one of those clinics that "compounds their own" *cough* FUCKING BULLSHIT *cough* you should have your script called into walmart as you can go to goodrx.com and get a copay coupon that should make it close to what Prime and I pay for our differing types of test respectively.
Oh, and just by chance.... I happened to have called CVS to find out how much pins and syringes were a couple hours ago as I'm running low. 18 guage bd 3cc syringe (to draw) = $.26/each. 23 guage 1 inch BD needle only (switch the needle to shoot.....18 is gonna hurt!) = $.18/each
For those asking for info, HTH! Good luck!
Really good post. Reliable Rx as recommended by Prime is an Indian pharmacy. They are legit. As are alldaygeneric and alldaychemist. As for using a 23 gauge for injecting? You are a badder man than me. I use 25g for quads and slin pins for tri's and delts. I use 23g to draw and it seems pretty quick to me.
-
Really good post. Reliable Rx as recommended by Prime is an Indian pharmacy. They are legit. As are alldaygeneric and alldaychemist. As for using a 23 gauge for injecting? You are a badder man than me. I use 25g for quads and slin pins for tri's and delts. I use 23g to draw and it seems pretty quick to me.
Sometimes my long winded posts contain more info than people want to believe is there just by glancing. ;)
An 18 draws 1.5 mls almost like it's a water based if you push equal air into the bottle first. I don't know how in the hell you do your side delts yourself, but then again you likely don't have little T-Rex arms like me. :'( The nurses bitch every fucking week about how hard it is to push it through, and try to talk me into a bigger gauge.....not happening.
The other thing for me is that I'm HUGE on cleanliness/100% sterileness with TRT. I wipe the stopper b4 and post injection, and switching the needles not only means the one I'm injecting is totally clean, but also it's first use is plunging my tissues not the bottle. Other than the length there isn't much difference in feel of injecting a 23 vs a 25 AG.
Site injections, and quad injections scare the shit out of me. My tri's are pretty good even after just a couple months training returning from 2.5+ yrs not lifting at all. I wouldn't mind doing my front delts (don't know how to safely), and rear delts (can't reach, and dr. won't allow nurses to do) Biceps you're supposed to use a 1-1.5 inch to get under the muscle aren't you? No way in hell I'd try that.
Have you ever hit a nerve doing quads, or not been able to walk right after a bad shot?
-
Sometimes my long winded posts contain more info than people want to believe is there just by glancing. ;)
An 18 draws 1.5 mls almost like it's a water based if you push equal air into the bottle first. I don't know how in the hell you do your side delts yourself, but then again you likely don't have little T-Rex arms like me. :'( The nurses bitch every fucking week about how hard it is to push it through, and try to talk me into a bigger gauge.....not happening.
The other thing for me is that I'm HUGE on cleanliness/100% sterileness with TRT. I wipe the stopper b4 and post injection, and switching the needles not only means the one I'm injecting is totally clean, but also it's first use is plunging my tissues not the bottle. Other than the length there isn't much difference in feel of injecting a 23 vs a 25 AG.
Site injections, and quad injections scare the shit out of me. My tri's are pretty good even after just a couple months training returning from 2.5+ yrs not lifting at all. I wouldn't mind doing my front delts (don't know how to safely), and rear delts (can't reach, and dr. won't allow nurses to do) Biceps you're supposed to use a 1-1.5 inch to get under the muscle aren't you? No way in hell I'd try that.
Have you ever hit a nerve doing quads, or not been able to walk right after a bad shot?
Never had any issues doing quads. But, I've been hearing all the horror stories which is why i've been doing tri's more recently. Hitting side delts is do-able for me but tri's are much, much easier.
Fuck bicep injections. Same for pec injections.
When I run out of 23g for drawing, I'll grab some 18's.