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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Powerlift66 on April 07, 2019, 01:31:25 PM
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He was saved...
http://legendfitness.com/2018/03/who-is-dr-ken-leistner/
Great guy,PIP...
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rip
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Sad business.
For the younger guys that might not be familiar, he was involved quite a bit with the early days of powerlifting and sports team strength and conditioning programs. The series he was doing for Titan was a nice read, especially the early articles. You can read them here -
https://titansupport.com/category/ken-leistner/page/13/ (start at page 13 and work backward).
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kl
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It's a shock to hear this.
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Not that old was he?
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Not that old was he?
I want to say early 70's. I seem to remember his birth year as sometime in the late 1940's. He didn't give off an old man vibe, so I think that makes you think he was younger than he was.
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Nooooooo! Loved reading his stuff. RIP
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72 years old. Born 1947.
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RIP
Sadly we all have to depart sooner or later
Read many of his articles
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Sad. That’s fairly young these days
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One must wonder if sudden heart attack, have not heard much yet.
If so, I would wonder why an older guy doesn't have all the health test that are out there? (Expensive, etc)?
The coronary calcium tests are now like 100.00, show inflammation, calcification of arteries.
May have been something different (aneurysm, etc) but who knows. We'll see.
50 and older guys, get every test you can out there, could save your life.
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That's too bad. In a bizarre coincidence, I just watched one of his training videos the other day on YouTube. I think he only weighed 160ish in it, but he military pressed over 250 for four, squatted 405x23, curled over 150 for five (?) and did other cool stuff, most of it with very good form. I haven't seen many guys train that way who were nearly as strong.
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Absolutely the real thing. He was right there during some of powerliftings biggest moments. His gym in Alameda was legendary. Lee. Moran and a host of other full-patched members of the Hells Angels gave that gym an authenticity that was unmatched.
PIP. Powerlift in Peace.
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That's too bad. In a bizarre coincidence, I just watched one of his training videos the other day on YouTube. I think he only weighed 160ish in it, but he military pressed over 250 for four, squatted 405x23, curled over 150 for five (?) and did other cool stuff, most of it with very good form. I haven't seen many guys train that way who were nearly as strong.
Ha, I thought it was gone forever, but I see it was reposted yesterday -
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The squats at 23 minutes in caused a stir close to 20 years ago.
Edit - Click here if video won't play on the site -
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From Dave Draper:
https://davedraper.com/pdfs/irononline1007.pdf
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He was saved...
http://legendfitness.com/2018/03/who-is-dr-ken-leistner/
Great guy,PIP...
He's lifting with the angels now.
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One must wonder if sudden heart attack, have not heard much yet.
If so, I would wonder why an older guy doesn't have all the health test that are out there? (Expensive, etc)?
The coronary calcium tests are now like 100.00, show inflammation, calcification of arteries.
May have been something different (aneurysm, etc) but who knows. We'll see.
50 and older guys, get every test you can out there, could save your life.
For many the first sign of heart trouble is death.
Watched the tape of the doctor deep squatting what appeared to be 405 for reps on the tape. Very impressive. What struck me is that he appeared to struggle lifting the 45lbs plates to load the barbell. Just hit me as unusual. Not saying the lift was staged. From from that.
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For many the first sign of heart trouble is death.
Watched the tape of the doctor deep squatting what appeared to be 405 for reps on the tape. Very impressive. What struck me is that he appeared to struggle lifting the 45lbs plates to load the barbell. Just hit me as unusual. Not saying the lift was staged. From from that.
I found that video a little strange - it just didn’t appear quite right
He did appear to take some effort with 45s & then the bar didn’t appear
To bend even a slight amount .
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I found that video a little strange - it just didn’t appear quite right
He did appear to take some effort with 45s & then the bar didn’t appear
To bend even a slight amount .
Same here mate, just skipped through it and also the actions towards the end of the sets look odd, getting another full rep easily after grinding to a halt the rep before on the military press? His 23rd rep of the squat looked as fast and easy as the first on the ascent but got stuck at the bottom on the next usually a few few are grinders before failing
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I remember Ken's articles in the mags (think it was Powerlifter USA and Ironman) back in the 80's and 90's with him training Kevin Tolbert. If I recall correctly he was an advocate of HIT type training in the sense of low volume and I think whole body workouts. I amazed at his strength in these videos and I assume they are real.
I have no reason to think he's a scammer. On the other hand, at the 14:45 he says Bill Pearl could do a press behind the neck with 450 which is like Ted Arcidi type strength and although I'm sure Pearl was strong as shit I'm also fairly certain that claim is total BS
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I want to believe too. I go back and forth on it, but I think it's possible. There is enough weight on the bar to cause it to flex, although it isn't whippy like an Olympic bar. Some of the really high end power bars don't show a tremendous amount of bend till you're a good bit past #405.
Also I judged it against Platz's #500 x 23 and a few others -
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But seeing them next to each other, the Leistner squats take a good deal more time to complete, and were noticeably grindier toward the end. So, could a guy that's been training like that for years gut out something in a rest/pause fashion like he did on that tape? Maybe I think.
As for the other stuff, not sure, maybe hamming it up for the camera? They were selling this as a charity secret training tape, and a lot was made about Leistner's toughness.
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I found that video a little strange - it just didn’t appear quite right
He did appear to take some effort with 45s & then the bar didn’t appear
To bend even a slight amount .
Watching the squat clip, it looks to me as if the bar bends very slightly at the top of the movement - not much, but this may have to do more with bar design.
Some bars are intentionally made to flex/bend more or less than others.
I remember at my first gym (which started as a powerlifting gym and retained a lot of its original equipment during my time there) the veteran lifters had a special bar they used SPECIFICALLY for bench pressing. They actually kept the bar locked in a back room when not in use to prevent other general gym members from using it for deadlifting, etc. I was told that certain use could damage the desired tempering of the bar.
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I remember Ken's articles in the mags (think it was Powerlifter USA and Ironman) back in the 80's and 90's with him training Kevin Tolbert. If I recall correctly he was an advocate of HIT type training in the sense of low volume and I think whole body workouts. I amazed at his strength in these videos and I assume they are real.
I have no reason to think he's a scammer. On the other hand, at the 14:45 he says Bill Pearl could do a press behind the neck with 450 which is like Ted Arcidi type strength and although I'm sure Pearl was strong as shit I'm also fairly certain that claim is total BS
Straw, you are right on here. Pearl could no way do 450 BNP. Not many could. Ted would rep w/ 315 or so, and he did a 375 for 1.
He may have done a 405 for one also. (I'll ask him next time I see him).
He recently got some shoulder repairs ( a new type of technology/surgery that caps the damaged bone with a artificial product) that brings back mobility, relieves pain.
Also had his knee's done.
The heavy lifting, takes its toll on people.
Bill was strong, but not insane strong like Ken mentioned.
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PIP.
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Didn’t ken have a darkie adopted son that they claimed was the strongest man who ever lived could squat 600x20 or so?
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Didn’t ken have a darkie adopted son that they claimed was the strongest man who ever lived could squat 600x20 or so?
Yes, Kevin Tolbert, who is a pretty high level strength coach in American football now. At one point, the claim was #600 x 30 for squats at about #250 - 260. This bothered me, but someone later explained that it was a machine squat, either on a TK Star Leverage Squat or a Nautilus machine.
This sort of made sense because he was big on the TK Star Squat, the Nautilius Duo Squat/Leg Press, and the Nautilius leverage leg press and promoted them quite a bit. He used to have guys switch between regular squats, the power squat machine, and a leg press variant.
It doesn't help that in some of his writings he doesn't mention when they were going between regular barbell squats and machine work. If you were casually reading the article and not familiar with other things he'd written, it was easy not to catch it. Whether this was by design or just because of the fast conversational style he had, I don't know -
Tolbert -
(http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4436/3293/400/kevintolbert.0.jpg).
TK Star Power Squat -
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/302377469702-0-1/s-l1000.jpg).
Nautilus Duo -
Nautilius Leg Press -
(http://www.drdarden.com/forum_images/c23d5-LeverageLegPress.jpg).
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Watching the squat clip, it looks to me as if the bar bends very slightly at the top of the movement - not much, but this may have to do more with bar design.
Some bars are intentionally made to flex/bend more or less than others.
I remember at my first gym (which started as a powerlifting gym and retained a lot of its original equipment during my time there) the veteran lifters had a special bar they used SPECIFICALLY for bench pressing. They actually kept the bar locked in a back room when not in use to prevent other general gym members from using it for deadlifting, etc. I was told that certain use could damage the desired tempering of the bar.
Correct there’s a lot of difference between an Eleiko Olympic bar & A Heavy duty Powerlifting Bar.
I’ve got an Eleiko Olympic lifting bar & That’s very springy & I think it’s an old Borg Power Bar
And that doesn’t bend until you got 600 /700 lbs on it.
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Watching the squat clip, it looks to me as if the bar bends very slightly at the top of the movement - not much, but this may have to do more with bar design.
Some bars are intentionally made to flex/bend more or less than others.
I remember at my first gym (which started as a powerlifting gym and retained a lot of its original equipment during my time there) the veteran lifters had a special bar they used SPECIFICALLY for bench pressing. They actually kept the bar locked in a back room when not in use to prevent other general gym members from using it for deadlifting, etc. I was told that certain use could damage the desired tempering of the bar.
Fascinating! 8) Although I did of course do the whole incremental increase over time thing for bodybuilding purposes, I never got into 'real' lifting like a lot of you guys (was never strong enough :-\) so I'm completely ignorant of considerations like this...
Do you know what specific characteristic(s) of that bar made it so desirable/suitable for benching I wonder - was it because it was especially stiff or something..?
Correct there’s a lot of difference between an Eleiko Olympic bar & A Heavy duty Powerlifting Bar.
I’ve got an Eleiko Olympic lifting bar & That’s very springy & I think it’s an old Borg Power Bar
And that doesn’t bend until you got 600 /700 lbs on it.
Again, very interesting. I'm no metallurgist, but I'd love to understand the difference in materials and/or production processes that influenced the end product so differently - any experts care to explain please?
Illuminati, I know you've competed at a high level - so in your experience does a 'springy' bar perhaps help with explosive 1RM work (or competitions)..? Or is a 'stiffy' better? (Sorry for being juvenile ;D)
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Fascinating! 8) Although I did of course do the whole incremental increase over time thing for bodybuilding purposes, I never got into 'real' lifting like a lot of you guys (was never strong enough :-\) so I'm completely ignorant of considerations like this...
Do you know what specific characteristic(s) of that bar made it so desirable/suitable for benching I wonder - was it because it was especially stiff or something..?
Again, very interesting. I'm no metallurgist, but I'd love to understand the difference in materials and/or production processes that influenced the end product so differently - any experts care to explain please?
Illuminati, I know you've competed at a high level - so in your experience does a 'springy' bar perhaps help with explosive 1RM work (or competitions)..? Or is a 'stiffy' better? (Sorry for being juvenile ;D)
Hmmm I found with a Eleiko Olympic bar it would go either way when squating
If you got the bar to bounce whip up on the bottom out of the hole squat position
It’d help & if it was on the down part make it more difficult.
The stiffer bar would give more control especially as the weights got heavier.
On the deadlift a Springy bar would help as it would bend up as you pulled & allow you to be in
A Higher stronger start position - That’s why the strongmen tend to use 9ft bars not 7ft ones.
As for the Bench I’ve not heard of a special bench bar - other than the cambered bars
That’s not to say there isn’t a bench bar.
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Yes, with a whippy Olympic bar, many of the best lifters can time and feel the whip, and get a few extra pounds out of it during certain stages of the lift.
With a powerlifting bar, the movements are slower and simpler, so stiffness wins out. there's less/no whip, so you're less likely to be thrown out of the groove.
The last bar you may find is a Deadlift bar used in some powerlifting feds. The longer length (7 1/2') and thinner shaft cause more deflection under load (they bend more :) ). This can shave a tiny bit of distance off the lift at the start, and many people seem to enjoy more pulling strength with a thinner bar (Pushing tends to favor a slightly thicker bar).
Edit - here's a good look a top OL lifter using bar whip (at the dip and catch, and the jerk) -
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Hmmm I found with a Eleiko Olympic bar it would go either way when squating
If you got the bar to bounce whip up on the bottom out of the hole squat position
It’d help & if it was on the down part make it more difficult.
The stiffer bar would give more control especially as the weights got heavier.
On the deadlift a Springy bar would help as it would bend up as you pulled & allow you to be in
A Higher stronger start position - That’s why the strongmen tend to use 9ft bars not 7ft ones.
As for the Bench I’ve not heard of a special bench bar - other than the cambered bars
That’s not to say there isn’t a bench bar.
I see - I guess it would take some practice to make sure you move at the right time to benefit from the bounce!
And your explanation of how the deadlift could benefit also makes perfect sense - thanks for taking the time to answer dude :)
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Yes, with a whippy Olympic bar, many of the best lifters can time and feel the whip, and get a few extra pounds out of it during certain stages of the lift.
With a powerlifting bar, the movements are slower and simpler, so stiffness wins out. there's less/no whip, so you're less likely to be thrown out of the groove.
The last bar you may find is a Deadlift bar used in some powerlifting feds. The longer length (7 1/2') and thinner shaft cause more deflection under load (they bend more :) ). This can shave a tiny bit of distance off the lift at the start, and many people seem to enjoy more pulling strength with a thinner bar (Pushing tends to favor a slightly thicker bar).
Edit - here's a good look a top OL lifter using bar whip (at the dip and catch, and the jerk) -
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I responded to Illuminati before I read your post, and yes I get it now. Although as I said I never moved much past 315 for anything myself and never really watched Olympic lifting I have always enjoyed watching strongman competitions. And I have found myself pointing out how technique was just as important as brute strength for some of the lifts - so being able to 'catch' the bounce clearly adds small percentage points of additional performance for high-level lifters...
I watched the vid too, and :o wow..... just wow.... explosive. Most of the bigger lifts I've watched on here were the powerlifting type - much slower (still impressive but in a different way to this vid)
Thanks for responding man 8)
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Didn’t ken have a darkie adopted son that they claimed was the strongest man who ever lived could squat 600x20 or so?
His Wife and another channel are putting up some old lifting videos, which might interest some -
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- Might be a bit boring for people not into equipment.
www.youtube.com/user/STGStrengthandPower/videos - Lots of early 80's - 90's stuff here.
www.youtube.com/channel/UCcQ6qJ1smwQSlnY3-FJoDiA - His wife's channel.
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Ha, I thought it was gone forever, but I see it was reposted yesterday -
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The squats at 23 minutes in caused a stir close to 20 years ago.
Edit - Click here if video won't play on the site -
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that's some high intensity training. I can see why he was so strong for his bodyweight.