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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Methyl m1ke on November 14, 2020, 06:10:13 PM
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Recently i pulled 455x4 last night i tried for 495 and it wouldnt budge. I couldnt get it moving at all. Is this mental? I know im strong enough past results show it. What gives? Any ideas?
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Deadlifting is about building a routine
If your trying to reach let’s say 2-3 reps on a big weight
You warm up with 135
2 sets of 10-15
Then 225 2 sets of 8
Skip 315 ( this takes much much training and good legs )
1 set of 12 with 405
Then hit 495
I did this routine while I was competing and weighing around 210-220 lean off season of even close to a show
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You shouldn't have pulled 455 for reps if you were trying to max at 495.
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Yeah, shouldn't have tried 495 after reps with 455. #495 is even a bit out of range if you're getting 455 x 4, you might get it, but it would be a grinder.
Pick a day you feel good, then do a few reps with a low %, then something like 3-5 reps at 60% for 1 set, then 3 at @70% for one set, then 1 - 2 reps at 80% for 1 set, 90% for 1 rep, 1 set. Then try the max or tiny record break. Also you need real rest between reps, 3- 5 minutes each set.
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"I know I'm strong enough"
Whether mental or physical, you obviously are not strong enough. ::) ???
This whole question made me laugh, like how in the hell could anyone say what the problem is without knowing the guy or seeing him lift? :D
It sounded to me like the 455 wasn't done in the same workout, it was "recently".
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Yeah, shouldn't have tried 495 after reps with 455. #495 is even a bit out of range if you're getting 455 x 4, you might get it, but it would be a grinder.
Pick a day you feel good, then do a few reps with a low %, then something like 3-5 reps at 60% for 1 set, then 3 at @70% for one set, then 1 - 2 reps at 80% for 1 set, 90% for 1 rep, 1 set. Then try the max or tiny record break. Also you need real rest between reps, 3- 5 minutes each set.
Yeah this^ you have to work up to the max lift then have session like the one outlined here to hit it....
You were already toast after maxing out those few reps on 455, that's it job done for the day...
Do a few more sessions build up some more strength, then go for it again as laid out above,
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For max attempts you want to conserve as much energy as possible, as little warm-ups or reps as possible, just enough to stay safe and prime the nervous system for the movement. What bb suggested is great but I do way less. Doing reps with say even 70% would take away from my max attempt - that's me personally.
Say I wanted to do a PR triple with 740lbs, I would do only singles after 315lbs, sometimes singles starting at 225. As fast singles as possible, no resisting at all on the negative to conserve energy.
I've done a shitload of deads in my life, would be surprised if anyone did more on this forum. From age 15 to 43, consistently every week unless sick. Back is still fine, knock on wood. :D
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For max attempts you want to conserve as much energy as possible, as little warm-ups or reps as possible, just enough to stay safe and prime the nervous system for the movement. What bb suggested is great but I do way less. Doing reps with say even 70% would take away from my max attempt - that's me personally.
Say I wanted to do a PR triple with 740lbs, I would do only singles after 315lbs, sometimes singles starting at 225. As fast singles as possible, no resisting at all on the negative to conserve energy.
I've done a shitload of deads in my life, would be surprised if anyone did more on this forum. From age 15 to 43, consistently every week unless sick. Back is still fine, knock on wood. :D
As you mention everyone is different, I couldn't get warmed up enough with that little volume.
It's a good guide to do enough that your fully warmed up and primed for the lift, but before the volume fatigues at all.
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Recently i pulled 455x4 last night i tried for 495 and it wouldnt budge. I couldnt get it moving at all. Is this mental? I know im strong enough past results show it. What gives? Any ideas?
Set of four. So lift it, take a new breath, lower, touch and up?
Or 4 single lifts in a row, releasing the tension in between?
Deads are different. If you did it the former way then it doesn't translate in the same way tha say squat and bench does.
With touch and go set you'll almost always get atleast a second rep if you get the first.
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The 455x4 was at least a month ago. It blew me away because it was the first time I had deadlifted since my gym closed way back in march. Also my previous best had been 405x2 so i crushed that and ive...been lazy since. Havent done any heavy legs havent been hitting my glutes hips etc. Next week or so when i deadlift again ill take the advice on here and do less volume working my way up. My routine deadlifting is always the same
135x10
225x8
315x6
Used to be 365x2 or 4 then it was 405x2
I never thought i would get past 405. Hitting 455 was awesome but it just makes me want 495 even more.
So out of curiosity being able to hit 455x4 does NOT imply i have the strength to pull 495? How can that be?
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So out of curiosity being able to hit 455x4 does NOT imply i have the strength to pull 495? How can that be?
#455 x 4 winds up as a #495 1rm at the tippity top of all the conversion scales / theories. Just from observation, that #495 will probably be a grindy rep, and more often than not most folks will be a tiny bit under it rather than exceed it. The only way to know is to go try it :).
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The 455x4 was at least a month ago. It blew me away because it was the first time I had deadlifted since my gym closed way back in march. Also my previous best had been 405x2 so i crushed that and ive...been lazy since. Havent done any heavy legs havent been hitting my glutes hips etc. Next week or so when i deadlift again ill take the advice on here and do less volume working my way up. My routine deadlifting is always the same
135x10
225x8
315x6
Used to be 365x2 or 4 then it was 405x2
I never thought i would get past 405. Hitting 455 was awesome but it just makes me want 495 even more.
So out of curiosity being able to hit 455x4 does NOT imply i have the strength to pull 495? How can that be?
Only started doing deadlifts again during the start of.lock downs. I throw in a fair bit of warm up sets.
60kg x 5
100kg x 3
120kg x 3
140kg x 3
160kg x 2
180 kg x 2
200kg x 1 (belt)
220 kg x 1 (chalk, belt)
Lifts are done double overhand grip.
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I've never understood the rationale for deadlifting exercises. All I see is a blown out back and unnecessary hernias. Just a stupid lift in my opinion.
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I've never understood the rationale for deadlifting exercises. All I see is a blown out back and unnecessary hernias. Just a stupid lift in my opinion.
I have no special rationale for doing them except that I love them. Primal, aggressive lift. Some people's minds balk at them but for me they are easier psychologically than max squats. Deads have been like a religion to me, I've had long stretches where all I've done is deads lol.
Yes I have an umbilical hernia, may have been from deads, though I think it started from heavy dumbell cross-bench pullovers. I've blown out my back a few times but no lasting problems so far. Whenever I get away from deads I tend to tweak my back.
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Yesterday's workout called for 20 sets of 3 - 3 three reps every 45 seconds for 15 minutes. Try to pick a weight that makes last set very hard.
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I have no special rationale for doing them except that I love them. Primal, aggressive lift. Some people's minds balk at them but for me they are easier psychologically than max squats. Deads have been like a religion to me, I've had long stretches where all I've done is deads lol.
Yes I have an umbilical hernia, may have been from deads, though I think it started from heavy dumbell cross-bench pullovers. I've blown out my back a few times but no lasting problems so far. Whenever I get away from deads I tend to tweak my back.
Think about your future physical well-being, bro. It ain't fun gimping around in your 40's and 50's because you didn't check your ego at the door.
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So out of curiosity being able to hit 455x4 does NOT imply i have the strength to pull 495? How can that be?
A few things:
You say it's been a month since you did the 445 for four reps set. What did you do in the month between that and trying to pull 495?
455x4 is easily a 495 1 RM, maybe more. But you said yourself, prior to your record with the 455, your previous best was a double with 405.
Think about that for a sec broski. To make that jump alone was something of a miracle. When you pulled 405x2, did you expect to single with 455, let alone much more?
How, then, are you going to improve your 1RM by 50 pounds plus in just a couple or three workouts?!
Mike, I dunno what, if anything, you're running. If you are "on," I would say you should keep doing whatever. Even still, breaking 500 requires a plan -- and I don't just mean a good, non-tiring warm-up routine. I mean a weeks-long plan.
The 455 is still very new to your system. Master it with sets of flawless singles and, depending on your schedule, try an equal number of sets of doubles in the next phase.
I would then drop the volume a hair but raise the weight a little -- say, going from 4-6 sets of 455x2 to 3-5 sets of 460 for three. Deload a little, ease back into it, and in short order, you'll have 475 for sets of doubles.
At that point, 500 should be an easy single.
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135-20,225-12,315-5,405-3,460-1,495-1
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A few things:
You say it's been a month since you did the 445 for four reps set. What did you do in the month between that and trying to pull 495?
455x4 is easily a 495 1 RM, maybe more. But you said yourself, prior to your record with the 455, your previous best was a double with 405.
Think about that for a sec broski. To make that jump alone was something of a miracle. When you pulled 405x2, did you expect to single with 455, let alone much more?
How, then, are you going to improve your 1RM by 50 pounds plus in just a couple or three workouts?!
Mike, I dunno what, if anything, you're running. If you are "on," I would say you should keep doing whatever. Even still, breaking 500 requires a plan -- and I don't just mean a good, non-tiring warm-up routine. I mean a weeks-long plan.
The 455 is still very new to your system. Master it with sets of flawless singles and, depending on your schedule, try an equal number of sets of doubles in the next phase.
I would then drop the volume a hair but raise the weight a little -- say, going from 4-6 sets of 455x2 to 3-5 sets of 460 for three. Deload a little, ease back into it, and in short order, you'll have 475 for sets of doubles.
At that point, 500 should be an easy single.
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Ok. I made the jump in weight because (i think) i have been putting effort into my glutes. I never used to. I have an A and B leg workouts which ive detailed here in the past. One day i squat heavy and then hit sissy squats and extensions hams calves get 1 exercise each. About 3 days later i hit reverse lunges romanian deadlifts and bulgarian split squats. Hams calves again. I swear by this routine. I had been hitting it for about 5-6.weeks at home before the gym opened back up.
Also it been more like 3 weeks not a whole month if that matters.
Anyway i appreciate the input.
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Recently i pulled 455x4 last night i tried for 495 and it wouldnt budge. I couldnt get it moving at all. Is this mental? I know im strong enough past results show it. What gives? Any ideas?
whats your program? dup?
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I’d go 135 for 10,225 for 8,315 for 2,405 for 1 then 495 for 1.then two the way back down.but 455 for 4 smoked you.
When I was a heavy bencher years ago I would warm up with 225 for 20 then 315 3,405 for 1,495 for 1.When I repped 315 and 405 I couldn’t get 495.so I would just rep them all on the way down.
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You could always do 225 for 100 reps
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At the end it's all vanity, we all die in the end
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At the end it's all vanity, we all die in the end
And nothing really matters!
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And nothing really matters!
Amen brother
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Lots of good information in here. I competed in power lifting for over 10 years and Olympic lifting for 6 years. If i was in this situation and ONLY wanted to test my 1RM, this is what i'd do.
Always deadlift first exercise, except some accessory movements.
Good mornings
bar x 20 reps
95 x 20 reps
135 x 20 reps
Deadlifts
135 x 10 reps
225 x 5 reps
315 x 3 reps
365 x 1 rep
405 x 1 rep
455 x 1 rep
475 x 1 rep - If 455 goes up real easy, you can jump to 495.
495 x 1 rep
As someone who has severe problems with their lower and upper back, forget ever doing a 1RM of anything. Save your body for the future. I haven't done deadlifts in 5 years and i still look fine. Squats and good mornings are plenty to keep your back strong and tight.
Ego lifting will destroy your body. Almost all power lifters i know are completely fucked by 50 years old. Back, shoulders, hips, neck, elbows, knees etc.
I used to deadlift over 700 pounds, not worth it at all IMO.
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i am not going for 1rm i am gunning to hit 495x2 then 495x4 then 545x2 then 545x4 and keep progressing upwards. its been working for me im sticking with it. i was hoping someone would point out either some type of technique flaw or ancillary muscle group ive neglected or something like that.
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i am not going for 1rm i am gunning to hit 495x2 then 495x4 then 545x2 then 545x4 and keep progressing upwards. its been working for me im sticking with it. i was hoping someone would point out either some type of technique flaw or ancillary muscle group ive neglected or something like that.
Without a video it's impossible to point out a technique flaw, if you were unable to break the weight though you might want to run a short block of heavy deficits with a 2nd day of banded speed pulls
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i am not going for 1rm i am gunning to hit 495x2 then 495x4 then 545x2 then 545x4 and keep progressing upwards. its been working for me im sticking with it. i was hoping someone would point out either some type of technique flaw or ancillary muscle group ive neglected or something like that.
Strength is built differently than muscle. I'm sure you know that. Just stay consistent.
There are a lot of exercises that help your deadlift. Depends on what point of the lift you are struggling.
Good mornings
Reverse hypers
Glute ham raises
Low deficit pulls - Stand on a 2" block or just use 25 or 35 pound plates with a smaller diameter
High pulls from above the knee in a cage
Reverse deadlifts
Chains/bands
Squats
There are a lot of tools to build your deadlift. If you want to pull 600+ pounds, you have to train for it.
Or just up the dosage. :D
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I pulled 495 as a 175 lb natty, it was really all consistency. It’s a lift you really have to concentrate on, and if your mind is not in the game your lifts will suffer. I’m trying to get back to my previous max and beyond but it’s a slow process and you just be patient.
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Without a video it's impossible to point out a technique flaw, if you were unable to break the weight though you might want to run a short block of heavy deficits with a 2nd day of banded speed pulls
i will make a vid next attempt then.
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Strength is built differently than muscle. I'm sure you know that. Just stay consistent.
There are a lot of exercises that help your deadlift. Depends on what point of the lift you are struggling.
Good mornings
Reverse hypers
Glute ham raises
Low deficit pulls - Stand on a 2" block or just use 25 or 35 pound plates with a smaller diameter
High pulls from above the knee in a cage
Reverse deadlifts
Chains/bands
Squats
There are a lot of tools to build your deadlift. If you want to pull 600+ pounds, you have to train for it.
Or just up the dosage. :D
strength and muscle go hand in hand is my understanding. how is this wrong? if i want to get bigger i need to get stronger, more or less. isnt this how muscle is built?
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I pulled 495 as a 175 lb natty, it was really all consistency. It’s a lift you really have to concentrate on, and if your mind is not in the game your lifts will suffer. I’m trying to get back to my previous max and beyond but it’s a slow process and you just be patient.
my friend said the same thing and you both are right. sleep has been terrible diet soso and i knew in my heart i did not have 495 in me but i gave it 100% anyway because it is what it is. if im not going to give 100% i just stay home. got to master my mind right now its all over the place and some days i have it other days i dont. Dorian said he had a great workout every time, i cannot say the same nor do i have a clear understanding what the difference between us is.
im also still using and it brings me shame and i suffer immensely but still its impossible to quit. i dont know where to find the strength to quit.
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strength and muscle go hand in hand is my understanding. how is this wrong? if i want to get bigger i need to get stronger, more or less. isnt this how muscle is built?
yes and no, especially bar specific strength, technique and leverages matter a lot pulling that's not so much strength related. look at someone like richard hawthorne or even steph cohen, you wouldnt call them stronger than you right? but they can smoke your deadlift
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yes and no, especially bar specific strength, technique and leverages matter a lot pulling that's not so much strength related. look at someone like richard hawthorne or even steph cohen, you wouldnt call them stronger than you right? but they can smoke your deadlift
True.
Strength has a lot to do with leverage and technique. I know guys who don't look like they even lift that can deadlift 500 pounds easily.
I've seen 5'3" 155 pound power lifters pull 700, they are short and compact, with proper training deadlifts are easy for them. I've seen 6'+ 250+ pound guys struggle to deadlift 400 pounds, mainly due to having long legs.
Without going into a huge wall of text, training for strength in the 1RM is completely different than trying to gain muscle mass, but yes they both go hand in hand to a certain extent. At my biggest, i could deadlift 585 for 2-3 reps on a good day. At my strongest i could do a double with 660. When i was into power lifting, my legs and chest were not nearly as big as when i was bodybuilding. It was amazing to see how my body changed over a 2-3 year period when i switched from bodybuilding to power lifting. I still looked generally the same, but my arms, legs and chest actually got smaller, however my strength was on another level.
The first thing i was taught when i got into power lifting seriously was that if you want a big deadlift, you need to have a big squat. I had to learn how to sit back on my heels, drive with my legs and hips, rather than just trying to lift it with my back. You learn to be like a piston in an engine, not just a big dude trying to yank a weight off the floor.
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Recently i pulled 455x4 last night i tried for 495 and it wouldnt budge. I couldnt get it moving at all. Is this mental? I know im strong enough past results show it. What gives? Any ideas?
Your nervous system was shot.
Try again in a month.
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Ego lifting will destroy your body. Almost all power lifters i know are completely fucked by 50 years old. Back, shoulders, hips, neck, elbows, knees etc.
I used to deadlift over 700 pounds, not worth it at all IMO.
It's worth it just for the exhilarating feeling from pulling a new PR, nothing better :D
I'm 43, been pulling hard since 15 years of age. Back is fine, lots of other problems though. One of my training partners is 55, once won the deadlift event at IPF Worlds. His body is a mess with arthritis everywhere, hips, shoulders, ankles and so on, but curiously back is fine despite extreme deadlift training for 35 years, sometimes hard deadlifts 3-4 times per week.
A while back I looked at my journals and saw that I'd been pulling at least 300kg/660lbs (up to raw conventional 770 PR) from the floor weekly for 12-13 years straight lol
I don't recommend it but I just love deads. I'd finally like to pull 800lbs raw conventional. I think it's possible even being as old as I am, might have to gain 20lbs of extra fluff though :D
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You could always do 225 for 100 reps
:o
;D
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my gym is shut down till at least next year. back to cinderblocks, i guess .... >:(
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It's worth it just for the exhilarating feeling from pulling a new PR, nothing better :D
I'm 43, been pulling hard since 15 years of age. Back is fine, lots of other problems though. One of my training partners is 55, once won the deadlift event at IPF Worlds. His body is a mess with arthritis everywhere, hips, shoulders, ankles and so on, but curiously back is fine despite extreme deadlift training for 35 years, sometimes hard deadlifts 3-4 times per week.
A while back I looked at my journals and saw that I'd been pulling at least 300kg/660lbs (up to raw conventional 770 PR) from the floor weekly for 12-13 years straight lol
I don't recommend it but I just love deads. I'd finally like to pull 800lbs raw conventional. I think it's possible even being as old as I am, might have to gain 20lbs of extra fluff though :D
43 is not old im 40 and have no health or physical issues except for occasional tennis elbow
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Try harder.
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43 is not old im 40 and have no health or physical issues except for occasional tennis elbow
I know strength can still be increased, though many feel that is over the hill and have already "given up" at that age, given up in the sense that they think they can't be hitting PRs anymore. :D So they just maintain as best they can.
Another friend of mine hit his first 300kg/660lbs deadlift at 56 years of age after a lifetime of juice and training. Pretty nuts if you ask me.
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I know strength can still be increased, though many feel that is over the hill and have already "given up" at that age, given up in the sense that they think they can't be hitting PRs anymore. :D So they just maintain as best they can.
Another friend of mine hit his first 300kg/660lbs deadlift at 56 years of age after a lifetime of juice and training. Pretty nuts if you ask me.
Yeah I think a lot just give up the drive after a certain age... We've seen that high level strength can still be possible up to 50 imo...
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It's worth it just for the exhilarating feeling from pulling a new PR, nothing better :D
I'm 43, been pulling hard since 15 years of age. Back is fine, lots of other problems though. One of my training partners is 55, once won the deadlift event at IPF Worlds. His body is a mess with arthritis everywhere, hips, shoulders, ankles and so on, but curiously back is fine despite extreme deadlift training for 35 years, sometimes hard deadlifts 3-4 times per week.
A while back I looked at my journals and saw that I'd been pulling at least 300kg/660lbs (up to raw conventional 770 PR) from the floor weekly for 12-13 years straight lol
I don't recommend it but I just love deads. I'd finally like to pull 800lbs raw conventional. I think it's possible even being as old as I am, might have to gain 20lbs of extra fluff though :D
Oh for sure! Deadlifts were my favorite exercise for years. I was always into the Jon Pall Sig saying "there is no reason to be alive, if you can't do deadlift". :D
I'm only a year older than you and my back is wrecked. Maybe it's due to a different factor, i think we all handle things based on our structure. I don't have a big bone structure like some guys do, i've always been a little injury prone.
At my strongest, i pulled 735 @ 258 pounds with nothing but chalk on my hands. It was quite a rush, i still remember seeing stars and almost blacking out afterwards. ;)
My best competition lift was 710 @ 242.
Good luck with 800.