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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Coach is Back! on December 07, 2023, 09:00:49 AM
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Jamaal Bowman latest Democrat to be censured following false fire alarm incident
For all intents and purposes he should be in jail along with Talib
Rep. Jamaal Bowman (D-NY) became the latest Democratic lawmaker to be censured by the House, this one over accusations the Squad member intentionally disrupted congressional proceedings by pulling a fire alarm earlier this year.
Lawmakers voted 214-191 to censure Bowman on Thursday, making him the third Democrat this year to be publicly condemned by the House. The resolution passed along party lines, with only three Democrats voting to censure Bowman: Reps. Jahana Hayes (D-CT), Chris Pappas (D-NH), and Marie Gluesenkamp Perez (D-WA).
Another four Democrats voted "present" on the measure: Reps. Susan Wild (D-PA), Glenn Ivey (D-MD), Deborah Ross (D-NC), and Chrissy Houlahan (D-PA), who are all on the Ethics Committee. One Republican voted "present": Rep. Andy Harris (R-MD).
Shortly after the vote concluded, Bowman was directed to stand at the front of the House floor while Speaker Mike Johnson (R-LA) read aloud the charges against him. Aside from the public rebuke, no other disciplinary action is attached to the measure.
The censure is designed to punish Bowman for falsely pulling a fire alarm in a congressional office building on Sept. 30. Caught on security footage, Bowman claimed he yanked the alarm out of "confusion" when a door wouldn't open in his rush to get to the House floor to vote.
Bowman was charged criminally and reached a plea deal, agreeing to pay a $1,000 fine, write an apology letter to the Capitol Police, and serve three months of probation.
“This is a felony, plain and simple,” said Rep. Lisa McClain (R-MI), who introduced the resolution. “It’s not difficult to understand. Capitol Police was forced to waste resources investigating rather than doing their job to keep the Capitol safe … Realizing no number of excuses could get him out of this, Mr. Bowman pled guilty.”
Bowman pushed back against the effort to censure him over the incident, denouncing the resolution as a distraction from "governing the American people."
In no way did I obstruct official proceedings. The vote took place, and Democrats avoided a government shutdown,” Bowman said. “This is an insult to the people I was elected to represent. Instead of passing meaningful legislation, some Republicans are using this to waste our time and money and to make you forget about all of the rights they want to destroy."
Other Democrats decried the effort as well, accusing House Republicans of seeking to weaponize the historically rare form of punishment to undermine the credibility of the opposite party.
Censure resolutions have not been used frequently over the course of history, with only five members being censured in the last 40 years. Three of those have been in this year alone after the censures of Bowman as well as Reps. Adam Schiff (D-CA) and Rashida Tlaib (D-MI) earlier this year.
The three resolutions mark the most censures to happen in the course of a year since 1870, when three other lawmakers were censured for selling military academy appointments.
Bowman's conduct was previously referred to the nonpartisan Ethics Committee, which decided last month not to open an investigation into the matter.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/jamaal-bowman-censured-over-false-fire-alarm-incident
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He may be correct, his pulling the alarm did nothing.. But.. the fact he couldn't navigate a hallway without pulling a fire alarm (taking him at his word) indicates to me that he is not ready for the job of governing America which is far more complex. I'm 61 and never came close to pulling a fire alarm out of confusion.. and I don't feel qualified to be in congress
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Jamaal Bowman latest Democrat to be censured following false fire alarm incident
For all intents and purposes he should be in jail along with Talib
Rep. Jamaal Bowman (D-NY) became the latest Democratic lawmaker to be censured by the House, this one over accusations the Squad member intentionally disrupted congressional proceedings by pulling a fire alarm earlier this year.
Lawmakers voted 214-191 to censure Bowman on Thursday, making him the third Democrat this year to be publicly condemned by the House. The resolution passed along party lines, with only three Democrats voting to censure Bowman: Reps. Jahana Hayes (D-CT), Chris Pappas (D-NH), and Marie Gluesenkamp Perez (D-WA).
Another four Democrats voted "present" on the measure: Reps. Susan Wild (D-PA), Glenn Ivey (D-MD), Deborah Ross (D-NC), and Chrissy Houlahan (D-PA), who are all on the Ethics Committee. One Republican voted "present": Rep. Andy Harris (R-MD).
Shortly after the vote concluded, Bowman was directed to stand at the front of the House floor while Speaker Mike Johnson (R-LA) read aloud the charges against him. Aside from the public rebuke, no other disciplinary action is attached to the measure.
The censure is designed to punish Bowman for falsely pulling a fire alarm in a congressional office building on Sept. 30. Caught on security footage, Bowman claimed he yanked the alarm out of "confusion" when a door wouldn't open in his rush to get to the House floor to vote.
Bowman was charged criminally and reached a plea deal, agreeing to pay a $1,000 fine, write an apology letter to the Capitol Police, and serve three months of probation.
“This is a felony, plain and simple,” said Rep. Lisa McClain (R-MI), who introduced the resolution. “It’s not difficult to understand. Capitol Police was forced to waste resources investigating rather than doing their job to keep the Capitol safe … Realizing no number of excuses could get him out of this, Mr. Bowman pled guilty.”
Bowman pushed back against the effort to censure him over the incident, denouncing the resolution as a distraction from "governing the American people."
In no way did I obstruct official proceedings. The vote took place, and Democrats avoided a government shutdown,” Bowman said. “This is an insult to the people I was elected to represent. Instead of passing meaningful legislation, some Republicans are using this to waste our time and money and to make you forget about all of the rights they want to destroy."
Other Democrats decried the effort as well, accusing House Republicans of seeking to weaponize the historically rare form of punishment to undermine the credibility of the opposite party.
Censure resolutions have not been used frequently over the course of history, with only five members being censured in the last 40 years. Three of those have been in this year alone after the censures of Bowman as well as Reps. Adam Schiff (D-CA) and Rashida Tlaib (D-MI) earlier this year.
The three resolutions mark the most censures to happen in the course of a year since 1870, when three other lawmakers were censured for selling military academy appointments.
Bowman's conduct was previously referred to the nonpartisan Ethics Committee, which decided last month not to open an investigation into the matter.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/jamaal-bowman-censured-over-false-fire-alarm-incident
NICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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He may be correct, his pulling the alarm did nothing.. But.. the fact he couldn't navigate a hallway without pulling a fire alarm (taking him at his word) indicates to me that he is not ready for the job of governing America which is far more complex. I'm 61 and never came close to pulling a fire alarm out of confusion.. and I don't feel qualified to be in congress
LOL! Jamaal Bowman's lame excuse does more harm than simply telling the truth would have. His lying or being that stupid raises the level of distrust people have in all elected officials. Never has it been so obvious to me how inept and ill-behaved some members of congress are. And it is not just Congress. Last spring, Republicans in the Oregon Senate ended a six-week walkout following reaching a deal on bills relating to abortion and guns. This is the latest in a series of legislative walkouts that the Republican party staged in recent years. Essentially, they walked off the job. In the private sector this action would get employees fired. Nine of folks who abandoned their responsibility were fined $325 for their unexcused absences beginning on June 5, 2023. The fines were likely waved as part of the 'deal.'
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LOL! Jamaal Bowman's lame excuse does more harm than simply telling the truth would have. His lying or being that stupid raises the level of distrust people have in all elected officials. Never has it been so obvious to me how inept and ill-behaved some members of congress are. And it is not just Congress. Last spring, Republicans in the Oregon Senate ended a six-week walkout following reaching a deal on bills relating to abortion and guns. This is the latest in a series of legislative walkouts that the Republican party staged in recent years. Essentially, they walked off the job. In the private sector this action would get employees fired. Nine of folks who abandoned their responsibility were fined $325 for their unexcused absences beginning on June 5, 2023. The fines were likely waved as part of the 'deal.'
Agree. His excuse basically says "I was unable to navigate a hallway without violating at least 1 ordinance and perhaps a few others"
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LOL! Jamaal Bowman's lame excuse does more harm than simply telling the truth would have. His lying or being that stupid raises the level of distrust people have in all elected officials. Never has it been so obvious to me how inept and ill-behaved some members of congress are. And it is not just Congress. Last spring, Republicans in the Oregon Senate ended a six-week walkout following reaching a deal on bills relating to abortion and guns. This is the latest in a series of legislative walkouts that the Republican party staged in recent years. Essentially, they walked off the job. In the private sector this action would get employees fired. Nine of folks who abandoned their responsibility were fined $325 for their unexcused absences beginning on June 5, 2023. The fines were likely waved as part of the 'deal.'
You’re using that as a comparison? 🤦♂️
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Agree. His excuse basically says "I was unable to navigate a hallway without violating at least 1 ordinance and perhaps a few others"
Good one, that actually made me chuckle.
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You’re using that as a comparison? 🤦♂️
It's a close to agreement as you're going to get. He just needed to take a dig at the R's to offset it.
Either way, both "sides" are being logical and rational here.
We need more agreement in calling out bullshit when it's just that - bullshit.
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Jamaal Bowman latest Democrat to be censured following false fire alarm incident
For all intents and purposes he should be in jail along with Talib
Rep. Jamaal Bowman (D-NY) became the latest Democratic lawmaker to be censured by the House, this one over accusations the Squad member intentionally disrupted congressional proceedings by pulling a fire alarm earlier this year.
Lawmakers voted 214-191 to censure Bowman on Thursday, making him the third Democrat this year to be publicly condemned by the House. The resolution passed along party lines, with only three Democrats voting to censure Bowman: Reps. Jahana Hayes (D-CT), Chris Pappas (D-NH), and Marie Gluesenkamp Perez (D-WA).
Another four Democrats voted "present" on the measure: Reps. Susan Wild (D-PA), Glenn Ivey (D-MD), Deborah Ross (D-NC), and Chrissy Houlahan (D-PA), who are all on the Ethics Committee. One Republican voted "present": Rep. Andy Harris (R-MD).
Shortly after the vote concluded, Bowman was directed to stand at the front of the House floor while Speaker Mike Johnson (R-LA) read aloud the charges against him. Aside from the public rebuke, no other disciplinary action is attached to the measure.
The censure is designed to punish Bowman for falsely pulling a fire alarm in a congressional office building on Sept. 30. Caught on security footage, Bowman claimed he yanked the alarm out of "confusion" when a door wouldn't open in his rush to get to the House floor to vote.
Bowman was charged criminally and reached a plea deal, agreeing to pay a $1,000 fine, write an apology letter to the Capitol Police, and serve three months of probation.
“This is a felony, plain and simple,” said Rep. Lisa McClain (R-MI), who introduced the resolution. “It’s not difficult to understand. Capitol Police was forced to waste resources investigating rather than doing their job to keep the Capitol safe … Realizing no number of excuses could get him out of this, Mr. Bowman pled guilty.”
Bowman pushed back against the effort to censure him over the incident, denouncing the resolution as a distraction from "governing the American people."
In no way did I obstruct official proceedings. The vote took place, and Democrats avoided a government shutdown,” Bowman said. “This is an insult to the people I was elected to represent. Instead of passing meaningful legislation, some Republicans are using this to waste our time and money and to make you forget about all of the rights they want to destroy."
Other Democrats decried the effort as well, accusing House Republicans of seeking to weaponize the historically rare form of punishment to undermine the credibility of the opposite party.
Censure resolutions have not been used frequently over the course of history, with only five members being censured in the last 40 years. Three of those have been in this year alone after the censures of Bowman as well as Reps. Adam Schiff (D-CA) and Rashida Tlaib (D-MI) earlier this year.
The three resolutions mark the most censures to happen in the course of a year since 1870, when three other lawmakers were censured for selling military academy appointments.
Bowman's conduct was previously referred to the nonpartisan Ethics Committee, which decided last month not to open an investigation into the matter.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/jamaal-bowman-censured-over-false-fire-alarm-incident
Please explain Coach as to how pulling a fire alarm amounts to an Insurrection??? You've been off the deep end lately
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You’re using that as a comparison? 🤦♂️
No, it was not a comparison. Both situations are examples of elected officials acting inappropriately.
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Please explain Coach as to how pulling a fire alarm amounts to an Insurrection??? You've been off the deep end lately
Going off the deep end would mean I couldn’t back anything I post. I have and do. But I digress.
That’s the point, Vince. It’s no more of an “insurrection” than January 6 and Rashida Talib leading 300 + Palestinians plus thousands more outside. I would argue that what she led in was worse than the fake January 6 narrative except without who she led in and were outside protesting weren’t tracked down across the country by Garlands Brownshirts and taken like political prisoners
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Going off the deep end would mean I couldn’t back anything I post. I have and do. But I digress.
That’s the point, Vince. It’s no more of an “insurrection” than January 6 and Rashida Talib leading 300 + Palestinians plus thousands more outside. I would argue that what she led in was worse than the fake January 6 narrative except without who she led in and were outside protesting weren’t tracked down across the country by Garlands Brownshirts and taken like political prisoners
An insurrection is a violent uprising against an authority or government which is what happenned on Jan 6th when they raided the Capitol Building to stop the certification of the votes. What Rashida Talib did was called a protest, something that's part of the 1st Amendment that you are allowed to do. Pulling a fire alarm...is just pulling a fire alarm
Stop being a fucking lemming, Coach. You know the difference
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An insurrection is a violent uprising against an authority or government which is what happenned on Jan 6th when they raided the Capitol Building to stop the certification of the votes. What Rashida Talib did was called a protest, something that's part of the 1st Amendment that you are allowed to do. Pulling a fire alarm...is just pulling a fire alarm
Stop being a fucking lemming, Coach. You know the difference
Was the BLM activity a protest or riot?
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Was the BLM activity a protest or riot?
You'll have to be specific but all i saw was just protests. The riots were committed by Antifa who used a lot of their protests as cover to destroy property spraying Black Lives Matter everywhere.
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You'll have to be specific but all i saw was just protests. The riots were committed by Antifa who used a lot of their protests as cover to destroy property spraying Black Lives Matter everywhere.
Burning of police stations, shooting of security guard, etc.
All antifa? All BLM innocent with no property damage?
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Burning of police stations, shooting of security guard, etc.
All antifa? All BLM innocent with no property damage?
A few coco's destroying shit doesn't speak for the organization no different then saying that all Trump supporters went and destroyed the Capitol Building
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A few coco's destroying shit doesn't speak for the organization no different then saying that all Trump supporters went and destroyed the Capitol Building
Legit question - did BLM make official statements that Antifa was utilizing their gatherings as cover and giving them a bad name?
Could have been like "outside a few of our cocos destroying shit, most of the damage was done by antifa mixing in with our fiery but mostly peaceful protests. Please do not let this reflect poorly on our organizations. Now excuse, me I have to take $6M of your donation money and close on my new house, followed by not giving an money to help actual black folks who need it".
I have not seen anything.
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Legit question - did BLM make official statements that Antifa was utilizing their gatherings as cover and giving them a bad name?
Could have been like "outside a few of our cocos destroying shit, most of the damage was done by antifa mixing in with our fiery but mostly peaceful protests. Please do not let this reflect poorly on our organizations. Now excuse, me I have to take $6M of your donation money and close on my new house, followed by not giving an money to help actual black folks who need it".
I have not seen anything.
They did make statements and beat up some of them at the protest. But honestly I don't give a shit what BLM does.
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You'll have to be specific but all i saw was just protests. The riots were committed by Antifa who used a lot of their protests as cover to destroy property spraying Black Lives Matter everywhere.
Vince, I was in DC two days after the 2020 “riots” not far from the Capital were boarded up and some burned businesses and buildings. I’m sure Antifa was apart of it but “BLM” was tagged all over the city. This is disgusting in our Nations Capital since they literally and proudly call themselves Marxists…..
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Vince, I was in DC two days after the 2020 “riots” not far from the Capital were boarded up and some burned businesses and buildings. I’m sure Antifa was apart of it but “BLM” was tagged all over the city. This is disgusting in our Nations Capital since they literally and proudly call themselves Marxists…..
That's right. Antifa was tagging a bunch of places with BLM using the organization as cover for their activities. There are practically no black people in Antifa.
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An insurrection is a violent uprising against an authority or government which is what happenned on Jan 6th when they raided the Capitol Building to stop the certification of the votes. What Rashida Talib did was called a protest, something that's part of the 1st Amendment that you are allowed to do. Pulling a fire alarm...is just pulling a fire alarm
Stop being a fucking lemming, Coach. You know the difference
If January 6 was an insurrection, then why have none of the more than 1,000 who have been prosecuted been charged with insurrection?
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If January 6 was an insurrection, then why have none of the more than 1,000 who have been prosecuted been charged with insurrection?
The charge would be seditious conspiracy or sedition. Only the Proud Boys have been convicted of that charge. A lot of them have been charged with domestic terrorism. Proving sedition is almost impossible to do without hard evidence and if the Feds didn't flip one of the Proud Boys, they would have got off scott free
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The charge would be seditious conspiracy or sedition. Only the Proud Boys have been convicted of that charge. A lot of them have been charged with domestic terrorism. Proving sedition is almost impossible to do without hard evidence and if the Feds didn't flip one of the Proud Boys, they would have got off scott free
The charge would be insurrection: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2383
If this was an insurrection, people would have been charged with insurrection.
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The charge would be insurrection: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2383
If this was an insurrection, people would have been charged with insurrection.
Sedition is a much more serious charge than insurrection according to that link you gave. But I'm not a prosecutor so hell if I know but they wouldn't charge something that they couldn't get a conviction on
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Sedition is a much more serious charge than insurrection according to that link you gave. But I'm not a prosecutor so hell if I know
I don't know which one is more serious, but that's not really the point. People manipulate words and language to make political points. This is one of those instances. Democrats call January 6 an insurrection. It wasn't an insurrection, but calling it one makes it sound much worse.
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I don't know which one is more serious, but that's not really the point. People manipulate words and language to make political points. This is one of those instances. Democrats call January 6 an insurrection. It wasn't an insurrection, but calling it one makes it sound much worse.
This is what started the whole thing
It started out as just a regular Trump Rally which is why most people were there to begin with. People obviously had different reasons to be there. Some were actually trying to overthrow the government, some wanted to destroy things, a few were actual Russian spies.
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This is what started the whole thing
It started out as just a regular Trump Rally which is why most people were there to begin with. People obviously had different reasons to be there. Some were actually trying to overthrow the government, some wanted to destroy things, a few were actual Russian spies.
Nobody was there to overthrow the government. They didn't have the weapons, means, or opportunity to overthrow the U.S. government and its military. This was nothing more than a number of people trespassing and disrupting a public proceedings, some with the help of people working on the grounds. But we have politicians (including our president) saying it was worse than 9/11.
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Nobody was there to overthrow the government. They didn't have the weapons, means, or opportunity to overthrow the U.S. government and its military. This was nothing more than a number of people trespassing and disrupting a public proceedings, some with the help of people working on the grounds. But we have politicians (including our president) saying it was worse than 9/11.
Plenty of people were there to overthrow it and a lot of them were armed. I'm just glad no-one got gunned down...well except that woman but she earned that high 5
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If January 6 was an insurrection, then why have none of the more than 1,000 who have been prosecuted been charged with insurrection?
Just a thought, but maybe it is because an insurrection is the sum of its parts.
Josh Blackman, professor of constitutional law at South Texas College of Law, says the crime of insurrection is very hard to prove. Federal prosecutors must prove these folks went to the Capitol building with the intent of overthrowing the government. This may have been the intent of some folks who participated in the January 6th 'whatever you want to call it,' but it is unlikely it was everyone's. My guess is many people who stormed the capital simply intended to disrupt the official count of electoral votes. Many more were just along for the ride or there 'to party', as it were, i.e. Jacob Chansley, sometimes referred to as the QAnon Shaman.
What rises to the level of an insurrection is wide ranging and debatable. According to a PBS lesson plan, events which historically rose to the level of an insurrection in the U.S. are, Shays’ Rebellion, January 1786, The Memphis and New Orleans Riots of 1866, Wilmington Coup D’état of 1898, Ocoee Riot, November 3, 1920, Protests at UC Berkeley, Free Speech Movement 1965. Some other examples of events that may be considered insurrections are the New York Draft Riots of 1863. Which may be the most violent insurrection in American history. This event continued over the course of four days.
Sometimes these events are called rebellions. Perhaps, it would be more accurate to label the event at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th a rebellion which according to Websters definition is: an open, armed, and usually unsuccessful defiance of or resistance to an established government. B.: an instance of such defiance or resistance. The event on January 6th, 2021, was an attempt to overturn his November 2020 election, which to my mind is not the same thing as overthrowing the government.
The bottom line is that the Department of Justice most likely charges folks with crimes that have a good chance of being proved. Many constitutional 'legal eagles' maintain convicting someone of being an insurrectionist is difficult. The hundreds of folks who have been charged and convicted in connection with the events of January 6, 2021, are probably lucky they weren’t additionally charged with insurrection. On the other hand, whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States of laws thereof, or gives aid and comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than ten years, or both, and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)
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Plenty of people were there to overthrow it and a lot of them were armed. I'm just glad no-one got gunned down...well except that woman but she earned that high 5
I'm unaware of anyone being charged with the use of a weapon to try and overthrow the government. Take a step back and think about this. A handful of people armed with things like hockey sticks (true story) showed up on January 6 to try and takeover the federal government and its military. You don't believe that.
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Just a thought, but maybe it is because an insurrection is the sum of its parts.
Josh Blackman, professor of constitutional law at South Texas College of Law, says the crime of insurrection is very hard to prove. Federal prosecutors must prove these folks went to the Capitol building with the intent of overthrowing the government. This may have been the intent of some folks who participated in the January 6th 'whatever you want to call it,' but it is unlikely it was everyone's. My guess is many people who stormed the capital simply intended to disrupt the official count of electoral votes. Many more were just along for the ride or there 'to party', as it were, i.e. Jacob Chansley, sometimes referred to as the QAnon Shaman.
What rises to the level of an insurrection is wide ranging and debatable. According to a PBS lesson plan, events which historically rose to the level of an insurrection in the U.S. are, Shays’ Rebellion, January 1786, The Memphis and New Orleans Riots of 1866, Wilmington Coup D’état of 1898, Ocoee Riot, November 3, 1920, Protests at UC Berkeley, Free Speech Movement 1965. Some other examples of events that may be considered insurrections are the New York Draft Riots of 1863. Which may be the most violent insurrection in American history. This event continued over the course of four days.
Sometimes these events are called rebellions. Perhaps, it would be more accurate to label the event at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th a rebellion which according to Websters definition is: an open, armed, and usually unsuccessful defiance of or resistance to an established government. B.: an instance of such defiance or resistance. The event on January 6th, 2021, was an attempt to overturn his November 2020 election, which to my mind is not the same thing as overthrowing the government.
The bottom line is that the Department of Justice most likely charges folks with crimes that have a good chance of being proved. Many constitutional 'legal eagles' maintain convicting someone of being an insurrectionist is difficult. The hundreds of folks who have been charged and convicted in connection with the events of January 6, 2021, are probably lucky they weren’t additionally charged with insurrection. On the other hand, whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States of laws thereof, or gives aid and comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than ten years, or both, and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)
It's much simpler than this. There was no insurrection. That's why no one was charged with insurrection.
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I'm unaware of anyone being charged with the use of a weapon to try and overthrow the government. Take a step back and think about this. A handful of people armed with things like hockey sticks (true story) showed up on January 6 to try and takeover the federal government and its military. You don't believe that.
They attacked Capitol Police and attempted to go out and kill Mike Pence and the other lawmakers. They had gallows set up. They also had pepper spray and there were people with guns. The weapons are beside the point but the intent.
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Just a thought, but maybe it is because an insurrection is the sum of its parts.
Josh Blackman, professor of constitutional law at South Texas College of Law, says the crime of insurrection is very hard to prove. Federal prosecutors must prove these folks went to the Capitol building with the intent of overthrowing the government. This may have been the intent of some folks who participated in the January 6th 'whatever you want to call it,' but it is unlikely it was everyone's. My guess is many people who stormed the capital simply intended to disrupt the official count of electoral votes. Many more were just along for the ride or there 'to party', as it were, i.e. Jacob Chansley, sometimes referred to as the QAnon Shaman.
What rises to the level of an insurrection is wide ranging and debatable. According to a PBS lesson plan, events which historically rose to the level of an insurrection in the U.S. are, Shays’ Rebellion, January 1786, The Memphis and New Orleans Riots of 1866, Wilmington Coup D’état of 1898, Ocoee Riot, November 3, 1920, Protests at UC Berkeley, Free Speech Movement 1965. Some other examples of events that may be considered insurrections are the New York Draft Riots of 1863. Which may be the most violent insurrection in American history. This event continued over the course of four days.
Sometimes these events are called rebellions. Perhaps, it would be more accurate to label the event at the U.S. Capitol on January 6th a rebellion which according to Websters definition is: an open, armed, and usually unsuccessful defiance of or resistance to an established government. B.: an instance of such defiance or resistance. The event on January 6th, 2021, was an attempt to overturn his November 2020 election, which to my mind is not the same thing as overthrowing the government.
The bottom line is that the Department of Justice most likely charges folks with crimes that have a good chance of being proved. Many constitutional 'legal eagles' maintain convicting someone of being an insurrectionist is difficult. The hundreds of folks who have been charged and convicted in connection with the events of January 6, 2021, are probably lucky they weren’t additionally charged with insurrection. On the other hand, whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States of laws thereof, or gives aid and comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than ten years, or both, and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
(June 25, 1948, ch. 645, 62 Stat. 808; Pub. L. 103–322, title XXXIII, § 330016(1)(L), Sept. 13, 1994, 108 Stat. 2147.)
Did you get the response you were hoping for?
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They attacked Capitol Police and attempted to go out and kill Mike Pence and the other lawmakers. They had gallows set up. They also had pepper spray and there were people with guns. The weapons are beside the point but the intent.
But... it doesn't matter. They won't ever see that.. you just have to trust me on this
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But... it doesn't matter. They won't ever see that.. you just have to trust me on this
It does , Only can you remind us all who was the only person shot & killed
that day & by whom were they shot. ?
or doesn't that matter to you ?
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They attacked Capitol Police and attempted to go out and kill Mike Pence and the other lawmakers. They had gallows set up. They also had pepper spray and there were people with guns. The weapons are beside the point but the intent.
No one was charged with trying to kill Mike Pence or other lawmakers.
So people with pepper spray were going to overthrow the federal government and our armed forces? Are you trolling? lol
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No one was charged with trying to kill Mike Pence or other lawmakers.
So people with pepper spray were going to overthrow the federal government and our armed forces? Are you trolling? lol
Do you think that what they did was not against the law and that those people did absolutely nothing wrong that day??? I'm not trolling, I'm being dead serious. The fact is that a lot of police officers were seriously injured that day and all because of the incident, protest, riot, insurrection or whatever you wish to call it.
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Do you think that what they did was not against the law and that those people did absolutely nothing wrong that day??? I'm not trolling, I'm being dead serious. The fact is that a lot of police officers were seriously injured that day and all because of the incident, protest, riot, insurrection or whatever you wish to call it.
Yes I think a number of people broke the law that day, including trespassing and interfering with a public proceeding. They should all be held accountable. What they did not do was engage in an insurrection.
Don't accept the narrative they have been peddling. No, a police officer was not bashed in the heed with a fire extinguisher. No, there were no police officers killed by any of the protesters. No, there was no one there who used a weapon to try and overthrow the government and our military.
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Yes I think a number of people broke the law that day, including trespassing and interfering with a public proceeding. They should all be held accountable. What they did not do was engage in an insurrection.
Don't accept the narrative they have been peddling. No, a police officer was not bashed in the heed with a fire extinguisher. No, there were no police officers killed by any of the protesters. No, there was no one there who used a weapon to try and overthrow the government and our military.
People have already plead guilty and convicted to hitting officers with not only a fire extinguisher but with bats, shovels, 2x4's, pepper spray etc. The definition of an insurrection is a violent uprising against an authority or government....Antifa and the Proud Boys do it on a regular basis, Palestinian supporters are now doing it...those are all insurrections. The whole argument in this thread was simply saying that pulling a fire alarm is NOT AN INSURRECTION. Would you not agree with me at least on that?
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People have already plead guilty and convicted to hitting officers with not only a fire extinguisher but with bats, shovels, 2x4's, pepper spray etc. The definition of an insurrection is a violent uprising against an authority or government....Antifa and the Proud Boys do it on a regular basis, Palestinian supporters are now doing it...those are all insurrections. The whole argument in this thread was simply saying that pulling a fire alarm is NOT AN INSURRECTION. Would you not agree with me at least on that?
Who pleaded guilty to hitting police officers with a fire extinguisher, etc.?
An insurrection isn't just a violent uprising; it is an attempt to overthrow and control a government.
I don't agree that Antifa and the Proud Boys should be mentioned in the same sentence. Not even close.
I do agree with you that pulling the fire alarm was not an insurrection. But Coach was using irony. He wasn't being literal. His point was that someone disrupting a public proceeding on January 6 was no more engaging in an insurrection than Bowman intentionally pulling the fire alarm, which disrupted a public proceeding.
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Who pleaded guilty to hitting police officers with a fire extinguisher, etc.?
An insurrection isn't just a violent uprising; it is an attempt to overthrow and control a government.
I don't agree that Antifa and the Proud Boys should be mentioned in the same sentence. Not even close.
I do agree with you that pulling the fire alarm was not an insurrection. But Coach was using irony. He wasn't being literal. His point was that someone disrupting a public proceeding on January 6 was no more engaging in an insurrection than Bowman intentionally pulling the fire alarm, which disrupted a public proceeding.
Go look up the cases. The definition of an insurrection is exactly as described in the Oxford dictionary.
Antifa and Proud Boys/Patriot Prayer are two different sides of the coin. I think some of the members of Antifa should have been charged with sedition....no different than Enrique Torres. They are 2 violent groups of people who go at each other on the street like the Crips and Bloods. All of them should be locked in the same cage so they can have at each other without endangering the lives of other people trying to get through the day in peace or having the roads blocked and their headlights busted out all because some black guy who was shot down by the police because he pointed a gun at them and was in commision of a crime
I fully believe in free speech and I know that a lot of those people on January 6th were caught up in the moment and as a lot of them have said in court, misled by Donald Trump in taking that action...although they are adult and should have known better
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Go look up the cases. The definition of an insurrection is exactly as described in the Oxford dictionary.
Antifa and Proud Boys/Patriot Prayer are two different sides of the coin. I think some of the members of Antifa should have been charged with sedition....no different than Enrique Torres. They are 2 violent groups of people who go at each other on the street like the Crips and Bloods. All of them should be locked in the same cage so they can have at each other without endangering the lives of other people trying to get through the day in peace or having the roads blocked and their headlights busted out all because some black guy who was shot down by the police because he pointed a gun at them and was in commision of a crime
I fully believe in free speech and I know that a lot of those people on January 6th were caught up in the moment and as a lot of them have said in court, misled by Donald Trump in taking that action...although they are adult and should have known better
I've looked at the cases and I don't recall seeing anyone pleading guilty to hitting a police officer with a fire extinguisher. You might be confusing this with the lie they told (and many continue to tell) that Officer Brian Sicknick was killed after being bashed in the head with a fire extinguisher. Never happened.
Antifa is a terrorist organization. They have assaulted people, attacked a federal courthouse in Oregon for like a month straight, used all sorts of weapons to attack law enforcement, etc. I'm unaware of the Proud Boys doing anything like that. But I confess I don't really follow them or precisely what they do.
Trump genuinely believes the election was stolen from him. If you believe in free speech, then you support his right to say that the election was stolen and to encourage people on January 6 to "peacefully and patriotically" protest. Those were his exact words.
But overall I think we agree that whomever broke the law on January 6 should be held accountable.
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I've looked at the cases and I don't recall seeing anyone pleading guilty to hitting a police officer with a fire extinguisher. You might be confusing this with the lie they told (and many continue to tell) that Officer Brian Sicknick was killed after being bashed in the head with a fire extinguisher. Never happened.
Antifa is a terrorist organization. They have assaulted people, attacked a federal courthouse in Oregon for like a month straight, used all sorts of weapons to attack law enforcement, etc. I'm unaware of the Proud Boys doing anything like that. But I confess I don't really follow them or precisely what they do.
Trump genuinely believes the election was stolen from him. If you believe in free speech, then you support his right to say that the election was stolen and to encourage people on January 6 to "peacefully and patriotically" protest. Those were his exact words.
But overall I think we agree that whomever broke the law on January 6 should be held accountable.
As president, Donald Trump failed and/or ignored the fact that a sitting presidents words has enormous influence over the actions of people and consequences. He can plead his case of a stolen election but he tells people things like falsely accuse multiple election workers of ballot stuffing as what happenned in Georgia where they literally had to run for their lives and sell their houses because of the death threat and people banging in their doors....and people believed him because he was the President Of The United States.
As a public servant, you have to give up some of your 1st Amendment rights for the good of the nation. If I go and tell a country to go fuck themselves, it means nothing. But if Trump does it, then he could start a war with the country. Hopefully the people in Iowa are smart enough to vote Nikki Haley
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As president, Donald Trump failed and/or ignored the fact that a sitting presidents words has enormous influence over the actions of people and consequences. He can plead his case of a stolen election but he tells people things like falsely accuse multiple election workers of ballot stuffing as what happenned in Georgia where they literally had to run for their lives and sell their houses because of the death threat and people banging in their doors....and people believed him because he was the President Of The United States.
As a public servant, you have to give up some of your 1st Amendment rights for the good of the nation. If I go and tell a country to go fuck themselves, it means nothing. But if Trump does it, then he could start a war with the country. Hopefully the people in Iowa are smart enough to vote Nikki Haley
::)
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Haley ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/iowa-poll-donald-trump-holds-overwhelming-lead-ron-desantis-edges-ahead-of-nikki-haley/ar-AA1ljIKi?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=8c66b2a0011a41108121a22136e00b12&ei=16
NO ONE can touch Mr. Trump this time around. MAGA
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As president, Donald Trump failed and/or ignored the fact that a sitting presidents words has enormous influence over the actions of people and consequences. He can plead his case of a stolen election but he tells people things like falsely accuse multiple election workers of ballot stuffing as what happenned in Georgia where they literally had to run for their lives and sell their houses because of the death threat and people banging in their doors....and people believed him because he was the President Of The United States.
As a public servant, you have to give up some of your 1st Amendment rights for the good of the nation. If I go and tell a country to go fuck themselves, it means nothing. But if Trump does it, then he could start a war with the country. Hopefully the people in Iowa are smart enough to vote Nikki Haley
Haley ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/iowa-poll-donald-trump-holds-overwhelming-lead-ron-desantis-edges-ahead-of-nikki-haley/ar-AA1ljIKi?ocid=msedgntp&pc=DCTS&cvid=8c66b2a0011a41108121a22136e00b12&ei=16
NO ONE can touch Mr. Trump this time around. MAGA
She doesn't have a snowball's chance of beating Trump.
You support this?
Nikki Haley proposes requiring social media users to verify their identities over ‘national security’ concerns
By Social Links forVictor Nava
Published Nov. 14, 2023
https://nypost.com/2023/11/14/news/nikki-haley-proposes-requiring-social-media-users-to-verify-their-identities/
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She doesn't have a snowball's chance of beating Trump.
You support this?
Nikki Haley proposes requiring social media users to verify their identities over ‘national security’ concerns
By Social Links forVictor Nava
Published Nov. 14, 2023
https://nypost.com/2023/11/14/news/nikki-haley-proposes-requiring-social-media-users-to-verify-their-identities/
Democrats are the biggest contributors to her campaign. Haley is paid for and Vince wants her as his leader.
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Plenty of people were there to overthrow it and a lot of them were armed. I'm just glad no-one got gunned down...well except that woman but she earned that high 5
LMFAO! ;D
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It's much simpler than this. There was no insurrection. That's why no one was charged with insurrection.
In your opinion. Not everyone shares this opinion, BTW.
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In your opinion. Not everyone shares this opinion, BTW.
It's a fact that none of the more than 1000 people who have been charged as a result of January 6 were charged with insurrection.
This insurrection stuff is just dumb. It's like calling a bunch of people who got in a fight murderers, when no one died and no one was charged with murder.