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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: HowieW on May 30, 2006, 06:17:35 PM
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I have a basic belief in one GOD that started the Universe eons ago. I can't accpet the basis for Christainity. Hmmm, a girl is pregnant but is still a virgin, becuase her child is really the sone of GOD.
This was done because this almighty GOD needed to do this to give mankind a shot at salvation???wtf?
That is kinda wacked , and to top it off anyone with any sense that would naturall question this tall tale, you have this fable of "doubting Thomas" that claims anyone who doesn't even doubt this tall tale for a second is more blessed than anyone who thinks it might not be true.
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It is an extraordinary story, but what story about the origin of life doesn't sound like science fiction? The "big bang" and evolution in general are wild too. Most religions have stories that can be considered a little fanciful.
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I agree 100% with Beach Bum's statement. Howie, wouldn't you at least agree that clinging to the idea of the "big bang" is no less subjective than the idea of a immaculate conception/virgin birth? It's my personal belief that the Bible is the most accurate historical account of our lives as we know it today. There's no documentation of a "big bang". Yet the Bible not only tells of an virgin birth in the New Testament, but it predicts such an event all throughout the old testament.
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I have a basic belief in one GOD that started the Universe eons ago. I can't accpet the basis for Christainity. Hmmm, a girl is pregnant but is still a virgin, becuase her child is really the sone of GOD.
This was done because this almighty GOD needed to do this to give mankind a shot at salvation???wtf?
That is kinda wacked , and to top it off anyone with any sense that would naturall question this tall tale, you have this fable of "doubting Thomas" that claims anyone who doesn't even doubt this tall tale for a second is more blessed than anyone who thinks it might not be true.
umm Howie i'm impressed that being a physicist you believe in God 8)
anyhow do you know your above ramble sounds like my dad...ie you sound like a muslim! :D
hey did you see the NASA video i posted? please do ..i want your opinion on it....
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8301005278479559011&q=nasa
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It is an extraordinary story, but what story about the origin of life doesn't sound like science fiction? The "big bang" and evolution in general are wild too. Most religions have stories that can be considered a little fanciful.
proof of the big bang
http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni/uni_101bbtest3.html
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proof of the big bang
http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni/uni_101bbtest3.html
Well . . . . . I read the article. Doesn't prove “cosmic microwave background radiation” resulted in a single cell creature.
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Well . . . . . I read the article. Doesn't prove “cosmic microwave background radiation” resulted in a single cell creature.
course it dosen't..but now we dont need god to get the universe started... ;)
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Well . . . . . I read the article. Doesn't prove “cosmic microwave background radiation” resulted in a single cell creature.
where did "cosmic microwave background radiation" come from again?
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where did "cosmic microwave background radiation" come from again?
I got 100000000000000000000000 00 to 1 odds it was God
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I got 100000000000000000000000 00 to 1 odds it was God
Schweeeet! ;D
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;D
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I got 100000000000000000000000 00 to 1 odds it was God
U seem to be hopping on both sides of the fence here, what exactly are ur beliefs?
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Just for the record I'm not an athiest. I believe God Exsist. I belive God is inside us and is there for us any time we need him/her. It's part of my confindence. I just don't believe organized religion. I don't believe in the literal text of the Bible (or koran or anything else a man wrote) in as much it was written by God. I believe it was written by men and with all their mistakes. (however there is plenty of good wisdom in some of these writtings)
To think that all those atoms, quantum particles, and molecules act on their own and form trillions of individual conciousnous with out God seems not likely to me. No matter how much science tries to explain everything about our exsistance their is still too many unexplained beautiful things that happen everyday that point to God.
I know one thing for sure: I don't have the answers.
I posted the above on another thread. I added the stuff in the ( )
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cool, thanks for the responce man 8)
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God does exist. He is your only path to heaven. I discovered this far too late in life but I am on the right path now. God was the only thing that stood between me and my alcohol addiction.
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where did "cosmic microwave background radiation" come from again?
yanno when any explosion happens it leaves a heat signature behind. The MBR is the heat signature left behind from the big bang..
and you can ditect it from EVERY direction.
recently (well i dont remember how recently) COBE..a NASA satellite picked up non uniform areas in the radiation...a non uniform big bang would make sence cause the universe is not uniform.
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God was the only thing that stood between me and my alcohol addiction.
Gods aparently a party poop :P
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background_radiation
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/bkg3k.html
well what do you know..i didn't think this would be on the web! :)
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From the first link:
"The cosmic microwave background is a prediction of the Big Bang. In the theory, the early universe was made up of a hot plasma of photons, electrons and baryons. The photons were constantly interacting with the plasma through Compton scattering. As the universe expanded, the cosmological redshift caused the plasma to cool until it became favorable for electrons to combine with hydrogen and helium nuclei and form atoms. . . ."
Okay, so in this theory, where does the "hot plasma of photons, electrons and baryons" in the "early universe" come from? :)
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God doesn't care about human suffering or anyone's prayers. Proof is everywhere.
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God doesn't care about human suffering or anyone's prayers. Proof is everywhere.
Why are you aware there is such a thing as "suffering?"
Is it because you realize that happiness and goodness are reality also?
DO you credit God w/happiness and goodness as well as suffering?
Also, how can you say that God doesn't care? Is your "proof" because suffering exists? That has nothing to do w/His caring or not.
Of course He cares about you. And He loves you Bast :)
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If God is all powerful AND he cared, then he would do something about people starving in the world, and wars etc.
Secondly if God even exists, who created God? Doesn't make logical sense.
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I have a basic belief in one GOD that started the Universe eons ago. I can't accpet the basis for Christainity. Hmmm, a girl is pregnant but is still a virgin, becuase her child is really the sone of GOD.
This was done because this almighty GOD needed to do this to give mankind a shot at salvation???wtf?
That is kinda wacked , and to top it off anyone with any sense that would naturall question this tall tale, you have this fable of "doubting Thomas" that claims anyone who doesn't even doubt this tall tale for a second is more blessed than anyone who thinks it might not be true.
Howie, For the most part i like your posts and laugh, but, I know your a school teacher and I'm assuming in a public school system. One of the main reasons I send my son to private school (Christian) is to not be indoctrinated with Liberal beliefs. As a teacher you should also study the very same questions you ask and not draw your own conclusions.
Start by reading "The Case for Christ" by Lee Stroble.
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Howie, For the most part i like your posts and laugh, but, I know your a school teacher and I'm assuming in a public school system. One of the main reasons I send my son to private school (Christian) is to not be indoctrinated with Liberal beliefs. As a teacher you should also study the very same questions you ask and not draw your own conclusions.
Start by reading "The Case for Christ" by Lee Stroble.
Or is it because you're afraid he'll think for himself if he hears "liberal beliefs"?
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Or is it because you're afraid he'll think for himself if he hears "liberal beliefs"?
That was spot on brother! ;D
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Or is it because you're afraid he'll think for himself if he hears "liberal beliefs"?
Liberal beliefs have nothing to do about belief in God. It's basic propaganda Bull shit conservatives use to keep seperation between liberals and conservatives. All liberals are trying to do is keep religion separated from state. Now sometimes that goes a little too far and too much energy is spent on it. Conservative platforms used to promote basic freedoms up to around 40 years ago when they started going after older southern voters buy promoting control. It's going a step further now by promoting the idea that if you are liberal you don't believe in GOD and therefore are attacking christianity every time they blow the whistle on conservative BS concerning this separation. That's really stupid. Church and state is a BAD mix. period. More have died or suffered as a result of it over the centuries. (50 million according to the "book of martyrs") And dumber conservatives (of course not the majority of conservatives) are buying into it like germans did in the 30's when it came to blaming Jews for all thier problems. And i do think what some liberals are going after borders on splitting hairs.
If anything, i want my children to question everything. I've raised them that way. Blind faith is dangerous. It can cuase much suffering. If you do not question authority it will by it's verfy nature manipulate and attemped to control you totally. Conservative and libelral ideology serves to balance our country.
If God is all powerful AND he cared, then he would do something about people starving in the world, and wars etc.
Secondly if God even exists, who created God? Doesn't make logical sense.
Bast that's such a Johnny style response (not intented ans an insult but more of a compliment). Read some of the other threads in this section. If our soul lives on to enternity, (if you don't believe that than this won't make any sense to you) than this visit on earth is but a quick video game and all the suffering we endure only serves to help our spirits grow. A analogy might might the "suffering" my poor teenage daughter goes through when i don't let her go out on a friday night with her freinds and stay out until 2 am. It might include making my son clean the rain gutters this summer all day on a saturday. Of course these things aren't as extreme as losing your wife or something but then again through failure and suffering we grow stronger spiritually.
Howie, For the most part i like your posts and laugh, but, I know your a school teacher and I'm assuming in a public school system. One of the main reasons I send my son to private school (Christian) is to not be indoctrinated with Liberal beliefs. As a teacher you should also study the very same questions you ask and not draw your own conclusions.
Start by reading "The Case for Christ" by Lee Stroble.
You make a good point Mr. Intense. I agree with you regarding a case for christ. Oddly, in 1982-83 i took a class in public high school. for some reason i can;t remember the name of the class, but just so you know it was a very liberal based school in California. Anyways we studied the orgins of every major religion. Class discussion was great as the vast majority were christians.
I would suggest to be careful not confuse "liberal beliefs" with inaccurate conservative rhetoric concernig the intentions of liberals when it comes to separation fo church and state.
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Good post Ozmo. I agree with most of what you say.
I have a problem with the way the political debate in this country has gone from agree/disagree to good vs. evil. Sean Hannity wrote a book a little while ago called "Deliver Us From Evil" and Ann Coulter wrote a book called "Treason," both talking about how evil liberals are. Way overboard IMO. I disagree with liberals on many issues, but the evil stuff is really unnecessary.
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I said the wrong thing. What I should have said instead of "Liberal beliefs" I shoud have said Liberal "Teachings".
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I said the wrong thing. What I should have said instead of "Liberal beliefs" I should have said Liberal "Teachings".
OK, I'm wondering what liberal teachings are you talking about specifically?
Also to....... working to create an objective non-bias curriculum that's politically correct.... is that a liberal teaching? Just wondering about other people's take on that including yours? Is that bad? Does it harm people? Of course there are other things that can be considered liberal teachings; what are some?
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From the first link:
before i answer your question..the MBR is direct evidence in proof of a theory..something we can measuresomething that comes from EVERY direction..and that could only happen (ONLY happen) if the MBR emission started when the universe ws very very young..ie at birth. now you ask where this plasma came from ..btw plasma is just a fancy word for = when its hot enough..the atoms break down into nutrons protons and electrons..and if it gets hotter..the protons and nutrons themselves break down into quarks..this mix is called plasma..NASA is testing plasma engines to send us into space as we speak...
"The cosmic microwave background is a prediction of the Big Bang. In the theory,
ok..i'll put it simply..
the uncertainity principle..cool..i found an article so i dont have to type
As a result, another tune that cosmologists like to hum is quantum theory. According to Heisenberg's uncertainty principle, one of the pillars of this paradoxical world, empty space can never be considered really empty; subatomic particles can flit in and out of existence on energy borrowed from energy fields. Crazy as it sounds, the effects of these quantum fluctuations have been observed in atoms, and similar fluctuations during the inflation are thought to have produced the seeds around which today's galaxies were formed.
Could the whole universe likewise be the result of a quantum fluctuation in some sort of primordial or eternal nothingness? Perhaps, as Dr. Turner put it, "Nothing is unstable."
http://www2.gol.com/users/coynerhm/before_the_big_bang_there_was__.htm <i didn't read the article..just picked out what i wanted from it>
you see the Heisenburgs uncertanity principle states that the more precisely you know the velocity (momentum) of a particle the less you know of its position and vice verca. How is this so? ok lets say a p[article moves from point A to B. Now when this particle is moving you try to observe it. Now to observe a particle a light particle (photon) must bounce off given particle and enter your eyes.
1) in the time the photon bounced off that particle and entered your eye the given particle has alreavy moved on to a different spot!!
2) the very act of viewing it..ie photon bouncing off..has changed its velocity and momentum also!!!
so the more you know where it is..the less you know how fast its moving.
ok given that..quantum mechanics now says that you one cannot know exactly the entropy of a given system (kinda) ie i cant sit here and say that a square cube of free space has energy exactly ZERO. thats not allowed by the uncertanity principle. Now what happens is ..in empty space ..virtual particles pop out of no where (a particle and an antiparticle) and then annihilate eachother (giving off gamma radiation). This satisfies the uncertanity principle..since the energy state (entopry) is not exactly zero because of the virtual particles..but the sum total is zero (particle + antiparticle = zero) (btw are virtual particle real? well we dectect black holes because of them..and we can detect the gamma radation given off by them when they annihilate eachother)
so now we have set it up that we r creating gama radiation out of nothing..and also..once in a bluee moon..once in eons..(like right outside of a black hole) one of these virtual particle fails to annihilate its twin and voila..they turn into real particles ( google CERN). The big bang..is one such quantum mechanical anomoly..
the above explaination is a simplification of a simplification.
http://www.hi.is/~hj/QuantumMechanics/quantum.html
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=+uncertainty+principle+quantum+mechanics
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Why are you aware there is such a thing as "suffering?"
God can make it so that we realize the presence of happiness without realizing suffering! after all..he IS god..no? :P
<Howie..feel free to correct the above explaination man..>
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My son is only 12 yrs old at the moment but I bet if a young girl shows up at my door, let's say 5 yrs from now pregnant & says it was my son that did it i'm betting he'll be saying it wasn't him ;).Does that count as a "divine' event? :D
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I dont believe that jesus was god/godlike. I can understand that some people believe in God, but it should remain a personal issue. They should keep that for themselves and not make it a political issue (like in america / a lot of muslim states).
Also, anybody who LITERALLY believes ANY book is dumb as ****.
Make up your own mind and don't let people (or a book) indoctrinate you, and don't try to do it to them ...
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God doesn't care about human suffering or anyone's prayers. Proof is everywhere.
this is what gets me
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It is an extraordinary story, but what story about the origin of life doesn't sound like science fiction? The "big bang" and evolution in general are wild too. Most religions have stories that can be considered a little fanciful.
Not so , the "big bang "theroy is based on emperical data from real astronomical data. For example, most of the stars and galaxies we observe have their light "red shifted" when we analyze the spectrum of it. This means the light wave is getting elongated and thus shifted to the red end of the visible light spectrum.
In all humilty I simply find that a lot of people don't fully understand how many popular scientific theories are proven and what the evidence means, etc.
Howard
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umm Howie i'm impressed that being a physicist you believe in God 8)
anyhow do you know your above ramble sounds like my dad...ie you sound like a muslim! :D
hey did you see the NASA video i posted? please do ..i want your opinion on it....
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8301005278479559011&q=nasa
To be a Muslim I would have to accept many other things on faith, like how Mahammed was teken up by GOD into heaven, etc. I don't buy that one either.
I watched afew minutes of the video, pretty neat and yes I am VERY interested in UFO's. However, many of the videos are tough to say as to what it is with 100% certainty. Many of the best may have been somebody seeing a top secret air craft before its' existance was known, like the Stealth in the 1980's and late 70's or B-2 Bomber , U-2 or SR 71 blackbird, etc
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Not so , the "big bang "theroy is based on emperical data from real astronomical data. For example, most of the stars and galaxies we observe have their light "red shifted" when we analyze the spectrum of it. This means the light wave is getting elongated and thus shifted to the red end of the visible light spectrum.
In all humilty I simply find that a lot of people don't fully understand how many popular scientific theories are proven and what the evidence means, etc.
Howard
A "big bang" isn't a wild theory, but a "big bang" that somehow produces a single cell creature that then multiplies into all of the life we have today sounds like . . . science fiction. :)
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Gods aparently a party poop :P
lol, ok sorry but that was funny.
Not trying to make fun of your battle