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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Religious Debates & Threads => Topic started by: Bast000 on June 08, 2006, 09:00:04 PM
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Is it true about Noah putting a male and female of every animal species on a boat? How many animals?
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I love how people believe this crap.
It would be scientifically impossible to have a ship where certain animals only live in sub-zero habitats and other animals that only survive in tropical regions. The ship would have to stretch around 20,000 miles to accomodate these animals. You would also need to include bacteria and diseases as these are living organisms.
The ship itself would be impossible to build,taking up at least an entire rain forest of trees for the wood.
hhahhahahahah People are still stupid enough to believe in this stuff. I hate Christians.
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I saw a story on some news magazine within the last year. There is some guy (a carpenter) who has built a reproduction of the arc. They interviewed him and his wife... tried to find in the internet… but no luck.
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Is it true about Noah putting a male and female of every animal species on a boat? How many animals?
Lets see, you multiple the number of years, divided by the number of days it rained, X the number of people who believe in Noah's Ark was real = seeing the Lochness Monster...... ::)
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Is it true about Noah putting a male and female of every animal species on a boat? How many animals?
I found this article. Gives a decent answer in my opinion.
How Could Noah and His Family Care for the Many Animals on Board the Ark?
by John Morris, Ph.D.
Abstract
Cooped up for months, pitching and rolling with the Ark, surrounded by the noise of the storm and the presence of other animals (Genesis 7:21-22). How would they cope?
Detractors from the Bible story of the Flood have scoffed at the idea of just a few people carrying out all the duties of animal care for a year. Without a doubt, it would have been a daunting task considering the number of animals and the frightening circumstances, but would it have been impossible?
Earlier studies have shown that the total number of animals in question are less than the millions the detractors envision. Noah was told to take two of each "kind" of animal on board, probably represented by today's "families" or "genera" rather than species. For instance, the dog "kind" includes many species—wolf, domestic dog, dingo, coyote, etc. Furthermore, most animal types are small, only a few dozen are large, making the average size something on the order of a cat. (John Woodmorappe's excellent book, Noah's Ark: A Feasibility Study, looks into this issue in depth.) The great majority of today's animals live in the sea and did not need to be on board.
But how about those inside? Cooped up for months, pitching and rolling with the Ark, surrounded by the noise of the storm and the presence of other animals (Genesis 7:21-22). How would they cope? And what about the meat-eaters?
It's well known that all animals can survive on a meatless diet. Care must be taken to satisfy their nutritional needs, but it is possible. Some carnivores even choose a vegetarian lifestyle. Other animal studies have noted that some animals, such as the bear, hibernate to survive times of undue stress. Many other animals (and perhaps nearly all) are able to enter into a
period of relative dormancy or estivation when faced with a danger they cannot overcome and from which they cannot flee. In such a state they require minimal food and exercise, and excrete little. In such a state, aggressive tendencies are ignored. The presence of a common, overwhelming predicament eliminates former predator/prey relationships.
Scripture actually hints at such a situation. Noah was told to build an Ark equipped with "rooms" for the animals. (Genesis 6:14). But the Hebrew word used is everywhere else rendered "nests," as in (Deuteronomy 32:11) where it applies to birds, but it's also applied to a place of rest and safety for humans too (Job 29:18). Is this an indication that the animals were to merely snuggle up and wait until the danger was over?
There is no way of knowing, of course, because this was a unique event, not repeatable nor testable in the present and the only One who knows didn't give us all the details. But wouldn't it be just like Noah's gracious God to make the job easier for him?
One final thought. The origin of this mysterious hibernation ability has no ready explanation in science. Might we not suppose that the loving Creator endowed animals onboard the Ark with this survival mechanism? There was probably no need for such an ability before the Flood. All animals today are descended from those on the Ark and all have inherited it. Since science has no better explanation for its origin, this supposition, which fits all the facts, should be given due consideration.
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where is noah when you need em? a species goes extinct every week on this planet
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didn't happen, nuff said
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My resources tell me there were 666 animals ;D
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My resources tell me there were 666 animals ;D
LOL
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(John Woodmorappe's excellent book, Noah's Ark: A Feasibility Study, looks into this issue in depth.)
HAHAHAHA.
Somebody is wasting his time writing a book about that?
Damn, i gotto buy that, should be a good laugh.
I've found a better explanation:
God shrunk all animals till they were the size of fleas. Then they could live in Noah's ears while singing christian-rock music, to entertain Noah. And they can live off his ear-excrements.
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If they took DNA samples of all animals they could have held it in the ark...lol
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I doubt even the Pope himself believes in that part of the Bible, hehe.
Pretty neat bedtime story though.
YIP
Zack
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I haven't done any reading on this in a while, but from my recollection there is plenty of evidence of a worldwide flood (not the "Ice Age" thing either).
Also, isn't there some evidence of the Ark in Turkey? Seem to recall reading something about that a while back.
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I haven't done any reading on this in a while, but from my recollection there is plenty of evidence of a worldwide flood (not the "Ice Age" thing either).
Also, isn't there some evidence of the Ark in Turkey? Seem to recall reading something about that a while back.
Sure buddy, there's plenty of evidence. If you need a good read:
John Woodmorappe's excellent book, Noah's Ark: A Feasibility Study
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Sure buddy, there's plenty of evidence. If you need a good read:
John Woodmorappe's excellent book, Noah's Ark: A Feasibility Study
::)
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I love how people believe this crap.
It would be scientifically impossible to have a ship where certain animals only live in sub-zero habitats and other animals that only survive in tropical regions. The ship would have to stretch around 20,000 miles to accomodate these animals. You would also need to include bacteria and diseases as these are living organisms.
The ship itself would be impossible to build,taking up at least an entire rain forest of trees for the wood.
hhahhahahahah People are still stupid enough to believe in this stuff. I hate Christians.
TA, I don't understand how you can hate Christians becuase of a story in the Old Testament. The Christian Bible is comprised of both the New and Old Testament. The Old Testament took place before Jesus was born, and the New Testament was written afterwards.
The story of Noah's Ark, althouhg present in the BIble, is inconsequencial to Christians. It is a story from the Torah, Judaisms' main religious text. You should be redirecting your negative sentiment towards the Jews, if indeed the story angers you that much.
I also doubt the Pope gives 2 figs about Noah either. The Old Testament shows us Christians where our roots are, but we spend our time reading the NEw Testament instead ;)
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I haven't done any reading on this in a while, but from my recollection there is plenty of evidence of a worldwide flood (not the "Ice Age" thing either).
Also, isn't there some evidence of the Ark in Turkey? Seem to recall reading something about that a while back.
No.
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I hate TA because hes a dork and built like a stringy 6 grader ;D
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Is it true about Noah putting a male and female of every animal species on a boat? How many animals?
No it's not possible at all. Complete BS. Every species would show a genetic bottleneck at the same time. LOL...
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No it's not possible at all. Complete BS. Every species would show a genetic bottleneck at the same time. LOL...
In population genetics there is something called "effective population size" and a "minimum viable population size" where if a population goes below a specific number of individuals, It can't possibly produce viable offspring anymore due to inbreeding.
The bible says that Noah took 2 pair of every "unclean" and 7 pair of every "cean" animal.
Genesis 7:2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.
This would make a total population for many species to be simply 4 individuals. Such a population could not possibly ever reproduce viable offspring. It wouldn't be possible for the animals off Noah's ark to possibly re-populate the earth with their "kind".
Generally biologists consider a species "extinct" once there are less than 40-60 individuals left of that species. Simply because even if they are alive, the inbreeding from them mating will kill off the population in a few generations.
This is 40 individuals...20 times more than we are supposed to believe repopulated the world after Noah's flood.
However if you're a fundamentalist who's explanation for everything in the world is "God did it!" then this type of scientific proof won't discourage you in the least. As these types of people usually respond "well anything is possible with God!". This means no amount of proof will convince them. They have their beliefs regardless of what is proven or disproven.
Their beliefs are based on emotion rather than physical or logical proofs or argumentation.
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imagine having to clean up the shit from all those animals. ;D
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In population genetics there is something called "effective population size" and a "minimum viable population size" where if a population goes below a specific number of individuals, It can't possibly produce viable offspring anymore due to inbreeding.
The bible says that Noah took 2 pair of every "unclean" and 7 pair of every "cean" animal.
This would make a total population for many species to be simply 4 individuals. Such a population could not possibly ever reproduce viable offspring. It wouldn't be possible for the animals off Noah's ark to possibly re-populate the earth with their "kind".
Generally biologists consider a species "extinct" once there are less than 40-60 individuals left of that species. Simply because even if they are alive, the inbreeding from them mating will kill off the population in a few generations.
This is 40 individuals...20 times more than we are supposed to believe repopulated the world after Noah's flood.
However if you're a fundamentalist who's explanation for everything in the world is "God did it!" then this type of scientific proof won't discourage you in the least. As these types of people usually respond "well anything is possible with God!". This means no amount of proof will convince them. They have their beliefs regardless of what is proven or disproven.
Their beliefs are based on emotion rather than physical or logical proofs or argumentation.
Excellent Post!
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In population genetics there is something called "effective population size" and a "minimum viable population size" where if a population goes below a specific number of individuals, It can't possibly produce viable offspring anymore due to inbreeding.
The bible says that Noah took 2 pair of every "unclean" and 7 pair of every "cean" animal.
This would make a total population for many species to be simply 4 individuals. Such a population could not possibly ever reproduce viable offspring. It wouldn't be possible for the animals off Noah's ark to possibly re-populate the earth with their "kind".
Generally biologists consider a species "extinct" once there are less than 40-60 individuals left of that species. Simply because even if they are alive, the inbreeding from them mating will kill off the population in a few generations.
This is 40 individuals...20 times more than we are supposed to believe repopulated the world after Noah's flood.
However if you're a fundamentalist who's explanation for everything in the world is "God did it!" then this type of scientific proof won't discourage you in the least. As these types of people usually respond "well anything is possible with God!". This means no amount of proof will convince them. They have their beliefs regardless of what is proven or disproven.
Their beliefs are based on emotion rather than physical or logical proofs or argumentation.
It's quite unfortunate that many Christians are hoping for science to prove their beliefs right, yet when scientifical facts are presented that works against the case of Christianity, they fail to recognize these facts.
I've claimed before, and I could do it again, that I will become a follower of whatever religion that has something real to back it up with.
It has nothing to do with having an easy change of hearts. But rather, you cannot refuse reality.
Unless, of course, you want to live a lie.
YIP
Zack
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It's quite unfortunate that many Christians are hoping for science to prove their beliefs right, yet when scientifical facts are presented that works against the case of Christianity, they fail to recognize these facts.
I've claimed before, and I could do it again, that I will become a follower of whatever religion that has something real to back it up with.
It has nothing to do with having an easy change of hearts. But rather, you cannot refuse reality.
Unless, of course, you want to live a lie.
YIP
Zack
Heggie- your the best!
PS- no one cares!
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In population genetics there is something called "effective population size" and a "minimum viable population size" where if a population goes below a specific number of individuals, It can't possibly produce viable offspring anymore due to inbreeding.
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No it's not possible at all. Complete BS. Every species would show a genetic bottleneck at the same time. LOL...
Ya mean like this...
(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/naughty_bunny.jpg)
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Ya mean like this...
(http://www.jaguarenterprises.net/images/naughty_bunny.jpg)
lol
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Two words---String Theory!!!
Its actually very possible...If "god" told him to do so, god just may have gave him the ability to work thru all the diminsions on earth...String theory shows that we have many diminsions...That being said, their could have been room...
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sure, the string theory...thats it. if god gave him the ability to to work through all the dimensions on earth to accomplish his word why wouldnt he mention the theory in the bible also? it would only help prove that it was possible and that it actually took place. instead of leaving it up to speculation, providing a reason Noah was able to accommodate two or more of every animal would only solidify the story in the bible and this debate would not exist. instead they just say take our word for it, it happened even though they cant explain it, and it sounds absolutely ridiculous.
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I haven't done any reading on this in a while, but from my recollection there is plenty of evidence of a worldwide flood (not the "Ice Age" thing either).
Also, isn't there some evidence of the Ark in Turkey? Seem to recall reading something about that a while back.
The whole Noah's ark bullshit is a ripoff of the Babylonian story of Gilgamesh.
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Don't know that story.
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Beach Bum, of course you don't. You've probably never bothered to explore Christianity's roots. Do you also think the concept of a messiah originated in Christianity too?
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Beach Bum, of course you don't. You've probably never bothered to explore Christianity's roots. Do you also think the concept of a messiah originated in Christianity too?
::)
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::)
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All three Abrahamic religions are based on the ancient people of the Middle East and their struggles. I do not see how modern day christians, jews and muslims think these teachings and stories apply to them, unless they're from the Middle East. ???
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All three Abrahamic religions are based on the ancient people of the Middle East and their struggles. I do not see how modern day christians, jews and muslims think these teachings and stories apply to them, unless they're from the Middle East. ???
How would a commandment telling me to tell the truth only apply to people from the Middle East? Only people from the Middle East should be faithful to their spouses? Solomon's proverbs were only for people from the Middle East? Not following you.
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How would a commandment telling me to tell the truth only apply to people from the Middle East? Only people from the Middle East should be faithful to their spouses? Solomon's proverbs were only for people from the Middle East? Not following you.
I'm not saying it doesn't apply to you, but what I am saying is that it's kinda silly to revolve your life around something that happened a long time ago in a foreign land and wasn't originally meant to be applied to people like you and I.
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I'm not saying it doesn't apply to you, but what I am saying is that it's kinda silly to revolve your life around something that happened a long time ago in a foreign land and wasn't originally meant to be applied to people like you and I.
Why do you say that? Much of what I read applies (or should apply) to everyone today. For examples, Solomon talks about the perils of debt (borrower is the servant of the lender), which is a huge problem in our country. He gives lots of practical advice about everyday relationships. There are commands, recommendations, and advice that apply to all of us throughout the Bible.
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sure, the string theory...thats it. if god gave him the ability to to work through all the dimensions on earth to accomplish his word why wouldnt he mention the theory in the bible also? it would only help prove that it was possible and that it actually took place. instead of leaving it up to speculation, providing a reason Noah was able to accommodate two or more of every animal would only solidify the story in the bible and this debate would not exist. instead they just say take our word for it, it happened even though they cant explain it, and it sounds absolutely ridiculous.
the earth was once considered flat...Now we understand thats not the case...If down the road we are able to truly understand and even travel thru all the dimensions, their really would be no need to actually write about it...It would just be reality...
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See this is the problem with most religions is that they take the Bible literally. The bible was written so that the normal person (most were uneducated) could understand the importance and strength of God. It was written in symbolic terms. There is truth to the bible in some respects as to practical moral theology but it was written by people so that others may understand.
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Pretty neat bedtime story though.
And great for marketing 'bible toys', too.
(http://trus.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pTRU1-2787475reg.jpg)
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And great for marketing 'bible toys', too.
(http://trus.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pTRU1-2787475reg.jpg)
Don't forget children's songs!
"God said to Noah, there's gonna be a floody floody..."
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I love how people believe this crap.
It would be scientifically impossible to have a ship where certain animals only live in sub-zero habitats and other animals that only survive in tropical regions. The ship would have to stretch around 20,000 miles to accomodate these animals. You would also need to include bacteria and diseases as these are living organisms.
The ship itself would be impossible to build,taking up at least an entire rain forest of trees for the wood.
hhahhahahahah People are still stupid enough to believe in this stuff. I hate Christians.
haha, great post.
Are there actually people out there believing this bullshit?