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Getbig Misc Discussion Boards => Pet Board => Topic started by: jmt1 on April 15, 2007, 08:14:57 AM



Title: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on April 15, 2007, 08:14:57 AM
According to The American Temperament Test Society the American Pit Bull Terrier showed a passing rate of 95% compared to 77% for all other breeds tested.

They tested 122 breeds and the 95% passing rate of the APBT was one of the highest.

What is temperament?

"the sum total of all inborn and acquired physical and mental traits and talents which determines, forms and regulates behavior in the environment"

http://www.atts.org/index.html


"Pit bulls are famous, in circles of knowledgeable dog people, for the love and loyalty they bestow on anyone who shows them a smidgen of kindness."
-- Linda Wilson-Fuoco, journalist


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 15, 2007, 09:44:54 AM
Few more facts

Pitbulls do not have a "lock jaw" that once engaged they cannot "unlock"

Originally Pitbulls where bred to be very loyal / tolerant of humans

Pitbulls make great working dogs... Drug Sniffing, Police k9, Therapy dog etc etc

Pitbulls are extremely intelligent / loyal

Pitbulls are targeted by dog fighters for there unmatched "game", loyalty,superior athletic ability, and toughness. Pits are exploited far worse then any other breed for these reason.

Pitbulls are not born aggressive

Pitbulls are perfectly normal dogs if raised correctly

Pitbulls do not think "who can I bite next" when walking around there yard

Pitbulls are dominant dogs, who need to be raised like any other dominant breeds

The media had a definite bias towards pitbulls

Pitbulls are targeted by thugs and criminals for there image, and muscular build (not there fault) Since this breed is often targeted by people who have no idea how to raise animals, or by people who get a dog then train/encourage it to attack people, when something happens the breed takes all the blame.

99 percent of pitbull /Dog attacks could be prevented if people where not morons


Most who are critics know little to nothing about the breed


A 200 lb, untrained, intact, male St Bernard could kill you much easier then a 65 lb pit.


Some of the greatest people in history have owned pitbulls


Petey from little rascals was a pit


You have a better chance of being killed by lightning then by a pitbull terrier


I have owned a pure bred, intact, pitbull terrier. He was the sweetest dog in the world. I own a 90 lb American bulldog currently. My gf owns a 10 lb silky terrier. The Silky is by far the most aggressive dog I have ever owned. I started to work with the dog because since the silky was so small, the wife never took the time to train/socialize her. Guess what, she is aggressive and dominant. If you let aggressive behavior slide, and do not take the time to raise a dog correctly it is going to be a problem. Sadly a lot of the people who own pits fall into this category. They need proper training and socialization. They need exercise and mental stimulation. They needs rules and guidelines. No different the a Shepard or a Doberman. No different then a 10 lb min pin. How do the kids of bad parents usually turn out? Same shit applies to people who buy pitbulls for all the wrong reasons.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on April 15, 2007, 10:00:17 AM
^ good post.... add on a couple more...


--- The Pit Bull was so popular in the early 1900's they were our mascot not only in World War One, but World War Two as well. They were featured on recruiting and propoganda posters during this time period.


--- Pits Bulls were refered to as the "nanny dog" because they are so good around children.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 15, 2007, 10:32:01 AM
APBT are the number one dog used for US customs. 

An APBT won more medals in WWI than any other dog in military history.

Famous names who owned and loved pits:

Teddy Roosevelt
Jack Johnson
Helen Keller


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 15, 2007, 10:48:50 AM
APBT are the number one dog used for US customs. 

An APBT won more medals in WWI than any other dog in military history.

Famous names who owned and loved pits:

Teddy Roosevelt
Jack Johnson
Helen Keller

Good post traps. Bunch more on this list.

Fred Astaire, President Roosevelt, Jack Dempsy, Thomas Edison, Madonna, Michael J Fox, Brad Pitt, Bernadette Peters, Sinbad, Alicia Silverstone, Linda Blair, Humphrey Bogart, Usher, Mel Brooks, Ann Bancroft, John Stuart, Jan Michael Vincent, Pink (the singer), Kelli Williams (Actress from The Practice), Ken Howard (Father in Crossing Jordon - his Pit Shadow saved his life), Malcolm Jamal Warner, Stephan Jenkins, Rosie Perez, Ananda Lewis, Amy Jo Johnson, Mary Tyler Moore, Steve and Terrie Erwin (Crockhunters), Jack Johnson (Hawaiian singer), Bill Berloni (Broadway show dog trainer who has said that the Pit is the breed of choice for training), Anthony Robbins, Molly Price (Actress from Third Watch), President Woodrow Wilson, Frankie Muniz, AJ Mclean, Barbara Eden, and even Helen Keller have been lucky enough to own this magnificent animal.




(http://pitbullregistry.com/WWIPitWithFlag.jpg)
(http://pitbullregistry.com/amer.jpg)


In 1917 a Pit Bull by the name of Sgt. Stubby became a war hero for saving several soldiers lives and even capturing a German Spy while in the trenches of France with the 26th Yankee Division.







Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 15, 2007, 02:21:03 PM
best thread on the subject....keep going guys! 8)


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 16, 2007, 04:27:39 AM
What dog breed is percentagewise behind most injuries and deaths?

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Euro-monster on April 16, 2007, 05:07:21 AM
What dog breed is percentagewise behind most injuries and deaths?

-Hedge

The dog with the most biting incidents in my country is the Golden retriever... :-\
They are responsible for the most biting incidents to children particular the face wounds.... ::)
They are breading the dogs by demand of the people regardless if the dogs are a good match or not. Accidents are just a matter of time.......


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 16, 2007, 06:00:49 AM
The dog with the most biting incidents in my country is the Golden retriever... :-\
They are responsible for the most biting incidents to children particular the face wounds.... ::)
They are breading the dogs by demand of the people regardless if the dogs are a good match or not. Accidents are just a matter of time.......

Percentagewise? :-\

I doubt it.

I would think that golden retrievers are the most popular breed, and I doubt that they are overrepresented in any stat.

But if you are right, I stand corrected.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: rockyfortune on April 16, 2007, 06:25:03 AM
It's not the dog..it's the owner...any argument otherwise is idiotic...no dog should be left alone with children...end of story...i got bit by a yorkie, and my sister's yorkie bit three people...


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 16, 2007, 06:42:15 AM
Percentagewise? :-\

I doubt it.

I would think that golden retrievers are the most popular breed, and I doubt that they are overrepresented in any stat.

But if you are right, I stand corrected.

-Hedge

There is no national registry for information on dog bites. Most communities keep there own bite stats. This single fact makes dog bite stats severally flawed from the start. When a dog bites a person it is reported by the victim. In many cases they report the dog as one type of dog when infact it is a mix of several breeds, or a totally diff breed then what they say. Take my American bulldog for example. Many people mistake him for a very large pitbull. Although he is a bully breed, he is actually a mastiff. He is not a terrier.

The CDC admits as much in there bite study (how the study is flawed). They list a pitbull as a "pitbull type". Obviously since that would include about 10 diff breeds, and any dog that someone thought was a pitbull, the study is fatally flawed from the start. A "pitbull type" would include pitbulls, American bulldogs (all three types) pitbull mixes, bull terriers, French bulldogs, certain mastiffs, Staffordshire terriers, boxers, dogos, bandogs, presa canarious and any other muscular, square faced, short haired dogs. As you can see forming statistics using these methods, and an umbrella that clumps totally diff breeds into one large group is inaccurate and unfair. The stats are innaccurate , that is a fact known by both sides since the study was done.

Take a look at these pictures. Tell me which dog is a pit. The average person would say pitbull type to describe all these dogs. I used pictures that would give you a chance to find the pit. I could have posted pictures that some pit owners woud not be sure about.






Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on April 16, 2007, 07:53:27 AM

Take a look at these pictures. Tell me which dog is a pit. The average person would say pitbull type to describe all these dogs. I used pictures that would give you a chance to find the pit. I could have posted pictures that some pit owners woud not be sure about.

Very good point.  Although I am not 100% privy on the breed....I know they are easily misrepresented.  A guy that I used to work with (his roomate) had pits.  Gave me a basic explanation of the differences which I honestly really didn't know.

I would say...more than 95% of the population wouldn't know.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 16, 2007, 09:05:17 AM
The dog with the most biting incidents in my country is the Golden retriever... :-\
They are responsible for the most biting incidents to children particular the face wounds.... ::)
They are breading the dogs by demand of the people regardless if the dogs are a good match or not. Accidents are just a matter of time.......

The stat about golden retriever's is true, its even on a pamphlet down at the SPCA where my girl works.

And hedge, since you represent the ignorant faction, have you ever wondered why there are so many staunch supporters of pit bulls out there that aren't ghetto thugs, or wannabees or lowlifes in general?  Have you yourself ever spent any time with a pit other than what you see on the news? 


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Euro-monster on April 16, 2007, 11:40:40 AM
Percentagewise? :-\

I doubt it.

I would think that golden retrievers are the most popular breed, and I doubt that they are overrepresented in any stat.

But if you are right, I stand corrected.

-Hedge

Trust me on this...i'm right ... :-\
Because they are very popular allot and i mean allot of people want to buy one!
They think because they use Goldenretrievers for commercials ands stuff that they are very friendly dogs.
But make no mistake....if you don't properly socialize a dog ...no matter what kind of dog...your in for a big surprise..... :o


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 16, 2007, 12:27:53 PM


Take a look at these pictures. Tell me which dog is a pit. The average person would say pitbull type to describe all these dogs. I used pictures that would give you a chance to find the pit. I could have posted pictures that some pit owners woud not be sure about.



The first and second looks to be an american pitbull.

The third doesn't look like a pitbull.

The fourth doesn't looks like a pitbull either.

But then again, I'm no dog expert.



-Hedge

The fourth?


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 16, 2007, 12:34:45 PM
Check out my other thread also. The first two are not pitbulls. None of them are even terriers.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on April 16, 2007, 12:43:20 PM
The one I'm pretty sure is a Pomeranian....& another one is a Beagle

 ;D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 16, 2007, 04:33:16 PM
The stat about golden retriever's is true, its even on a pamphlet down at the SPCA where my girl works.

And hedge, since you represent the ignorant faction, have you ever wondered why there are so many staunch supporters of pit bulls out there that aren't ghetto thugs, or wannabees or lowlifes in general?  Have you yourself ever spent any time with a pit other than what you see on the news? 

To answer your last question: Yes, I have.

The problem with that dog, was the strength of it, and it was very obvious that if that dog ever got in fight with another dog, it would tear the other dog apart.

I've been around Golden Retrievers as well. They're not at all as strong or do not have the same type of aggressiveness. They are a bit more fluctuant in mood, are easier to trig, but they don't really get aggressive IMO.

As for your first question: I believe that most people who gets the pitbull instead of a golden or some other weak dog, are interested in an exciting dog who are strong and tough, and wants to boost his/her own self image. At least when they get their first dog, later on, they may have other reasons.

But initially, I believe it's the same reason some people buy a HUMMER or a Fugly Pickup truck.

It may not be the best ride. It sure as hell isn't. But it's the biggest, baddest and coolest in the hood, so goddamn, I'm gonna get one of those.

The same reason is why some people get those freak versions of chihuahuas. Because they look crazy, and they can look freaky when walking the dog.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on April 16, 2007, 04:41:35 PM
To answer your last question: Yes, I have.

The problem with that dog, was the strength of it, and it was very obvious that if that dog ever got in fight with another dog, it would tear the other dog apart.

I've been around Golden Retrievers as well. They're not at all as strong or do not have the same type of aggressiveness. They are a bit more fluctuant in mood, are easier to trig, but they don't really get aggressive IMO.

As for your first question: I believe that most people who gets the pitbull instead of a golden or some other weak dog, are interested in an exciting dog who are strong and tough, and wants to boost his/her own self image. At least when they get their first dog, later on, they may have other reasons.

But initially, I believe it's the same reason some people buy a HUMMER or a Fugly Pickup truck.

It may not be the best ride. It sure as hell isn't. But it's the biggest, baddest and coolest in the hood, so goddamn, I'm gonna get one of those.

The same reason is why some people get those freak versions of chihuahuas. Because they look crazy, and they can look freaky when walking the dog.

-Hedge

Freak version of a chi?

post pictures


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 16, 2007, 06:42:06 PM
To answer your last question: Yes, I have.

The problem with that dog, was the strength of it, and it was very obvious that if that dog ever got in fight with another dog, it would tear the other dog apart.

I've been around Golden Retrievers as well. They're not at all as strong or do not have the same type of aggressiveness. They are a bit more fluctuant in mood, are easier to trig, but they don't really get aggressive IMO.

As for your first question: I believe that most people who gets the pitbull instead of a golden or some other weak dog, are interested in an exciting dog who are strong and tough, and wants to boost his/her own self image. At least when they get their first dog, later on, they may have other reasons.
But initially, I believe it's the same reason some people buy a HUMMER or a Fugly Pickup truck.

It may not be the best ride. It sure as hell isn't. But it's the biggest, baddest and coolest in the hood, so goddamn, I'm gonna get one of those.

The same reason is why some people get those freak versions of chihuahuas. Because they look crazy, and they can look freaky when walking the dog.

-Hedge
I disagree with this I know several people with families, with small children, that have pits. First off they got pits because they are the most loyal and loving dog I ever met. Secondly they will defend their owners and children at all cost. Third it's not about self image, it's about having a beautiful animal that would never leave your side. They are very trainable, smart and eager to learn.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 16, 2007, 06:43:14 PM
oh yeah, Body88, it's #4 the fawn :)


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 16, 2007, 06:46:16 PM
oh yeah, Body88, it's #4 the fawn :)

Looks like it huh? That is actually a female american bulldog. The scott/performance type. Actually none of those pups are pits. The pup above the last is a hybrid type american bulldog, the same type of ab I have. The first guy is a presa canario, and the second is a bandog.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 16, 2007, 06:55:43 PM
Looks like it huh? That is actually a female american bulldog. The scott/performance type. Actually none of those pups are pits. The pup above the last is a hybrid type american bulldog, the same type of ab I have. The first guy is a presa canario, and the second is a bandog.
she would be the closest looking to a pit to me. I though tyou said you put one in there for everyone to choose from, I was wrong :'(


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 16, 2007, 08:28:18 PM
she would be the closest looking to a pit to me. I though tyou said you put one in there for everyone to choose from, I was wrong :'(

I did... It was a dirty trick! I am sorry my friend.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 16, 2007, 08:53:58 PM
To answer your last question: Yes, I have.

The problem with that dog, was the strength of it, and it was very obvious that if that dog ever got in fight with another dog, it would tear the other dog apart.

I've been around Golden Retrievers as well. They're not at all as strong or do not have the same type of aggressiveness. They are a bit more fluctuant in mood, are easier to trig, but they don't really get aggressive IMO.

As for your first question: I believe that most people who gets the pitbull instead of a golden or some other weak dog, are interested in an exciting dog who are strong and tough, and wants to boost his/her own self image. At least when they get their first dog, later on, they may have other reasons.

But initially, I believe it's the same reason some people buy a HUMMER or a Fugly Pickup truck.

It may not be the best ride. It sure as hell isn't. But it's the biggest, baddest and coolest in the hood, so goddamn, I'm gonna get one of those.

The same reason is why some people get those freak versions of chihuahuas. Because they look crazy, and they can look freaky when walking the dog.

-Hedge


I am going to respectfully disagree. You seem to know a lot about powerlifting. You are also a obvious fan of bodybuilding, or at least working out. A far better argument could be made that all the insecurities you listed would pertain to a person into bodybuilding and powerlifting. What exactly does lifting a large amount of weight prove? Does that give one a certain kind of image? Make one stronger to do more damage in a fight? Are you trying to boost your self image by power lifting and bodybuilding Hedge? You must be because most bb's and pl's are very insecure. Same as all pitbull owners, correct?

I think you fail to realize many people look at a pitbull or a Doberman the same way many people look at a golden retriever. Are Goldie owners trying to project an Image of beauty? Are they all insecure they do not have long golden hair? Many people like the way pitbulls or bully breeds look. Not because they are insecure, because they just like the way they look, thats all. Same reason some people like ketchup, and some people like mustard. Blond or Brunet? Pitbulls are very unique looking dogs, and IMO very handsome dogs. Are you saying Petey from little rascals was not one of the most beloved dogs in history? Spud McKenzie from the Bud commericals? (bull terrier) Far more people think my 90 lb American Bulldog is cute then scary. He has very unique markings and a ton of character. He is extremely loyal and very friendly. Although he is not a pitbull , he is a bully type breed. I bought him because to me he is the most handsome dog out there. I bought him for his loyalty, and his great personality. He is the perfect dog for a person who is into sports and likes to partake in athletic activities ( hiking, running and swimming). He offers my gf/home protection when I am not around, yet is gentle and loving with my 2 year old nephew. He has a huge heart, and is a great companion. I would not trade him for any other breed. I did not buy him to project a image. I can say with confidence most all the people I know who own ab's did not but them for "image". Having owned a 75 lb brindle pitbull, I can say the exact same things where true for him as my current pup. Pitbull's are extremely loyal and fun to interact with. They are courageous and funny as hell. They are not mean and no different then any other dog, if raised like any dominant type breed should be raised. Just because a segment of the people who get them have issues with insecurity or might want to project a "image" you do not ban an entire breed of dog.

Why do you have no beef with people owning 200 lb st Bernard's? Is it because they are cuddly? One of those could kill you much easier then a pitbull. Should humans who are athletically Superior to the average human be banned because they are stronger, and more agile then most the population? You have a beef with people with insecurities, not pitbulls. If they did not use pitbulls to project an image, they would use Doberman. If not Doberman's, how about 200 lb St Bernard's. If not dogs, how about the biggest guns ? No guns, how about huge knives? Ban knives, how about the biggest pipe bomb? You see where I'm going with this? It is the people, not the tools they use to project there insecurities. Unfortunately the ones who suffer are the pitbulls who are made out to look like monsters. Yes, there are crazy assed pitbulls. But that is not a common thing. There are crazy dogs of ALL breeds. There are no more crazy pitbulls out there ,then crazy labs and cocker spaniels. Just so happens the worlds most exploited dog these days is the APBT. You can thank the low life pit fighters, drug dealers, and scumbag element, that bring many of these dogs up to do exactly the things the breed gets the bad rap for. Get familiar with the Presa canario and Argentinian dogo. They are the next dogs you are going to see exploited. It will never end. They said ALL the same junk about Rottweilers/Doberman/GSd's in the past. Now it is pits. After pits it will be something else.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 16, 2007, 10:53:50 PM
St. bernards are actually quite commonly schizophrenic, yes SCHIZOPHRENIC.  Look it up and you will see they are quite prone to personality disorders, crazy stuff.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 16, 2007, 11:08:13 PM
To answer your last question: Yes, I have.

The problem with that dog, was the strength of it, and it was very obvious that if that dog ever got in fight with another dog, it would tear the other dog apart.

I've been around Golden Retrievers as well. They're not at all as strong or do not have the same type of aggressiveness. They are a bit more fluctuant in mood, are easier to trig, but they don't really get aggressive IMO.

As for your first question: I believe that most people who gets the pitbull instead of a golden or some other weak dog, are interested in an exciting dog who are strong and tough, and wants to boost his/her own self image. At least when they get their first dog, later on, they may have other reasons.

But initially, I believe it's the same reason some people buy a HUMMER or a Fugly Pickup truck.

It may not be the best ride. It sure as hell isn't. But it's the biggest, baddest and coolest in the hood, so goddamn, I'm gonna get one of those.

The same reason is why some people get those freak versions of chihuahuas. Because they look crazy, and they can look freaky when walking the dog.

-Hedge

Ok, in terms of strength, i've never had a golden retriever, but i grew up with labs, which are comparable.  A 105 lbs male lab, an 85 Lbs female lab and a 65 lbs female lab.  Not as strong as a pit???  HA! They might not look as muscular due to the long fur, but those dogs are strong as shit. The male caught a burglar breaking into our neighbors house and pinned him until my dad heard the ruckus and came over.  The 65 lbs female could pull me and my buddies around the neighborhood on our roller blades for hours all the way through high school (and we were 200 lbs plus footballers/track athletes) and the 85 pounder used to due the same.  There's a reason they dominate those great outdoor games long jump, its because they have incredible explosive strength and endurance like no other.  Now, when a 65, 85 or 105 lbs dog attacks a human, the results are always the same regardless of breed (ask the woman who had her face ripped off by a lab).  the point is, you don't have to have a pit to have a dangerous dog, they just happen to be the popular one at the moment.  there are some dumbasses out there who get pitbulls, but being as how they are an immensely popular breed (some studies make they the most popular in america), the number of problems versus the number of normal ones is miniscule. 

After today you should be more worried about getting rid of guns as opposed to pit bulls.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 17, 2007, 03:08:01 AM
Thanks for all the replies.

Obviously, I am no fan of dogs, except for one dog, belongs to the parents of a friend of mine. He's some ugly crossbreed between german shepherd, labrador, and a few other things, the result of horny dogs meeting in street corners.

Thanks for the replies, I enjoy learning about the issue, becoming more educated.

I still believe that dogs should not be treated as humans, whether you like dogs or not, they're animals, not something else. Meaning, having dogs in bed, feeding them from the table, et al... It's not good. Either for the dog, or for the owner.

The next step is zoophilia IMO.

As far as pitbulls: I generally don't like dogs, as you know. I find them unnecessary. The protection issue is moot IMO: Our society should not rely on our citizens to protect themselves, that should be taken care of by the police.

Dogs have shown to have a fitness effect on elder people, so for them, I am all for getting small nice active dogs, such as yorkshire terriers or shit like that.

Cuddly, someone mentioned cuddly. I talked to the owner of a german shepherd a few days ago. She told me that her dog will always be loud, no matter how good discipline she will teach the dog.


What really has to be done, is to look into getting some kind of certificate for dog owning, and also stipulate who gets to breed.

Shit is getting out of hand.

Once again, thanks for the interesting discussion, I am definitely learning.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 17, 2007, 10:12:01 AM
Thanks for all the replies.

Obviously, I am no fan of dogs, except for one dog, belongs to the parents of a friend of mine. He's some ugly crossbreed between german shepherd, labrador, and a few other things, the result of horny dogs meeting in street corners.

Thanks for the replies, I enjoy learning about the issue, becoming more educated.

I still believe that dogs should not be treated as humans, whether you like dogs or not, they're animals, not something else. Meaning, having dogs in bed, feeding them from the table, et al... It's not good. Either for the dog, or for the owner.

The next step is zoophilia IMO.

As far as pitbulls: I generally don't like dogs, as you know. I find them unnecessary. The protection issue is moot IMO: Our society should not rely on our citizens to protect themselves, that should be taken care of by the police.

Dogs have shown to have a fitness effect on elder people, so for them, I am all for getting small nice active dogs, such as yorkshire terriers or shit like that.

Cuddly, someone mentioned cuddly. I talked to the owner of a german shepherd a few days ago. She told me that her dog will always be loud, no matter how good discipline she will teach the dog.

What really has to be done, is to look into getting some kind of certificate for dog owning, and also stipulate who gets to breed.

Shit is getting out of hand.

Once again, thanks for the interesting discussion, I am definitely learning.

-Hedge

German shepherds are gaurd dogs and trained/bred to be high strung and bark a lot.  they do... constantly, with a very shrill bark at that.  it gets EVERYONE's attention, mission accomplished, true?

I also agree with your thoughts about deciding who gets to own a dog ( i don't think anyone ever convicted of a violent felony should be able to own one, however many people feel that the empathy involved in owning/caring for a dog is a direct sign of rehabilitation in any violent offender), but it is a direct violation of our civil liberties to do so. The licence law is a start, but i don't think there is enough money or interest to enforce it properly.  In terms on breeding, i think that the law about making fixing/spaying your pets upon purchase unless a registered breeder is a great idea.

I do understand why some people don't like "dog people."  Some dog owners let their dogs run the show and live for their animals and it can be a bit annoying, but these might be people who can't have kids or are societies social rejects, so a dog is really the center of their world... so you have to walk in their shoes before you can judge.

In terms of protection, someone said in response to yesterday's shooting, that this is why they like to have a gun in their house, to defend their family in case someone goes nuts or breaks in.  I said that no one needs a gun and houses with dogs get broken into on a much more rare basis than thouse without.  And your theory about police being the one's to protect us is wishful thinking.  if the police were that good no one would ever  get mugged, raped, murdered, robbed, car jacked, etc... but shit happens.  Women who take their walks at night with dogs feel safer and don't get attacked by predators, the numbers back it up.

Dogs are a big part of our society whether one likes it or not, but to define them as unecessary sounds close minded, childish and indicative of a person with serious social issues and or intimacy issues.  No offense, but thats like me telling you that shoes are unecessary and that you should just build callouses... because i can't afford shoes and i have dealt without them.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 17, 2007, 10:15:50 AM

Dogs have shown to have a fitness effect on elder people, so for them, I am all for getting small nice active dogs, such as yorkshire terriers or shit like that.


Yorkshire terriers are insane, constantly bark and very snappy dogs.  If big dogs had their temperment... shit, we'd all have been mauled by this point.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 17, 2007, 11:07:58 AM
Yorkshire terriers are insane, constantly bark and very snappy dogs.  If big dogs had their temperment... shit, we'd all have been mauled by this point.

I do not know of many yorki therapy dogs, do you? A lot of pitbulls used for that. I think hedge is confused about what the typical "therapy" dog looks like. They are never toy breeds.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 17, 2007, 11:22:32 AM
I do not know of many yorki therapy dogs, do you? A lot of pitbulls used for that. I think hedge is confused about what the typical "therapy" dog looks like. They are never toy breeds.

NEVER toy breeds.  Toy breeds can't even tolerate the amount of petting that comes with being a therapy dog.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on April 17, 2007, 11:31:41 AM
pit bulls have excelled as Animal-Assisted-Therapy dogs... they work with the elderly, deeply troubled or abused children, physically traumatized hospital patients, and even those who are terminally ill.... the pits outstanding temperment and the overwhelming love and affection they have for people make them the ideal dog for this type of work.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: body88 on April 17, 2007, 11:32:35 AM
NEVER toy breeds.  Toy breeds can't even tolerate the amount of petting that comes with being a therapy dog.

I agree. A lot of toys make bad therapy dogs imo. Pitbulls are often used as therapy dogs.  As shown by jmt above. Hedge did you know these facts?


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 17, 2007, 11:45:13 AM
No. Didn't know that pitbulls were used to treat retarded kids.

What's the breed that Buffalo Bill has in Silence of the Lambs?

I've seen that kind of dog with a few elder people, seems to work nice as a kick in the butt.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: TrapsMcLats on April 17, 2007, 11:55:34 AM
No. Didn't know that pitbulls were used to treat retarded kids.

What's the breed that Buffalo Bill has in Silence of the Lambs?

I've seen that kind of dog with a few elder people, seems to work nice as a kick in the butt.

-Hedge

People are going to love their dog regardless of the breed.  It just goes that for therapy work, larger dogs/working dogs are often more popular because they are bred for a steady temperment and to work well and loyaly to humans.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 17, 2007, 12:04:05 PM
People are going to love their dog regardless of the breed.  It just goes that for therapy work, larger dogs/working dogs are often more popular because they are bred for a steady temperment and to work well and loyaly to humans.

If a pitbull is better for therapy, then of course, that's the kind of dog who should be used.

I am an utiliarian.

That's also why I will watch the Denver law with great interest, and if it turns out that there's no decrease in dog attacks, percentage wise, I will definitely change my mind on pitbulls.

I don't like dogs. But I have an open mind about it, at least I like to think that.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 17, 2007, 03:18:15 PM
No. Didn't know that pitbulls were used to treat retarded kids.
What's the breed that Buffalo Bill has in Silence of the Lambs?

I've seen that kind of dog with a few elder people, seems to work nice as a kick in the butt.

-Hedge

Hedge, a statement like this from you? :-\

They don't just treat HANDICAPPED kids, they also used in therapy for the elderly. While these dogs are very powerful they are also very obidient and can be trained very well to be calm, not jumpy or snippy like small breeds.

that retarded comment makes me wonder about you. Aren't you one of the ones who complained about my avatar awhile back? but you're going to call children retards? HMMMMMMM................ .. :-\


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 17, 2007, 03:28:17 PM
Hedge, a statement like this from you? :-\

They don't just treat HANDICAPPED kids, they also used in therapy for the elderly. While these dogs are very powerful they are also very obidient and can be trained very well to be calm, not jumpy or snippy like small breeds.

that retarded comment makes me wonder about you. Aren't you one of the ones who complained about my avatar awhile back? but you're going to call children retards? HMMMMMMM................ .. :-\

What?

I think American History X is a great movie, and Ed Norton awesome.

Why would I complain that you have an avatar from it?

Sorry, you got the wrong guy, but I actually recall someone bitching about your avatar being racist. I thought that was retarded dumb. ;)




BTW, didn't mean to offend you, retarded kids is simply another wording for kids with a learning disability.

Same thing, but retarded is the correct medical term, I think?

No matter, the issue at hand are the dogs.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 17, 2007, 03:42:14 PM
What?

I think American History X is a great movie, and Ed Norton awesome.

Why would I complain that you have an avatar from it?

Sorry, you got the wrong guy, but I actually recall someone bitching about your avatar being racist. I thought that was retarded dumb. ;)




BTW, didn't mean to offend you, retarded kids is simply another wording for kids with a learning disability.

Same thing, but retarded is the correct medical term, I think?

No matter, the issue at hand are the dogs.

Ah, yes, the dogs....beautiful aren't they? :D

No offense taken, just got a soft spot for kids, don't think it's cool to talk shit to children with disabilities. Misunderstood you. :D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Euro-monster on April 18, 2007, 12:19:25 AM
My nephew has dyslexia...what a retard!.... :-\

.... ;D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: chaos on April 19, 2007, 06:28:37 PM
My nephew has dyslexia...what a retard!.... :-\

.... ;D
he's probably a mod on the political board :P


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Euro-monster on April 20, 2007, 12:27:41 AM
he's probably a mod on the political board :P

You know it!... :D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Jadethegladiator on April 26, 2007, 11:05:00 PM
I love my bulldogs.....end of story.  ;) 


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Jadethegladiator on April 26, 2007, 11:07:08 PM
Rocky....always on the look out!


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Jadethegladiator on April 26, 2007, 11:09:35 PM
Rocky & Roxy

Hedgehog, btw, I traded in the Hummer.  :'(


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on April 27, 2007, 08:52:48 AM
I'll add you to the "Represent your pet" thread Jade



Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jaejonna on April 27, 2007, 11:21:05 AM
his name is Savage...


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: SinCitysmallGUY on April 28, 2007, 09:15:24 AM
We don't have a name yet but I think we are leaning towards Zues.....


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Hedgehog on April 29, 2007, 01:51:25 PM
Rocky & Roxy

Hedgehog, btw, I traded in the Hummer.  :'(

About time. :-*

Hummer's -they're so 2001.

-Hedge


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Jadethegladiator on May 08, 2007, 05:14:31 PM
About time. :-*

Hummer's -they're so 2001.

-Hedge

HH,
Just so you know, when Hummer comes out with a diesel, I am so there.  The little 2 seater (VO6) that I got now just isn't getting it!  Think of dogs bro! ;D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: dizzleman06 on May 19, 2007, 08:59:02 AM
his name is Savage...

Ah, he is so cute!  he is gonna be a heart breaker!


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 20, 2007, 09:34:38 AM
99% of the time when i see a pit bull with a person..i'm thinking "self esteem issues"

its also usually with guys in huge SUVs..usually 2..each with a huge intimidating looking collar with chains and usually a lot of chains around the dogs neck..



its like the doggie equivalent of the guy at the petrol pump blaring his rap music for everyone to hear.."YEEASH..i'm hard and i reprezent >:("


 ::)


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on May 20, 2007, 09:39:19 AM
HH,
Just so you know, when Hummer comes out with a diesel, I am so there.  The little 2 seater (VO6) that I got now just isn't getting it!  Think of dogs bro! ;D

You mean ZO6 right?


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on May 20, 2007, 09:40:36 AM
99% of the time when i see a pit bull with a person..i'm thinking "self esteem issues"

its also usually with guys in huge SUVs..usually 2..each with a huge intimidating looking collar with chains and usually a lot of chains around the dogs neck..



its like the doggie equivalent of the guy at the petrol pump blaring his rap music for everyone to hear.."YEEASH..i'm hard and i reprezent >:("


 ::)

I'm sure people can say thing when they see me walking the Rottie

but...

it's funny how many people ask to pet him.  Yeah....he's just a big scary monster.

 ;D


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 20, 2007, 09:59:06 AM
I'm sure people can say thing when they see me walking the Rottie

but...

it's funny how many people ask to pet him.  Yeah....he's just a big scary monster.

 ;D


the exception does not disprove the rule...

...


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on May 20, 2007, 10:29:38 AM

the exception does not disprove the rule...

...

maybe thats just your rule


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 20, 2007, 11:01:58 AM
maybe thats just your rule

i dont make em up as i go along mate..

i've been around really nice pits..even used to play fetch with a 4 by 4 with one...nice doggie..

HOWEVER (maybe its my area) the majority of pits in this area belong to the wrong type of crowd..

not the pits fault..but  THEY ARE a dominant breed...

PIT lovers are sorta like the NRA..."guns dont kill people"..yeeah but the gun sure helps aye...


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on May 20, 2007, 11:19:36 AM
i dont make em up as i go along mate..

i've been around really nice pits..even used to play fetch with a 4 by 4 with one...nice doggie..

HOWEVER (maybe its my area) the majority of pits in this area belong to the wrong type of crowd..

not the pits fault..but  THEY ARE a dominant breed...

PIT lovers are sorta like the NRA..."guns dont kill people"..yeeah but the gun sure helps aye...

Well, here in California...all the tough guys have cats

 ;)


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 20, 2007, 11:35:35 AM
Well, here in California...all the tough guys have cats

 ;)

i REALLY gotta visit the west coast one day..yall like have a different country there altogether..


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: knny187 on May 20, 2007, 12:27:33 PM
yeah...it's pretty different


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on May 20, 2007, 12:42:41 PM
i dont make em up as i go along mate..

i've been around really nice pits..even used to play fetch with a 4 by 4 with one...nice doggie..

HOWEVER (maybe its my area) the majority of pits in this area belong to the wrong type of crowd..

not the pits fault..but  THEY ARE a dominant breed...

PIT lovers are sorta like the NRA..."guns dont kill people"..yeeah but the gun sure helps aye...

its true that pits are the favorite dog of these scumbag drug dealers, wanna be thugs, n dog fighters.

the problem is too many people dont realize what a great dog the "pitbull" is and blame the dog instead of placing blame where it belongs.

http://home.epix.net/~pkp/PitBullArticle.html


Alfons Estelt of the American Temperament Test Society, Inc., said, "The American Pit Bull Terriers participating in our temperament evaluation have shown a passing rate of 95%. The other 121 breeds of dogs in our tests showed the average passing rate of 77%. While the heredity factor is of measurable importance, these results show that a dog, even if used for dogfighting, is not pre-disposed as such, but is brought by his environment."


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 20, 2007, 04:20:09 PM


the problem is too many people dont realize what a great dog the "pitbull" is and blame the dog instead of placing blame where it belongs.






i KNOW that...i know akitas that are nice as hell also..

and i know gun owners that are responsible...


but there r wayyyy too many idiots in society...there r more idiots than non idiots...

i guess i shouldn't talk..i'm a horse lover..and i've been around agressive horses (and a 1500lb animal can do a lot more damage than a dog can) but i still defend them...

i should just shut up


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on May 20, 2007, 04:45:44 PM
i wasnt trying to say that you didnt know

just meant that there are many people out there, people in the media, other dog owners, ect, who dont know what the true pitbull is all about.

they have this misconcemption that pits are these vicious evil dogs who run around just waiting to attack someone.

they love to place blame on the dog and not the owner who made the dog that way.

these are the ignorant fools i was refering to.


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 21, 2007, 04:51:19 PM
look a gun safely handled is NOT a bad thing..but IT STILL IS A GUN AND IN THE WRONG HANDS...

take away the persons gun and give him a mango..and well..that person cant do shit..

in the same way..take away an assholes pit and give him lassie..and he cant do shit..


in the process many good people lose guns
in the process many good people lose pits


fair or not..i dont know..

ask the NRA.. :-\


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: jmt1 on May 21, 2007, 05:40:17 PM
look a gun safely handled is NOT a bad thing..but IT STILL IS A GUN AND IN THE WRONG HANDS...

take away the persons gun and give him a mango..and well..that person cant do shit..

in the same way..take away an assholes pit and give him lassie..and he cant do shit..


in the process many good people lose guns
in the process many good people lose pits


fair or not..i dont know..

ask the NRA.. :-\
when your making this comparison why are you chosing to single out pitbulls?

if you take away their pitbull they can get a roti.

take away the roti, they can go get a german shepard.

take that away they get a doberman, chow, akita, ect, ect, ect.






Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: ToxicAvenger on May 21, 2007, 06:25:12 PM
when your making this comparison why are you chosing to single out pitbulls?

if you take away their pitbull they can get a roti.

take away the roti, they can go get a german shepard.

take that away they get a doberman, chow, akita, ect, ect, ect.






i hate to admit but i have known alsatians ...(german sheps in amreekan)

and in all honesty..you GOTTA PICK THE RIGHT ONE REGARDLESS OF OWNER...

i have known 2 purebreds...$2500 a piece...

1 that recently died (RIP) ws a ..well a sweetheart..

the 1 thats alive..he'll attack and kill anyone new he meets and HE'S BEEN SOCIALIZED.and the owners sent him to skool and so on and so forth...

i've known the dog for 6 yrs...and he's drawn blood on me 2ice in the past yr just trying to play bite my leg to tell me he's gotta go out to poop...

you CANT pet his head..he'll take your hand off..
if he comes lays on your feet DONT PET HIM..LET HIM LAY.or HE'LL TAKE OFF YOUR HAND
when i go into this house i gotta announce my presence to him or i'll have him go for my throat.
THEY HAVE TRIED EVERYTHING


now..can ya imagine this dog in the wrong hands..i smack max when i can...and HARD....and he listens to me(if i'm actually really pissed..otherwise..nope) BUT when i smack him he STILL tries to nip me..

i have a point here..

there r more rotties and pits and akitas that way than sheps...

actually there r more akitas that way than anytbing else but most people cant afford pure bred akitas ($ 4000 a piece)

akitas are wayyy more agressive than pits..but a pit rottie hybred is CHEAP for the dumb girls..

hope u willget what i'm trying 2 say


Title: Re: Fact about American Pit Bull Terriers....
Post by: Vet on June 12, 2007, 10:54:04 PM

I am going to respectfully disagree. You seem to know a lot about powerlifting. You are also a obvious fan of bodybuilding, or at least working out. A far better argument could be made that all the insecurities you listed would pertain to a person into bodybuilding and powerlifting. What exactly does lifting a large amount of weight prove? Does that give one a certain kind of image? Make one stronger to do more damage in a fight? Are you trying to boost your self image by power lifting and bodybuilding Hedge? You must be because most bb's and pl's are very insecure. Same as all pitbull owners, correct?

I think you fail to realize many people look at a pitbull or a Doberman the same way many people look at a golden retriever. Are Goldie owners trying to project an Image of beauty? Are they all insecure they do not have long golden hair? Many people like the way pitbulls or bully breeds look. Not because they are insecure, because they just like the way they look, thats all. Same reason some people like ketchup, and some people like mustard. Blond or Brunet? Pitbulls are very unique looking dogs, and IMO very handsome dogs. Are you saying Petey from little rascals was not one of the most beloved dogs in history? Spud McKenzie from the Bud commericals? (bull terrier) Far more people think my 90 lb American Bulldog is cute then scary. He has very unique markings and a ton of character. He is extremely loyal and very friendly. Although he is not a pitbull , he is a bully type breed. I bought him because to me he is the most handsome dog out there. I bought him for his loyalty, and his great personality. He is the perfect dog for a person who is into sports and likes to partake in athletic activities ( hiking, running and swimming). He offers my gf/home protection when I am not around, yet is gentle and loving with my 2 year old nephew. He has a huge heart, and is a great companion. I would not trade him for any other breed. I did not buy him to project a image. I can say with confidence most all the people I know who own ab's did not but them for "image". Having owned a 75 lb brindle pitbull, I can say the exact same things where true for him as my current pup. Pitbull's are extremely loyal and fun to interact with. They are courageous and funny as hell. They are not mean and no different then any other dog, if raised like any dominant type breed should be raised. Just because a segment of the people who get them have issues with insecurity or might want to project a "image" you do not ban an entire breed of dog.

Why do you have no beef with people owning 200 lb st Bernard's? Is it because they are cuddly? One of those could kill you much easier then a pitbull. Should humans who are athletically Superior to the average human be banned because they are stronger, and more agile then most the population? You have a beef with people with insecurities, not pitbulls. If they did not use pitbulls to project an image, they would use Doberman. If not Doberman's, how about 200 lb St Bernard's. If not dogs, how about the biggest guns ? No guns, how about huge knives? Ban knives, how about the biggest pipe bomb? You see where I'm going with this? It is the people, not the tools they use to project there insecurities. Unfortunately the ones who suffer are the pitbulls who are made out to look like monsters. Yes, there are crazy assed pitbulls. But that is not a common thing. There are crazy dogs of ALL breeds. There are no more crazy pitbulls out there ,then crazy labs and cocker spaniels. Just so happens the worlds most exploited dog these days is the APBT. You can thank the low life pit fighters, drug dealers, and scumbag element, that bring many of these dogs up to do exactly the things the breed gets the bad rap for. Get familiar with the Presa canario and Argentinian dogo. They are the next dogs you are going to see exploited. It will never end. They said ALL the same junk about Rottweilers/Doberman/GSd's in the past. Now it is pits. After pits it will be something else.

This is a very, very good post...


I dont' own a dog to "look pretty" or for a status symbol or anything like that.   I come from a farm background where a dog had a job and they did that job, be it herding cattle, guarding the livestock, or hunting.   I'll tell you why I own pits.....which are dogs that I don't hunt with and that I don't use to work livestock.....   I like the intensity.   My two females are in bed right now with my wife, cuddled up next to her with 110% intensity.  A pitbull does just about everything at 110+%.  This means they love you, they play with you, they live with you at 110%.   When I did farm calls, my male was always ready to get in the truck and go out and work cattle, be it midnight, 3 AM or 6 AM.  It didn't matter, he had a job to do and he was going to do it and he enjoyed doing it until the day he died from cancer.   I was pretty well known for the big black lab and the brindle pit in the vet truck driving around at all hours of the night making farm calls.   I've weight pulled with my female, I've also used her to pull trees, other brush, and the lawnmower out of my yard---why?  Because she was good at it and she did it with 110%.   

And I'll be the first to admit, I'm sure my 285lb ass looked funny as hell cruising in my old white bomb toyota corolla blasting Hank Williams Jr with two pits and a boxer hanging their heads out the window.... but darnit, thats my way.   ;D