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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: HowieW on March 28, 2008, 02:52:47 PM
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Team U champ and IFBB natural pro Gregg Rando, a legally blind pro bodybuilder enters the NY pro.
He stays drug free, looks decent, but places well down in the line up with his smaller mass.
He quietly leaves the contest and heads to a lawyers office in NY that has experience with pro athletes and due process for athletes.
Rando and his lawyer file suit in a NY venue where the meet was held. The suit is based on the grounds that the IFBB pro div. failed to enforce their own drug testing rules. As an active IFBB pro Rando would have the legal standing needed to file such a suit.They could contend that Rando, a drug free bodybuilder who followed the rules, was denied a FAIR and equitable shot at prize money.
Imagine the IFBB having to defend their current "lack of testing" policy against Rando, a blind pro , sitting in court in front of a judge :o
The IFBB lawyers might try to pull " the random testing " thing , but it would fold quickly.
All the other side would have to do is to demand the IFBB show the court their records of actual steroid testing over the last few years ( as evidence). This would prove they don't do any testing and Rando would win the case with ease and whatever judgement $$$ that went with it.
What do you think?
Howard
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You are stupid. Especially considering you took a heavily juiced bodybuilder to use as an example.
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Team U champ and IFBB natural pro Gregg Rando, a legally blind pro bodybuilder enters the NY pro.
He stays drug free, looks decent, but places well down in the line up with his smaller mass.
He quietly leaves the contest and heads to a lawyers office in NY that has experience with pro athletes and due process for athletes.
Rando and his lawyer file suit in a NY venue where the meet was held. The suit is based on the grounds that the IFBB pro div. failed to enforce their own drug testing rules. As an active IFBB pro Rando would have the legal standing needed to file such a suit.They could contend that Rando, a drug free bodybuilder who followed the rules, was denied a FAIR and equitable shot at prize money.
Imagine the IFBB having to defend their current "lack of testing" policy against Rando, a blind pro , sitting in court in front of a judge :o
The IFBB lawyers might try to pull " the random testing " thing , but it would fold quickly.
All the other side would have to do is to demand the IFBB show the court their records of actual steroid testing over the last few years ( as evidence). This would prove they don't do any testing and Rando would win the case with ease and whatever judgement $$$ that went with it.
What do you think?
Howard
The IFBB could only be held accountable in this senario, IF they chose to announce they were testing, then failed to test everyone equally...They are under no obligation to test, as it clearly states in the rulebook, they "reserve the right" and athletes "may be subject to".....nowhere does it say the testing is mandatory, or absolutely will be given. The shows are not represented as "drug free" or "tested shows"...
Following your senario....there is no reason to believe that Rando is anymore drug free than anyone else....he would have to have had a drug test by an accredited lab that would show he was clean. Past shows mean nothing...
Sorry bro, your ficticious senario falls apart right from the beginning....
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You are stupid. Especially considering you took a heavily juiced bodybuilder to use as an example.
wtf? Gregg Rando is the legally blind pro that won the overall at the Team U at around 190 ripped lbs at around 5'9". I doubt you need to be juiced to do that, just diet and train your ass off with great genetics.
Wait a min, I forgot the get big rule of any guy with any muscle is juiced to the gills. ::)
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wtf? Gregg Rando is the legally blind pro that won the overall at the Team U at around 190 ripped lbs at around 5'9". I doubt you need to be juiced to do that, just diet and train your ass off with great genetics.
Wait a min, I forgot the get big rule of any guy with any muscle is juiced to the gills. ::)
WTF man, are you just playing stupid or what?
(http://www.gregrando.com/files/gregMain1.gif)
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Howie, how many threads do you need to start on the same subject?
Don't you have taxes to file? Dogs to walk? A kitchen to clean?
Maybe you can read to underprivileged kids at your local elementary school? Volunteer to be a counselor or something?
Seriously bud you need to find something else to occupy your mind.....
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The IFBB could only be held accountable in this senario, IF they chose to announce they were testing, then failed to test everyone equally...They are under no obligation to test, as it clearly states in the rulebook, they "reserve the right" and athletes "may be subject to".....nowhere does it say the testing is mandatory, or absolutely will be given. The shows are not represented as "drug free" or "tested shows"...
Following your senario....there is no reason to believe that Rando is anymore drug free than anyone else....he would have to have had a drug test by an accredited lab that would show he was clean. Past shows mean nothing...
Sorry bro, your ficticious senario falls apart right from the beginning....
Sorry Chic , but their is already a sports legal precedent based on my scenario.
The Circuit Ct for the NJ/NY area ruled against a boxing federation that failed to provide consistant and fair drug testing consistant intheir own rules. It was for a Lt Hvy wt chamionship fight and the loser filed on grounds that they did NOT drug test the title bout ( for steroids). The judge ruled this violated the "public trust" and faith in fairly run athletics.The legal precedent is there already my friend.Unlike some of these meatheads, I fact check and base my info on actual facts and refrences . In all modesty, I have pretty decent academic background and know a little bit about doing research, seriously.I didn't pull this idea out my butt, trust me.
Seriously , check it out under the Ct of appeals rulings for the Circuit Ct of the NY/NJ area.
The IFBB would have to show they do some form of actual testing over the last few years. How many actual steroid tests have they done with pros over the past 5 years? This little bit of info would sink their case.
Howard
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Howie - the 'IFBB' and the 'IFBB Professional League' are completely different things.
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Howie - the 'IFBB' and the 'IFBB Professional League' are completely different things.
The IFBB pro league has a 48 pg addendum on banned substances, check it out
Please check your facts, thanks
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Flawed argument Howie.. Rando is as much drug free as all the other IFBB pros.. I recall his training partner posting on MD at least a year ago and he admitted to administering Rando's drugs.
Aaaaaaaaaaaah, rumors. I love how everyone makes their counter arguments on actual verified facts.
ie....I know a guy who said x,y, z
Plus, Rando is my hypothetical guy in a hypothetical scenario based on sound legal precedent and the IFBB's own rules. * Do you guys understand the difference between a logical argument based on principle vs a personal attack based on certain , trivial details? I was simply trying to make a counter point to the flawed POLICY of the IFBB's lack of active testing.
Anyhoo, you will pleased to know I give up on this LOL
I am going to an ATL area NGA natural pro show sat night.
Of course they will all secretly be useing the juice as NOBODY can bodybuilding without it. ::)
Havee a great weekend, Howard
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That's why they the IFBB should DELETE that Stupid Fukin Rule.No Drug testing = IFBB Pros Drug Rule. ::)
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:-\
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Sorry Chic , but their is already a sports legal precedent based on my scenario.
The Circuit Ct for the NJ/NY area ruled against a boxing federation that failed to provide consistant and fair drug testing consistant intheir own rules. It was for a Lt Hvy wt chamionship fight and the loser filed on grounds that they did NOT drug test the title bout ( for steroids). The judge ruled this violated the "public trust" and faith in fairly run athletics.The legal precedent is there already my friend.Unlike some of these meatheads, I fact check and base my info on actual facts and refrences . In all modesty, I have pretty decent academic background and know a little bit about doing research, seriously.I didn't pull this idea out my butt, trust me.
Seriously , check it out under the Ct of appeals rulings for the Circuit Ct of the NY/NJ area.
The IFBB would have to show they do some form of actual testing over the last few years. How many actual steroid tests have they done with pros over the past 5 years? This little bit of info would sink their case.
Howard
Actually, they would have to show a precedent, as in frequent drug tests, in order for that to be accurate. By consistently NOT testing, they've shown no predisposition, or pattern to claim anything except that they're consistant and all was treated fairly.
The ruling in the boxing case was probably based on the fact that they set a precedent by testing previous bouts.
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2001, which is when he won TU
(http://www.repetrope.com/assets/content/Media01/galleries/14031/fullsize/14031-rando-g-04.jpg)
(http://www.repetrope.com/assets/content/Media01/galleries/12023/fullsize/12023-rando-g-01.jpg)
2005, as a pro
(http://www.gregrando.com/files/WebGalleryImages/Albums/Album5/Large/IMG_3609.jpg)
(http://www.gregrando.com/files/WebGalleryImages/Albums/Album3/Large/aabj0070.jpg)
2006
(http://www.gregrando.com/files/WebGalleryImages/Albums/Album1/Large/_DSC5819.jpg)
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Actually, they would have to show a precedent, as in frequent drug tests, in order for that to be accurate. By consistently NOT testing, they've shown no predisposition, or pattern to claim anything except that they're consistant and all was treated fairly.
The ruling in the boxing case was probably based on the fact that they set a precedent by testing previous bouts.
They tested for diuretics in 2001 no?
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They tested for diuretics in 2001 no?
If you're talking about the Olympia, I believe that was the year they attempted to test....it was thrown out due to a non-accredited testing company being used (alledgedly)
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Greg rando natural?
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If you're talking about the Olympia, I believe that was the year they attempted to test....it was thrown out due to a non-accredited testing company being used (alledgedly)
Wouldn't that set a precedent? They found 5 different diuretics in Jay that year, but then he threatened to sue. That is when the story about the non accredited lab cam to light. Non the less, they did test that year.
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He certainly looks natural ::)
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Another night of Chick defending the IFBB tooth and nail.........
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Wouldn't that set a precedent? They found 5 different diuretics in Jay that year, but then he threatened to sue. That is when the story about the non accredited lab cam to light. Non the less, they did test that year.
That was 7 years ago, Jim.....and not a test since...hardy a precedent.
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Another night of Chick defending the IFBB tooth and nail.........
Where is any defending of the IFBB?
No wonder some of you think the way you do.....I explain why there is no testing, and how the rules read...it's got nothing to do with defending the federation.
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You are stupid. Especially considering you took a heavily juiced bodybuilder to use as an example.
hahaha ;D
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That was 7 years ago, Jim.....and not a test since...hardy a precedent.
Actually I can't believe I posted on this thread. :( I couldn't care less what these guys take anyway. Howie needs a new hobby. ;D
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Where is any defending of the IFBB?
No wonder some of you think the way you do.....I explain why there is no testing, and how the rules read...it's got nothing to do with defending the federation.
The whole thread reaks of the newest cologne being hawked by Bob Chick, "The IFBB Defense"....
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Maybe you can read to underprivileged kids at your local elementary school? Volunteer to be a counselor or something?
Howie is above that drivel and scum.
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Team U champ and IFBB natural pro Gregg Rando, a legally blind pro bodybuilder enters the NY pro.
He stays drug free, looks decent, but places well down in the line up with his smaller mass.
He quietly leaves the contest and heads to a lawyers office in NY that has experience with pro athletes and due process for athletes.
Rando and his lawyer file suit in a NY venue where the meet was held. The suit is based on the grounds that the IFBB pro div. failed to enforce their own drug testing rules. As an active IFBB pro Rando would have the legal standing needed to file such a suit.They could contend that Rando, a drug free bodybuilder who followed the rules, was denied a FAIR and equitable shot at prize money.
Imagine the IFBB having to defend their current "lack of testing" policy against Rando, a blind pro , sitting in court in front of a judge :o
The IFBB lawyers might try to pull " the random testing " thing , but it would fold quickly.
All the other side would have to do is to demand the IFBB show the court their records of actual steroid testing over the last few years ( as evidence). This would prove they don't do any testing and Rando would win the case with ease and whatever judgement $$$ that went with it.
What do you think?
Howard
Howie, whip yourself back into top shape and get yourself a pro card. I'd love to see YOU do what you suggest Rando could do above. You could be the only hope to bring down (or reform) the IFBB and bring some sanity and integrity to professional bodybuilding.
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Actually, they would have to show a precedent, as in frequent drug tests, in order for that to be accurate. By consistently NOT testing, they've shown no predisposition, or pattern to claim anything except that they're consistant and all was treated fairly.
The ruling in the boxing case was probably based on the fact that they set a precedent by testing previous bouts.
Chick, you do not have a clue as to the legality of pro sports law.
Zero, nada, nothing.
All the guy would have to do is POINT TO THE RULE THAT STATES STEROIDS ARE ILLEGAL. He would not have to prove precedent or anything else.
Now take your GED and go back to night school and learn a thing or two.
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That was 7 years ago, Jim.....and not a test since...hardy a precedent.
Hey Johnny Cochran Jr, please show me ANY LAW, ANYWHERE, that says there has to be "precedent" to enforce a rule of a Pro Sports organization.
That has to be the stupidest comment you have ever posted-ever-and that is saying ALOT!
BOOM!
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All it would take is someone to put a bug in the ear of a politician looking to make his or her mark that the IFBB is the biggest offender all illegal drug use to get the ball rolling and that would severely hurt the IFBB. Once the media took over and it went to congress and the all bodybuilders were forced to go natural for a while, revenue would go down because no one want to see a natural bodybuilder and soon the end of the IFBB once the media took over. That is unless of course the politician was hushed with some greenbacks.
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Howie, whip yourself back into top shape and get yourself a pro card. I'd love to see YOU do what you suggest Rando could do above. You could be the only hope to bring down (or reform) the IFBB and bring some sanity and integrity to professional bodybuilding.
At damn near 50 ( will be this DEC), I am too old to have a decent shot at winning the Team U even if I had Rando's great genetics. Plus, while my hormone levels meaure in the ideal-normal range ( 660 mg /dl) for testosterone, I do use Androgel, prescribed to me from my doc monthly.
The return to sanity in terms of drug use/abuse in our sport is way beyong anything some Joe Blow like me could ever hope to change. Now, some icon like Arnold could , if and only if he had the desire to do so.
Thanks , Howard
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Where is any defending of the IFBB?
No wonder some of you think the way you do.....I explain why there is no testing, and how the rules read...it's got nothing to do with defending the federation.
Since neither of us are lawyers Chic, we will simply have to agree to disagree on this "academic exercise" .
As an old fart fan, I just want to see a great pro contest when I buy a ticket and hope for the best when I think of the overall welfare of the pros I watch.
By NOT testing the fans do see a better, upgraded , "enhanced" pro on stage, no question.
I am simply looking at the possible fallout that could hurt the sport I love.
Howard
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wtf? Gregg Rando is the legally blind pro that won the overall at the Team U at around 190 ripped lbs at around 5'9". I doubt you need to be juiced to do that, just diet and train your ass off with great genetics.
Wait a min, I forgot the get big rule of any guy with any muscle is juiced to the gills. ::)
Come on Howie!!........................ ..seriously
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Mike A, Rando is my "hypothetical" subject in a hypothetical idea based on sound legal principle and the IFBB's own , written rules on the subject. I was simply making a point about the IFBB's lack of drug testing and enforcement of their own rules. It is an agrument against the current POLICY.
hen you place emphasis on one individual you miss the point of the principle.
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the truth his, Team U winners are not natural
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the truth his, Team U winners are not natural
Sadly, your words ring true.
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funny how Melissa Detwiller spoke about her hormones usage on the MD forums before the Team U yet she still won her class :)
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funny how Melissa Detwiller spoke about her hormones usage on the MD forums before the Team U yet she still won her class :)
Who knows? Look , my pt has nothing to do with which individuals are NOT 100% drug free in the Team U.
I don't know why, but everytime I try to make a pt pro/con a POLICY in bodybuilding, so many seem to get all caught up in some trivial details. ???
It is the idea that a pro, any pro for that matter , who decided to compete without useing the juice for that show, could file a law suit in the manner I outlined in the thread.How successful that lawsuit would be is beyond my expertise as I am not a lawyer or judge.
Howard
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All it would take is someone to put a bug in the ear of a politician looking to make his or her mark that the IFBB is the biggest offender all illegal drug use to get the ball rolling and that would severely hurt the IFBB. Once the media took over and it went to congress and the all bodybuilders were forced to go natural for a while, revenue would go down because no one want to see a natural bodybuilder and soon the end of the IFBB once the media took over. That is unless of course the politician was hushed with some greenbacks.
I'm very surprised the government or politicians don't attack BB more. It is actually the IFBB and BB that has made steroids so bad in other sports. They see what steroids have done with increasing muscle size and strength in the BB's and feel they need to do the same to help increase their strength and speed and size to help them be better in their sport. Knowing that BB's take a huge amount of roids they could get the results they need by taking less. If steroids weren't so prevalent in BB and promoted so much by the IFBB then other sports probably wouldn't be using them like they do nowadays.
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The return to sanity in terms of drug use/abuse in our sport is way beyong anything some Joe Blow like me could ever hope to change. Now, some icon like Arnold could , if and only if he had the desire to do so.
Thanks , Howard
Don't underestimate your power to instigate potential big change. There are countless examples throughout the ages of "Joe Blow's" and "nobodies" who stood up for what was right and thus changed the course of history. You might not be the next Rosa Parks, but who knows . . . your passion regarding the drug hypocrisy of the IFBB could someday result in positive changes to professional bodybuilding.
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I'm very surprised the government or politicians don't attack BB more. It is actually the IFBB and BB that has made steroids so bad in other sports. They see what steroids have done with increasing muscle size and strength in the BB's and feel they need to do the same to help increase their strength and speed and size to help them be better in their sport. Knowing that BB's take a huge amount of roids they could get the results they need by taking less. If steroids weren't so prevalent in BB and promoted so much by the IFBB then other sports probably wouldn't be using them like they do nowadays.
I agree completely. Most people, including politicians, don't have a clue how much bodybuilding affects professional sports. Even though bodybuilding competition is not mainstream, training and drug use is and professional athletes (or their trainers) use bodybuilders to draw their knowledge from.
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Rando wouldn’t bring up such a suit for the same reason this guy wouldn’t.
They are/were both pawns for the so-called IFBB NATURAL movement.
And we know what happened to Freitas.
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actually,
the rule book states a drug free "policy" as one of the rules.
there is no weak language that you describe, preceeding this policy/rule.
The IFBB could only be held accountable in this senario, IF they chose to announce they were testing, then failed to test everyone equally...They are under no obligation to test, as it clearly states in the rulebook, they "reserve the right" and athletes "may be subject to".....nowhere does it say the testing is mandatory, or absolutely will be given. The shows are not represented as "drug free" or "tested shows"...
Following your senario....there is no reason to believe that Rando is anymore drug free than anyone else....he would have to have had a drug test by an accredited lab that would show he was clean. Past shows mean nothing...
Sorry bro, your ficticious senario falls apart right from the beginning....
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The IFBB have a Drug Rule but they would never dream of using it.It is just there for the look of common decency.Clowns ::)Delete your stupid never used rules. ;D
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If you're talking about the Olympia, I believe that was the year they attempted to test....it was thrown out due to a non-accredited testing company being used (alledgedly)
LOL... you're trying not to piss off Cutler OR the brass. bravo!
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funny how Melissa Detwiller spoke about her hormones usage on the MD forums before the Team U yet she still won her class :)
I call bullshit, Stavios.
Melissa Detwiller is a natural, dude. She competes as a natural in a natty org. I demand proof, or a retraction.
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I call bullshit, Stavios.
Melissa Detwiller is a natural, dude. She competes as a natural in a natty org. I demand proof, or a retraction.
Natural ??? you have to be kidding ?
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Natural ??? you have to be kidding ?
You can't compete in the Team Universe if you're using steroids. I'm quite sure she never admitted use of hormones on a forum, that would be silliness.
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Until you Fail a Drug test your NATURAL. ::)They do Drug test don't they????.
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funny how Melissa Detwiller spoke about her hormones usage on the MD forums before the Team U yet she still won her class :)
Detwiller came on here as well, debating her use and the effects.
And then entered the Team U.
I wonder what natural BB's entering thought about that?
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All she talks about is Drugs and Drug use by her and how well her pussy works.FFS ::)
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The IFBB could only be held accountable in this senario, IF they chose to announce they were testing, then failed to test everyone equally...They are under no obligation to test, as it clearly states in the rulebook, they "reserve the right" and athletes "may be subject to".....nowhere does it say the testing is mandatory, or absolutely will be given. The shows are not represented as "drug free" or "tested shows"...
Following your senario....there is no reason to believe that Rando is anymore drug free than anyone else....he would have to have had a drug test by an accredited lab that would show he was clean. Past shows mean nothing...
Sorry bro, your ficticious senario falls apart right from the beginning....
Chick is right.
Plus, once they found out the blind dude was using GH, Insulin, and test prop/susp he wouldn't win his legal battle anyway. :D
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Mike A, Rando is my "hypothetical" subject in a hypothetical idea based on sound legal principle and the IFBB's own , written rules on the subject. I was simply making a point about the IFBB's lack of drug testing and enforcement of their own rules. It is an agrument against the current POLICY.
hen you place emphasis on one individual you miss the point of the principle.
You used a specific name, meaning you knew of this bodybuilder and knew what he looked like. This tells me you know jack shit about bodybuilding and drugs.
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You used a specific name, meaning you knew of this bodybuilder and knew what he looked like. This tells me you know jack shit about bodybuilding and drugs.
You just illustrated why I can't make logical arguments on this forum, thanks for pointing out the typical mindset and thought process of many out there.
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You used a specific name, meaning you knew of this bodybuilder and knew what he looked like. This tells me you know jack shit about bodybuilding and drugs.
You are another GETBIG FOOL if you think Howie knows little about bodybuilding!
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You are another GETBIG FOOL if you think Howie knows little about bodybuilding!
no biggy my friend, they do have a right to express opinions and make replys, even if they make no sense :o Give me a buzz.
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You are another GETBIG FOOL if you think Howie knows little about bodybuilding!
Look, I know he knows a lot about bodybuilding but why is he making such silly arguments? Bix, do you think he's rational in thinking bodybuilding could get rid of the drugs?
It's like Vince Basile saying he thinks you could get as big as a pro without drugs with the perfect training program. You'd think someone involved in the sport for so long would know better.
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Look, I know he knows a lot about bodybuilding but why is he making such silly arguments? Bix, do you think he's rational in thinking bodybuilding could get rid of the drugs?
It's like Vince Basile saying he thinks you could get as big as a pro without drugs with the perfect training program. You'd think someone involved in the sport for so long would know better.
Ok , sonce you made a serrious , intelligent and thoughtful reply I shall respond in a similar manner.
I NEVER said I felt that any pro could be as big or massive without drugs.
I only talked about the LEGAL issues and drug testing policy in the IFBB pro division.
For the record I am NOt 100% against steroid or HGH use.I do question some of the legal issues.
I am against extreme, risky drug use and behavior.
If you are bored, hehe, read my latest post on how the Manion belly ban edict is a better idea than drug testing.
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Anabolics should be legalized (IMO)......Period. What gives anyone the right to say Yay or Nay as to what we can do or not do to ourselves. Don't be submissive !
"Live & Let Live"
If Steroids where a non-banned substance and it was Natural vs. Chemically Enhanced, "Natural",,,,would truly be a thing of the past.
Like any other banned substance, by banning, all this does is drive the product underground employing many (Shady) opportunists
Legalize and control.
Obviously their are many "Bodybuilders" that are using themselves as Guinea Pigs and introducing many foreign substances into themselves that are effectively unknown. Good for them ?
Maybe not for me or You but again, "Live and Let Live"
X
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Howie if you truly want your 15 minutes of Fame go to the media and tell them your dreams of becoming an IFBB Pro is shattered as they don't Drug test and you refuse to break the law and use a banned substance.So without Drug testing it's not fair. ;D
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Wait...Blind people can't take steroids? I'm pretty sure blind people can still count pills and ask people to inject them.
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Howie if you truly want your 15 minutes of Fame go to the media and tell them your dreams of becoming an IFBB Pro is shattered as they don't Drug test and you refuse to break the law and use a banned substance.So without Drug testing it's not fair. ;D
LOL, the reason I never got close to a pro card is because my physique was NOT good enough. It would not have mattered what I took , I am not that great a bodybuilder.
Once again, the topic is drawn away from the main idea and into trivial personal crap.
If you can't argue your point on the merits I guess you shoot the messenger LOL.
As for the blind pro bodybuilder Rando, once again he was hyothetical natural pro, the fact he is blind is NOT the issue. I also see we have another reply about how 'roids should be legal.Once again I agree 100% , but that is not the issue. The drugs are illegal and like speeding, it matters little what you THINK should happen, it matters what the legal speed limit is.
Why don't some of you seriously try making a counter point based on the topic of the thread idea and the merits of your IDEAS about it.Making personal atatcks against me doesn't elevate your side of the issue, and it doesn't bother me. What does bug me is how so few here engage in actual dialogue about real issues on bodybuilding policy.
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Howie I wasn't taking the Piss out of you.I really think you should go to media and tell them of the problems of young up and coming BBs who have to break the law and use massive amounts of Drugs and they the IFBB don't test as per their own Drug Rules.It only takes one man to change History.
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Wait...Blind people can't take steroids? I'm pretty sure blind people can still count pills and ask people to inject them.
and shave their ass hair :-X
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Flawed argument Howie.. Rando is as much drug free as all the other IFBB pros.. I recall his training partner posting on MD at least a year ago and he admitted to administering Rando's drugs.
The only person that train with greg Rando its me and I have never ever said that!!! WTF get, your facts straight!!
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Howie the change is happening Threads being moved and deleted everywhere.Look at the Politics and Political issues board.That's where they the Power to be think you belong.You must have something they want to HIDE. ;D
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DELETE the IFBB Drug Rule make it easier for drug uses to do it without ever having to worry about being tested like it says in the rules.It's not like it's ever going to be an Olympic sport HAHAHAHAHAH.FFS. ::)
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What individuals do is their business as long as they don't harm others, etc. However, when some take drugs and these drugs give an advantage then that competition is not fair. We can look back at how the Eastern Block and especially East Germany cheated by drugging even young girls. When the communist block collapsed Germany was unified and many wondered how they would fare in the Olympic Games. They didn't fare any better and yet East Germany came third in some Olympics. Those drugs made a huge difference.
According to gh15 and others it is necessary to take huge amounts of various drugs to be competitive at the highest level in bodybuilding. We are not talking about a few pills for a couple of months but persistent, steady use for several years. The consequences and side effects are unknown but no sensible person would or should have to take those risks to compete as a pro.
I think it is possible to get huge without drugs or supplements. That others do not agree does not falsify the possibility.
Bob could do heaps in his position but is silent. It makes me wonder if he still uses to maintain his large muscles. Otherwise, it makes no sense why he as professional athlete rep is not campaigning hard to enforce the anti drug rules.
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There is No anti Drug Rules that's my point.They the IFBB are the laughing stock with such a benign Drug Rule that means nothing.We the IFBB will not test for banned substances you can take that to the bank.IDIOTS. ::)
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There is No anti Drug Rules that's my point.They the IFBB are the laughing stock with such a benign Drug Rule that means nothing.We the IFBB will not test for banned substances you can take that to the bank.IDIOTS. ::)
Laughing stock to who?
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Can we add obliviousness to the list of characteristics required for pro athletes rep?
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To any competitor who reads the IFBB Drug Rule. ::)Chick
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Posts: 6088
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Re: Nightmare scenario for the IFBB
« Reply #71 on: Today at 11:09:57 PM » Quote
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Quote from: Meltdown on Today at 11:08:15 PM
There is No anti Drug Rules that's my point.They the IFBB are the laughing stock with such a benign Drug Rule that means nothing.We the IFBB will not test for banned substances you can take that to the bank.IDIOTS.
Laughing stock to who?
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Chick does the name Jose Canseco mean anything to you?I think he talked a little out of school about Drugs in sport.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Drug Rule.
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Chick does the name Jose Canseco mean anything to you?I think he talked a little out of school about Drugs in sport.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Drug Rule.
No, it doesn't.
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I think he played sport where Drug use was banned you know like all modern sports.And he spilled the beans on who was using what and where.Started as I like to say a huge fire and it's still burning.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Drug Rule.
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Great....who cares?
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Chick, can you tell us again how the rationale for a drug testing rule in the IFBB is similar to the drug testing policy on another random company's books. Hahahahahaha
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How can the Pro Rep send out the message It's Fine to Use and Abuse Drugs as we the IFBB Don't test.Man that's a Fukin JOKE.This house of cards will fall.DEA would not believe how the IFBB works.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Rule.Apart from the fact that Drugs are BANNED in sport it's Fukin Illegal.IDIOTS.
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How can the Pro Rep send out the message It's Fine to Use and Abuse Drugs as we the IFBB Don't test.Man that's a Fukin JOKE.This house of cards will fall.DEA would not believe how the IFBB works.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Rule.Apart from the fact that Drugs are BANNED in sport it's Fukin Illegal.IDIOTS.
Not my fight....
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the the IOC, that ben weider has so desparately spent all his life trying to get the IFBB recognized with.
IFBB drug testing is a joke
the IFBB rules are joke
anyone who tried to defend the IFBB rules is a joke
hope this helps.
Laughing stock to who?
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Bob you are one of the smartest Pros ever and I know that, just look at your charisma and how you don't give a Fuk about anything A True Italian you know the Money is coming in and all this Drug talk means Fuk all to you as you are over 40 with low test levels means Doctors script so all very very Legal.Gotta give it to you Dude You are Livin the Dream.You are one of the smartest.Congrats Amico.
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the the IOC, that ben weider has so desparately spent all his life trying to get the IFBB recognized with.
IFBB drug testing is a joke
the IFBB rules are joke
anyone who tried to defend the IFBB rules is a joke
hope this helps.
LOL.....the IOC....
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LOL.....the IOC....
If the IOC is a joke (and I ain't saying it isn't) then bodybuilding must be an even bigger JOKE since it's not deemed worthy enough to be a participatory sport at the dirty Olympics hahaha.
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If the IOC is a joke (and I ain't saying it isn't) then bodybuilding must be an even bigger JOKE since it's not deemed worthy enough to be a participatory sport at the dirty Olympics hahaha.
Bodybuilding never had a chance of getting accepted into th Olympics, despite Ben Weider's best intentions....and it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted.
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Bodybuilding never had a chance of getting accepted into th Olympics, despite Ben Weider's best intentions....and it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted.
Interesting. I was gonna mention figure skating as being subjective in its judging but maybe it isn't "totally subjective". (I don't know.)
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Interesting. I was gonna mention figure skating as being subjective in its judging but maybe it isn't "totally subjective". (I don't know.)
Even ice skating and gymnastics have required elements to their routines....bb does not.
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Bodybuilding never had a chance of getting accepted into th Olympics, despite Ben Weider's best intentions....and it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted.
Bob, you don't know what you are talking about. It is possible to make judging partially objective by using photos and making the images the same size, etc. That is what a lot of us do after the contests when we examine photos. I wonder what the concept 'totally subjective' means? There is a sense in which all judging is totally subjective because it takes place in the brains of humans.
There is controversy in boxing, skating, gymnastics, diving, beauty contests, dancing, singing, etc., etc.
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Bodybuilding never had a chance of getting accepted into th Olympics, despite Ben Weider's best intentions....and it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted.
gymnastics and figure skating, both are subjectively judged
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Bob, you don't know what you are talking about. It is possible to make judging partially objective by using photos and making the images the same size, etc. That is what a lot of us do after the contests when we examine photos. I wonder what the concept 'totally subjective' means? There is a sense in which all judging is totally subjective because it takes place in the brains of humans.
There is controversy in boxing, skating, gymnastics, diving, beauty contests, dancing, singing, etc., etc.
STFU Basile....
Pictures....LOL Yeah, thats it.
'TOTALLY SUBJECTIVE"...meaning based on pure opinion...no set criteria. The difference between any Olympic sport and ours...even the two sports I listed have required elements that can be judged, they were done or they were not....and almost all of those sports have enough of their own problems with the outcomes with the little "opinion" based criteria they have.
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Even ice skating and gymnastics have required elements to their routines....bb does not.
sure it does.
Ever heard of Pre-judging?
Figure skaters have a Pre-judging of their own, it's called"forms" and it is performed the day before they do their free skating routines.
Sound Familiar?
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There is criteria that judges use to assess and separate physiques. It is not just a matter of opinion. There is even a test for judges so why would the IFBB have that test if all judging was mere opinion?
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sure it does.
Ever heard of Pre-judging?
Figure skaters have a Pre-judging of their own, it's called"forms" and it is performed the day before they do their free skating routines.
Sound Familiar?
Going through the mandatory poses is not, and could not be considered "required elements" as there is not a "athletic move" being performed....both ice skating and gymnastics do...
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Going through the mandatory poses is not, and could not be considered "required elements" as there is not a "athletic move" being performed....both ice skating and gymnastics do...
so I guess that's why bodybuilders are not athletes . . .
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BB dont need no stinking olympics
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I hope you all see what Chic is saying is all true and it is also the reasons why bodybuilding in not a true sport but more of a show or contest. In the Olympics the athletes are judged on their physical performance not how they look doing it. The best built person does not always win. In bodybuilding you have judges who all think differently and have inside their head what looks great.
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bob,
according to you the IOC is fine with the IFBB's drug testing program,
it was just the "subjective" nature of the sport they didn't like.
with smoke and mirror explanations such as this, you will have your ifbb post for a long time
Bodybuilding never had a chance of getting accepted into th Olympics, despite Ben Weider's best intentions....and it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted.
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bob,
according to you the IOC is fine with the IFBB's drug testing program,
it was just the "subjective" nature of the sport they didn't like.
with smoke and mirror explanations such as this, you will have your ifbb post for a long time
*IF* BB was accepted into the Olympics, they would have been subject to the same IOC testing that anyone else in the Olympics is....makes your comment irrelevant.
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"it had (has) everything to do with being totally subjective in it's judging and criteria....without anything but opinion to dictate a winner, it would never be accepted"
Perfectly said Bob !
X
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If the reason why the IOC did not put BB into the Olympics was because of the judging then why did Weider push so hard to implement the Steroid rules and related bullshit instead of not work on something to do with the judging and the way it was done so he could satisfy the IOC's concerns directly. I think you may have this all wrong Chic. Your reason does not make sense.
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wtf? Gregg Rando is the legally blind pro that won the overall at the Team U at around 190 ripped lbs at around 5'9". I doubt you need to be juiced to do that, just diet and train your ass off with great genetics.
Wait a min, I forgot the get big rule of any guy with any muscle is juiced to the gills. ::)
Howie come on man! the team u guys are juiced the gills as any other competitors in other shows. Some of the best conditioned most ripped bb'ers ive seen have been the ams in the team u. You dont get that way from just diet and train your ass off.
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If the reason why the IOC did not put BB into the Olympics was because of the judging then why did Weider push so hard to implement the Steroid rules and related bullshit instead of not work on something to do with the judging and the way it was done so he could satisfy the IOC's concerns directly. I think you may have this all wrong Chic. Your reason does not make sense.
Simple matter of trying to "sell the product" and make it as attractive as possible to the IOC...drug testing was certainly one way to do that and show they were on the same page as the OC...lets face it..there is NOTHING they could have done to change to judging...it's STILL going to be solely based on opinion.
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Howie come on man! the team u guys are juiced the gills as any other competitors in other shows. Some of the best conditioned most ripped bb'ers ive seen have been the ams in the team u. You dont get that way from just diet and train your ass off.
This may the worst "side effect" from drug use in bdoybuilding.
It gets a lot of guys thinking that NOBODY could ever look decent unless they use a medicine cabinet full of drugs.
I competed without a drug in my body from 87-95 and did just fine in regional NON tested NPC shows, even won a few . Considering the fact that I anothing special in the world of bodybuilding, I think this proves you can build a decent physique without a boatload of juice.
Howard
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the IFBB's attempt at amatuer drug testing testing is a joke at best,
the IOC was smart enough to see that the IFBB was/is incapable of being legitimatly drug free.
hence Ben's dream has not been realized, Bob.
the IFBB drug testing is a joke, and although you are trying to paint it otherwise, that is why the IFBB is not a recongized sport.
*IF* BB was accepted into the Olympics, they would have been subject to the same IOC testing that anyone else in the Olympics is....makes your comment irrelevant.
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Bob has been running around defending this and patching that and still the dam has burst. No one can save the IFBB.
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the IFBB's attempt at amatuer drug testing testing is a joke at best,
the IOC was smart enough to see that the IFBB was/is incapable of being legitimatly drug free.
hence Ben's dream has not been realized, Bob.
the IFBB drug testing is a joke, and although you are trying to paint it otherwise, that is why the IFBB is not a recongized sport.
You don't know what you're talking about....again, if BB was accepted, they would have been under IOC testing, just like every other Olympic sport...whether or not the IFBB's testing was up to par, was irrelevant to the IOC testing.
Judging and interest level was soley responsibl..nothing else.
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Bob has been running around defending this and patching that and still the dam has burst. No one can save the IFBB.
LOL.....It doesn't need to be "saved" Basile...it's doing just fine.
Where is this bursting Dam you speak of??
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Bob has been running around defending this and patching that and still the dam has burst. No one can save the IFBB.
Vince, the Arnold had a record crowd this yr I believe.
I am afraid our views on extreme drug use and related issues on physiques are in a very small minority.
Having said that, you may feel that ticket buyers like me contribute to the "problem".
Why knows? In the end I am a fan and simply want to go to a top notch event.
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Vince, the Arnold had a record crowd this yr I believe.
I am afraid our views on extreme drug use and related issues on physiques are in a very small minority.
Having said that, you may feel that ticket buyers like me contribute to the "problem".
Why knows? In the end I am a fan and simply want to go to a top notch event.
He knows not of what he speaks, Howie...
Not just the Arnold, but the Olympia, and the webcasts are triple what they were 2 years ago....money is up, sponsorships are up and athlete contracts are up...
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And Joe and Ben got lifetime achievement awards. So what? The sport still sucks thanks to guys like you.
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And the Prize Money is Fuked 10k for 1st at a grand prix is laughable.Now that the IFBB will never be an Olympic sport which anybody with half a brain knew right from the start.Why not DELETE that benign Drug Rule.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Rule. ;D
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And Joe and Ben got lifetime achievement awards. So what? The sport still sucks thanks to guys like you.
Vince c'mon, the actual contests are pretty decent productions now, seriously.
Being that negative is not your style my friend.
Every era has its pros and cons in any sport.
I don't care for the extreme freak look, but am thrilled with the better sound and light at big contests now.
The OVERALL gym, contest and involvement for serious fans is a lot better NOW than 20 or more years ago.
Ok, we don't see eye to eye with Bob on one rather controversial issue.
But, all three of us have a real passion for bodybuilding.
Let us embarce that, join hands and sing another round of " Pass the protein bars"
I honestly think some of us would love to hear some actual stories from you about your days of training and winning shows like Mr Canada. How about it? You have a lot to share I bet?
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They used to broadcast the Olympia. With the drugs no major sponsor will touch it. Bob boasts of two contests being successful but that is nothing compared to what is possible with the sport were it truly drug free.
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They used to broadcast the Olympia. With the drugs no major sponsor will touch it. Bob boasts of two contests being successful but that is nothing compared to what is possible with the sport were it truly drug free.
Again, you show your ignorance, Basile...it had nothing to do with the drugs...it had EVERYTHING to do with the NUMBERS watching it (or lack therof)...
If it were "truly drug free" it would be as dead as the Natural organizations and interests levels, and sponsorships (few if any) they boast of.....
Lay off the crack, old man..
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Bob if the Drug Rule is benign and the IFBB want to promote Drug use by NEVER testing Pros WHY THE FUK NOT make the IFBB Pro Drugs????Tell the world we are so very happy that all our Pros are Fukin loaded to the gills with that much shit we couldn't even measure it.Now that's growing some balls.Instead of having a Drug Rule for No reason. ::)
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LOL.....It doesn't need to be "saved" Basile...it's doing just fine.
If by the IFBB you mean the Arnold Classic and the Olympia. For Toronto, Montreal, Colorado, the European Grand Prix cities, etc., not so fine. Compare the NOC at the 5000 seat Beacon Theatre a few years back to the NY Pro at the 1200 seat Manhattan City College auditorium. Or the Ironman at the 4000 seat Pasadena theater vs the 1200 seat side room with it's folding chairs at the LA convention center. Or the 20% filled high school auditorium for the Keystone Classic. "It's doing just fine" is a bit of a stretch.
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Don't mention the NY Pro as it only has 6 competitors signed at the moment.Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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I hate to agree with Bob, but he's right... no Olympics and no broadcasts for bodybuilding are solely the result of noboby caring to watch it. Drugs had nothing at all to do with either case.
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If by the IFBB you mean the Arnold Classic and the Olympia.
The Arnold and Olympia do well because they're not just bodybuilding shows. Between the expos, parties, seminars, and lots of other events, they're full weekends that make a fun getaway for a lot of people. If they were just the bodybuilding shows with the same competitors and that's it, their attendance would suck ass too.
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Bodybuilders at the professional level have little or no respect and rightly so.
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Vince:
By others, for themselves, or both?
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From the public. The pros amaze me but I don't envy what they have to do.
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The public cannot respect what they cannot comprehend
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The public clearly comprehends that steroids contribute big time to huge bodybuilders. Can you imagine what the medical and sports science professionals think about pro bodybuilders? QED.
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Vince you are forgettin how much Money$$$$$$$$$$$$ these guys make look at even your Oz show 10k for 1st place and wait for it 1k for 5th now that is some serious cash right there.Makes all the Drug use and abuse worth it.IQ of most Pros= single digit. ::)
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Vince you are forgettin how much Money$$$$$$$$$$$$ these guys make look at even your Oz show 10k for 1st place and wait for it 1k for 5th now that is some serious cash right there.Makes all the Drug use and abuse worth it.IQ of most Pros= single digit. ::)
Here's a newsflash for you....no one ever got in bodybuilding for the money.
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Thank God for that can you imagine how Fukin disappointed they would be. ;D
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Any news Howie on that IFBB Drug testing program.
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I know guys who buy shit off Rando and pay him with monopoly money and then dance all over his braille books...
Howie the world is a cold place brother...Freezing actually! That is one of the reason's dancing is so popular....
It keeps you warm....Your blind friend should quit bodybuilding and hit the streets....Dancing is the future Howie...Your holding on to this natural bodybuilding shit way to tight...Let it go and let your mind go...Look to the mushroom, he is your friend...The streets are the only answer...You can not defeat the rich jews at there own game...You must hit the streets and go underground....You are leading this blind man down the wrong path....It is surely a path of destruction...And why the fuck do you have the words Syntex Anadrol 50 brailled to the head of your cock?...What does that mean Howie?
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Bob,
Wayne,Ben et always refered to the IOC, WADA standards when they
spoke about the supposed drug testing protcol in the IFBB.
the IFBB adopting these protocols (on paper) did not adopt these protocols for the hell of it, as you suggest.
Ben life long dream was for the IFBB to be in the olympics, and this was one steps taken towards that dream.
there are many other subjective sports that the outcome is based on opinion.
Drug usage in the IFBB is as blatant as you get, to think the "Drugs really wasn't the issue" is somewhat naive.
You don't know what you're talking about....again, if BB was accepted, they would have been under IOC testing, just like every other Olympic sport...whether or not the IFBB's testing was up to par, was irrelevant to the IOC testing.
Judging and interest level was soley responsibl..nothing else.
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Bob,
Wayne,Ben et always refered to the IOC, WADA standards when they
spoke about the supposed drug testing protcol in the IFBB.
the IFBB adopting these protocols (on paper) did not adopt these protocols for the hell of it, as you suggest.
Ben life long dream was for the IFBB to be in the olympics, and this was one steps taken towards that dream.
there are many other subjective sports that the outcome is based on opinion.
Drug usage in the IFBB is as blatant as you get, to think the "Drugs really wasn't the issue" is somewhat naive.
Ben doing what he felt he needed to do to get Olympic regognition, has nothing to do with the fact that it can't be judged on anything BUT opinion....and there are NO other sports that are based on such..even gymnastics and ice skating have required elements that can be judged, the rest being subjective with reguards to style, performance, etc...and those are the two sports they (the IOC) ahve the most problems and controvery with (no surprise there)....
I never said they adopted them "for the hell of it"...you did.
At the end of the day, BB was not getting into the Olympics for the reasons I specified....not the drug issue. I've already pointed out....*IF* BB did get accepted, they would have been under the same testing as every other sport in the Olympics...
That said, what you're implying makes no sense, and is irrelevant to the discussion.
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Ben doing what he felt need to get olympic regonition had everything to do with the fact that steroid use in bodybuilding was so blatant, that even being considered for IOC testing would have been a joke. At least now Ben can say / did say that there is testing at the amateur level (which is hardly credible)
this idea of yours that the IOC doesn't like juding based on opinion only when it comes to bodybuilding is sort of beleivable
You talk of required elements that can be judged in ice skating and gymnastics.
last time I checked there are "required elements" for judging criteria in bodybuilding as well. Just check the rule book.
The real issue for the IOC (which happens to be the topic of this thread) was/is the blatant illegal steroid use in the IFBB.
Why would thte IOC even consider a "sport" whose governing body does nothing but reward the biggest most blatant drug users?
Simple logic. drugs > judging based on opinion
Ben doing what he felt he needed to do to get Olympic regognition, has nothing to do with the fact that it can't be judged on anything BUT opinion....and there are NO other sports that are based on such..even gymnastics and ice skating have required elements that can be judged, the rest being subjective with reguards to style, performance, etc...and those are the two sports they (the IOC) ahve the most problems and controvery with (no surprise there)....
I never said they adopted them "for the hell of it"...you did.
At the end of the day, BB was not getting into the Olympics for the reasons I specified....not the drug issue. I've already pointed out....*IF* BB did get accepted, they would have been under the same testing as every other sport in the Olympics...
That said, what you're implying makes no sense, and is irrelevant to the discussion.
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Ben doing what he felt need to get olympic regonition had everything to do with the fact that steroid use in bodybuilding was so blatant, that even being considered for IOC testing would have been a joke. At least now Ben can say / did say that there is testing at the amateur level (which is hardly credible)
this idea of yours that the IOC doesn't like juding based on opinion only when it comes to bodybuilding is sort of beleivable
You talk of required elements that can be judged in ice skating and gymnastics.
last time I checked there are "required elements" for judging criteria in bodybuilding as well. Just check the rule book.
The real issue for the IOC (which happens to be the topic of this thread) was/is the blatant illegal steroid use in the IFBB.
Why would thte IOC even consider a "sport" whose governing body does nothing but reward the biggest most blatant drug users?
Simple logic. drugs > judging based on opinion
The "mandatories" in BB are hardy comparable to "required elements/ moves" in gymnastics or ice skating....athletic moves is what separates what were talking about. Any pro can hit a front double biceps, merely striking the pose does not constitute a athletic move, it's what it looks like thatmakes up the competition...and that is based on OPINION and nothing more.....it's the difference between the short program in womens fitness and the quarter turns in figure...etc, etc.
The ONLY requirement in pro BB, is that you actually DO the pose....
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So Chick what I am reading here from you, I draw the conclusion that the IFBB Judging leaves a lot be desired ESP that the Fukin Sport can't be a part of the Olympics because it's all based on OPINION.hMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM MMM.Sounds Fuked up sort of like that Benign IFBB Drug Rule.Olympics was a pipe dream just like big prize money in BB. ::)
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simply performing a figure skating "required elements/moves" is all that is required to gain points?
well what happens when all competitors can perform the "required elements/moves" ?
that is where they are judged on the actual execution of these moves, based on observation/opinion, just like bodybuilding.
There is written criteria for the subjective judgement in figure skating, but again that also exists for bodybuilding.
The "mandatories" in BB are hardy comparable to "required elements/ moves" in gymnastics or ice skating....athletic moves is what separates what were talking about. Any pro can hit a front double biceps, merely striking the pose does not constitute a athletic move, it's what it looks like thatmakes up the competition...and that is based on OPINION and nothing more.....it's the difference between the short program in womens fitness and the quarter turns in figure...etc, etc.
The ONLY requirement in pro BB, is that you actually DO the pose....
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I feel sorry for this Blind Pro, if he could see, he would have realize the IFBB is completely "Natural and Clean" ::)....ahahahahah
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simply performing a figure skating "required elements/moves" is all that is required to gain points?
well what happens when all competitors can perform the "required elements/moves" ?
that is where they are judged on the actual execution of these moves, based on observation/opinion, just like bodybuilding.
There is written criteria for the subjective judgement in figure skating, but again that also exists for bodybuilding.
In effect, yes....skating is broken down into two categories for judging...required elements and artistic portion. Required elements is just that...a triple toe, line work, triple axel, combo, etc....IF one of these is NOT done, you get points deducted.
Then there is the "artistic presentation"....the style that went into it, was it performed cleanly? the arrangement of coreography, music selection, etc....
Not too strangly....THAT is where all the controversy comes from...as OPINIONS varry a great deal...JUST LIKE IN PRO BB.
I'm not suire I can explain it anymore simply....there cant be any required elements in BB, as it's a "presentation" judged entirely on opinion from the judges.....THATS WHY IT'S NOT IN THE OLYMPICS.
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bob,
clearly you can rationalize all you would like, but the bottom line is figure skating is an opinion based sport, JUST LIKE BODYBUILDING!!
but figure skating and other olympic sports do not turn a blind eye to obvious illegal steriod use. THE IFBB DOES!
that is why bodybuilding is not in the olympics, not this scripted theory of yours which makes the IFBB/bodybuilding sound like the "victim".
In effect, yes....skating is broken down into two categories for judging...required elements and artistic portion. Required elements is just that...a triple toe, line work, triple axel, combo, etc....IF one of these is NOT done, you get points deducted.
Then there is the "artistic presentation"....the style that went into it, was it performed cleanly? the arrangement of coreography, music selection, etc....
Not too strangly....THAT is where all the controversy comes from...as OPINIONS varry a great deal...JUST LIKE IN PRO BB.
I'm not suire I can explain it anymore simply....there cant be any required elements in BB, as it's a "presentation" judged entirely on opinion from the judges.....THATS WHY IT'S NOT IN THE OLYMPICS.
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Chick is saying what milos has been saying for years the IFBB Judges can't judge it's just and interpretation of their opinion.Hence will never be an Olympic sport. ::)
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bob,
clearly you can rationalize all you would like, but the bottom line is figure skating is an opinion based sport, JUST LIKE BODYBUILDING!!
but figure skating and other olympic sports do not turn a blind eye to obvious illegal steriod use. THE IFBB DOES!
that is why bodybuilding is not in the olympics, not this scripted theory of yours which makes the IFBB/bodybuilding sound like the "victim".
A triple axel is either completed, or it's not....where's the opinion? same goes for every other "required" element. It's either followed up by a triple toe or it's not...where's the opinion?
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A triple axel is either completed, or it's not....where's the opinion? same goes for every other "required" element. It's either followed up by a triple toe or it's not...where's the opinion?
i'm no figure skating expert, but not every completed "triple axel" is the same, and thus I doubt that they're all scored the same.
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A triple axel is either completed, or it's not....where's the opinion? same goes for every other "required" element. It's either followed up by a triple toe or it's not...where's the opinion?
I don't think triples are required. Ice skating takes extreme skill, balance, endurance, timing, and choreography Ice skaters are judged on how well (technical) they do the routine they have choosen. Certain elements have higher ratings. If the skater does a very difficult moves perfect thier scores are higher. If they fuck up the lose more. The easier the moves the less points it is worth but it is safer. That is why not everyone goes out and does a triple. It is harder and they have more to lose if they miss it. The judging for ice skating is very difficult and technical. Far from how a BB contest is judged which is 100% in the eyes of the judges. Hope this helps.
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i'm no figure skating expert, but not every completed "triple axel" is the same, and thus I doubt that they're all scored the same.
If you go back and read my posts, I've already pointed out that the judging in ice skating and gymnastics are in two parts...technical program, and artistic...the artistic is where the "opinion" based judging comes into play....
Keith is right about the degree of difficulty, and the performers have a set program the submit before they take the ice...if they miss a move, or fall, or fail to complete a move, they get scored down....NONE of this can apply to BB.
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Keith is right about the degree of difficulty, and the performers have a set program the submit before they take the ice...if they miss a move, or fall, or fail to complete a move, they get scored down....NONE of this can apply to BB.
why not? it would stop BBers from doing dumb shit. ;D
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why not? it would stop BBers from doing dumb shit. ;D
Like this?
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the opinion is in how determining how well it was executed compared to another competitor.
the IOC even considering accepting a steroid abusing sports organization without a legitimate testing program already in place
is laughable Bob.
i this sounds bad for an IFBB official to even acknowledge but,
steroids use is the reason the IFBB is a laughing stock of a sport in the eyes of the IOC.
A triple axel is either completed, or it's not....where's the opinion? same goes for every other "required" element. It's either followed up by a triple toe or it's not...where's the opinion?
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Maybe the bottom line is that the Olympic committee and people in general accept gymnastics/skating as an athletic competition. Is oiled up men posing in their underwear an athletic competition or a drug fueled beauty pageant? I know the sport takes place in the gym.
I love training and bodybuilding in general but the public at large see it as a subculture of an activity. ESPN won't even show it but it will have billiard contests. I would think the vast majority of readers of muscle magazines are insecure teenagers and guys in their early twenties. I'm sure the surveys by the magazine owners would contradict this. I also think the fan base is being siphoned off by young men going toward MMA. I think the fan base has similar traits.
No one involved with making money from bodybuilding would like to see real drug testing taking place. The sport would cease to exist. How would the top ten stars really look without pharmaceutical assistance? No one would pay to see a 5'10" 200lbs bodybuilders. The hardcore fan wants and expects a 5'10" 270lbs. freak of a chemist experiment.
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IFBB are one of the very few federations that encourage the Use and Abuse of Drugs just look how many Pros have been tested in the last 5 years.It's a Fukin JOKE.Even their Rep says the Drug Rule in the IFBB is just there for the image of doing the right thing.Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm m.FFS ::)
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The professional bodybuilders do not have an athletes rep. There is no election and thus no accountability. What the IFBB have appointed is an apologist for them. In other words, they have a stooge and pasty who has a job much like a sheepdog who herds up strays and makes the rest fear even thinking about doing that.
Read how this inept person tries to damage bodybuilding instead of philosophically supporting it. He doesn't have the vocabulary or depth to represent anyone.
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The professional bodybuilders do not have an athletes rep. There is no election and thus no accountability. What the IFBB have appointed is an apologist for them. In other words, they have a stooge and pasty who has a job much like a sheepdog who herds up strays and makes the rest fear even thinking about doing that.
Read how this inept person tries to damage bodybuilding instead of philosophically supporting it. He doesn't have the vocabulary or depth to represent anyone.
You've already been exposed for what you are, Basile...an old blowhard. STFU on talking about what I do for the athletes, or what kind of job I'm doing...you don't know either....you aren't privvy to ONE single thing involving pro bodybuilding past 1970....
Keep posting your nonsense, though....I enjoy you making your bold statements, while having the same knowledge of the subject as anyone with a computer handy...
LOL
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is your position another one of those "lifetime entitlements" that they like to throw around the IFBB?
You've already been exposed for what you are, Basile...an old blowhard. STFU on talking about what I do for the athletes, or what kind of job I'm doing...you don't know either....you aren't privvy to ONE single thing involving pro bodybuilding past 1970....
Keep posting your nonsense, though....I enjoy you making your bold statements, while having the same knowledge of the subject as anyone with a computer handy...
LOL
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Chick
Question......
On the average day, how many hours are put in as the athlete's rep?
Or, is it that little where you can tell us how many hours a month is put in?
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Chick
Question......
On the average day, how many hours are put in as the athlete's rep?
Or, is it that little where you can tell us how many hours a month is put in?
There are no "day to day" duties as a rep...there are times where it is busier than others, certainly...
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Sorry Chic , but their is already a sports legal precedent based on my scenario.
The Circuit Ct for the NJ/NY area ruled against a boxing federation that failed to provide consistant and fair drug testing consistant intheir own rules. It was for a Lt Hvy wt chamionship fight and the loser filed on grounds that they did NOT drug test the title bout ( for steroids). The judge ruled this violated the "public trust" and faith in fairly run athletics.The legal precedent is there already my friend.Unlike some of these meatheads, I fact check and base my info on actual facts and refrences . In all modesty, I have pretty decent academic background and know a little bit about doing research, seriously.I didn't pull this idea out my butt, trust me.
Seriously , check it out under the Ct of appeals rulings for the Circuit Ct of the NY/NJ area.
haven't read all this but the 'legal precedent' you speak of is in the public interest for gambling purposes. Last time i checked Vegas wasn't running odds on the IFBB so why don't you just shut up with your useless dribble.
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There are no "day to day" duties as a rep...there are times where it is busier than others, certainly...
I hear ya...
but lets say in the average month....how many times are you called upon or taking up some action on account of compeitiors needs as the athlete's rep?
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I hear ya...
but lets say in the average month....how many times are you called upon or taking up some action on account of compeitiors needs as the athlete's rep?
4-5...depends on the month and if there is a contest nearing.
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4-5...depends on the month and if there is a contest nearing.
Maybe you can answer this...or maybe you don't want to....
but...
As an athlete's rep....it's volunteer as I understand & there's no pay involved.
If you're making long distance calls or have expenses under your duties as an Athlete's Rep....
Do you claim any of those expenses at the end of the year for a tax break?
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I am sure some Pros would love IFBB to do Drug tests might mean less toxic side effects that Fuk them for life.They might not tell you about their problems but they are there.How is it some Pros go from monsters to little boys in the matter of weeks when off their massive doses?????There is obviously No foundation under all that drug use on some Pros.How Fuked up is that.One week 280lb next month 200lb.FFS. ::)
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Maybe you can answer this...or maybe you don't want to....
but...
As an athlete's rep....it's volunteer as I understand & there's no pay involved.
If you're making long distance calls or have expenses under your duties as an Athlete's Rep....
Do you claim any of those expenses at the end of the year for a tax break?
The only "expense" involved is time....
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Bob you do know the one thing you can't get back is TIME.Dude you are in a good place in life nothing to prove to anyone nice home beautiful wife and a new baby.Time is what you should be using well not worrying about Fukin BBs they only care about themselves.You know that.Fuk wasting Time and Money on that crap.Time better spent making change.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Drug Rule. ::)
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I made a serious allegation to Bob C and he replies that I should STFU. Nice vocabulary and reply. This guy, despite what Howie says, is a mug. I am not personally attacking him. Just stating the facts the way I see it from his behaviour on Getbig. Apparently, he enjoys my contributions as they make his drab days fun. He easily antagonishes others and one wonders how on earth this brute was appointed to a job requiring tact and diplomacy.
Bob uses his 'position' to futher his career because it gives him a current standing and involvement in the professional scene. I would bet he has a VOIP phone so doesn't pay much even for international calls. He surely deserves some IFBB reward for services to the BB community!
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I made a serious allegation to Bob C and he replies that I should STFU. Nice vocabulary and reply. This guy, despite what Howie says, is a mug. I am not personally attacking him. Just stating the facts the way I see it from his behaviour on Getbig. Apparently, he enjoys my contributions as they make his drab days fun. He easily antagonishes others and one wonders how on earth this brute was appointed to a job requiring tact and diplomacy.
Bob uses his 'position' to futher his career because it gives him a current standing and involvement in the professional scene. I would bet he has a VOIP phone so doesn't pay much even for international calls. He surely deserves some IFBB reward for services to the BB community!
There's your whole problem wraped up in one sentence, Basile....
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Vince as an old retired BB champ you know reporters will listen to you if you contact them and tell them that when you were competing a small amount of drugs were being used but now the major BB org IFBB has a benign Drug Rule that is not enforced which infact Rewards Pros with a win and cash and company endorsements for Abusing massive amounts of banned Drugs.Now go and tell the Sydney Times.You can make a change Vince and then you might get a reward for services to the BB community!
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Bob, curious about something....
At an IFBB event....if you schedule an Athlete's Meeting...who picks up the tab for the room you guys may utilize for the meeting?
In theory, who ever rents the convention etc...can actually charge you.
Just curious.
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FOC room sponsor gets a couple of rooms FOC and it doesn't have to be a big room only ever about 5 people and that is with girlfriends.
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howie the problem is not just with Chick being a lackey to the ifbb,
the problem is the ifbb's joke of a testing program.
there was some sort of drug testing of the athletes that was conducted at the arnold,
but amazingly the athletes rep knows nothing about it?
I think this is bit of a stretch Vince and is attacking Bob on policy that he has nothing to do with.
What troubles me, is seeing two champs, from different eras, involved in such needless bickering.
Like me, Vince is against the current extreme drug use he sees in bodybuilding. Bob is simply trying to do what is in the best interest to sell tickets and bring in fans, sponsers, etc. He makes a good argument that would help bring $$ to the IFBB pros he represents. While I don't agree with the current drug policy of NO active testing, I am not aware of a single IFBB pro that wants testing in IFBB pro events.
I know Vince may be frustrated by what he sees, but I feel an intelligent man like him can do a better job presenting his case and opinion, than blasting Bob in this personal attack. I can see why Bob replied with a "STFU", but also know he could have done a better job being a bit more diplomatic .
Oh well, I am just a Joe Blow , what do I know ??? I will just sit back , buy my ticket , cheer on my favorite pros and enjoy the show.
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Bob uses his 'position' to futher his career because it gives him a current standing and involvement in the professional scene. I would bet he has a VOIP phone Musclephone so doesn't pay much even for international calls. He surely deserves some IFBB reward for services to the BB community!
fixed
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Yes Bob did say something about Drug testing at the Arnold I think he said they asked the Pros are any of you using Drugs and they all said No.IFBB Drug test = No Fukin Drug test.
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The sheep who qualify as pros in this ass-kissing sport are not going to make any waves. They have been corralled and know who to bow to and have done that for years. That is how the system works. This is an oppressive sport controlled by self-interested dictators.
Can you imagine if one of the top pros was interviewed on national television and was forthright and open about all drugs and injections he took to win a top title? Imagine Jay going on the Today Show and telling all. It would destroy the sport and everyone in it. It is disgraceful and pathetic that this drug abuse is tolerated by Arnold, the IFBB, Bob Chick and just about all the fans. I say, no thanks. Bring health and sanity back to the sport. Test the bastards to keep them honest. Off season testing, too. Just like other sports. Look at how Marion Jones was stripped of her titles and medals. That is what needs to be done in this sport.
I am sick of jerks like Bob Chick claiming to represent the athletes. That is so far from the truth that it is laughable. Bodybuilding has always been controversial but today it is sick. Chick isn't doing anything because he is another pro who did all that shit to win his masters title. Goodness knows how long drug abuse has to occur before something is done to protect the sheep from themselves.
Mr Olympia is a big title but the honour of winning it evaporated when even young kids know the competitors take drugs. Congratulations Chick and the IFBB.
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and the beat goes on ...
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Vince make a change contact your Sydney times and tell all, you have been a top Ifbb competitor so someone will listen.It only takes one man to make a change.
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(http://www.metromusictherapy.com/images/pic_alzheimers.jpg)
(http://www.alivewithalzheimers.com/nss-folder/pictures/Greenblat_cover1.jpg)
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Bob, curious about something....
At an IFBB event....if you schedule an Athlete's Meeting...who picks up the tab for the room you guys may utilize for the meeting?
In theory, who ever rents the convention etc...can actually charge you.
Just curious.
The IFBB does...the meetings are scheduled around major shows, I'm there on BB.com's dime, or AMI's....nothing comes out of my pocket.
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Looks like the drugs are a political issue. Arnold talked about his taking steroids in the old days when they weren't illegal. He said they test now and even off season. What a joke. Guess Arnold is a bullshitter like most politicians are. Include Bob Chick as a bullshitter. Of course, he is the epitome of an internet apologist for the IFBB so proudly earned his blue blazer.
&feature=related
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The IFBB does...the meetings are scheduled around major shows, I'm there on BB.com's dime, or AMI's....nothing comes out of my pocket.
The reason why I asked is because it shows me the IFBB supports the Athletes to come together for the better interest of the organization & the participants.
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The reason why I asked is because it shows me the IFBB supports the Athletes to come together for the better interest of the organization & the participants.
They do...they had no obligation to even entertain the idea of representatives for the athletes, but basically, it's up to the athletes to be as involved as they wish to be...
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Bob would you support Pros if they chose not to do a show unless the Prize Money increased - Judges were changed around for all comps and the IFBB cancelled that benign Drug Rule or started doing Drug tests. ;DHmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
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They do...they had no obligation to even entertain the idea of representatives for the athletes, but basically, it's up to the athletes to be as involved as they wish to be...
Bob, why don't you come clean and tell everyone what the real deal is? Pro bodybuilding is a butt-kissing enterprise. What everyone learns, eventually, is to not rock the boat. That is why no one wants to be athletes rep and why few attend meetings or come on line to voice an opinion. Anyone who is outspoken gets put down in contests or booted out. The others don't say a word because they all move up a notch if someone is banned or suspended. The rule has always been to not upset the IFFB people or the judges. Seems to me even the athletes rep position is a conflict and diminishes any athlete who does that job. Retired guys like yourself are probably oblivious to what is going on.
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bob come clean, and lose his prestigious position??
ha ha ~!
Bob, why don't you come clean and tell everyone what the real deal is? Pro bodybuilding is a butt-kissing enterprise. What everyone learns, eventually, is to not rock the boat. That is why no one wants to be athletes rep and why few attend meetings or come on line to voice an opinion. Anyone who is outspoken gets put down in contests or booted out. The others don't say a word because they all move up a notch if someone is banned or suspended. The rule has always been to not upset the IFFB people or the judges. Seems to me even the athletes rep position is a conflict and diminishes any athlete who does that job. Retired guys like yourself are probably oblivious to what is going on.
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Bob, why don't you come clean and tell everyone what the real deal is? Pro bodybuilding is a butt-kissing enterprise. What everyone learns, eventually, is to not rock the boat. That is why no one wants to be athletes rep and why few attend meetings or come on line to voice an opinion. Anyone who is outspoken gets put down in contests or booted out. The others don't say a word because they all move up a notch if someone is banned or suspended. The rule has always been to not upset the IFFB people or the judges. Seems to me even the athletes rep position is a conflict and diminishes any athlete who does that job. Retired guys like yourself are probably oblivious to what is going on.
Here's the real deal....
Plenty of guys have "rocked the boat"...Shawn being one of them, and I the other...no one other than us has ever expresed interest in being the rep as it's a thankless job, a payless job, and requires someone who isn't afraid to voice opinion.
I'd like to see your list of how many people have been "put down" in contests or "booted out" for being outspoken....please, list all your examples.
With a rep in place, the athletes don't have to be outspoken, or worry about saying something that might jeopardize their placings...they can channel any of their grievances, opinions or comments to their respective rep....which they have on many occasions.
Guys like me who are out of competition 1 year and retired aren't oblivious....guys that get their info on message boards, were never a pro, and been retired from being an amateur for 38 years, are....
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http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=arguing+on+the+internet&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
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Bob I think Milos and Lee and a few others might not agree with that last statement.Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmm ESP Milos all the dude does is talk trash about IFBB Judging.Is he still an IFBB Pro??????HmmmmmmmmmmmmNO. ::)
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Bob I think Milos and Lee and a few others might not agree with that last statement.Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmm ESP Milos all the dude does is talk trash about IFBB Judging.Is he still an IFBB Pro??????HmmmmmmmmmmmmNO. ::)
Neither one of the guys you mention were suspended for being outspoken..
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Neither one of the guys you mention were suspended for being outspoken..
complaining about corruption is not a form of being outspoken?
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Bob, you really are a stooge, patsy and now fool.
Anyone who has read your posts on this forum know that you said you CANNOT represent Lee Priest's request to enter other shows because he is only one guy. If several pros want a change, etc., then that is different and you can present their concerns.
When are you going to comprehend that what happens to one person could affect everyone? Why on earth should the pros need a dork like you to represent them? If the pro division did things for the benefit of all bodybuilders then there would be no need for a pro rep. Certainly now that you have copped so much negative stuff for your position do you think anyone else would touch your job with a 10 foot pole. Congratulations on your lifetime appointment.
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complaining about corruption is not a form of being outspoken?
Yes, it is....and he wasn't suspended for being outspoken
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Bob, don't try to smooth talk the lads here on Getbig. Lee was told he was suspended for a year. Then this became indefinite. Outspoken guys like him and Milos get the boot. A stooge and patsy like yourself get annointed, I mean, appointed.
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Bob, don't try to smooth talk the lads here on Getbig. Lee was told he was suspended for a year. Then this became indefinite. Outspoken guys like him and Milos get the boot. A stooge and patsy like yourself get annointed, I mean, appointed.
Lee was suspended for a year..initially. The suspension lapsed his then current menbership. He was offered a chance to come back during his 1 year suspension period...he refused the offer.
Lee was suspended for competing for a non-sanctioned federation...not for being outspoken, which he's done plenty of times beffore, and never supended.
Milos was suspended for allegations against an official, without proof of such. He was given 3 chances to provide such proof, he failed to deliver, and was subsequently suspende. Milos had made many comments over the years, never suspended for any of them..
As usual...keep showing your ignorance.
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Lee was suspended for a year..initially. The suspension lapsed his then current menbership. He was offered a chance to come back during his 1 year suspension period...he refused the offer.
Lee was suspended for competing for a non-sanctioned federation...not for being outspoken, which he's done plenty of times beffore, and never supended.
Milos was suspended for allegations against an official, without proof of such. He was given 3 chances to provide such proof, he failed to deliver, and was subsequently suspende. Milos had made many comments over the years, never suspended for any of them..
As usual...keep showing your ignorance.
This is the epitome of a stooge personified. We know what the IFBB ruling was. How about doing your damn appointed job. Oh, I forgot, you are loyal to the guy who appointed you and not the athletes. Do you have a vote on the pro committee?
Hope this helps.
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This is the epitome of a stooge personified. We know what the IFBB ruling was. How about doing your damn appointed job. Oh, I forgot, you are loyal to the guy who appointed you and not the athletes. Do you have a vote on the pro committee?
Hope this helps.
Obviously, you didn't know it...or you wouldn't have made the stupid comment you did...
What was my "job" supposed to be?
Yes, I have a vote...
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Can you tell us who else has a vote on the pro committee?
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Here you go, Basile.....at least you're consistant at being wrong.
PRO LEE PRIEST
Lee Priest, IFBB Pro
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 587
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by lastrep
I am so glad that you're staying so positive, great attitude for sure. Odds are you WILL be back competing again and we the fans really really really can't wait for you to get back on stage! The last few years of competing you really brought an awesome new look, and you're one of the last few GOOD pro from the awesome days of the 90's that's still around.. very good to see!
Keep it low key and cool till the vote..
YEAH ONE OF THE LAST GUYS FROM THE 90S.......YES WOULD LOVE TO BE BACK FOR THE FANS..I HAVE FAITH IN THE IFBB......SO WE WILL ALL WAIT AND SEE...I WOULD LIKE TO THANK BOB AS WELL FOR HELPING ME OUT WHEN HE DIDNT HAVE TO AS ME NOT BEING AN IFBB ATHLETE HE DIDNT HAVE TO DO ANYTHING BUT HE DID SO BIG THANK YOU BOB.......NOW WE WILL ALL STAY POSITIVE NO NEED TO BE NEGATIVE....IT WILL ALL WORK OUT
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The sheep who qualify as pros in this ass-kissing sport are not going to make any waves. They have been corralled and know who to bow to and have done that for years. That is how the system works. This is an oppressive sport controlled by self-interested dictators.
Can you imagine if one of the top pros was interviewed on national television and was forthright and open about all drugs and injections he took to win a top title? Imagine Jay going on the Today Show and telling all. It would destroy the sport and everyone in it. It is disgraceful and pathetic that this drug abuse is tolerated by Arnold, the IFBB, Bob Chick and just about all the fans. I say, no thanks. Bring health and sanity back to the sport. Test the bastards to keep them honest. Off season testing, too. Just like other sports. Look at how Marion Jones was stripped of her titles and medals. That is what needs to be done in this sport.
I am sick of jerks like Bob Chick claiming to represent the athletes. That is so far from the truth that it is laughable. Bodybuilding has always been controversial but today it is sick. Chick isn't doing anything because he is another pro who did all that shit to win his masters title. Goodness knows how long drug abuse has to occur before something is done to protect the sheep from themselves.
Mr Olympia is a big title but the honour of winning it evaporated when even young kids know the competitors take drugs. Congratulations Chick and the IFBB.
Basile, your living in the past bro...Your continuely trying to recreate the wheel and you believe that the fatter you are, the more gold one holds...Just let it all go bro...Try banging a chick under the weight of 150...Ya i know its new age to you but these 500 pounders that everyone is talking about you banging will never be in style...Much like your lat machine/coffee maker/street sweeper...
Chick is dancing in the circle you thought you were once in and its eating you alive...He is the only one to this day who will even answer your email or address you online...C'on bro you still have time to get it all back together...
Oh and one last thing, are you the Basile who manufactured those fake tiny blue dball pills of the 80's? Or do i have that wrong?
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complaining about corruption is not a form of being outspoken?
I think accusing someone was the problem, without the proof.
This is the epitome of a stooge personified.
Vince, you continue to attack, while Bob continues to give you rational explanatins and debates. Once again, the arguement on Lee was debated over hundreds of threads. Lee now has a good chance to come back into the IFBB. Meeting is at the Olympia. Simple as that.
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chick...is there any chance that lee competes in the olympia this year, or does the meeting only reference the 2009 season?
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I don't need blokes to pat me on the back. I could care less if Bob has some support. This is an open forum and I am stating my opinions. Bob attacks me personally all the time so he deserves to get some back. I stand by what I say and would definitely say it to him in person. I don't hide behind a gimmick or anonymous account like so many others out there. Where are all the guys from the old days? Where are the intellects like Zane and Scott to debate these issues? Clearly they stay well away from the internet forums. Therefore, who is left to challenge what is happening in our sport?
The fact that Bob has a vote on the pro committee should make it clear that he cannot compete because that would be unfair to other competitors. The fact that so many rules are either unenforced or randomly so makes being a pro bodybuilder a rather haphazard occupation. Not that many of the pros are truly professional. Bob might call himself a pro but he makes no income from competitions so that is a farce. I swear, bodybuilding has descended into a sordid state where it becomes an insider club and hardly a sports organization. All those appointments and no accountability make it difficult to get justice or make changes. Bob can do hardly anything for guys like Lee. Sure, Lee knows what he has to do, namely kiss butt, and that is what I read in the post quoted above. What a pity he has to do that. Reminds me of the sad occasion when Bev Francis reduced her bodyweight and did all that 'feminine' posing and still they didn't reward her with a Ms Olympia. Don't tell me the IFBB plays fair. I started Bev out in her bodybuilding career and she never got the titles she deserved thanks to Ben and the IFBB. It is documented in the movie Pumping Iron 2. Ben said he does what the majority want and so they allowed fake boobs. That has resulted in the current extreme look that hardly anyone finds attractive. Thanks, Ben. The truth is individuals with a vision have to stand up and speak out about directions and ideals. The IFBB has no idea where it is going and look at the result for the professionals. All manner of restrictions and reduced opportunities to make a living from competing because there are fewer contests and they can't compete in rival organizations. Do I have to mention how insanely dangerous it is to take those drugs to be able to place in the tops shows? Can they find one doctor or sports medicine researcher who will endorse what the pros are doing? No, it is dangerous and plainly crazy. If Bob took those drugs, etc., then he is part of the current problem because it would be hypocritical for him to be opposed to what he so willingly practiced.
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Lee was suspended for a year..initially. The suspension lapsed his then current menbership. He was offered a chance to come back during his 1 year suspension period...he refused the offer.
Lee was suspended for competing for a non-sanctioned federation...not for being outspoken, which he's done plenty of times beffore, and never supended.
Milos was suspended for allegations against an official, without proof of such. He was given 3 chances to provide such proof, he failed to deliver, and was subsequently suspende. Milos had made many comments over the years, never suspended for any of them..
As usual...keep showing your ignorance.
Why would Milos be suspended for making allegations. Other pros and probably judges make allegations of other pros using synthol, steroids yet none of them have proven it. How come they don't get suspended.
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Why would Milos be suspended for making allegations.
because the guy being accused is now the number 2 guy in the amateur IFBB
(btw, Milos was simply the first high profile person making those accusations. I had been hearing the same for years.)
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I don't need blokes to pat me on the back. I could care less if Bob has some support. This is an open forum and I am stating my opinions. Bob attacks me personally all the time so he deserves to get some back. I stand by what I say and would definitely say it to him in person. I don't hide behind a gimmick or anonymous account like so many others out there. Where are all the guys from the old days? Where are the intellects like Zane and Scott to debate these issues? Clearly they stay well away from the internet forums. Therefore, who is left to challenge what is happening in our sport?
The fact that Bob has a vote on the pro committee should make it clear that he cannot compete because that would be unfair to other competitors. The fact that so many rules are either unenforced or randomly so makes being a pro bodybuilder a rather haphazard occupation. Not that many of the pros are truly professional. Bob might call himself a pro but he makes no income from competitions so that is a farce. I swear, bodybuilding has descended into a sordid state where it becomes an insider club and hardly a sports organization. All those appointments and no accountability make it difficult to get justice or make changes. Bob can do hardly anything for guys like Lee. Sure, Lee knows what he has to do, namely kiss butt, and that is what I read in the post quoted above. What a pity he has to do that. Reminds me of the sad occasion when Bev Francis reduced her bodyweight and did all that 'feminine' posing and still they didn't reward her with a Ms Olympia. Don't tell me the IFBB plays fair. I started Bev out in her bodybuilding career and she never got the titles she deserved thanks to Ben and the IFBB. It is documented in the movie Pumping Iron 2. Ben said he does what the majority want and so they allowed fake boobs. That has resulted in the current extreme look that hardly anyone finds attractive. Thanks, Ben. The truth is individuals with a vision have to stand up and speak out about directions and ideals. The IFBB has no idea where it is going and look at the result for the professionals. All manner of restrictions and reduced opportunities to make a living from competing because there are fewer contests and they can't compete in rival organizations. Do I have to mention how insanely dangerous it is to take those drugs to be able to place in the tops shows? Can they find one doctor or sports medicine researcher who will endorse what the pros are doing? No, it is dangerous and plainly crazy. If Bob took those drugs, etc., then he is part of the current problem because it would be hypocritical for him to be opposed to what he so willingly practiced.
The super rich never complain about competition...In fact they know that it is needed...You won't see the guys from old anywhere near the computer because most of them were followers to begin with...The men who come forward are the ones who have nothing to hide and can stand up for themselves and love competition...When the Squadfathers or the Goatboys of the world make a grown man afraid of posting, you have to believe that they are afraid of something...
Vince---I would like your expert opinion on a sofa/sleeper...I've come up with an idea of actually having a sofa or couch that can pull out into a bed...I'm thinking that people in urban areas that have family come by and want to spend the night don't have to sleep on the floor...Its just a thought i've had running thru my head for the last few decades and now i'm actually thinking of jumping on it...I figured you may want in on it possibly...What do ya think?
I also have an idea of a lazyboy/leg extension machine...Something really up your alley...I'll shoot ya a PM....
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I don't need blokes to pat me on the back. I could care less if Bob has some support. This is an open forum and I am stating my opinions. Bob attacks me personally all the time so he deserves to get some back. I stand by what I say and would definitely say it to him in person. I don't hide behind a gimmick or anonymous account like so many others out there. Where are all the guys from the old days? Where are the intellects like Zane and Scott to debate these issues? Clearly they stay well away from the internet forums. Therefore, who is left to challenge what is happening in our sport?
The fact that Bob has a vote on the pro committee should make it clear that he cannot compete because that would be unfair to other competitors. The fact that so many rules are either unenforced or randomly so makes being a pro bodybuilder a rather haphazard occupation. Not that many of the pros are truly professional. Bob might call himself a pro but he makes no income from competitions so that is a farce. I swear, bodybuilding has descended into a sordid state where it becomes an insider club and hardly a sports organization. All those appointments and no accountability make it difficult to get justice or make changes. Bob can do hardly anything for guys like Lee. Sure, Lee knows what he has to do, namely kiss butt, and that is what I read in the post quoted above. What a pity he has to do that. Reminds me of the sad occasion when Bev Francis reduced her bodyweight and did all that 'feminine' posing and still they didn't reward her with a Ms Olympia. Don't tell me the IFBB plays fair. I started Bev out in her bodybuilding career and she never got the titles she deserved thanks to Ben and the IFBB. It is documented in the movie Pumping Iron 2. Ben said he does what the majority want and so they allowed fake boobs. That has resulted in the current extreme look that hardly anyone finds attractive. Thanks, Ben. The truth is individuals with a vision have to stand up and speak out about directions and ideals. The IFBB has no idea where it is going and look at the result for the professionals. All manner of restrictions and reduced opportunities to make a living from competing because there are fewer contests and they can't compete in rival organizations. Do I have to mention how insanely dangerous it is to take those drugs to be able to place in the tops shows? Can they find one doctor or sports medicine researcher who will endorse what the pros are doing? No, it is dangerous and plainly crazy. If Bob took those drugs, etc., then he is part of the current problem because it would be hypocritical for him to be opposed to what he so willingly practiced.
(http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/47/makeitstop.jpg)
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Bob, why don't you come clean and tell everyone what the real deal is? Pro bodybuilding is a butt-kissing enterprise. What everyone learns, eventually, is to not rock the boat. That is why no one wants to be athletes rep and why few attend meetings or come on line to voice an opinion. Anyone who is outspoken gets put down in contests or booted out. The others don't say a word because they all move up a notch if someone is banned or suspended. The rule has always been to not upset the IFFB people or the judges. Seems to me even the athletes rep position is a conflict and diminishes any athlete who does that job. Retired guys like yourself are probably oblivious to what is going on.
Shit...isn't everthing today about being an ass kisser?
What do you see in the corporate world if someone isn't an ass kisser? They are fired for not being a team player.
There's a difference between doing what's expected of you, being a man, using tact........
verses going against the grain.
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Why would Milos be suspended for making allegations. Other pros and probably judges make allegations of other pros using synthol, steroids yet none of them have proven it. How come they don't get suspended.
He wasn't....he was suspended for making a verbal attack on a IFBB official (allegations are one thing, defametory comments, slander, etc are another) It was PROOF of his allegations he was unable to produce that sealed the deal.
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He wasn't....he was suspended for making a verbal attack on a IFBB official (allegations are one thing, defametory comments, slander, etc are another) It was PROOF of his allegations he was unable to produce that sealed the deal.
So after 20+ years as a pro and competing in more contests than anyone else and helping the IFBB for all those years, some verbal rants against an IFBB official gets him suspended. Man you guys are tough. No loyalty to the people who have actually done good for BB. Must have really hit a nerve on this judge for him to cry so much and the IFBB to do such drastic punishment. It's not like he burnt some girl up, or fucks fruit, or gets busted and goes to jail form drug dealing, he actually said some bad things about a judge. Why didn't the IFBB just send him to prison and fine him $1 million. ::)
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So after 20+ years as a pro and competing in more contests than anyone else and helping the IFBB for all those years, some verbal rants against an IFBB official gets him suspended. Man you guys are tough. No loyalty to the people who have actually done good for BB. Must have really hit a nerve on this judge for him to cry so much and the IFBB to do such drastic punishment. It's not like he burnt some girl up, or fucks fruit, or gets busted and goes to jail form drug dealing, he actually said some bad things about a judge. Why didn't the IFBB just send him to prison and fine him $1 million. ::)
Milos was never suspended (to my knowledge) in those 20+ years...and he was one of the most outspoken BBers, never afraid to speak his mind (same goes for Shawn and myself)...there is a way to do things properly, and through the proper channels, and achieve what you're looking to do. I'm sure Milos would have done things a bit differently looking back at what it achieved.
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Chick said
He wasn't....he was suspended for making a verbal attack on a IFBB official (allegations are one thing, defametory comments, slander, etc are another) It was PROOF of his allegations he was unable to produce that sealed the deal.
I thought it was proven that this official was selling "titles" to the highest payer?
Milos wrote a whole thread exposing this injustice....why hasnt Milos been reinstated?
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So after 20+ years as a pro and competing in more contests than anyone else and helping the IFBB for all those years, some verbal rants against an IFBB official gets him suspended. Man you guys are tough. No loyalty to the people who have actually done good for BB. Must have really hit a nerve on this judge for him to cry so much and the IFBB to do such drastic punishment. It's not like he burnt some girl up, or fucks fruit, or gets busted and goes to jail form drug dealing, he actually said some bad things about a judge. Why didn't the IFBB just send him to prison and fine him $1 million. ::)
Milos did make a lot of accusations and very specific ones at that. He shouldn't have gotten so in depth with his arguement without having some solid proof to back it up. Don't get me wrong I like Milos and he could very well be right about everything he said but the truth is he has nothing solid to back it up.
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A thread exposing Paul Chua:
Hi all,
This might be old news for you, but it is time that we blow the cover off the biggest IFBB cover-up of the Decade!
It is with utter dismay that I have learnt from the ABBF website, that Milos Sarcev has been suspended by the IFBB for one year over his allegations of contest fixing by Paul Chua, the Sec. Gen. of the ABBF.
In my respectful view, this decision is viewed in Asia as chalking one up for injustice. With due respect, the IFBB Pro League Disciplinary Committee has committed a grave travesty against Sarcev and Asian Bodybuilding as they have crucified Sarcev without due inquiry into the matter (into the facts and merits of the case) - choosing instead to throw the book and discipline Milos on a technicality (for talking to the media and not going through the proper IFBB channels)
For your information, Mr. Sarcev is a very brave man in facing up to this man who has systematically raped and pillaged Asian bodybuilding for the past few decades. Every allegation that Sarcev has made is true!
Mr. Chua sells bodybuilding titles in Asia to the highest bidder for as high as US$100,000.00! (eg. in the Asian Games) He uses the power of his office as IFBB Vice President to devastating effect, suspending athletes/officials and even entire affiliate committees when faced with exposure.
For your information Mr. Chua was charged in Court by the Singapore Corrupt Practices Investigation Bureau in the mid-eighties for pocketing the Financial Grants of 2 Singapore bodybuilders, JoJo Sinclair and Azman Abdullah. This wily man managed after 3 years of on and off-court appearances to get the complainants to withdraw charges, ostensibly through restitution plus a promise of titles.
He hand picks crooked or compliant judges who are in cahoots with him to ensure that the winner will be the one who greases his palm. So rotten is the ABBF that virtually every affiliated country has had officials changed at his behest and his corrupt tentacles spreads far and wide.
In fact, we in Asia are so powerless to stop this dishonest man that we have to turn to registering a website called www.ArrestPaulChua.com to collect and collate evidence so that Paul Chua can be put where crooks like him belong - in the slammer! The website is up and running. In this day and age of the internet, Paul Chua cannot hide behind the cloak of his office for long! I'm pleased to forward herewith the initial website content draft. A Hall of Infamy section is included in the website, reserved for those who abet and condone Paul Chua's criminal activities!
The obscene haste with which Milos's Disciplinary Proceedings and Appeal was disposed off by the IFBB was a sham from the get-go! Paul Chua is able to carry out his evil, diabolical and inquisitorial schemes and behave with such impunity, because unfortunately the whole IFBB machinery, as it currently stands, is geared towards allowing him to do so, supporting perhaps inadvertently, his delusions of omnipotence! I call on the IFBB Pro League to at least determine the veracity of this vile rape against Asian bodybuilding!
As a matter of interest, Paul Chua holds the Asian franchise for Weider products. Is that why action has been taken against the complainant and not the perpetrator of the crime. It may be a freudian slip, but both the ABBF and SBBF (both controlled by Paul Chua) websites are registered as dot biz. It seems to me that bodybuilding is more than just a sport to Paul Chua. He's never lifted a dumbell in his life, let alone train! He's only in it for the money and the opportunity to make a killing, come contest season. Everything that he touches involves money and his dirty fingerprints can be found all over the train wreck that is Asian bodybuilding!
Finally, do remember that in this age of the internet, nothing can remain covered up for long.... The FBI (if any money from Paul Chua's ill-gotten gains is traced up to the higher offices in the IFBB) and the Singapore Corrupt Practices Investigation Bureau (where Paul Chua commits most of his crimes as that is where the ABBF Secretariat is located) as well as the mainstream media will definitely be hearing from us!
Regards,
Frankie Dee aka Frank D Law
Chairman of Executive Committee
www.arrestpaulchua.com
Hong Kong
__________________
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For Justice, Fairplay and Truth
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Chick said
I thought it was proven that this official was selling "titles" to the highest payer?
Milos wrote a whole thread exposing this injustice....why hasnt Milos been reinstated?
You thought wrong..
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Im sorry Chick.... I guess many of us are ill informed...
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Im sorry Chick.... I guess many of us are ill informed...
Posting accusations from someone certainly does not constitute "proof" of anything.....
Just stating the obvious (or so I thought)...I don't know this Paul Chua guy from a bag of beans, and certainly am not familiar with IFBB amateur/ asia and what goes on there...
What I do know, is there is a way to bring attention to something AND stay within the guidelines of protocol...
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the ifbb commitee chose not to re-instate Lee even after he served his suspension time for competing in the PDI.
his many outspoken comments about the IFBB contributed to this, according to you (at least at the time). Are you now changing your story?
Milos complaining about Paul Chua corruption had little to do with the actual suspension.
He was suspended for not kissing the IFBB's ass i.e. written apology.
its amazing how an ifbb official can twist the truth just to make the ifbb look somewhat credible.
Lee was suspended for a year..initially. The suspension lapsed his then current menbership. He was offered a chance to come back during his 1 year suspension period...he refused the offer.
Lee was suspended for competing for a non-sanctioned federation...not for being outspoken, which he's done plenty of times beffore, and never supended.
Milos was suspended for allegations against an official, without proof of such. He was given 3 chances to provide such proof, he failed to deliver, and was subsequently suspende. Milos had made many comments over the years, never suspended for any of them..
As usual...keep showing your ignorance.
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Q - whats the going rate for a press pass at an IFBB event?
A - completely submissive behaviour towards the IFBB
I think accusing someone was the problem, without the proof.
Vince, you continue to attack, while Bob continues to give you rational explanatins and debates. Once again, the arguement on Lee was debated over hundreds of threads. Lee now has a good chance to come back into the IFBB. Meeting is at the Olympia. Simple as that.
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the ifbb commitee chose not to re-instate Lee even after he served his suspension time for competing in the PDI.
his many outspoken comments about the IFBB contributed to this, according to you (at least at the time). Are you now changing your story?
Milos complaining about Paul Chua corruption had little to do with the actual suspension.
He was suspended for not kissing the IFBB's ass i.e. written apology.
its amazing how an ifbb official can twist the truth just to make the ifbb look somewhat credible.
Comprehension is a problem for you, isn't it?
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not getting owned on a message board is apparently one of yours
Comprehension is a problem for you, isn't it?
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not getting owned on a message board is apparently one of yours
Good comeback....especially from a guy who cant understand wht he reads and keeps asking the same questions over and over...
The only person you've "owned" is yourself...everytime you post.
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Good comeback....especially from a guy who cant understand wht he reads and keeps asking the same questions over and over...
The only person you've "owned" is yourself...everytime you post.
Can you believe people like him have a right to vote ;D
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Can you believe people like him have a right to vote ;D
He's got a few years to go before he's old enough...
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He's got a few years to go before he's old enough...
For the love of God I pray you're right.
Maybe he will get hit by a bus before then ;)
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The IFBB and NPC are one of many organizations for Bodybuilding. Bodybuilders have options in terms of drug test, criteria of judging etc , in various organizations. If you don't like the polices, the drug test, you are welcome to compete in a different organization or start your own. The NPC and IFBB are the most recognized organizations pure and simple for their success. The point that many make about the ability to compete in different organizations is complete lack of sense of reality. No you can not work for Honda and Ford or NBA and the European league....you must choose and they may not accept you back that is just that way life is....
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The IFBB and NPC are one of many organizations for Bodybuilding. Bodybuilders have options in terms of drug test, criteria of judging etc , in various organizations. If you don't like the polices, the drug test, you are welcome to compete in a different organization or start your own. The NPC and IFBB are the most recognized organizations pure and simple for their success. The point that many make about the ability to compete in different organizations is complete lack of sense of reality. No you can not work for Honda and Ford or NBA and the European league....you must choose and they may not accept you back that is just that way life is....
Too bad Basile is to senile to realize this. I never understood why so many bitch when they can leave and go do something else whenever they feel like it. I mean it's not like things just got this way in the past few years, BBers have always struggled to get by and have always needed to use drugs to be anywhere near the top in the I.F.B.B..
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the only question that I've asked you is if your IFBB position is another "lifetime entitlement", to which you refused to answer.
the rest of my posts directed towards you, have merely pointed how laughable your politically correct versions of the truth can be.
E.g. - Lee/Milos weren't suspended for being outspoken.
Good comeback....especially from a guy who cant understand wht he reads and keeps asking the same questions over and over...
The only person you've "owned" is yourself...everytime you post.
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the only question that I've asked you is if your IFBB position is another "lifetime entitlement", to which you refused to answer.
the rest of my posts directed towards you, have merely pointed how laughable your politically correct versions of the truth can be.
E.g. - Lee/Milos weren't suspended for being outspoken.
I didn't refuse to answer it, I didn't see it...no, it's not a lifetime entitlement.
You can point out all you like, you're wrong, plain and simple....I have the facts to back it up...you have nothing but bullshit.
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Bob do ever read the IFBB Pro Rules It states in the rules you can be suspended if you bring discredit to the IFBB or if you talk inappropriately about other Pros.Isn't that the same as speaking your mind = suspension.Hmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmm
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Posting accusations from someone certainly does not constitute "proof" of anything.....
Ah, Bob, takes note of a principle in the philosophy of science. Does this statement apply to your allegations and putdowns of others?
Bob brings discredit to himself, the IFBB, and bodybuilding every time he defends them on discussion boards. Hard to believe anyone could achieve that but tactless Bob is gifted.
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Ah, Bob, takes note of a principle in the philosophy of science. Does this statement apply to your allegations and putdowns of others?
Bob brings discredit to himself, the IFBB, and bodybuilding every time he defends them on discussion boards. Hard to believe anyone could achieve that but tactless Bob is gifted.
Vince,
It's two different kinds of people in this world....The ones like you that only criticized and see problems and other that try to find solutions. A 7 year old could walk in any business and point out problems ...but it takes a different kind of person to find solutions and actually implement them ...well we all can see which category you fall....just keep it up!!!
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Vince,
It's two different kinds of people in this world....The ones like you that only criticized and see problems and other that try to find solutions. A 7 year old could walk in any business and point out problems ...but it takes a different kind of person to find solutions and actually implement them ...well we all can see which category you fall....just keep it up!!!
What's worse is he is really olds and can ramble on for pages at a time basically writing novels and because of his alzheimers he hasn't brought up a new point in 20-30yrs.
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Vince,
A 7 year old could walk in any business and point out problems ...
Yeah, but since Vince has 70 additional years of experience over the 7-year-old, he can point out a LOT of problems.
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The IFBB don't have a problem they are making PLENTY of tax free dollars as a non proffit organization.HAHAHAHAHA Just like their fantasy Drug Rule. ::)
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Yeah, but since Vince has 70 additional years of experience over the 7-year-old, he can point out a LOT of problems.
That is Great ....He and you are welcome to start a new organization if you think you can do better.
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Simple question to the IFBB fans out there. Why does the IFBB suck? They have controversies year after year. No drug testing. No synthol disqualifications, etc. It is a sham. Bob is there trying to patch up a sinking ship. Now, why is it so difficult to grasp this concept?
Let me spell the philosophy out here for those who didn't attend university. Most theories are false. That means statements are often wrong. If this is true then even Bob's statements are likely to be false and wrong. How about that? Bob finally says that allegations don't make something true but assumes everything he says about others is true when in fact he is wrong most of the time. No wonder the simpleton got the nod for athletes rep. I mean, what fool would volunteer for that shitty job? No pro wants it. I don't consider a guy a pro just because he got some silly card. A professional is someone who makes a living from winnings and endorsements. Winning a controversial masters title hardly makes a guy a professional bodybuilder. I mean, give me a break.
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A few of us started a better bodybuilding organization after the debacle at the 80 Olympia in Sydney. We abandoned the enterprise because bodybuilders were loyal to the IFBB because they wanted that path to the Olympia. bodybuilders aren't worth working for. Sorry to say this. This has always been true in open competitions. They resemble beauty contests instead of sporting ones.
It would be easy to form a better organization than the IFBB. First of all there would be no need for an athletes rep.
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Vince are you saying one day someone will stand up and take NOTICE that the IFBB is a Fukin Joke with their Fake Drug Rules and running as a Non Profit Org while making mega dollars and paying no TAX.Seems like a pipe dream No one could pull this off. ::)
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A few of us started a better bodybuilding organization after the debacle at the 80 Olympia in Sydney. We abandoned the enterprise because bodybuilders were loyal to the IFBB because they wanted that path to the Olympia. bodybuilders aren't worth working for. Sorry to say this. This has always been true in open competitions. They resemble beauty contests instead of sporting ones.
It would be easy to form a better organization than the IFBB. First of all there would be no need for an athletes rep.
You were incapable to form a new successfully organization...now you are trying to teach one how to do better. Vince your time has long pass you. If you can not make any constructive criticism or make something better them you are wasting time and making yourself look desperate. You may not like Bob, but the fact is He does something to improve bodybuilding...you...wel l you are here in the boards ...criticizing with no sense.
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Nope, we were not going to the trouble of running good contests when the bodybuilders associated with Paul Graham. In 1982 John Terrilli enterred our nationals because there was conflict in the IFBB so he won our show and went to England and won his class at the NABBA Universe. Paul quickly got John on side after his return so that disappointed us and proved the bodybuilders were fickle and would do anything they could to win a show. Everyone who promotes shows knows this.
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too bad the Ifbb doesn't pay you like Ford/Honda pays its employess,
what do we have here? another piss poor analogy!
try again
The IFBB and NPC are one of many organizations for Bodybuilding. Bodybuilders have options in terms of drug test, criteria of judging etc , in various organizations. If you don't like the polices, the drug test, you are welcome to compete in a different organization or start your own. The NPC and IFBB are the most recognized organizations pure and simple for their success. The point that many make about the ability to compete in different organizations is complete lack of sense of reality. No you can not work for Honda and Ford or NBA and the European league....you must choose and they may not accept you back that is just that way life is....
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that would imply that your term as the athletes rep has a defined duration.
what is that duration?
or is it as long as you're manions boy?
btw - the "facts" that you speak of are slanted. you don't lie about most things.
I didn't refuse to answer it, I didn't see it...no, it's not a lifetime entitlement.
You can point out all you like, you're wrong, plain and simple....I have the facts to back it up...you have nothing but bullshit.
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Self-interest is always transparent in the IFBB. You help the IFBB and they sometimes reciprocate. Or you wait in line to be anointed.
Take Bob's position. Well, no one wants it do they? So, even though there are no elections the default is that Bob keeps his shitty job because none of the other pros are stupid enough to take it. Besides, how can you represent guys you are competing against? That is a conflict. So perhaps it is best that a retired 3rd tier guy gets the job. I mean, what harm can he do? I wonder if he voted to keep Milos and Lee out?
Now, let us be real, folks, does anyone expect an appointed guy and friend of the boss will be disloyal to them? Nope. Bob is the predictable stooge and patsy. Look at the hiding he is receiving regularly on Getbig by guys far smarter than he is. On the positive side he provides well for his family and that can't be said for most pros out there. No wonder he is tenacious about his position. He needs that role to be part of the current bodybuilding scene. You hear him pontificate on those radio shows about the other pros and that surely is a conflict with his position. How can he criticize the other pros re their physiques and then represent them? Clearly the guy has no clue at all about what he is doing. He is the enemy of the professionals and a confederate among them.
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Self-interest is always transparent in the IFBB. You help the IFBB and they sometimes reciprocate. Or you wait in line to be anointed.
Take Bob's position. Well, no one wants it do they? So, even though there are no elections the default is that Bob keeps his shitty job because none of the other pros are stupid enough to take it. Besides, how can you represent guys you are competing against? That is a conflict. So perhaps it is best that a retired 3rd tier guy gets the job. I mean, what harm can he do? I wonder if he voted to keep Milos and Lee out?
Now, let us be real, folks, does anyone expect an appointed guy and friend of the boss will be disloyal to them? Nope. Bob is the predictable stooge and patsy. Look at the hiding he is receiving regularly on Getbig by guys far smarter than he is. On the positive side he provides well for his family and that can't be said for most pros out there. No wonder he is tenacious about his position. He needs that role to be part of the current bodybuilding scene. You hear him pontificate on those radio shows about the other pros and that surely is a conflict with his position. How can he criticize the other pros re their physiques and then represent them? Clearly the guy has no clue at all about what he is doing. He is the enemy of the professionals and a confederate among them.
m
What conflict is there in providing color comentary in a physique show, and representing athletes in matters of rules, regulations, and contracts? Whether or not I believe in my expert opinion, a guy is holding water, or isn't better on a given day than another athlete....has nothing to do with whether or not they are treated fairly by the IFBB, or need advices relevant to their career....
God, you are fuckin clueless, Basile...
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God, you are fuckin clueless, Basile...
Comes from his obsession with fat chicks.
But he's right about one thing, you're Jim Manions mouthpiece and rubber stamp.
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m
What conflict is there in providing color comentary in a physique show, and representing athletes in matters of rules, regulations, and contracts? Whether or not I believe in my expert opinion, a guy is holding water, or isn't better on a given day than another athlete....has nothing to do with whether or not they are treated fairly by the IFBB, or need advices relevant to their career....
God, you are fuckin clueless, Basile...
Amazing he ever won a contest huh?
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Bob it's been a few weeks since the Arnold you said some competitors were Drug tested.Where can we the paying public find the test results????. ::)
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m
What conflict is there in providing color comentary in a physique show, and representing athletes in matters of rules, regulations, and contracts? Whether or not I believe in my expert opinion, a guy is holding water, or isn't better on a given day than another athlete....has nothing to do with whether or not they are treated fairly by the IFBB, or need advices relevant to their career....
God, you are fuckin clueless, Basile...
I might be a pain in the ass to you Bob, but you are a confederate. How dare you comment on other professionals as a radio commentator! You have no shame and do damage to others by your comments. I guess if you had been elected you might show some responsibility.
Anyway, you have no moral authority to say much re other people. You were appointed to your job with the IFBB and you sure as hell didn't deserve to beat Rusty Jeffers. Those judges who put you first should all be disqualified from ever judging again. You received a gift and the only reason there isn't much controversy about it is because it was a third tier contest and few even bothered to look at the photos. You never looked as good as Jeffers nor will you ever look that good.
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Vince I know Bob busts your balls but lets not get too personal you know as Chick knows the IFBB are a Power to themselves and answer to no one not even the tax man nor Drug agencies.They have Drug Rules just for the LOOK never to be used Drug Rules with the Pros.It's a Fukin JOKE.People have even died at contests and they still get away with it.FFS. ::)
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Personally.....
If a commentator can't comment......then what they hell would be his job Vince?
::)
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I might be a pain in the ass to you Bob, but you are a confederate. How dare you comment on other professionals as a radio commentator! You have no shame and do damage to others by your comments. I guess if you had been elected you might show some responsibility.
Anyway, you have no moral authority to say much re other people. You were appointed to your job with the IFBB and you sure as hell didn't deserve to beat Rusty Jeffers. Those judges who put you first should all be disqualified from ever judging again. You received a gift and the only reason there isn't much controversy about it is because it was a third tier contest and few even bothered to look at the photos. You never looked as good as Jeffers nor will you ever look that good.
Vince,
Your understanding of Bodybuilding is prehistoric....It would be better for you to just peacefully accept your age and admitted that you are part of the pass. You are a like a museum ....a boring,angry ...broken one.
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The present day bodybuilding sucks big time. Arnold and others used to deny they used drugs when they were competing. The disclosures came years later. It was considered cheating to use gear. What would anyone make of what the pros are taking now? I mean, ask doctors and exercise scientists what they think of those drug protocols. Synthol? That is beyond absurd and has nothing whatever to do with bodybuilding but everything to do with winning at any cost. Fake, painted on tans, fake breasts in women and fake muscles. No top guy had rear delts like many of the pros do today. The sport is a sham and the IFBB have to accept responsibility for what it has become. They refuse to enforce their own drug rules.
So, don't come here bagging guys from the old days. Things weren't that great then, either, because drugs were used by most who won top contests. When it is all said and done the sport really sucks. It is a sham.
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The present day bodybuilding sucks big time. Arnold and others used to deny they used drugs when they were competing. The disclosures came years later. It was considered cheating to use gear. What would anyone make of what the pros are taking now? I mean, ask doctors and exercise scientists what they think of those drug protocols. Synthol? That is beyond absurd and has nothing whatever to do with bodybuilding but everything to do with winning at any cost. Fake, painted on tans, fake breasts in women and fake muscles. No top guy had rear delts like many of the pros do today. The sport is a sham and the IFBB have to accept responsibility for what it has become. They refuse to enforce their own drug rules.
So, don't come here bagging guys from the old days. Things weren't that great then, either, because drugs were used by most who won top contests. When it is all said and done the sport really sucks. It is a sham.
But they were taking d-bol like tic tacs in the gym.
Kind of hard to make that statement. Maybe they wouldn't claim to take steroids on tape, radio, tv, or any kind of film. But in their everyday life they weren't denying it.
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The present day bodybuilding sucks big time. Arnold and others used to deny they used drugs when they were competing. The disclosures came years later. It was considered cheating to use gear. What would anyone make of what the pros are taking now? I mean, ask doctors and exercise scientists what they think of those drug protocols. Synthol? That is beyond absurd and has nothing whatever to do with bodybuilding but everything to do with winning at any cost. Fake, painted on tans, fake breasts in women and fake muscles. No top guy had rear delts like many of the pros do today. The sport is a sham and the IFBB have to accept responsibility for what it has become. They refuse to enforce their own drug rules.
So, don't come here bagging guys from the old days. Things weren't that great then, either, because drugs were used by most who won top contests. When it is all said and done the sport really sucks. It is a sham.
And it's been 40 years since your day and you are still a whiny complaining annoying ass gas bag. STOP following BBing if you don't like it, it hasn't changed much since your day and it's not going to change anytime soon, it's obvious that your views are in the minority and BBing will do fine without the likes of you around. Seriously give it up old man, why not start yelling at clouds because they block the sun, maybe you can convince them to go somewhere else so you can always enjoy a bright sunny day. ::)
If you want to follow the BBing you are looking for try finding a natural association and follow that, it's been obvious for years now that the I.F.B.B. is not for you yet you constantly complain and whine about how it's run. Follow another organization if you don't like it, it's not the I.F.B.B.'s fault it's the most sucessful and well known out there it's the fault of all the fans and people who compete within it's ranks, blame them not Bob Chick or the Owners.
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Maybe they wouldn't claim to take steroids on tape, radio, tv, or any kind of film. But in their everyday life they weren't denying it.
Vince has said that no pro admitted to him that they used steroids. He wanted to be in the 'inner circle' of bodybuilding but wasn't admitted entrance LOL.
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Vansass talks out of his ass. Who are these anonymous dickheads on the net? If I say that the champs didn't admit to using steroids in the past that is what happened. I bought every muscle mag published between 1960 and about 2000. I know what I read. Arnold never admitted in seminars that he used. He exaggerated how many vitamins he took, too, and said he took handfulls. Just messing with the dopes who paid money to hear him say nothing important at all about training.
To be in the inner circle of bodybuilding in the 1970 you virtually had to be training at Golds Gym in Venice or be a huge guy already. The local lads who were using steroids hardly wanted those who didn't use to have that advantage. It all is self-interest in the end.
Hope this helps.
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And it's been 40 years since your day and you are still a whiny complaining annoying ass gas bag. STOP following BBing if you don't like it, it hasn't changed much since your day and it's not going to change anytime soon, it's obvious that your views are in the minority and BBing will do fine without the likes of you around. Seriously give it up old man, why not start yelling at clouds because they block the sun, maybe you can convince them to go somewhere else so you can always enjoy a bright sunny day. ::)
If you want to follow the BBing you are looking for try finding a natural association and follow that, it's been obvious for years now that the I.F.B.B. is not for you yet you constantly complain and whine about how it's run. Follow another organization if you don't like it, it's not the I.F.B.B.'s fault it's the most sucessful and well known out there it's the fault of all the fans and people who compete within it's ranks, blame them not Bob Chick or the Owners.
Exactly. Can you imagine holding a grudge for over 35 years and still being this pissed off?
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,
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Bob is quiet today Vince goes on and on but you can't take the Fact away that the IFBB have Drug Rules that they never use with Pros.All I say is DELETE the Fukin Rule and don't look like Fukin Fools.Simple.DELETE DELETE DELETE. ::)
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Vince you seem empassioned on these issues, but where is it all going?...Why not start a grass roots movement for the change you want...start out with a web site, recruit others that feel the same way and start letter writing campaigns and organizing protests at shows.
I am not an ageist like many here, I think you can do it and I dont think it is too late at all. You have the background in the sport and the wisdom and experience to educate others but going on and on here on getbig is a hardly a focused and functional endeavor. On one hand you are preaching to the deaf and the other you are preaching to the choir.
I say do something about it, if you think its impossible and too late then you are losing to the smaller minds and catatonic automatons in this sport that accept whatever they are fed.
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It's amazing how Bodybuilders of yesteryear were so smart.
They saw Vince coming & had enough foresight to not say anything about their drug habits.
They KNEW that one day there would be an internet for Vince to be telling all their stories.
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Vince take up the challenge just like nycbull suggests it only takes one man to make a change. ;D
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Now that Bagdahd Bob deal is funny and clever.
I leave and go hiking for a few days and the same crap is being argued ad naseum, and some of you think I am a broken record. I am sorry I even started this thread ::)
Howie, when you are gone for a while I can't tell if it's because you are back on your meds or off again. ???
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So now you wish you hadn't started this thread??Why have the powers that be contacted you and put the needle into you?.Howard you are right to challenge and ask questions.They the IFBB have benign Drug Rules and NEVER Drug test.It's time to stand up and tell them DRUG TEST PROS.
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So Howard if your son wanted to be a IFBB Pro would you tell him go for it son it's a fair playing field they the IFBB have great Drug testing and the sport is SAFE and good for your health.hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm m ::)
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No Howard your quote is Not the Joke the IFBB Drug Rule is the Fukin JOKE. ::)
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I was hiking with the dogs around the state parks of NE Georgia, really pretty.No internet and fairly private.
Sometimes ya gotta get away and chill out.I love the gym , but the mountians are just awesome.
Talk about a fun, scenic way to do cardio ;)
As for the meds... :o
Sounds awesome!!! :) You need to stop taking this place so seriously though.
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Thought for a moment there I would have to clean up the sport all by myself. I don't admire the guys who juice to the gills. That is crazy.
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Vince will make a change for the better.IFBB Drug Rule = No Fukin Drug Rule. ::)
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A thread exposing Paul Chua:
Hi all,
This might be old news for you, but it is time that we blow the cover off the biggest IFBB cover-up of the Decade!
It is with utter dismay that I have learnt from the ABBF website, that Milos Sarcev has been suspended by the IFBB for one year over his allegations of contest fixing by Paul Chua, the Sec. Gen. of the ABBF.
In my respectful view, this decision is viewed in Asia as chalking one up for injustice. With due respect, the IFBB Pro League Disciplinary Committee has committed a grave travesty against Sarcev and Asian Bodybuilding as they have crucified Sarcev without due inquiry into the matter (into the facts and merits of the case) - choosing instead to throw the book and discipline Milos on a technicality (for talking to the media and not going through the proper IFBB channels)
For your information, Mr. Sarcev is a very brave man in facing up to this man who has systematically raped and pillaged Asian bodybuilding for the past few decades. Every allegation that Sarcev has made is true!
Mr. Chua sells bodybuilding titles in Asia to the highest bidder for as high as US$100,000.00! (eg. in the Asian Games) He uses the power of his office as IFBB Vice President to devastating effect, suspending athletes/officials and even entire affiliate committees when faced with exposure.
For your information Mr. Chua was charged in Court by the Singapore Corrupt Practices Investigation Bureau in the mid-eighties for pocketing the Financial Grants of 2 Singapore bodybuilders, JoJo Sinclair and Azman Abdullah. This wily man managed after 3 years of on and off-court appearances to get the complainants to withdraw charges, ostensibly through restitution plus a promise of titles.
He hand picks crooked or compliant judges who are in cahoots with him to ensure that the winner will be the one who greases his palm. So rotten is the ABBF that virtually every affiliated country has had officials changed at his behest and his corrupt tentacles spreads far and wide.
In fact, we in Asia are so powerless to stop this dishonest man that we have to turn to registering a website called www.ArrestPaulChua.com to collect and collate evidence so that Paul Chua can be put where crooks like him belong - in the slammer! The website is up and running. In this day and age of the internet, Paul Chua cannot hide behind the cloak of his office for long! I'm pleased to forward herewith the initial website content draft. A Hall of Infamy section is included in the website, reserved for those who abet and condone Paul Chua's criminal activities!
The obscene haste with which Milos's Disciplinary Proceedings and Appeal was disposed off by the IFBB was a sham from the get-go! Paul Chua is able to carry out his evil, diabolical and inquisitorial schemes and behave with such impunity, because unfortunately the whole IFBB machinery, as it currently stands, is geared towards allowing him to do so, supporting perhaps inadvertently, his delusions of omnipotence! I call on the IFBB Pro League to at least determine the veracity of this vile rape against Asian bodybuilding!
As a matter of interest, Paul Chua holds the Asian franchise for Weider products. Is that why action has been taken against the complainant and not the perpetrator of the crime. It may be a freudian slip, but both the ABBF and SBBF (both controlled by Paul Chua) websites are registered as dot biz. It seems to me that bodybuilding is more than just a sport to Paul Chua. He's never lifted a dumbell in his life, let alone train! He's only in it for the money and the opportunity to make a killing, come contest season. Everything that he touches involves money and his dirty fingerprints can be found all over the train wreck that is Asian bodybuilding!
Finally, do remember that in this age of the internet, nothing can remain covered up for long.... The FBI (if any money from Paul Chua's ill-gotten gains is traced up to the higher offices in the IFBB) and the Singapore Corrupt Practices Investigation Bureau (where Paul Chua commits most of his crimes as that is where the ABBF Secretariat is located) as well as the mainstream media will definitely be hearing from us!
Regards,
Frankie Dee aka Frank D Law
Chairman of Executive Committee
www.arrestpaulchua.com
Hong Kong
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For Justice, Fairplay and Truth
Frankie - are you ready to press the issue little further?
I think it's about time...
I have recently received few more "things" about Mr. Chua and I think it's good time to start...what should have been done long ago...
You know where to find me.
www.milossarcev.com
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Milos laying down the SMACK It's about time someone stands up for the Truth.Oh and the IFBB Rules need to be applied equally.Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmm
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Milos was never suspended (to my knowledge) in those 20+ years...and he was one of the most outspoken BBers, never afraid to speak his mind (same goes for Shawn and myself)...there is a way to do things properly, and through the proper channels, and achieve what you're looking to do. I'm sure Milos would have done things a bit differently looking back at what it achieved.
No BOB,
I wouldn't have done things a bit differently - not a slightest little bit...
I was in Doha (Asian Games) as I was told by several Government officials of Malaysia (including Minister of Youth and Sport - Dato Azalina) that than 3 times IFBB World Champion was told directly by Mr. PAUL Chua that he is NOT going to win GOLD at the Asian Games...
That was disturbing news to many people in Malaysia and Government wanted to make sure their athletes would have best possible preparation, coach and so important gold medal of Sazali Samad would be of National importance!
I was than informed about rumors that in Asia EVERY SHOW is fixed well in advance - due to bribery of their President - MR. Paul Chua...
I didn't take it seriously as I don't just take rumors as facts - but when so many people are talking about it - at least I thought it is not bad idea to pay attention and capture every little detail...
When I got a call from MINISTER OF YOUTH AND SPORT of Malaysia - seriously concerned that their sure to win gold medal - bodybuilder Sazali Samad who two months earlier secured yet another IFBB World title might NOT win expected gold - I started investigating a bit...
She (Dato Azalina) called his name and asked me what I know about MR. Paul CHUA?
As I didn't have a facts - I only said: Dato AZALINA I promise to get SAZALI and LEONG (second world class competitor training in my gym and preparing for the Asian GAMES) in absolutely the best shape of their lives and I promise - I will go with them and not leave anything to a chance...(I went FOR FREE - to mention that fact as many people suggested I was money driven and paid to do certain things...)
I also said - fixing the score sheets is punishable by law and being equivalent to Olympic games - I simply don't see how anyone could cheat...regardless.
Leong and Zali came to Fullerton weeks before - for final prep (pictures of these two spectacular NATURAL bodybuilding champions are on my site)...
They also brought me a list of every medal in each category - as they were told - Paul Chua's highest bidder list of what is going to happen in Doha...and sadly: list they had more than a month in advance was: OFFICIAL SCORE SHEET EXACTLY!!!
Well, at the time I simply didn't believe it...and I deep down really hoped that IF something looks fishy - I will be able to make a difference.
First, I hoped that as IFBB pro I might be recognized and let "inside"...
Than, as I got off the airplane - immediately I was interviewed with panicking Malaysian reporters that their superstar will loose to some young bodybuilder from UAE who's officials had meeting behind the close doors with mr CHUA...etc..etc
Everything was leading towards well rehearsed scenario...but what had happened was really out of the comic books.
In one of the categories I remember my friend Leong asked me - what I THINK ABOUT COMPETITOR number 3?
I looked at the guy - who looked like a badminton player in off season - having little extra fat but certainly not much muscles - to be considered a top competitor (OK I am slightly exaggerating - but not by much...PHOTOS ARE ON MY SITE since than).
All in all I looked at his competition - and said: "well, no way in the World this guy will make top five."
Leong started laughing - he is going to win!
NO WAY. I 'll bet you something like this is impossible. I mean MICKY Mouse with Walt Disney as a head judge can't beat Ronnie Coleman in bodybuilding contest...No way Leong!
"Save your money Milos - this is Paul's boy from Singapore - he NEVER LOST A CONTEST in ASIA...."
"Well - he is going to loose this one..."
and needless to say - Leong was right...Paul's Boy got a PERFECT SCORE!!!
Anyway, what followed was just shameful act of corruption/bribery of the worst kind - and I was there to witness it.
WELL, I did something that I CONSIDERED proper...I informed immediately ifbb president RAFAEL Santonja - who called me minutes before I had very important dinner (about that - little later).
I told RAFAEL what i witnessed and asked him to insist getting ORIGINAL SCORE SHEETS from MR. Paul Chua (JIM MANION requested the same from Rafael - but never got it!?) - as I know that score sheets were manipulated...
But, what really gets me is: REASON THAT I WAS SUSPENDED!?!
I REPORTED suspicion of fixing scores - which I hoped was in interest of integrity of the IFBB...and I was told that I am acting against the FEDERATION?
At the above mentioned dinner - in presence of another IFBB PRO, owner of famous gym in MIDDLE east introduced me to his guest at the dinner table - official judge from QATAR.
he insisted that judge disclose how was judging...with big smile on his face...
JUDGE SAID - i WAS DRAWING FLOWERS ON MY SCORE SHEET...
???
Well - that's all you have to say?
HE SAID - here in ASIA - everyone knows that score sheets judges make are not the same PAUL CHUA uses for the final score...Everything is ready well in advance...
RESULTS ARE IN - BEFORE COMPETITION EVEN STARTED...
My friend at the time - IFBB PRO SAID: "Milos, you remember that I told you how I left competition before super heavyweight class started?
When we got in a car - they announced winner of the super heavyweight class - and competition was still ON..."Somebody" told reporters little early - don't you think..."
Anyway...
While I was watching the contest - Dato AZALINA approached me and told me: Milos, would you be so kind and give TV interview to my countryman in MALAYSIA and tell them what happened here today.
I said: if I say what i really think - it will NOT be pretty DATO Azalina...I am really upset - this is most disturbing thing I have ever witnessed since I started bodybuilding...
NO, NO, NO Milos - go ahead and tell my COUNTRYMAN EXACTLY what you think - don't hold anything back!
And so I did...and to this day I stand behind every word I said...
Show was fixed and everyone knows it...I reported it and somehow I am the one being suspended?!
They asked me to show the proof - and I told them exactly where to find it: ORIGINAL SCORE SHEETS...However - nobody bothered to find them?
Now, how exactly did I breach IFBB code of ethics? ETHICS - ETHICS....ETHICS I am talking about...
I would want to investigate who was ethical in this whole situation...while I am suspended, lost my contracts, IFBB card...etc...etc...
But, truth finds its way out...and I have no doubt one of these days TRUTH will surface...and than I will be one asking questions...but for the time being - I am going back to my suspended corner....
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Milos Chick has said many times you are back in as soon as you say SORRY and you know they want you to lick some balls.So Fuk all the Ethics what's not Ethical about the Pros Rep asking an Ex IFBB Pro to say Sorry to the very corrupt people that caused you so much Stress.
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Milos, pick up the phone and speak to Bob! Don't air your dirty laundry on this forum! It just makes you appear childish and bitter!
Don't you have anything better to do with your time? You seem to spend an awful amount of it, on here, arguing like a semi-illiterate adolescent.
Rather than continuing with your 'bitchy and illogical attacks', focus on readjusting your dubious supplementation programs or spend more quality-time with your 'loving and devoted' family!
Just quit with the further running-down of this industry!
And again, pick up the phone and talk to Bob like any rational adult would!
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They asked me to show the proof - and I told them exactly where to find it: ORIGINAL SCORE SHEETS...However - nobody bothered to find them?
Maybe they couldn't find the score sheets because the corruption goes all the way to the top, Santonja, Ben Weider, all know the score. What do you think Milos? Obviously the IFBB officials who decided on your suspension are in on it if what you say is true.
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Why the Fuk would Milos lie???.He had nothing to gain by telling what he saw.The IFBB have been doing this for Fukin Decades just ask Serge Nubret.
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Milos, pick up the phone and speak to Bob! Don't air your dirty laundry on this forum! It just makes you appear childish and bitter!
Don't you have anything better to do with your time? You seem to spend an awful amount of it, on here, arguing like a semi-illiterate adolescent.
Rather than continuing with your 'bitchy and illogical attacks', focus on readjusting your dubious supplementation programs or spend more quality-time with your 'loving and devoted' family!
Just quit with the further running-down of this industry!
And again, pick up the phone and talk to Bob like any rational adult would!
finally, a sane person. thanks hank.
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Milos, pick up the phone and speak to Bob! Don't air your dirty laundry on this forum! It just makes you appear childish and bitter!
the irony
Don't you have anything better to do with your time? You seem to spend an awful amount of it, on here, arguing like a semi-illiterate adolescent.
the irony
Rather than continuing with your 'bitchy and illogical attacks', focus on readjusting your dubious supplementation programs or spend more quality-time with your 'loving and devoted' family!
the irony
Just quit with the further running-down of this industry!
you get the idea
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Why the Fuk would Milos lie???.He had nothing to gain by telling what he saw.The IFBB have been doing this for Fukin Decades just ask Serge Nubret.
Exactly true. The courts would look at this and laugh. Milos has absolutely NO motive at all to do what he i doing. The IFBB has every motive to cover it up. And now they say for Milos to say sorry. hahaha now what a bunch of morons. I just wish Milos and Lee would get together and take the IFBB to court for something. They would lose in a heart beat in whatever case was brought against them
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Milos is being Serious guys this is his money the IFBB are playing with how to Fuk a mans livelihood.
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Pick up the phone Milos! Make the call to Bob! Stop trading insults on this forum. You look like a child!
Bottom line, if you really feel that 'hard done by' then take the matters to court. Let a jury decide!
The fact is you wont! Because you don't have a case. It is like everything that has become your life; a fabrication, a distortion of the truth.
Either leave this organisation for good or settle it in a court of law....
You are well versed in the operation of our legal system Milos! History has shown you are very good manipulator of the truth! So, give it a shot; if you are that intent on the truth being aired!
And again, i ask you to pick up the phone and speak to Bob. Afterall, you are 'the mind' and possess such superior intelligence!
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Milos, Chick says why bother your Finished well he didn't say that but read his posts I think you will get the general gist of what he thinks of you.
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Milos, Lee: NABBA Pro Universe, Saturday 4 October 2008, Southport, England, UK
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Milos, Lee: NABBA Pro Universe, Saturday 4 October 2008, Southport, England, UK
You can count Lee out...
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Chick can you honestly say Priest will be judged Fairly with that complete back tattoo???I call BS no chance with his history he will ever Win another IFBB Pro show.
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You can count Lee out...
Yeah... Lee's being a good boy... he still thinks he's getting back in the IFBB. ::)
So, Bob, seriously... do you and Manion sit and laugh over a few beers about the way you've been stringing the angry midget along?
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Chick can you honestly say Priest will be judged Fairly with that complete back tattoo???I call BS no chance with his history he will ever Win another IFBB Pro show.
No...I can't. I havent seen what it looks like, or if it takes away from his physique to the point of having it impact his placing.
I guess we'll see when the time comes....
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How old is Lee Priest?
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Man it's his whole Fukin back.No way this could be judged with that much ink. FFS Hell's Angels have less ink.
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How old is Lee Priest?
I think he still has a few years left until he hits 40.
But when he does, no Master's title for him... he's not sponsored by Bodybuilding.com!
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hes 36,
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Milos, you hate the IFBB, they hate you, just leave it at that!
Why continue the war? There are no winners, just ask the angry midget.
Milos, you would 'not' try this kind of behaviour in your native Serbia. The authorities there would have you strung and locked up in an instance!
Milos, i think you just enjoy all the attention. In essence, you are just mocking this sport. You are not really interested in seeing justice. You are motivated purely by self interest and greed. This is evidenced by your questionable supplemention and training programs.
Bottom line, stay in Fullerton and keep an eye on your wife and business. If you don't like 'our system' denounce your immigration visa and return to sunny Serbia!
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Milos made a Promise to his daughter to compete back on stage as an IFBB Pro and also for his best mate Sonny.So Milos needs to say SORRY and get that illusive IFBB Pro card back.Hmmmmmmmmmmmm
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Milos, you hate the IFBB, they hate you, just leave it at that!
Why continue the war? There are no winners, just ask the angry midget.
Milos, you would 'not' try this kind of behaviour in your native Serbia. The authorities there would have you strung and locked up in an instance!
Milos, i think you just enjoy all the attention. In essence, you are just mocking this sport. You are not really interested in seeing justice. You are motivated purely by self interest and greed. This is evidenced by your questionable supplemention and training programs.
Bottom line, stay in Fullerton and keep an eye on your wife and business. If you don't like 'our system' denounce your immigration visa and return to sunny Serbia!
Actually Hank I consider you the foremost expert on this (along with Goodrum). Since everyone hates you and you have no friends maybe you can help Milos. Then he can exactly the opposite of what you tell him and he'll be alright
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Milos, again, if there is a case to be answered, you must then explore it via the relevant legal channels!
You have threatened in the past to take the IFBB through the court system.. Well, maybe this is your chance to carry out such a promise!
Yes Milos, you have made a promise to your daughter, well maybe it is time also to renew your promise of taking the IFBB through the appropriate legal channels.
Time to man-up Milos, and stop calling everyone's bluff!
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Milos is hoping to get the Pros Rep on side then he may have a chance. ::)