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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Milos_Sarcev on August 24, 2008, 02:19:52 AM
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I would really like to get EVERYBODY'S ATTENTION in effort to give credit where credit is due - to my dear friend (and former athlete who is now training /with great success/ with Charles Glass) - Mr. Joel Stubbs - classy gentleman and THE nicest person you'll ever met who just happen to have in my opinion one of the best physiques in the world.
I know Joel since 2005 and I am painfully watching injustice he is getting time after time again at the IFBB pro shows he is entering around the world.
He NEVER places at the top...and more often than not - in my opinion - he is definitely deserving the place among the top 5 finishers [and if I was a judge he would have won several titles already...] - but he NEVER gets favorable callouts and therefore appropriate placing.
In 2006 I urged him to go to European tour as he would had a chance to stand right next to Ronnie Coleman and Jay Cutler - and show the world HOW GOOD he really is (standing next to Jay and Ronnie and BEATING TWO of the very best bodybuilders pose by pose is what I was really after...but it never happened - as he had some VISA issues and never made it to Europe...)
Well, fast foreword to 2008...I am still watching (with even more pain - as I truly admire and LOVE the man...Yes, I am saying proudly as Joel is such an exceptional human being that I don't mind publicly stating what I just did - as he certainly deserves it...being possibly the very best person on this Planet...) Joel getting NO love from the IFBB judges...
I spoke with few about Joel and I always get the same answer: NO LEGS...and I told them - why don't you measure his legs and I bet you he'll have the biggest circumference measurement in the whole lineup...
I asked NO LEGS?
And than I pointed out:
HAMSTRINGS - exceptionally well developed and in balance with the rest of his body - which is EXCEPTIONAL...
Three major muscles of the hamstrings:
SEMIMEBRANOSUS
SEMITENDINOSUS
BICEPS FEMORIS - all 3 very well developed and clearly separated - highly recognizable in rear poses...
GRACILIS also visible in rear poses - is yet another well developed muscle Joel posses.
Besides Hamstrings - in side poses TFL (Tensor Fasciae Latae) muscle of Joel is world class...making his legs from SIDE and REAR VIEW - exceptionally well developed.
Truth is - his legs are still somewhat lacking behind the UPPER BODY...But, here is the trick:
Flex magazine (FLEXONLINE reporters from previous Europa shows) went as far as making statement that Joel Stubbs has THE BEST UPPER BODY OF ALL TIMES!!!!
Imagine the magnitude of that statement!?
The best upper body world have ever witnessed...including Arnold, Sergio, Milos Grin, Haney, Colleman, Zane, Yates, Wheeler, Sarcev...well all the IFBB LEGENDS (suspended ::)or not)...
So even if his legs ARE well developed - it is possible that his upper body (being the BEST EVER) will still overpower his well developed legs...so is this imbalance punishable (which seems to be the case) or should it be reworded Huh
I pointed out to one of the IFBB judges exactly this - and he said - "Well Milos - you said it - his balance is OFF...so that is why we penalize him..."
But, I had to add...than - how come some competitors with exceptional bodyparts - like Lee Haney, Dorian Yates...etc - get awarded for exceptional bodypart that is NOT balanced with the rest of their physiques? Joel's whole upper body is OUT OF THIS WORLD so why would he be penalized when others are reworded?
Hmmm, judge would whisper...you got the point...
WELL - DON'T I? Grin
So - let me continue:
CALVES and LOWER LEG MUSCLES - pretty good and especially considering that genetically he should have problem developing CALF muscles - he had ABOVE THE AVERAGE calves - beating many top Olympia competitors in that department...
Looking at last years top 6 - I would say that he beats Dexter (3), Ronnie (4), Dennis Wolf (5) and Melvin (6) in that department...and many more Olympians as well...
GASTROCNEMIUS
SOLEUS
PERONEALS
TIBIALIS ANTERIOR/POSTERIOR
All of these muscle groups are well developed and as I already mentioned - better than majority of the TOP 6 mr. Olympia finishers - SO KEEP THIS IN MIND!!!
GLUTEUS MINIMUS/MEDIUS/MAXIMUS - also...Well developed and defined...
ADDUCTOR COMPLEX (all 3 muscles: Adductor Longus, Brevis and Magnus) - very well developed indeed and so is SARTORIUS (longest inner-thigh muscle)...
So - only ONE GROUP OF MUSCLES possibly in question: QUADRICEPS!!!
Look at many photos of Joels quads...
It is easy to notice that he has GREAT SEPARATION, STRIATIONS, and fully developed all 4 heads ("ceps") of QUADRI(4)-CEPS muscles...Vastus medialis (tear drop), Vastus lateralis (sweep), Vastus Intermedius/Rectus Femoris
Joel's problem is double surgery he had on both of his knees - souvenir from his basketball days...(by the way - his brother is basketball player and I had pleasure meeting him in Texas last weekend. Please - go ahead and shake hands with his brother...If you don't get the chills down your spine - I would be surprised...He doesn't have a hand...he has a giant baseball glove instead...)...
So, INJURY caused some muscle atrophy or loss...and somehow - in HIS CASE judges are penalizing him for it while OTHERS got a break...
Who?
Dorian Yates and his torn (and almost non existent) biceps...Chris d-i-c-kerson winning the Mr. Olympia 1982 with torn chest + biceps...Levrone, Tony Freeman with torn chest...etc...etc
So WHY is it OK for some but not for others?
Now THAT IS THE QUESTION NOW (rather than TO BE or NOT TO BE...of some...I don't know...well - nobody...What kind of stupid question is that? To be or not to be? To bodybuild or not to bodybuild makes much more sense...Well, if you don't compete...in the IFBB especially...[suspended cannot be suspended again...like double jeopardy... Grin Grin Grin]
OK, I am joking here - when I am talking about very serious issue.
Joel Stubbs is consummate professional who is putting a lot of effort into his profession enduring numerous sacrifices along the way...
He knows that competing at the highest level means possibility of the highest awards and therefore all the sacrifices are somewhat easier to cope with - believing that one of these days he will get his DUE justice and maybe MAKE SOME MONEY before he turns 100 years old...when winning Olympia and getting few million $ just wouldn't matter - like it would if he gets it TODAY (or the way I see it by 2009...)
Please, please, please - for the love of God - can more of you speak up and force judges to recognize and realize that Joel Stubbs should be getting comparisons with the very best...and I certainly hope that he would get his chance to possibly qualify for the Mr. Olympia in the next contest (Atlantic City...)...just weeks away...
Here is Joel at the Europa Supershow 2008
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Meltdown?
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Huge beyond belief. :o
Tell him to step up the g4p and he should start placing better. :-X :-X
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.
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more pics of Joel Stubbs(placed 14th among 40 competitors at 2008 Europa)
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i dont think his proportion allow the judges to place him higher
he is extremly wide, but has not the density of the "real greatest upper bodys in history" (this statement probably made by FLEX magazine is wrong, even his back is not as good as considered often)
and his legs are weak
i know, it s not easy to bild full quads beeing that tall, but his package is uncomplete an will remain uncomplete for ever
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more pics of Joel Stubbs(placed 14th among 40 competitors at 2008 Europa)
Soooooooft.
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I agree with you Milos.
Stubbs is very impressive.
Yates had the worst arms on any Olympia competitor
in history, and still Dorian won with perfect scores.
"Pro" BB shows is not about who have the best body.
Other things come into play first.
How you look is #4 on the list.
Ask Cutler, he laugh at those who believe in hard training and fair judging.
Stubbs legs have a huge gap between Vastus Medialis, Lateralis,
Rectus femoris and the patella.
Giving the illusion his Rectus Femoris insert too high.
If he could fill that area with something, silicone or whatever the surgeon
will chose.
Cover that area on the photo with a pen and see that it looks much better.
I wish him good luck and hope he stay injury free.
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Joel Stubbs - real man. But ... He is very modest. A Hercules - is also "no legs." But Hercules - this is Hercules. The judges think the image of bodybuilding. Patience ... Joel
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big guy
weak quads, and the forearms of a member of the croquet team
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The weaknesses are so blurring its not even funny Milos
Non existant FOREARMS, totally throws him off
His quads are unfortunetly too small, again balance is off
Conditioning is no way good enough, he is soft compared to the top guys.
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huge guy shoulder back chest...
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arms dwarved by shoulders...
and his legs are too small for his upper body
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i dont think his proportion allow the judges to place him higher
he is extremly wide, but has not the density of the "real greatest upper bodys in history" (this statement probably made by FLEX magazine is wrong, even his back is not as good as considered often)
and his legs are weak
i know, it s not easy to bild full quads beeing that tall, but his package is uncomplete an will remain uncomplete for ever
by that rational, he would have placed better if he looked worse???? dude is phenonimal, he is one of the best ever!!!
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Mr.Olympia upper body with the low level amateur legs.
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I would really like to get EVERYBODY'S ATTENTION in effort to give credit where credit is due - to my dear friend (and former athlete who is now training /with great success/ with Charles Glass) - Mr. Joel Stubbs - classy gentleman and THE nicest person you'll ever met who just happen to have in my opinion one of the best physiques in the world.
I know Joel since 2005 and I am painfully watching injustice he is getting time after time again at the IFBB pro shows he is entering around the world.
He NEVER places at the top...and more often than not - in my opinion - he is definitely deserving the place among the top 5 finishers [and if I was a judge he would have won several titles already...] - but he NEVER gets favorable callouts and therefore appropriate placing.
In 2006 I urged him to go to European tour as he would had a chance to stand right next to Ronnie Coleman and Jay Cutler - and show the world HOW GOOD he really is (standing next to Jay and Ronnie and BEATING TWO of the very best bodybuilders pose by pose is what I was really after...but it never happened - as he had some VISA issues and never made it to Europe...)
Well, fast foreword to 2008...I am still watching (with even more pain - as I truly admire and LOVE the man...Yes, I am saying proudly as Joel is such an exceptional human being that I don't mind publicly stating what I just did - as he certainly deserves it...being possibly the very best person on this Planet...) Joel getting NO love from the IFBB judges...
I spoke with few about Joel and I always get the same answer: NO LEGS...and I told them - why don't you measure his legs and I bet you he'll have the biggest circumference measurement in the whole lineup...
I asked NO LEGS?
And than I pointed out:
HAMSTRINGS - exceptionally well developed and in balance with the rest of his body - which is EXCEPTIONAL...
Three major muscles of the hamstrings:
SEMIMEBRANOSUS
SEMITENDINOSUS
BICEPS FEMORIS - all 3 very well developed and clearly separated - highly recognizable in rear poses...
GRACILIS also visible in rear poses - is yet another well developed muscle Joel posses.
Besides Hamstrings - in side poses TFL (Tensor Fasciae Latae) muscle of Joel is world class...making his legs from SIDE and REAR VIEW - exceptionally well developed.
Truth is - his legs are still somewhat lacking behind the UPPER BODY...But, here is the trick:
Flex magazine (FLEXONLINE reporters from previous Europa shows) went as far as making statement that Joel Stubbs has THE BEST UPPER BODY OF ALL TIMES!!!!
Imagine the magnitude of that statement!?
The best upper body world have ever witnessed...including Arnold, Sergio, Milos Grin, Haney, Colleman, Zane, Yates, Wheeler, Sarcev...well all the IFBB LEGENDS (suspended ::)or not)...
So even if his legs ARE well developed - it is possible that his upper body (being the BEST EVER) will still overpower his well developed legs...so is this imbalance punishable (which seems to be the case) or should it be reworded Huh
I pointed out to one of the IFBB judges exactly this - and he said - "Well Milos - you said it - his balance is OFF...so that is why we penalize him..."
But, I had to add...than - how come some competitors with exceptional bodyparts - like Lee Haney, Dorian Yates...etc - get awarded for exceptional bodypart that is NOT balanced with the rest of their physiques? Joel's whole upper body is OUT OF THIS WORLD so why would he be penalized when others are reworded?
Hmmm, judge would whisper...you got the point...
WELL - DON'T I? Grin
So - let me continue:
CALVES and LOWER LEG MUSCLES - pretty good and especially considering that genetically he should have problem developing CALF muscles - he had ABOVE THE AVERAGE calves - beating many top Olympia competitors in that department...
Looking at last years top 6 - I would say that he beats Dexter (3), Ronnie (4), Dennis Wolf (5) and Melvin (6) in that department...and many more Olympians as well...
GASTROCNEMIUS
SOLEUS
PERONEALS
TIBIALIS ANTERIOR/POSTERIOR
All of these muscle groups are well developed and as I already mentioned - better than majority of the TOP 6 mr. Olympia finishers - SO KEEP THIS IN MIND!!!
GLUTEUS MINIMUS/MEDIUS/MAXIMUS - also...Well developed and defined...
ADDUCTOR COMPLEX (all 3 muscles: Adductor Longus, Brevis and Magnus) - very well developed indeed and so is SARTORIUS (longest inner-thigh muscle)...
So - only ONE GROUP OF MUSCLES possibly in question: QUADRICEPS!!!
Look at many photos of Joels quads...
It is easy to notice that he has GREAT SEPARATION, STRIATIONS, and fully developed all 4 heads ("ceps") of QUADRI(4)-CEPS muscles...Vastus medialis (tear drop), Vastus lateralis (sweep), Vastus Intermedius/Rectus Femoris
Joel's problem is double surgery he had on both of his knees - souvenir from his basketball days...(by the way - his brother is basketball player and I had pleasure meeting him in Texas last weekend. Please - go ahead and shake hands with his brother...If you don't get the chills down your spine - I would be surprised...He doesn't have a hand...he has a giant baseball glove instead...)...
So, INJURY caused some muscle atrophy or loss...and somehow - in HIS CASE judges are penalizing him for it while OTHERS got a break...
Who?
Dorian Yates and his torn (and almost non existent) biceps...Chris d-i-c-kerson winning the Mr. Olympia 1982 with torn chest + biceps...Levrone, Tony Freeman with torn chest...etc...etc
So WHY is it OK for some but not for others?
Now THAT IS THE QUESTION NOW (rather than TO BE or NOT TO BE...of some...I don't know...well - nobody...What kind of stupid question is that? To be or not to be? To bodybuild or not to bodybuild makes much more sense...Well, if you don't compete...in the IFBB especially...[suspended cannot be suspended again...like double jeopardy... Grin Grin Grin]
OK, I am joking here - when I am talking about very serious issue.
Joel Stubbs is consummate professional who is putting a lot of effort into his profession enduring numerous sacrifices along the way...
He knows that competing at the highest level means possibility of the highest awards and therefore all the sacrifices are somewhat easier to cope with - believing that one of these days he will get his DUE justice and maybe MAKE SOME MONEY before he turns 100 years old...when winning Olympia and getting few million $ just wouldn't matter - like it would if he gets it TODAY (or the way I see it by 2009...)
Please, please, please - for the love of God - can more of you speak up and force judges to recognize and realize that Joel Stubbs should be getting comparisons with the very best...and I certainly hope that he would get his chance to possibly qualify for the Mr. Olympia in the next contest (Atlantic City...)...just weeks away...
Here is Joel at the Europa Supershow 2008
MILOS HOW MANY CALORIES DOES HE TAKE IN? Us musgayners are tweakin out of our spine to know this crucial informations from the great Milos , the master of getting hoes for over 4 straight decades?
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The problem Milos....
His waist is too small, gut is not distended enough!!!
IFBB only truly awards the preggo bellies!
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Looks impressive!! Needs to up the dosages!!
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I like how Milos conveniently left out full body photos, ::)
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big dude, all the way big dude
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monster calves.
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he is extremly wide, but has not the density of the "real greatest upper bodys in history" (this statement probably made by FLEX magazine is wrong, even his back is not as good as considered often)
and his legs are weak
i know, it s not easy to bild full quads beeing that tall, but his package is uncomplete an will remain uncomplete for ever
Agreed about the density.
Calves aren't THAT great, forearms create a terrible arm inbalance (even as far as making the biceps/triceps look small in the front double biceps - I'd work on that pose), hamstring separation is non-existant in the 2008 Europa shots. But he does have great points like a massive chest and back, thick legs and arms from the side and wide shouldered.
Best shot, besides the front lat spread:
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=230528.0;attach=269965;image)
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Milos,
I can see where your coming from, but just can't agree with you. Joel Stubbs upper body is untouchable, perhaps the best today. You have heard this over and over again, that he lacks development in the lower body. Well, maybe not development, but definitely size to match his upper body. It doesn't matter about the tape measure or how big his muscles are. Bodybuilding has to do with symmetry and proportions. You should know this as you are a IFBB pro known to many to have one of the best symmetrical physiques out there. It is ashame that he doesn't get the callouts and comparisons. I would love to see him stand next to Jay or Dennis Wolf.
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That's not Michael Arvilla.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=230528.0;attach=269963;image)
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i agree with Milos, Joel is an incredible bodybuilder.
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Milos has posted this before :"Joel's problem is double surgery he had on both of his knees - souvenir from his basketball days."
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That's not Michael Arvilla.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=230528.0;attach=269963;image)
>:( >:( >:(
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We're all entitled to our opinion. I agree with Milos and think Joel Stubbs should have gotten way better call-outs and placed much higher in the shows I have seen.
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He'd place much better with legs. Too bad.
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it's not even about the legs, his whole frame is so big and wide that he doesn't have the same muscle density as the other guys.
awesome bodybuilder (just like every IFBB PRO, you have to look damn good to be on a pro stage)
but I think he pretty much placed where he deserved the whole time
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milos here's the truth about joel:
the bad:
1.pecs are wide, but aren't thick
2.has no forearms.(this is a biggy in my eyes as it makes a lot of his poses look poor)
3.conditioning is poor, he always looks soft.
4.posing is poor, he needsd more work to help hide his weaknesses.
5.quads are a disgrace.
the good:
1.back is probably the best in the world.
2.he's black so probably has a 9" penis (the judges like that)
3.if he improves 'the bad' above (even slightly) he would probably be one of the best if not the best.
however if his quads are stuck like that forever he'll struggle to win a major show. It might not be fair, but thats life - but at least he still has a big shlong. :D
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2.he's black so probably has a 9" penis (the judges like that)
Roflmao.
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agree with milos, I was at the australian grand prix 2007 and i remember when it was pre judging and stubbs came out, everyone in the crowd was just in shock on how big this dude was, even heard a few people yellin some ronnie coleman sayings hahaha....he shoulda been top 3 or 4 in that contest
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;) FRONT RELAX
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;D
SIDE RELAX
COMPLETE BODY (LEGS INCLUDED) - JUDGE JOEL NEXT TO TONY (winner of this contest)...and top guys - JJ DCH
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;D ;D ;D ;D ;DREAR RELAX :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
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Just in case you didn't notice ::) ::) ::) the difference....
COMPLETE REAR VIEW - LEGS INCLUDED - HOW CAN JOEL LOOSE THIS ROUND?
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Milos, any of the guys in your team ever place TOO HIGH?
Why do the judges only punish your guys?
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Milos, any of the guys in your team ever place TOO HIGH?
Why do the judges only punish your guys?
;D ;D ;D You noticed... conspiracy...
Well - at least you know if you are Milos's athlete and you place - than as soon as you leave him you'll win... ;)
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;)other side...
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well...here we go...FRONT LAT SPREAD
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FRONT DBL BICEPS
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Its intersting that his legs dont look weak from rear.
BTW his back is not of this world..
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SIDE CHEST ;) ;) ;)
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SIDE CHEST ;) ;) ;)
he seems too long and lanky
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PAY ATENCION - with Spanish accent (for better effect)
Ouch...
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SIDE CHEST ;) ;) ;)
As for side chest, I vote for JJ.
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AND...here we go...REAR VIEW... 8) 8) 8)
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Good thing is - judges are close to the stage...and they can see what's going on...off course IF they open their eyes... ::)
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PAY ATENCION - with Spanish accent (for better effect)
Ouch...
Fais Attencion (with frch accentegu)
He has to turn his torso nearly completely frontside to give illusion of depth
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when i see pic of joe stub all i see is cool back and a pair of chicken leg
one of the worst bodybuilders of recent times imo
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Good thing is - judges are close to the stage...and they can see what's going on...off course IF they open their eyes... ::)
Honestly saying, too close.
Thats why they cant see the whole shape.
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I agree with Milos. Joel should NOT be docked points for having two blown out
knees, when Dorian, Ronnie, etc., were NOT, for their torn biceps, triceps, etc.,...
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YES, I said IF THEY OPEN THEIR EYES...
and PAY ATENCION what's REALLY happening on that stage...as I see something very clearly...and I hope you can too...
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stubbs has bad calves in those pics
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Sorry Joel...while your legs from rear view look normal and could be compared to OTHERS - your upper body is JUST TOO BIG, TOO WIDE, TOO MUSCULAR WITH TOO MUCH MUSCLE AND BIGGEST V-TAPER...etc...etc...etc - and you will be marked down for NOT REALISTIC PHYSIQUE...
Besides your parents don't have the proof they are from this Planet - so better shut up and not complain or else...Just ask Milos how does suspension feels like (and I am not talking test-susp...)
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stubbs has bad calves in those pics
Look above and compare to others...
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One more time - for judges only...and this is REAR LAT SPREAD... ::)
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Almost done...SIDE TRICEPS...
Judges please: as you didn't see it last weekend...
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i think guy next to stubb look better
i mean stubb okay as bodybuild back seem overdevelop and too much focus on it
guy next to stubb looks better imo
calves look a bit better and so do legs
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Joel Stubbs is making everyone his bitch from behind.
From the front though Freeman gets it.
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wow jonny jackson abs look real good
stubb abbs look kinda bunched up
wow stubb calves look super little in those pics
cool pix milas thank for post
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ABS ;D ;D ;D
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AND....MOST MUSCULAR ;) ;) ;)
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maybe i see something diff on my screen but stubb abs dont look as good as the rest
sorry i just dont see what u talk about miloe
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Milos, what do you think about tamali's chances for an olympia qualification are at the Atlantic city pro?
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AND....MOST MUSCULAR ;) ;) ;)
That upper body is amazing, but the legs ruin it.
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his legs look smaller than the guys way shorter than him...
and dareem is killin everyone in the side triceps
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That back shot of Stubbs is pretty impressive. The rest of them are pulling the lats forward for accentuation, and he's actually straight or concave.
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ABS ;D ;D ;D
He's getting his ass handed to him by everyone in these ab shots.
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milos i was kinda fan of joe stubbs before and had good things to say
but after u post these shots i get turned off of him and no like him anymore :-\
he looks like shit-please dont get offended
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Great back, but whole upper body? Be real.
Arms are average at best compared to most other top 10 pros.
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Great back, but whole upper body? Be real.
Arms are average at best compared to most other top 10 pros.
Great delts and traps as well. Stubbs slays from the back but from the front he just doesn't have it. He looks like a mess imo. An all around ugly and incomplete front double bi, extremely lanky arms that don't look filled out, the forearms of a middleweight, along with a lack of upper pecs. Then the lower half is just plain bad. His quads are separated, yes, but there is not close to enough mass. Sorry Milos, i'm sure he is a super nice guy but that doesn't mean he's top 5 material.
IMO Toney Freeman deservedly won that show fair and square... he looks the most complete, his physique flows the best, and he was in the condition needed for a victory.
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Probably the skinniest forearms I've seen on a pro. Toney Freeman is another guy who has underdeveloped forearms for a big man. Stubbs has a back, and some striated delts, and that's about it.
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when i see pic of joe stub all i see is cool back and a pair of chicken leg
one of the worst bodybuilders of recent times imo
i think guy next to stubb look better
i mean stubb okay as bodybuild back seem overdevelop and too much focus on it
guy next to stubb looks better imo
calves look a bit better and so do legs
wow jonny jackson abs look real good
stubb abbs look kinda bunched up
wow stubb calves look super little in those pics
cool pix milas thank for post
milos i was kinda fan of joe stubbs before and had good things to say
but after u post these shots i get turned off of him and no like him anymore :-\
he looks like shit-please dont get offended
maybe i see something diff on my screen but stubb abs dont look as good as the rest
sorry i just dont see what u talk about miloe
Ok, I think we got the point, f@ggot. You dont like Stubbs. One post would've sufficed. ::) ::)
Now go sniff Nasser's soiled undies and jerk off like usual, you gay trolling schmoe. :-X
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I personally think Stubbs is awesome but it's really hard to justify higher placings to someone with such weak and quite smooth legs, its half the body you know....
Milos you're confused, you use to pull it because you had shitty arms but great legs but it doesn't work the other way around, we aren't in the 70's.
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Joel Stubbs on the cover of MuscleMag (Oct,2008) :)
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It seems like he's really only weak in one part of his legs, the teardrops. From the back and side he looks very symmetrical.
Is there anything he can do to hide that in his poses? Arnold had weak legs and used to put one leg in front and keep them close together when he did poses from the front.
Seems like their penalizing anybody with that kind of injury. Jojo Ntiforo did place either, and I thought he looked great. Makes you wonder how Harris finished so far ahead of them both
Doesn't seem like their penalizing Toney Freeman for his torn pec!
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It seems like he's really only weak in one part of his legs, the teardrops. From the back and side he looks very symmetrical.
Is there anything he can do to hide that in his poses? Arnold had weak legs and used to put one leg in front and keep them close together when he did poses from the front.
Seems like their penalizing anybody with that kind of injury. Jojo Ntiforo did place either, and I thought he looked great. Makes you wonder how Harris finished so far ahead of them both
Doesn't seem like their penalizing Toney Freeman for his torn pec!
One torn pec <<<<< both legs.
I really like Stubbs and think he could easily be top 3 if his legs were better but unfortunately he have that injury that throws everything off :-\
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If only the back was judged, he'd be a serious contender.
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i agree with Milos, Joel is an incredible bodybuilder.
yes but they judge on penis size
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Just my opinion :D
If I was a judge
He lacks proportion all around
legs are terrible from the front, his medialis is one of the smallest I have ever seen and the separation between intermedius-lateralis and intermedius-medialis is just BAD and not in a good way bad ::)
while his separation of quad and hamstring is great from the size
and his legs do look normal from the back but he has no calves which kills it
he needs to fill out his inner chest more, because when he does a double bicep all the mass goes to the sides and leaves his mid chest flat
and on the ABS pose :P
DAMN those are some scrambled up abs lol :-X, like jay cutler(atleast he has cool scrambled up DIAMOND shaped abs) shouldn't be allowed to do the abs and thigh cuz he aint got no abs nor thigh
what's wrong with his knees? it looks like they are bleeding on stage :o
he doesn't look hard enough
but that's pretty much it ;D
Great back though 8) I have to give him something after all the judging :-*
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Bird Legs.
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I personally think Stubbs is awesome but it's really hard to justify higher placings to someone with such weak and quite smooth legs, its half the body you know....
Milos you're confused, you use to pull it because you had shitty arms but great legs but it doesn't work the other way around, we aren't in the 70's.
woa woa woa bring down the insults there
first of all, Milos doesn't have GREAT arms agreed BUT I think all he needs a bicep PEAK ( his biceps are massive but lack the peak)
it's genetics, you can't get arms like Kevin Levrone (best triceps ever) unless you're born with the genes
and what's wrong with the guys in the 70's?
their legs looked in proportion with their upper bodies and they could actually run and do activities
I would like to see you achieve a physique like Serge Nubret, he has never used steroids and at age 65 looked better than most pros
then tom platz came along and screwed everything up lol
massive legs with small upper body looks terrible
massive upper body with medium legs looks great
bodybuilding needs to go back to the days where people actually wanted to look like a bodybuilder and didn't think they should be put in a circus because they look like freaks
By the way what caused bodybuilders to get so huge?
was it the advancement of steroids?
taking greater amounts of steroids?
introduction of growth hormone (dorian yates, ronnie coleman, jay cutler say: HELL YES :D)(notice the huge pregnant woman HGH guts on them)
what was it?
I know that it wasn't because bodybuilders today work harder, see what arnold tells Dexter Jackson after he wins the Arnold classic "we used to workout workout 5 hours a day, every day, and you work out 1 hour a couple of times a week?, what are you saying? you got a body like this by just taking some PILLS?
Dex: today we have MUSCLETECH ( >:( F$ck*ng bull cr@p supplements and people who buy them)
Dex: pills? yes hydroxycut
>:( >:( >:(
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Milos, you said that you were working or making some supplements that are Hormone free
they are not Anabolic Steroids but can give a natural bodybuilder drug like results?
are you done making those? ;D
I'd really like to know what they are, are they like testosterone boosters or something?
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heres the deal joel is wide as shit and is big with a great back.
But he does not have the muscle density or conditioning that other guys have. Those pics you posted Milos, every one up there looks better. They have muscle maturity that Joel does not have.