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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 01:31:55 PM



Title: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 01:31:55 PM
I receive a fair amount of private messages asking me specific drug advice which I pretty much always ignore. I am not in the business of providing specific drug advice on this forum. I have, however, received a plethora of questions that fall into the same categories over and over so I figured I would address some of them.

1. Insulin and Fat Gain
- Everyone is always concerned about gaining fat on slin. There are some important things to realize about slin: 1) if you want to be truly huge you need to use insulin. 2) if you are not using enough drugs when you use insulin you will gain a little or a lot of fat dependent on your genetics. So how do you minimize fat gain on insulin? Slowly increase how much slin you are using and when you use it. Start with a small amount post workout. Ramp that up a bit. When you feel comfortable with that, start using it pre workout instead. Then start using it in the morning and pre workout. Then once those dosages top out (15-20iu each) start adding it before other meals, one meal at a time, and start low and build the doses up. When you top out at 15-20iu per shot per meal, add another slin shot. Finally, once you are using slin with every meal, pre workout and post workout, incorporate a long last insulin at the start of your day as well. Build the dosage up on that. Next, you need to make sure you are using enough of the other drugs to see results. You should not run insulin unless you are on at least a gram of test and 5iu GH everyday OR minimum 10iu GH blasting. If genetically you have a tendency to gain fat, it would be beneficial to run 50-75mcg t3 daily. Also do not fall into the trap of believing you NEED 10g carbs per 1iu insulin. That is a reasonable place to start to gauge your sensitivity but very very few people need that many carbs per 1iu. ESPECIALLY if you are using GH...I have personally gone as low as 6g carbs per 1iu. Insulin is not perfect, it will help to shuttle nutrients but that does not mean you can or should eat like a pig. In fact its quite the opposite...when on slin you need to be eating CLEANER than usual. Perhaps more carbs and protein but cleaner sources...chicken breast, tilapia, sweet potatoes, oats..these are the foods to eat when the slin hits you.

2. Primobolan
Everyone is obsessed with primobolan. This is not new. Its been all the hype for a long time. The major issue with primobolan is that 1) you need to run a shitload if you are a man and 2) its usually fake. If you can actually get legit primo and run it in high doses, it works almost like tren without the negative side effects. That is not to say it doesnt have negative side effects. primo in effective doses will make you bald and flare up your prostate like nothing else. Regardless, there really is no point using primo if you are a man unless you can run it non stop at a gram MINIMUM. 1.2-1.5 grams primo run for the entire duration of a 16 week contest prep is a great thing.

3. GH Dosing Protocols
I have explained these before so I will be brief
1) Pre Contest/"Cutting"/etc...when the primary purpose is fat loss and not mass gain, GH should be dosed 3-5x throughout the day, everyday. i like to keep a constant stream in the body all day long pre contest so if you can only afford 15iu's per day, id recommend hitting it 2.5-3iu 5-6x per day.
2) Mass Gain - if your goal is pure size, post workout IV blasts 3-4x per week with pre workout insulin is ideal. Anything less than 10iu is worthless for this protocol. Basically, take the amount of GH you can afford to use weekly and divide it by 3 (I typically recommend a 5x5 or DC split during offseason blasts anyhow which are usually 3 days per week) and take 3 large doses postworkout, IV. Wait 20-30 mins after the shot to have your post workout shake.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Raymondo on March 26, 2013, 01:36:59 PM
The stuff about primobolan runs contrary to a lot of peoples' opinions.

Apart from the fact that a lot of it is counterfeit


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: el numero uno on March 26, 2013, 01:42:22 PM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 01:45:58 PM
The stuff about primobolan runs contrary to a lot of peoples' opinions.

Apart from the fact that a lot of it is counterfeit

I have never met anyone who has actually used primo that believed it was worthwhile in low/moderate doses for men.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: The_Iron_Disciple on March 26, 2013, 01:58:35 PM
I have never met anyone who has actually used primo that believed it was worthwhile in low/moderate doses for men.

Agreed.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: hangclean on March 26, 2013, 02:50:56 PM
I have never met anyone who has actually used primo that believed it was worthwhile in low/moderate doses for men.
masteron does pretty much the same thing as primo and it is way cheaper.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: makaveli25 on March 26, 2013, 02:54:10 PM
Ya I'm done running primo. It's a waste of money at anything less than a gram. I got mine from a very good source to. It does make you look pretty good but it can be done a lot cheaper. A combination of masteron and npp gave me a better look and was a hell of a lot cheaper.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: dustin on March 26, 2013, 02:55:47 PM
masteron does pretty much the same thing as primo and it is way cheaper.

Prossssstttaaaatttteeeee eeeeee.

I love me some masteron but it's not without it's own dangers. But the thing I like about it most is how it makes you feel like you're on a lot more gear than you really are. Doesn't work the same pathways as an AI, but it's basically anti-estrogenic in it's own, to a small but appreciable degree.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: hangclean on March 26, 2013, 04:08:45 PM
Prossssstttaaaatttteeeee eeeeee.

I love me some masteron but it's not without it's own dangers. But the thing I like about it most is how it makes you feel like you're on a lot more gear than you really are. Doesn't work the same pathways as an AI, but it's basically anti-estrogenic in it's own, to a small but appreciable degree.
primo is also a DHT derivative, so it has effects on the prostate as well.  I honestly don't understand why anyone pays the extra money for primo.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 04:26:56 PM
primo is also a DHT derivative, so it has effects on the prostate as well.  I honestly don't understand why anyone pays the extra money for primo.

Primo does not yield the same effects as masteron. Masteron is a great drug but it just will not build quantifiable muscle mass. Primo in the 1+ gram range is similar to tren without the night sweats and mental issues.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Dokey111 on March 26, 2013, 04:40:24 PM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?

 :D


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 04:58:36 PM
aha, so, if you wanna get truly huge you need insulin, the 8gramms of steroids weekly will not cut it.

i see.

Im going to assume theres a level of sarcasm in your post (please correct me if im wrong).

insulin is by far the most powerful drug in today's bodybuilding arsenal. if your goal is to be huge, you are short changing yourself by not using slin.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: LATS on March 26, 2013, 05:02:39 PM
I agree.. Primo is basically a waste of money at under800 to 1000 Mgs.. But at that dose you will have dht issues like no ones biz... But very good gains..


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 26, 2013, 05:17:44 PM
I agree.. Primo is basically a waste of money at under800 to 1000 Mgs.. But at that dose you will have dht issues like no ones biz... But very good gains..

Depends on the person. I know those who have run 1.5 grams of primo for 16-20 weeks and have not lost any hair or had prostate flareups. I truly believe the reason primo gets a bad rep is because :
1) most bodybuilders are broke and cant shell out what it costs to run 1g+ for 4+ months
2) half of the time primo is actually eq or masteron


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: trapz101 on March 26, 2013, 07:14:15 PM
Im going to assume theres a level of sarcasm in your post (please correct me if im wrong).

insulin is by far the most powerful drug in today's bodybuilding arsenal. if your goal is to be huge, you are short changing yourself by not using slin.

I have to agree with this..


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: falco on March 27, 2013, 04:05:44 AM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?

(http://www.whatdafaqshow.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/lmao.jpeg)


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: AlphaMaleDawg on March 27, 2013, 04:22:11 AM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lka915sLrA1qhgme2.gif)


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BigCyp on March 27, 2013, 04:37:57 AM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?

Lolburgers


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: irishdave on March 27, 2013, 10:51:55 AM
Ugh, I thought primo was very light on the hairline? You're saying it makes you bald? It's one of the least androgenic around


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Raymondo on March 27, 2013, 11:00:54 AM
Ugh, I thought primo was very light on the hairline? You're saying it makes you bald? It's one of the least androgenic around

That's what I thought, too


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: dustin on March 27, 2013, 02:32:10 PM
at what dosages I can still be considered a natty?

Stay under a gram of test and just don't count any other anabolics. Then you're legit! 8)


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: LATS on March 27, 2013, 09:01:18 PM
I do agree that most primo is faked using mast or other compounds.. When legit primo was available the cost was outrageous per amp.. Beware of " cheap" primo.. Not worth the odds..


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: hangclean on March 27, 2013, 11:37:40 PM
Ugh, I thought primo was very light on the hairline? You're saying it makes you bald? It's one of the least androgenic around
any DHT derivitive can fuck your hair up.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: mame09 on March 28, 2013, 02:48:07 AM
primo is definetly not cheap and cant get more than 200mg/ml human grade

not worth injecting 6ml only primo

if you buy the powder its the most expensive powder out of all the roids


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: irishdave on March 28, 2013, 02:59:12 AM
I can get isis primo 100ml/mg for pretty cheap - haven't tried it yet though


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: falco on March 28, 2013, 03:08:32 AM
Spanish primobolan Depot is around 9 an ampoul.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: jon cole on March 28, 2013, 01:02:59 PM
I have never met anyone who has actually used primo that believed it was worthwhile in low/moderate doses for men.

my first cycle back in 2003 was 1 sust and 300mg of primo bayer, all legit.
my best cycle ever.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: theworm on March 28, 2013, 05:14:47 PM
I would love to try GH!  But legit pharm hgh in the us will run about 3000 for 5 IU 3x week x 12 weeks!   Crazy expensive.   And most GH out of china is probably hcg or who knows what else, I mean shit, china was making toys for kids with lead in it!


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: gh2 on March 29, 2013, 01:02:53 AM
3. GH Dosing Protocols
I have explained these before so I will be brief
1) Pre Contest/"Cutting"/etc...when the primary purpose is fat loss and not mass gain, GH should be dosed 3-5x throughout the day, everyday. i like to keep a constant stream in the body all day long pre contest so if you can only afford 15iu's per day, id recommend hitting it 2.5-3iu 5-6x per day.
2) Mass Gain - if your goal is pure size, post workout IV blasts 3-4x per week with pre workout insulin is ideal. Anything less than 10iu is worthless for this protocol. Basically, take the amount of GH you can afford to use weekly and divide it by 3 (I typically recommend a 5x5 or DC split during offseason blasts anyhow which are usually 3 days per week) and take 3 large doses postworkout, IV. Wait 20-30 mins after the shot to have your post workout shake.

Interesting stuff BFG and I agree. You say anything less then 10 iu is worthless for mass gains. I presume you mean 10 iu x 3 pr week (10 iu pr shot) and not 10 iu divided into 3 days (3,33 iu pr shot)? For those of us who can't afford these amounts and don't want to go near IV injections or use slin I would think 4-8 iu post workout 3 times a week for mass gains would still be better then nothing at all?


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Red29 on March 29, 2013, 06:57:57 AM
Depends on the person. I know those who have run 1.5 grams of primo for 16-20 weeks and have not lost any hair or had prostate flareups. I truly believe the reason primo gets a bad rep is because :
1) most bodybuilders are broke and cant shell out what it costs to run 1g+ for 4+ months
2) half of the time primo is actually eq or masteron

ive run into this before. was using "800mg" of 'primo' and it turned out to be EQ, dosed at i suspect 300mg/ml. 2400 EQ. way too much lol


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 29, 2013, 12:04:39 PM
Interesting stuff BFG and I agree. You say anything less then 10 iu is worthless for mass gains. I presume you mean 10 iu x 3 pr week (10 iu pr shot) and not 10 iu divided into 3 days (3,33 iu pr shot)? For those of us who can't afford these amounts and don't want to go near IV injections or use slin I would think 4-8 iu post workout 3 times a week for mass gains would still be better then nothing at all?

if you can only do 8iu 3x week post workout, why cant you do 10iu? thats the difference of 24iu's monthly.

anyway, if you really cant afford 10+ iu 3x per week and your goal is mass gains and you are under 30 years old you should probably just spend the money on more gear.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: theworm on March 29, 2013, 03:04:34 PM
BFG,

If one can only afford 5 IU 3x a week x 12 weeks ( it's 3 grand!!!), but it's legit GH from a US pharmacy, think I could gain a solid 10? 

I do not want the sides of test, and I want some of the health benefits of GH, ie better skin hair and better cholesterol numbers.    Thoughts on this? And where is the best place to shoot GH IM?


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Red29 on March 29, 2013, 03:26:30 PM
BFG,

If one can only afford 5 IU 3x a week x 12 weeks ( it's 3 grand!!!), but it's legit GH from a US pharmacy, think I could gain a solid 10? 

I do not want the sides of test, and I want some of the health benefits of GH, ie better skin hair and better cholesterol numbers.    Thoughts on this? And where is the best place to shoot GH IM?

Delts


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 29, 2013, 07:26:02 PM
BFG,

If one can only afford 5 IU 3x a week x 12 weeks ( it's 3 grand!!!), but it's legit GH from a US pharmacy, think I could gain a solid 10? 

I do not want the sides of test, and I want some of the health benefits of GH, ie better skin hair and better cholesterol numbers.    Thoughts on this? And where is the best place to shoot GH IM?

dont think you will gain 10lbs of lean muscle (thats a TON) from 5iu's of GH 3 times per week. If your goal is just general health improvement from GH take 3iu's Monday - Friday...

Makes absolutely no difference where you shoot it IM and honestly id probably recommend shooting it sub-q when doing the 3iu's for general health. Heres a story to prove my point about making no difference where you shoot it, I remember hanging out at a guest posing Ben Pakulski was doing a few years ago and he was swearing up and down to site inject each area of your body trained with GH...talking about how it was the key to bringing up lagging body parts...if that was the case, why do his arms still suck?


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Red29 on March 29, 2013, 07:58:41 PM
dont think you will gain 10lbs of lean muscle (thats a TON) from 5iu's of GH 3 times per week. If your goal is just general health improvement from GH take 3iu's Monday - Friday...

Makes absolutely no difference where you shoot it IM and honestly id probably recommend shooting it sub-q when doing the 3iu's for general health. Heres a story to prove my point about making no difference where you shoot it, I remember hanging out at a guest posing Ben Pakulski was doing a few years ago and he was swearing up and down to site inject each area of your body trained with GH...talking about how it was the key to bringing up lagging body parts...if that was the case, why do his arms still suck?

probably thought the localized swelling was a sign it was growing.


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: BFG on March 29, 2013, 08:32:06 PM
probably thought the localized swelling was a sign it was growing.

GH injections dont cause any localized swelling unless you are doing it really, extremely wrong.



Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: Red29 on March 29, 2013, 09:51:55 PM
GH injections dont cause any localized swelling unless you are doing it really, extremely wrong.



true but somehow i doubt ben was only pinning gh pre workout


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: The_Iron_Disciple on March 29, 2013, 11:20:50 PM
^^^ I would assume repeated injections of GH into the same spot would induce some type of swelling. Perhaps this is what Ben was driving at ? I don't know. He seems to be a pretty smart bb'er, so I would assume he rotates his sites.

Anyways, BFG is correct though in stating Ben's genetic weaklink ( i.e - his arms ). Really makes me curious as to what Ben meant. Lol. Seriously ! Lol !

Question, BFG ...

we talk alot about GH and insulin. Obviously, these are the 2 most important things in today's bb'ing ( I use both myself, in fact ). However, what are your thoughts regarding ( in order to perhaps save money ) peptides and insulin ? Same effect ? Obviously, I would assume rHGH is the superior option. Just curious though.

As always, thank you for your time. :)


Title: Re: Insulin and Fat Gain, Primobolan, GH dosing protocols, etc
Post by: theworm on March 30, 2013, 04:38:48 AM
dont think you will gain 10lbs of lean muscle (thats a TON) from 5iu's of GH 3 times per week. If your goal is just general health improvement from GH take 3iu's Monday - Friday...

Makes absolutely no difference where you shoot it IM and honestly id probably recommend shooting it sub-q when doing the 3iu's for general health. Heres a story to prove my point about making no difference where you shoot it, I remember hanging out at a guest posing Ben Pakulski was doing a few years ago and he was swearing up and down to site inject each area of your body trained with GH...talking about how it was the key to bringing up lagging body parts...if that was the case, why do his arms still suck?

Really?  Not a solid 8-10 pounds?  Even if its legit US pharm GH? 

Also, if I wanna do it for health benefits, how many cycles would u recommend per year?  12 weeks on, 12 weeks off and repeat?