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Getbig Main Boards => Politics and Political Issues Board => Topic started by: Dos Equis on January 07, 2014, 11:51:41 AM
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Good. I hope he lives the rest of his life looking over his shoulder.
Ex-Homeland Chief Napolitano: No Mercy for Edward Snowden
Sunday, 05 Jan 2014
By Newsmax Wires
Former NSA leaker Edward Snowden should not receive amnesty of any type because of the profound damage he did to the United States, says former Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano.
In an interview to be broadcast Sunday on NBC’s “Meet the Press,’’ Napolitano said she strongly disagreed with The New York Times and Britain’s Guardian newspaper, which have argued that the United States should welcome him back with open arms because of the debate on national security that his theft provoked.
“I think Snowden has exacted quite a bit of damage and did it in a way that violated the law,” Napolitano said. “I think he’s committed crimes and I think that the damage we’ll see now and we’ll see it for years to come.”
The New York Times wrote in a Jan. 1 editorial that Snowden deserved “some form of clemency” or sharply reduced charges because he had essentially served as a whistle-blower to government abuse of its anti-terrorism surveillance powers.
Napolitano will lead a U.S. delegation to Russia for the 2014 Olympic Games in Sochi. Two bomb attacks last month in Russia raised fears that terrorists will target the games.
Russian authorities have said they are deploying 30,000 police officers in and around the Olympic site. Some analysts have suggested that could leave other areas vulnerable.
Napolitano said she shared that concern, and that the U.S. would work with Russia and the International Olympic Committee “as closely as we can” to ensure the safety of the games.
Muslim separatist groups are the leading suspects in the two suicide bombings in the southern Russian city of Volgograd that killed more than 30 people. Sochi is located on the Black Sea, about 435 miles (700 kilometers) southwest of Volgograd.
The U.S. delegation Napolitano is leading includes prominent American lesbian and gay athletes, including tennis player Billie Jean King and figure skater Brian Boitano.
Russia has faced criticism for adopting anti-gay laws. Napolitano said the makeup of the delegation was designed to “demonstrate that the United States is a very free and open and tolerant society.”
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/napolitano-no-clemency-snowden/2014/01/05/id/545249#ixzz2pkC6pd4m
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Exclusive: Snowden Swiped Password From NSA Coworker
BY MICHAEL ISIKOFF
A civilian NSA employee recently resigned after being stripped of his security clearance for allowing former agency contractor Edward Snowden to use his personal log-in credentials to access classified information, according to an agency memo obtained by NBC News.
In addition, an active duty member of the U.S. military and a contractor have been barred from accessing National Security Agency facilities after they were “implicated” in actions that may have aided Snowden, the memo states. Their status is now being reviewed by their employers, the memo says.
The Feb. 10 memo, sent to congressional intelligence and judiciary committees this week, provides the first official account of a sweeping NSA internal inquiry aimed at identifying intelligence officials and contractors who may been responsible for one of the biggest security breaches in U.S. history. The memo is unclassified but labeled “for official use only.”
"Unbeknownst to the civilian, Mr. Snowden was able to capture the password, allowing him even greater access to classified information.”
While the memo’s account is sketchy, it suggests that, contrary to Snowden’s statements, he used an element of trickery to retrieve his trove of tens of thousands of classified documents: “At Snowden’s request,” the civilian NSA employee, who is not identified by name, entered his password onto Snowden’s computer terminal, the memo states.
“Unbeknownst to the civilian, Mr. Snowden was able to capture the password, allowing him even greater access to classified information,” the memo states.
The memo states that the civilian employee was unaware that Snowden “intended to unlawfully disclose classified information.” Nevertheless, by sharing with Snowden his personal “public key infrastructure” certificate -- a system of highly secure credentials that provided greater access to NSA’s internal computer system -- the employee “failed to comply with security obligations,” the memo states. As a result, the employee’s security clearance was revoked in November and the NSA has notified the Justice Department that he recently resigned. (A public key infrastructure certificate is a highly secure system of password and log-in exchanges designed to protect against unauthorized access to sensitive computer networks.)
The memo does not explain what actions the U.S. military member and the contractor took that caused them to lose their access to NSA facilities.
"Has anybody been disciplined at NSA for dropping the ball so badly?”
The Feb. 10 memo was signed by Ethan Bauman, the NSA’s director of legislative affairs. It was sent to the congressional committees after repeated questions from senior members about whether the NSA intended to hold any of its employees accountable for the security lapses that enable Snowden to gain access to massive volumes of classified documents that he later leaked to the news media
“Has anybody been disciplined at NSA for dropping the ball so badly?” Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., demanded of NSA Director Gen. Keith Alexander at a Dec. 11 hearing. Alexander at the time replied that the agency had three “cases” that “we’re currently reviewing.” (An NSA spokeswoman Vanee Vines declined comment Wednesday night, writing in an email: “I don’t have anything for your story.”)
The question of how Snowden was able to obtain as much classified material as he did while working at a remote NSA station in Hawaii has been the subject of intensive investigation by the U.S. intelligence community for months.
Reuters reporters Mark Hosenball and Warren Strobel reported in November that Snowden used login credential and passwords provided “unwittingly” by colleagues at the Hawaii spy base. The Reuters report said Snowden “may have persuaded between 20 and 25 fellow workers” to give him their passwords. But the NSA never publicly commented on that report and Snowden appeared to deny it during a public Google chat on Jan. 23.
“Was the privacy of your co-workers considered while you were stealing their log-in and password information?” Snowden was asked during the chat.
“With all due respect to Mark Hosenball, the Reuters report that put this out there was simply wrong,” Snowden replied. “I never stole any passwords, nor did I trick an army of co-workers.”
Ben Wizner, a lawyer for the ACLU who represents Snowden, did not immediately respond to phone and email requests for comment.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/exclusive-snowden-swiped-password-nsa-coworker-n29006
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So he did to the NSA what the NSA does to you, and he's the bad guy.
I get it.
;D
Personally - I don't have a problem with what he did. The govt spying on its citizens and lying about it? Breaking the 4th amendment, putting us into an Orwellian state of feasr over the police state and snowden is the enemy?
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I agree... It's our patriotic duty to keep our government in check.
He's a damn patriot.
This. But the government spins it and uses the troops as leverage and suddenly he's the enemy.
A lot of my Marine friends said the same thing.. who cares if he puts us at risk, our job is to be at risk, our governments job is to protect the citizens rights and freedoms.
It pisses me off that the government used the military as political leverage to turn the populous against this guy.
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X 3
As free American citizens, the Federal Government is no friend of ours.
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Snowden should get the Nobel Peace prize. Plus, why the hell would he even want to come back? Kind of like jumping on board the Titanic (Olympic ;) ) as it's going down.
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Guilty of being truthfull to Americans.
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Brilliants. ::)
Snowden Elected Leader of Students at UK School
Tuesday, 18 Feb 2014
Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden has been elected as the official representative of the student body at the University of Glasgow.
The results of the voting were announced Tuesday.
Snowden is in Russian, where he has received temporary asylum. He left the United States after leaking documents disclosing details of U.S. spies' surveillance of the Internet and telephone communications.
Glasgow students had earlier said they contacted Snowden through his lawyers and he agreed to run for the job, known as rector. Some who have held the post in the past have been unable to come to Glasgow.
Given that Britain has an extradition treaty with the United States, where Snowden is wanted on criminal charges, it is most unlikely that he would choose to come.
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/EU-Britain-Snowden-University/2014/02/18/id/553369#ixzz2the9QYXb
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Pretty much of a thread backfire, lol.
Complicated issue, though; I'm not sure what to think about Snowden except that I think his heart seems to have been in the right place.
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Pretty much of a thread backfire, lol.
Complicated issue, though; I'm not sure what to think about Snowden except that I think his heart seems to have been in the right place.
Thread backfire is when you make a statement or post a story that turns out to be false. It's not when people disagree with your opinion. One of the things you want when stories are posted is differing viewpoints.
I hope he winds up in a very small prison cell.
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Who is more deserving of a peace price
Obama or Snowden?
Case closed
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Neither.
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Thread backfire is when you make a statement or post a story that turns out to be false. It's not when people disagree with your opinion. One of the things you want when stories are posted is differing viewpoints.
I hope he winds up in a very small prison cell.
Demonstrably not true even on GetBig, BB.
If a false statement is jumped on by other folks during which it's proved to be false, that IS called a "thread backfire" too, but it's commonly seen on our own G & O board (as well as boards like mma.tv) that the term is used when someone posts an opinion (particularly when the opinion is a strong one) and near 100% of the folks that reply disagree. (Just did a search of the term "thread backfire" on the G&O board that confirms this.)
FWIW (nuthin!), on your initial post, had you not written, "I hope he lives the rest of his life looking over his shoulder.", or maybe just added "What does everyone else think?", I wouldn't have said anything about any backfire.
It's not unremarkable, I think, that not one person who commented seems to agree with you. (Though, to be fair, not really that many people have commented.)
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Demonstrably not true even on GetBig, BB.
If a false statement is jumped on by other folks during which it's proved to be false, that IS called a "thread backfire" too, but it's commonly seen on our own G & O board (as well as boards like mma.tv) that the term is used when someone posts an opinion (particularly when the opinion is a strong one) and near 100% of the folks that reply disagree. (Just did a search of the term "thread backfire" on the G&O board that confirms this.)
FWIW (nuthin!), on your initial post, had you not written, "I hope he lives the rest of his life looking over his shoulder.", or maybe just added "What does everyone else think?", I wouldn't have said anything about any backfire.
It's not unremarkable, I think, that not one person who commented seems to agree with you. (Though, to be fair, not really that many people have commented.)
I disagree. There are many instances where most people come down on one side or the other when offering opinions. That's not a "backfire."
And I cannot speak for anyone else, but I don't care how many people agree or disagree with my opinions. It's really about having a discussion.
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I disagree. There are many instances where most people come down on one side or the other when offering opinions. That's not a "backfire."
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Disagree all you want. You're just not right in this case. It may have been the case that a "thread backfire" meant only what you say it means at one time but it doesn't mean that NOW.
Seriously, search the G&O board for the term "thread backfire" (you'll get 8 pages of results) and see what I'm talking about.
Fact is, word definitions change over time, ya feel me? (I'm sure I butchered that, lol)
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Disagree all you want. You're just not right in this case. It may have been the case that a "thread backfire" meant only what you say it means at one time but it doesn't mean that NOW.
Seriously, search the G&O board for the term "thread backfire" (you'll get 8 pages of results) and see what I'm talking about.
Fact is, word definitions change over time, ya feel me? (I'm sure I butchered that, lol)
No, I'm not going to search the G&O. It's not that important.
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No, I'm not going to search the G&O. It's not that important.
Fine.
BTW, I sympathize with you a little; Drives me up the wall that the verb "to conversate" has worked its way into the English language.
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Fine.
BTW, I sympathize with you a little; Drives me up the wall that the verb "to conversate" has worked its way into the English language.
Is that even a word? (I've never used it.)
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Is that even a word? (I've never used it.)
According to more and more dictionaries, yes. Back-formation from "conversation" much like the much older (and more accepted) "to orientate" from "orientation". (Personally, I think "to converse" and "to orient" are enough.)
Honestly, I LIKE many African-American vernacular contributions to language (supplies a little flava, imo) but reek of retardation (to me) and drive me up the wall.
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Joint Chiefs chairman: Snowden will take 2 years to evaluate, will cost military millions
Published March 06, 2014
Associated Press
WASHINGTON – The top U.S. military officer says it will take two years of study and billions of dollars to overcome the loss of security to military operations and tactics that were revealed in the massive stash of documents taken by former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden.
Joint Chiefs Chairman Gen. Martin Dempsey tells the House Armed Services Committee the Pentagon set up a task force to determine how the documents could be used and how to mitigate the problem. He says the task force will take two years due to the "magnitude of this challenge."
U.S. officials have said that the vast majority of the documents taken by Snowden related to U.S. military capabilities. Less than 10 percent involved domestic surveillance programs that have been discussed more widely.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/03/06/joint-chiefs-chairman-snowden-leaks-takes-2-years-to-evaluate-will-cost/
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Snowden deserves a medal compared to Obama
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I just read an article claiming Snowden tried to go through the proper channels several times.
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I just read an article claiming Snowden tried to go through the proper channels several times.
I don't doubt it at all
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I just read an article claiming Snowden tried to go through the proper channels several times.
Oh I'll call BS on that one. And even if he did, so what? Doesn't justify breaking the law and causing the damage he did.
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Oh I'll call BS on that one. And even if he did, so what? Doesn't justify breaking the law and causing the damage he did.
To me it does. These treasonous criminals in public office would never have told the truth on their own accord but for him.
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To me it does. These treasonous criminals in public office would never have told the truth on their own accord but for him.
I agree they likely would never told the truth about the NSA spying, but that doesn't outweigh the damage he did to our national security. And then to go work with other countries to give them our secrets? He should be shot.
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I agree they likely would never told the truth about the NSA spying, but that doesn't outweigh the damage he did to our national security. And then to go work with other countries to give them our secrets? He should be shot.
Your national security was damaged the Woodrow Wilson signed the Federal Reserve Act into place. It was further damaged the day you allowed AIPAC to sway your politicians to put another nation's interests over it's own. Your national security was damaged the day your country put the Patriot Act in place and shredded the Constitution. Your national security was damaged when your country squandered the national treasury to invade other countries on false flag pretenses, indebting your citizens, your children & grandchildren to come into indentured servitude to private bankers. What Chutzpah!
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I agree they likely would never told the truth about the NSA spying, but that doesn't outweigh the damage he did to our national security. And then to go work with other countries to give them our secrets? He should be shot.
I think it does outweigh the damage he's done by thousands of miles... There's a very good chance we could lose our Republic if the NSA continued down the path they were/are on.
I'm not even sure of any damage he's done?
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I think it does outweigh the damage he's done by thousands of miles... There's a very good chance we could lose our Republic if the NSA continued down the path they were/are on.
I'm not even sure of any damage he's done?
You've already lost your Republic, ...the question is, can you get it back?
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You've already lost your Republic, ...the question is, can you get it back?
I wouldn't go that far, because the system is still mostly in place. Especially at the State and Local level. It's mainly just being abused.
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I wouldn't go that far, because the system is still mostly in place. Especially at the State and Local level. It's mainly just being abused.
No money, in debt beyond the present generation, Patriot Act, Constitution turned into confetti, NDAA, Journalists with Stockholm Syndrome, corporations more powerful than gov't... If that's a Republic, ...perhaps you might want to give a Communist Dictatorship a try? ::)
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;D
Personally - I don't have a problem with what he did. The govt spying on its citizens and lying about it? Breaking the 4th amendment, putting us into an Orwellian state of feasr over the police state and snowden is the enemy?
This. It's also clear that some unthinking turds here can't see 'Murica setting a foot wrong.
They'll support anything and everything their 'Murica does
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Your national security was damaged the Woodrow Wilson signed the Federal Reserve Act into place. It was further damaged the day you allowed AIPAC to sway your politicians to put another nation's interests over it's own. Your national security was damaged the day your country put the Patriot Act in place and shredded the Constitution. Your national security was damaged when your country squandered the national treasury to invade other countries on false flag pretenses, indebting your citizens, your children & grandchildren to come into indentured servitude to private bankers. What Chutzpah!
Ok. Thanks.
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I think it does outweigh the damage he's done by thousands of miles... There's a very good chance we could lose our Republic if the NSA continued down the path they were/are on.
I'm not even sure of any damage he's done?
Read the posts in this thread and others about Snowden. They outline the damage he has done.
We were not going to "lose the Republic." I'm not even sure what you mean by that? The spying needed to stop, but it could have been stopped without him disclosing secrets to countries around the planet that had absolutely nothing to do with the NSA spying on Americans.
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Truth.
Bill Gates: Edward Snowden Is Not a Hero
Friday, 14 Mar 2014
By Cathy Burke
National Security Agency secrets-leaker Edward Snowden is no hero, according to Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates.
"I think he broke the law,” Gates told Rolling Stone in an interview published in its latest issue.
“I certainly wouldn't characterize him as a hero. If he wanted to raise the issues and stay in the country and engage in civil disobedience or something of that kind, or if he had been careful in terms of what he had released, then it would fit more of the model of 'OK, I'm really trying to improve things.'
“You won't find much admiration from me."
Gates said “there has to be a debate” about government surveillance,“but the specific techniques they use become unavailable if they're discussed in detail.”
“So the debate needs to be about the general notion of under what circumstances should they be allowed to do things,” he said, adding:
“Should surveillance be usable for petty crimes like jaywalking or minor drug possession?
Or is there a higher threshold for certain information? Those aren't easy questions.”
Gates conceded issues of personal privacy are complicated, but that in some cases, “cameras everywhere” can be a good thing.
“My personal view is having cameras in inner cities is a very good thing,” he said, saying petty crime in London has gone down,and asserting “They catch terrorists because of it.”
“And if something really bad happens, most of the time you can figure out who did it,” he said. “There's a general view there that it's not used to invade privacy in some way. Yet in an American city, in order to take advantage of that in the same way, you have to trust what this information is going to be used for.”
He also said it’s no secret there’s no secrets.
“Every phone number you dial, every credit-card charge you make –it's long since passed that a typical person doesn't leave footprints,” he said. “But we need explicit rules... society does have an overriding interest in some activities, like, ‘Am I gathering nuclear-weapons plans, and am I going to kill millions of people?’ If we think there's an increasing chance of that, who do you trust? I actually wish we were having more intense debates about these things.”
Last July, the Guardian reported Microsoft had aided the NSA and FBI in accessing user data, including providing video and audio conversations from Skype, Microsoft's video chat service.
A Der Spiegel report in December also found that the NSA would use fake Windows error messages to spy on people.
Last year, Microsoft executives reportedly had meetings to discuss how to better encrypt user data and pledged in court they would fight any government requests for data of foreign customers.
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/bill-gates-edward-snowden-security/2014/03/14/id/559713#ixzz2wHE0qZCz
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Read the posts in this thread and others about Snowden. They outline the damage he has done.
We were not going to "lose the Republic." I'm not even sure what you mean by that? The spying needed to stop, but it could have been stopped without him disclosing secrets to countries around the planet that had absolutely nothing to do with the NSA spying on Americans.
That's fair enough.
You hold the same vitriol against your government for the lies and spying I hope?
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Truth.
Bill Gates: Edward Snowden Is Not a Hero
Friday, 14 Mar 2014
By Cathy Burke
National Security Agency secrets-leaker Edward Snowden is no hero, according to Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates.
"I think he broke the law,” Gates told Rolling Stone in an interview published in its latest issue.
Looks to me like Snowden wasn't the only one who broke the law.
Seems a lot of laws and a few promises were broken by quite a few people.
The Constitution is supposed to be the highest law in the land.
Seems to me the 4th Amendment to it got broken shredded, irretrievably ripped into tiny little pieces scattered into garbage pails all over the country (similar to that 911 Air Traffic Control audio tape)
"I promise to faithfully execute the laws on this land, ...uphold the Constitution, and protect it from all enemies both foreign & domestic... yada yada yada... how's that been working out so far?
Then there's willfully lying to a Congressional oversight committee? Is that against the law too?
Let's not even mention the "Whistle-blower Laws" that's supposed to protect gov't workers who blow the whistle on gov't misconduct. Do we see THAT law being upheld, or do we see Gov't wanting to rip out Snowden's heart and eat it while it's still beating?
What about the various Nuremburg laws forbidding naked aggressive wars against countries that didn't attack you first?
Sounds to me like there's been a whole lot of lawbreaking and complicitous "mission creep" taking place.
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That's fair enough.
You hold the same vitriol against your government for the lies and spying I hope?
I was very upset about the NSA spying on Americans. I'm also very upset over Snowden being a traitor.
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Looks to me like Snowden wasn't the only one who broke the law.
Seems a lot of laws and a few promises were broken by quite a few people.
The Constitution is supposed to be the highest law in the land.
Seems to me the 4th Amendment to it got broken shredded, irretrievably ripped into tiny little pieces scattered into garbage pails all over the country (similar to that 911 Air Traffic Control audio tape)
"I promise to faithfully execute the laws on this land, ...uphold the Constitution, and protect it from all enemies both foreign & domestic... yada yada yada... how's that been working out so far?
Then there's willfully lying to a Congressional oversight committee? Is that against the law too?
Let's not even mention the "Whistle-blower Laws" that's supposed to protect gov't workers who blow the whistle on gov't misconduct. Do we see THAT law being upheld, or do we see Gov't wanting to rip out Snowden's heart and eat it while it's still beating?
What about the various Nuremburg laws forbidding naked aggressive wars against countries that didn't attack you first?
Sounds to me like there's been a whole lot of lawbreaking and complicitous "mission creep" taking place.
You mix fact and fiction quite bit.
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You mix fact and fiction quite bit.
Where's the fact?
Where's the fiction?
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Where's the fact?
Where's the fiction?
This is fiction: "Seems to me the 4th Amendment to it got broken shredded, irretrievably ripped into tiny little pieces scattered into garbage pails all over the country (similar to that 911 Air Traffic Control audio tape)"
So is this: "What about the various Nuremburg laws forbidding naked aggressive wars against countries that didn't attack you first?"
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NSA Director Gen. Keith Alexander says future Snowden leaks could lead to deaths
Published March 25, 2014
FoxNews.com
The data that National Security Agency leaker Edward Snowden's holds could, if released, lead to deaths, the agency's outgoing director says.
Gen. Keith Alexander said in an interview aired Tuesday on "Special Report with Bret Baier" that the possibility that more information coming from Snowden could cost people their lives represents his "greatest concern."
"Do you know what he has?" host Baier asked the general.
"We have a good assessment of what he has, yes," Alexander said.
"And is there a lot more damaging to come?"
"Yes, especially to our military operations and those who are serving overseas," Alexander replied.
Alexander said he was "hugely disappointed" when he learned that Snowden, who was entrusted with sensitive information, began leaking NSA data last summer.
"I think this will haunt him for the rest of his life," Alexander said. "Here's a young guy who made some huge mistakes."
When asked what he would do with Snowden were he granted 15 minutes alone with him, Alexander said he wouldn't attack the former analyst, but instead might reveal to him the damage he's caused the agency, "so he knows the damage -- the significant damage to our nation and to our allies."
Alexander also said the reforms pushed by President Obama, which would require the NSA to prove more direct links from terrorists before acquiring data from telephone companies, are sensible.
"The approach that we put forward ... is one that would limit what we get, so it does away with the business record FISA database as we know it today, and we would now work with the telecommunications company on specific numbers that have a terrorist nexus and get only that data," Alexander said. "This is an approach that I think meets the intent of protecting our civil liberties and privacy and the security of this country."
Also in the interview, Alexander addressed concerns raised by former President Carter, who on Sunday said he uses snail mail to communicate with foreign leaders for fear his emails are being monitored.
"We're not [monitoring the emails]," Alexander said. "So he can now go back to writing emails. The reality is, we don't do that. And if we did, it would be illegal and we'd be ... held accountable and responsible."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/03/25/nsa-director-to-jimmy-carter-agency-not-spying-on-your-emails/
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NSA Director Gen. Keith Alexander says future Snowden leaks could lead to deaths
Published March 25, 2014
FoxNews.com
Never would have expected him to say that...
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Never would have expected him to say that...
"outgoing director"
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"outgoing director"
Doesn't he still need to defend things that happened under his watch? He's still in the military.
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Doesn't he still need to defend things that happened under his watch? He's still in the military.
Not really. No need to defend an agency you no longer work for. Plus he's either retiring or is already retired.
And he's a four star general. He can pretty much say whatever the heck he wants now (as a retiree).
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And that's partly why you were a lousy president.
Jimmy Carter: If I Were President, I Would Consider Pardoning Snowden
by Josh Feldman | 6:22 pm, April 3rd, 2014
Jimmy Carter said in an interview with BBC Newsnight Thursday that if he were still president, he would very strongly consider issuing Edward Snowden a presidential pardon, in contrast with the defiant tone President Obama‘s struck on Snowden’s actions.
Carter acknowledged that Snowden clearly violated the law, but if he was in the White House right now, he wouldn’t be so quick to go along with a harsh sentence against him.
“If he comes home, if he’s tried, if he’s found guilty, if he was incarcerated, and I was president… then I would certainly consider giving him a pardon. But it would be based on the fact that the punishment, in my opinion, exceeded the harm that he did to our country.”
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/jimmy-carter-if-i-were-president-i-would-consider-pardoning-snowden/#ooid=kxY2FvbDonV9FMp7lzgGAZCyBFp4FZ5B
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"I'm very upset by this traitor except for the parts that embarrassed obama, he's a hero for that part" - Conflicted Getbiggers.
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A lot of my Marine friends said the same thing.. who cares if he puts us at risk, our job is to be at risk, our governments job is to protect the citizens rights and freedoms.
...
Incredibly well said. I'm in awe (and will be stealing this to use on other forums).
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Incredibly well said. I'm in awe (and will be stealing this to use on other forums).
Yeah, I agree... Really cool
Makes you feel better about things
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Anyone who willingly gives classified documents or information about US programs to another country is a traitor. That has nothing to do with the US Constitution. If he would have stoped at the Gov spying on its citizens, he would be a hero. But he crossed the line. Offering to helf germany and Brazil? That is a US hero? I think not. No Russia OWNS him, until they have every ounce of intel, then it's the "accident".
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Anyone who willingly gives classified documents or information about US programs to another country is a traitor. That has nothing to do with the US Constitution. If he would have stoped at the Gov spying on its citizens, he would be a hero. But he crossed the line. Offering to helf germany and Brazil? That is a US hero? I think not. No Russia OWNS him, until they have every ounce of intel, then it's the "accident".
He only gave away information of crimes that should have never been classified to begin with though.
The NSA is as much of a friend to the American people as Pakistan is.
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Anyone who willingly gives classified documents or information about US programs to another country is a traitor. That has nothing to do with the US Constitution. If he would have stoped at the Gov spying on its citizens, he would be a hero. But he crossed the line. Offering to helf germany and Brazil? That is a US hero? I think not. No Russia OWNS him, until they have every ounce of intel, then it's the "accident".
I agree. Is this my gimmick?? :o
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He only gave away information of crimes that should have never been classified to begin with though.
The NSA is as much of a friend to the American people as Pakistan is.
Not true. He told a number of other countries that we were spying on them. You think we should just put up a website that identifies all the countries we spy on?
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Did you go through every single document to make sure? did he? What difference does it make anyway? Why help other countries? I say again, what does that have to do with the Constitution?
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Not true. He told a number of other countries that we were spying on them. You think we should just put up a website that identifies all the countries we spy on?
WE weren't spying on them, rogue criminals at the NSA were.
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I am all for whistleblowers exposing greed, corruption , and abuse by any government agency, but he crossed that line. Now he is hiding out at that beacon of Freedom and civil liberties, Russia, who just invaded a foriegn country and annexed it. How fitting.
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Did you go through every single document to make sure? did he? What difference does it make anyway? Why help other countries? I say again, what does that have to do with the Constitution?
I honestly don't believe he helped other countries. The news that's come out so far tells us that all he's done is set us on the right track to ending a rogue government origination that's a major threat to our freedom and democracy.
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I am all for whistleblowers exposing greed, corruption , and abuse by any government agency, but he crossed that line. Now he is hiding out at that beacon of Freedom and civil liberties, Russia, who just invaded a foriegn country and annexed it. How fitting.
It seems kind of fitting to me. Russia is the only major country that isn't giving up their sovereignty to the globalist world elite. Obama is more interested in funding the UN global military then funding the US military. I just posted an article about it. An undemocratic minority egged on by the globalists overthrew the democraticly elected government of Ukraine, and the people of Crimea exercised their natural right to secede.
Moscow is certainly no friend of ours don't get me wrong, but Washington DC isn't much better nowadays.
just my opinion...
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"exercised their natural right to secede"? After Russian troops had taken it already? That vote was a joke. If it would have happened in the natural course of the Ukraines development, then i would agree. But that is like the US invading cuba and then they vote to become part of the US. And BTW, Putin went from KGB agent to a billionare. Yeah, he is a shinning example for all.
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"exercised their natural right to secede"? After Russian troops had taken it already? That vote was a joke. If it would have happened in the natural course of the Ukraines development, then i would agree. But that is like the US invading cuba and then they vote to become part of the US. And BTW, Putin went from KGB agent to a billionare. Yeah, he is a shinning example for all.
If the government of Cuba was overthrown by a minority of neo nazis being supported by Russia we would likely send in some troops as well.
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"I honestly don't believe he helped other countries"? How did germany know the NSA was spying on them? He told them! Why? Does that help the US in anyway? You cannot let you disdain for the Gov blind you to the point that you agree with anyone that harms the US GOV, ultimately, it that weakens the nation.
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Thanks for the discussion, I enjoyed it. Have a good one.
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"I honestly don't believe he helped other countries"? How did germany know the NSA was spying on them? He told them! Why? Does that help the US in anyway? You cannot let you disdain for the Gov blind you to the point that you agree with anyone that harms the US GOV, ultimately, it that weakens the nation.
Legitimate government entities are in a stronger position now to try rein in these rogue agencies. Only good can come of shining some light on so much criminal activity.
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Thanks for the discussion, I enjoyed it. Have a good one.
Later, thanks!
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That traitor isn't in prison yet??
Snowden Makes Stunning Appearance On Putin TV Interview In Apparent PR Stunt
BRETT LOGIURATO
APR. 17, 2014
Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden made a surprise appearance on Thursday at Russian President Vladimir Putin's annual televised call-in with the nation.
Snowden's appearance gave Putin the opportunity to defend Russian surveillance, implicitly gaining Snowden's approval. Considering the tightly controlled circumstances of the rogue agent's asylum in Russia, the appearance has been widely seen as a PR stunt.
David Herszenhorn, a Moscow-based reporter for The New York Times, called it a "stunning in-your-face move" by the Kremlin.
Snowden asked Putin: "Does Russia store, intercept, or analyze, in any way, the communications of millions of individuals, and do you believe that simply increasing the effectiveness of intelligence or law enforcement investigations can justify a place in societies rather than subjects under surveillance?"
Putin said he would answer by talking as one professional spy to another, noting his past as a KGB agent and Snowden's past in the NSA before he leaked thousands of documents exposing U.S. surveillance programs.
"Our intelligence efforts are strictly regulated by our law ... " Putin said, according to a translation by Russia Today. "You have to get a court permission to stalk a particular person. We don't have a mass system of such interception. And according to our law, it cannot exist.
"Of course, we know that criminals and terrorists use technology for their criminal acts, and special services have to use technical means to respond to their crimes. Of course, we do some efforts like that. But we do not have a mass scale, uncontrollable effort like that. I hope we won't do that."
Putin added that Russia doesn't have the monetary or technical capabilities of U.S. programs.
Snowden's public appearance in Russia will likely add fuel to some U.S. lawmakers' claims that he has more extensive ties with Russia's government than he would like to admit. Mike Rogers, the Republican chair of the House Intelligence Committee, said last month that Snowden was "supporting, in an odd way," the Russian expansion into Crimea.
http://www.businessinsider.com/edward-snowden-putin-q-a-surveillance-2014-4#ixzz2zAU2tvgV
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What a stooge. Asking an ex-spy if he believes in spying. This should prove that he has given Russia everything he knows.
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Edward Snowden Says The US Stranded Him In Russia — Here Are 4 Problems With That Claim
MICHAEL KELLEY
MAY 28, 2014, 9:05 AM
Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden told "Nightly News" anchor Brian Williams in Moscow that he "never intended to end up in Russia."
The 30-year-old asserts that the U.S. State Department stranded him in Moscow after he arrived from Hong Kong on June 23.
"I had a flight booked to Cuba onwards to Latin America and I was stopped because the United States government decided to revoke my passport and trap me in Moscow Airport," Snowden said. "So when people ask why are you in Russia, I say, 'Please ask the State Department.'"
There are several issues with the claim that the U.S. stranded Snowden in Russia. Here are the most glaring:
1. Snowden couldn't have left Russia because he had no valid travel documents when he landed at Moscow's Sheremetyevo airport. The U.S. revoked Snowden's passport the day before he left. WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange then acquired an unsigned Ecuadorian travel document — ostensibly for safe passage to Latin America — that was void when Snowden landed in Moscow.
2. WikiLeaks told him to go to Russia and stay there. Assange told Janet Reitman of Rolling Stone magazine in December that he advised Snowden against going to Latin America because "he would be physically safest in Russia." WikiLeaks, who advised Snowden in Hong Kong while paying for his lodging and travel, reiterated the statement on May 1.
3. Snowden is an NSA-trained hacker and "spy" who was traveling through the territory of two U.S. adversaries. To a foreign intelligence service, "Snowden is priceless." The idea that someone of his status and expertise could freely pass through Moscow is highly implausible.
4. WikiLeaks told Business Insider that the Ecuadorian document was meant to help Snowden leave Hong Kong. That raises the question of why Snowden would need the document if his passport was still valid (Snowden says he used it to leave China). WikiLeaks has not explained why it would send the NSA-trained hacker to Russia knowing he would land with a void passport and a bunk travel document.
Basically, as explained by Russian security services expert Andrei Soldatov, "Snowden made a great mistake when he decided to go to Moscow." And there was little that the U.S. could do about it once he landed.
U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry, in response, called Snowden's claim "dumb."
Soldatov, who co-wrote the book on the post-Soviet Russian security services (FSB), detailed how the FSB would likely want to have handled Snowden after he reached out to Russian officials while staying in Hong Kong.
"The first step is to get Snowden to Moscow," Soldatov said. "The next step is to have him locked for 40 days [to decide what to do] … The next step is to provide him asylum ... Then to say, 'Someone is looking for you, you are in danger.' … And then you have the guy in a controlled environment, and then you can work with him."
That appears to be what has happened. Snowden has now been living under FSB protection in an undisclosed location for 10 months. And even though Kerry offered to "have him on a flight today" if he wants to return to America, there is no indication that Vladimir Putin would allow that.
So if the former CIA technician "never intended to end up in Russia," perhaps he shouldn't have flown to Moscow in the first place.
http://www.businessinsider.com/snowden-says-us-stranded-him-in-russia-2014-5#ixzz337lOX7wY
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But he says he has no contact with the Russian Government, except for kissing Putin's ass on TV. He can access and download classified documents, but he can't print out the "nemerous" emails he says he sent out?
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That traitor isn't in prison yet??
The word traitor is tossed around more frequently than the word "patriot" these days.
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The word traitor is tossed around more frequently than the word "patriot" these days.
I only use it when it fits, like it does with Snowden. Cannot speak for anyone else.
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I only use it when it fits, like it does with Snowden. Cannot speak for anyone else.
That you think it fits doesn't mean it does. Also, are you familiar with Stewart Baker, ex-Assistant Secretary for Policy at DHS? You two would get along just fabulously!.
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That you think it fits doesn't mean it does. Also, are you familiar with Stewart Baker, ex-Assistant Secretary for Policy at DHS? You two would get along just fabulously!.
I'm just expressing an opinion, so it doesn't matter whether you or anyone else thinks it fits.
No, I don't know Stewart Baker. Are you familiar with Morton Downy, Jr.? You two would have been buddies. :)
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I'm just expressing an opinion, so it doesn't matter whether you or anyone else thinks it fits.
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion. But you do know what they say about opinions, right?
No, I don't know Stewart Baker. Are you familiar with Morton Downy, Jr.? You two would have been buddies. :)
You may want to read the bullshit he writes. This is fairly typical: http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/06/02/fast-eddie-snowdens-problem-with-the-truth/
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You are, of course, entitled to your opinion. But you do know what they say about opinions, right?
You may want to read the bullshit he writes. This is fairly typical: http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/06/02/fast-eddie-snowdens-problem-with-the-truth/
Yes, I am entitled to express my opinion on an opinion board, just like everyone else.
I skimmed the link. Didn't see him call Snowden a traitor. That's the one improvement I'd offer to his commentary.
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Yes, I am entitled to express my opinion on an opinion board, just like everyone else.
I skimmed the link. Didn't see him call Snowden a traitor. That's the one improvement I'd offer to his commentary.
I'd hardly call piling shit on top of shit an improvement, but hey... it's your opinion and you're entitled to it, right? An interesting question is whether you can logically support that opinion. Something tells me that you cannot.
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I'd hardly call piling shit on top of shit an improvement, but hey... it's your opinion and you're entitled to it, right? An interesting question is whether you can logically support that opinion. Something tells me that you cannot.
Yes, we are entitled to our opinions, especially on an opinion board. You seem to be the only person struggling with that concept.
Snowden disclosed secrets to foreign countries. Telling other countries that we are spying on them makes him a traitor. And what is worse, he is essentially getting paid for his treason, because at least two foreign countries have sponsored him. I wonder if he will ever need to work again?
I hope he spends the rest of his life looking over his shoulder.
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Snowden disclosed secrets to foreign countries.
Correction: Snowden disclosed pervasive spying by the American Government on the American public via American journalists. This may not mean much to you, but it means a lot to some of us.
Telling other countries that we are spying on them makes him a traitor.
You're acting like other countries didn't know they were being spied on. Are you really that naive?
And what is worse, he is essentially getting paid for his treason, because at least two foreign countries have sponsored him.
Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence. Which country is sponsoring him and how? Remember, he only ended up stranded in Russia because the State Department revoked his passport, and no evidence has been presented that indicates that he is cooperating with the FSB or the Russian Government. Or ANY Government, for that matter.
I hope he spends the rest of his life looking over his shoulder.
Snowden knew he was throwing his life away when he chose to do this. But it is a pity he did so for people like you.
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Correction: Snowden disclosed pervasive spying by the American Government on the American public via American journalists. This may not mean much to you, but it means a lot to some of us.
You're acting like other countries didn't know they were being spied on. Are you really that naive?
Objection. Assumes facts not in evidence. Which country is sponsoring him and how? Remember, he only ended up stranded in Russia because the State Department revoked his passport, and no evidence has been presented that indicates that he is cooperating with the FSB or the Russian Government. Or ANY Government, for that matter.
Snowden knew he was throwing his life away when he chose to do this. But it is a pity he did so for people like you.
Other countries know we are spying on them, so it's fine for an American citizen with a security clearance, who signed a non-disclosure agreement, to violate both his agreement and federal law to disclose exactly how we are spying on other countries? How stupid is that? If that is the case, then why are we maintaining secrets? There is a reason we don't post our covert activities on the internet. Talk about naive.
I don't believe he paid for his accommodations in either Hong Kong or Russia. I doubt he has gainful employment, other than sharing American secrets with foreign countries. Who paid his hotel bill? Who is buying his food? Who is paying for accommodations now? (Rhetorical questions.)
Wait. Snowden threw his life away for people like me? lol . . . . I could care less about that traitorous turd. I am glad we know about the domestic spying, but he went way too far by sharing secrets with foreign countries. Indefensible. And there are ways to be a whistleblower. This is not one of them.
I doubt he is suffering. He needs to share a cell with Bradley Manning (or whatever the heck his female name is now).
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Big Data Firm Says It Can Link Snowden Data To Changed Terrorist Behavior
by DINA TEMPLE-RASTON
August 01, 2014
For nearly a year, U.S. government officials have said revelations from former NSA contract worker Edward Snowden harmed national security and allowed terrorists to develop their own countermeasures. Those officials haven't publicly given specific examples — but a tech firm based in Cambridge, Mass., says it has tangible evidence of the changes.
According to a new report to be released Friday by big data firm Recorded Future, a direct connection can be drawn: Just months after the Snowden documents were released, al-Qaida dramatically changed the way its operatives interacted online.
"We saw at least three major product releases coming out with different organizations with al-Qaida and associated organizations fairly quickly after the Snowden disclosures," said Recorded Future's CEO and co-founder Christopher Ahlberg. "But we wanted to go deeper and see how big those changes were."
By "product releases," Ahlberg means new software. And for the first time, Recorded Future says, it can now codify just how big a change it was.
The company brought in a cyber expert, Mario Vuksan, the CEO of Reversing Labs, to investigate the technical aspects of the new software. Vuksan essentially reverse-engineered the 2013 encryption updates and found not only more sophisticated software but also newly available downloads that allowed encryption on cellphones, Android products and Macs.
To put that change into context, for years, al-Qaida has used an encryption program written by its own coders called Mujahideen Secrets. It was a Windows-based program that groups like al-Qaida's arm in Yemen and al-Shabab in Somalia used to scramble their communications. American-born radical imam Anwar al-Awlaki used it, too. Since Mujahideen Secret's introduction in 2007, there had been some minor updates to the program, but no big upgrades.
Ahlberg thought the fact that the group changed the program months after Snowden's revelations provided good circumstantial evidence that the former contractor had had an impact — but he wanted to see how much.
As it turns out, Recorded Future and Reversing Labs discovered that al-Qaida didn't just tinker at the edges of its seven-year-old encryption software; it overhauled it. The new programs no longer use much of what's known as "homebrew," or homemade algorithms. Instead, al-Qaida has started incorporating more sophisticated open-source code to help disguise its communications.
"This is as close to proof that you can get that these have changed and improved their communications structure post the Snowden leaks," Ahlberg said.
Others are less sure that you can draw a straight line from Snowden to the changes in al-Qaida's encryption program. Bruce Schneier, a technologist and fellow at the Berkman Center at Harvard, said it's hard to tell.
"Certainly they have made changes," Schneier said, "but is that because of the normal costs of software development or because they thought rightly or wrongly that they were being targeted?"
Whatever the reason, Schneier says, al-Qaida's new encryption program won't necessarily keep communications secret, and the only way to ensure that nothing gets picked up is to not send anything electronically. Osama bin Laden understood that. That's why he ended up resorting to couriers.
Upgrading encryption software might mask communications for al-Qaida temporarily, but probably not for long, Schneier said.
"It is relatively easy to find vulnerabilities in software," he added. "This is why cybercriminals do so well stealing our credit cards. And it is also going to be why intelligence agencies are going to be able to break whatever software these al-Qaida operatives are using."
The NSA, for its part, declined to comment.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/08/01/336958020/big-data-firm-says-it-can-link-snowden-data-to-changed-terrorist-behavior?ft=1&f=1001
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I wonder who is paying for this traitorous turd to live this kind of lifestyle? Must be Russia.
Snowden makes first public appearance, secretly visits Moscow’s Bolshoi theatre
Published time: August 05, 2014 17:18
Edited time: August 05, 2014 19:40 Get short URL
The US whistleblower Edward Snowden has visited Moscow’s Bolshoi Theatre in his first public appearance since coming to Russia a year ago. Reporters were hardly able to recognize the former CIA employee without his signature look glasses.
The NSA whistleblower apparently decided to mark a year of asylum in Russia by making a public appearance. He attended the Tsar's Bride opera in Moscow’s historic Bolshoi Theatre.
Snowden slipped in almost unnoticed. He sat in one of the theatre’s boxes, admiring Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov’s opera that recounts a tragic love story during the time of Ivan the Terrible’s reign in Russia.
Snowden publically promised to study Russian culture when he was granted asylum in August last year.
In June 2013, the former NSA contractor landed in Moscow’s Sheremetyevo airport in transit from Hong Kong, with Ecuador as his final destination.
After Snowden leaked sensitive US intelligence, Washington charged him with theft of government property, unauthorized communication of national defense information, and willful communication of classified intelligence to an unauthorized person, canceling his passport upon arrival in Moscow. This led to the leaker getting stranded in the transit zone until Russia granted him temporary asylum.
His Russian lawyer, Anatoly Kucherena, told RT that during the time Snowden was holed up in the airport he brought him books by prominent Russian authors such as Fyodor Dostoevsky, Anton Chekhov, and the classic 12-volume History of the Russian state by 19th century historian Nikolay Karamzin - all of those books in English.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BuPyM4WCYAAqUiM.jpg:large)
(http://rt.com/files/news/2b/81/80/00/snowden-moscow-visit-theatre.jpg)
The State Academic Bolshoi Theater, in Moscow (RIA Novosti / Vladimir Vyatkin)The State Academic Bolshoi Theater, in Moscow (RIA Novosti / Vladimir Vyatkin)
At the same time, according to Kucherena, Snowden promised to learn Russian. When Snowden was granted asylum, he was taken to an undisclosed “safe place” and has not been seen in public since. During this time he has made a few videos and appeared in teleconferences and interviews.
In August last year, Life news published a photo of a man it claimed was the first showing US intelligence leaker Edward Snowden in Moscow. The image showed a casually-dressed man, with a goatee and glasses, pushing a supermarket trolley full of groceries across a road. However the photo was blurry and it was hard to establish the man’s identity.
Snowden filed an official petition on July 9 to extend his asylum in Russia for another year. The whistleblower can stay in the country while his application is being processed. Currently, Snowden holds a three-year post as Rector of the University of Glasgow and serves on the Freedom of the Press Foundation board of directors.
http://rt.com/news/178200-snowden-moscow-visit-theatre/
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I wonder who is paying for this traitorous turd to live this kind of lifestyle? Must be Russia.
Snowden makes first public appearance, secretly visits Moscow’s Bolshoi theatre
Published time: August 05, 2014 17:18
Edited time: August 05, 2014 19:40 Get short URL
The US whistleblower Edward Snowden has visited Moscow’s Bolshoi Theatre in his first public appearance since coming to Russia a year ago. Reporters were hardly able to recognize the former CIA employee without his signature look glasses.
The NSA whistleblower apparently decided to mark a year of asylum in Russia by making a public appearance. He attended the Tsar's Bride opera in Moscow’s historic Bolshoi Theatre.
Snowden slipped in almost unnoticed. He sat in one of the theatre’s boxes, admiring Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov’s opera that recounts a tragic love story during the time of Ivan the Terrible’s reign in Russia.
Snowden publically promised to study Russian culture when he was granted asylum in August last year.
In June 2013, the former NSA contractor landed in Moscow’s Sheremetyevo airport in transit from Hong Kong, with Ecuador as his final destination.
After Snowden leaked sensitive US intelligence, Washington charged him with theft of government property, unauthorized communication of national defense information, and willful communication of classified intelligence to an unauthorized person, canceling his passport upon arrival in Moscow. This led to the leaker getting stranded in the transit zone until Russia granted him temporary asylum.
His Russian lawyer, Anatoly Kucherena, told RT that during the time Snowden was holed up in the airport he brought him books by prominent Russian authors such as Fyodor Dostoevsky, Anton Chekhov, and the classic 12-volume History of the Russian state by 19th century historian Nikolay Karamzin - all of those books in English.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BuPyM4WCYAAqUiM.jpg:large)
(http://rt.com/files/news/2b/81/80/00/snowden-moscow-visit-theatre.jpg)
The State Academic Bolshoi Theater, in Moscow (RIA Novosti / Vladimir Vyatkin)The State Academic Bolshoi Theater, in Moscow (RIA Novosti / Vladimir Vyatkin)
At the same time, according to Kucherena, Snowden promised to learn Russian. When Snowden was granted asylum, he was taken to an undisclosed “safe place” and has not been seen in public since. During this time he has made a few videos and appeared in teleconferences and interviews.
In August last year, Life news published a photo of a man it claimed was the first showing US intelligence leaker Edward Snowden in Moscow. The image showed a casually-dressed man, with a goatee and glasses, pushing a supermarket trolley full of groceries across a road. However the photo was blurry and it was hard to establish the man’s identity.
Snowden filed an official petition on July 9 to extend his asylum in Russia for another year. The whistleblower can stay in the country while his application is being processed. Currently, Snowden holds a three-year post as Rector of the University of Glasgow and serves on the Freedom of the Press Foundation board of directors.
http://rt.com/news/178200-snowden-moscow-visit-theatre/
What kind of lifestyle? Is it something talked about at the link? (I've only read what you've excerpted and not the article at the link itself.)
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I wonder who is paying for this traitorous turd to live this kind of lifestyle? Must be Russia.
Rock solid logic there...
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Rock solid logic there...
I agree.
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What kind of lifestyle? Is it something talked about at the link? (I've only read what you've excerpted and not the article at the link itself.)
He is likely unemployed. Not too many unemployed people attend the theater. And I doubt he is living in squalor.
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He is likely unemployed. Not too many unemployed people attend the theater. And I doubt he is living in squalor.
You should spare yourself the embarrassment of finding out exactly what your doubts on the topic are worth, especially considering that they are pure speculation on your part.
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You should spare yourself the embarrassment of finding out exactly what your doubts on the topic are worth, especially considering that they are pure speculation on your part.
Embarrassment? lol
My opinion is as speculative as your unexpressed opinion. Nobody knows for certain what he is doing. But if you think he is slaving away at a 9-5 job, then you are pretty naive.
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He is likely unemployed. Not too many unemployed people attend the theater. And I doubt he is living in squalor.
But didn't the article say "his one public appearance"? Couldn't he have savings that would cover one ticket to the Bolshoi Theater?
If ya ask me, having to live anywhere near Moscow, holed up like he mostly is or not, sounds like the suck to me.
Weather is too humid in summer and hella cold in the winter. Even shittier than the weather in Raleigh, NC that I'm happy to not have to deal with anymore.
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But didn't the article say "his one public appearance"? Couldn't he have savings that would cover one ticket to the Bolshoi Theater?
If ya ask me, having to live anywhere near Moscow, holed up like he mostly is or not, sounds like the suck to me.
Weather is too humid in summer and hella cold in the winter. Even shittier than the weather in Raleigh, NC that I'm happy to not have to deal with anymore.
He left his job in Hawaii in May 2013. If he was living off savings (assuming he had any), I doubt living in hotels, etc. allowed him to save money.
The man has been cooperating with one of our longest foes. They have to be taking care of that traitor.
I hope to see him behind bars one day.
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Edward Snowden Wins Sweden's 'Alternative Nobel Prize'
Wednesday, 24 Sep 2014
Former U.S. spy agency contractor Edward Snowden has been awarded Sweden's Right Livelihood Honorary Award, often referred to as the 'Alternative Nobel Prize', for his work on press freedom, the award's foundation said on Wednesday.
Snowden is wanted by the United States for leaking extensive secrets of its electronic surveillance programmes and lives in Russia where he has a three-year residence permit.
The Right Livelihood Award Foundation said Snowden was given the prize "for his courage and skill in revealing the unprecedented extent of state surveillance violating basic democratic processes and constitutional rights."
He shares the award with Alan Rusbridger, editor-in-chief of the British newspaper The Guardian, with whom he collaborated to publish his revelations on the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA), the foundation said in a statement.
It also said it would fund legal support for Snowden.
Snowden, who fled to Hong Kong and then Moscow last year, is believed to have taken 1.7 million computerised documents. Those published so far revealed massive programmes run by the NSA that gathered information on emails, phone calls and Internet use by hundreds of millions of Americans.
Snowden was charged last year in the United States with theft of government property, unauthorised communication of national defence information and wilful communication of classified intelligence to an unauthorised person.
The Right Livelihood Award was established in 1980 to honour and support those "offering practical and exemplary answers to the most urgent challenges facing us today".
http://www.Newsmax.com/Newsfront/edward-snowden-sweden-alternative-nobel/2014/09/24/id/596600/#ixzz3EFhkw13n
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http://www.showbiz411.com/2014/10/10/edward-snowden-doc-premieres-shocking-inside-look-at-how-he-did-it
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::)
CELEBRITIES SIGN STATEMENT IN SUPPORT OF SNOWDEN, WIKILEAKS
by DANIEL NUSSBAUM 10 Nov 2014
Russell Brand And Susan Sarandon Declare Support For Edward Snowden
NY Daily News
A group of over 50 musicians, actors, celebrities, and other public figures signed a statement in support of whistleblowing organization WikiLeaks and notorious NSA contractor Edward Snowden this week.
According to Rolling Stone, the signatories include musicians Moby, M.I.A., P.J. Harvey, Tom Morello, and Thurston Moore; actors Russell Brand, Viggo Mortensen, Pamela Anderson, and Susan Sarandon; and directors Alfonso Cuaron and Terry Gilliam. Political commentator and linguist Noam Chomsky and clothing designer Vivienne Westwood also signed the statement.
The statement reads:
We stand in support of those fearless whistleblowers and publishers who risk their lives and careers to stand up for truth and justice. Thanks to the courage of sources like Daniel Ellsberg, Chelsea Manning, Jeremy Hammond and Edward Snowden, the public can finally see for themselves the war crimes, corruption, mass surveillance, and abuses of power of the U.S. government and other governments around the world. WikiLeaks is essential for its fearless dedication in defending these sources and publishing their truths. These bold and courageous acts spark accountability, can transform governments and ultimately make the world a better place.
Several of the people who signed the statement of support issued statements of their own, including Viggo Mortensen, who called for the public to donate to the Courage Foundation, Snowden's legal defense fund.
"As Albert Camus once put it, governments, by definition, do not have consciences; they have policies and nothing more," Mortensen wrote in his statement. "Therefore, it is up to all of us free-thinking citizens to demand truly transparent democracy and high, unbiased moral standards from those who govern us. I hope everyone can chip in to support Snowden and those patriotic whistleblowers that come after him."
In her own statement, clothing designer Westwood promoted CitizenFour, a new documentary sympathetic to Snowden.
"I didn't ask Edward Snowden to stick his neck out for me," Westwood's statement read. "But now that he did, I ask myself where would we be without him?"
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Hollywood/2014/11/10/Russell-Brand-M-I-A-Noam-Chomsky-and-Others-Sign-Statement-in-Support-of-Snowden-WikiLeaks
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Feds: Snowden Would Face Charges If He Returns
(http://www.newsmax.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?guid=8dabcd29-00bb-4f22-b144-a27551534840&SiteName=Newsmax&maxsidesize=600)
Image: Feds: Snowden Would Face Charges If He Returns (AFPTV/AFP/Getty Images)
Wednesday, 04 Mar 2015
Edward Snowden's Russian lawyer said Tuesday that legal teams are "doing everything possible" to return him to the United States, but his lead American attorney said the Russian's statements were exaggerated.
“This is much ado about nothing,” Ben Wizner, who serves as director of the ACLU's Speech, Privacy & Technology Project and is Snowden’s head legal counsel in the United States, told Vanity Fair's website in an e-mail. "Just [Snowden’s] Russian lawyer paraphrasing what [Snowden] has always said: that he would return to the U.S. if a fair trial were available.”
At a news conference in Moscow on Tuesday, Anatoly Kucherena, who is Snowden's attorney in Russia, said he would not "keep it secret that he... wants to return back home. And we are doing everything possible now to solve this issue. There is a group of U.S. lawyers, there is also a group of German lawyers and I'm dealing with it on the Russian side."
Kucherena, who has links to the Kremlin, made the comments during a news conference Tuesday to present a book he has written about Snowden.
Snowden has been living under asylum in Russia since 2013, where he fled after leaking vital documents from the National Security Agency. He has long said he wishes to return home to the United States, but won't because of what he calls the threat of unfair prosecution.
Latest News Update
In Washington, U.S. officials said they would welcome the former NSA contractor's Snowden's return to the United States but he would have to face criminal charges which have been filed against him. Russia has repeatedly refused to extradite him.
"It remains our position that Mr. Snowden should return to the United States and face the charges filed against him,"Justice Department spokesman Marc Raimondi told Reuters: "If he does, he will be accorded full due process and protections."
Snowden is praised by some as a civil rights campaigner and whistleblower and condemned by others as a traitor who compromised U.S. security. Kucherena said in August Snowden had been given a three-year Russian residence permit.
The U.S. position is that "Snowden is not a whistleblower. He is accused of leaking classified information and there is no question his actions have inflicted serious harms on our national security," Raimondi said.
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/snowden-return-US-russia/2015/03/04/id/628147/#ixzz3TRU9Bk3z
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Feds: Snowden Would Face Charges If He Returns
(http://www.newsmax.com/CMSPages/GetFile.aspx?guid=8dabcd29-00bb-4f22-b144-a27551534840&SiteName=Newsmax&maxsidesize=600)
Image: Feds: Snowden Would Face Charges If He Returns (AFPTV/AFP/Getty Images)
Wednesday, 04 Mar 2015
Edward Snowden's Russian lawyer said Tuesday that legal teams are "doing everything possible" to return him to the United States, but his lead American attorney said the Russian's statements were exaggerated.
“This is much ado about nothing,” Ben Wizner, who serves as director of the ACLU's Speech, Privacy & Technology Project and is Snowden’s head legal counsel in the United States, told Vanity Fair's website in an e-mail. "Just [Snowden’s] Russian lawyer paraphrasing what [Snowden] has always said: that he would return to the U.S. if a fair trial were available.”
At a news conference in Moscow on Tuesday, Anatoly Kucherena, who is Snowden's attorney in Russia, said he would not "keep it secret that he... wants to return back home. And we are doing everything possible now to solve this issue. There is a group of U.S. lawyers, there is also a group of German lawyers and I'm dealing with it on the Russian side."
Kucherena, who has links to the Kremlin, made the comments during a news conference Tuesday to present a book he has written about Snowden.
Snowden has been living under asylum in Russia since 2013, where he fled after leaking vital documents from the National Security Agency. He has long said he wishes to return home to the United States, but won't because of what he calls the threat of unfair prosecution.
Latest News Update
In Washington, U.S. officials said they would welcome the former NSA contractor's Snowden's return to the United States but he would have to face criminal charges which have been filed against him. Russia has repeatedly refused to extradite him.
"It remains our position that Mr. Snowden should return to the United States and face the charges filed against him,"Justice Department spokesman Marc Raimondi told Reuters: "If he does, he will be accorded full due process and protections."
Snowden is praised by some as a civil rights campaigner and whistleblower and condemned by others as a traitor who compromised U.S. security. Kucherena said in August Snowden had been given a three-year Russian residence permit.
The U.S. position is that "Snowden is not a whistleblower. He is accused of leaking classified information and there is no question his actions have inflicted serious harms on our national security," Raimondi said.
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/snowden-return-US-russia/2015/03/04/id/628147/#ixzz3TRU9Bk3z
Sounds like Putin has n more use for him and is geting rid of the dead weight. He should have gone to Cuba instead.
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>:(
Eric Holder: The Justice Department could strike deal with Edward Snowden
Michael Isikoff
Chief Investigative Correspondent
July 6, 2015
Former Attorney General Eric Holder said today that a “possibility exists” for the Justice Department to cut a deal with former NSA contractor Edward Snowden that would allow him to return to the United States from Moscow.
In an interview with Yahoo News, Holder said “we are in a different place as a result of the Snowden disclosures” and that “his actions spurred a necessary debate” that prompted President Obama and Congress to change policies on the bulk collection of phone records of American citizens.
Asked if that meant the Justice Department might now be open to a plea bargain that allows Snowden to return from his self-imposed exile in Moscow, Holder replied: “I certainly think there could be a basis for a resolution that everybody could ultimately be satisfied with. I think the possibility exists.”
Holder’s comments came as he began a new job as a private lawyer at Covington & Burling, the elite Washington law firm where he worked before serving as the nation’s top law enforcement officer from February 2009 until last April.
In that capacity, Holder presided over an unprecedented crackdown on government leakers, including the filing of a June 2013 criminal complaint against Snowden, charging him with three felony violations of the Espionage Act for turning over tens of thousands of government documents to journalists.
Holder had previously said — in a January 2014 interview with MSNBC — that the U.S. would be willing to “engage in conversation” with Snowden and his lawyers were he willing to return to the United States to face the charges, but ruled out any granting of clemency.
But his remarks to Yahoo News go further than any current or former Obama administration official in suggesting that Snowden’s disclosures had a positive impact and that the administration might be open to a negotiated plea that the self-described whistleblower could accept, according to his lawyer Ben Wizner.
Eric Holder: The Justice Department could strike deal with Edward Snowden
Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden is seen on a screen during a video conference as part of Amnesty International’s Write for Rights campaign in 2014. (Photo: Charles Platiau/Pool/AP)
“The former attorney general’s recognition that Snowden’s actions led to meaningful changes is welcome,” said Wizner. “This is significant … I don’t think we’ve seen this kind of respect from anybody at a Cabinet level before.”
Holder declined to discuss what the outlines of a possible deal might consist of, saying that as the former attorney general, it would not be “appropriate” for him to discuss it.
It’s also not clear whether Holder’s comments signal a shift in Obama administration attitudes that could result in a resolution of the charges against Snowden. Melanie Newman, chief spokeswoman for Attorney General Loretta Lynch, Holder’s successor, immediately shot down the idea that the Justice Department was softening its stance on Snowden.
“This is an ongoing case so I am not going to get into specific details but I can say our position regarding bringing Edward Snowden back to the United States to face charges has not changed,” she said in an email.
Three sources familiar with informal discussions of Snowden’s case told Yahoo News that one top U.S. intelligence official, Robert Litt, the chief counsel to Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, recently privately floated the idea that the government might be open to a plea bargain in which Snowden returns to the United States, pleads guilty to one felony count and receives a prison sentence of three to five years in exchange for full cooperation with the government.
Litt declined to comment. A source close to Litt said any comments he made were personal and did not represent the position of the U.S. government. The source also said Litt has made clear to Snowden’s representatives that “nothing is going to happen unless he comes in and moves off this idea, ‘I’m entitled to a medal.’”
But Wizner, Snowden’s lawyer, said any felony plea by Snowden that results in prison time would be unacceptable to his client. “Our position is he should not be reporting to prison as a felon and losing his civil rights as a result of his act of conscience,” he said.
Moreover, any suggestion of leniency toward Snowden would likely run into strong political opposition in Congress as well as fierce resistance from hard-liners in the intelligence community who remain outraged over his wholesale disclosure of highly classified government documents. Those feelings have, in some ways, been exacerbated by Snowden’s worldwide celebrity that recently prompted him to enter into an arrangement with a speaker’s bureau that has allowed him to give paid talks to worldwide audiences via Skype from his apartment in Moscow.
“I’m quite stunned that we would be considering any return of Snowden to this country other than to meet a jury of his peers, period,” said Michael Hayden, former director of both the NSA and CIA under President George W. Bush, when asked about Holder’s comments.
What Snowden did, however, “was the greatest hemorrhaging of legitimate American secrets in the history of the republic, no question about it,” Hayden added.
Whatever happens, Snowden’s legal fate won’t be in Holder’s hands. In the interview, he said he planned to concentrate on giving “strategic advice” to corporate clients at Covington — but no lobbying — while also engaging in significant pro bono work, including starting a foundation to promote issues such as criminal justice reform.
Holder also said he has already had “interactions” with Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign and expects to be helpful, including possibly speaking at campaign events and providing advice. “That will be up to the campaign,” he said. “Whatever the nominee wants.”
https://www.yahoo.com/politics/eric-holder-the-justice-department-could-strike-123393663066.html
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Title should read:
US Citizens: No Mercy for Napolitano or Whore Politicians
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>:(
Eric Holder: The Justice Department could strike deal with Edward Snowden
Michael Isikoff
Chief Investigative Correspondent
July 6, 2015
Former Attorney General Eric Holder said today that a “possibility exists” for the Justice Department to cut a deal with former NSA contractor Edward Snowden that would allow him to return to the United States from Moscow.
In an interview with Yahoo News, Holder said “we are in a different place as a result of the Snowden disclosures” and that “his actions spurred a necessary debate” that prompted President Obama and Congress to change policies on the bulk collection of phone records of American citizens.
Asked if that meant the Justice Department might now be open to a plea bargain that allows Snowden to return from his self-imposed exile in Moscow, Holder replied: “I certainly think there could be a basis for a resolution that everybody could ultimately be satisfied with. I think the possibility exists.”
Holder’s comments came as he began a new job as a private lawyer at Covington & Burling, the elite Washington law firm where he worked before serving as the nation’s top law enforcement officer from February 2009 until last April.
In that capacity, Holder presided over an unprecedented crackdown on government leakers, including the filing of a June 2013 criminal complaint against Snowden, charging him with three felony violations of the Espionage Act for turning over tens of thousands of government documents to journalists.
Holder had previously said — in a January 2014 interview with MSNBC — that the U.S. would be willing to “engage in conversation” with Snowden and his lawyers were he willing to return to the United States to face the charges, but ruled out any granting of clemency.
But his remarks to Yahoo News go further than any current or former Obama administration official in suggesting that Snowden’s disclosures had a positive impact and that the administration might be open to a negotiated plea that the self-described whistleblower could accept, according to his lawyer Ben Wizner.
Eric Holder: The Justice Department could strike deal with Edward Snowden
Former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden is seen on a screen during a video conference as part of Amnesty International’s Write for Rights campaign in 2014. (Photo: Charles Platiau/Pool/AP)
“The former attorney general’s recognition that Snowden’s actions led to meaningful changes is welcome,” said Wizner. “This is significant … I don’t think we’ve seen this kind of respect from anybody at a Cabinet level before.”
Holder declined to discuss what the outlines of a possible deal might consist of, saying that as the former attorney general, it would not be “appropriate” for him to discuss it.
It’s also not clear whether Holder’s comments signal a shift in Obama administration attitudes that could result in a resolution of the charges against Snowden. Melanie Newman, chief spokeswoman for Attorney General Loretta Lynch, Holder’s successor, immediately shot down the idea that the Justice Department was softening its stance on Snowden.
“This is an ongoing case so I am not going to get into specific details but I can say our position regarding bringing Edward Snowden back to the United States to face charges has not changed,” she said in an email.
Three sources familiar with informal discussions of Snowden’s case told Yahoo News that one top U.S. intelligence official, Robert Litt, the chief counsel to Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, recently privately floated the idea that the government might be open to a plea bargain in which Snowden returns to the United States, pleads guilty to one felony count and receives a prison sentence of three to five years in exchange for full cooperation with the government.
Litt declined to comment. A source close to Litt said any comments he made were personal and did not represent the position of the U.S. government. The source also said Litt has made clear to Snowden’s representatives that “nothing is going to happen unless he comes in and moves off this idea, ‘I’m entitled to a medal.’”
But Wizner, Snowden’s lawyer, said any felony plea by Snowden that results in prison time would be unacceptable to his client. “Our position is he should not be reporting to prison as a felon and losing his civil rights as a result of his act of conscience,” he said.
Moreover, any suggestion of leniency toward Snowden would likely run into strong political opposition in Congress as well as fierce resistance from hard-liners in the intelligence community who remain outraged over his wholesale disclosure of highly classified government documents. Those feelings have, in some ways, been exacerbated by Snowden’s worldwide celebrity that recently prompted him to enter into an arrangement with a speaker’s bureau that has allowed him to give paid talks to worldwide audiences via Skype from his apartment in Moscow.
“I’m quite stunned that we would be considering any return of Snowden to this country other than to meet a jury of his peers, period,” said Michael Hayden, former director of both the NSA and CIA under President George W. Bush, when asked about Holder’s comments.
What Snowden did, however, “was the greatest hemorrhaging of legitimate American secrets in the history of the republic, no question about it,” Hayden added.
Whatever happens, Snowden’s legal fate won’t be in Holder’s hands. In the interview, he said he planned to concentrate on giving “strategic advice” to corporate clients at Covington — but no lobbying — while also engaging in significant pro bono work, including starting a foundation to promote issues such as criminal justice reform.
Holder also said he has already had “interactions” with Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign and expects to be helpful, including possibly speaking at campaign events and providing advice. “That will be up to the campaign,” he said. “Whatever the nominee wants.”
https://www.yahoo.com/politics/eric-holder-the-justice-department-could-strike-123393663066.html
Good, they should recognize that what he did wasn't 100% bad.
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Good, they should recognize that what he did wasn't 100% bad.
Yeah what's a little treason among friends. He should spend the rest of his life in prison IMO.
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Yeah what's a little treason among friends. He should spend the rest of his life in prison IMO.
I disagree, not the rest of his life. Just till he's 85-90! ;D
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I disagree, not the rest of his life. Just till he's 85-90! ;D
I can live with that. A little time off for good behavior. :)
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Yeah what's a little treason among friends. He should spend the rest of his life in prison IMO.
I don't know where the balance is - he certainly has to do time - but a lifetime is way, way excessive.
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I don't know where the balance is - he certainly has to do time - but a lifetime is way, way excessive.
I think when criminals are convicted, they can bring in things that might reduce their punishment during the sentencing phase. I'm not sure how that would reasonably and logically work with Snowden. What can he say? "Yes, I knowingly violated federal law, violated my confidentiality agreement, stole confidential information affecting national security, shared secret information with allies and enemies that has nothing to do with the NSA spying on Americans . . . but at least I exposed the NSA spying on Americans"?
I might do what catracho said and let him out when he is 85-90.
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I think when criminals are convicted, they can bring in things that might reduce their punishment during the sentencing phase. I'm not sure how that would reasonably and logically work with Snowden. What can he say? "Yes, I knowingly violated federal law, violated my confidentiality agreement, stole confidential information affecting national security, shared secret information with allies and enemies that has nothing to do with the NSA spying on Americans . . . but at least I exposed the NSA spying on Americans"?
Yeah, installing wiretaps siphoning gigabits of traffic per second at Tier 1 IXs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A) which were analyzed by systems that can process the data streams in real time (http://www.spiegel.de/media/media-34103.pdf) and store and make it available for querying via a Google-style interface (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XKeyscore), so that analysts could have a steady supply of porn (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/21/us/politics/edward-snowden-at-nsa-sexually-explicit-photos-often-shared.html?_r=0), and hacking into corporate computer infrastructure to siphon data in an unencrypted state (https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/nsa-infiltrates-links-to-yahoo-google-data-centers-worldwide-snowden-documents-say/2013/10/30/e51d661e-4166-11e3-8b74-d89d714ca4dd_story.html) is simply "exposing the NSA spying on Americans." I could go on...
Did Snowden break the law? Yes. Should he face trial? Yes. But cut the bullshit because what he exposed was way more important than "the NSA spying on Americans": he exposed a government ruck amuck and using secret laws and secret Courts to turn the country - and the entire world - into a huge surveillance state that would leave George Orwell blushing.
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Yeah, installing wiretaps siphoning gigabits of traffic per second at Tier 1 IXs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A) which were analyzed by systems that can process the data streams in real time (http://www.spiegel.de/media/media-34103.pdf) and store and make it available for querying via a Google-style interface (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XKeyscore), so that analysts could have a steady supply of porn (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/21/us/politics/edward-snowden-at-nsa-sexually-explicit-photos-often-shared.html?_r=0), and hacking into corporate computer infrastructure to siphon data in an unencrypted state (https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/nsa-infiltrates-links-to-yahoo-google-data-centers-worldwide-snowden-documents-say/2013/10/30/e51d661e-4166-11e3-8b74-d89d714ca4dd_story.html) is simply "exposing the NSA spying on Americans." I could go on...
Did Snowden break the law? Yes. Should he face trial? Yes. But cut the bullshit because what he exposed was way more important than "the NSA spying on Americans": he exposed a government ruck amuck and using secret laws and secret Courts to turn the country - and the entire world - into a huge surveillance state that would leave George Orwell blushing.
Did he break the law? Yes. Did he commit treason? Yes. So cut the BS apologizing for a traitor. I am glad we know about the spying, but I have zero sympathy for that traitor. There is absolutely no justification for him stealing and then sharing information with allies and enemies about us spying on them. In terms of his punishment, stealing classified intel and giving it to Russia et al. dwarfs his disclosure of the NSA spying on Americans.
But like I said earlier, I'm cool with letting him out when he gets past about 85 or so.
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Did he break the law? Yes. Did he commit treason? Yes. So cut the BS apologizing for a traitor. I am glad we know about the spying, but I have zero sympathy for that traitor. There is absolutely no justification for him stealing and then sharing information with allies and enemies about us spying on them. In terms of his punishment, stealing classified intel and giving it to Russia et al. dwarfs his disclosure of the NSA spying on Americans.
But like I said earlier, I'm cool with letting him out when he gets past about 85 or so.
Fuck you and the penis you rode in on asshole - I'm not apologizing for anyone. I'm stating my opinion - which happens to be almost diametrically opposite to yours. You are happy with living under constant surveillance and I'm not. You think that it's ok for the Government to shred the Constitution to shreds and I don't. You believe it's appropriate to have secret laws and secret courts and I don't. If you don't like what I have to say, that's too bad.
You say there's no justification for what he did; that's your opinion and you're welcome to it. But that's all it and it's not worth very much. And one more thing you arrogant prig: he's presumed innocent until charges are brought and he's proven guilty in a court of law. That you and your ilk think him guilty doesn't make him so.
And while you're frothing at the mouth about what Snowden did and how it damaged the country, you don't seem the least bit bothered by what this Government has done or how hose actions damaged the country. Some American you are...
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Snowden could fly into the USA this summer, declare his intention to take on hilary... and win the DEM party presidential nomination a few months later.
and you know, this man.
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Fuck you and the penis you rode in on asshole - I'm not apologizing for anyone. I'm stating my opinion - which happens to be almost diametrically opposite to yours. You are happy with living under constant surveillance and I'm not. You think that it's ok for the Government to shred the Constitution to shreds and I don't. You believe it's appropriate to have secret laws and secret courts and I don't. If you don't like what I have to say, that's too bad.
You say there's no justification for what he did; that's your opinion and you're welcome to it. But that's all it and it's not worth very much. And one more thing you arrogant prig: he's presumed innocent until charges are brought and he's proven guilty in a court of law. That you and your ilk think him guilty doesn't make him so.
And while you're frothing at the mouth about what Snowden did and how it damaged the country, you don't seem the least bit bothered by what this Government has done or how hose actions damaged the country. Some American you are...
You sound pretty angry.
The only thing I'll respond to is the "presumed innocent" part. We're not in a court of law. This is a message board. There is no "innocent until proven guilty" on a message board or in the court of public opinion. Plus, anyone who doesn't have their head up Snowden's rear end knows he has already admitted stealing classified intel.
Now, take a deep breath, and as I recommended before, go smoke a joint so you can calm down. Might make you feel better too.
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I think when criminals are convicted, they can bring in things that might reduce their punishment during the sentencing phase. I'm not sure how that would reasonably and logically work with Snowden. What can he say? "Yes, I knowingly violated federal law, violated my confidentiality agreement, stole confidential information affecting national security, shared secret information with allies and enemies that has nothing to do with the NSA spying on Americans . . . but at least I exposed the NSA spying on Americans"?
I might do what catracho said and let him out when he is 85-90.
Nope. He would point out that he tried numerous times to raise the flag through legitimate channels. He will point out that he was ignored, shunned, even threatened with the loss of his career. He will point out that even now there has been ZERO accountability. He will point out that the Constitution was being shit on. He will point out that even in the aftermath members of Congress were wrongly spied on when investigating the matter. He will point out that his actions led to much needed change.
A lifetime or near lifetime imprisonment is cruel and unusual, IMO.
He has to do time for sure and not all of his behavior can be justified by the greater good argument, but I would think 5-10 would be an appropriate range (given only what is in the public sector).
Which leads to another question, would he ever even get a fair, open, public trial. Me thinks they would bend over backwards to keep it out of the public claiming national security.
A plea may be the fairest, most open thing available.
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Nope. He would point out that he tried numerous times to raise the flag through legitimate channels. He will point out that he was ignored, shunned, even threatened with the loss of his career. He will point out that even now there has been ZERO accountability. He will point out that the Constitution was being shit on. He will point out that even in the aftermath members of Congress were wrongly spied on when investigating the matter. He will point out that his actions led to much needed change.
A lifetime or near lifetime imprisonment is cruel and unusual, IMO.
He has to do time for sure and not all of his behavior can be justified by the greater good argument, but I would think 5-10 would be an appropriate range (given only what is in the public sector).
Which leads to another question, would he ever even get a fair, open, public trial. Me thinks they would bend over backwards to keep it out of the public claiming national security.
A plea may be the fairest, most open thing available.
I doubt most of that is true. When he did try and be a legitimate whistle blower? Where are you getting that from?
Even if we assume everything you wrote is true, stealing classified intel and providing it to our enemies, who in return give him shelter, overshadows any of the good that came out of his exposure of the NSA spying. There is no way he doesn't get anything less than something close to a life sentence, which is exactly what he deserves.
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I doubt most of that is true. When he did try and be a legitimate whistle blower? Where are you getting that from?
He repeatedly attempted to report some of the blatant abuses via internal channels, including going all the way up to the IG. If you can't be bothered to read up on the details of a case you're pronouncing opinions, what good are those opinions?
Even if we assume everything you wrote is true, stealing classified intel and providing it to our enemies, who in return give him shelter, overshadows any of the good that came out of his exposure of the NSA spying. There is no way he doesn't get anything less than something close to a life sentence, which is exactly what he deserves.
No, it's your opinion that the good that came out of this is overshadowed by the bad. What objective evidence, if any, do you have to support that position? The statements of public officials like James Clapper, that provably and repeatedly lied under oath in a Congressional hearing and didn't face any repercussions? Or from the public officials that keep telling you how terrorist attacks are being averted every second of every day and you should be a-ok with the fact that all it took was a little bit of freedom?
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He repeatedly attempted to report some of the blatant abuses via internal channels, including going all the way up to the IG. If you can't be bothered to read up on the details of a case you're pronouncing opinions, what good are those opinions?
No, it's your opinion that the good that came out of this is overshadowed by the bad. What objective evidence, if any, do you have to support that position? The statements of public officials like James Clapper, that provably and repeatedly lied under oath in a Congressional hearing and didn't face any repercussions? Or from the public officials that keep telling you how terrorist attacks are being averted every second of every day and you should be a-ok with the fact that all it took was a little bit of freedom?
I'm not going to look it up. If you want to post a link I'll read it.
Of course it's my opinion. I've posted numerous articles in this thread about the damage his treason has caused that support my opinion.
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I'm not going to look it up. If you want to post a link I'll read it.
It's not my job to do your research for you. If you want to make a fool of yourself by commenting on topics that you aren't informed about, that's certainly your right and I'm under no obligation to help you avoid that.
Of course it's my opinion. I've posted numerous articles in this thread about the damage his treason has caused that support my opinion.
You know what they say about opinions, right?
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It's not my job to do your research for you. If you want to make a fool of yourself by commenting on topics that you aren't informed about, that's certainly your right and I'm under no obligation to help you avoid that.
You know what they say about opinions, right?
You make a claim that Snowden tried to go through proper channels. I call BS. You then tell me to go look for information to support your claim. lol I think not.
I know what they say about opinions. What's your point?
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You make a claim that Snowden tried to go through proper channels. I call BS. You then tell me to go look for information to support your claim. lol I think not.
I know what they say about opinions. What's your point?
YOU made the claim he didn't go through proper channels. When challenged, you said you weren't going to look it up, despite it only taking 5 seconds (Google is your friend): http://firedoglake.com/2014/05/29/nbc-news-confirms-attempt-by-edward-snowden-to-go-through-channels-at-nsa/ - and there's plenty more.
If you can't be bothered to research the subject that you're talking about, perhaps you ought to shut up and let the adults - who who have researched - discuss without butting in.
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YOU made the claim he didn't go through proper channels. When challenged, you said you weren't going to look it up, despite it only taking 5 seconds (Google is your friend): http://firedoglake.com/2014/05/29/nbc-news-confirms-attempt-by-edward-snowden-to-go-through-channels-at-nsa/ - and there's plenty more.
If you can't be bothered to research the subject that you're talking about, perhaps you ought to shut up and let the adults - who who have researched - discuss without butting in.
Actually, if you go back and read the thread (which I recommend), you will see that someone else first claimed he went through proper channels. That was later repeated by Skip, and then by you.
Thanks for the link. The closest thing I see to him actually trying to blow the whistle is this:
After this portion of the interview played, Williams informed viewers that NBC News had learned from “multiple sources that Snowden did indeed send at least one email to the General Counsel’s office raising policy and legal questions.” It was working to confirm further details and had filed a Freedom of Information Act request for any other records of Snowden going through channels.
Pretty weak. The rest of the article talks about Snowden's own alleged repeated attempts to blow the whistle. One of the reasons that doesn't pass the smell test is he should have his own copies of numerous purported emails. The same guy who stole an untold number of classified documents doesn't have copies of his own emails? The stench is strong.
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Actually, if you go back and read the thread (which I recommend), you will see that someone else first claimed he went through proper channels. That was later repeated by Skip, and then by you.
Thanks for the link. The closest thing I see to him actually trying to blow the whistle is this:
After this portion of the interview played, Williams informed viewers that NBC News had learned from “multiple sources that Snowden did indeed send at least one email to the General Counsel’s office raising policy and legal questions.” It was working to confirm further details and had filed a Freedom of Information Act request for any other records of Snowden going through channels.
Pretty weak. The rest of the article talks about Snowden's own alleged repeated attempts to blow the whistle. One of the reasons that doesn't pass the smell test is he should have his own copies of numerous purported emails. The same guy who stole an untold number of classified documents doesn't have copies of his own emails? The stench is strong.
Not really all that week. There's way more than one e-mail, a fact acknowledged in open hearings in the Senate commitee. Besides, even if Snowde had the copies and provided them, would you accept them at face value? You - and your ilk - are likely to argue he falsified them. And note, that it's unclear that going through "proper channels" would have helped. Plenty of others have gone through proper channels and did everything by the book and what happened? Thomas Drake, a senior executive at NSA, followed procedure and securely reported abuses to Congress; he faced prosecution.
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Not really all that week. There's way more than one e-mail, a fact acknowledged in open hearings in the Senate commitee. Besides, even if Snowde had the copies and provided them, would you accept them at face value? You - and your ilk - are likely to argue he falsified them. And note, that it's unclear that going through "proper channels" would have helped. Plenty of others have gone through proper channels and did everything by the book and what happened? Thomas Drake, a senior executive at NSA, followed procedure and securely reported abuses to Congress; he faced prosecution.
I don't know if I would accept them or not. Maybe yes, maybe no. Depends on what they said, who they were addressed to, whether they appear to be genuine, etc.
There are plenty of protections for whistleblowers. I know whistleblowers who have done it the right way. If he would have done it the right way, I doubt he would have been prosecuted. And if he would have stopped at only exposing the NSA spying on Americans instead of stealing and then giving confidential intel to our enemies, this would be an entirely different discussion.
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disagree. he took an oath and worked for years at intel agencies.
when they pay your bills, when they give a check, you agree to STFU. you can't pick and choose when to leak classified shit base don your own personal ethics code.
I dont like the govt spying on americans, but i think he did brek law, he deserves jail. the MINUTE it's okay to leak SOME classified shit based on the moral code of some random dude, we are screwed. cause the next random dude might feel like giving away nuke secrets, etc.
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I don't know if I would accept them or not. Maybe yes, maybe no. Depends on what they said, who they were addressed to, whether they appear to be genuine, etc.
There are plenty of protections for whistleblowers. I know whistleblowers who have done it the right way. If he would have done it the right way, I doubt he would have been prosecuted. And if he would have stopped at only exposing the NSA spying on Americans instead of stealing and then giving confidential intel to our enemies, this would be an entirely different discussion.
Again, tell that to Thomas Drake who tried to responsbility "blow the whistle" by talking with the Senate and House Intelligence Committees.
disagree. he took an oath and worked for years at intel agencies.
when they pay your bills, when they give a check, you agree to STFU. you can't pick and choose when to leak classified shit base don your own personal ethics code.
I dont like the govt spying on americans, but i think he did brek law, he deserves jail. the MINUTE it's okay to leak SOME classified shit based on the moral code of some random dude, we are screwed. cause the next random dude might feel like giving away nuke secrets, etc.
He deserves a fair trial. What happens after that is up to the jury.
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He deserves a fair trial. What happens after that is up to the jury.
agree, always. But he needs to be on trial for it. not on the run, not pardoned, etc. I may disagree 100% with the evil shit he revealed, but I respect the secrecy, classified nature of our nation's forces and branches.
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Again, tell that to Thomas Drake who tried to responsbility "blow the whistle" by talking with the Senate and House Intelligence Committees.
He deserves a fair trial. What happens after that is up to the jury.
Wasn't Thomas Drake convicted of a crime? If so, doesn't sound like he did it the right way, but I haven't followed his situation.
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Wasn't Thomas Drake convicted of a crime? If so, doesn't sound like he did it the right way, but I haven't followed his situation.
Right, because why would anyone be convicted if they didn't do something bad, right? ::)
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agree, always. But he needs to be on trial for it. not on the run, not pardoned, etc. I may disagree 100% with the evil shit he revealed, but I respect the secrecy, classified nature of our nation's forces and branches.
I don't think he gets a free ride. But life in prison? Shit, there were Lincoln conspirators that got pardoned for fucks sake.
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Right, because why would anyone be convicted if they didn't do something bad, right? ::)
Including those who plead guilty to committing a crime like Drake did, right? ::)
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Good.
No sign of deal for Snowden as White House rejects 2-year online petition
Published August 02, 2015
FoxNews.com
Edward Snowden will likely remain hiding in Russia for some time, with Washington officials and most Americans offering no leniency or forgiveness for him notoriously stealing classified information and jeopardizing U.S. national security.
The White House is the most recent entity to take such a position, rejecting a two-year-long petition drive on its own website to pardon Snowden, who took classified National Security Agency data while working as a government contractor.
“Mr. Snowden's dangerous decision to steal and disclose classified information had severe consequences for the security of our country and the people who work … to protect it,” Lisa Monaco, President Obama’s adviser on Homeland Security and Counterterrorism, said this week. “He should come home to the United States and be judged by a jury of his peers.”
She also said that if Snowden thought his actions were consistent with civil disobedience, then he should have done what others who have taken issue with their own government have done: “Challenge it, speak out, engage in a constructive act of protest.”
The 31-year-old Snowden was a NSA contractor from 2009 to 2013, working roughly the last 15 months at an agency facility in Hawaii that reportedly monitored China and North Korea.
He gave the top-secret information to several journalists before departing in May 2013 for Hong Kong.
In June, the Justice Department charged Snowden with espionage while he was in Russia, where he has since been granted temporary asylum. Snowden purportedly was headed to Ecuador.
Snowden’s efforts exposed the federal government’s vast electronic-spying programs including a post-9/11 project that collects and stores data on Americans’ phone calls and other electronic activities. He reportedly collected, then gave to journalists 50,000 to as many as 200,000 documents.
Washington lawyer Stephen Kohn, who specializes in advocating for corporate and government whistleblowers, argued Wednesday that the U.S. should nevertheless strike a deal with Snowden and show some leniency.
He argued that Snowden never had the opportunity to expose the information, as Morales suggested, because the federal government did not include intelligence agencies when enacting whistleblower laws in 1978.
“It’s stuck in the mud,” said Kohn, a partner in the firm Kohn, Kohn and Colapinto. “These arcane practices have no effective way to report misconduct. … When Congress establishes safe procedures, people use them.”
Kohn also argued the deal should essentially be that Snowden turns over the remaining information in exchange for a punishment less than life in prison.
“It’s in the American public’s interest to contain more damage,” he said.
Americans, however, don’t appear willing or eager to cut Snowden a break.
Roughly 64 percent of them familiar with Snowden have a negative view of him, according to a poll published in April by U.S. News & World Report.
Snowden will likely remain beyond U.S. borders at least until Obama leaves office in January 2017.
None of the 17 GOP presidential candidates have touted a deal, if elected president, and unlikely will, considering the party’s base favors those tough on national security.
David Payne, a Republican strategist and partner at Vox Global, argues the 2016 GOP candidates have a range of beliefs on the issue: from former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush and Florida Sen. Marco Rubio, who think the recent reforms to our government “snooping” laws were extreme, to Kentucky Sen. Rand Paul, who has proposed major restrictions to government data collection on citizens.
He also points out that the April poll was funded by the American Civil Liberties Union, which supports Snowden. And he argues nobody in the GOP field would back a “politically tricky” presidential pardon.
“We won’t see a Republican presidential nominee go anywhere near this idea,” he said Thursday.
Democratic challenge Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders purportedly expressed interest last year in some leniency for Snowden but made clear that he thought he committed a crime.
However, neither his nor the campaign of fellow 2016 Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton responded to a request this week for a statement about Snowden.
Former Attorney General Eric Holder has recently said “the possibility exists” that Snowden could strike a deal that would limit his prison time, to perhaps three to five years.
However, the White House has also downplayed Holder’s comments.
"I would caution you against reading his comments that way," Press Secretary Josh Earnest told reporters July 8.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/02/no-sign-deal-for-snowden-from-white-house-to-congress-2016-field/