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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:39:05 AM



Title: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:39:05 AM
Mike was never able to best Arnold. He went down hill from 1980 on, yet his build was awesome in his prime.

(http://www.muscleandbrawn.com/mabwallpaper/mentzer/1600mentzer.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:40:02 AM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Ny1A3uTKbGE/UCqR8BM2n3I/AAAAAAAAA0A/cFLFedTcZAU/s400/Mike%2BMentzer.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:41:01 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/1d/a4/2d/1da42d423fed7191707eea6235a3e784.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:41:57 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/2a/83/fb/2a83fb03ce7c1ee9c0fc858959aaaedf.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:42:50 AM
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-fOgCbAplWeI/Un_hQrGXlaI/AAAAAAAADsw/pjUZF5suM1s/s1600/MIKE_MENTZER_ARNOLD_SCHWARZENEGGER_MR_OLYMPIA_1980_POSEDOWN_SIDE_BICEPS_MUSCULAR_01.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:43:46 AM
(http://johndoebodybuilding.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Mike-Mentzer.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:45:44 AM
(http://baye.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/mike-mentzer-barbell-curl.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:47:20 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/bc/83/c7/bc83c700fd85deda3471eee99f319849.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:49:18 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/0c/82/b7/0c82b75d35f4a27979ef549c00996529.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:50:36 AM
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-AslGmA_N15k/TyP2htMSKAI/AAAAAAAAI7M/HsT8-GkI0-M/s1600/k56.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Skylge on April 02, 2017, 09:50:42 AM
(http://johndoebodybuilding.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Mike-Mentzer.jpg)

Shopped photo?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:52:43 AM
Not sure, it does look suspect on the sides.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 09:56:07 AM
(http://66.media.tumblr.com/d084c7db9e89e74202d5ac7b5853f40a/tumblr_nga6fkUVBf1u5spl4o1_1280.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dj181 on April 02, 2017, 10:22:50 AM
outstanding arms, especially tris


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Ugly on April 02, 2017, 10:26:02 AM
Mike was never able to best Arnold. He went down hill from 1980 on

Needs to let that whole Olympia fiasco go. Shit's gonna end up killing him.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Disgusted on April 02, 2017, 10:31:27 AM
Poor Mike, A victim of his own mind. I have wondered if he had a mild form of schizophrenia.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 10:34:49 AM
Needs to let that whole Olympia fiasco go. Shit's gonna end up killing him.

 ;D


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 10:36:19 AM
Poor Mike, A victim of his own mind. I have wondered if he had a mild form of schizophrenia.

Well he did have issues, amphetamines probably did not do him any favors.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Disgusted on April 02, 2017, 10:38:19 AM
Well he did have issues, amphetamines probably did not do him any favors.

He needed to just put that shit behind him and compete in a few more shows.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 10:43:22 AM
He needed to just put that shit behind him and compete in a few more shows.

Agreed, had he stuck with it he may have won the Olympia at least once.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The_Iron_Disciple on April 02, 2017, 10:46:58 AM
My ideal physique.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Nether Animal on April 02, 2017, 10:48:34 AM
Shopped photo?

Yes.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Disgusted on April 02, 2017, 10:49:00 AM
Mentzer was a daredevil.  He didn't mind trying new drugs and pushing the limits on gear. 3 grams a week of deca alone.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 02, 2017, 10:53:11 AM
looks short. like an action figure


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: _bruce_ on April 02, 2017, 12:03:17 PM
looks short. like an action figure


He kinda looked like a figure from "Masters Of The Universe". Simply outstanding in some shots.

p.s.: the day I saw the video of him and his brother training the german Markus-dude was such a sobering experience.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Matt on April 02, 2017, 12:29:05 PM
Mentzer was a daredevil.  He didn't mind trying new drugs and pushing the limits on gear. 3 grams a week of deca alone.

He said non-HIT training protocols were designed for genetic freaks on steroids.  As if he was anything but a genetic freak on steroids himself.  ::)

Also, all training is pretty consistent in showing that volume is the best for muscle growth.  Not sure what him and Dozer were on about when it came to HIT, but it obviously worked for them.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 02, 2017, 01:15:10 PM
I am no pro, nor have I ever used steroids tempting as it is. From my experience training with high reps And several sets at the start of the workout then heavy less reps towards the end has worked well for me. I once tried Arnold Schwarzenegger's guide to modern overtraining bible. Never got anywhere with it. In fact it was around 1990 that a weight lifter in his fifties approached me and showed me how less was more unless I was running gear.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: wes on April 02, 2017, 01:45:59 PM
He said non-HIT training protocols were designed for genetic freaks on steroids.  As if he was anything but a genetic freak on steroids himself.  ::)

Also, all training is pretty consistent in showing that volume is the best for muscle growth.  Not sure what him and Dozer were on about when it came to HIT, but it obviously worked for them.
He built his body using volume training originally.......HIT just maintained his body.

He grew but so would anyone on the amount of gear he used.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Taffin on April 02, 2017, 01:49:02 PM
Shopped photo?

Not sure, it does look suspect on the sides.

Not sure why they blurred it like that, but I can't find evidence of tampering with Mike's proportions when I rock and roll between the two versions of this shot.  It think the fact they letterboxed it in this way creates the optical illusion of increased width...

Take a look for yourself...


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Parker on April 02, 2017, 02:08:16 PM
Not sure why they blurred it like that, but I can't find evidence of tampering with Mike's proportions when I rock and roll between the two versions of this shot.  It think the fact they letterboxed it in this way creates the optical illusion of increased width...

Take a look for yourself...
take a look at the bar outside of his arm.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ARNIE1947 on April 02, 2017, 07:22:42 PM
Not sure why they blurred it like that, but I can't find evidence of tampering with Mike's proportions when I rock and roll between the two versions of this shot.  It think the fact they letterboxed it in this way creates the optical illusion of increased width...

Take a look for yourself...


Photoshopped....


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Coach is Back! on April 02, 2017, 07:59:54 PM
Mentzer was a daredevil.  He didn't mind trying new drugs and pushing the limits on gear. 3 grams a week of deca alone.

Damn!!


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Disgusted on April 02, 2017, 08:06:51 PM
Damn!!

Know a pro who went to one of his training seminars back in the mid 90's. Kind of a private group of guys. At the end he said some Mexican? looking guy would then talk about drug use not Mike. Orals were run 6 weeks on 6 weeks off. So Dbol drol for example were run at 100 to 200 mg daily. Injects 1500 Mgs weekly of say deca and 1500 mgs of test or what ever you liked. Mike apparently liked his deca.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: bigkahuna on April 02, 2017, 08:18:18 PM
Mentzer was a daredevil.  He didn't mind trying new drugs and pushing the limits on gear. 3 grams a week of deca alone.

3grams of Deca back in the day is like 10grams of the UG stuff u get nowadays ;D


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Coach is Back! on April 02, 2017, 08:21:46 PM
Know a pro who went to one of his training seminars back in the mid 90's. Kind of a private group of guys. At the end he said some Mexican? looking guy would then talk about drug use not Mike. Orals were run 6 weeks on 6 weeks off. So Dbol drol for example were run at 100 to 200 mg daily. Injects 1500 Mgs weekly of say deca and 1500 mgs of test or what ever you liked. Mike apparently liked his deca.

That just blows me away especially since everything back then was real.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Coach is Back! on April 02, 2017, 08:23:32 PM
3grams of Deca back in the day is like 10grams of the UG stuff u get nowadays ;D

Back then even the D-bol was I think still the 5mg CIBA.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Disgusted on April 02, 2017, 09:36:57 PM
Back then even the D-bol was I think still the 5mg CIBA.


It was. I happen to get one of the last bottles right before it got discontinued. Prescribed by my doc. 


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Master Blaster on April 02, 2017, 09:37:51 PM
 :P


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Ronnie Rep on April 03, 2017, 05:35:29 AM
He needed to just put that shit behind him and compete in a few more shows.
That might have pushed him even further over the edge if he din't agree with his placings.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Griffith on April 03, 2017, 05:48:49 AM
What happened in 1980?  ???

Looks a lot more impressive in those pics.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Keto Kid on April 03, 2017, 06:20:06 AM
Interesting views on Nutrition, taken from an interview he did with IronMan Magazine

Theoretically, you can become highly defined eating nothing but ice cream'as long as your daily total calorie intake is below your maintenance need of calories. Then you have to resort to bodyfat for energy. I'm not advocating that because it's not a well-balanced diet. Eat a well-balanced diet'60 percent carbohydrates, 25 percent proteins and 15 percent fat'but eat a reduced number of calories. It doesn't have to be all protein. I know the majority of my fellow Mr. Olympia competitors woke up every morning during their training period grumpy bastards because all they had to look forward to was tuna fish and water. I woke up in the morning always looking forward to breakfast because I had bran muffins and often cake and cookies, fruits and vegetables.
I ate a wide assortment of carbohydrates; often I would have just carrot cake and coffee for breakfast because I knew I needed that sugar for the workout. But I didn't do it recklessly; I knew what my daily maintenance need of calories was and as long as I stayed below that every day'I kept a daily record of my calorie intake'I could eat that cake with impunity and not get fat. I was getting ripped, as a matter of fact.

I was eating ice cream at least four days a week before the Mr. Olympia contest'again, not recklessly. I knew that I had to get under 2,500 calories a day. I was averaging about 1,800. So I was burning about 700 calories a day in fat. And I was actually burning more than that because I was so active. I was riding my bicycle up to 40 miles a day. And I was getting cut up before my very eyes. Every day I would wake up and see more definition'and the night before I had just had an ice cream cone. I mean, it's ridiculous eating nothing but protein or tuna fish and water to get cut up. Not only is it not healthy and no fun, it's just ridiculous.

You've got to have carbohydrates to build muscle, and you've got to have carbohydrates to maintain muscle. If you're looking to build mass, you've got to have a large amount of carbohydrates in your diet. Not an untold number'again, 60 percent of your daily maintenance need of calories. And, when you're trying to lose fat and maintain muscle, you need sugar in your diet. As long as you're eating a reduced calorie diet, you can eat as many carbs as you want and still get ripped.
Theoretically, you can eat pure table sugar and be as ripped as a Mohamed Makkawy. I've gone beyond the 60 percent that I mentioned. Before the Olympia I was eating almost 80 to 90 percent carbohydrates. Tom Platz, who looked unbelievable at this year's Mr. Olympia'he was probably around 2 percent bodyfat. In the last three days before the contest he stayed at my home in Palm Springs to get some sun, and I couldn't believe my eyeballs when I saw him: His skin was like tissue paper! He was eating 400 grams of carbohydrates a day, but he was performing a lot of aerobics, and he was getting fewer calories than he needed to maintain himself. It can be done.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dj181 on April 03, 2017, 06:41:56 AM
He built his body using volume training originally.......HIT just maintained his body.

He grew but so would anyone on the amount of gear he used.

he built most of his size early on with volume brosef

but back in the late 70s he added a few more pounds of lean dry muscle with rest pause  8)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 08:18:30 AM
What happened in 1980?  ???

Looks a lot more impressive in those pics.

Looks like he over dieted lost his fullness and went flat.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 03, 2017, 08:59:51 AM
died way too young.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Griffith on April 03, 2017, 09:29:55 AM
Looks like he over dieted lost his fullness and went flat.

Yes, there's a massive difference, he has the wow factor in the pics here, didn't really have that in 1980.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dj181 on April 03, 2017, 10:58:27 AM
blob splatz was never 2 %


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dseiler on April 03, 2017, 01:12:23 PM
Poor Mike, A victim of his own mind. I have wondered if he had a mild form of schizophrenia.

Some of his later interviews you can see that the guy was definitely manic. Then again, don't you have to be to succeed in bodybuilding?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: mazrim on April 03, 2017, 01:42:05 PM
(http://66.media.tumblr.com/d084c7db9e89e74202d5ac7b5853f40a/tumblr_nga6fkUVBf1u5spl4o1_1280.jpg)
Super full arms. Wish I had anything close to that.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 01:56:54 PM
Super full arms. Wish I had anything close to that.

Loved the way his arms hung relaxed by his side. Like a big ham hock. No one had that particular look at that time.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-BquYedW6PQQ/T1yhnWkZOpI/AAAAAAAAANg/Uol_R7yA4c4/s1600/mike+mentzer4.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 01:58:35 PM
(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/sh0.08/e35/p640x640/15875704_1137352553029219_1108003284926332928_n.jpg?ig_cache_key=MTQyNzIxODM3MjM3MTAxNzM5Mw%3D%3D.2)

Unlike bbers today, Mentzer had a unique look. And it's nice to see real delts without it being pumped up from site injects and synthol.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 03, 2017, 02:30:50 PM
i dont know man

i wish he had a bald head, some tattoos and maybe a piercing


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 03, 2017, 02:58:51 PM
i dont know man

i wish he had a bald head, some tattoos and maybe a piercing


yeah that would look great on mike


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 03, 2017, 03:03:17 PM
and how come there's no gay rumours about him?

dont tell me he was a heterosexual bodybuilder!!!



Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: bigkahuna on April 03, 2017, 03:06:39 PM
Never noticed til now but seems like he only had the genetics for a 4 pack


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 03, 2017, 03:10:56 PM
or 5 pack

i noticed it too, still it looks good and better than a lot of others

i dont see a whole lot of pictures of his back

dont know how it compared to others competing at that time


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Rajkapoor on April 03, 2017, 03:16:59 PM
Mike was an atheist.enough proof that he was the most intelligent competitive pro bodybuilder ever lived.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 04:01:44 PM
and how come there's no gay rumours about him?

dont tell me he was a heterosexual bodybuilder!!!



It was the first time I heard the phrase, "Mike got more ass than a toilet seat."

But rest assured the homos on this board make up their own fantasies.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 04:10:20 PM
or 5 pack

i noticed it too, still it looks good and better than a lot of others

i dont see a whole lot of pictures of his back

dont know how it compared to others competing at that time

Good lat development but sorely lacking in mid back. The lower trap development. Didn't have that full "kite" display. Dickerson, Zane, Robby... all the top guys destroyed him in that department.

It didn't seem to be mentioned much, if at all, during that time but I feel this is one of the reason's  why he lost to Kal, Zane and Arnold. They were all clearly better from the back.

(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=oQtWv1XIEE2dqQcn24ZMWlZvLkzSvW3+9YQrLJS1VEbC27J63JTU1uOb9cyFIHeOOTbfpJC6TzPI6k2QzmOjtf0EwyPTB3J9L89jjRAvRXlevbNmm8+p+ZnXBPkx4iwM&u=http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/mi4.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/k72.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/m65.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Bevo on April 03, 2017, 04:31:35 PM
It was the first time I heard the phrase, "Mike got more ass than a toilet seat."

But rest assured the homos on this board make up their own fantasies.

No one got more ass than bob Paris..... fact


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 04:36:20 PM
No one got more ass than bob Paris..... fact

LOL.

OK, you got me there.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 04:38:44 PM
Loved the way his arms hung relaxed by his side. Like a big ham hock. No one had that particular look at that time.

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-BquYedW6PQQ/T1yhnWkZOpI/AAAAAAAAANg/Uol_R7yA4c4/s1600/mike+mentzer4.jpg)

Yep, his arms where thick as fuck.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 04:41:28 PM
Good lat development but sorely lacking in mid back. The lower trap development. Didn't have that full "kite" display. Dickerson, Zane, Robby... all the top guys destroyed him in that department.

It didn't seem to be mentioned much, if at all, during that time but I feel this is one of the reason's  why he lost to Kal, Zane and Arnold. They were all clearly better from the back.

(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=oQtWv1XIEE2dqQcn24ZMWlZvLkzSvW3+9YQrLJS1VEbC27J63JTU1uOb9cyFIHeOOTbfpJC6TzPI6k2QzmOjtf0EwyPTB3J9L89jjRAvRXlevbNmm8+p+ZnXBPkx4iwM&u=http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/mi4.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/k72.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/m65.jpg)

You're right. His back did not have the full thick sweeping lats. Still like his build though, just looked powerful.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Ugly on April 03, 2017, 04:42:57 PM
Old CHP friend said he once arrested Mike for posing in his undies by a freeway onramp. Irvine, I think, yelling at cars all incoherent and such. Mid/late 80s, before any of us knew he was cuckoopants.

Didn't sound too far-fetched years later.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 04:44:19 PM
Some informed commentary for those that are interested in Mentzer:

The truth is quite clear to anyone who was present during this period: either as a competitor or an observer.
            Mentzer was the most popular bodybuilder in the world during his prime [ with the fans up until Arnold started making movies] - NO doubt about it. Ask Bob Kennedy or Wayne Gallasch [ sp] who was the main person selling videos at the time. He was the modern day Steve Reeves with a spectacular look [ head to toe when in shape] that no one could match. I remember in London,  Mentzer gracefully walking down the street and everyone [ non bodybuilders and especially women as well] going crazy. This is what happened where ever Mentzer went. He would tell me that he had so many requests from women that it was hard to comprehend. When the Mentzer's trained EVERY eye was on them. Believe it that all would trade their physiques for his in a heart beat.
           At the 79 Olympia Chris Lund stated that Mentzer had the greatest physique that he had ever photographed up to that point. [ I believe this statement was published in the mags also- not sure though]. Serge Nubret stated that Mike was superior but would not be given the title [ to that effect]. Which leads us to the dark side  of Mike and at the time quite an extensive one existed.
           As I previously said Mike was the most admired bodybuilder in the world at the time because of his unique physique [ when in shape] COMBINED with his astounding good looks, excellent command of the English language, graceful manner  in which he carried himself, unparalleled confidence [ like Arnold].
          However:
              Mike was often an abrasive, aloof, and downright rude individual. He felt [ imo] that he was royalty and in a class by himself . At every turn [ seminars, writings etc.] he would criticize the training beliefs of others and basically describe them as " know nothings". He would also tell everyone not to waste their money on supplements, protein powder, etc. which one would imagine did not endear him to the Weiders who made their money from such. He also referred to the IFBB judges in most unfaltering terms.
             Thus it is not so difficult to understand why Mike was denied both the 79-80 Olympia's. Many strongly disliked Mike and some still do. However the topic of a wide pelvis and large glutes was issued which can be answered with antecedal evidence supplied:
                     I recall some one saying [ Ed Corney  I believe]  that Mentzer had more signature poses than any competitor ever; which caused me to review and agree with his assertion.
                    The following: leg extending sartorious
                                       Crucifix [ his and Sergio's]
                                       Open handed back pose
                                       Twisting, kneeling one arm tricep
                                       Two arms overhead forearm - only overhead pose at that time that was ever done was by -Sergio- victory pose.
                                       One arm side [ arm extended] done from rt. or left side and done either with ONE arm or BOTH arms:  As done only by Arnold and Dave Draper but theirs was only the right side with both arms.
                                       Double forearm pose from the back
                                       AND TO ANSWER THE WIDE HIP question the VACUUM pose done only by MIke and Zane in which we felt [ due to the fact that MIke was much thicker] his vacuum was  superior. However only he and Zane could do one. Of course one of the requirements for a successful vacuum is NARROW hips- which Mike had- along with the crucifix pose also demanding the same requirement. Of course Mike had the best crucifix. Ask Robbie Robertson a person who knows a thing or two about wide hips if Mentzer had an issue there.                                       AS far as large glutes I don't see it as an issue.
      Additional comments: I remember Bob Kennedy stating that the two bodybuilders with the best genetics in his opinion was Mentzer and Yates - this was printed in one of his books. No mention of wide hips and large buttocks.
        - In later life Mike apologized to many for his behavior that may have offended others. Mike was the rare individual that had the ability to evolve as a human spirit. He was as honest an individual as I have ever known and passionately dedicated to the truth. Mike believed all he hypothesized.
          Actually just the other day I was sitting outside a car wash and happened to be speaking with one of the top amateur guys today. He brought up Mentzer and how he admired him and asked my opinion. Later as I drove to the gym I realized I have never seen anyone [ dating back to the 60's] that looked as good [ head to toe] as Mike Mentzer.                                  
                                      
                                      
        


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 04:45:48 PM
Old CHP friend said he once arrested Mike for posing in his undies by a freeway onramp. Irvine, I think, yelling at cars all incoherent and such. Mid/late 80s, before any of us knew he was cuckoopants.

Didn't sound too far-fetched years later.

It is well known that Mike went through a very dark period that I don't think he ever fully recovered from.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 03, 2017, 04:50:37 PM
Some informed commentary for those that are interested in Mentzer:

The truth is quite clear to anyone who was present during this period: either as a competitor or an observer.
            Mentzer was the most popular bodybuilder in the world during his prime [ with the fans up until Arnold started making movies] - NO doubt about it. Ask Bob Kennedy or Wayne Gallasch [ sp] who was the main person selling videos at the time. He was the modern day Steve Reeves with a spectacular look [ head to toe when in shape] that no one could match. I remember in London,  Mentzer gracefully walking down the street and everyone [ non bodybuilders and especially women as well] going crazy. This is what happened where ever Mentzer went. He would tell me that he had so many requests from women that it was hard to comprehend. When the Mentzer's trained EVERY eye was on them. Believe it that all would trade their physiques for his in a heart beat.
           At the 79 Olympia Chris Lund stated that Mentzer had the greatest physique that he had ever photographed up to that point. [ I believe this statement was published in the mags also- not sure though]. Serge Nubret stated that Mike was superior but would not be given the title [ to that effect]. Which leads us to the dark side  of Mike and at the time quite an extensive one existed.
           As I previously said Mike was the most admired bodybuilder in the world at the time because of his unique physique [ when in shape] COMBINED with his astounding good looks, excellent command of the English language, graceful manner  in which he carried himself, unparalleled confidence [ like Arnold].
          However:
              Mike was often an abrasive, aloof, and downright rude individual. He felt [ imo] that he was royalty and in a class by himself . At every turn [ seminars, writings etc.] he would criticize the training beliefs of others and basically describe them as " know nothings". He would also tell everyone not to waste their money on supplements, protein powder, etc. which one would imagine did not endear him to the Weiders who made their money from such. He also referred to the IFBB judges in most unfaltering terms.
             Thus it is not so difficult to understand why Mike was denied both the 79-80 Olympia's. Many strongly disliked Mike and some still do. However the topic of a wide pelvis and large glutes was issued which can be answered with antecedal evidence supplied:
                     I recall some one saying [ Ed Corney  I believe]  that Mentzer had more signature poses than any competitor ever; which caused me to review and agree with his assertion.
                    The following: leg extending sartorious
                                       Crucifix [ his and Sergio's]
                                       Open handed back pose
                                       Twisting, kneeling one arm tricep
                                       Two arms overhead forearm - only overhead pose at that time that was ever done was by -Sergio- victory pose.
                                       One arm side [ arm extended] done from rt. or left side and done either with ONE arm or BOTH arms:  As done only by Arnold and Dave Draper but theirs was only the right side with both arms.
                                       Double forearm pose from the back
                                       AND TO ANSWER THE WIDE HIP question the VACUUM pose done only by MIke and Zane in which we felt [ due to the fact that MIke was much thicker] his vacuum was  superior. However only he and Zane could do one. Of course one of the requirements for a successful vacuum is NARROW hips- which Mike had- along with the crucifix pose also demanding the same requirement. Of course Mike had the best crucifix. Ask Robbie Robertson a person who knows a thing or two about wide hips if Mentzer had an issue there.                                       AS far as large glutes I don't see it as an issue.
      Additional comments: I remember Bob Kennedy stating that the two bodybuilders with the best genetics in his opinion was Mentzer and Yates - this was printed in one of his books. No mention of wide hips and large buttocks.
        - In later life Mike apologized to many for his behavior that may have offended others. Mike was the rare individual that had the ability to evolve as a human spirit. He was as honest an individual as I have ever known and passionately dedicated to the truth. Mike believed all he hypothesized.
          Actually just the other day I was sitting outside a car wash and happened to be speaking with one of the top amateur guys today. He brought up Mentzer and how he admired him and asked my opinion. Later as I drove to the gym I realized I have never seen anyone [ dating back to the 60's] that looked as good [ head to toe] as Mike Mentzer.                                  
                                      
                                      
        

great post


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Ugly on April 03, 2017, 04:51:11 PM
It is well known that Mike went through a very dark period that I don't think he ever fully recovered from.

Cop said he was on meth, too. On top of regular crazy.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 05:00:34 PM
It really is a shame his mental health took a turn for the worse then when he got back on track his physical health went down the drain from chain smoking and his overweight pot belly. He was definitely dedicated to training in a precise manner. Any of you guys ever give H.I.T a good go of it?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Ugly on April 03, 2017, 05:18:41 PM
Was Ray goofy, too?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Slik on April 03, 2017, 07:12:23 PM
I stated this before and maybe some other old timers from Venice can chime in. Mike was banned for a short period but still hung out in the parking lot this was hmm...late 80s early 90s. He'd speak jibberish to as u would enter and exit golds.  Later he was allowed back in and was personal training people 


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Scott on April 03, 2017, 07:29:02 PM
Mike Mentzer is one of my all time favorite bodybuilders.  He is up there with Arnold, Reeves, Zane, Paris, etc.  His was a rugged, powerful physique that along with his training methods inspired many people to take up weight training as a healthy hobby.    His way may not be the best way for everyone but within his varying styles there may well be the one that fits you.

I do a couple of variations on his theme and find that both work and when I grow stale, I take a few days extra off from training one way and then switch to the other one.  Mike showed us that there was a life outside the gym and it was worth living. 

Of course  he went total nutso but ultimately  came back, sensible if not roaring back.   ;D  Yeah, I know...crap in one hand and wish in the other and what do you get?  A hand full of Wiggsian theory.  Hey...It's "black" after all.  ;D


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:29:45 PM
(http://images.t-nation.com/forum_images/b/f/bf5da-mike_mentzer.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:32:19 PM
Mike Mentzer is one of my all time favorite bodybuilders.  He is up there with Arnold, Reeves, Zane, Paris, etc.  His was a rugged, powerful physique that along with his training methods inspired many people to take up weight training as a healthy hobby.    His way may not be the best way for everyone but within his varying styles there may well be the one that fits you.

I do a couple of variations on his theme and find that both work and when I grow stale, I take a few days extra off from training one way and then switch to the other one.  Mike showed us that there was a life outside the gym and it was worth living. 

Of course  he went total nutso but ultimately  came back, sensible if not roaring back.   ;D  Yeah, I know...crap in one hand and wish in the other and what do you get?  A hand full of Wiggsian theory.  Hey...It's "black" after all.  ;D

I go back and forth with his training methods to those of volume. I do this because it seems to shake things up and keep the training from becoming stale.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Scott on April 03, 2017, 07:35:01 PM
I go back and forth with his training methods to those of volume. I do this because it seems to shake things up and keep the training from becoming stale.

That is yet another excellent way to train using his methods and others.  I would guess that it helps you to stay mentally and physically  involved in your training.  Well done!


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:38:22 PM
(http://www.x-rep.com/images/IMezine/MentzerSideOutside.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:44:44 PM
That is yet another excellent way to train using his methods and others.  I would guess that it helps you to stay mentally and physically  involved in your training.  Well done!

Yep. I can remember when myself and my training partner decided to buy his H.I.T program back in the early 90s. It was pretty cool the excitement we had for the possibility of a training protocol that could yield gains in less time. We went after it and we blew up pretty good after a month or so. I realize that any change in training can have a positive effect so I took the results with a grain of salt. However I still remember the feeling we had is something new. Almost like a secret from the others that where milling around in the gym doing the same shit day in day out. We went in and where done in literally 25 min and made gains. Some of the no nothings in the gym where confused. After a couple months on it it became stale and that's when I realized a wholistic training g approach was best. To mix things up every couple of months was best.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:49:21 PM
(http://www.hackthegym.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/mike-mentzer.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 03, 2017, 07:51:03 PM
(http://www.mikementzer.com/images/mike_hercules_bob_gardner_big.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 03, 2017, 08:54:27 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=209862.0;attach=245769;image)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 03, 2017, 09:30:36 PM
I always felt Mike Mentzer was overrated.

I know he was pretty popular with the fans and had a catchy training gimmick, but for me he always seemed incomplete. When he is standing alone in a B&W photo, he looks good. Put him in a tough lineup with big guys and he would fade away. Like Danny Padilla to some degree. Alone in a B&W photo Danny looked unbeatable. In a lineup among mass monsters Danny just disappeared. Right or wrong, that was the truth.

Mentzer had below average calves, soft hammies, terrible glutes, weak inner back thickness, subpar traps, thin chest, and a wide blocky waist compared to the best of his peer group. That's not to say Mentzer was terrible, just the opposite, but it gave the Weiders what they needed to make sure Mike would never beat their Golden Boys. When Mike started writing anti-establishment articles (with Arthur Jones from Nautilus fame?) the Weiders phased him out and the downward spiral began.



Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: pellius on April 04, 2017, 12:02:56 AM
I always felt Mike Mentzer was overrated.

I know he was pretty popular with the fans and had a catchy training gimmick, but for me he always seemed incomplete. When he is standing alone in a B&W photo, he looks good. Put him in a tough lineup with big guys and he would fade away. Like Danny Padilla to some degree. Alone in a B&W photo Danny looked unbeatable. In a lineup among mass monsters Danny just disappeared. Right or wrong, that was the truth.

Mentzer had below average calves, soft hammies, terrible flutes, weak inner back thickness, subpar traps, thin chest, and a wide blocky waist compared to the best of his peer group. That's not to say Mentzer was terrible, just the opposite, but it gave the Weiders what they needed to make sure Mike would never beat their Golden Boys. When Mike started writing anti-establishment articles (with Arthur Jones from Nautilus fame?) the Weiders phased him out and the downward spiral began.



You can make a fair argument on all your points but "below average calves"? Those were considered on of his best features. They were described as having a "unique, freaky, knotty appearance" in an article featuring his calves. Other than Dickerson, who had better calves than Mentzer during the time he competed? Not many. Even was better than Boyer Cole who tried to market  some "calf shoe" to capitalize on his amazing calves. The Olympian's at the time (not counting Arnold) like Franco, Zane and Samir couldn't match Mentzer's calves.

Maybe not your preference, but below average?

(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=/ucAwUM1q+zAs85Yt33/+G2/go64CZEq8XKPgvLpiKIK3T0zTm9vewAlcIzvlXcHG8LoNUlLugJHRdcHQnwYVygBzT5g6sMhUs3ZWyqHYQSRaDKCmh9kYpVi0tP4SHyoL4xUSE6tZ9gkF+1xxjut9tDOxT8h/TL7b2HMLrf6ijU=&u=http://www.extrastrong.ru/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Mike-Mentzer-calves-Standing-calf-raises.jpg)
(https://tse4.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.-emxnsyNGF7Pm29wy7Dx5ADFEs&pid=15.1&H=243&W=160)
(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=37r+5H+lrzzb8d9z7/rrUKd/2cRcBJ7gC2wQwNN2gl8By/xBVD+0nHno+6z2zPyx43PvkQuw1CI9DNIE9ubNhmLjwpVNQuHaM9723Z3b73/TFJPqwwGS6P6qJgk/F1f3&u=http://www.drdarden.com/forum_images/916e6-MikeMentzer_calf.jpg)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dseiler on April 04, 2017, 04:44:30 AM
Some informed commentary for those that are interested in Mentzer:

The truth is quite clear to anyone who was present during this period: either as a competitor or an observer.
            Mentzer was the most popular bodybuilder in the world during his prime [ with the fans up until Arnold started making movies] - NO doubt about it. Ask Bob Kennedy or Wayne Gallasch [ sp] who was the main person selling videos at the time. He was the modern day Steve Reeves with a spectacular look [ head to toe when in shape] that no one could match. I remember in London,  Mentzer gracefully walking down the street and everyone [ non bodybuilders and especially women as well] going crazy. This is what happened where ever Mentzer went. He would tell me that he had so many requests from women that it was hard to comprehend. When the Mentzer's trained EVERY eye was on them. Believe it that all would trade their physiques for his in a heart beat.
           At the 79 Olympia Chris Lund stated that Mentzer had the greatest physique that he had ever photographed up to that point. [ I believe this statement was published in the mags also- not sure though]. Serge Nubret stated that Mike was superior but would not be given the title [ to that effect]. Which leads us to the dark side  of Mike and at the time quite an extensive one existed.
           As I previously said Mike was the most admired bodybuilder in the world at the time because of his unique physique [ when in shape] COMBINED with his astounding good looks, excellent command of the English language, graceful manner  in which he carried himself, unparalleled confidence [ like Arnold].
          However:
              Mike was often an abrasive, aloof, and downright rude individual. He felt [ imo] that he was royalty and in a class by himself . At every turn [ seminars, writings etc.] he would criticize the training beliefs of others and basically describe them as " know nothings". He would also tell everyone not to waste their money on supplements, protein powder, etc. which one would imagine did not endear him to the Weiders who made their money from such. He also referred to the IFBB judges in most unfaltering terms.
             Thus it is not so difficult to understand why Mike was denied both the 79-80 Olympia's. Many strongly disliked Mike and some still do. However the topic of a wide pelvis and large glutes was issued which can be answered with antecedal evidence supplied:
                     I recall some one saying [ Ed Corney  I believe]  that Mentzer had more signature poses than any competitor ever; which caused me to review and agree with his assertion.
                    The following: leg extending sartorious
                                       Crucifix [ his and Sergio's]
                                       Open handed back pose
                                       Twisting, kneeling one arm tricep
                                       Two arms overhead forearm - only overhead pose at that time that was ever done was by -Sergio- victory pose.
                                       One arm side [ arm extended] done from rt. or left side and done either with ONE arm or BOTH arms:  As done only by Arnold and Dave Draper but theirs was only the right side with both arms.
                                       Double forearm pose from the back
                                       AND TO ANSWER THE WIDE HIP question the VACUUM pose done only by MIke and Zane in which we felt [ due to the fact that MIke was much thicker] his vacuum was  superior. However only he and Zane could do one. Of course one of the requirements for a successful vacuum is NARROW hips- which Mike had- along with the crucifix pose also demanding the same requirement. Of course Mike had the best crucifix. Ask Robbie Robertson a person who knows a thing or two about wide hips if Mentzer had an issue there.                                       AS far as large glutes I don't see it as an issue.
      Additional comments: I remember Bob Kennedy stating that the two bodybuilders with the best genetics in his opinion was Mentzer and Yates - this was printed in one of his books. No mention of wide hips and large buttocks.
        - In later life Mike apologized to many for his behavior that may have offended others. Mike was the rare individual that had the ability to evolve as a human spirit. He was as honest an individual as I have ever known and passionately dedicated to the truth. Mike believed all he hypothesized.
          Actually just the other day I was sitting outside a car wash and happened to be speaking with one of the top amateur guys today. He brought up Mentzer and how he admired him and asked my opinion. Later as I drove to the gym I realized I have never seen anyone [ dating back to the 60's] that looked as good [ head to toe] as Mike Mentzer.                                  
                                      
                                      
        

Awesome stuff. Thank you.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 04, 2017, 06:55:32 AM
You can make a fair argument on all your points but "below average calves"? Those were considered on of his best features. They were described as having a "unique, freaky, knotty appearance" in an article featuring his calves. Other than Dickerson, who had better calves than Mentzer during the time he competed? Not many. Even was better than Boyer Cole who tried to market  some "calf shoe" to capitalize on his amazing calves. The Olympian's at the time (not counting Arnold) like Franco, Zane and Samir couldn't match Mentzer's calves.

Maybe not your preference, but below average?

(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=/ucAwUM1q+zAs85Yt33/+G2/go64CZEq8XKPgvLpiKIK3T0zTm9vewAlcIzvlXcHG8LoNUlLugJHRdcHQnwYVygBzT5g6sMhUs3ZWyqHYQSRaDKCmh9kYpVi0tP4SHyoL4xUSE6tZ9gkF+1xxjut9tDOxT8h/TL7b2HMLrf6ijU=&u=http://www.extrastrong.ru/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Mike-Mentzer-calves-Standing-calf-raises.jpg)
(https://tse4.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.-emxnsyNGF7Pm29wy7Dx5ADFEs&pid=15.1&H=243&W=160)
(https://www.searchlock.com/mirror/p?e=1&h=37r+5H+lrzzb8d9z7/rrUKd/2cRcBJ7gC2wQwNN2gl8By/xBVD+0nHno+6z2zPyx43PvkQuw1CI9DNIE9ubNhmLjwpVNQuHaM9723Z3b73/TFJPqwwGS6P6qJgk/F1f3&u=http://www.drdarden.com/forum_images/916e6-MikeMentzer_calf.jpg)

Pellius....B&W photos and all by himself. Like I said.

And I'm pretty sure the middle photo is not Mentzer, it's Platz isn't it?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldtimer1 on April 04, 2017, 12:12:54 PM
I remember when he lost the Mr. Universe twice. They might have changed the name of it by then. He lost to Kalman who beat him both on conditioning, size and every body part except calves. He also lost to Robby who clearly beat him too.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 04, 2017, 12:14:47 PM
Pellius....B&W photos and all by himself. Like I said.

And I'm pretty sure the middle photo is not Mentzer, it's Platz isn't it?

I agree with you ( except the calves ) overrated , people act like he's the second coming of Christ , awesome physique but lets get serious 


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 04, 2017, 12:29:57 PM
well he aint no branch warren

thats for sure!


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Fortress on April 04, 2017, 12:56:07 PM
When I met him in the mid-'90s he was a chain-smoking lunatic. Just hanging around the front of Gold's mumbling nonsense.

In and out of reality.

He lived for a time on the beach, sleeping under the piers.

Great build during his prime and a very intelligent fella, but unfortunately prone to mental illness. Rec drugs, as mentioned, didn't help.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Kwon on April 04, 2017, 12:57:29 PM
Looked like the second coming of Christ here.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=719556;image)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: ratherbebig on April 04, 2017, 01:48:23 PM
yeah he shouldve spent all his day in his basement logged on to getbig instead


 ::)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Ugly on April 04, 2017, 01:56:27 PM
yeah he shouldve spent all his day in his basement logged on to getbig instead


 ::)

If only, in that vast in-between, there were another option.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 04, 2017, 03:32:19 PM
looked good here to


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 04, 2017, 03:34:26 PM
looked good here to

Thigh looks shopped.

B&W photo and standing alone, he always looked ok in those photos.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 04, 2017, 03:44:24 PM
Narrower than Heath


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldtimer1 on April 04, 2017, 04:02:37 PM
Amphetamines will make anyone insane. Just give it time. So addictive and makes you feel so alive. Mentzer wrote a lot about his positive experiences with speed but in the end it destroyed him.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 04, 2017, 06:10:38 PM
Thigh looks shopped.

B&W photo and standing alone, he always looked ok in those photos.

You keep repeating the same thing. I don't think anyone is making the case that he was the best bodybuilder. The fact is he was a very good bodybuilder that inspired many to look beyond the usual methods. Let's not forget he won the 1978 Mr Universe with the only perfect score ever of 300, doing the same thing at the 1979 Mr. Olympia winning the heavyweight class (lost overall to Frank Zane)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 04, 2017, 09:01:29 PM
You keep repeating the same thing. I don't think anyone is making the case that he was the best bodybuilder. The fact is he was a very good bodybuilder that inspired many to look beyond the usual methods. Let's not forget he won the 1978 Mr Universe with the only perfect score ever of 300, doing the same thing at the 1979 Mr. Olympia winning the heavyweight class (lost overall to Frank Zane)

Well, that's because people are making my point with the continued posting of B&W photos.

Mentzer was an aloof know-it-all who pushed his Heavy Duty methods to make money off gullible kids.

Of course he never mentioned that HD only worked when you were juiced to the eyeballs.

The guy had the most fragile psyche of all time. He lost one show and it drove him to insanity and then the grave because he couldn't accept someone else was superior to him.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 04, 2017, 09:10:32 PM
He convinced me to read the fountainhead, and power factor training, hours of my life I can't get back.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: heenok on April 05, 2017, 12:30:12 AM
I think hes a bullshiter. He just understood that its a lot easier to sell people that they will get more working less hard than the other way round.
He never trained low volume at all, was a drug addict and ended up a crazy hobo.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Nether Animal on April 05, 2017, 12:51:01 AM
I think hes a bullshiter. He just understood that its a lot easier to sell people that they will get more working less hard than the other way round.
He never trained low volume at all, was a drug addict and ended up a crazy hobo.

True, and quite plausible. He never even trained that way coming up, and by the '80s he was done competing anyway. Many proponents of the training style end up getting injured as well.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: BBSSchlemiel on April 05, 2017, 02:33:53 AM
Mentzer was a daredevil.  He didn't mind trying new drugs and pushing the limits on gear. 3 grams a week of deca alone.

Source?


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Tha Grim Lifter on April 05, 2017, 02:58:57 AM
Saying he was robbed in 1979.....it was the flip of a coin in 1980 if he was better than a way below top form Frank Zane as Zane's structure was easily better. Cannot see how he could beat Zane at his best in 1979. Pictures are one thing the video's tell the whole story.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: _bruce_ on April 05, 2017, 04:27:28 AM
yeah he shouldve spent all his day in his basement logged on to getbig instead


 ::)

 ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dj181 on April 05, 2017, 05:24:20 AM
yeah he shouldve spent all his day in his basement logged on to getbig instead


 ::)

 ;D


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Rambone on April 05, 2017, 05:26:19 AM
Source?

Ray Mentzer via Ouija board


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Kwon on April 05, 2017, 06:17:54 AM
I always felt Mike Mentzer was overrated.

I know he was pretty popular with the fans and had a catchy training gimmick, but for me he always seemed incomplete. When he is standing alone in a B&W photo, he looks good. Put him in a tough lineup with big guys and he would fade away. Like Danny Padilla to some degree. Alone in a B&W photo Danny looked unbeatable. In a lineup among mass monsters Danny just disappeared. Right or wrong, that was the truth.

Mentzer had below average calves, soft hammies, terrible flutes, weak inner back thickness, subpar traps, thin chest, and a wide blocky waist compared to the best of his peer group. That's not to say Mentzer was terrible, just the opposite, but it gave the Weiders what they needed to make sure Mike would never beat their Golden Boys.

Since when did you need to musically perform on the bodybuildingstage?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCPj4JPbKtA


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 05, 2017, 06:18:46 AM
here is my experience training h.i.t now remember its been quite a few years.

my strength shot up quite a bit, but i followed it to a t, no cardio nothing,  so i had zero cuts.  i do think h.i.t works for limited periods of time.plus trying to go up in weight

and reps ever single week becomes quite taxing. i think h.i.t  works best for those who are naturally lean.  i will say this though the slow full motion of reps he prescribed

work great.     plus what mike prescribed later on isnt what he prescribed when he was at his peak. i have his heavy duty journal  he did alot of cardio when getting ready

for a show.  


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: dj181 on April 05, 2017, 09:54:58 AM
he trained everything 3 days a week on a full body workout up until bout 78 or so  :o :-X



Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: MAXX on April 05, 2017, 11:50:12 AM
When I met him in the mid-'90s he was a chain-smoking lunatic. Just hanging around the front of Gold's mumbling nonsense.

In and out of reality.

He lived for a time on the beach, sleeping under the piers.

Great build during his prime and a very intelligent fella, but unfortunately prone to mental illness. Rec drugs, as mentioned, didn't help.
so sad  :(

I think people should have helped Mentzer more during his drugged years. You know like bodybuilding brothers.. Oh well..


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Rambone on April 05, 2017, 05:01:01 PM
When I met him in the mid-'90s he was a chain-smoking lunatic. Just hanging around the front of Gold's mumbling nonsense.

In and out of reality.

He lived for a time on the beach, sleeping under the piers.

Great build during his prime and a very intelligent fella, but unfortunately prone to mental illness. Rec drugs, as mentioned, didn't help.

Living the dream!


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: The Scott on April 05, 2017, 06:29:22 PM

Since when did you need to musically perform on the bodybuildingstage?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCPj4JPbKtA

Perhaps he was thinking of the backstage playing of the skin flute prior to posing?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pkaz on April 05, 2017, 09:13:31 PM
I would frequently meet Ray Mentzer for breakfast in Rocky Cola Cafe in Redondo Beach. His food intake was incredible and our discussion clearly pointed out that HIT was BS.. HIT included sets of increasing weight until max rep set was final. Meaning, slowly work up in weight and the hit maximum rep at last set. Ray was a very interesting person to know and speak with. At the time he was starting a rehabilitation center in Redondo Beach. A shame his mind and eventually his body rebelled.




Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on April 05, 2017, 11:29:26 PM
people dont talk enough about RAY



Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Simple Simon on April 05, 2017, 11:48:09 PM
here is my experience training h.i.t now remember its been quite a few years.

my strength shot up quite a bit, but i followed it to a t, no cardio nothing,  so i had zero cuts.  i do think h.i.t works for limited periods of time.plus trying to go up in weight

and reps ever single week becomes quite taxing. i think h.i.t  works best for those who are naturally lean.  i will say this though the slow full motion of reps he prescribed

work great.     plus what mike prescribed later on isnt what he prescribed when he was at his peak. i have his heavy duty journal  he did alot of cardio when getting ready

for a show.  
your lack of cuts was down to eating too much, not lack of cardio.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 06, 2017, 08:25:25 AM
here is my experience training h.i.t now remember its been quite a few years.

my strength shot up quite a bit, but i followed it to a t, no cardio nothing,  so i had zero cuts.  i do think h.i.t works for limited periods of time.plus trying to go up in weight

and reps ever single week becomes quite taxing. i think h.i.t  works best for those who are naturally lean.  i will say this though the slow full motion of reps he prescribed

work great.     plus what mike prescribed later on isnt what he prescribed when he was at his peak. i have his heavy duty journal  he did alot of cardio when getting ready

for a show.  

what Be There said.

HIT pairs well with compound exercise, and like you said, in cycles where you haven't done high intensity in a while. The 1 set of 20 reps squat is good too, but you'll find after a while with HIT your work capacity, endurance starts to suffer. You can do great first and second sets, but then you feel too obliterated. The endurance guy, while it was hard, can go back later and do more lighter work for the slow twitch fibers., cause he hasn't felt like he worked enough.



Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Eric2 on April 06, 2017, 09:01:45 AM
what Be There said.

HIT pairs well with compound exercise, and like you said, in cycles where you haven't done high intensity in a while. The 1 set of 20 reps squat is good too, but you'll find after a while with HIT your work capacity, endurance starts to suffer. You can do great first and second sets, but then you feel too obliterated. The endurance guy, while it was hard, can go back later and do more lighter work for the slow twitch fibers., cause he hasn't felt like he worked enough.



Yes. When I gave it a go for a month or so I made gains then hit a wall. I went back to a higher volume program and the muscle began to respond again. Like mentioned earlier going back and forth between methods is a good idea. Keeps things from going stale. Sometimes mixing a pwerlifting program for a month is great too.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 06, 2017, 10:59:58 AM
people dont talk enough about RAY



Ray had a great build, more classic looking than Mike but lacking that trademark thickness in spots. Given that the coroner's report found potentially lethal levels of opiates in both brothers blood after their deaths, I believe Ray to have suicided after finding Mike dead.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 06, 2017, 11:25:16 AM
Ray had a great build, more classic looking than Mike but lacking that trademark thickness in spots. Given that the coroner's report found potentially lethal levels of opiates in both brothers blood after their deaths, I believe Ray to have suicided after finding Mike dead.

I thought about that with Ray as well. Even though his health was really bad the timing seemed suspect.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 06, 2017, 11:31:35 AM
i read, ray was one of the strongest pros out there in the 80's as well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on April 06, 2017, 11:31:54 AM
Ray had a great build, more classic looking than Mike but lacking that trademark thickness in spots. Given that the coroner's report found potentially lethal levels of opiates in both brothers blood after their deaths, I believe Ray to have suicided after finding Mike dead.

I think Jerry Brainum wrote that he thought they both OD'd


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 06, 2017, 11:35:49 AM
I think Jerry Brainum wrote that he thought they both OD'd

Wonder if they both opted out then. Mike with his mental health issue and Ray was near deaths door anyway according to Mike. Ray was getting dialisis done every week and not doing well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 06, 2017, 12:04:38 PM
the thing is mike didnt seem suicidal he just wrapped up making his training video that day .   and by all account he was still making good money off his books, and articles he wrote.   mike was one of those pros i was hoping to see, get it all back together, i always enjoyed his writings and he was the best bb writer out there.

the guy could get you to think and was smart.   joe weider did like mike quite a bit contrary to popular believe, he was paying mike more than any one in the early 80's.

and when mike got out of the hospital joe did let him advertise his heavy duty  books for free in his magazines until mike got on his feet again .


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on April 06, 2017, 02:30:03 PM
Mike's death could have been accidental OD or drug induced heart attack
Rays death seems more suspect

This is what Jerry Brainum wrote about it (found it on Dave Draper board and had posted it on a similar thread here a few years ago)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Zillotch on April 06, 2017, 02:35:40 PM
the guy could get you to think and was smart

lol


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on April 06, 2017, 04:08:56 PM
the thing is mike didnt seem suicidal he just wrapped up making his training video that day .   and by all account he was still making good money off his books, and articles he wrote.   mike was one of those pros i was hoping to see, get it all back together, i always enjoyed his writings and he was the best bb writer out there.

the guy could get you to think and was smart.   joe weider did like mike quite a bit contrary to popular believe, he was paying mike more than any one in the early 80's.

and when mike got out of the hospital joe did let him advertise his heavy duty  books for free in his magazines until mike got on his feet again .

Wonder what he would have said about all the pregnant bellies in bodybuilding nowadays..


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 06, 2017, 04:25:06 PM
Wonder what he would have said about all the pregnant bellies in bodybuilding nowadays..

knowing mike he would have said they are eating and dosing to much


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Danimal77 on April 06, 2017, 10:01:32 PM
looks short. like an action figure


5'8", 225 pounds and legit 18 5/8" bicep.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 06, 2017, 10:53:16 PM
the thing is mike didnt seem suicidal he just wrapped up making his training video that day . 

I know that. I think Mike was a legit heart attack. He was probably used to the daily pain med use, you can tell he was in pain just walking around when they were shooting that training video. He was also in a better mood than Ray during that day.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 08, 2017, 02:47:01 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 08, 2017, 02:47:59 AM
 ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dieter on April 08, 2017, 06:38:01 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 08, 2017, 07:13:31 AM
always had Mentzer pegged as a jooooo

big nose and glasses with eyes too close together ie typical joo


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on April 08, 2017, 07:54:45 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.

LOL he looks so short there. Looks like Freddie Mecury on the gas and then transitioned effortlessly to the leather guy from the Village People when he put the hat on.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 08, 2017, 08:08:40 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.

Jeez, just goes to show how bodybuilding has never been presented in a good light. Wtf did I just watch? A shitty band from the 70s and Mike posing in front of the band. So bad I could not watch it all. Lol fuck


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on April 08, 2017, 08:20:56 AM
i think they were onto something there!

we need to bring todays bodybuilders together with todays bands!!

phil heath and guns n roses tour 2017!!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 08, 2017, 08:24:20 AM
mike was a huge  fan of led zeppelin, his training partners said he would blast them in his car on the way to the gym before his workouts,  so that makes him pretty fucking cool in my book


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 08, 2017, 08:29:55 AM
mike was a huge  fan of led zeppelin, his training partners said he would blast them in his car on the way to the gym before his workouts,  so that makes him pretty fucking cool in my book

he also liked Wagner

typical tough and macho GERMAN 8) 8) 8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRU1AJsXN1g


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 08, 2017, 08:37:35 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.

It looks like a drunkard who wakes up without clothes to a rock concert. Agree not a great image for bodybuilding/bodybuilders  :o


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 08, 2017, 09:04:18 AM
always had Mentzer pegged as a jooooo

big nose and glasses with eyes too close together ie typical joo

Nose doesn't look big.... I thought he was German or something.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 08, 2017, 09:12:28 AM
Nose doesn't look big.... I thought he was German or something.


he is German, but kinda looks like a roided out version of this jooooo

(https://media.giphy.com/media/JTqMC28B4KoyQ/giphy.gif)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Ugly on April 08, 2017, 10:42:53 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.

Good Lord.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on April 08, 2017, 11:31:05 AM
Interesting discussion.  Some really good points, especially about his back, which hd recognized  in the late 70s and started doing power cleans and deadlifts, along with heavy machine shrugs. Like in his pecs, he just didn't have the fiber density, that he had in his delts, arms, and legs. He had good traps from the front, his MM pose was freaky. He was more gifted in the limbs than in the torso, by his own admission, though he gained evenly when I asked him. The drug thing is right and wrong. He started using at 19 when he first competed in the Mr. America contest. He used Deca, though not in those doses, that figure came from Viator when he was high. Mike used d Decadurabolin, Durabolin and Dianabol. He found with more modest doses, he had less water retention issues.  Was big on going up on his roof, and sweating out the water. Interesting story about Casey when he trained with Mike, Mike told me that Casey was so 'luded out which spotting Mike doing Universal Incline presses with the stack plus a 45 lb plate, that Mike told him, if you're not into this, then we shouldn't train together, this is important to me. He would say the same thing when training clients, including me. Made a study of motivation, used to attend classes given by Rex Dante, Mike said he'd get so excited going, he'd almost pee his  pants lol. The amphetamines were pretty much his downfall, along with unresolved psychological issues, which he admitted fed of each other. In the 90s, he was doing well financially, had a great place in Marina Del Rey, and later in Playa which was even cooler, split 3 level condo, guy had good taste. Bought a Jag around that time, but drove a crappy black station wagon before that. He was only psychotic sounding one time when I talked to him, we used to have 3 hour phone convos the night of the 94 O, he was Dorian was going to win, but that the biceps tear wouldn't hurt him, probably add more peak if anything, well he was partly right. Now he was seeing dead people, that night, I escaped that call when I could lol. I do miss the guy, he was always a good friend.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on April 08, 2017, 01:22:57 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-w9J6KZo-c

Mike looks like an angry insecure gay midget here trying to intimidate the band.
looks damn cool there to me

 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on April 08, 2017, 01:28:16 PM
thanks for the story viking11  :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 08, 2017, 01:46:04 PM
Interesting discussion.  Some really good points, especially about his back, which hd recognized  in the late 70s and started doing power cleans and deadlifts, along with heavy machine shrugs. Like in his pecs, he just didn't have the fiber density, that he had in his delts, arms, and legs. He had good traps from the front, his MM pose was freaky. He was more gifted in the limbs than in the torso, by his own admission, though he gained evenly when I asked him. The drug thing is right and wrong. He started using at 19 when he first competed in the Mr. America contest. He used Deca, though not in those doses, that figure came from Viator when he was high. Mike used d Decadurabolin, Durabolin and Dianabol. He found with more modest doses, he had less water retention issues.  Was big on going up on his roof, and sweating out the water. Interesting story about Casey when he trained with Mike, Mike told me that Casey was so 'luded out which spotting Mike doing Universal Incline presses with the stack plus a 45 lb plate, that Mike told him, if you're not into this, then we shouldn't train together, this is important to me. He would say the same thing when training clients, including me. Made a study of motivation, used to attend classes given by Rex Dante, Mike said he'd get so excited going, he'd almost pee his  pants lol. The amphetamines were pretty much his downfall, along with unresolved psychological issues, which he admitted fed of each other. In the 90s, he was doing well financially, had a great place in Marina Del Rey, and later in Playa which was even cooler, split 3 level condo, guy had good taste. Bought a Jag around that time, but drove a crappy black station wagon before that. He was only psychotic sounding one time when I talked to him, we used to have 3 hour phone convos the night of the 94 O, he was Dorian was going to win, but that the biceps tear wouldn't hurt him, probably add more peak if anything, well he was partly right. Now he was seeing dead people, that night, I escaped that call when I could lol. I do miss the guy, he was always a good friend.

Cool story thanx for sharing. Had I lived in the area in the 90s I would have sought him out for training.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on April 08, 2017, 02:00:45 PM
Interesting discussion.  Some really good points, especially about his back, which hd recognized  in the late 70s and started doing power cleans and deadlifts, along with heavy machine shrugs. Like in his pecs, he just didn't have the fiber density, that he had in his delts, arms, and legs. He had good traps from the front, his MM pose was freaky. He was more gifted in the limbs than in the torso, by his own admission, though he gained evenly when I asked him. The drug thing is right and wrong. He started using at 19 when he first competed in the Mr. America contest. He used Deca, though not in those doses, that figure came from Viator when he was high. Mike used d Decadurabolin, Durabolin and Dianabol. He found with more modest doses, he had less water retention issues.  Was big on going up on his roof, and sweating out the water. Interesting story about Casey when he trained with Mike, Mike told me that Casey was so 'luded out which spotting Mike doing Universal Incline presses with the stack plus a 45 lb plate, that Mike told him, if you're not into this, then we shouldn't train together, this is important to me. He would say the same thing when training clients, including me. Made a study of motivation, used to attend classes given by Rex Dante, Mike said he'd get so excited going, he'd almost pee his  pants lol. The amphetamines were pretty much his downfall, along with unresolved psychological issues, which he admitted fed of each other. In the 90s, he was doing well financially, had a great place in Marina Del Rey, and later in Playa which was even cooler, split 3 level condo, guy had good taste. Bought a Jag around that time, but drove a crappy black station wagon before that. He was only psychotic sounding one time when I talked to him, we used to have 3 hour phone convos the night of the 94 O, he was Dorian was going to win, but that the biceps tear wouldn't hurt him, probably add more peak if anything, well he was partly right. Now he was seeing dead people, that night, I escaped that call when I could lol. I do miss the guy, he was always a good friend.

Primary reason I came here, and also the reason I stay. Great insight.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on April 08, 2017, 02:02:54 PM
Interesting discussion.  Some really good points, especially about his back, which hd recognized  in the late 70s and started doing power cleans and deadlifts, along with heavy machine shrugs. Like in his pecs, he just didn't have the fiber density, that he had in his delts, arms, and legs. He had good traps from the front, his MM pose was freaky. He was more gifted in the limbs than in the torso, by his own admission, though he gained evenly when I asked him. The drug thing is right and wrong. He started using at 19 when he first competed in the Mr. America contest. He used Deca, though not in those doses, that figure came from Viator when he was high. Mike used d Decadurabolin, Durabolin and Dianabol. He found with more modest doses, he had less water retention issues.  Was big on going up on his roof, and sweating out the water. Interesting story about Casey when he trained with Mike, Mike told me that Casey was so 'luded out which spotting Mike doing Universal Incline presses with the stack plus a 45 lb plate, that Mike told him, if you're not into this, then we shouldn't train together, this is important to me. He would say the same thing when training clients, including me. Made a study of motivation, used to attend classes given by Rex Dante, Mike said he'd get so excited going, he'd almost pee his  pants lol. The amphetamines were pretty much his downfall, along with unresolved psychological issues, which he admitted fed of each other. In the 90s, he was doing well financially, had a great place in Marina Del Rey, and later in Playa which was even cooler, split 3 level condo, guy had good taste. Bought a Jag around that time, but drove a crappy black station wagon before that. He was only psychotic sounding one time when I talked to him, we used to have 3 hour phone convos the night of the 94 O, he was Dorian was going to win, but that the biceps tear wouldn't hurt him, probably add more peak if anything, well he was partly right. Now he was seeing dead people, that night, I escaped that call when I could lol. I do miss the guy, he was always a good friend.

Any more on this one? Studying motivation?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 08, 2017, 02:03:44 PM
Interesting discussion.  Some really good points, especially about his back, which hd recognized  in the late 70s and started doing power cleans and deadlifts, along with heavy machine shrugs. Like in his pecs, he just didn't have the fiber density, that he had in his delts, arms, and legs. He had good traps from the front, his MM pose was freaky. He was more gifted in the limbs than in the torso, by his own admission, though he gained evenly when I asked him. The drug thing is right and wrong. He started using at 19 when he first competed in the Mr. America contest. He used Deca, though not in those doses, that figure came from Viator when he was high. Mike used d Decadurabolin, Durabolin and Dianabol. He found with more modest doses, he had less water retention issues.  Was big on going up on his roof, and sweating out the water. Interesting story about Casey when he trained with Mike, Mike told me that Casey was so 'luded out which spotting Mike doing Universal Incline presses with the stack plus a 45 lb plate, that Mike told him, if you're not into this, then we shouldn't train together, this is important to me. He would say the same thing when training clients, including me. Made a study of motivation, used to attend classes given by Rex Dante, Mike said he'd get so excited going, he'd almost pee his  pants lol. The amphetamines were pretty much his downfall, along with unresolved psychological issues, which he admitted fed of each other. In the 90s, he was doing well financially, had a great place in Marina Del Rey, and later in Playa which was even cooler, split 3 level condo, guy had good taste. Bought a Jag around that time, but drove a crappy black station wagon before that. He was only psychotic sounding one time when I talked to him, we used to have 3 hour phone convos the night of the 94 O, he was Dorian was going to win, but that the biceps tear wouldn't hurt him, probably add more peak if anything, well he was partly right. Now he was seeing dead people, that night, I escaped that call when I could lol. I do miss the guy, he was always a good friend.

wow viking great post , did he ever tell you how much cardio he did for a show?  i have his heavy duty journal for the 79 olympia prep, looked like he was doing one to two sessions per day


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on April 08, 2017, 05:14:31 PM
Thanks for the comments, glad people enjoyed the post! Rex Dante was sort of a motivational speaker and life coach incorporating the ideas of Ayn Rand. He was pretty down to earth, I did some phone consults with him on Mike's referral, after my ex and I split and I was going through a down period. He helped me with some insights and ideas.
As to cardio, Mike kinda became a cardio fiend in 79 when he had let his mother's death and other things affect him to the point of getting really depressed and staying in bed until noon. He lost his motivation for a while, and finally saw Ray looking freaky prior to his America win, which lit a  fire under his ass. He was too far from contest condition, so he added in cardio to accelerate the process, and ate less fat and protein and carbs to fuel his weight workouts. He wasn't afraid to challenge the prevailing conventional wisdom of the time, which may have been ultimately his best contribution to the sport.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on April 08, 2017, 05:50:22 PM
how did he offically die?

he brother died like right afterwards?

did he brother do the exact same shit?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 08, 2017, 06:55:54 PM
https://youtu.be/aBcS0C_mlxs


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 08, 2017, 07:20:11 PM
Thanks for the comments, glad people enjoyed the post! Rex Dante was sort of a motivational speaker and life coach incorporating the ideas of Ayn Rand. He was pretty down to earth, I did some phone consults with him on Mike's referral, after my ex and I split and I was going through a down period. He helped me with some insights and ideas.
As to cardio, Mike kinda became a cardio fiend in 79 when he had let his mother's death and other things affect him to the point of getting really depressed and staying in bed until noon. He lost his motivation for a while, and finally saw Ray looking freaky prior to his America win, which lit a  fire under his ass. He was too far from contest condition, so he added in cardio to accelerate the process, and ate less fat and protein and carbs to fuel his weight workouts. He wasn't afraid to challenge the prevailing conventional wisdom of the time, which may have been ultimately his best contribution to the sport.

i totally agree, i really liked how he said eating to much protein was bullshit as well, and said bulking up was stupid cause he had done it as well.   guy was way ahead of his time in thinking was always my favorite bb.  still is for that matter.


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: Taffin on April 09, 2017, 01:49:12 AM

At the risk of outing myself - what a handsome b@stard in this shot - look at them cheekbones! (nh)

(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/sh0.08/e35/p640x640/15875704_1137352553029219_1108003284926332928_n.jpg?ig_cache_key=MTQyNzIxODM3MjM3MTAxNzM5Mw%3D%3D.2)

Unlike bbers today, Mentzer had a unique look. And it's nice to see real delts without it being pumped up from site injects and synthol.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on April 09, 2017, 01:55:39 AM
i think they were onto something there!

we need to bring todays bodybuilders together with todays bands!!

phil heath and guns n roses tour 2017!!

It appears Axl is already in the bulking stage  :o

(I realise I'm probably the last person in the world to find this out - especially as I never watch entertainment channel sh1t - so this probably merits a Lincoln poster, but I just Googled and noticed this pic.....FFS!)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 09, 2017, 03:12:19 AM
his last training ideas were rather nuts

ie training just once a week or less

wonder if anyone ever made true progress on that  ???

He basically preached training 3-4 times per week from the mid 70s til the mid 90s then all the sudden he "discovered" that training once a week or even less was best


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 09, 2017, 06:30:44 AM
his last training ideas were rather nuts

ie training just once a week or less

wonder if anyone ever made true progress on that  ??
He basically preached training 3-4 times per week from the mid 70s til the mid 90s then all the sudden he "discovered" that training once a week or even less was best

I tried the once every 7 to 10 days routine outlined in his book, "High-Intensity Training the Mike Mentzer Way".  I trained so hard that I was too sore to train the next day. Or the next.  Or the next...  I was sore for well over a week. 

To be honest, I did not experience any real benefit from that routine that I or anyone else noticed. I even tried resting a couple of weeks before hitting it again.  Now I use a variation of his original methods and train between 2 and 4 times a week and with warmup sets, I usually do no more than 6 to 9 sets per body part and am finished within 30 minutes. 

If I miss a week for whatever reason, not a problem.  I think Mentzer was above average smarts-wise but his anger (read: ego)  kept him from being Mr. Olympia after 1980. His physique was superb and I would rather bodybuilding returned to that era.

Of course drugs played a huge part in his training but that's true of all "modern" bodybuilders.  His downfall was his ego. The amphetamines worked to destroy him.  Jack LaLanne was once quoted as saying he asked a modern day bodybuilder "why the drugs?" and the man said it was because they worked and they wanted to build more muscle.  LaLanne stated rather openly that he could see why that sufficed as if you had told him in his youth that drinking beef blood would put more muscle on him, he would've been down at the slaughter house with a gallon container.

It's not true of everything but moderation in many things is the key to not only longevity but perhaps happiness.  Mentzer will be remembered longer than Coleman or Haney but not Oliva or Arnold and I think it's entirely due to his showing people that training less can give you more and not just in the gym but also in your actually have a life outside of the gym.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 09, 2017, 06:44:08 AM
^^^ thanks for the feedback

it seems that training 3-4 days per week is ideal

i think that 7 days is too long btw bodyparts


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on April 09, 2017, 06:44:56 AM
^^^ thanks for the feedback

it seems that training 3-4 days per week is ideal

i think that 7 days is too long btw bodyparts
said the 132lb man


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 09, 2017, 06:47:51 AM
I tried the once every 7 to 10 days routine outlined in his book, "High-Intensity Training the Mike Mentzer Way".  I trained so hard that I was too sore to train the next day. Or the next.  Or the next...  I was sore for well over a week. 

To be honest, I did not experience any real benefit from that routine that I or anyone else noticed. I even tried resting a couple of weeks before hitting it again.  Now I use a variation of his original methods and train between 2 and 4 times a week and with warmup sets, I usually do no more than 6 to 9 sets per body part and am finished within 30 minutes. 

If I miss a week for whatever reason, not a problem.  I think Mentzer was above average smarts-wise but his anger (read: ego)  kept him from being Mr. Olympia after 1980. His physique was superb and I would rather bodybuilding returned to that era.

Of course drugs played a huge part in his training but that's true of all "modern" bodybuilders.  His downfall was his ego. The amphetamines worked to destroy him.  Jack LaLanne was once quoted as saying he asked a modern day bodybuilder "why the drugs?" and the man said it was because they worked and they wanted to build more muscle.  LaLanne stated rather openly that he could see why that sufficed as if you had told him in his youth that drinking beef blood would put more muscle on him, he would've been down at the slaughter house with a gallon container.

It's not true of everything but moderation in many things is the key to not only longevity but perhaps happiness.  Mentzer will be remembered longer than Coleman or Haney but not Oliva or Arnold and I think it's entirely due to his showing people that training less can give you more and not just in the gym but also in your actually have a life outside of the gym.

Well put. I had the same response in training once per week as you did. Mike's training ideas is where his legacy lies. More so than his competition days. I do not know where the line is drawn exactly as to when too much training has occurred or not enough. When it comes down to it if I am motivated to work out for over an hour then that's what I do. If I hit it hard and gas out in a half an hour then that is what I do. If the muscle I want to train are still tight from before then I give it another day. Mike opened the door for me to listen more to my body, not just a workout routine written by some so called expert I never trained with. It really boils down (for me) to being in tune with my body.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 09, 2017, 06:48:56 AM
said the 132lb man

 ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Mr Anabolic on April 09, 2017, 07:10:44 AM
^^^ thanks for the feedback

it seems that training 3-4 days per week is ideal

i think that 7 days is too long btw bodyparts

In my experience, 4 day/week between body parts is the best for size, but you need to back off once in a while and take off.  I always grew when I did this. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 09, 2017, 07:17:32 AM
speaking of the Mentzer diet get a load of this....

    

In his Heavy Duty Journal he gives a few examples of what he ate during his contest preparation before the 1979 Mr. Olympia (they′re samples from his training log). For example:

1. On June 27th, he ate nothing(!) for breakfast. He first meal at four o′ clock in the afternoon (is that PM?) he consumed only one peach and a protein drink (200 calories). At nine in the evening he ate 60 grams of nuts and raisins (200 calories) and one salad (150 calories). So he ate only 550 calories total that day... (He weighed 102 kg before his workout).

2. Juli 16th

Breakfast: 1/2 honey melon (50) and 1 nectarine (75);

Post-workout meal: same as above;

Lunch (12:00): Turkey (150) and baked potato (125);

Diner (16:00): Turkey (350), water melon, yoghurt and some sweets (450);

Snack: Plums (70) and some bread (150).

Total: 1545 calories.


I′ve noticed he liked to eat fruit, cake(!), pancakes and, his favorite... ice cream! The evening before the contest he also drank some coffee, 1 glas of wine and 1 wodkacocktail as ′diuretics′.

Hope this will give you some insight into his eating habits!

Oh, I almost forgot: yes, in his The Mentzer Method to Fitness (with Ardy Friedberg, 1980) he claims that he ate only 60 grams of protein a day to maintain his bodyweight of 220 pounds (and still growing muscle)!


   
B-WINE (Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands) on 8/26/2004 5:35:35 AM    
   

Here are three more examples of the HD Journal:

1. August 21th, 1979

Breakfast: Pancakes (?) (400 calories) and protein (drink?) (...)

Post-workout snack: cake (250) and melon (...)

15:30: Chicken (250), Fruit (100) and baked potato (150)


2. September 3rd, 1979

Breakfast: 2 brancakes (?), margarine (350), pineapple (100) and protein (drink?) (150)

15:30: 1 piece of chicken (150), half potato with butter (100)

Snack: a couple of strawberries (50)


3. September 29th, 1979

Breakfast (at 10:00): Apple pie (300), pineapple and fig(pear?)s (350)

15:00: Turkey (200) and fruitcake (500)

Note: He had diner at a restaurant with his brother Ray, Pam (Ray′s girlfriend?), Jusup Wilkosz and his wife, and Axel Gottlob. He says he ate more calories then he could count!


P.S. I′m sorry if it′s sometimes a bit vague here and there, but I had to translate it from German (I own a German copy of the book; I also have HD I in German) to English and I′m Dutch myself...

http://www.highintensity.net/Forums/ViewTopic.asp?topic_id=649

AND AGAIN.... he claims that he ate only 60 grams of protein a day to maintain his bodyweight of 220 pounds (and still growing muscle)!  :o :o :o


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 09, 2017, 07:39:25 AM
his last training ideas were rather nuts

ie training just once a week or less

wonder if anyone ever made true progress on that  ???

He basically preached training 3-4 times per week from the mid 70s til the mid 90s then all the sudden he "discovered" that training once a week or even less was best

I've been doing it 10 years now and it's served me extremely well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 09, 2017, 07:45:05 AM
Well put. I had the same response in training once per week as you did. Mike's training ideas is where his legacy lies. More so than his competition days. I do not know where the line is drawn exactly as to when too much training has occurred or not enough. When it comes down to it if I am motivated to work out for over an hour then that's what I do. If I hit it hard and gas out in a half an hour then that is what I do. If the muscle I want to train are still tight from before then I give it another day. Mike opened the door for me to listen more to my body, not just a workout routine written by some so called expert I never trained with. It really boils down (for me) to being in tune with my body.

Excellent insight into what it is to train as a man that thinks for himself.  "Dinosaur Training" by Brooks Kubick is a great read but like Mentzer's HD, you have to tailor it to yourself, otherwise you may get injured and/or burn out.  I've been training now for well over 40 years (now in my 60s) and I do it because it makes me feel both mentally and physically better.

And yes, there are times I will do a ton of light weight pumping sets in a row because I feel like it and it feels good to just pump it up as fast as I can.  Mostly it is a mixture of HD/Dinosaur training but again, tailored to my body as I see fit.  A few weeks back I did my warmups and then did a set of DB flys to failure followed (within a few seconds) by a single set of Smith Machine BP to failure and then rest pause in the same set to ultimate failure.  I do not have anyone to spot me so I just do what I can until I can't do it and the Smith Machine allows me to do just that.

I'm a wussy.   ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jollygiant on April 09, 2017, 07:51:53 AM
Excellent insight into what it is to train as a man that thinks for himself.  "Dinosaur Training" by Brooks Kubick is a great read but like Mentzer's HD, you have to tailor it to yourself, otherwise you may get injured and/or burn out.  I've been training now for well over 40 years (now in my 60s) and I do it because it makes me feel both mentally and physically better.

And yes, there are times I will do a ton of light weight pumping sets in a row because I feel like it and it feels good to just pump it up as fast as I can.  Mostly it is a mixture of HD/Dinosaur training but again, tailored to my body as I see fit.  A few weeks back I did my warmups and then did a set of DB flys to failure followed (within a few seconds) by a single set of Smith Machine BP to failure and then rest pause in the same set to ultimate failure.  I do not have anyone to spot me so I just do what I can until I can't do it and the Smith Machine allows me to do just that.

I'm a wussy.   ;D
yes, nothing is carved in stone.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on April 09, 2017, 08:54:50 AM
;)

where do you keep digging up all these old photos, you are 132lbs, who fucking cares what shape you are in.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: YngiweRhoads on April 09, 2017, 09:05:35 AM
his last training ideas were rather nuts

ie training just once a week or less

wonder if anyone ever made true progress on that  ???


He basically preached training 3-4 times per week from the mid 70s til the mid 90s then all the sudden he "discovered" that training once a week or even less was best

I did.

I was at the strongest point in my life working following one of his workout routines.

I found it hard on my joints after a few months and stopped. Went back to my usual 3xweek afterwards.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 09, 2017, 09:08:17 AM
where do you keep digging up all these old photos, you are 132lbs, who fucking cares what shape you are in.

walking weight is bout a buck 60 chief

ill make 32s to set the strict curl record once I'm ready  ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 09, 2017, 09:28:23 AM
I did.

I was at the strongest point in my life working following one of his workout routines.

I found it hard on my joints after a few months and stopped. Went back to my usual 3xweek afterwards.

Consolidated routine?

The strength gains are phenomenal if done right. I use his ideal routine at the moment as my usual training partner moved away from town due to work about 9 months ago and I haven't really found a suitable replacement yet. It's easier to spot myself with that routine due to the exercise choices, if that makes sense, in terms of static holds and negatives.

We were up to deadlifting 240kg for 15 reps (partner got more or less the same), but with extremely slow negatives from the first to the last rep, probably 5-6 seconds per negative or more. That way it becomes far more than just a 'lift' IMO, it really focuses on each and every portion of the movement. Done in that fashion we were having to sit down to compose ourselves for 15 minutes afterwards from the sheer exhaustion. We'd drive back from a workout trembling from head to toe!





Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 09, 2017, 09:42:07 AM
I did.

I was at the strongest point in my life working following one of his workout routines.

I found it hard on my joints after a few months and stopped. Went back to my usual 3xweek afterwards.


the same here, my strength shot up big time,  as well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on April 09, 2017, 09:43:31 AM
walking weight is bout a buck 60 chief

ill make 32s to set the strict curl record once I'm ready  ;)

if you can make 132 then thats your actual LBM.

Stop acting stupid joon.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 09, 2017, 09:43:53 AM
speaking of the Mentzer diet get a load of this....

    

In his Heavy Duty Journal he gives a few examples of what he ate during his contest preparation before the 1979 Mr. Olympia (they′re samples from his training log). For example:

1. On June 27th, he ate nothing(!) for breakfast. He first meal at four o′ clock in the afternoon (is that PM?) he consumed only one peach and a protein drink (200 calories). At nine in the evening he ate 60 grams of nuts and raisins (200 calories) and one salad (150 calories). So he ate only 550 calories total that day... (He weighed 102 kg before his workout).

2. Juli 16th

Breakfast: 1/2 honey melon (50) and 1 nectarine (75);

Post-workout meal: same as above;

Lunch (12:00): Turkey (150) and baked potato (125);

Diner (16:00): Turkey (350), water melon, yoghurt and some sweets (450);

Snack: Plums (70) and some bread (150).

Total: 1545 calories.


I′ve noticed he liked to eat fruit, cake(!), pancakes and, his favorite... ice cream! The evening before the contest he also drank some coffee, 1 glas of wine and 1 wodkacocktail as ′diuretics′.

Hope this will give you some insight into his eating habits!

Oh, I almost forgot: yes, in his The Mentzer Method to Fitness (with Ardy Friedberg, 1980) he claims that he ate only 60 grams of protein a day to maintain his bodyweight of 220 pounds (and still growing muscle)!


   
B-WINE (Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands) on 8/26/2004 5:35:35 AM    
   

Here are three more examples of the HD Journal:

1. August 21th, 1979

Breakfast: Pancakes (?) (400 calories) and protein (drink?) (...)

Post-workout snack: cake (250) and melon (...)

15:30: Chicken (250), Fruit (100) and baked potato (150)


2. September 3rd, 1979

Breakfast: 2 brancakes (?), margarine (350), pineapple (100) and protein (drink?) (150)

15:30: 1 piece of chicken (150), half potato with butter (100)

Snack: a couple of strawberries (50)


3. September 29th, 1979

Breakfast (at 10:00): Apple pie (300), pineapple and fig(pear?)s (350)

15:00: Turkey (200) and fruitcake (500)

Note: He had diner at a restaurant with his brother Ray, Pam (Ray′s girlfriend?), Jusup Wilkosz and his wife, and Axel Gottlob. He says he ate more calories then he could count!


P.S. I′m sorry if it′s sometimes a bit vague here and there, but I had to translate it from German (I own a German copy of the book; I also have HD I in German) to English and I′m Dutch myself...

http://www.highintensity.net/Forums/ViewTopic.asp?topic_id=649

AND AGAIN.... he claims that he ate only 60 grams of protein a day to maintain his bodyweight of 220 pounds (and still growing muscle)!  :o :o :o


dj i have that same journal i commend you for typing all of that out, yes, mike believed in high carbs and just less calories to lose fat, makes things simpler to


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 09, 2017, 09:47:05 AM
Consolidated routine?

The strength gains are phenomenal if done right. I use his ideal routine at the moment as my usual training partner moved away from town due to work about 9 months ago and I haven't really found a suitable replacement yet. It's easier to spot myself with that routine due to the exercise choices, if that makes sense, in terms of static holds and negatives.

We were up to deadlifting 240kg for 15 reps (partner got more or less the same), but with extremely slow negatives from the first to the last rep, probably 5-6 seconds per negative or more. That way it becomes far more than just a 'lift' IMO, it really focuses on each and every portion of the movement. Done in that fashion we were having to sit down to compose ourselves for 15 minutes afterwards from the sheer exhaustion. We'd drive back from a workout trembling from head to toe!





Well done!  When I trained my hardest via HIT, I would nearly pass out on the floor after I finished.   I literally did not want to move.  It can be difficult to get a training partner as most think you are crazy to train like that.  Who knows?  Maybe they're somewhat right!  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 09, 2017, 09:51:56 AM
Well done!  When I trained my hardest via HIT, I would nearly pass out on the floor after I finished.   I literally did not want to move.  It can be difficult to get a training partner as most think you are crazy to train like that.  Who knows?  Maybe they're somewhat right!  ;D

scott i made my best strength gains ever training that way, but had  a couple bad injuries which were my fault i was young and didnt warm up properly.

i wouldnt train this way year round though .


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 09, 2017, 10:05:04 AM
scott i made my best strength gains ever training that way, but had  a couple bad injuries which were my fault i was young and didnt warm up properly.

i wouldnt train this way year round though .

I agree.  Brief and intense is the best way to go but proper warmup is needed to avoid injury.

In the beginning, I trained 6 days a week for 2 or more hours as that is what I read "the champs" did.  I upped it to twice a day for up to 5 hours total a day.  One day I looked at my life and decided I did not want to be a "Mr. Anything" as one, I did not possess the necessary long/low muscle insertions in my calves  ;D and two, I needed to get an education and a better job.  Plus the guys at the original Gold's showed me it would take drugs and I wasn't really too keen on that.

They were very honest about that aspect and I will never forget Ken Waller laughing and then smiling as I bought a XXX Gold's tank top and told him I'd grow into it.  Good times and good memories.  Waller and Franco were very kind to a 6' 1", 120 lb. kid that day.  And later on Mike Mentzer showed me that a decent physique is well within reach but that reach should also include a balanced life.   I like to think that if he had just avoided the amphetamines he might have come out ahead.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 09, 2017, 10:12:39 AM
Well done!  When I trained my hardest via HIT, I would nearly pass out on the floor after I finished.   I literally did not want to move.  It can be difficult to get a training partner as most think you are crazy to train like that.  Who knows?  Maybe they're somewhat right!  ;D

I think you need somebody who has a very similar strength level also. You need somebody who can really feel when you've put 100 percent into a negative for example and have absolutely nothing left.

Would've loved to have had the opportunity to speak with Mike. I can't imagine the amount of people he has inspired to simply think critically about what they are actually doing in the gym, as opposed to just mindlessly going through the motions; regardless of whether you follow his method.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Henda on April 09, 2017, 12:04:23 PM
Those idiotic mentzer/hardgainer/Stuart mcrobert routines built their reputation on the fact that many of the people trying them out are chronically overtrained on the high volume routines touted in all the magazines, it's the defatiguing from the volume routine that causes the great initial gains, after that it becomes a constant struggle to gain size but they are decent for strength but there are far better methods of training for both size and strength


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 02:09:55 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on April 09, 2017, 03:40:10 PM
:)

What a solid physique and a small midsection. Bodybuilding has gone backwards since then.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 09, 2017, 04:14:26 PM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 04:28:47 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 09, 2017, 04:33:29 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=720287;image)

 :)

Even taking into account the mental problems of later years, Mike Mentzer was and remains vastly superior to Phildo.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 04:37:14 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 04:38:32 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 04:41:47 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 09, 2017, 04:49:34 PM
i still do not get how zane won that show

i bet he sucked and fucked all the judges


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 05:44:26 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 09, 2017, 06:06:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 09, 2017, 06:33:01 PM
i still do not get how zane won that show

i bet he sucked and fucked all the judges

Politics running the show, and maybe some backstage glory hole action.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 09, 2017, 06:34:04 PM
:)

Cool shots, unique build he had.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 09, 2017, 06:37:32 PM
Even taking into account the mental problems of later years, Mike Mentzer was and remains vastly superior to Phildo.

You know to be quite honest, after Dorian Yates and most of the Ronnie Coleman era, I stopped paying attention to the Olympia. The new guys that have been winning since just don't have any appeal? Especially Phil (MyCracken) the midget.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on April 09, 2017, 07:31:15 PM
What a solid physique and a small midsection. Bodybuilding has gone backwards since then.

Mike Mentzer has gone backwards since then.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 10, 2017, 04:43:10 AM
He must have seriously messed up his diet or some other part of his prep for the 1980 Olympia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on April 10, 2017, 04:45:44 AM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v353/dekethecreep/mentzer-trains-boyer-coe-o.gif)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 10, 2017, 04:50:14 AM
He must have seriously messed up his diet or some other part of his prep for the 1980 Olympia.
His belly was hanging out all over the place, wonder why?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 10, 2017, 05:14:28 AM
His belly was hanging out all over the place, wonder why?

Wasn't that from using heavy weights for his abs?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 10, 2017, 05:21:29 AM
You know to be quite honest, after Dorian Yates and most of the Ronnie Coleman era, I stopped paying attention to the Olympia. The new guys that have been winning since just don't have any appeal? Especially Phil (MyCracken) the midget.

i quit following after yates retired myself.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Kwon on April 10, 2017, 05:25:20 AM
i quit following after yates retired myself.

Why did yates retire you?


Even though he was difficult to compete with, you could've still kept competing at smaller shows.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 10, 2017, 05:29:17 AM
Why did yates retire you?


Even though he was difficult to compete with, you could've still kept competing at smaller shows.

bwa ha ha , good one bro ,

i meant i quit following the contests and competitors  after dorian retired,  i really thought that flex would win the 98 olympia, but ronnie came out of nowhere that year.

but i have never really got into it is since.   in the 90's  i knew just about allt he competitors there were a ton of good bb's back then to. that era was so intense competition wise.

another guy who had a nice look was al q gurley    i beleive he blew his knees out,  aron baker, got fucked over quite a bit to


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 10, 2017, 06:01:30 AM
Consolidated routine?

The strength gains are phenomenal if done right. I use his ideal routine at the moment as my usual training partner moved away from town due to work about 9 months ago and I haven't really found a suitable replacement yet. It's easier to spot myself with that routine due to the exercise choices, if that makes sense, in terms of static holds and negatives.

We were up to deadlifting 240kg for 15 reps (partner got more or less the same), but with extremely slow negatives from the first to the last rep, probably 5-6 seconds per negative or more. That way it becomes far more than just a 'lift' IMO, it really focuses on each and every portion of the movement. Done in that fashion we were having to sit down to compose ourselves for 15 minutes afterwards from the sheer exhaustion. We'd drive back from a workout trembling from head to toe!





240 ks for 15 is very good impressive

what was you starting weight and reps,  and how long did it take you to get there? 

And how often did you dead?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on April 10, 2017, 06:23:27 AM
Wasn't that from using heavy weights for his abs?

(http://i.makeagif.com/save/JNE1py)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 10, 2017, 08:58:02 AM
Those idiotic mentzer/hardgainer/Stuart mcrobert routines built their reputation on the fact that many of the people trying them out are chronically overtrained on the high volume routines touted in all the magazines, it's the defatiguing from the volume routine that causes the great initial gains, after that it becomes a constant struggle to gain size but they are decent for strength but there are far better methods of training for both size and strength

Beyond Brawn starts off as a good read. Then it's like Stuart taking 20 pages on what can be said on a paragraph or two. The guy just doesn't know when to stop.

His quest to do, I forgot the details, deadlift 400+ for 20 reps is telling. Gotta keep pushing the weight, even micro load. All about intensity, anything else is futile. Blame the injuries for non stellar form. Too stubborn.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 10, 2017, 09:03:11 AM
i still do not get how zane won that show

i bet he sucked and fucked all the judges

You're up against the chemist conditioning

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=44997.0;attach=52254;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: drmarkp on April 10, 2017, 10:36:22 AM
.. I am a proponent of high intensity, but in my opinion the best version of Mentzer's physique was not achieved as a result of 'heavy duty' training - but in spite of it

Mentzer was a genetic phenom who at 19 looked phenomenal and had already placed top 10 at the 71' 'Mr. America' contest

While true that he may have 'chronically over trained' at some point in his pre nautilus days, with his genetics all he would have had to do is tone his volume down a bit and he could have achieved a physique at least equal to his best ever on the Olympia stage

He may have learned a lot from Art Jones in terms of putting things in perspective, but even with conventional training and with some insight and perspective; he would have been a top champion with or without his extreme approach to heavy duty

He took merely took one dogma and replaced it with his own


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on April 10, 2017, 10:39:54 AM
.. I am a proponent of high intensity, but in my opinion the best version of Mentzer's physique was not achieved as a result of 'heavy duty' training - but in spite of it

Mentzer was a genetic phenom who at 19 looked phenomenal and had already placed top 10 at the 71' 'Mr. America' contest

While true that he may have 'chronically over trained' at some point in his pre nautilus days, with his genetics all he would have had to do is tone his volume down a bit and he could have achieved a physique at least equal to his best ever on the Olympia stage

He may have learned a lot from Art Jones in terms of putting things in perspective, but even with conventional training and with some insight and perspective; he would have been a top champion with or without his extreme approach to heavy duty

He took merely took one dogma and replaced it with his own

we are all limited by genetics, doesnt matter what you do to lift, as long as you stress a muscle it will respond with growth, or not depending on your genetic make up.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 10, 2017, 11:23:00 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: nukkaready on April 10, 2017, 12:38:28 PM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 10, 2017, 01:53:29 PM
^^^ he's got the biggest arms in that line up


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 10, 2017, 02:38:20 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jollygiant on April 10, 2017, 09:36:25 PM
Beyond Brawn starts off as a good read. Then it's like Stuart taking 20 pages on what can be said on a paragraph or two. The guy just doesn't know when to stop.

His quest to do, I forgot the details, deadlift 400+ for 20 reps is telling. Gotta keep pushing the weight, even micro load. All about intensity, anything else is futile. Blame the injuries for non stellar form. Too stubborn.
I think the book is good. talks a lot of sense.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 11, 2017, 03:41:32 AM
240 ks for 15 is very good impressive

what was you starting weight and reps,  and how long did it take you to get there? 

And how often did you dead?

I'm a bit pissed at myself as kept a record of everything in various notepads over the years, but don't know where they all are so couldn't give you a full record. 

I'm going to attempt to start the consolidated routine again as soon as I've found a new training partner in line with my schedule. I will let you know if and when I do.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: nukkaready on April 11, 2017, 04:42:17 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 11, 2017, 04:48:48 AM
the thing with mike is you could read an article of his and it got you to think

beside arnold, i cant think of one bodybuilder that wrote interesting articles,about training. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 11, 2017, 05:09:16 AM
I'm a bit pissed at myself as kept a record of everything in various notepads over the years, but don't know where they all are so couldn't give you a full record. 

I'm going to attempt to start the consolidated routine again as soon as I've found a new training partner in line with my schedule. I will let you know if and when I do.

good stuff

do you happen to remember how much you pulled the 1st time you did it?

lifting 550 for 15 could possibly put  you at a 700 pound single



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 11, 2017, 05:30:32 AM
the thing with mike is you could read an article of his and it got you to think

beside arnold, i cant think of one bodybuilder that wrote interesting articles,about training. 

Athletes aren't authors.  And were the Mentzer articles from the period in the 70s when his mind was sacked out on amphetamines?  Frankly the lesson from Mentzer is that speed affects your mind and fucks you up much worse than steroids.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: _bruce_ on April 11, 2017, 05:31:03 AM
.

Awesome!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on April 11, 2017, 07:56:02 AM
Athletes aren't authors.  And were the Mentzer articles from the period in the 70s when his mind was sacked out on amphetamines?  Frankly the lesson from Mentzer is that speed affects your mind and fucks you up much worse than steroids.

Most of his articles were like that. Wordy, yes, but they got you to think beyond the convention.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 11, 2017, 09:41:01 AM
good stuff

do you happen to remember how much you pulled the 1st time you did it?

lifting 550 for 15 could possibly put  you at a 700 pound single



Somewhere around 160kg for a set was where I started off at from what I can remember. Done in the same fashion, super slow negatives, so a whole different exercise done in that fashion.

I'm really big on rest pause at the moment, really useful whilst I'm training on my own.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Henda on April 11, 2017, 10:56:04 AM
Beyond Brawn starts off as a good read. Then it's like Stuart taking 20 pages on what can be said on a paragraph or two. The guy just doesn't know when to stop.

His quest to do, I forgot the details, deadlift 400+ for 20 reps is telling. Gotta keep pushing the weight, even micro load. All about intensity, anything else is futile. Blame the injuries for non stellar form. Too stubborn.

I agree, there's Some good info/principles in the book it does hammer home the importance of progressive workouts but it's routines are far too conservative, especially the lack of direct arm work which I took as gospel along with all his other advices when I followed his routines in late teenage years which resulted in barely 15 inch arms at 225 bodyweight which looked ridiculous.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 11, 2017, 11:36:05 AM
Somewhere around 160kg for a set was where I started off at from what I can remember. Done in the same fashion, super slow negatives, so a whole different exercise done in that fashion.

I'm really big on rest pause at the moment, really useful whilst I'm training on my own.


slow negatives on deads must be a real bitch

I believe Mentzer stated somewhere that rest pause is best with push exercises,  mainly chest and delt work


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SilverSpoon on April 11, 2017, 11:49:48 AM
slow negatives on deads must be a real bitch

I believe Mentzer stated somewhere that rest pause is best with push exercises,  mainly chest and delt work

I used to consult with Mentzer.  I truly don't think he had any better routines than Heavy Duty II.  The consolidation routine was too little in the way of exercise, and would lead to deconditioning.  I remember one guy on the boards (Jammin' Jake Sands) used to train once every 5 weeks with this routine.  No, I am not joking.
 

I had figured out doing slow negatives on deads was a great way to train for quite some time prior to my consults.  Turns out Vince Anello was training a 6 second negative for many years.  There is nothing new under the sun.  The answer is to train briefly, intensely, progressively and consistently if you are natural.  Your results will speak for themselves.  And if you are something short of a genetic marvel, you will be better than most of your friends, but will not look like Mike O'Hearn, Skip LaCour or Jeff Willet.

I had one friend who had the genetics of a Casey Viator (huge forearms and calves) who remained natural.  Very impressive, but was never cut or stage ready.  Me, I vastly improved from where I started, so I was/am happy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Zillotch on April 11, 2017, 12:01:19 PM
:)

.

bodybuilding doesnt get much better


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 11, 2017, 02:12:44 PM
I used to consult with Mentzer.  I truly don't think he had any better routines than Heavy Duty II.  The consolidation routine was too little in the way of exercise, and would lead to deconditioning.  I remember one guy on the boards (Jammin' Jake Sands) used to train once every 5 weeks with this routine.  No, I am not joking.
 

I had figured out doing slow negatives on deads was a great way to train for quite some time prior to my consults.  Turns out Vince Anello was training a 6 second negative for many years.  There is nothing new under the sun.  The answer is to train briefly, intensely, progressively and consistently if you are natural.  Your results will speak for themselves.  And if you are something short of a genetic marvel, you will be better than most of your friends, but will not look like Mike O'Hearn, Skip LaCour or Jeff Willet.

I had one friend who had the genetics of a Casey Viator (huge forearms and calves) who remained natural.  Very impressive, but was never cut or stage ready.  Me, I vastly improved from where I started, so I was/am happy.

thanks for the feedback

do you mean the routine where one trains once very 4-7 days or the one that starts off with training 3 days a week?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 03:03:49 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on April 11, 2017, 04:17:15 PM
Mentzer trained the entire body 3x a week at the time he won Mr America and I think Ray did the same thing as well (fully body 3x a week) when he won in 1979

Some recent studies have shown that muscle protein synthesis only takes 24 to 48 hours (Jerry Brainum wrote about this in his newsletter earlier this year and had cited the studies. He also said that more experienced trainers tend to be closer to 24 hours.) 

Mentzer's later concepts of very short and very infrequent workouts seemed a bit loony to me even at the time he was promoting them. 

I think the low volume of true working sets per muscle group (~ 4 to 8 depending on the body party and frequency) makes a lot of sense and working each bodypart at least 2 x a week and 3 x if you can handle it.

This is the summary of the article from Brainums site (appliedmetabolics.com)

I won't post the entire article since it is long and it's also a subcription site

Quote
  It's a common observation that the more advanced you are in your training, the slower the gains. Those who are new to training make the most rapid gains for a number of reasons, with a primary reason being greater neuromuscular efficiency, or communication between the brain and the muscles. But after about a year or so, muscle gains come far and few between. Some scientists looked at all the factors that underlie muscular hypertrophy or growth and concluded that perhaps the age-old advice of providing adequate rest between workout sessions may not completely apply to advanced trainees. The reason why you need to rest for 24 to 48 hours between workouts is related to factors such as the muscle protein synthesis process. But MPS peaks in 48 hours in beginners, but only 24 hours in those with more training experience. Much of the reason why you need that much rest relates to the higher training volume that most trainees use in their training, such as 16 sets or more per muscle group. But according to a new hypothesis, those with more training experience can likely build more muscle by training more frequently, training each muscle two or even three times a week, but use a lower volume of training, such as 4 sets per muscle group with a higher level of training intensity (to complete muscular failure). This style of training would allow complete recovery, but not lead to overtraining. After about 16 weeks of this more frequent training, a trainee would then switch to a more conventional style featuring less frequency for 24 weeks.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 04:23:53 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on April 11, 2017, 04:24:06 PM
Also, I think Mentzer's dieting advice is basically worthless

Not shitting on the  guy.  He had an amazing build and definitely had good ideas on the need to lower the number of sets, using full extension and contraction, etc..  Not sure that anyone really needs to go to beyond failure with negatives, etc..   Rest pause is a good idea but not a fan of how he did it.  I like the going to failure (or where you would fail on the next rep) and then resting 10-30 seconds and doing a few more reps and maybe doing that once more (ala DC training).  That only works well for some exercises.  Mechanical drop sets are another way to raise intensity without killing your joints.  


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 04:26:40 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 04:36:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 04:45:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 04:52:04 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 05:21:32 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 05:24:34 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 05:26:34 PM
Apparently he wasn't


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: WalterWhite on April 11, 2017, 05:50:58 PM
Great pics nd MM was thick!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 05:56:42 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 05:58:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 06:02:25 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 06:09:48 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 11, 2017, 06:12:14 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 11, 2017, 06:47:16 PM
danny padilla always had good things to say about mike in any interview he gave and mike was brought up


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 11, 2017, 06:59:42 PM
Was some kinda Mentzer time capsule or coffin recently opened? 

Without a doubt the most disappointing sighting at Gold's Gym back in the day


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 11, 2017, 07:14:11 PM
Mentzer trained the entire body 3x a week at the time he won Mr America and I think Ray did the same thing as well (fully body 3x a week) when he won in 1979

Some recent studies have shown that muscle protein synthesis only takes 24 to 48 hours (Jerry Brainum wrote about this in his newsletter earlier this year and had cited the studies. He also said that more experienced trainers tend to be closer to 24 hours.) 

Mentzer's later concepts of very short and very infrequent workouts seemed a bit loony to me even at the time he was promoting them. 

I think the low volume of true working sets per muscle group (~ 4 to 8 depending on the body party and frequency) makes a lot of sense and working each bodypart at least 2 x a week and 3 x if you can handle it.

This is the summary of the article from Brainums site (appliedmetabolics.com)

I won't post the entire article since it is long and it's also a subcription site


Kinda makes sense to a point. I know if I really bomb large muscle groups I have to take several days before I can hit them again. Such as legs chest and back. Yet and arms and calves can be hit three times per week. In fact the smaller muscle groups respond better when I train them more frequently. Large multijoint movements take severL days nd sometimes a full week to recover from.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on April 11, 2017, 07:58:32 PM
Kinda makes sense to a point. I know if I really bomb large muscle groups I have to take several days before I can hit them again. Such as legs chest and back. Yet and arms and calves can be hit three times per week. In fact the smaller muscle groups respond better when I train them more frequently. Large multijoint movements take severL days nd sometimes a full week to recover from.

yeah, that's the thing.  You really can't bomb anything in terms of volume (I have the same problem too, I always want to do more)

you have to do just enough to stimulate muscle protein synthesis and then stop

another example of the premise here:  https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters (https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters)

right now I'm doing upper body Monday, Wednesday , Friday

and lower body Tuesday, Saturday

I prefer slightly more volume on leg day and need a bit more time to recover

Also, you can toggle the volume for various upper body muscle groups on M,W,F or change the rep scheme


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 12, 2017, 02:38:24 AM
While I still think Mentzer was a very smart individual and waaaaay above average in that respect for a bodybuilder, I still must take into account that he took AAS.  Without the drugs, he would likely have been a good natural. With them, he was a great competitive bodybuilder.  He freely admitted taking AAS but I do not recall him ever quoting his dosage/frequency rates but again, Mike Mentzer was a great competitive bodybuilder in a time many think was the golden era for not just AAS enhanced bodybuilders but all of competitive bodybuilding.

It would be nice if there were a return to sanity.  And yeah, I realize using the word "sanity" in a thread about Mike is a bit of a dichotomy.  ;D

Brooks Kubik is another author on training that thinks like Mentzer in that hard, infrequent training is the way to go.   His concern is primarily strength training and I can't fault him on his choice but he also speaks of size and strength.  Bodybuilding is more of an afterthought to him, if it is a thought at all.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 12, 2017, 02:55:00 AM
^^^^ he actually did say what he was taking and it was this.... 400 my of deca every 10 days and 5 dbol a day

and yep, you can train arms more often but righ now II'm doing very heavytraining 1-3 reps so tthere's no fuckngway I could ttrain stric curl like that 3 times a week or even twice a week


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 12, 2017, 05:45:08 AM
He definitely had a unique and very powerful look.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on April 12, 2017, 05:55:32 AM
I forgot just how good he looked at one point in his career. Unreal, like an action figure. Alot of these picsites serve to hilight just how far off he was in 1980. He actually looked alot better in 79. He over dieter and lost alot of his thickness without necessarily getting leaner. His subsequent mental breAK down was more of a result of his drug use than the result of the Olympia. No doubt his reliance on methamphetamines reduced his coping abilities and his perceptions of reality.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 12, 2017, 03:49:32 PM

Brooks Kubik is another author on training that thinks like Mentzer in that hard, infrequent training is the way to go.   His concern is primarily strength training and I can't fault him on his choice but he also speaks of size and strength.  Bodybuilding is more of an afterthought to him, if it is a thought at all.

and Brooks nearly crippled himself with that mindset


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 12, 2017, 03:52:26 PM
:)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=720666;image)

says it all right there.

Mike did all he could. You just can't alter the genetics.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 12, 2017, 11:34:55 PM
Here is an edited photo I took at the 1980 Mr Olympia. Mike looks like the winner here but he didn't do so well in the comparisons and placed a disappointing 5th.

He followed the philosophy of Ayn Rand so figured he had the one correct theory about training. His whole world collapsed after

this contest. Mike was an exceptional writer and one of the few to embrace a comprehensive philosophy that he lived by.  



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 13, 2017, 12:04:36 AM
Here is an edited photo I took at the 1980 Mr Olympia. Mike looks like the winner here but he didn't do so well in the comparisons and placed a disappointing 5th.

He followed the philosophy of Ayn Rand so figured he had the one correct theory about training. His whole world collapsed after

this contest. Mike was an exceptional writer and one of the few to embrace a comprehensive philosophy that he lived by.  



Mike looks incredible in that picture. Good shot Vince  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 13, 2017, 04:34:06 AM
says it all right there.

Mike did all he could. You just can't alter the genetics.


Mentzer still has a more powerful look though.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 13, 2017, 04:56:27 AM
Mentzer still has a more powerful look though.

who do you think would have won in a fistfight  ???


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: nukkaready on April 13, 2017, 05:05:16 AM
I think this photo illustrates very well that Mike was getting lost in some of the comparisons at the 1980 Mr. O, especially in those where you could see that his chest on that day was very flat and at times tiny looking.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 13, 2017, 05:07:08 AM
who do you think would have won in a fistfight  ???

Mentzer.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 05:15:00 AM
Here is a side view comparison at the Olympia. Arnold was not standing side on to make himself look better.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 05:16:39 AM
Here is the back view.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 05:23:54 AM
Here is Mike FDB. Have to admit that Mike looks very good here. No weak point.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 05:28:00 AM
Mike back pose.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 13, 2017, 05:51:34 AM
Here is Mike FDB. Have to admit that Mike looks very good here. No weak point.

coz he had thick ass arms, that's why


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on April 13, 2017, 06:16:24 AM
Here is an edited photo I took at the 1980 Mr Olympia. Mike looks like the winner here but he didn't do so well in the comparisons and placed a disappointing 5th.

He followed the philosophy of Ayn Rand so figured he had the one correct theory about training. His whole world collapsed after

this contest. Mike was an exceptional writer and one of the few to embrace a comprehensive philosophy that he lived by.  



You did not took that photo you liar fuck.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 13, 2017, 06:50:08 AM
Great photos Vince. I think Arnold beat everybody hands down, but only from the front. Every shot I have seen so far from the back proves otherwise. Arnold's arms look thin from the back as does his back in comparison to the others.  Also when watching the footage of this contest you can hear the judges telling Arnold to do the side pose correctly and he smiles knowingly ignoring them anyway. He would not have done so if he was confident with that pose. He should have been marked down for that arrogant stunt.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 06:56:14 AM
Great photos Vince. I think Arnold beat everybody hands down, but only from the front. Every shot I have seen so far from the back proves otherwise. Arnold's arms look thin from the back as does his back in comparison to the others.  Also when watching the footage of this contest you can hear the judges telling Arnold to do the side pose correctly and he smiles knowingly ignoring them anyway. He would not have done so if he was confident with that pose. He should have been marked down for that arrogant stunt.

Thanks for the comments re my photos. I took hours editing them to remove backgrounds, etc.

Arnold cheated and was warned by Oscar State but no points were deducted. When posting triceps he put in a biceps pose with the rear arm.

People booed loudly after the decision was announced. Later they acknowledged Arnold who was very popular in bodybuilding circles in Sydney.

Dennis had the best Abs in the contest. Mike had a great midsection but this pose doesn't show all that he had.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 07:50:10 AM
Here is the best Photoshop I did for Getbig. There are many champions in the photo. Can you name them all?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 13, 2017, 09:30:56 AM
And where is Yates ?  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on April 13, 2017, 09:58:26 AM
I saw a video awhile back of the 1980 Olympia. Arnold at 80% looked better than anyone there. Dickerson looked carved out of ice. I completely accept Arnold one and Dickerson two.  If anyone should complain about placing it should be Callender.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on April 13, 2017, 10:14:40 AM
I saw a video awhile back of the 1980 Olympia. Arnold at 80% looked better than anyone there. Dickerson looked carved out of ice. I completely accept Arnold one and Dickerson two.  If anyone should complain about placing it should be Callender.
X2


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 13, 2017, 10:15:36 AM
Roy C. ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 13, 2017, 11:27:16 AM
And where is Yates ?  ;D

Retired and living the "high" life in Marbella Spain. ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 13, 2017, 11:28:57 AM
Roy C. ;)

Much better back here than what Arnold brought that day.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on April 13, 2017, 11:54:09 AM
Here is a side view comparison at the Olympia. Arnold was not standing side on to make himself look better.

Zane by a country mile in this and the relaxed back shot.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 13, 2017, 12:30:55 PM
Zane by a country mile in this and the relaxed back shot.

J

his hip structure is about half tthe size of the rest of those hippos


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on April 13, 2017, 03:45:44 PM
Here is a side view comparison at the Olympia. Arnold was not standing side on to make himself look better.
That's how they all do it these days.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on April 13, 2017, 03:49:42 PM
Great photos Vince. I think Arnold beat everybody hands down, but only from the front. Every shot I have seen so far from the back proves otherwise. Arnold's arms look thin from the back as does his back in comparison to the others.  Also when watching the footage of this contest you can hear the judges telling Arnold to do the side pose correctly and he smiles knowingly ignoring them anyway. He would not have done so if he was confident with that pose. He should have been marked down for that arrogant stunt.
True but only at the relaxed quaterturns. His back looked pretty good in the BDB and RLS poses and definitely better than Mentzer's.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 13, 2017, 03:53:13 PM
Here is Mike FDB. Have to admit that Mike looks very good here. No weak point.

Yes; lack of lat flare with his torso. Hell, his torso altogether was a weak point in '80.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 13, 2017, 04:29:28 PM
Callendar was a disappointment. In 1979 in Sydney he won a pro contest. The next year he didn't have the same package.

Lots of these guys looked great on their own but faded in the comparisons.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on April 14, 2017, 12:53:29 AM
Here is an edited photo I took at the 1980 Mr Olympia. Mike looks like the winner here but he didn't do so well in the comparisons and placed a disappointing 5th.

He followed the philosophy of Ayn Rand so figured he had the one correct theory about training. His whole world collapsed after

this contest. Mike was an exceptional writer and one of the few to embrace a comprehensive philosophy that he lived by.  

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=720875;image)

Vince, I did't know you took that pic! In those days to get any info on contests you had to wait for the mags to come out. I could never afford a subscription but would read them at the news stands selectively buying the ones that seemed worth it. The 1980 Olympia edition qualified and it was the only time I bought a mag without flipping through it first. I actually restrained myself from going through it on the drive home but waiting until I go home and settled. I opened the mag to the Olympia section and this pic was the first one I saw. I actually said "WOW!" out loud to myself. He seemed flawless in a very difficult pose to pull off. I was sure Mentzer had won. Reading his articles prior it seemed predestined.

I don't consider myself an expert now and especially way back then, but to my untrained eyes I did not think Arnold should have won. But I resigned myself to the fact that Arnold was Arnold and when the smoke clears he always comes out the winner. I remember that scene in PI where he says that even if Louie came in a little bit better than he was he would still win. "I'd put us in a room."

BTW, good to see you back. You were sorely missed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 14, 2017, 01:21:18 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=720875;image)

Vince, I did't know you took that pic! In those days to get any info on contests you had to wait for the mags to come out. I could never afford a subscription but would read them at the news stands selectively buying the ones that seemed worth it. The 1980 Olympia edition qualified and it was the only time I bought a mag without flipping through it first. I actually restrained myself from going through it on the drive home but waiting until I go home and settled. I opened the mag to the Olympia section and this pic was the first one I saw. I actually said "WOW!" out loud to myself. He seemed flawless in a very difficult pose to pull off. I was sure Mentzer had won. Reading his articles prior it seemed predestined.

I don't consider myself an expert now and especially way back then, but to my untrained eyes I did not think Arnold should have won. But I resigned myself to the fact that Arnold was Arnold and when the smoke clears he always comes out the winner. I remember that scene in PI where he says that even if Louie came in a little bit better than he was he would still win. "I'd put us in a room."

BTW, good to see you back. You were sorely missed.

Hi Pellius, how are things over there in Hawaii? I still haven't returned there to take some photos and see you can look up Keith's daughter.

The 80 Olympia was interesting mainly because all the top guys except Sergio were there. Paul Graham told me Arnold was entering and so I told

people to help sell more tickets. Our gym sold 200 tickets to that contest. I picked a seat in the middle of the Concert Hall to take photos.

So I saw the contest through my lens. I took heaps of photos of everyone at the judging then took colour slides at night. Arguments can be made

that several of the guys could have won that contest. Arnold, Chris, Frank, Mike, Boyer, Roger, Roy C, and perhaps Danny. What happened was that

too many judges gave 20 out of 20 scores during the rounds and so didn't separate the men. The judges who did separate them had their votes carry

more weight in the end. Things were quite even until Arnold started posing. In the lineups he didn't stand out and you could see he was down. When

he did all those 3/4 turns from front to back to side, etc., the contest was over. See for yourself in the photo below. No one else came close to him

then. Little Danny was perhaps more impressive but no one placed him high.

Many claim that Mike was robbed. Well, they weren't there. Mike was good posing on his own but faded when standing next to Arnold. Boyer did

the best posing round and hid any weak points he had. That is probably why he placed ahead of Mike. Mike looks like the champ in the cover photo.

How on earth didn't he dominate the contest? I think he lost too much size preparing for the show. This could have been because he lost to a smaller

but more refined Zane the year before. Dennis looked great but was let down by his posing. Wide, big and great abs. First place votes were given

to several guys. Many received 20 out of 20 scores in some of the rounds. Silly thing those rounds.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 14, 2017, 05:23:23 AM
I think this photo illustrates very well that Mike was getting lost in some of the comparisons at the 1980 Mr. O, especially in those where you could see that his chest on that day was very flat and at times tiny looking.

Exactly this.  By 1980 the speed had pushed him too far and he was getting worse.  He had crossed the line.

As much as I love being nostalgic and remembering the myth of Mentzer, I realize that was youthful naïveté.  He achieved some great things bodybuilding wise.  But he was ultimately a meathead compared to Arnold whose achievements make him look like an ant (and I still hate the weepy old man Arnold).

PS At least Mentzer got to fuck Rachel McLish though.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 14, 2017, 05:25:32 AM
You did not took that photo you liar fuck.

He did.  He took it out of his closet where he keeps his muscle mags stashed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 14, 2017, 05:28:13 AM
Exactly this.  By 1980 the speed had pushed him too far and he was getting worse.  He had crossed the line.

As much as I love being nostalgic and remembering the myth of Mentzer, I realize that was youthful naïveté.  He achieved some great things bodybuilding wise.  But he was ultimately a meathead compared to Arnold whose achievements make him look like an ant (and I still hate the weepy old man Arnold).

PS At least Mentzer got to fuck Rachel McLish though.

Ray dated mclish, not mike..


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 14, 2017, 05:35:37 AM
Ray dated mclish, not mike..

I didn't say date


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 14, 2017, 05:44:54 AM
Ray dated mclish, not mike..


I didn't say date

I'd say you have a point there, good sir.   ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 14, 2017, 06:00:41 AM
I didn't say date

Nice, haha...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: nukkaready on April 14, 2017, 11:34:40 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on April 14, 2017, 11:36:46 AM
.
cool pic never saw it


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on April 14, 2017, 01:05:09 PM
Here is a side view comparison at the Olympia. Arnold was not standing side on to make himself look better.
He didn't have to do that,it wasn't necessary...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 14, 2017, 02:18:04 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 14, 2017, 02:42:29 PM
Ray dated mclish, not mike..

Ray told me a bit about his romance with Rachel. Said she was into Jesus and that contributed to their breaking up. Ray was a serious guy who didn't suffer fools. He named his daughter Dagny after the heroine in Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 14, 2017, 02:45:32 PM
Ray told me a bit about his romance with Rachel. Said she was into Jesus and that contributed to their breaking up. Ray was a serious guy who didn't suffer fools. He named his daughter Dagny after the heroine in Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand.

Well then.  You can't possibly get any more serious than that!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 14, 2017, 05:17:13 PM
He didn't have to do that,it wasn't necessary...

A man amongst boys, went home and fucked the Tijuana prom queen


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 14, 2017, 09:45:57 PM
(https://www.girlswithmuscle.com/images/full/960225062.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 15, 2017, 02:43:54 AM
imagine Mentzer's arms with Haneys torso  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on April 15, 2017, 03:03:44 AM
.

cool pic never saw it

Me either, thanks for posting.

They look like a muscular Matryoshka (Russia dolls) set!   :D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on April 15, 2017, 03:19:21 AM
imagine Mentzer's arms with Haneys torso  8)

Indeed.  We've all played this game for years, I bet.

Hmm... in fact, your comment has made me want to make a rough cut and paste collage of what I personally consider to be some of the finest bodyparts over the years, and assemble them into the 'perfect' albeit non-existent BB physique.... (though it must have been done on here before at some point I'd have thought...)  Project needs a name though... Frankenweider? 

Victor von Taffin


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Mr Anabolic on April 15, 2017, 04:59:39 AM

Hi Pellius, how are things over there in Hawaii? I still haven't returned there to take some photos and see you can look up Keith's daughter.

The 80 Olympia was interesting mainly because all the top guys except Sergio were there. Paul Graham told me Arnold was entering and so I told

people to help sell more tickets. Our gym sold 200 tickets to that contest. I picked a seat in the middle of the Concert Hall to take photos.

So I saw the contest through my lens. I took heaps of photos of everyone at the judging then took colour slides at night. Arguments can be made

that several of the guys could have won that contest. Arnold, Chris, Frank, Mike, Boyer, Roger, Roy C, and perhaps Danny. What happened was that

too many judges gave 20 out of 20 scores during the rounds and so didn't separate the men. The judges who did separate them had their votes carry

more weight in the end. Things were quite even until Arnold started posing. In the lineups he didn't stand out and you could see he was down. When

he did all those 3/4 turns from front to back to side, etc., the contest was over. See for yourself in the photo below. No one else came close to him

then. Little Danny was perhaps more impressive but no one placed him high.

Many claim that Mike was robbed. Well, they weren't there. Mike was good posing on his own but faded when standing next to Arnold. Boyer did

the best posing round and hid any weak points he had. That is probably why he placed ahead of Mike. Mike looks like the champ in the cover photo.

How on earth didn't he dominate the contest? I think he lost too much size preparing for the show. This could have been because he lost to a smaller

but more refined Zane the year before. Dennis looked great but was let down by his posing. Wide, big and great abs. First place votes were given

to several guys. Many received 20 out of 20 scores in some of the rounds. Silly thing those rounds.

Why some people cannot see this is beyond me.  Mentzer was not robbed... he was small and flat that night.  Arnold beat him easily, fare and square.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 15, 2017, 05:06:34 AM
Me either, thanks for posting.

They look like a muscular Matryoshka (Russia dolls) set!   :D

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=721151;image)

They look like well built men in street clothes.  This opposed to guys like Coleman, Cutler or Phildo looking like stuffed sausages in leftover nomad tents.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 15, 2017, 05:14:38 AM
Ray was hittin McLish? I pictured him being way too nerdy.  :o


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 15, 2017, 05:33:05 AM
imagine Mentzer's arms with Haneys torso  8)

also Mentzer's legs ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 15, 2017, 06:43:22 AM
Mentzer bro.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: _bruce_ on April 15, 2017, 06:48:36 AM
They look like well built men in street clothes.  This opposed to guys like Coleman, Cutler or Phildo looking like stuffed sausages in leftover nomad tents.

 ;D ;D ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 15, 2017, 07:27:23 AM
(http://reps-id.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/mike-mentzer6.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 15, 2017, 07:28:50 AM
(http://www.greatestphysiques.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Mike-Mentzer-girls-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 15, 2017, 07:30:04 AM
(http://www.greatestphysiques.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Mike-Mentzer-heavy-duty.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 15, 2017, 07:35:04 AM
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/mi57.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on April 15, 2017, 09:23:43 AM
They look like well built men in street clothes.  This opposed to guys like Coleman, Cutler or Phildo looking like stuffed sausages in leftover nomad tents.

Whatever can you mean...?  :D

(http://s12.postimg.org/lfzqzt7v1/big-ron-in-suit.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 15, 2017, 02:55:32 PM
Whatever can you mean...?  :D

(http://s12.postimg.org/lfzqzt7v1/big-ron-in-suit.jpg)

Sheeeeit!  Coleman looks like a black Herne!  What a porker!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 15, 2017, 03:01:54 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 15, 2017, 03:03:09 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 15, 2017, 03:07:46 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: HockeyFightFan on April 15, 2017, 03:41:00 PM
:)

Barely bigger than Platz...a career lightheavy


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 16, 2017, 04:35:03 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 16, 2017, 04:38:09 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on April 16, 2017, 05:19:41 PM
Andreas Cahling was/is a tiny person.  Good physique, but tiny.  Not nearly as tiny as Padilla but also not nearly as good.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 16, 2017, 05:35:52 PM
Recently saw Andreas in a movie on Netflix called "Kung Fury". He had a small part in it, the movie is a short 30 min laughable shit fest throwback filled with 1980s nostalgia. Mixed with martial arts,cops, hot prehistoric babes, with Hitler/Nazis.
Lots of video game style action and violence.

(http://tenminuteinterviews.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/andreas-cahling1-940x521.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 16, 2017, 05:40:04 PM
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HqhVNpexEw8/VQKr8e5BQWI/AAAAAAAAGEg/B9bOXWmERYk/s1600/mike-mentzer-forced-reps.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 16, 2017, 05:42:14 PM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/91/77/a4/9177a41236ec66d40c1b03714dbea65a.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Submissionfytr on April 16, 2017, 06:17:23 PM
Probably most ideal physique ever IMO.  Huge, ripped, powerful, just a great build. Many guys after him bigger, more ripped, but they look like death most often.  Mike always looked like he could lift a house, never dieted down, or bloated.  Didn't look at all the pages, but I love the pic that's around of him and his brother in middle of a workout and it looks like Lou Ferrigno interrupted them or something, and they dropped their weights and got up in his face  ;D May not be what that pic is about at all, but I like to think so...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on April 16, 2017, 06:25:22 PM
:)

Lou F seems super interested here.  Who drew that Mentzer representation on his shirt, Steve Cephello?

Why is Casey Viator's Tshirt tied off at the midriff?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Submissionfytr on April 17, 2017, 12:47:13 PM
As a huge Mike Mentzer fan from my teens on, I have read everything I could (all of his books except "Muscles in Minutes), and own his official training dvd from right before he passed, as well as a 2-dvd bootleg of a seminar he gave years ago.  I'd have to say without a doubt he had the biggest influence on me out of any other bodybuilder.  Not that I ever was one myself, aspired to be, or had anywhere near the genetics to win an amateur show with 1 other person it, but whenever in late teens, early 20's I wanted to add muscle or gain some weight, I used Heavy Duty and never failed to get results.  I've also followed Yate's version, with a bit more volume and extra day in the gym, this also was always successful at packing on some weight/muscle.  People who asked earlier in the thread, or wondering in general, IMO these were some of most important things to consider using any version of his training:
-it's not he built great physique w/ volume and "maintained" it w/ heavy duty;he grew out of a plateau w/ it
-his ideas may not all be scientifically valid (his diet info  is major weakness) but work anecdotally
-if was off some aspects (no direct training needed for some parts) his work made people think critically
-his legendary training sessions, stuff of legend, inspired many of us to train to failure
-his writing was very inspirational, and well done; a very reflective, analytical man-too much for some
-he spoke freely about drugs/steroids; this board witch hunts "fake" natties/liars and Mike was open
-in his prime, huge but athletic appearance and one of few that did cardio, in book says would run 5mi. day
-influenced many others who did go on to have higher profiles in BB, like Dorian Yates
-may not be well-known but his principals can be applied to other athletic endeavors such as martial
      arts, boxing, MMA training.  The personally helped me to critically think in terms of training to failure,
      recovery after work outs, the need to some days (hard sparring) to shorten the work out in direct
      relation to the intensity, and especially how the body recovers during rest as a SYSTEM not individual
      parts affected by particular workout (I used to do a boxing workout so hard my shoulders, arms, etc.
      hurt badly and were sore for days, before I thought about Mentzer's ideas and applied them. When I
      did use some of the general principals for martial arts training, I avoided injuries better, recovered
      overall better, was able to sleep by giving nervous system a break, and come back to have more
      or whatever I had done last.
 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 17, 2017, 12:55:03 PM
:)

Mike and Casey, along with Danny Padilla and Lee Priest have/had the greatest genetics for arms IMO.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 17, 2017, 02:11:43 PM
At the 1978 Mr Universe Mike scored a perfect 300. So what? He always mentioned this fact. Perfect score implies perfect physique? What bothers me is that he accepts the judges decisions when he wins but says the contest is fixed when he loses. At the 1980 Olympia he finally had the chance to show everyone this perfect physique. His presentation was excellent but he lost in the comparison rounds. You had to be there to see this for yourself. Imagine his ego after placing 5th? His whole world collapsed after this contest. He smashed his trophy. I guess if you can't accept reality then you have to find ways to deal with it and mental illness is one way people 'cope'. Could he have learned from that defeat and come in bigger and better in 81? If ever there was a contest that was easy to win it was that year. Well, apparently the result was determined long before the contest if we believe stories mentioned in Randy Roach's book about the 80 and 81 Olympias.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on April 17, 2017, 02:58:54 PM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on April 17, 2017, 06:53:50 PM
mentzer was a retard made worse by drug addiction. he was a footnote in bb. He possesed exactly 0 knowledge or secrets other than pro level muscle comes from genes and needles.

dumbass lost his mind loosing clearly to arnold.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on April 18, 2017, 05:21:04 AM
mentzer was a retard made worse by drug addiction. he was a footnote in bb. He possesed exactly 0 knowledge or secrets other than pro level muscle comes from genes and needles.

dumbass lost his mind loosing clearly to arnold.

Actually he will still be talked about in 50 years time.
You on the other hand, will be remembered only by your close relatives, by a span of time of one single generation, if that.

Take care.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 18, 2017, 09:07:28 PM
mentzer was a retard made worse by drug addiction. he was a footnote in bb. He possesed exactly 0 knowledge or secrets other than pro level muscle comes from genes and needles.

dumbass lost his mind loosing clearly to arnold.

If Mike Mentzer is a retard then what does that make all the other bodybuilders out there?

Mike was highly intelligent and wrote like an highly educated person with an excellent vocabulary. You can't fake intelligence.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on April 18, 2017, 09:10:21 PM
If Mike Mentzer is a retard then what does that make all the other bodybuilders out there?

Mike was highly intelligent and wrote like an highly educated person with an excellent vocabulary. You can't fake intelligence.

What's Mike been up to lately?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: WalterWhite on April 18, 2017, 09:21:57 PM
If Mike Mentzer is a retard then what does that make all the other bodybuilders out there?

Mike was highly intelligent and wrote like an highly educated person with an excellent vocabulary. You can't fake intelligence.

I listened to one of his lectures recently and have to agree. I may not agree with all of his positions/assumptions but he spoke like an intelligent professor. The full presentations is excellent.

This is a snippet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHzZ_HAtHa8


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on April 18, 2017, 10:06:10 PM
what was Mentzers ethnic descent? German mostly I guess because of the name.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 18, 2017, 11:01:13 PM
Probably his last interview.

Mike Mentzer's Last Interview | Iron Man Magazine

http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/mike-mentzers-last-interview/


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on April 18, 2017, 11:03:52 PM
If Mike Mentzer is a retard then what does that make all the other bodybuilders out there?

Mike was highly intelligent and wrote like an highly educated person with an excellent vocabulary. You can't fake intelligence.

Vince, you should know by now on this board you get all kinds. There are some comments that are so beyond the pale that it doesn't even merit a written response but rather a head shake and a roll of eyes.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 18, 2017, 11:19:18 PM
Vince, you should know by now on this board you get all kinds. There are some comments that are so beyond the pale that it doesn't even merit a written response but rather a head shake and a roll of eyes.

I agree. The best reply is NO reply. I ignore some comments and even some posters. Nasty people reveal more about themselves than their targets.

Lots of people here who have achieved very little inside or outside the gym.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on April 18, 2017, 11:47:45 PM
If Mike Mentzer is a retard then what does that make all the other bodybuilders out there?

Mike was highly intelligent and wrote like an highly educated person with an excellent vocabulary. You can't fake intelligence.
You sir are living proof of that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: French on April 19, 2017, 12:39:12 AM
 :D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on April 19, 2017, 12:59:07 AM
that last photo is pretty awesome

he was a bit too short for my liking, but an interesting action figure type physique


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 19, 2017, 01:29:07 AM
that last photo is pretty awesome

he was a bit too short for my liking, but an interesting action figure type physique

Mike and Ray both had large heads for their physiques. Ray in particular was quite a huge guy but he doesn't seem that big in photos.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 19, 2017, 01:44:54 AM
Mike and Casey, along with Danny Padilla and Lee Priest have/had the greatest genetics for arms IMO.

casey arms were good mikes were great

some of the best triceps ever


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 19, 2017, 01:49:01 AM
casey arms were good mikes were great

some of the best triceps ever

Here you go.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on April 19, 2017, 01:51:49 AM
what was Mentzers ethnic descent? German mostly I guess because of the name.

Germanic descent, same as Zane and Arnie

us germanic descent fellas are at the top of the top race ie. the white race

we got the bodies and athletic talent of blacks and the brains intellects of the jooooos


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 19, 2017, 04:46:09 AM
I listened to one of his lectures recently and have to agree. I may not agree with all of his positions/assumptions but he spoke like an intelligent professor. The full presentations is excellent.

This is a snippet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHzZ_HAtHa8


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 19, 2017, 04:54:19 AM
Mike was an intelligent speaker, that video is a good example of it. So many bodybuilders speak while half flexing their arms. Looking ridiculous, Mike was able to separate himself from that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Danimal77 on April 19, 2017, 07:09:01 PM
Ray had a great build, more classic looking than Mike but lacking that trademark thickness in spots. Given that the coroner's report found potentially lethal levels of opiates in both brothers blood after their deaths, I believe Ray to have suicided after finding Mike dead.

I found Ray to be thick but just lacking the cuts and vascularity that Mike had in spades.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on April 20, 2017, 05:00:34 AM
When I met Mike Mentzer at Golds Gym, Venice, in 1991 I gave him an article I wrote about the judging of the 1980 Mr Olympia. I asked for the original judges sheets and

got them or copies. So I analysed what happened and wrote a story for IronMan. They wouldn't publish it. I ended up giving the article to Mike at the gym. Of course he

wouldn't be pleased because I didn't think he won the contest. I always wondered if he destroyed it. Part of history gone. In those days everything was typed or hand written.

Today we do everyone digitally and can easily save copies.

Oh, yes, after one contest in Sydney attended by Mike there was a seminar where we could ask questions. Mike was on the panel of experts. People asked the usual

stuff and then I asked about hypertrophy. Mike got a laugh when he said to me, "So you can't make your muscles grow?" Of something like that. So I had to explain

that I was asking a theoretical question about hypertrophy. I can't remember the response Mike gave.

I wanted to debate Mike online but he didn't post on forums that I know of. He died when he was 49 in 2001. Ray died two days later at 47. Both gone way too soon.

In the photo at my place I was showing Ray the muscle between the thumb and index finger. Mine was larger than his and might be why I can pinch grip more than most people.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Thespritz0 on April 20, 2017, 07:49:25 AM
that last photo is pretty awesome

he was a bit too short for my liking, but an interesting action figure type physique
^^
He was 5'8", that's not too short... Franco Columbu was short (or Lee Priest!!)...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Keto Kid on April 20, 2017, 09:21:35 AM
Did Mike ever talk about anabolics? Wonder what kind of cycles he used.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 20, 2017, 09:37:50 AM
Mike and Dorian


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on April 20, 2017, 09:44:29 AM
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/91/77/a4/9177a41236ec66d40c1b03714dbea65a.jpg)

OK, so what the actual F is that?  I presume it's a one-off by a Mentzer fan..?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: _bruce_ on April 20, 2017, 10:12:42 AM
When I met Mike Mentzer at Golds Gym, Venice, in 1991 I gave him an article I wrote about the judging of the 1980 Mr Olympia. I asked for the original judges sheets and

got them or copies. So I analysed what happened and wrote a story for IronMan. They wouldn't publish it. I ended up giving the article to Mike at the gym. Of course he

wouldn't be pleased because I didn't think he won the contest. I always wondered if he destroyed it. Part of history gone. In those days everything was typed or hand written.

Today we do everyone digitally and can easily save copies.

Oh, yes, after one contest in Sydney attended by Mike there was a seminar where we could ask questions. Mike was on the panel of experts. People asked the usual

stuff and then I asked about hypertrophy. Mike got a laugh when he said to me, "So you can't make your muscles grow?" Of something like that. So I had to explain

that I was asking a theoretical question about hypertrophy. I can't remember the response Mike gave.

I wanted to debate Mike online but he didn't post on forums that I know of. He died when he was 49 in 2001. Ray died two days later at 47. Both gone way too soon.

In the photo at my place I was showing Ray the muscle between the thumb and index finger. Mine was larger than his and might be why I can pinch grip more than most people.

Pretty cool that you met them in person.
Gifted and enhanced bodybuilders make anybody look small and useless... as the floatsam would say.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on April 20, 2017, 12:10:49 PM
^^
He was 5'8", that's not too short... Franco Columbu was short (or Lee Priest!!)...

5'8 is average height, he looked in proportion.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 20, 2017, 04:02:01 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on April 20, 2017, 04:05:51 PM
I am sure mike felt real "intelligent" when he was cracked out running naked in the streets of santa monica.

fuck off with your continued bullshit about chestless wonder mentzer and get back to begging for blue stars


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ARNIE1947 on April 20, 2017, 07:06:28 PM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ARNIE1947 on April 20, 2017, 07:08:21 PM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 21, 2017, 03:25:51 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 21, 2017, 04:45:35 AM
5th place at the 80 Olympia. "That's bullshit" I think he said after that.  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on April 21, 2017, 05:50:58 AM
I am sure mike felt real "intelligent" when he was cracked out running naked in the streets of santa monica.

fuck off with your continued bullshit about chestless wonder mentzer and get back to begging for blue stars

Stupidest post ever. Yes, I said stupidest.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on April 21, 2017, 09:55:24 AM
The thighs and calves in some of the last pics are just insane... thighs not as good as Platz's became, but legs were very balanced and kinda freaky..


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on April 21, 2017, 11:58:01 AM
The thighs and calves in some of the last pics are just insane... thighs not as good as Platz's became, but legs were very balanced and kinda freaky..

Bit like Dorian, you see the thickness from the side.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 22, 2017, 11:43:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 22, 2017, 02:26:15 PM
5th place at the 80 Olympia. "That's bullshit" I think he said after that.  ;D
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=722450;image)


rodger looks like a serial killer in that pic


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 22, 2017, 02:47:07 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on April 22, 2017, 08:12:44 PM
5th place at the 80 Olympia. "That's bullshit" I think he said after that.  ;D

Pretty sure Mike smashed his plastic trophy and threw it in the trash. It never left Australia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on April 22, 2017, 08:17:50 PM
Pretty sure Mike smashed his plastic trophy and threw it in the trash. It never left Australia.

Mentzer = 0 ability to cope. Totally lacking the mental fortitude he so admired in John Galt and Howard Roark.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Kwon on April 22, 2017, 08:26:11 PM
I am sure mike felt real "intelligent" when he was cracked out running naked in the streets of santa monica.

fuck off with your continued bullshit about chestless wonder mentzer and get back to begging for blue stars

I don't know how or why, so many men just "take it" .
Why do so many men allow a woman to pressure them into doing things they don't want?
From having kids to taking jobs they hate, I've seen plenty of men just going along with her. WTF?

At my wife's Christmas office party I met a real pathetic character.
He was a CPA with a decent income and worked out.
After a few drinks he confessed he hated his marriage and his 12 yr old son was a spoiled brat.
In fact,  he last had sex with his wife 7 years ago and they slept in separate rooms.
Why he stayed married was a real mystery to me.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 22, 2017, 09:20:24 PM
Pretty sure Mike smashed his plastic trophy and threw it in the trash. It never left Australia.

Zane did that from what I read, In his room.. after  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Thespritz0 on April 23, 2017, 03:04:28 AM
rodger looks like a serial killer in that pic
^^
I read years ago where he was as mad as fuck after that contest, he'd worked out with INSANE poundages all year and
came in conditioned, to have that corruption in the judging...
IMHO 1981 was worse, Franco was terrible!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on April 23, 2017, 04:33:05 AM
I don't know how or why, so many men just "take it" .
Why do so many men allow a woman to pressure them into doing things they don't want?
From having kids to taking jobs they hate, I've seen plenty of men just going along with her. WTF?

At my wife's Christmas office party I met a real pathetic character.
He was a CPA with a decent income and worked out.
After a few drinks he confessed he hated his marriage and his 12 yr old son was a spoiled brat.
In fact,  he last had sex with his wife 7 years ago and they slept in separate rooms.
Why he stayed married was a real mystery to me.


hey kwon you have a very good point there, ill give you another scenario for you my dads second wife , had a severe mental illness he had two kids with her, he stayed married to her for several years because of how men always get fucked in divorces.

finally he couldnt take it anymore and divorced her, poor bastard had to pay child and spousal suppport for awhile. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 28, 2017, 01:25:09 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 28, 2017, 01:26:41 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 28, 2017, 11:26:00 PM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on April 29, 2017, 02:30:39 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=723688)
 8)
this is the picture that made me want to bodybuild when I was a kid


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 29, 2017, 11:48:59 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 30, 2017, 07:15:50 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 30, 2017, 08:11:47 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: kepler2008 on April 30, 2017, 11:50:55 AM
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/tSQ6zUCscw0/maxresdefault.jpg)
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/d0/8f/77/d08f7749651c1d9c91507a80163bc99d.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: kepler2008 on April 30, 2017, 11:55:44 AM
(http://fitnessvolt.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Mike-Mentzer-Mr.-Heavy-Duty-20.jpg)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=31152.0;attach=282892)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on April 30, 2017, 11:58:40 AM
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/tSQ6zUCscw0/maxresdefault.jpg)
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/d0/8f/77/d08f7749651c1d9c91507a80163bc99d.jpg)

looks good


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on April 30, 2017, 12:57:49 PM
looks good

Top pic I can see how anyone would be high on themselves. Bottom pic, you can see the lacking chest.

Mike was a smart guy. I think the real reason he quit was because he knew he lost. He knew he didn't have it to be Mr Olympia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on April 30, 2017, 05:16:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 30, 2017, 10:33:08 PM
Sometimes Mike impresses more in those semi-relaxed shots.. with that powerful look


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on April 30, 2017, 10:42:14 PM
One of his favorite pose


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jwb on May 01, 2017, 01:39:09 AM
Mike was way better in 1976, 1977 and 1978 than he was in 1979 and 1980.

He was a shadow of his 1978 form in 1980.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 01, 2017, 03:30:04 AM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: karasan on May 01, 2017, 09:16:15 AM
If there would be no video images and only still pictures of Golden Age Bb'ers I would rank Mentzer a close second after Sergio...
His posing is so dramatic, those crazy forearms, triceps, cannonball delts and nice biceps, perfect waist...
Extended arm poses, vacuums, arms above head poses...
What is even more funny is, both Sergio's and Mentzer's posing seems flawless and dramatic in magazine pictures, but it was quite the contrary...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on May 01, 2017, 10:04:24 AM
Perfect waist? He had notoriously wide hips, plus a weak chest. Disappears on some shots posted on the last page. Great bber but far from perfect


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Henda on May 01, 2017, 12:28:30 PM
Had the same stupid tash and haircut forever, great physique in some shots but looked like he was an absolute jerk


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 01, 2017, 03:40:04 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Thespritz0 on May 01, 2017, 07:31:51 PM
Had the same stupid tash and haircut forever, great physique in some shots but looked like he was an absolute jerk
^^
I don't know how old you are, but that was the style back then look at the group photos, there are many over 1/2 of the guys had those moustaches...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 02, 2017, 06:44:20 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 02, 2017, 07:27:29 AM
1979 MO


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 02, 2017, 07:32:30 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 02, 2017, 07:45:17 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 02, 2017, 02:52:26 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on May 03, 2017, 12:00:44 AM
Perfect waist? He had notoriously wide hips, plus a weak chest. Disappears on some shots posted on the last page. Great bber but far from perfect

I was in my late teens early twenties when Mentzer was in his prime and the biggest thing during that time. He was the most influential bber to me and I followed and read every article about him and every article he wrote. As with all bbers, there were criticisms regarding his physique. A lot having to do with him taking first place in the heavyweight division at the 79 Olympia but losing the overall to Zane. The criticism mostly focused on the need to improved his conditioning and allowing his gut to sag more than once during the show.  A sagging gut is something everybody has when you let yourself relax. Arnold was especially good at always sucking it in. But look at some of the guys standing in the background. Waller and even Padilla had a bit of a pouch.

Anyway, never had it ever been mentioned that he had a wide waist during that time. Never. That was never an issue during his era when he actually competed. That came decades later and I don't know how it caught on. Just look at him straight on. Sure he didn't have a tinny tiny waist like Buchannan or that extreme taper like Olivia. But a wide waist? No way, you can pull a vacuum with a wide waist. Arnold had a wide waist. Tinnerino had a wide waist. Roger Walker, Ken Waller and Franco's waist was no more narrower than Mentzer.

Even his chest wasn't criticized as being sorely lacking. Mentzer at the time was considered almost perfectly proportioned. But someone along the way made the wide waist crack and it caught on and everybody just falls in line parroting someone else.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on May 03, 2017, 03:22:51 AM
I was in my late teens early twenties when Mentzer was in his prime and the biggest thing during that time. He was the most influential bber to me and I followed and read every article about him and every article he wrote. As with all bbers, there were criticisms regarding his physique. A lot having to do with him taking first place in the heavyweight division at the 79 Olympia but losing the overall to Zane. The criticism mostly focused on the need to improved his conditioning and allowing his gut to sag more than once during the show.  A sagging gut is something everybody has when you let yourself relax. Arnold was especially good at always sucking it in. But look at some of the guys standing in the background. Waller and even Padilla had a bit of a pouch.

Anyway, never had it ever been mentioned that he had a wide waist during that time. Never. That was never an issue during his era when he actually competed. That came decades later and I don't know how it caught on. Just look at him straight on. Sure he didn't have a tinny tiny waist like Buchannan or that extreme taper like Olivia. But a wide waist? No way, you can pull a vacuum with a wide waist. Arnold had a wide waist. Tinnerino had a wide waist. Roger Walker, Ken Waller and Franco's waist was no more narrower than Mentzer.

Even his chest wasn't criticized as being sorely lacking. Mentzer at the time was considered almost perfectly proportioned. But someone along the way made the wide waist crack and it caught on and everybody just falls in line parroting someone else.



I said wide hips. His waist itself is actually fine, but the disparity between that and the hips is/was the knock on him, specifically.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 03, 2017, 08:55:02 PM
The problem is that the form of abdominals not help him too. Same for Coleman.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: kepler2008 on May 04, 2017, 11:57:04 AM
In those ancient times, drugs showed very positive effects on those long and sharpened quadriceps.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/1e/cc/81/1ecc81e156f96f5697b3501e898981d1.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 04, 2017, 02:19:33 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The_Iron_Disciple on May 04, 2017, 02:53:57 PM
In those ancient times, drugs showed very positive effects on those long and sharpened quadriceps.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/1e/cc/81/1ecc81e156f96f5697b3501e898981d1.jpg)


Perfection.

A damn shame Mike never won the Olympia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NaturalWonder83 on May 04, 2017, 03:52:50 PM

Perfection.

A damn shame Mike never won the Olympia.
agreed


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on May 04, 2017, 04:22:02 PM

Perfection.

A damn shame Mike never won the Olympia.



In that picture he does look damn good
Big full balanced
Probably one the best pics of him.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on May 04, 2017, 05:45:46 PM

Perfection.

A damn shame Mike never won the Olympia.

Mike and Robby Robinson lost to Frank Zane. Both must have wondered what the judges were looking for. All those years trying to get huge and they lost to a smaller guy.

Mike and Ray both had somewhat large heads and this detracted from seeing how big they actually were. Compare with Sergio to see what I mean.

Mike lost to Zane partly because of 'conditioning' and he wasn't going to let that happen again. Perhaps he lost too much size trying to get really ripped? When Mike posed

at the 80 Olympia he looked great on his own. But in the comparisons he didn't look like the winner. Once Arnold started posing his arms and chest the contest was over.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on May 04, 2017, 06:07:55 PM


In that picture he does look damn good
Big full balanced
Probably one the best pics of him.

Yep, too bad that build was not at the 1980 Mr O. Arnold would have still one because it was rigged for him to. Yet had mike brought that physique that year all of his arguments following would have made more sense.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jwb on May 05, 2017, 12:05:43 AM
In those ancient times, drugs showed very positive effects on those long and sharpened quadriceps.

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/1e/cc/81/1ecc81e156f96f5697b3501e898981d1.jpg)
1977 he was THICK that year


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on May 05, 2017, 12:55:00 AM
I said wide hips. His waist itself is actually fine, but the disparity between that and the hips is/was the knock on him, specifically.

Not trying to make this a pissing match as you are a real bb fan and contribute greatly to this board but I'm not sure I'm following. To me, for a man, wide hips/wide waist are synonymous. If you have one you  have the other. It's not like women who have hour glass figure where they can enormous butts but tiny waists.

Could you please post a pic of Mike where you think clearly illustrates his wide hips. Ideally a comparison shot between the champs of the day (Zane, Coe, Arnold, Waller, Franco, Corney, Walker, Wilcoz...)


Title: Re: Mentzer
Post by: daron_e on May 05, 2017, 06:10:40 AM
Well, that's because people are making my point with the continued posting of B&W photos.

Mentzer was an aloof know-it-all who pushed his Heavy Duty methods to make money off gullible kids.

Of course he never mentioned that HD only worked when you were juiced to the eyeballs.

The guy had the most fragile psyche of all time. He lost one show and it drove him to insanity and then the grave because he couldn't accept someone else was superior to him.
HD has been all I have done for almost 20 years. If it didn't work for u..u didn't do it right or hard enough.. period


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: daron_e on May 05, 2017, 06:53:36 AM
I saw a video awhile back of the 1980 Olympia. Arnold at 80% looked better than anyone there. Dickerson looked carved out of ice. I completely accept Arnold one and Dickerson two.  If anyone should complain about placing it should be Callender.
Arnold had no legs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 05, 2017, 11:11:45 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on May 05, 2017, 12:04:04 PM
Love this pic because of a massive Robby in the background.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on May 05, 2017, 01:30:02 PM
1977 he was THICK that year

hard to believe that he was ttraining full body 3 times a week at the time  :o


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 05, 2017, 10:36:04 PM
.........


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on May 06, 2017, 08:51:34 AM
.........

In the bottom pic mike looks smooth / narrow & a belly.

Just goes to prove a picture taken at wrong or right moment
Can make all the difference to how we judge someone's physique.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 08, 2017, 03:31:14 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 08, 2017, 06:00:17 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on May 08, 2017, 10:41:41 PM
 When it is all said and done those titles don't mean that much. Mike and Ray had great physiques and Mike was an excellent writer. His memory will outlive any titles he did or did not win.

Before 1970 the NABBA Mr Universe title was the biggest title you could win. What a shame Joe came up with the Mr Olympia name because that doesn't sound as important as Mr Universe.

All the guys who won big titles in the past are mostly forgotten. Steve Reeves is one of few who became a legend.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on May 09, 2017, 02:52:10 AM
Also the 1971 NABBA Universe was the contest of the year..1971 IFBB Mr Olympia being a joke


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on May 11, 2017, 10:04:11 AM
i gotta defend mike here. he did not drink his own urine!!!!  dan duchaine started that rumor cuz mike had to carry around this jug to piss in for 24 hours to check his kidneys. he had to piss in every time. he couldnt leave it at home. duchaine loved controversy. he was the "howard stern" of bodybuilding. lol. yes mike had mental issues lots of them. but also he and his brother ray  were not lovers either!! another duchaine story!!  dan and mike never really got along. mike didnt really get along with to many . he thought he was "better" than most.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on May 11, 2017, 11:49:07 AM
i gotta defend mike here. he did not drink his own urine!!!!  dan duchaine started that rumor cuz mike had to carry around this jug to piss in for 24 hours to check his kidneys. he had to piss in every time. he couldnt leave it at home. duchaine loved controversy. he was the "howard stern" of bodybuilding. lol. yes mike had mental issues lots of them. but also he and his brother ray  were not lovers either!! another duchaine story!!  dan and mike never really got along. mike didnt really get along with to many . he thought he was "better" than most.

What about running through the streets naked and claiming art Jones was God also believing Arnold was orchestrating a conspiracy to destroy him?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on May 11, 2017, 12:54:20 PM
i gotta defend mike here. he did not drink his own urine!!!!  dan duchaine started that rumor cuz mike had to carry around this jug to piss in for 24 hours to check his kidneys. he had to piss in every time. he couldnt leave it at home. duchaine loved controversy. he was the "howard stern" of bodybuilding. lol. yes mike had mental issues lots of them. but also he and his brother ray  were not lovers either!! another duchaine story!!  dan and mike never really got along. mike didnt really get along with to many . he thought he was "better" than most.

he was better than most

FYI,  that's a narcissist way of life

they truly do believe that they are better than most and in many cases they are correct  ;)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on May 11, 2017, 02:57:11 PM
like i said he did have alot of mental issues but drinking his own urine and having sex with his brother wasnt on the list!! yes he was naked in the streets when he was whacked out on meth. he didnt run thru the streets proclaiming arthur jones is god. he did that at golds gym. he would just stick his head inside and yell "arthur jones is god" . lol.  for no good reason. thats one of the reasons he got banned from golds.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 14, 2017, 07:59:23 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on May 14, 2017, 08:08:42 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=726271;image)

:)

That right there is proof that even if HIT doesn't work, drugs do.  So HIT works on drugs.  Really well, too.    ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on May 14, 2017, 02:28:03 PM
good stuff. motivation thread here.

his legs dont do it for me tho - but he is a unique cat with a crazy awesome body


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 14, 2017, 04:47:16 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 14, 2017, 04:50:36 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on May 15, 2017, 04:29:21 AM
Great arms he built.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on May 15, 2017, 04:34:57 AM
^^^ and tthose arms were only a tad over 18 inches


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Ronnie Rep on May 15, 2017, 06:08:20 AM
^^^ and tthose arms were only a tad over 18 inches
i saw him up close about 3 times. His arms were definitely closer to 19" than 18".


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on May 15, 2017, 06:18:21 AM
(http://www.ambal.ru/62676302931.jpg)
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-IyCXZgLGCM8/VTlJwc3hhsI/AAAAAAAAGoc/kTbGVm--0-I/s1600/504c7a9b04c4cf07e4d87df13a03bc0b.jpg)
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSIMaLbdu_lI5EIgtIiAM4pFvwHaIBGVwUTGDwxR4vhvs2i-WwI)
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-HqhVNpexEw8/VQKr8e5BQWI/AAAAAAAAGEg/B9bOXWmERYk/s1600/mike-mentzer-forced-reps.jpg)
(http://www.pharmasports.de/pharmasports/images/Mike_Ray_Mentzer_Bodybuilding.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on May 15, 2017, 07:40:37 AM
(https://www.mikementzer.com/images/mikebystevefrance.jpg)
(https://68.media.tumblr.com/c09969eea4593647bf3beb00af4e2212/tumblr_o3cd57wVex1uvyc5ao1_1280.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: njflex on May 16, 2017, 05:28:28 AM
stocky thickness...cool build...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 16, 2017, 06:34:34 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 16, 2017, 01:56:58 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: daron_e on May 16, 2017, 05:06:45 PM
good stuff. motivation thread here.

his legs dont do it for me tho - but he is a unique cat with a crazy awesome body
well.. Arnold beat him...with no legs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on May 17, 2017, 03:02:30 AM
well.. Arnold beat him...with no legs.

Arnold's legs weren't that bad. As I've said before, Mentzer overdieted and came in too small. He was better in the preceding years.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on May 17, 2017, 03:06:22 AM
Here's an example. Mike's chest had no pop, and his trademark thickness wasn't there because he came in too light.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 17, 2017, 02:03:32 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 26, 2017, 05:51:36 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on May 26, 2017, 05:54:11 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on May 27, 2017, 03:00:36 PM
Here's an example. Mike's chest had no pop, and his trademark thickness wasn't there because he came in too light.

yep, "so ludicrous was the decision".

(https://s3.postimg.org/l0csha9mb/Zmike-mentzer-arnold-schwarzenegger-e14241171938.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on May 27, 2017, 07:27:13 PM
I love bodybuilders in hotel pics the best -  ;D even better when on bed and multiple me  ;D  haha jk


when i was younger i remember reading his HIT stuff, and it seemed so simple it was confusing to me. i never could grasp WTF (17-20 ish) so I never gave it a fair shake. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Desolate on May 27, 2017, 10:25:24 PM
I was a fan.

I still am.

But Mentzer had a number of weaknesses.

Legs too short.
Torso too long.
Head too big - literally.

This throws off his proportions big time.

He just can't compete with guys who have better genetic structures.

Even with more size, it just exaggerates the weaknesses.

The whole look reminds me of Platz and Gaspari.

The three are very similar.




Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 10, 2017, 05:47:29 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 10, 2017, 05:48:43 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on June 10, 2017, 08:20:38 PM
:)

You seem to be able to find the rarest of pictures. I've never seen these or the last ones either, cool


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: 6 Reps on June 10, 2017, 08:52:10 PM
He passed away 16 years ago today, June 10, 2001.  PIP.  I think he was only about 50 years old.  Here is the first part of the allegedly first article about his high intensity low set training, from 1976:


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: 6 Reps on June 10, 2017, 08:55:39 PM
Second part of the above article:


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 10, 2017, 11:01:57 PM
I was a fan.

I still am.

But Mentzer had a number of weaknesses.

Legs too short.
Torso too long.
Head too big - literally.

This throws off his proportions big time.

He just can't compete with guys who have better genetic structures.

Even with more size, it just exaggerates the weaknesses.

The whole look reminds me of Platz and Gaspari.

The three are very similar.




Amazing how people can have such different perspectives. I thought he was near perfectly proportioned.

Too have so many weaknesses presented here yet still being one of the most popular and in the top five bbers in his era as well as one of the most influential despite such a short professional career.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 11, 2017, 04:20:05 AM
hey 6 reps, thanks for that article Bro

cool beans 8)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on June 11, 2017, 05:29:22 PM
He passed away 16 years ago today, June 10, 2001.  PIP.  I think he was only about 50 years old.  Here is the first part of the allegedly first article about his high intensity low set training, from 1976:

He was ahead of the curve, that's for sure. His preaching of training to failure as the driver for muscle growth has been verified in a number of studies at McMaster University. Where Mentzer was off a bit was his notion that one set to failure was enough. Research by the same group at McMaster, as well as others, has shown that 2-3 sets to failure cause even greater growth.

http://www.cbass.com/Volumetraining.htm (http://www.cbass.com/Volumetraining.htm)

But all in all, Mentzer definitely was one of the  leaders at the time in scientific bodybuilding.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dokey111 on June 11, 2017, 05:46:58 PM
Mentzer had really great genetics and he took drugs.  And he trained hard. What else do you want to know


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 12, 2017, 01:16:27 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 12, 2017, 01:21:02 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 12, 2017, 07:51:04 PM

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-IyCXZgLGCM8/VTlJwc3hhsI/AAAAAAAAGoc/kTbGVm--0-I/s1600/504c7a9b04c4cf07e4d87df13a03bc0b.jpg)

That's Roger Callard.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on June 13, 2017, 12:45:53 AM
Sorry. Men with moustache all look the same.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 13, 2017, 12:59:13 PM
mentzer trained like everyone else did to get his size. maintaining it he did heavy duty but not one set per bodypart. he pyramided up like everyone else but only counted the last set as the only set.  he found a niche that people would believe and buy into it. what the mags said was bull but kinda true too. saying arnold did 2 hours or more each day for 6 days etc was kinda true but ONLY before contest time. rest of the time was 45 min to and hour 3-4 days a week. same as everyone did from my time. mentzers system sounds good on paper and DOES  work a little bit as will any new training system. but you get used to it and with his ( as he wanted people to do it) you burned out way to quickly. good for an occasional workout when time is limited. yes he had great genetics. yes he used alot of drugs yes he used street drugs and smoked. everyone back then had mail order courses and t shirts to make money. mentzer had a great idea and no one else was selling it. case closed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 13, 2017, 01:10:42 PM
mentzer trained like everyone else did to get his size. maintaining it he did heavy duty but not one set per bodypart. he pyramided up like everyone else but only counted the last set as the only set.  he found a niche that people would believe and buy into it. what the mags said was bull but kinda true too. saying arnold did 2 hours or more each day for 6 days etc was kinda true but ONLY before contest time. rest of the time was 45 min to and hour 3-4 days a week. same as everyone did from my time. mentzers system sounds good on paper and DOES  work a little bit as will any new training system. but you get used to it and with his ( as he wanted people to do it) you burned out way to quickly. good for an occasional workout when time is limited. yes he had great genetics. yes he used alot of drugs yes he used street drugs and smoked. everyone back then had mail order courses and t shirts to make money. mentzer had a great idea and no one else was selling it. case closed.

You know all this how? Did you personally watch Mike train or even train with him like MaxRep did? You were able to keep track and witness Arnold's training routine of 3-4 days a week 45min to an hour?

You seem to lack a basic understanding of Mentzer's/Jone's training theory as recovery was one of the hallmarks of their protocols which were spaced out to avoid being "burnt out" (over training).  You are far more likely to "burn out" training six days a week two hours a day than Casey's 3 days a week 25 minutes workout during the Colorado experiment.

It should also be noted that one of the reasons he went to Arthur Jones was to due to his lack of progress with conventional training and it was only after meeting Viator and Jones and spending time with them that you can see the progress he made. Progress he documented and spoke extensively about. Many also have noted how Sergio Oliva was at his best after going to Florida and training under the tutelage of Jones using his equipment and protocol.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 13, 2017, 01:37:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 13, 2017, 01:46:06 PM
you can train more frequently with lower volume

in that article posted by 6 reps he was training arms 3 days a week with 5 hard sets for bis and tris

I just can't bbelieve that anyone made any real progress ttraining once a week as he prescribed at his final days 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tha Grim Lifter on June 13, 2017, 06:27:02 PM
You know all this how? Did you personally watch Mike train or even train with him like MaxRep did? You were able to keep track and witness Arnold's training routine of 3-4 days a week 45min to an hour?

You seem to lack a basic understanding of Mentzer's/Jone's training theory as recovery was one of the hallmarks of their protocols which were spaced out to avoid being "burnt out" (over training).  You are far more likely to "burn out" training six days a week two hours a day than Casey's 3 days a week 25 minutes workout during the Colorado experiment.

It should also be noted that one of the reasons he went to Arthur Jones was to due to his lack of progress with conventional training and it was only after meeting Viator and Jones and spending time with them that you can see the progress he made. Progress he documented and spoke extensively about. Many also have noted how Sergio Oliva was at his best after going to Florida and training under the tutelage of Jones using his equipment and protocol.

100% true. Although you will burn out over time regardless.

I found it interesting to read that Vince Gironda's trainers all seemed to burn out after 3 weeks of 3 workouts a week and needed a week off as that seems to be when the nervous system needs a rest.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 14, 2017, 11:48:15 AM
yes recovery is important very important. again you guys are just repeating what is printed in the magazines  they lie. they sell magazines. they have to have something more interesting each month. yes i did speak with mike a few times. more so his brother ray. did you know that casey viater used to sneak in workouts with free weights during his colorado experiment? did you know he was using steroids? ( even though arthur swore he wasnt) and did you know that sergio did look great after spending time with arthur in florida but not due to just the workouts and recovery. he finally got serious about it. he could grow using bricks and wood for weights. he never ate right he was genetically gifted. and no you cant "grow" training once a week. mike was lost mentally. he assumed if you got stronger you got bigger. and thats not true. his "students" ( he didnt have very many) simply got a rep or two more because they learned the machine and technique . but mike was trying to say they got stronger thus bigger on every workout.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 14, 2017, 12:14:09 PM
^^^ yep, you're right

they did get stronger and they did gain weight but I'm willing to bet that weight gain was fat and not muscle

so thier deads and dips did go up and they did gain weight but not muscle

3 times a week can work well, but not once a week or less


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 14, 2017, 12:15:58 PM
^^^ yep, you're right

they did get stronger and they did gain weight but I'm willing to bet that weight gain was fat and not muscle

so thier deads and dips did go up and they did gain weight but not muscle

3 times a week can work well, but not once a week or less
and your 13lb weight gain wasnt muscle either so whats you point?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 14, 2017, 12:59:31 PM
and your 13lb weight gain wasnt muscle either so whats you point?

well no shit it wasn't all muscle but I bet a good 3 or 4 pounds of it was

as I said before, my upper back is noticeably wider now  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 14, 2017, 01:07:35 PM
well no shit it wasn't all muscle but I bet a good 3 or 4 pounds of it was

as I said before, my upper back is noticeably wider now  8)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y161/SSkoal/RL/Back2.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 14, 2017, 01:08:41 PM
^^^ nice try chief

I'll see if I can get someone else to take the update back pics

had a short chat with a Greek girl at my gym,  but don't think she'd be able to sneak into the men's locker room with me

maybe I can get the tall Spanish fella that i see from time to time to take the shots

he's a ppretty cool hombre


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 14, 2017, 01:09:23 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 14, 2017, 01:10:33 PM
^^^ nice try chief

I'll see if I can get someone else to take the update back pics

had a short chat with a Greek girl at my gym,  but don't think she'd be able to sneak into the men's locker room with me

maybe I can get the tall Spanish fella that i see from time to time to take the shots

he's a ppretty cool hombre

creepy gimmick...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Waller on June 14, 2017, 01:11:11 PM
^^^ nice try chief

I'll see if I can get someone else to take the update back pics

had a short chat with a Greek girl at my gym,  but don't think she'd be able to sneak into the men's locker room with me

maybe I can get the tall Spanish fella that i see from time to time to take the shots

he's a ppretty cool hombre

Set the camera timer, lean your phone against something, pose and wait. You don't need anyone else to take a picture for you.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Megalodon on June 14, 2017, 01:15:31 PM
That's Roger Callard.

A google search for Roger Callard can't even cut Callard a break :P


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 14, 2017, 01:16:38 PM
Set the camera timer, lean your phone against something, pose and wait. You don't need anyone else to take a picture for you.
gimmicks cant take photos of long gone members...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 14, 2017, 01:47:58 PM
Set the camera timer, lean your phone against something, pose and wait. You don't need anyone else to take a picture for you.

kinda hard to get the same angle as the before pic following your advices

it's best to get the same angle and distance to get a fair assessment of before and after

I've gained 13 lbs and my ppull downs are up 50 lbs for reps.and deads are up 35 lbs for reps

 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on June 14, 2017, 01:58:24 PM
mentzer trained like everyone else did to get his size. maintaining it he did heavy duty but not one set per bodypart. he pyramided up like everyone else but only counted the last set as the only set.  he found a niche that people would believe and buy into it. what the mags said was bull but kinda true too. saying arnold did 2 hours or more each day for 6 days etc was kinda true but ONLY before contest time. rest of the time was 45 min to and hour 3-4 days a week. same as everyone did from my time. mentzers system sounds good on paper and DOES  work a little bit as will any new training system. but you get used to it and with his ( as he wanted people to do it) you burned out way to quickly. good for an occasional workout when time is limited. yes he had great genetics. yes he used alot of drugs yes he used street drugs and smoked. everyone back then had mail order courses and t shirts to make money. mentzer had a great idea and no one else was selling it. case closed.

I agree with this . . . I've sent Ric Drasin an email to see what he had seen.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 14, 2017, 06:50:53 PM
I agree with this . . . I've sent Ric Drasin an email to see what he had seen.

J

Ewwwww...What Drasin has seen must not be seen. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 15, 2017, 12:05:01 AM
yes recovery is important very important. again you guys are just repeating what is printed in the magazines  they lie. they sell magazines. they have to have something more interesting each month. yes i did speak with mike a few times. more so his brother ray. did you know that casey viater used to sneak in workouts with free weights during his colorado experiment? did you know he was using steroids? ( even though arthur swore he wasnt) and did you know that sergio did look great after spending time with arthur in florida but not due to just the workouts and recovery. he finally got serious about it. he could grow using bricks and wood for weights. he never ate right he was genetically gifted. and no you cant "grow" training once a week. mike was lost mentally. he assumed if you got stronger you got bigger. and thats not true. his "students" ( he didnt have very many) simply got a rep or two more because they learned the machine and technique . but mike was trying to say they got stronger thus bigger on every workout.

Absolute bull shit! Do you have any evidence whatsoever to support this claim? Jones keep very close tabs on Casey and there was no incentive for Casey whatsoever to do extra workouts. What did he care if Jones' theories, protocol, and equipment was the holy grail? He didn't even liked Jones.

And LOL at Sergio only got serious when he was with Jones.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 12:26:55 PM
The ever honorable Pellius is correct :). All that shit about Casey sneaking in extra workouts was a rumor, nothing more.  While I'm certain Jones was wrong on the "no steroids!" count, drugs could not have played THAT big of a role in his quick progress; even if he was taking grams per week from the start, the stuff wouldn't blow him up like that in the first week or so, and that was when he gained at the quickest rate.

No... The Colorado Experiment is testament to a HUGE rebound by so-called muscle memory, facilitated by tons of food and hitting each bodypart hard with a high frequency.  Quite simple, really.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 12:58:35 PM
mentzer trained like everyone else did to get his size. maintaining it he did heavy duty but not one set per bodypart. he pyramided up like everyone else but only counted the last set as the only set.

Partially correct, my good man.  

But not quite :D

Mentzer built his base working with two of his dad's buddies, a pair of powerlifters, when he started training in their garage gym.  He was only 12 at the outset, iirc.  

Anyhow -- and as related by Mike personally to my ears -- he and his two mentors lifted no more than four times a week, and usually three.  They most certainly did NOT do volume training.  Mike said they were interested in getting stronger and little else which, to them, required they maybe do a handful of hard sets per muscle group, usually centered around the big three.  By the time Mike was 15, he could flat bench 350 and "squat 500 for a few reps," or so he said.  (Yes, Fortress, I'm sure you'll dispute that ;). Fwiw, I agree his reps probably didn't reach depth ... then again, so fucking what?  He was a drug-free teenager training in an early powerlifting style regimen.)

Point being, NO, he didn't "build his base with volume" and/or only "maintain" that with his brand of HIT.  He DID go off the deep end late in life, but it's frankly stupid to submit to some lame dichotomy that holds Mentzer's input to either this OR that extreme :/


Quote
  he found a niche that people would believe and buy into it. what the mags said was bull but kinda true too. saying arnold did 2 hours or more each day for 6 days etc was kinda true but ONLY before contest time. rest of the time was 45 min to and hour 3-4 days a week. same as everyone did from my time. mentzers system sounds good on paper and DOES  work a little bit as will any new training system. but you get used to it and with his ( as he wanted people to do it) you burned out way to quickly. good for an occasional workout when time is limited. yes he had great genetics. yes he used alot of drugs yes he used street drugs and smoked. everyone back then had mail order courses and t shirts to make money. mentzer had a great idea and no one else was selling it. case closed.

Again, yes and no.

If Mike developed Heavy Duty and ultra-infrequent training as a pure marketing gimmick to get more clients, wouldn't he be better served by sticking to his recommendations circa the original Heavy Duty concepts?  At the very least, why not hang by what he advocated in his '92 edition of HD?  Higher frequency multiplied by more clients = more more money, yes?

Mentzer truly *believed* he'd found the best way to train.  No question.  I'm just sorry that, in the end, his logic was severely flawed -- and his one workout every blue moon, totally wrong. :(


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 15, 2017, 01:36:23 PM
The ever honorable Pellius is correct :). All that shit about Casey sneaking in extra workouts was a rumor, nothing more.  While I'm certain Jones was wrong on the "no steroids!" count, drugs could not have played THAT big of a role in his quick progress; even if he was taking grams per week from the start, the stuff wouldn't blow him up like that in the first week or so, and that was when he gained at the quickest rate.

No... The Colorado Experiment is testament to a HUGE rebound by so-called muscle memory, facilitated by tons of food and hitting each bodypart hard with a high frequency.  Quite simple, really.



second post in and talking about people like old friends, who were you before?
I hope it isnt "the Trainer", you do have a ring of him.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 02:22:49 PM
second post in and talking about people like old friends, who were you before?
I hope it isnt "the Trainer", you do have a ring of him.

I've always been the same guy, 'cept for my handle Lodz.

You might also note this isn't my "second post in," unless of course you cannot count :/

Curiously, I would've given you due props, too.  Oh well.  Attack the person's easier than address what he says, nay?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 15, 2017, 02:25:12 PM
I've always been the same guy, 'cept for my handle Lodz.

You might also note this isn't my "second post in," unless of course you cannot count :/

Curiously, I would've given you due props, too.  Oh well.  Attack the person's easier than address what he says, nay?

it was your second post  ;)
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=profile;u=102618;sa=showPosts


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 02:27:09 PM
Oops, shit, my bad:  I was also doriancutlerman, but for the life of me, I can't track down the email Addy or password associated therewith :(


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 02:30:35 PM
it was your second post  ;)
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=profile;u=102618;sa=showPosts

Heh, you beat me to it! :)

Lodz first, DCM second, then Darth, which I activated ... today? 

Eh, I'm those guys, but nobody's sock.  I wanted to remain DCM but as I said, I can't remember the email addy I used for it :/


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 15, 2017, 02:32:38 PM
Heh, you beat me to it! :)

Lodz first, DCM second, then Darth, which I activated ... today? 

Eh, I'm those guys, but nobody's sock.  I wanted to remain DCM but as I said, I can't remember the email addy I used for it :/

welcome to the thunderdome fuckface!!!!!!!!!!!

hang on, waut a minute.....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 15, 2017, 09:41:22 PM
 ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 16, 2017, 03:28:33 AM
it seems that mentzer looked his best circa 76-77 when he was training full body 3 ttimes per week

he didn't look as good (shape and fullness) in 79-80 when he was training on a 2-way split 3-4 days a week

interesting. ....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 16, 2017, 05:21:50 AM
lmao at some of these posts. did you know that casey was regaining muscle at the colorado experiment? did you know he fell on an oil rig lost a finger got a serious infection and was hospitalized? thats when jones did the experiment .when casey had lost alot of weight  due to infection. so if any of you actually lift weights ( which i really doubt) then you know how quickly you regain lost muscle. even without drugs. so he regained what he lost. big deal. and yes he did sneak other weight workouts in. did you know casey himself said he got in the best shape of his life when he used VOLUME training. i love nautlius machines i believe in less is more for most of the time. hard and infrequent  with rests. all good advice. BUT its like any other workout program you cant do it all the time. even rotating exercises in and out. you have to give your body a break. and yes mentzer did train like everyone else in his early career he trained that way even in the air force. he didnt start "heavy duty" until he seen casey and met jones and then it took him several years to do it. he had injured a shoulder and wasnt really able to lift and train and compete. please learn more about these great pros before you go repeating WHAT you think is the truth. remember what you read is mostly made up to sell magazines. period.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on June 16, 2017, 05:39:00 AM
Who cares about the Colorado experiment. It just shows that Viator was a freak of nature. It's no testimony to HIT or Nautilus equipment either.

Same with Brooks Kubick going on and on about Peary Rader gaining 100 lbs in one year from squats. Cause he was super skinny means he was a hardgainer, lol.

You want to test the effectiveness of some protocol, you need a cohort of many subjects, a good sampling of the general population. And even then, the test will be flawed cause you can't control everything.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on June 16, 2017, 05:40:30 AM
lmao at some of these posts. did you know that casey was regaining muscle at the colorado experiment? did you know he fell on an oil rig lost a finger got a serious infection and was hospitalized? thats when jones did the experiment .when casey had lost alot of weight  due to infection. so if any of you actually lift weights ( which i really doubt) then you know how quickly you regain lost muscle. even without drugs. so he regained what he lost. big deal. and yes he did sneak other weight workouts in. did you know casey himself said he got in the best shape of his life when he used VOLUME training. i love nautlius machines i believe in less is more for most of the time. hard and infrequent  with rests. all good advice. BUT its like any other workout program you cant do it all the time. even rotating exercises in and out. you have to give your body a break. and yes mentzer did train like everyone else in his early career he trained that way even in the air force. he didnt start "heavy duty" until he seen casey and met jones and then it took him several years to do it. he had injured a shoulder and wasnt really able to lift and train and compete. please learn more about these great pros before you go repeating WHAT you think is the truth. remember what you read is mostly made up to sell magazines. period.

THIS


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 16, 2017, 06:02:41 AM
calves of peace


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: stuntmovie on June 16, 2017, 06:06:00 AM
(The following in no way disagrees with DARTH nor BIGBY) who apparently appear to know this stuff due to personal involvement.)

I hate to disagree with people I disagree with but it appears that 'most' of you Getbiggers cast your opinions regarding individuals you’ve never met nor seen nor spoken with.

Most Getbiggers were not even born yet, but offer random comments in an effort to be the experts that they want to be …. but ain’t.

I ain’t no expert neither but …. I’ve met and seen and spoken with each and every one of these usual suspects and some non-guilty parties during the period in which  the Colorado Experiment was conducted  ….. and all though I was in no position to accuse anyone of misrepresenting the facts …..

The general consensus of opinion at that precise moment of time was that Casey was  on the juice.

This general consensus of opinion was held by a prevailing number of IFBB professional bodybuilders immediately following the publication of the results of this ‘experiment’.

Needless to say …. the number of professional IFBB bodybuilders at that time was relatively small and some of those doubtful pros may have been expressing a bit of jealousy when the results were publicized.

So if Casey did or did not, is still in question, regardless of what us GetBig experts have to say.

And … I fail to recall any comments nor rumors about Casey training with any equipment other than Nautilus during this experiment.

And you should be aware that Nautilus equipment and Nautilus principals were new at that time and generally not acceptable by most anyone who lifted heavy things.

Arguments are welcome but only from those who were present and a bit more knowledgeable about the subject matter
than those whose imaginations run wild and are not based on what really occurred.

My thanks to DARTH and BIGBY for the comments they offered somewhere above. I had forgotten about Casey's injury.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 16, 2017, 06:11:34 AM
Mentzer took lots of drugs (the interview I read is no longer available online), ate a lot and lifted weights.  Anyone of us can do the same with similar but not equal results.

I tried Heavy Duty in the late 70s and it worked but not nearly as well as it did for Mentzer and I suppose that the main reason is no drugs.  Just like a drug protocol, a training routine works differently for each of us but Mentzer was right about the best way to train regardless of whether or not you are natural.

Brooks Kubick gives an example in his book "Dinosaur Training" where talks about taking a skinny guy and putting him to work in a lumber camp.  Grow or die.  If he had thought further about it, he would have noted that the skinny guy was working HARD every day, not just 2 or 4 times a week but his idea is still valid.  Train HARD and then refuel and rest.

I have Mentzer's final book and have tried the every week or more training.  It was so brutal that I didn't want to train the next day.  Or the next.  I was so sore that I stull hurt a week later.  My son refused to train with me as did any one else I knew after doing one session with me in my garage gym.  I combined H.I.T. with Dinosaur Training and just beat the shit out of myself doing it.

I still train in a variation on Mentzer's theme and sometimes incorporate thick bars in there but to be honest, the thick bar training hurts my joints too much.  I train alone and so make use of rest/pause training once or twice a week and also include pre-exhaust training but only once a week.   I am sore but not SORE. Each workout lasts 30 to 45 minutes and I am training 2 to 4 times per week. 

Mentzer's greatest contribution to my training is showing me that I didn't have to be in the gym for up to 5 hours a day 6 days a week.  That sort of life is no life for anyone with aspirations of doing more with the time allotted them.  While not a genius in the Mensa tradition (I have no idea of his IQ but he was a man well versed in a variety of subjects and had common sense to boot), Mike Mentzer was far above the intellectual norm for the world in which he moved.   

I can take a vacation and not worry about not making it to the gym and Mentzer's revelatory writings made me aware of that.  Once I accepted that having a good life as a goal and training to for not only size and strength but good health, I then adapted Mike's H.I.T. to my particular needs.  Now I actually looked forward to days both in and out of the gym.   

And I have Mike Mentzer and to a lesser degree, Brooks Kubick, to thank for that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 16, 2017, 06:21:01 AM
What year did mentzer look his best?

'77?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on June 16, 2017, 08:12:12 AM
lmao at some of these posts. did you know that casey was regaining muscle at the colorado experiment? did you know he fell on an oil rig lost a finger got a serious infection and was hospitalized? thats when jones did the experiment .when casey had lost alot of weight  due to infection. so if any of you actually lift weights ( which i really doubt) then you know how quickly you regain lost muscle. even without drugs. so he regained what he lost. big deal. and yes he did sneak other weight workouts in. did you know casey himself said he got in the best shape of his life when he used VOLUME training. i love nautlius machines i believe in less is more for most of the time. hard and infrequent  with rests. all good advice. BUT its like any other workout program you cant do it all the time. even rotating exercises in and out. you have to give your body a break. and yes mentzer did train like everyone else in his early career he trained that way even in the air force. he didnt start "heavy duty" until he seen casey and met jones and then it took him several years to do it. he had injured a shoulder and wasnt really able to lift and train and compete. please learn more about these great pros before you go repeating WHAT you think is the truth. remember what you read is mostly made up to sell magazines. period.

Only reason I come back to this board is this. Great stuff.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 16, 2017, 10:23:22 AM
also gaysey wasn't 16-17% at the start he was much leaner, more like 7-8% and he wasn't sub-3 at the end either, again like 7-8%


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on June 16, 2017, 04:48:42 PM
Tired of tin foil hat revisionist that say Sergio's physique was the result of Arthur Jones. He trained a couple of weeks with Jones in Florida.  He trained high volume prior and high volume after as countless guys in the gym can testify too.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 16, 2017, 08:15:13 PM
lmao at some of these posts. did you know that casey was regaining muscle at the colorado experiment? did you know he fell on an oil rig lost a finger got a serious infection and was hospitalized? thats when jones did the experiment .when casey had lost alot of weight  due to infection. so if any of you actually lift weights ( which i really doubt) then you know how quickly you regain lost muscle. even without drugs. so he regained what he lost. big deal. and yes he did sneak other weight workouts in. did you know casey himself said he got in the best shape of his life when he used VOLUME training. i love nautlius machines i believe in less is more for most of the time. hard and infrequent  with rests. all good advice. BUT its like any other workout program you cant do it all the time. even rotating exercises in and out. you have to give your body a break. and yes mentzer did train like everyone else in his early career he trained that way even in the air force. he didnt start "heavy duty" until he seen casey and met jones and then it took him several years to do it. he had injured a shoulder and wasnt really able to lift and train and compete. please learn more about these great pros before you go repeating WHAT you think is the truth. remember what you read is mostly made up to sell magazines. period.

Casey's story was widely know even in the late seventies and muscle rebound was the primary reason for such rapid gains. Mentzer detailed his history with Casey and Jones and his shift to a different protocol. You can watch Dorian's training tapes where Mentzer's and Jones' influence are obvious.

Taking breaks was clearly encouraged and considered mandatory. Mentzer has a brief discussion about this during his last video tape serious where he questioned that German guy he was training about why he took four or fives days off and even commented that it was a smart thing to do.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Chidoman on June 16, 2017, 08:49:53 PM
Casey's story was widely know even in the late seventies and muscle rebound was the primary reason for such rapid gains. Mentzer detailed his history with Casey and Jones and his shift to a different protocol. You can watch Dorian's training tapes where Mentzer's and Jones' influence are obvious.

Taking breaks was clearly encouraged and considered mandatory. Mentzer has a brief discussion about this during his last video tape serious where he questioned that German guy he was training about why he took four or fives days off and even commented that it was a smart thing to do.

This Man knows what he's talking about and It just makes sense!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 16, 2017, 08:52:27 PM
Tired of tin foil hat revisionist that say Sergio's physique was the result of Arthur Jones. He trained a couple of weeks with Jones in Florida.  He trained high volume prior and high volume after as countless guys in the gym can testify too.

I'm not sure anybody is claiming Jones' was responsible for Sergio's physique. Many claim that Jones' got him into the best shape of his life.

Of course, I wasn't there and stuntmovie feels only those who were or had first hand knowledge can offer an opinion. So perhaps we should listen to what Oliva says himself about his experience with Arthur Jones.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/sergio-oliva-interview/

And as far as training a couple of weeks with Jones:

"My arms were so crazy and the only one who measured them was Arthur Jones. God bless him in heaven because he was real good to me and he was a very honest guy. He didn't believe in all the other stuff. With me he was like a father and took me under his wing. And I spent, I believe it was four or five months in Deland Florida with him and he took care of everything and he took care of me like I was a king. The guy was an incredible man."
https://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson331.htm


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 17, 2017, 05:22:32 AM
like i said thats when sergio got serious about his training and nutrition etc. he didnt know much about either. he was a genetic freak for sure. he could of grown just watching people workout.. jones always wanted to say how sergios arm was bigger than his head etc  lmao.  he had one pic where sergio was tilting his head and holdng his arm flexed etc to create the illusion it was and even in that pic it didnt really look like it. lol.and for all of you to know im 53 years old. ive been around this game a long time. been lifting since 14 and before that actually at home i was 12. so yes i do know a few of these guys ( no never met sergio personally)  mentzers, viator ,joe gold ,lee priest, leroy colbert,mike ohearn, barbarians samir ,pearl and a few others.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 17, 2017, 12:59:11 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 17, 2017, 02:08:37 PM
"weider principals"  lmao.   joe tried to take credit for everything ever done by any bodybuilder ever!! every system was a 'weider" system.  when i was a kid i beleieved the crap too.  and mentzer went from 199 to 215 in 3 days AFTER  contest!  big freakin deal. carb deplete carb load and bam there you go. lol . gain a pound a day with crash weight gain formula number 7. lol .. so many fakes half truths lies and being deceitful  from uncle joe and the gang. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 17, 2017, 02:09:58 PM
oh also in the article mike says his arm was 19 1/4 inch cold.  mike himself always said it was never bigger than 18 5/8 . see how these mags inflate everything.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BIG AL MCKECHNIE on June 17, 2017, 02:13:08 PM
I trained at Golds, Hampton Drive Venice regularly when I was on secondment to the San Diego Navy base during my RAF days and saw Mike and Ray train plenty of times. They didn't train any differently than the other guys. I remember they trained with Sammir Bannout quite often.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 17, 2017, 02:15:46 PM
back in the early 80s i used to consult mike as a personal trainer, we didnt have cordless back then so when i was training and he was on the phone i could only reach one of the machines, i saw some tremendous growth to the back of my shoulders, sadly the rest of my body remained the same.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 17, 2017, 02:31:17 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on June 17, 2017, 04:50:21 PM
like i said thats when sergio got serious about his training and nutrition etc. he didnt know much about either. he was a genetic freak for sure. he could of grown just watching people workout.. jones always wanted to say how sergios arm was bigger than his head etc  lmao.  he had one pic where sergio was tilting his head and holdng his arm flexed etc to create the illusion it was and even in that pic it didnt really look like it. lol.and for all of you to know im 53 years old. ive been around this game a long time. been lifting since 14 and before that actually at home i was 12. so yes i do know a few of these guys ( no never met sergio personally)  mentzers, viator ,joe gold ,lee priest, leroy colbert,mike ohearn, barbarians samir ,pearl and a few others.

I didn't mean to diss you, brother.  All I'm saying is that I knew Mike and can only relate what he told me.  That includes what he said about his teenaged training which involved fairly low volume.  Since he was stacked by the time he was 18/19 and before he joined the USAF, I do feel it is misleading to say he built his base with Arnoldesque volume workouts.  Unlike you, a bunch of people did NOT know him and they mindlessly repeat rumors and hearsay like it is God's honest truth.

By the way, if I didn't make it clear, I know the whole Colorado thing was purely an exercise in muscle memory.  I thought I even said as much.

Now, I do dispute the rumors that Casey was sneaking in extra workouts (the only person I ever know to assert that was Jeff Everson, and he was firmly in Weider's pocket), but in spite of Jones' blustering, Mike also told me that Viator was using something throughout that so-called "experiment."


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on June 17, 2017, 04:51:23 PM
Look I'm a fan of Casey and Mike but this Colorado experiment is total bullshit. Take a look at the before and after pics. We are supposed to believe that this is a 63.21 pound of muscle gain with a 17.93 decrease in body fat? LMAO not a fucking chance. In the before pics Casey is very lean and I really don't see much if any fat loss in the after pics. Remember that anyone who gains even 10 pounds of muscle while being lean will "look" leaner because of the muscle gained. The skin will stretch and you will see the muscle better. Casey looks to be just as lean in both pics. So lets break this down.

Casey started at a body weight of

166.87 at 13.8 % BF So at this weight he is 143.8 pounds lean.  ::)

He ended the experiment at a body weight of

212.15 so if he lost 17.93 pounds of body fat he would be at 2.4% bf in the end photos  ::)

So this would put him at 207 pounds lean and Casey did all of this while eating large amounts of food that they never really kept track of since this was just an experiment about training.  ::)  They never really bother to explain this fat loss. If you look at Casey in pics of him at the height of his competition career during his Olympia days he is bigger and more ripped so I'll have to assume he was close to zero % BF on stage with even more muscle while dieting on 1500 calories which he stated he was eating in the interview I read once Musclemag. The numbers don't add up as far as him being 2.4% BF and the photos and amounts of food supposedly eaten. I'd say he gained about 20 pounds of muscle at the most and BF levels stayed the same.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 17, 2017, 05:24:59 PM
I didn't mean to diss you, brother.  All I'm saying is that I knew Mike and can only relate what he told me.  That includes what he said about his teenaged training which involved fairly low volume.  Since he was stacked by the time he was 18/19 and before he joined the USAF, I do feel it is misleading to say he built his base with Arnoldesque volume workouts.  Unlike you, a bunch of people did NOT know him and they mindlessly repeat rumors and hearsay like it is God's honest truth.

By the way, if I didn't make it clear, I know the whole Colorado thing was purely an exercise in muscle memory.  I thought I even said as much.

Now, I do dispute the rumors that Casey was sneaking in extra workouts (the only person I ever know to assert that was Jeff Everson, and he was firmly in Weider's pocket), but in spite of Jones' blustering, Mike also told me that Viator was using something throughout that so-called "experiment."

x2.

Also, you can just look at both Mike and Ray during their early days with Jones. They were noticeably smaller and less developed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 17, 2017, 05:32:08 PM
Look I'm a fan of Casey and Mike but this Colorado experiment is total bullshit. Take a look at the before and after pics. We are supposed to believe that this is a 63.21 pound of muscle gain with a 17.93 decrease in body fat? LMAO not a fucking chance. In the before pics Casey is very lean and I really don't see much if any fat loss in the after pics. Remember that anyone who gains even 10 pounds of muscle while being lean will "look" leaner because of the muscle gained. The skin will stretch and you will see the muscle better. Casey looks to be just as lean in both pics. So lets break this down.

Casey started at a body weight of

166.87 at 13.8 % BF So at this weight he is 143.8 pounds lean.  ::)

He ended the experiment at a body weight of

212.15 so if he lost 17.93 pounds of body fat he would be at 2.4% bf in the end photos  ::)

So this would put him at 207 pounds lean and Casey did all of this while eating large amounts of food that they never really kept track of since this was just an experiment about training.  ::)  They never really bother to explain this fat loss. If you look at Casey in pics of him at the height of his competition career during his Olympia days he is bigger and more ripped so I'll have to assume he was close to zero % BF on stage with even more muscle while dieting on 1500 calories which he stated he was eating in the interview I read once Musclemag. The numbers don't add up as far as him being 2.4% BF and the photos and amounts of food supposedly eaten. I'd say he gained about 20 pounds of muscle at the most and BF levels stayed the same.

This is probably the best point made regarding the veracity of the experiment. Even back in the late 1970s my inexperienced eyes questioned the claim that Casey gained 63 pounds of lean muscle in a month muscle memory or not. The pics aren't even close in comparison.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 18, 2017, 03:03:24 AM
Look I'm a fan of Casey and Mike but this Colorado experiment is total bullshit. Take a look at the before and after pics. We are supposed to believe that this is a 63.21 pound of muscle gain with a 17.93 decrease in body fat? LMAO not a fucking chance. In the before pics Casey is very lean and I really don't see much if any fat loss in the after pics. Remember that anyone who gains even 10 pounds of muscle while being lean will "look" leaner because of the muscle gained. The skin will stretch and you will see the muscle better. Casey looks to be just as lean in both pics. So lets break this down.

Casey started at a body weight of

166.87 at 13.8 % BF So at this weight he is 143.8 pounds lean.  ::)

He ended the experiment at a body weight of

212.15 so if he lost 17.93 pounds of body fat he would be at 2.4% bf in the end photos  ::)

So this would put him at 207 pounds lean and Casey did all of this while eating large amounts of food that they never really kept track of since this was just an experiment about training.  ::)  They never really bother to explain this fat loss. If you look at Casey in pics of him at the height of his competition career during his Olympia days he is bigger and more ripped so I'll have to assume he was close to zero % BF on stage with even more muscle while dieting on 1500 calories which he stated he was eating in the interview I read once Musclemag. The numbers don't add up as far as him being 2.4% BF and the photos and amounts of food supposedly eaten. I'd say he gained about 20 pounds of muscle at the most and BF levels stayed the same.

I said that about 10 posts earlier brosef



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 18, 2017, 03:04:12 AM
also gaysey wasn't 16-17% at the start he was much leaner, more like 7-8% and he wasn't sub-3 at the end either, again like 7-8%


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 03:37:13 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 06:15:25 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 09:41:54 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 10:50:54 AM
Lol at Mentzer being "intelligent." Where's the evidence of that? He wrote a couple of articles where he peddled some unverified bro-science and sprinkled in a few Ayn Rand quotes. What degrees did he earn? What peer-reviewed papers did he author? He was a short guy with good athletic genetics for strength who took a lot of drugs. There are tons of gymnasts, wrestlers, etc., with similar genetics who could look like Mentzer with the right combination of drugs and self-discipline. He's nothing special.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 11:13:55 AM

(http://orig13.deviantart.net/9ff2/f/2011/278/1/7/gymnast_3_by_stonepiler-d4byjk3.jpg)

(https://bodybuildingblog-1e89.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/yuri-van-gelder-spiermassa.png)

(http://3g1o5q2sqh3w32ohtj4dwggw.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/male_gymnast-rings.jpg)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 18, 2017, 11:56:31 AM
^^^^^ where is the second guys ttriceps  ???


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 18, 2017, 12:08:03 PM
Lol at Mentzer being "intelligent." Where's the evidence of that? He wrote a couple of articles where he peddled some unverified bro-science and sprinkled in a few Ayn Rand quotes. What degrees did he earn? What peer-reviewed papers did he author? He was a short guy with good athletic genetics for strength who took a lot of drugs. There are tons of gymnasts, wrestlers, etc., with similar genetics who could look like Mentzer with the right combination of drugs and self-discipline. He's nothing special.

There are tenfold the people doing gear and training nowadays as opposed to Mentzer's heyday - show me an example of somebody nowadays with a similar build please? Mike's got a unique build, instantly recognisable to anybody who knows a bit about Bodybuilding/training history. His own brother was built nothing like him, so I seriously doubt you can find 'tons' of very similar builds.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 12:50:04 PM
Lol at Mentzer being "intelligent." Where's the evidence of that? He wrote a couple of articles where he peddled some unverified bro-science and sprinkled in a few Ayn Rand quotes. What degrees did he earn? What peer-reviewed papers did he author? He was a short guy with good athletic genetics for strength who took a lot of drugs. There are tons of gymnasts, wrestlers, etc., with similar genetics who could look like Mentzer with the right combination of drugs and self-discipline. He's nothing special.

Do you consider yourself intelligent?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 12:50:31 PM
^^^^^ where is the second guys ttriceps  ???

dont worry, when he's done as a gymnast he will add some tricep pushdowns and he will be ready for olympia stage



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 12:51:45 PM
His own brother was built nothing like him

huh?

(http://www.davedraper.com/fusionbb/fbbuploads/med_1300136385-bodybuilder-Mike-Mentzer-et-Ray-Mentzer-les-inseparables.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 12:53:50 PM
There are tenfold the people doing gear and training nowadays as opposed to Mentzer's heyday - show me an example of somebody nowadays with a similar build please? Mike's got a unique build, instantly recognisable to anybody who knows a bit about Bodybuilding/training history. His own brother was built nothing like him, so I seriously doubt you can find 'tons' of very similar builds.

Of course Mentzer has a "unique build." Every single person on earth does. Mentzer had good genetics and the self-discipline to diet.

You're right. A lot more kids are on gear today than back in Mentzer's time. However, most have shit genetics and are only noticeable because of the drugs.Bodybuilding remains a niche hobby that is hidden away from the general public which perceives it as nothing more than a laughable sideshow. Why would a D-1 college athlete in gymnastics, wrestling, swimming, football, etc., start injecting himself everyday to be a competitive bodybuilder? Instead of being a hero to his family and friends he'll be an outcast.

Bodybuilding is genetics, drugs, and self-discipline. High intensity training, high volume, low volume, etc., etc., is a all BS. Tax the muscle once or twice a week and eat reasonably well. If you have the right genetics and take the right drugs you can look like a bodybuilder. If you are willing to suffer and not eat for a couple of months you can get ripped.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 12:54:11 PM
There are tenfold the people doing gear and training nowadays as opposed to Mentzer's heyday - show me an example of somebody nowadays with a similar build please? Mike's got a unique build, instantly recognisable to anybody who knows a bit about Bodybuilding/training history. His own brother was built nothing like him, so I seriously doubt you can find 'tons' of very similar builds.

X2. There's a reason why a Mentzer discussion goes on forever. Not many bbers had such an impact as he did.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 12:55:26 PM
Do you consider yourself intelligent?

I think I'm of average intelligence.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 12:57:01 PM
X2. There's a reason why a Mentzer discussion goes on forever. Not many bbers had such an impact as he did.

the reason people still care about mentzer is because he looks like a action figure and people obsessing over bodybuilding are still 12 years old mentally


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 01:01:16 PM
X2. There's a reason why a Mentzer discussion goes on forever. Not many bbers had such an impact as he did.

Yes, because not many people have their, and their twin's, total mental breakdown, at a relatively young age, captured on video. The Mentzers went out like total train wrecks. If they were two relatively normal old men peddling their bro-science BS, nobody would care.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 01:04:29 PM
as much as people talk about mentzer

more people will talk about rich piana!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 01:06:21 PM
I think I'm of average intelligence.

Then why should we listen to you and take anything you say seriously?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 01:07:30 PM
as much as people talk about mentzer

more people will talk about rich piana!

Rich will outlive the Mentzers by a long time.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 01:08:47 PM
as much as people talk about mentzer

more people will talk about rich piana!

Not ten years from now.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OlympiaGym on June 18, 2017, 01:09:19 PM
Then why should we listen to you and take anything you say seriously?

I'm just a bored jackass who is estranged from his children - like everyone else posting on this site right now.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 01:09:24 PM
Not ten years from now.

but 30 years from now


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 01:40:47 PM
the reason people still care about mentzer is because he looks like a action figure and people obsessing over bodybuilding are still 12 years old mentally

Is that why you are an active participant on this thread?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 02:11:31 PM
Is that why you are an active participant on this thread?

i dont think participating in a thread about mentzer and caring about mentzer is the same thing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 02:18:59 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 18, 2017, 04:37:42 PM
Rich will outlive the Mentzers by a long time.

Given that both of them are dead, that is not too difficult a task for even Piano to achieve.  'n' sheit.

Back on topic.  Mentzer was far above average in intelligence for a bodybuilder.  Don't believe that?  Just listen to the 8 time SchmOelympia wiener Ronaldo Coleman. His level of mindless meanderings are just slightly below that of idiots like Cutler and the Phildo "the boy with no clavicles" Heath to name but two.

What a maroon is Piana the pincushion. 

Zane makes them look like single cell fooktards.  Oh wait!!  They are.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on June 18, 2017, 04:47:19 PM
Outside of Arnold, Mike Mentzer is the most talked about bodybuilder ever. At his peak he was making insane money for the time. When I was a teen he was first breaking on the scene. Since I ate up everything Arthur Jones wrote I was more than intrigued with everything that Mentzer wrote. I use to tear out everything he wrote and kept it in a file. I still might have the most complete Mike Mentzer collection of his writings anywhere.

Do I still believe super low sets and training to failure for every set to be the magical road to bodybuilding nivarna. No, I don't.  It is a tool like many in the bodybuilding tool box.  In bodybuilding we don't have facts. We have theories. You can't argue a theory is a fact. If we had facts we would all be training exactly alike in terms of sets, frequency and exercise selection.   


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 04:54:52 PM
Outside of Arnold, Mike Mentzer is the most talked about bodybuilder ever. At his peak he was making insane money for the time. When I was a teen he was first breaking on the scene. Since I ate up everything Arthur Jones wrote I was more than intrigued with everything that Mentzer wrote. I use to tear out everything he wrote and kept it in a file. I still might have the most complete Mike Mentzer collection of his writings anywhere.

Do I still believe super low sets and training to failure for every set to be the magical road to bodybuilding nivarna. No, I don't.  It is a tool like many in the bodybuilding tool box.  In bodybuilding we don't have facts. We have theories. You can't argue a theory is a fact. If we had facts we would all be training exactly alike in terms of sets, frequency and exercise selection.   


Quote
Outside of Arnold, Mike Mentzer is the most talked about bodybuilder ever.

Not even close lol Mike Mentzer is like Shawn Ray , OVERRATED!! the product of good self promotion.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on June 18, 2017, 05:11:07 PM
Is that why you are an active participant on this thread?

Dont waste your time. Dude is the most unentertaining gimmick in site history. No impact made, anywhere.. And not for lack of trying


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on June 18, 2017, 05:15:33 PM
the reason people still care about mentzer is because he looks like a action figure and people obsessing over bodybuilding are still 12 years old mentally

Interesting how you took this from a discussion that stayed mostly on target. Freud would have had a field day with you.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on June 18, 2017, 05:17:48 PM

Not even close lol Mike Mentzer is like Shawn Ray , OVERRATED!! the product of good self promotion.

Look on any bodybuilding board. If Mentzer comes up it's a long thread.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 18, 2017, 05:27:01 PM
Look on any bodybuilding board. If Mentzer comes up it's a long thread.

Yeah because of his zealots who fluff up his training philosophies and defend it tooth & nail. Heavy Duty works for some people , not most. He's the textbook definition of overrated , Won only 1 pro contest.

19th and that's a gift


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 18, 2017, 05:30:22 PM
i dont think participating in a thread about mentzer and caring about mentzer is the same thing.


Of course not. All your opinions and comments about Mentzer is proof of your indifference. Gotcha.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on June 18, 2017, 05:55:47 PM
Outside of Arnold, Mike Mentzer is the most talked about bodybuilder ever.

not sure about that.

(https://s1.postimg.org/n0fst5lxb/bbtrends.jpg)





Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: johnny1 on June 18, 2017, 06:45:32 PM
Yeah because of his zealots who fluff up his training philosophies and defend it tooth & nail. Heavy Duty works for some people , not most. He's the textbook definition of overrated , Won only 1 pro contest.

19th and that's a gift
lol...Samir 21st? Now that's ridiculous he'd been @ least 6-8 places better than that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: HockeyFightFan on June 18, 2017, 09:42:18 PM
lol...Samir 21st? Now that's ridiculous he'd been @ least 6-8 places better than that.

Top 24 of all time and the list doesn't include Bob Paris or Albert Beckles?

Hmmmm-kay....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 18, 2017, 11:39:40 PM
(https://patchesofpride.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/nissanjoespot21.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on June 19, 2017, 02:44:48 AM
as much as people talk about mentzer

more people will talk about rich piana!

Mike was a bodybuilder

Pianna is a bodyfiller


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 19, 2017, 02:59:16 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on June 19, 2017, 09:21:37 AM
Mike was a bodybuilder

Pianna is a bodyfiller

HAHAHAHHAHHAAA!  That's absolutely correct!  In fact, I can confirm that Rich is just about* to rebrand and launch the latest addition to his 5% product range (see pic below)

And just like all the other products that are available from him, this carries the Rich Piana No-Sh1t Promise:

"No Motherf**king African-American ingredients in this Motherf**ker - and that's guaran-f**kin-teed!"


(http://images.lteplatform.com/images/products/600x600/554772380.jpg)

*Available from about Mid-May


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:08:51 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:10:19 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:10:56 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:12:07 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:13:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 21, 2017, 11:16:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 21, 2017, 12:06:57 PM
Great shots, haven't seen a lot of the above.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 21, 2017, 12:22:25 PM
are there any clips on YouTube of his superstars performances?



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: josephbd on June 22, 2017, 01:34:58 AM
:)
wow. Are there anymore pics from this series of him Training?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: josephbd on June 22, 2017, 01:40:33 AM
:)
That is such a great pic of him deadlifting! Awesome! Thank you!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 23, 2017, 10:52:18 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: josephbd on June 23, 2017, 11:27:29 AM
:)
Great shot!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 24, 2017, 03:55:25 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 24, 2017, 04:15:17 AM
▲▲▲▲

the top pic is actually a better look

lean, but not too lean


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 24, 2017, 01:32:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 24, 2017, 01:36:44 PM
:)

13" arms


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 24, 2017, 01:52:23 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ratherbebig on June 24, 2017, 01:54:27 PM
shopped

no way he had cardio for climbing that mountain


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 25, 2017, 04:08:09 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on June 26, 2017, 06:01:04 AM
80


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on June 26, 2017, 12:34:17 PM
13" arms

Fuck off.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OLKE_TEXAS on June 26, 2017, 01:10:04 PM
I worked out with mike and ray in rehab.
Ended up training them for a couple of years. Good times.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on June 26, 2017, 04:45:16 PM
underwhelming in every way. owned so hard in '80 became a crackwhore and both he and brother died junkies.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on June 27, 2017, 04:44:41 PM
I worked out with mike and ray in rehab.
Ended up training them for a couple of years. Good times.


You must have some good stories...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on June 27, 2017, 04:45:56 PM
underwhelming in every way. owned so hard in '80 became a crackwhore and both he and brother died junkies.

Not every way.

He was probably smarter than you. Prettier, too.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on June 27, 2017, 07:01:47 PM
Couldnt even beat twink Zane.  Some legend.

smart? he created exactly nothing new or useful, his one rep "hit" bullshit has long since been laughed out of existence.

hes nothing but a failed BB who was too butthurt to compete and not smart enough to make a living selling his bullshit training plan. So he chose to die a junkie.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 27, 2017, 11:51:48 PM
Couldnt even beat twink Zane.  Some legend.

smart? he created exactly nothing new or useful, his one rep "hit" bullshit has long since been laughed out of existence.

hes nothing but a failed BB who was too butthurt to compete and not smart enough to make a living selling his bullshit training plan. So he chose to die a junkie.



"Created nothing new or useful"? True, most of his ideas originated from Arthur Jones but to say he added nothing new or useful is beyond ludicrous. I wonder how old you were or if you were even born during Mentzer's hey day. Back then no one was talking about recovery ability and distinguishing between localized and systemic recovery. It was all more, more, more. "Specialization" routines to "bring up weak body parts" always entire more frequency, more duration. The concept of intensity was rarely if ever brought up. There was no pre exhaust concepts, emphasis and the importance of eccentric contraction -- Mentzer talked about rest pause training when Danta and sons were still in diapers.

Six day a week training, body part 2-3 times a week was the rule before Mentzer arrived on the scene. Even relating the correlation between size and strength and training for progression took a far, far back seat to getting "the pump" and volume. Set after set after set. To be so breathtakingly ignorant and claim that HIT has long since been laughed out of existence. What planet are you living on? Various forms of high intensity training is being practiced by millions throughout the world. Ever heard of Dorian Yates? And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.

And again your ignorance is beyond staggering. Mentzer was very successful selling and promoting his theories and travelled around the world doing so. He's been to places, experienced other cultures, met people throughout the world at a level that you will never even remotely come close to. And it was due solely to his huge fan base that still exist to this day.

Yes, he was a flawed man like all of us and it was his undoing but his impact in bbing will be long remember and discussed just like we are doing now. Just like people around the world are doing now.

Many disagree with Mentzer and vehemently dispute his claims and beliefs, but it's rare to see someone like you take such a personal offense to the point of losing all sense of reason and rationality making accusations and claims that are demonstrably false. It seems Mentzer had a lot more influence on your psyche than you are willing to admit or are even aware of. You act like he personally hurt your feelings and it seems to have scared you for life.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Van_Bilderass on June 28, 2017, 12:06:57 AM
And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.



I seem to remember his last evolution in training theory where you only held a weight for like 15 seconds. Say a leg extension, you held the weight at the contracted position to failure and that was it. I'm not sure but I think you then rested for 2 or 3 weeks until you did the same thing again. Do you remember this? It was in his last articles for "all natural" MD as I recall.

Mentzer was a huge influence on me wrt training, thinking critically about all the different theories. Now I think his thinking was deeply flawed on several things but he got me thinking at least. :D



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 28, 2017, 02:57:17 AM
I seem to remember his last evolution in training theory where you only held a weight for like 15 seconds. Say a leg extension, you held the weight at the contracted position to failure and that was it. I'm not sure but I think you then rested for 2 or 3 weeks until you did the same thing again. Do you remember this? It was in his last articles for "all natural" MD as I recall.

Mentzer was a huge influence on me wrt training, thinking critically about all the different theories. Now I think his thinking was deeply flawed on several things but he got me thinking at least. :D



I reckon if you are performing static holds followed by super slow negatives, in terms of time under tension and units of work, you can count it as a set simply due to the intensity and duration of the exercise.

I must say though I never do 1 rep maxes, simply because in my experience the closer you get to going all out on a single rep the more you increase the risk of injury. I will do the occasional set of 3-4 reps in rest pause fashion with super slow negs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 28, 2017, 02:58:01 AM
"Created nothing new or useful"? True, most of his ideas originated from Arthur Jones but to say he added nothing new or useful is beyond ludicrous. I wonder how old you were or if you were even born during Mentzer's hey day. Back then no one was talking about recovery ability and distinguishing between localized and systemic recovery. It was all more, more, more. "Specialization" routines to "bring up weak body parts" always entire more frequency, more duration. The concept of intensity was rarely if ever brought up. There was no pre exhaust concepts, emphasis and the importance of eccentric contraction -- Mentzer talked about rest pause training when Danta and sons were still in diapers.

Six day a week training, body part 2-3 times a week was the rule before Mentzer arrived on the scene. Even relating the correlation between size and strength and training for progression took a far, far back seat to getting "the pump" and volume. Set after set after set. To be so breathtakingly ignorant and claim that HIT has long since been laughed out of existence. What planet are you living on? Various forms of high intensity training is being practiced by millions throughout the world. Ever heard of Dorian Yates? And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.

And again your ignorance is beyond staggering. Mentzer was very successful selling and promoting his theories and travelled around the world doing so. He's been to places, experienced other cultures, met people throughout the world at a level that you will never even remotely come close to. And it was due solely to his huge fan base that still exist to this day.

Yes, he was a flawed man like all of us and it was his undoing but his impact in bbing will be long remember and discussed just like we are doing now. Just like people around the world are doing now.

Many disagree with Mentzer and vehemently dispute his claims and beliefs, but it's rare to see someone like you take such a personal offense to the point of losing all sense of reason and rationality making accusations and claims that are demonstrably false. It seems Mentzer had a lot more influence on your psyche than you are willing to admit or are even aware of. You act like he personally hurt your feelings and it seems to have scared you for life.

Mike has done more for training philosophy than the vast majority that's for sure.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on June 28, 2017, 04:30:52 AM
"Created nothing new or useful"? True, most of his ideas originated from Arthur Jones but to say he added nothing new or useful is beyond ludicrous. I wonder how old you were or if you were even born during Mentzer's hey day. Back then no one was talking about recovery ability and distinguishing between localized and systemic recovery. It was all more, more, more. "Specialization" routines to "bring up weak body parts" always entire more frequency, more duration. The concept of intensity was rarely if ever brought up. There was no pre exhaust concepts, emphasis and the importance of eccentric contraction -- Mentzer talked about rest pause training when Danta and sons were still in diapers.

Six day a week training, body part 2-3 times a week was the rule before Mentzer arrived on the scene. Even relating the correlation between size and strength and training for progression took a far, far back seat to getting "the pump" and volume. Set after set after set. To be so breathtakingly ignorant and claim that HIT has long since been laughed out of existence. What planet are you living on? Various forms of high intensity training is being practiced by millions throughout the world. Ever heard of Dorian Yates? And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.

And again your ignorance is beyond staggering. Mentzer was very successful selling and promoting his theories and travelled around the world doing so. He's been to places, experienced other cultures, met people throughout the world at a level that you will never even remotely come close to. And it was due solely to his huge fan base that still exist to this day.

Yes, he was a flawed man like all of us and it was his undoing but his impact in bbing will be long remember and discussed just like we are doing now. Just like people around the world are doing now.

Many disagree with Mentzer and vehemently dispute his claims and beliefs, but it's rare to see someone like you take such a personal offense to the point of losing all sense of reason and rationality making accusations and claims that are demonstrably false. It seems Mentzer had a lot more influence on your psyche than you are willing to admit or are even aware of. You act like he personally hurt your feelings and it seems to have scared you for life.

Excellent stuff.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 28, 2017, 05:11:31 AM
mike did get people thinking about recovery and stuff. however mike didnt train the way he preached. he did fewer sets than most but he still did the basic pyrimad system. even dorian yates did too.  on paper arthur jones ideas sound solid. and to a point they are/were. mike tried to "tweak" them a bit. pre exhaustion , rest pause etc are all solid training advice BUT only on occasion. the guys in the mags didnt always train 6 days 2 times a day 2 hours each hetc. they took days off when they were exhausted. and they only trained that way prior to a big show. most of the time it was 3 or 4 days a week heavy weights low reps etc. even on drugs they knew they couldnt beat their bodies for months. the mags always wanted you to believe the guys were "super" human or something. mike kinda went against what the mags was trying to push . he wasnt so much "smart" as he was honest. mike didnt believe in protein supplements and always said so. in fact his diet was low protein and higher carbs when getting ready for a show. ( but he was using amphetimines then too) i didnt see mike much after in his later years as i had moved away and visted calif seldom. bodybuilding isnt hard to figure out. lift as much as you want listen to your body eat food sleep take drugs repeat. to keep from getting bored mix up your routines and never stay on one for months and months unless you are growing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 28, 2017, 12:52:15 PM
Young Ray


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 28, 2017, 01:19:05 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: OLKE_TEXAS on June 28, 2017, 01:28:41 PM
:)
[/quote
Dirty trainers of peas


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 28, 2017, 02:39:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 29, 2017, 12:32:03 AM
I seem to remember his last evolution in training theory where you only held a weight for like 15 seconds. Say a leg extension, you held the weight at the contracted position to failure and that was it. I'm not sure but I think you then rested for 2 or 3 weeks until you did the same thing again. Do you remember this? It was in his last articles for "all natural" MD as I recall.

Mentzer was a huge influence on me wrt training, thinking critically about all the different theories. Now I think his thinking was deeply flawed on several things but he got me thinking at least. :D



Yes, he did consider and experiment with static holds. But that's a far cry from ORM max as a training tool.

We can speculate Mentzer's latest training evolution by simply watching the video tape series he was working on just before he died. The training protocol he put Markus Reinhardt through was pretty much what I remember him outlining in his articles and "Heavy Duty" training courses he wrote during the seventies. Pre exhaust, force reps, controlled negatives, one set per exercise (not per muscle group), a lot of grunting and grimacing....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 29, 2017, 12:39:06 AM
 I also want to echo some of the comments others have made regarding Mentzer's influence on them.
Perhaps the main influence. He made you think. He made you reconsider the Weider dogma of the day. To not just blindly follow the routines outlines in the muscle rags of the time. I remember as a teen literally devoting my life hitting the weights six days a week always worn out, always skinny, always full of hope. Arthur Jones and Mentzer were like a breath of fresh air.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on June 29, 2017, 03:06:27 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on June 29, 2017, 03:23:54 AM
I remember reading an article by Mentzer regarding calorific intake and building muscle.
It was something along the lines of eating around 20 cals a day over maintenance was  the difference between gaining 10lbs of muscle in a year and not gaining it.

He referred to is as the difference of a bite of an apple.

His theory was it was the training that built the muscle not calorific increase


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 29, 2017, 03:34:21 AM
I remember reading an article by Mentzer regarding calorific intake and building muscle.
It was something along the lines of eating around 20 cals a day over maintenance was  the difference between gaining 10lbs of muscle in a year and not gaining it.

He referred to is as the difference of a bite of an apple.

His theory was it was the training that built the muscle not calorific increase

true dat!

and he also said that strength increases precede size increases and that he would gain in strength for weeks with no size increase and then.... BOOM! he would add a few pounds of muscle in a day or two

AJ also said that muscle growth occurs very rapidly,  whenever it occurs


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 29, 2017, 04:09:32 AM
To me, more than anything, if people actually read/listen to Mike's words and speak to those who knew him (like Joanne Sharkey who runs his Website) you'll realise he was a really kind spirit. My training partner and I have had lengthy chats with Samir about him too and he echoed this and said he was one of the nicest, most helpful guys in the business. He honestly couldn't praise his character enough.

Mike wasn't squeaky clean though and had his fair share of problems, but I think that makes him more likeable, not less, contrary to what some of you say. He was human after all.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 29, 2017, 04:22:54 AM
mike was wrong about getting stronger before the muscle got bigger. he didnt take into account that you learn to do the exercise better therefore resulting in a strength increase. for example. if someone never ever lifted they would be awkward in lifts so as they got used to the exercise they could do more reps and add weight  thats NOT  strength increase thats just learning the exercise. he also never considered the power of the mind. somedays you dont feel like lifting and your not into your workout other days your excited and lift more. did you get stronger? no.  maybe your tired  from not enough rest and then the next time your refreshed and get more reps. did you get stronger? no.  or maybe your trying to lift and cant do it and suddenly a hot chick walks in and now you can lift the weight for more reps. did you get stronger? no.  mike was smart about not needing longer workouts and more days but again he didnt do what he preached either. he also forgot to mention that most guys didnt follow the 6 days 2 hours a diy routine all the time. only pre contest.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 29, 2017, 04:41:15 AM
mike was wrong about getting stronger before the muscle got bigger. he didnt take into account that you learn to do the exercise better therefore resulting in a strength increase. for example. if someone never ever lifted they would be awkward in lifts so as they got used to the exercise they could do more reps and add weight  thats NOT  strength increase thats just learning the exercise. he also never considered the power of the mind. somedays you dont feel like lifting and your not into your workout other days your excited and lift more. did you get stronger? no.  maybe your tired  from not enough rest and then the next time your refreshed and get more reps. did you get stronger? no.  or maybe your trying to lift and cant do it and suddenly a hot chick walks in and now you can lift the weight for more reps. did you get stronger? no.  mike was smart about not needing longer workouts and more days but again he didnt do what he preached either. he also forgot to mention that most guys didnt follow the 6 days 2 hours a diy routine all the time. only pre contest.

that's true what you write bout newbie strength gains

it also happens when you do a new exercise of if you return to an old one that you hhaven't done in awhile (and this is true for.advanced lifters)

but..... This strength before size was mike's own personal experience and it happened when he was at a very advanced stage ie.circa 78-79 and it happened on exercises he had already been doing for a long time


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on June 29, 2017, 09:05:21 AM
I worked out with mike and ray in rehab.
Ended up training them for a couple of years. Good times.


You must have some good stories...

Not really. OLKE told me they were arrogant and dicks to everyone, especially family


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 29, 2017, 11:29:28 AM
One thing that made an impression on me is that after Don Ross introduced me to Mike at Gold's during the late 1980s was that he always greeted me first when he saw me and always called me by my name. Because he was working we never got into any long discussions but he was always exceedingly polite and good humored.

Another thing that made an impression was his voice. It didn't match as how I would imagine. It was kind of squeaky and nerdy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on June 29, 2017, 01:54:08 PM
"Created nothing new or useful"? True, most of his ideas originated from Arthur Jones but to say he added nothing new or useful is beyond ludicrous. I wonder how old you were or if you were even born during Mentzer's hey day. Back then no one was talking about recovery ability and distinguishing between localized and systemic recovery. It was all more, more, more. "Specialization" routines to "bring up weak body parts" always entire more frequency, more duration. The concept of intensity was rarely if ever brought up. There was no pre exhaust concepts, emphasis and the importance of eccentric contraction -- Mentzer talked about rest pause training when Danta and sons were still in diapers.

Six day a week training, body part 2-3 times a week was the rule before Mentzer arrived on the scene. Even relating the correlation between size and strength and training for progression took a far, far back seat to getting "the pump" and volume. Set after set after set. To be so breathtakingly ignorant and claim that HIT has long since been laughed out of existence. What planet are you living on? Various forms of high intensity training is being practiced by millions throughout the world. Ever heard of Dorian Yates? And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.

And again your ignorance is beyond staggering. Mentzer was very successful selling and promoting his theories and travelled around the world doing so. He's been to places, experienced other cultures, met people throughout the world at a level that you will never even remotely come close to. And it was due solely to his huge fan base that still exist to this day.

Yes, he was a flawed man like all of us and it was his undoing but his impact in bbing will be long remember and discussed just like we are doing now. Just like people around the world are doing now.

Many disagree with Mentzer and vehemently dispute his claims and beliefs, but it's rare to see someone like you take such a personal offense to the point of losing all sense of reason and rationality making accusations and claims that are demonstrably false. It seems Mentzer had a lot more influence on your psyche than you are willing to admit or are even aware of. You act like he personally hurt your feelings and it seems to have scared you for life.

LoL didnt read your essay twinkie. Full of bullshit.

Again. He did nothing and died a junkie. Not a loss.

PS - couldnt even beat Zane. LoL


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 29, 2017, 04:13:20 PM
Given that the vast majority of today's bodybuilders are total lazy retards, it would take only a room temperature IQ to be considered a genius among them.

But Mike Mentzer was above average even among the average outside  bodybuilding. I think Mike was correct in his line of thinking.   It is true that drugs are the thing that separates us from the schmoebait, but either with or with out them, Mentzers philosophy of training will get you there and help to keep you there.

And you will have time for a real life instead of the usual imitation of one.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on June 29, 2017, 06:34:47 PM
"Created nothing new or useful"? True, most of his ideas originated from Arthur Jones but to say he added nothing new or useful is beyond ludicrous. I wonder how old you were or if you were even born during Mentzer's hey day. Back then no one was talking about recovery ability and distinguishing between localized and systemic recovery. It was all more, more, more. "Specialization" routines to "bring up weak body parts" always entire more frequency, more duration. The concept of intensity was rarely if ever brought up. There was no pre exhaust concepts, emphasis and the importance of eccentric contraction -- Mentzer talked about rest pause training when Danta and sons were still in diapers.

Six day a week training, body part 2-3 times a week was the rule before Mentzer arrived on the scene. Even relating the correlation between size and strength and training for progression took a far, far back seat to getting "the pump" and volume. Set after set after set. To be so breathtakingly ignorant and claim that HIT has long since been laughed out of existence. What planet are you living on? Various forms of high intensity training is being practiced by millions throughout the world. Ever heard of Dorian Yates? And never did Mentzer talk or promote "one rep bull shit." In fact, Jones specifically cautioned against such practice unless you were a power lifter. He was adamant in the difference between demonstrating strength and developing it. He believed that one rep training did nothing to stimulate size and strength.

And again your ignorance is beyond staggering. Mentzer was very successful selling and promoting his theories and travelled around the world doing so. He's been to places, experienced other cultures, met people throughout the world at a level that you will never even remotely come close to. And it was due solely to his huge fan base that still exist to this day.

Yes, he was a flawed man like all of us and it was his undoing but his impact in bbing will be long remember and discussed just like we are doing now. Just like people around the world are doing now.

Many disagree with Mentzer and vehemently dispute his claims and beliefs, but it's rare to see someone like you take such a personal offense to the point of losing all sense of reason and rationality making accusations and claims that are demonstrably false. It seems Mentzer had a lot more influence on your psyche than you are willing to admit or are even aware of. You act like he personally hurt your feelings and it seems to have scared you for life.

An intelligent, rational, and logical post.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 29, 2017, 07:17:28 PM
An intelligent, rational, and logical post.

You sir, are correct.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 30, 2017, 12:19:52 AM
LoL didnt read your essay twinkie. Full of bullshit.

Again. He did nothing and died a junkie. Not a loss.

PS - couldnt even beat Zane. LoL

Of course you didn't. Anything more than a few sentences taxes the upper limit of your attention span. So you just repeat the same unsubstantiated accusations. You don't argue or reason. You emote. Your responses are based on emotions and feelings. Much like a impetuous child or a woman who doesn't get her way.

In a sense you are like the anti-Mentzer. Illogical, emotional, irrational, feelings based. I see now why Mentzer offends you so much. Why you comes across as a frustrated baby pounding his spoon on the table presented asinine arguments like "he couldn't EVEN beat Zane." As if losing to a three time Mr. Olympia and one who many consider to this day to have the ideal physique somehow negates Mentzer's standing as one of the best bbers in his era and certainly the most influential one.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on June 30, 2017, 03:37:06 AM
Of course you didn't. Anything more than a few sentences taxes the upper limit of your attention span. So you just repeat the same unsubstantiated accusations. You don't argue or reason. You emote. Your responses are based on emotions and feelings. Much like a impetuous child or a woman who doesn't get her way.

In a sense you are like the anti-Mentzer. Illogical, emotional, irrational, feelings based. I see now why Mentzer offends you so much. Why you comes across as a frustrated baby pounding his spoon on the table presented asinine arguments like "he couldn't EVEN beat Zane." As if losing to a three time Mr. Olympia and one who many consider to this day to have the ideal physique somehow negates Mentzer's standing as one of the best bbers in his era and certainly the most influential one.



I'm going to take a wild guess that 'Sgt Barnes' didn't make it to the second paragraph of your post. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on June 30, 2017, 03:48:01 AM
that's true what you write bout newbie strength gains

it also happens when you do a new exercise of if you return to an old one that you hhaven't done in awhile (and this is true for.advanced lifters)

but..... This strength before size was mike's own personal experience and it happened when he was at a very advanced stage ie.circa 78-79 and it happened on exercises he had already been doing for a long time

bump

any of you experienced lifters ever experience this?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on June 30, 2017, 11:17:43 AM
sorry but it wasnt mikes personal experience at that time. he WROTE about it at that time. he also said he gained 10lbs of muscle while using weiders new amino acids in pill form. at that SAME time. lol. which is funny cuz mike was against the supplement bs. he didnt push hardly any.in fact mike didnt even come up with the name for his system HEAVY DUTY. i forget who it was but it wasnt mike. he simply had a new way to make money from gullible people looking for a quick way to get bigger. every pro had their own courses back then. remember vince girondas "4 side to every muscle" training?  or coes and columbos  how to create a "split" in your bicep or chest? or how about the danny padilla "tie in" courses ? lol just a small sample. and yes mikes voice was very nasal. like  a whiner ( which he became anyways)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on June 30, 2017, 02:30:32 PM
penius melting down over his junkie hero. melt on old man

(BTW- methzer never did beat zane)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 30, 2017, 07:30:32 PM
penius melting down over his junkie hero. melt on old man

(BTW- methzer never did beat zane)

Yes, the customary response of one who cannot formulate a coherent  argument.

I expect the "nut hugger" accusation is forthcoming.

Like your intellect, you write and spell like an inner city child.

"penius" Oh brother. Really? How old are you?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on June 30, 2017, 07:37:23 PM
my argument penius, is factual and perfectly coherent.

1. Methzer died a weak minded junkie

2. Methzer could never even beat Zane

3. You are melting all over about your thong hero.


3 facts. Prove them wrong.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on June 30, 2017, 07:54:59 PM
my argument penius, is factual and perfectly coherent.

1. Methzer died a weak minded junkie

2. Methzer could never even beat Zane

3. You are melting all over about your thong hero.


3 facts. Prove them wrong.

Mike died a chain smoking fool.

Mentzer could have defeated Zane but instead chose to surrender to his own  bruised  ego.

What "facts" must be proven wrong?  2+2=4?    This last statement of yours (#3 on your H.I.T. parade quoted above) is somewhat of the blanket variety and as any adult knows, a blanket often just smothers the truth.  Mike scored a perfect 300 in the Universe back when it meant something to win the Universe. 

I had the opportunity to watch Mentor train at the original Gold's and it was brief, intense and by association very inspirational.  Mentor was just a man.  No one here "worships" him.  That sort of idiocy is reserved for that pile of barely ambulatory shit, Ronnie Coleman.   That dilapidated retard is worse off than Mike Mentor ever was but he has the false security of 8 Schmoedows.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on June 30, 2017, 11:17:36 PM
my argument penius, is factual and perfectly coherent.

1. Methzer died a weak minded junkie

2. Methzer could never even beat Zane

3. You are melting all over about your thong hero.


3 facts. Prove them wrong.

The argument was Mentzer's influence and changing the thinking and approach to bodybuilding for millions around the world. Pro bodybuilders almost by definition are compulsive junkies.

Try to keep up. You can even spell "Mentzer", begin a sentence with a capital letter, or even count (1,2,3,3) ffs! Everything about reeks of an uneducated moron.

Keep posting and following this thread while telling us how Mentzer had no impact or influence.

Amazing how much Mentzer, someone you never met or knew, has hurt you. Time to move on cup cake.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 01, 2017, 04:44:03 AM
yes mike got a 300 score which went to his head and he always talked about it every chance he got. he really did think he was "perfect" and thats a big reason why when arnold and everyone else beat him he couldnt take it. BUT he wasnt the first or only person to get a "perfect 300". i believe it was carlos rodriquez  who got one before he did.( im not sure who but i think it was him) also in the old grand prix days a few others got them too. they mean nothing. its a judges opinion and they are just human.  and yes mike was a chain smoker mostly his whole life. a drug addict too. and he was also an alcoholic. few people know this.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on July 01, 2017, 05:24:14 AM
Some random thoughts. Outside of Arnold at the time he was the most famous bodybuilder by far. Anyone remember how slow Mentzer was in the 100 yard dash in ABC's Superstars show? He really took Arthur Jones writings and put his own spin on training protocol. For this he will go down in bodybuilding history.  I think I own every article he ever wrote back in the day. He is still the biggest influence on my training. Was he a drug addict? Yes. Did he have mental problems because of his drug addiction? Yes. In so many ways his life was tragic. He went from making crazy money for a bodybuilder back in the day to being flat broke. He blew all his money on a failed fitness magazine and out dated video making equipment that he was suckered into buying. He lost the love of his life Cathy to another bodybuilder who married her. Clint had a very stable lucrative career.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 01, 2017, 05:28:01 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 01, 2017, 05:40:08 AM
he really did think he was "perfect" and thats a big reason why when arnold and everyone else beat him he couldnt take it.

this is a prime example of narcissistic rage


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 01, 2017, 05:50:43 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 01, 2017, 06:00:19 AM
Some random thoughts. Outside of Arnold at the time he was the most famous bodybuilder by far. Anyone remember how slow Mentzer was in the 100 yard dash in ABC's Superstars show? He really took Arthur Jones writings and put his own spin on training protocol. For this he will go down in bodybuilding history.  I think I own every article he ever wrote back in the day. He is still the biggest influence on my training. Was he a drug addict? Yes. Did he have mental problems because of his drug addiction? Yes. In so many ways his life was tragic. He went from making crazy money for a bodybuilder back in the day to being flat broke. He blew all his money on a failed fitness magazine and out dated video making equipment that he was suckered into buying. He lost the love of his life Cathy to another bodybuilder who married her. Clint had a very stable lucrative career.

Quote
Some random thoughts. Outside of Arnold at the time he was the most famous bodybuilder by far

Not even close. The average person on the street knows who Arnold is , and Lou Ferrigno NO ONE knows who Mike Mentzer is , even in bodybuilding circles he's not even top 20 of most popular bodybuilders



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on July 01, 2017, 06:19:34 AM
LoL didnt read your essay twinkie. Full of bullshit.

Again. He did nothing and died a junkie. Not a loss.

PS - couldnt even beat Zane. LoL

Well, if you wish to continue this argument you should read it because Pellius just made you look like a jackass.

You keep saying "He couldn't even beat Zane". You say that like Zane didn't beat just about every notable bodybuilder of the era including Arnold, you dumbfuck. Zane 3 time Olympia winner won or placed in top 3 of almost every contest he competed in. Zane one of the most successful bodybuilders of all time.

I understand Mentzer had his faults and for a guy who was so adamant that his way was right it's fun to talk about his failures. You've done that. Now fuck off.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 01, 2017, 06:25:16 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 01, 2017, 07:58:17 AM
Young Ray

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=732822;image)

Probably started soon after and shut down any chance of being taller than 5'8" to 5' 9".  Probably the main reason so many of todays "bodybuilders" are below average height.  AS supplementation sends a signal to your body that puberty has begun and this in turn sends a signal to begin the epiphyseal process and BINGO!  You don't get any taller.

Doctors here can correct as they see fit as I am no physician. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 01, 2017, 08:44:51 AM
.

wonder what that waist measured? 

32-33?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 01, 2017, 10:39:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on July 01, 2017, 11:14:29 AM
yes mike got a 300 score which went to his head and he always talked about it every chance he got. he really did think he was "perfect" and thats a big reason why when arnold and everyone else beat him he couldnt take it. BUT he wasnt the first or only person to get a "perfect 300". i believe it was carlos rodriquez  who got one before he did.( im not sure who but i think it was him) also in the old grand prix days a few others got them too. they mean nothing. its a judges opinion and they are just human.  and yes mike was a chain smoker mostly his whole life. a drug addict too. and he was also an alcoholic. few people know this.
This "perfect score of 300" was a new way of scoring the competitors back then,that's why he might have been the first to receive it. Before him Sergio and Arnold won Olympia's and other contests with unanimous decisions,not perfect 300 score simply because it didn't existed at the time. Today the "perfect score" is 20( 4 rounds x 5) and so many competitors have won pro shows that way.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on July 01, 2017, 11:22:46 AM
This "perfect score of 300" was a new way of scoring the competitors back then,that's why he might have been the first to receive it. Before him Sergio and Arnold won Olympia's and other contests with unanimous decisions,not perfect 300 score simply because it didn't existed at the time. Today the "perfect score" is 20( 4 rounds x 5) and so many competitors have won pro shows that way.

Danny Padilla got a perfect score of 300 against Robbies 296, they gave Robbie the win...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on July 01, 2017, 11:46:24 AM
Danny Padilla got a perfect score of 300 against Robbies 296, they gave Robbie the win...
Yeah,at the 1979 NOC. Mentzer placed 3-rd there.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 01, 2017, 12:25:43 PM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on July 01, 2017, 01:11:44 PM
:)
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=732863)
this film available somewhere?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 01, 2017, 01:17:02 PM
this film available somewhere?

Not that I know of , apparently it was a seminar in 1983 in Duisburg Germany ,  Joachim Streletz was a German champ who is doing the translating for Mike.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 01, 2017, 01:50:46 PM
yes those shows  was what i mentioned. but before mikes 300 someone else got it too. i believe it was carlos rodriguez . imnot sure but i think so. but it never got much attention if at all. but when mike got it it was posted everywhere and mike always brought it up. lol. yes i know how the judging was and is. no one is perfect thats why the scores dont mean shit. but mike thought they did.( at least his 330 did lol )


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 01, 2017, 02:51:17 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=733132;image)

:)

From left to right, Schmoe Weider, Lou Ferrigno, Mike Mentzer, Kent Kuehn, Robbie Robinson, Rick Wayne and the ever slutty man-ho Ken Sprague.

I suppose Ric Drasin was off that day.  Probably just tired from pounding Sprague's dirt star in another of those films he was "blackmailed" into doing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Ugly on July 01, 2017, 05:09:28 PM
From left to right, Schmoe Weider, Lou Ferrigno, Mike Mentzer, Kent Kuehn, Robbie Robinson, Rick Wayne and the ever slutty man-ho Ken Sprague.

I suppose Ric Drasin was off that day.  Probably just tired from pounding Sprague's dirt star in another of those films he was "blackmailed" into doing.

Queer post, which is sorta your thing.

Schmoe this, schmoe that - a bit obsessed with men fucking men, it seems.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 01, 2017, 10:02:42 PM
Queer post, which is sorta your thing.

Schmoe this, schmoe that - a bit obsessed with men fucking men, it seems.

Fuck that, ace.   "Obsessed"?  Yeah, with the truth.  Have a nice day, kiddo.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 01, 2017, 10:49:15 PM
Probably started soon after and shut down any chance of being taller than 5'8" to 5' 9".  Probably the main reason so many of todays "bodybuilders" are below average height.  AS supplementation sends a signal to your body that puberty has begun and this in turn sends a signal to begin the epiphyseal process and BINGO!  You don't get any taller.

Doctors here can correct as they see fit as I am no physician.  


I'm not sure if your reasoning is correct. You may be right but I remember Mike stating that he was taller than his father and I believe Ray was taller than Mike. Just like people criticize Lee Priest for being a midget because he juiced so early when he turned out taller than both his parents. Arnold was popping dbols like candy at 15 yo and it didn't hurt his height.

Also, during puberty, that's when testosterone shoots up and since all anabolic steroids are derivatives of testosterone I'm not sure how much of a role, if any, anabolic hormones play in stifling a man's height.

Also, I think men that tend to be short in stature tend to gravitate toward bbing and also are more successful in packing on muscle than their taller brethen.

Perhaps others more knowledgeable, like Van B, can chime in on this.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 02, 2017, 05:01:26 AM
the medical establishments have said that using gear to soon CAN cause the growth plates at the bones to stop . basically making you stay at the height you were when you started taking gear. now most guys start gear about 15-18 or even later so basically your done growing anyways. but the same establishment used to say lifting weights before a certain age would also stunt your growthh too. lol. who knows


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: funk51 on July 02, 2017, 10:39:01 AM
first pic=mike at 19 years of age training on 5-6 days a week volume before he discovered the magical HIT system that transformed him on only a few sets 2-3 days a week.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 02, 2017, 10:43:51 AM
Mentzer had the type of physique that drew admiration instead of flies. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 02, 2017, 11:00:52 AM
Mentzer had the type of physique that drew admiration instead of flies. 

LOL!

So true.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 02, 2017, 01:31:30 PM
his "hit" didnt build his body. many days and hours in the gym over years built it. his hit was a way to make a buck. period.  its just a training system. no more. no less. he didnt use it. he didnt get his size with it. he got everything from normal workouts. but later he could drop some time in the gym. its a great way to keep your gains with minimal work. but only for brief times. if you use it to long you burn out overtrain and go backwards in progress.  he was 19 in pic and i think 27 or 28 in other pic.  look at viator at 19 and in his 30s when he was still competing and doing regular workouts. he didnt do his nautilus or hit or anything close to it. hell he was already a monster when jones first used him to sell his "nautilus system"  . mike was a good bodybuilder when he stood alone. but when he was with other bodybuilders he didnt look so hot. he was very small. the only good thing mike did was got guys re thinking how much time they devoted to training. but if you look back at the bodies in the 70s they looked awesome. now days they dont train the same way take to many drugs and are just big bloof balls. dont lift heavy dont train long and dont train as often.  they stay on drugs year round too. bring back the 70s!!!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Van_Bilderass on July 02, 2017, 02:52:56 PM


I'm not sure if your reasoning is correct. You may be right but I remember Mike stating that he was taller than his father and I believe Ray was taller than Mike. Just like people criticize Lee Priest for being a midget because he juiced so early when he turned out taller than both his parents. Arnold was popping dbols like candy at 15 yo and it didn't hurt his height.

Also, during puberty, that's when testosterone shoots up and since all anabolic steroids are derivatives of testosterone I'm not sure how much of a role, if any, anabolic hormones play in stifling a man's height.

Also, I think men that tend to be short in stature tend to gravitate toward bbing and also are more successful in packing on muscle than their taller brethen.

Perhaps others more knowledgeable, like Van B, can chime in on this.

It's estrogen which seals the growth plates. That's why Arimidex can increase height according to studies. Interestingly it has been combined with Anavar in some study to further increase height IIRC. Anavar doesn't convert to estrogen as some reading might not know.

Theoretically steroids could stunt growth, though most start after their big growth spurt in puberty, even if they start real young. I don't know how much of an impact they could have on that final smaller growth period in the late teens and after.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Ugly on July 02, 2017, 04:23:17 PM
Fuck that, ace.   "Obsessed"?  Yeah, with the truth.  Have a nice day, kiddo.

Yeah, you been schmoeing this and that forever. Explains your "contempt" for queers and transwhatevers, anyway.

(Also, truth is kryptonite for cultists, dummy. You swallow what you're told, like you did with "The Christ." Just traded your myth for a TMZ celeb-pres is all.)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 02, 2017, 05:08:45 PM
Yeah, you been schmoeing this and that forever. Explains your "contempt" for queers and transwhatevers, anyway.

(Also, truth is kryptonite for cultists, dummy. You swallow what you're told, like you did with "The Christ." Just traded your myth for a TMZ celeb-pres is all.)

Easy there Schmoezilla.   


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 02, 2017, 05:37:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 02, 2017, 06:55:01 PM
Stars like Robbie, Mike and even Arnold didn't like losing to Zane who was a lighter built guy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 02, 2017, 11:21:52 PM
It's estrogen which seals the growth plates. That's why Arimidex can increase height according to studies. Interestingly it has been combined with Anavar in some study to further increase height IIRC. Anavar doesn't convert to estrogen as some reading might not know.

Theoretically steroids could stunt growth, though most start after their big growth spurt in puberty, even if they start real young. I don't know how much of an impact they could have on that final smaller growth period in the late teens and after.

Interesting. I did not know that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 02, 2017, 11:23:56 PM
Stars like Robbie, Mike and even Arnold didn't like losing to Zane who was a lighter built guy.

I don't think they liked losing regardless of weight differences.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 02, 2017, 11:31:00 PM
I don't think they liked losing regardless of weight differences.

Quite true, however bodybuilding is about getting really big muscles so Zane was the exception. In other words, a bigger Zane should beat a smaller Frank if everything else is equal.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 02, 2017, 11:35:24 PM
Quite true, however bodybuilding is about getting really big muscles so Zane was the exception. In other words, a bigger Zane should beat a smaller Frank if everything else is equal.

True.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 03, 2017, 12:43:49 AM
his "hit" didnt build his body. many days and hours in the gym over years built it. his hit was a way to make a buck. period.  its just a training system. no more. no less. he didnt use it. he didnt get his size with it. he got everything from normal workouts. but later he could drop some time in the gym. its a great way to keep your gains with minimal work. but only for brief times. if you use it to long you burn out overtrain and go backwards in progress.  he was 19 in pic and i think 27 or 28 in other pic.  look at viator at 19 and in his 30s when he was still competing and doing regular workouts. he didnt do his nautilus or hit or anything close to it. hell he was already a monster when jones first used him to sell his "nautilus system"  . mike was a good bodybuilder when he stood alone. but when he was with other bodybuilders he didnt look so hot. he was very small. the only good thing mike did was got guys re thinking how much time they devoted to training. but if you look back at the bodies in the 70s they looked awesome. now days they dont train the same way take to many drugs and are just big bloof balls. dont lift heavy dont train long and dont train as often.  they stay on drugs year round too. bring back the 70s!!!

so when he said that he was doing Jones style HIT in 76-77 he was lying?

training full body 3 times a week is brutally hard and I'm really surprised that he actually made gains on it


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on July 03, 2017, 04:30:53 AM
so when he said that he was doing Jones style HIT in 76-77 he was lying?

training full body 3 times a week is brutally hard and I'm really surprised that he actually made gains on it

not unless you train hard it isnt....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 03, 2017, 07:03:13 AM
Just because mike built his physique with volume does not mean his later training programs where false. I prefer to use both from time to time in order to break a stall in training. I prefer volume as it gives the pump and release great uphoria with the workouts and leaves me feeling like i worked everything. With hit i get gains but not the imediate satisfaction of a good feeling workout.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 03, 2017, 07:20:03 AM
Euphoria.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 03, 2017, 12:06:00 PM
first of all what the "champs" wrote in the magazines ( most were ghost written anyways) and the truth was always different. they wrote what would sell. what they wanted people to believe they did or ate or whatever. the mags wanted us to think our heros were super humans trained for hours everyday used weights heavy enough to crush a truck etc. used vitamins and powders. used rubber bands and cables when traveling  wore stupid type tank tops and wrist bracelets too. lol so when mike said he trained this way or that it was about promoting his courses. t shirts and get seminars etc. what and how he trained and most trained was always a bit different then what they said. one time i was talking with tom prince in golds and he was looking at a muscle mag and it had him training chest. he was laughing. i said whats so funny.  he showed me the mag and said i got 7000 bucks for this article.  i dont do anything like this in my training!!!  so remember what they say in the mags is to sell. period. mike didnt use "hit" like he wanted people to believe. he did the pryamid sets and only counted the last set as a working set. so 4-5 sets per exercise like everyone else but only counted one. often he would do a few more sets. and when he was asked why he did more than just one set his response was " i do it for assurance". 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 03, 2017, 12:35:13 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on July 03, 2017, 12:36:18 PM
that is a great pic of mike


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 04, 2017, 04:26:22 AM
first of all what the "champs" wrote in the magazines ( most were ghost written anyways) and the truth was always different. they wrote what would sell. what they wanted people to believe they did or ate or whatever. the mags wanted us to think our heros were super humans trained for hours everyday used weights heavy enough to crush a truck etc. used vitamins and powders. used rubber bands and cables when traveling  wore stupid type tank tops and wrist bracelets too. lol so when mike said he trained this way or that it was about promoting his courses. t shirts and get seminars etc. what and how he trained and most trained was always a bit different then what they said. one time i was talking with tom prince in golds and he was looking at a muscle mag and it had him training chest. he was laughing. i said whats so funny.  he showed me the mag and said i got 7000 bucks for this article.  i dont do anything like this in my training!!!  so remember what they say in the mags is to sell. period. mike didnt use "hit" like he wanted people to believe. he did the pryamid sets and only counted the last set as a working set. so 4-5 sets per exercise like everyone else but only counted one. often he would do a few more sets. and when he was asked why he did more than just one set his response was " i do it for assurance". 

do those warm up sets before the last set to failure do anything go aid muscle gain?

according to mike and AJ they don't and the only set that creates gains is hat blast set to failure

also did mike look better and fuller in the pecs in 76-77 when he was training 3 times per week?

NO do us a favor please, post up a shot or 2 from 76-77 when he was doing 3 day per week and another shot or two from 78-80 when he switched to training each part twice a week

thanks bro


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 04, 2017, 06:20:36 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 04, 2017, 06:22:17 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 04, 2017, 06:23:01 AM
exercise alone doesnt change the body much when your already advanced. its the DRUGS  excuse me the response to DRUGS. and again just cuz someone says they trained 1 bodypart a week or everyday doesnt make it the TRUTH. anyone who believes this crap is retarded and im tired of saying how mike really trained. people will still believe what they have read in a magazine. or even heard in his seminars. post all the pics of anytime in his life it doesnt change how he trained and dieted and what drugs he took to get there. look at arnold. when he wasnt getting ready for a show he shrunk he could of easily came out with a course ( he did sell courses too by the way) that said gain 60 pounds in 30 days. train 2 hours a day 6 days a week and go from 170 to 230 and win mr olympia. was it the "training" or the drugs or the bodys response?  mike was a good bodybuilder but he wasnt honest. he did what sold. and people to this day still believe the crap. where are all the so called "hit" clients that mike had? have they won anything? do they ever say i owe it all to mike mentzer? according to mike he had thousands in person and phone consultation clients. if so they should be 500 lbs and 2 percent bodyfat by now. lmfao. case closed. im done commenting about mike. may he rest in peace and ray too. casey as well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 04, 2017, 06:23:36 AM
that pic is of ray not mike with rachel


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 04, 2017, 06:34:01 AM
that pic is of ray not mike with rachel

Is that Rachel?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 04, 2017, 06:36:09 AM
Is that Rachel?

Yup.  And that is Ray next to her.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 04, 2017, 07:33:06 AM
exercise alone doesnt change the body much when your already advanced. its the DRUGS  excuse me the response to DRUGS. and again just cuz someone says they trained 1 bodypart a week or everyday doesnt make it the TRUTH. anyone who believes this crap is retarded and im tired of saying how mike really trained. people will still believe what they have read in a magazine. or even heard in his seminars. post all the pics of anytime in his life it doesnt change how he trained and dieted and what drugs he took to get there. look at arnold. when he wasnt getting ready for a show he shrunk he could of easily came out with a course ( he did sell courses too by the way) that said gain 60 pounds in 30 days. train 2 hours a day 6 days a week and go from 170 to 230 and win mr olympia. was it the "training" or the drugs or the bodys response?  mike was a good bodybuilder but he wasnt honest. he did what sold. and people to this day still believe the crap. where are all the so called "hit" clients that mike had? have they won anything? do they ever say i owe it all to mike mentzer? according to mike he had thousands in person and phone consultation clients. if so they should be 500 lbs and 2 percent bodyfat by now. lmfao. case closed. im done commenting about mike. may he rest in peace and ray too. casey as well.

before he got all loony with this training once a week horseshit he was training clients 3 days a week on a 3 was split

this was in the early 9th

he got Aaron baker on that program and he gained lots of quaility muscle

you can see it when yo compare Aaron first WBF contest and the second

hey nether animal post up a comparison shot of Baker in the first WBF show to the second WBF show please

I know you have them on your hard drive brosef


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 04, 2017, 08:45:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 04, 2017, 09:57:40 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 04, 2017, 10:38:07 AM
Here is a photo of Ray and Rachel. Ray told me things fell apart between them mainly because of her being more religious. Every time Ray did a seminar some woman would fancy him. So he did have appeal to them.

I edited the photo a bit.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 04, 2017, 01:03:08 PM
yup thats mostly it. she was a religious freak . but not so religious ray ( and few others) didnt give it to her pretty good WITHOUT having to marry her.  now back to mike and aron baker. how you look at a contest isnt just from your training. its mostly from dieting. you can be good and do this workout and look like shit the next time doing the exact same contest.  so training isnt the main thing for that. ( it helps dont get me wrong but carbing is the most beneficial) also so they said they trained this way did they say how much they increased their drugs? or switched them around? NO THEY DONT/ my point again is just cuz they said they trained that way doesnt mean they did.   and the other thread your right  arthur jones and  mike both said the first few sets were a waste of time that you only grow on the last final all out balls to the wall set.  on paper and in theory they are right. but in reality they are not right. yes growth has to be forced. the body doesnt like to change. but you cant grow each and every set of every exercise of every workout. its not possible. the body needs a warm up to move maximum weights. the pyrimade system works great. no warm up? maximum weights? hellloooo injury.  try this start your car drop it in drive floor the pedal and hold it for as long as you can. try this every day. whats gonna happen? same to your body.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 04, 2017, 01:05:21 PM
Yup.  And that is Ray next to her.

Yeah I know that's Ray. I though it was a different girl, for some reason it kinda doesn't look like her smile


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 04, 2017, 01:16:44 PM
yep you have to warm up before making an all out effort,  that's a given

I'd also heard that fellas who did do AJ's full body wo 3 times a week made ggains on the legs but not elsewhere so much because they always did do legs first so after that effort their energy/power was shot and they couldn't put the necessary effort into upper body work after that



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 04, 2017, 01:25:17 PM
Best gains I ever made was near 20 years ago when I was 30. I did a MondAy Wednesday Friday program. Chest back on monday, Wednesday legs, Friday shoulders and arms. I never juiced so I feel I needed more rest because of that fact. I did a couple warm up sets for each exercise then 3 to 5 working sets after the warm up.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 04, 2017, 04:32:41 PM
first of all what the "champs" wrote in the magazines ( most were ghost written anyways) and the truth was always different. they wrote what would sell. what they wanted people to believe they did or ate or whatever. the mags wanted us to think our heros were super humans trained for hours everyday used weights heavy enough to crush a truck etc. used vitamins and powders. used rubber bands and cables when traveling  wore stupid type tank tops and wrist bracelets too. lol so when mike said he trained this way or that it was about promoting his courses. t shirts and get seminars etc. what and how he trained and most trained was always a bit different then what they said. one time i was talking with tom prince in golds and he was looking at a muscle mag and it had him training chest. he was laughing. i said whats so funny.  he showed me the mag and said i got 7000 bucks for this article.  i dont do anything like this in my training!!!  so remember what they say in the mags is to sell. period. mike didnt use "hit" like he wanted people to believe. he did the pryamid sets and only counted the last set as a working set. so 4-5 sets per exercise like everyone else but only counted one. often he would do a few more sets. and when he was asked why he did more than just one set his response was " i do it for assurance".  

This is an over statement. Most of what was published in bodybuilding magazines was what writers and champions believed at the time. If you read magazines from the 1940s you would know that. When we look back we now know that many of the ideas and theories were not quite right. For example, everyone believed that doing twists with a broom handle or bar would result in a smaller waist. In 1968 I tested that idea and did half an hour of twists a day for two weeks. Result? No difference in waist size. So I knew that was false.

Nutrition ideas were also false. We were encouraged to take vitamin supplements and more protein. I was at UBC in the early 1960s and Lionel Pugh, a professor, asked me if I took supplements. I told him I took vitamin B complex and C. He said, "The sewers of Vancouver are filled with vitamins!" That embarrassed me so I headed to the university library and studied nutrition. He was right, bodybuilders took too many supplements. Everything we needed was provided by a balanced diet and more food. There was no need for extra protein like all the magazines said. In those days we believed we needed more protein because muscles were composed of protein and other things. Well, there is more water in muscles than protein! So should we drink more water?

I never saw Mike train but I know what Ray did. He lived at my place for a year and worked at my gyms then. I will outline his method in another post.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tommywishbone on July 04, 2017, 05:13:07 PM
first of all what the "champs" wrote in the magazines ( most were ghost written anyways) and the truth was always different. they wrote what would sell. what they wanted people to believe they did or ate or whatever. the mags wanted us to think our heros were super humans trained for hours everyday used weights heavy enough to crush a truck etc. used vitamins and powders. used rubber bands and cables when traveling  wore stupid type tank tops and wrist bracelets too. lol so when mike said he trained this way or that it was about promoting his courses. t shirts and get seminars etc. what and how he trained and most trained was always a bit different then what they said. one time i was talking with tom prince in golds and he was looking at a muscle mag and it had him training chest. he was laughing. i said whats so funny.  he showed me the mag and said i got 7000 bucks for this article.  i dont do anything like this in my training!!!  so remember what they say in the mags is to sell. period. mike didnt use "hit" like he wanted people to believe. he did the pryamid sets and only counted the last set as a working set. so 4-5 sets per exercise like everyone else but only counted one. often he would do a few more sets. and when he was asked why he did more than just one set his response was " i do it for assurance". 

LOL! Every writer of every single article in totality, in any bodybuilding mag ever published never made $7,000.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 04, 2017, 06:02:07 PM
LOL! Every writer of every single article in totality, in any bodybuilding mag ever published never made $7,000.

I wasn't paid for my articles in most muscle magazines. Photos got peanuts. Two articles that were published in IronMan in 2000 and 2001 earned me a subscription for two years. That was okay.

So I doubt anyone was paid much by Weider, either. He had a reputation of not paying. Dave Draper sued Joe but settled before going to court. We all felt Dave missed out on getting much more.

I think Joe would give muscle guys space in his magazines as payment. Editors were not paid much either. It was all a pipedream.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 04, 2017, 06:22:03 PM
This is an over statement. Most of what was published in bodybuilding magazines was what writers and champions believed at the time. If you read magazines from the 1940s you would know that. When we look back we now know that many of the ideas and theories were not quite right. For example, everyone believed that doing twists with a broom handle or bar would result in a smaller waist. In 1968 I tested that idea and did half an hour of twists a day for two weeks. Result? No difference in waist size. So I knew that was false.

Nutrition ideas were also false. We were encouraged to take vitamin supplements and more protein. I was at UBC in the early 1960s and Lionel Pugh, a professor, asked me if I took supplements. I told him I took vitamin B complex and C. He said, "The sewers of Vancouver are filled with vitamins!" That embarrassed me so I headed to the university library and studied nutrition. He was right, bodybuilders took too many supplements. Everything we needed was provided by a balanced diet and more food. There was no need for extra protein like all the magazines said. In those days we believed we needed more protein because muscles were composed of protein and other things. Well, there is more water in muscles than protein! So should we drink more water?

I never saw Mike train but I know what Ray did. He lived at my place for a year and worked at my gyms then. I will outline his method in another post.



I saw the Mentzers and Viator train together in the late 70s at the original Gold's.  Unless they were putting on an act they trained as they promoted themselves doing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Running Wild on July 04, 2017, 06:22:39 PM
Ray's midsection looks much better.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=733642;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on July 04, 2017, 09:25:31 PM
When Ray was in Sydney he gave seminars and also conducted two training camps at two of my gyms. Had two gyms then. He trained a couple of bodybuilders and one made good gains doing what Ray said.

Essentially you train body parts twice a week....once directly and once indirectly. He would alternate push and pull movements and combine chest with biceps and back with triceps done on different days. On back days the biceps are getting an indirect workout. On chest days the triceps are getting an indirect workout. Legs were on the day between. Sometimes he did shoulders and calves on the Saturday. He surely didn't do what I would say was volume training. His protocols were a challenge to finish and most people found that method too difficult and taxing. Ray and I agreed that to stimulate hypertrophy you had to exhaust the muscle and the symptoms were the same no matter how you achieved it. Ray's method got there quicker than mine. What I found was that almost all the champs needed many, many near maximal sets to get huge muscles. Ray boasted that he could exhaust a muscle in one rep. No one took him up on his challenge. I suspect that 'rep' would be sustained, etc.

Ray was quite knowledgeable about how to do exercises. Hand positions and that sort of thing made a difference so he watched for those things when helping others. I recall his changing my hand position on an exercise at Golds Gym in Venice in 1991. I was doing chest presses on a Hammer machine. Oh, about machines. For some strange reason few people used Nautilus at Golds Venice. They were in the second room so easy to access even in busy times. I guess there was a rebound from what Arthur Jones wrote so most of the muscleheads used free weights or equipment in the main gym area.

Ray stayed at my place for about a year back in 87-88. Kathy and their daughter, Dagny, stayed longer as Ray moved out. I had introduced him to Pam who he eventually married. They all returned to LA in 88.

One day when I was training triceps I finished up using a heavy stack for lying triceps extensions. Ray saw what I was doing and without any warm up proceeded to duplicate my set. After he finished he rubbed his elbows. Silly of him to not warm his elbows up. I guess he figured he was much stronger than me so could handle the weight with ease. Not so. I had been training for a while on that exercise so was able to handle more weight than anyone else in the gym in that movement. Ray was a big guy. Muscle for muscle one of the biggest guys I have seen. Somehow he doesn't look that big in photos.

One day at Golds I introduced Ray to Paul Dillet. Paul was weighing 290 that day and even though Ray was over 260 he looked small beside Paul. Afterwards he had to mention how ugly Paul's veins were. He was amazed that I had met more people than he had in the gym and he lived there. Well, Ray didn't go out of his way to talk to others. He just wanted to be left alone.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 04, 2017, 11:32:51 PM
I was also training at Gold's in 1991 and considered Dillet the biggest bber I have ever seen in person.

He just seemed like a different species from another planet. He also looked intimidating with that Frankenstein head.

I was also surprised at how easy he trained. Never really pushed himself and just kind of went through the motions.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 05, 2017, 04:39:53 AM
you basically said the same thing i said about the nutrition training supplements etc. magazines pushed the stuff told us our champs were using this and that so we would buy it too. did they take it? most didnt and still dont. it was used to sell and make money. but we believed them because it was in the magazines and we thought it had to be true. lol   in reality we dont need them eat food. we dont need alot pf protein or vitamins but the mags wants us to buy their products ( even though some claim they dont own the supplements. lol ) when tom got paid it wasnt weider he was not under contract with weider it was actually muscle mag if i remember correctly.  he had another mag i think iron man not sure and said he got 2000 for the workout in that one that he didnt do either. he was laughing about them. again im going off what he said i dont know for sure how much he got but thats what he said.  and yes dillet was a lazy bodybuilder but responds very well to drugs. oops i mean his "electric muscle machine"  lmao. you guys remember that. him trying to sell that was like mentzer selling his crap. lol maybe worse. yes it was worse cuz mentzers could actually work ( for a while anyway)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 05, 2017, 06:29:11 AM
When Ray was in Sydney he gave seminars and also conducted two training camps at two of my gyms. Had two gyms then. He trained a couple of bodybuilders and one made good gains doing what Ray said.

Essentially you train body parts twice a week....once directly and once indirectly. He would alternate push and pull movements and combine chest with biceps and back with triceps done on different days. On back days the biceps are getting an indirect workout. On chest days the triceps are getting an indirect workout. Legs were on the day between. Sometimes he did shoulders and calves on the Saturday. He surely didn't do what I would say was volume training. His protocols were a challenge to finish and most people found that method too difficult and taxing. Ray and I agreed that to stimulate hypertrophy you had to exhaust the muscle and the symptoms were the same no matter how you achieved it. Ray's method got there quicker than mine. What I found was that almost all the champs needed many, many near maximal sets to get huge muscles. Ray boasted that he could exhaust a muscle in one rep. No one took him up on his challenge. I suspect that 'rep' would be sustained, etc.

Ray was quite knowledgeable about how to do exercises. Hand positions and that sort of thing made a difference so he watched for those things when helping others. I recall his changing my hand position on an exercise at Golds Gym in Venice in 1991. I was doing chest presses on a Hammer machine. Oh, about machines. For some strange reason few people used Nautilus at Golds Venice. They were in the second room so easy to access even in busy times. I guess there was a rebound from what Arthur Jones wrote so most of the muscleheads used free weights or equipment in the main gym area.

Ray stayed at my place for about a year back in 87-88. Kathy and their daughter, Dagny, stayed longer as Ray moved out. I had introduced him to Pam who he eventually married. They all returned to LA in 88.

One day when I was training triceps I finished up using a heavy stack for lying triceps extensions. Ray saw what I was doing and without any warm up proceeded to duplicate my set. After he finished he rubbed his elbows. Silly of him to not warm his elbows up. I guess he figured he was much stronger than me so could handle the weight with ease. Not so. I had been training for a while on that exercise so was able to handle more weight than anyone else in the gym in that movement. Ray was a big guy. Muscle for muscle one of the biggest guys I have seen. Somehow he doesn't look that big in photos.

One day at Golds I introduced Ray to Paul Dillet. Paul was weighing 290 that day and even though Ray was over 260 he looked small beside Paul. Afterwards he had to mention how ugly Paul's veins were. He was amazed that I had met more people than he had in the gym and he lived there. Well, Ray didn't go out of his way to talk to others. He just wanted to be left alone.

Great stuff. Man, Dillet was freakish.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SilverSpoon on July 05, 2017, 07:19:54 AM
yep you have to warm up before making an all out effort,  that's a given

I'd also heard that fellas who did do AJ's full body wo 3 times a week made ggains on the legs but not elsewhere so much because they always did do legs first so after that effort their energy/power was shot and they couldn't put the necessary effort into upper body work after that



A fellow who worked at Nautilus by the name of Joe Mullen had a very logical approach to alleviate this inherent problem with Jones' HIT (a problem I experienced myself).  Simply put, you evaluated each full body workout grading each exercise that you did.  Whichever exercise you did worst at, you trained first the next workout, with the best exercise from the previous workout being performed last.  My brother (who competed at NPC Nationals a number of times) commented to me that my training made me bigger, but that I was too balanced, nothing had a "wow" factor.  FYI, I was always natural, so I used to retort that maybe there was a key difference between my training and his (one he would never acknowledge).

Mullen recommended using compound movements almost exclusively, and to really only focus on single joint rotary movements if one were glaringly weak in an area, or if one were getting ready for a contest.  I can tell you that his method produced very good results for me when I was working crazy hours (70+ week) and was only training Monday and Friday of one week, then Wed. of the following week.

Another way around the problem many faced with Jones' training recommendation that I have used personally is to train the smaller bodyparts first as a warm up to the bigger compound movements.  I would start some of these workouts with movements such as 4-way neck, bicep curls (which never seem to get adequately directly worked in a true Nautilus program as they are only done towards the end of a workout) tricep, calves.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 05, 2017, 08:34:21 AM
^^^ Thanks for the feedback brosef

AJ wrote an article about true athletes training, you know like baseball, basketball players, sprinters, and he advised for ttrue athletes to make the muscles directly involved in their sports as strong as possible while training the other muscle to an adequate level of strength

me thinks that was/is great advice


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 05, 2017, 08:48:51 AM
aj was smart and mostly right. and yes you should always train a weak bodypart not only first in the workout BUT also the first workout of the week.  and you dont need alot of different exercises . the only reason to do 3 or 4 exercises is to get away from the boredom of doing one exercise to many times. each may hit the body part slightly different but not really anything to noticable. do you know that alot of strength and size doesnt actually come from the positive portion of the lift but actually from the negative. and yes depending on how hard you train you do need more rest. BUT if you dont max out dont go crazy failure with forced reps negatives etc like aj and mike wanted people to do then youcan train more often. in the day guys trained cuz they loved to train. love the sound of the weights hanging with friends etc. nowdays they hurry up like they hate training and being in the gym. get done fast take drugs eat.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 05, 2017, 10:57:31 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 05, 2017, 01:55:27 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 06, 2017, 03:59:41 AM
for the record    mike never trained dorian. NEVER. he always tried to make people think he did by taking photos of him "helping" dorian.   even dorian himself as always said mike didnt train him. he just incorporated some of his ideas into his training. period. again mike was trying to push his theory by using dorian.   mike was a decent guy but completly loony near the end. hell even in the 80s he was losing it.   


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 12:56:22 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 12:58:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 01:49:33 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 01:53:33 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on July 06, 2017, 02:00:54 PM
Mike seemed quite charismatic
Spoke well & presented a 'New Training Technique' that
A lot of people bought into.

He did have a good thick physique - chest & back lacked a bit.
And he looks very good when stood on his own.
Was to light at the 80 Olympia & no where near good enough to win
It that year.

Sadly he was emotionally unstable / destroyed by that Olympia
Likely not helped by taking recreational drugs he relied on,
Coupled with a fragile mind / ego.

He & Ray died far to young.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 02:04:51 PM
Mike seemed quite charismatic
Spoke well & presented a 'New Training Technique' that
A lot of people bought into.

He did have a good thick physique - chest & back lacked a bit.
And he looks very good when stood on his own.
Was to light at the 80 Olympia & no where near good enough to win
It that year.

Sadly he was emotionally unstable / destroyed by that Olympia
Likely not helped by taking recreational drugs he relied on,
Coupled with a fragile mind / ego.

He & Ray died far to young.

Arnold had a point about that gut thing  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 06, 2017, 03:14:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on July 06, 2017, 05:46:42 PM
Mike seemed quite charismatic
Spoke well & presented a 'New Training Technique' that
A lot of people bought into.

He did have a good thick physique - chest & back lacked a bit.
And he looks very good when stood on his own.
Was to light at the 80 Olympia & no where near good enough to win
It that year.

Sadly he was emotionally unstable / destroyed by that Olympia
Likely not helped by taking recreational drugs he relied on,
Coupled with a fragile mind / ego.

He & Ray died far to young.

forgot to mention he wasnt good enough to even beat zane or dickerson.....and died a junkie.   Some thong hero.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on July 06, 2017, 10:43:58 PM
Arnold had a point about that gut thing  ;D

I think that was because Mentzer used also heavy weights on his abs and midsection.

Arnold on the other hand would deliberately try to keep his waist trim and do broomstick twists and body weight exercise for abs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 06, 2017, 10:59:34 PM
I think that was because Mentzer used also heavy weights on his abs and midsection.

Arnold on the other hand would deliberately try to keep his waist trim and do broomstick twists and body weight exercise for abs.

The abs is a relatively thin muscle. Even when thickly develop they do not give the appearance of a distended gut. They will show through and appear more defined when fully developed.

The "broomstick" twist is an absolutely worthless exercise and will do nothing to "trim" your waist. The light twisting movement is a good warm up but you  can do that without a broom stick which adds nothing to the movement and only ties up the broom which should be used to sweep the floor.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on July 07, 2017, 12:23:15 AM
The abs is a relatively thin muscle. Even when thickly develop they do not give the appearance of a distended gut. They will show through and appear more defined when fully developed.

The "broomstick" twist is an absolutely worthless exercise and will do nothing to "trim" your waist. The light twisting movement is a good warm up but you  can do that without a broom stick which adds nothing to the movement and only ties up the broom which should be used to sweep the floor.




Yes - all that is correct.
Yet mike did have a turtle belly on stage
& Arnold didn't.

Also Arnold had the better overall physique than Mike
Considerably so.

Mike's Mental state & Recreational Drugs stopped him from
Improving his physique & he became a wreck mentally
& Physically.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 07, 2017, 02:45:56 AM



Yes - all that is correct.
Yet mike did have a turtle belly on stage
& Arnold didn't.

Also Arnold had the better overall physique than Mike
Considerably so.

Mike's Mental state & Recreational Drugs stopped him from
Improving his physique & he became a wreck mentally
& Physically.

Mike's "turtle belly" was in 1979. I think it had a lot to do with him not sucking in his stomach  like Arnold and most bbers at the time have always done. Even skinny guys will have some distention when they relax their gut and let it hang out.

Mike's life is a tragic story.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 07, 2017, 03:49:58 AM
like i always said i think mike was the first to use insulin. ( i have no proof he never admited it. he interviewed tim belknap about being a diabetic) and then it seemed his gut got out of control. also he ( and others) used the gh from dead people for a short time. plus he did train his abs heavy ( not heavy duty but he used weights)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 07, 2017, 03:58:25 AM
Quote from: NarcissisticDeity gink=topic=628065.msg8822335#msg8822335 date=1499382884
:)

that's the comparison pic that AJ took of Mentzer and Baldwin

at that time '74 they both had 17 1/4 inch arms and AJ predicted that Baldwin arms were near maxed out but that Mentzer could get his up to 19 due to having the longer ttriceps


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 07, 2017, 09:29:59 PM
that's the comparison pic that AJ took of Mentzer and Baldwin

at that time '74 they both had 17 1/4 inch arms and AJ predicted that Baldwin arms were near maxed out but that Mentzer could get his up to 19 due to having the longer ttriceps

Baldwin, never consider a thickly built bber, is killing Mentzer in the pec department.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 08, 2017, 12:01:48 AM
Baldwin, never consider a thickly built bber, is killing Mentzer in the pec department.

that's true

just as AJ said, Mentzer and Caesy V were limb guys while Franco was a torso guy


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 08, 2017, 01:51:32 AM
like i always said i think mike was the first to use insulin. ( i have no proof he never admited it. he interviewed tim belknap about being a diabetic) and then it seemed his gut got out of control. also he ( and others) used the gh from dead people for a short time. plus he did train his abs heavy ( not heavy duty but he used weights)

It was Milos who brought the use of insulin to bbing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 08, 2017, 03:36:57 AM
forgot to mention he wasnt good enough to even beat zane or dickerson.....and died a junkie.   Some thong hero.

This is manifestation of some unresolved daddy issues.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 08, 2017, 08:16:29 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 08, 2017, 08:19:29 AM
^^^ looks lik he Iis wearing the fake nose and glasses at the top pic  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 08:22:29 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 08:24:41 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 08:27:02 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 08:29:00 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 10:40:56 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 09, 2017, 01:04:24 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on July 09, 2017, 05:03:14 PM
1980 Olympia where he came in 5th.  I think it was a fair placing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jwb on July 09, 2017, 06:57:32 PM
It was Milos who brought the use of insulin to bbing.
gary strydom taught a few of my friends about it in 1989.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 09, 2017, 07:25:28 PM
1980 Olympia where he came in 5th.  I think it was a fair placing.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=734569;image)

Dickerson sucked big time. He had no business being on that stage and how he got second is beyond rational belief.  Arnold in 1st and Mentzer and Zane could go either way for 2nd.

Dickerson sucked.  Pointy elbows and a face and ears reminiscent of Curious George.  Plus he's a man-ho.  Disgusting creature that sold him self on film.   And Weider had Nubret exiled for making a "risqué" movie?  Dickerson probably was the blackmale in a Drasin film or two. 





Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 11, 2017, 02:48:45 AM
Dickerson sucked big time. He had no business being on that stage and how he got second is beyond rational belief.  Arnold in 1st and Mentzer and Zane could go either way for 2nd.

Dickerson sucked.  Pointy elbows and a face and ears reminiscent of Curious George.  Plus he's a man-ho.  Disgusting creature that sold him self on film.   And Weider had Nubret exiled for making a "risqué" movie?  Dickerson probably was the blackmale in a Drasin film or two. 





Mentzer may have over dieted and came in a bit small and flat than usual but standing next to Zane you can see how much bigger and thicker he is than Zane and just as conditioned.

I am also at a lost as to how Dickerson got into the top five. He looks good from the back and has tremendous calves but other than that very unimpressive.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 11, 2017, 03:11:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 11, 2017, 03:40:58 AM
dyke's physique was much more aesthetically pleasing than gay's


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on July 11, 2017, 03:51:05 AM
:)

Man, Mike's build was so fucking cool.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on July 11, 2017, 04:07:24 AM
Dickerson sucked big time. He had no business being on that stage and how he got second is beyond rational belief.  Arnold in 1st and Mentzer and Zane could go either way for 2nd.

Dickerson sucked.  Pointy elbows and a face and ears reminiscent of Curious George.  Plus he's a man-ho.  Disgusting creature that sold him self on film.   And Weider had Nubret exiled for making a "risqué" movie?  Dickerson probably was the blackmale in a Drasin film or two.  





I completely disagree about Dickerson. During that period he came in first or second in every contest he entered. He looked during this peak of his competitive years like he was cut from ice with his density. Look at all the Grand Prix he won and didn't he come in second in three Olympias? Look at that picture. Just amazing just standing there. Seeing him live next to another top champ made the other guy look bloated and soft.

Also Mentzer was far from as conditioned as Zane and Dickerson.  I think fans of high intensity have a warped impression on how good Viator and Mentzer were. They could do nothing wrong on stage in their subjective eyes.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 13, 2017, 02:11:51 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: karasan on July 13, 2017, 10:16:22 PM
If he had real confidence he could be the ultimate pussy slayer. He has the physique and rugged good looks, too bad he was too tense, kind of wooden personality.
He could only be the prophet of wannabe acne faced bbers.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 13, 2017, 11:43:30 PM
If he had real confidence he could be the ultimate pussy slayer. He has the physique and rugged good looks, too bad he was too tense, kind of wooden personality.
He could only be the prophet of wannabe acne faced bbers.

What are you talking about? Obviously you've never met Mike nor are aware of his reputation and how he was perceived by others. "Wooden personality"? Based on what? He was considered by most as very personable and I was pleased at what a good sense of humor he had. And as far as "pussy slaying" a writer once described him as "getting more ass than a toilet seat."

Both Mike and Ray had no trouble getting the hotties.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 13, 2017, 11:44:50 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=735389;image)

A young Howard looking pretty intense there.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: karasan on July 14, 2017, 12:30:40 AM
Happy to hear that, the guy seemed to have amazing potential, well above average intelligence and education, unique physiue and good looks, I dunno, what I read about his quarrel with Arnold he seemed lacking ease and humour Arnold had.
Getting more ass than a ladies' toilet seat, respect!

What are you talking about? Obviously you've never met Mike nor are aware of his reputation and how he was perceived by others. "Wooden personality"? Based on what? He was considered by most as very personable and I was pleased at what a good sense of humor he had. And as far as "pussy slaying" a writer once described him as "getting more ass than a toilet seat."

Both Mike and Ray had no trouble getting the hotties.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 14, 2017, 04:51:45 AM
Happy to hear that, the guy seemed to have amazing potential, well above average intelligence and education, unique physiue and good looks, I dunno, what I read about his quarrel with Arnold he seemed lacking ease and humour Arnold had.
Getting more ass than a ladies' toilet seat, respect!


Nothing like judging someone based on a second or third hand account of ONE encounter.

Boy, I loves me some interwebs!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Never1AShow on July 14, 2017, 05:10:37 AM
Imagine reading in all the muscle magazine about Mike Mentzer being such a god and the uncrowned Mr Olympia in 1980 and then being in Golds Venice day after day seeing him in there looking like a nobody fat sloppy looking dirtbag.  "is thatMike Mentzer?"

It's all illusion


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on July 14, 2017, 06:41:46 AM
What are you talking about? Obviously you've never met Mike nor are aware of his reputation and how he was perceived by others. "Wooden personality"? Based on what? He was considered by most as very personable and I was pleased at what a good sense of humor he had. And as far as "pussy slaying" a writer once described him as "getting more ass than a toilet seat."


No Homo?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: karasan on July 14, 2017, 06:59:26 AM
Nothing like judging someone based on a second or third hand account of ONE encounter.

Boy, I loves me some interwebs!
Rumour is, you love the sensation of spraying semen all over your fat sweaty face...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 14, 2017, 09:32:52 AM
yes milos brought insulin to the masses. tim belknap ( a bodybuilder in the 70 and 80s) was a diabetic and mike interviewed him. he was fascinated by tim who was short and massive and used insulin. mike didnt understand how being a diabetic tim could get huge. then a few months later mike shows up with a gut!! everyone knows now that insuling can and will give you a big bloated gut. mike never admited to using insulin back then but it seems like maybe he did. he got the insulin gut . just my opinion.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BIG AL MCKECHNIE on July 14, 2017, 10:59:21 AM
yes milos brought insulin to the masses. tim belknap ( a bodybuilder in the 70 and 80s) was a diabetic and mike interviewed him. he was fascinated by tim who was short and massive and used insulin. mike didnt understand how being a diabetic tim could get huge. then a few months later mike shows up with a gut!! everyone knows now that insuling can and will give you a big bloated gut. mike never admited to using insulin back then but it seems like maybe he did. he got the insulin gut . just my opinion.

Mike's first meeting and interview with Tim was early 1981. His big gut was apparent in 1979 when Tim was unknown and weighed 175. Mike did seem fascinated with Tim's insulin use in the interview that I believe was published in June 81 m+f when Tim was training for the Mr America.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: nukkaready on July 14, 2017, 11:30:33 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on July 14, 2017, 11:46:32 AM
I completely disagree about Dickerson. During that period he came in first or second in every contest he entered. He looked during this peak of his competitive years like he was cut from ice with his density. Look at all the Grand Prix he won and didn't he come in second in three Olympias? Look at that picture. Just amazing just standing there. Seeing him live next to another top champ made the other guy look bloated and soft.

Also Mentzer was far from as conditioned as Zane and Dickerson.  I think fans of high intensity have a warped impression on how good Viator and Mentzer were. They could do nothing wrong on stage in their subjective eyes.

I dunno...Mike's conditioning looks pretty kick-ass there.

But as much as I concur with The Scott's take on Elbow Dicksuckerson, the dude was sliced there.  And I also agree that many HIT folk tend to exaggerate just how good Viator and the Mentzers were, Casey in particular.  I probably would have given him first or *no less than second* at the 1982 Olympia, but he had a very wide, longish waist, oddly-shaped pecs that looked very flat when he got shredded, and a huge head.  He was also a terrible poser, at least in '82...no rhyme or reason to his routine at all.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 14, 2017, 11:58:52 AM
both dyke and gaysey were limb guys

good arms and legs but not so great torsos


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on July 14, 2017, 12:05:14 PM
both dyke and gaysey were limb guys

good arms and legs but not so great torsos

Very true.  Casey almost bucked the trend with his back, though.

And LOL at those nicknames :D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on July 14, 2017, 12:06:30 PM
:)

I remember this picture from one of MM mail order training programs
It's crazy how big his forearms and triceps look. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on July 14, 2017, 02:06:56 PM
Very true.  Casey almost bucked the trend with his back, though.

And LOL at those nicknames :D
dj181s gimmick commenting on his own gimmick posts...

take a quick skim of these and tell me its not dj.... ::)
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=profile;u=102618;sa=showPosts


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 14, 2017, 02:14:04 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 14, 2017, 02:25:25 PM
Nothing like judging someone based on a second or third hand account of ONE encounter.

Boy, I loves me some interwebs!

Actually, I saw Mike and had brief convos several times a week over a period of two years.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 14, 2017, 02:27:46 PM
Imagine reading in all the muscle magazine about Mike Mentzer being such a god and the uncrowned Mr Olympia in 1980 and then being in Golds Venice day after day seeing him in there looking like a nobody fat sloppy looking dirtbag.  "is thatMike Mentzer?"

It's all illusion

"fat sloppy looking dirtbag."

That was certainly not my impression.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 14, 2017, 02:35:05 PM
yes milos brought insulin to the masses. tim belknap ( a bodybuilder in the 70 and 80s) was a diabetic and mike interviewed him. he was fascinated by tim who was short and massive and used insulin. mike didnt understand how being a diabetic tim could get huge. then a few months later mike shows up with a gut!! everyone knows now that insuling can and will give you a big bloated gut. mike never admited to using insulin back then but it seems like maybe he did. he got the insulin gut . just my opinion.

I guarantee you that there were and are a lot of diabetics that bodybuild. Why would Mike think there was any connection between being a diabetic and being muscular? Most diabetics are fat. And it's not having diabetes that made them fat is being fat that made them a type 2 diabetic. Most type 1 are not fat.

MIke's gut was primarily due to him not holding it in. That applies to everyone. Look at his "gut" when he does. Insulin and gh does not in and of itself give you a distended belly. Maybe constantly stuffing yourself does. Just like the beer belly. No insulin or gh there. Just some heavy beer drinking constantly pushing your stomach out.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 14, 2017, 02:40:54 PM
:)

Pellius. See this is what I mean regarding wide hips in comparison with his waist.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on July 14, 2017, 02:51:33 PM
dj181s gimmick commenting on his own gimmick posts...

take a quick skim of these and tell me its not dj.... ::)
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=profile;u=102618;sa=showPosts

Don't be an asshole.  I've already established my previous handles and make no bones about that.  Anyone with a modicum of intelligence could clearly see I've nothing to do with djabcxwz apart from half-agreeing him vis-à-vis the notion that so-called hit champs tended to be limb-dominant.

Aren't you the older guy pepping for a show?  Someone I wished the best, and who I thought I said should do very well?

Maybe I forgot to post said messages, but I meant to.  


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 14, 2017, 02:57:58 PM
yes lots of insulin with beer drinking. it only takes 67 grams of fast acting carbs to cause an insulin release. so a ber hashan that ( most do some donti kinow) so if your drinking alot of beer you get alot of insulin released. and yes alcohol causes stomach inflamation too plus it stretches your gut out. when mike was in contest mode he ate carbs and had alcohol every nite ( he said he used it to help relax) lol


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 12:06:17 AM
Pellius. See this is what I mean regarding wide hips in comparison with his waist.

When you do a "reply" it doesn't include the attached pics anymore. You have to do it separately.
Open pic in another tab then copy/paste into the "image" function in your reply so I know what
you are referring to.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 12:16:57 AM
yes lots of insulin with beer drinking. it only takes 67 grams of fast acting carbs to cause an insulin release. so a ber hashan that ( most do some donti kinow) so if your drinking alot of beer you get alot of insulin released. and yes alcohol causes stomach inflamation too plus it stretches your gut out. when mike was in contest mode he ate carbs and had alcohol every nite ( he said he used it to help relax) lol

I don't see how insulin per se, the actual mechanics, will cause a distended stomach. Same with HGH.

They give AIDS patients and children tons of hgh and no distended stomach. Millions of diabetics use tons of insulin, including my aunt, with no distended stomach. I want to distinguish between a fatso stomach and a distended gut. My uncle is the classic skinny/fat. Skinny arms/ skinny legs, narrow shoulders but distended belly. Loves his beer drinking. He even comments on how his stomach protrudes when he drinks while patting his belly and claiming it's a trophy of the good life. lol!

I can see the mechanics of stuffing your belly with food and liquids over the course of many years and make your gut protrude but I can't see how slin/gh stretches your belly.

Would be interested in Van B's opinion.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 12:20:31 AM
No Homo?

Never even crossed my mind that this comment could also apply to gays. And I don't think
it crossed the mind of the writer either. But I understand this is getbig and over the years
it's morphed into a very gay centric board. Seems no matter what is written here there's always someone who can find a gay angle.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 15, 2017, 03:16:39 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 15, 2017, 03:27:00 AM
When you do a "reply" it doesn't include the attached pics anymore. You have to do it separately.
Open pic in another tab then copy/paste into the "image" function in your reply so I know what
you are referring to.

If you click the  text on the quote from my post it takes you to the pertinent image, but either way:

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=735537;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 15, 2017, 05:09:22 AM
Don't be an asshole.  I've already established my previous handles and make no bones about that.  Anyone with a modicum of intelligence could clearly see I've nothing to do with djabcxwz apart from half-agreeing him vis-à-vis the notion that so-called hit champs tended to be limb-dominant.

Aren't you the older guy pepping for a show?  Someone I wished the best, and who I thought I said should do very well?

Maybe I forgot to post said messages, but I meant to.  

it's just a typical troll tactic from this turd

his usual route is to claim your a gimmick and not the ooriginal poster

although I will admit is was pretty cool that he made that spermataste dork melt and end up getting banned from the boards


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 15, 2017, 05:14:10 AM
growth hormone alone doesnt cause a big gut. using alot of it can cause the intestines to grow to. ( growth hormone is not site specific nor muscle specific per se)  insulin doesnt cause it either when used in small amounts. does a bodybuilder ever use ANYTHING in small amounts? you need the carbs( food) to stay alive when using insulin. more food more insulin more storage( size) eating alot distends stomach. insulin stores food. add in growth which increases your blood sugar so now you use more insulin and there you go. a viscious circle. insuline can add some muscle . growth just helps the scales get bigger numbers( and can add some muscle)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 15, 2017, 05:23:41 AM
growth hormone alone doesnt cause a big gut. using alot of it can cause the intestines to grow to. ( growth hormone is not site specific nor muscle specific per se)  insulin doesnt cause it either when used in small amounts. does a bodybuilder ever use ANYTHING in small amounts? you need the carbs( food) to stay alive when using insulin. more food more insulin more storage( size) eating alot distends stomach. insulin stores food. add in growth which increases your blood sugar so now you use more insulin and there you go. a viscious circle. insuline can add some muscle . growth just helps the scales get bigger numbers( and can add some muscle)

you're a pretty smart dude

how long you been doing this hobby?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 15, 2017, 12:31:35 PM
im 53 been at it since 12. been around and seen alot. thanks.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on July 15, 2017, 01:05:48 PM
growth hormone alone doesnt cause a big gut. using alot of it can cause the intestines to grow to. ( growth hormone is not site specific nor muscle specific per se)  insulin doesnt cause it either when used in small amounts. does a bodybuilder ever use ANYTHING in small amounts? you need the carbs( food) to stay alive when using insulin. more food more insulin more storage( size) eating alot distends stomach. insulin stores food. add in growth which increases your blood sugar so now you use more insulin and there you go. a viscious circle. insuline can add some muscle . growth just helps the scales get bigger numbers( and can add some muscle)

Ah, no.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on July 15, 2017, 01:10:06 PM
you're a pretty smart dude

how long you been doing this hobby?

Lol. Break out the drug talk and dj suddenly is attracted like moth to a light.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 15, 2017, 01:16:45 PM
Lol. Break out the drug talk and dj suddenly is attracted like moth to a light.

 ;D

this stuff is interesting shit

just been watching YouTube vids on weight cutting to see if it's safe to drop 30 pounds in less than 24 hrs to make weight

10 is definitely doable and a breeze but not sure if 30 would be


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on July 15, 2017, 01:17:42 PM
;D

this stuff is interesting shit

just been watching YouTube vids on weight cutting to see if it's safe to drop 30 pounds in less than 24 hrs to make weight

10 is definitely doable and a breeze but not sure if 30 would be
dropping 1/4 of your overall bodyweight is never a good idea.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 15, 2017, 02:40:20 PM
ummm yes. what i posted is fact. like i have always said here im not here to argue or name call or make shit up just to post. if i post something its the truth. not hearsay not what i read or thought.  except when i said i think mike used insulin. my opinion. he got the muscular big gut .  he was the first to show it on stage weather it was cuz he couldnt hold it in or not he still had a gut. if his muscles were strong the gut shouldnt distend when the abs are visable unless its protruding from the inside out causing it. so large intestines will do that plus a huge stomach from over eating. insulin use will cause that. period. im done defending myself.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on July 15, 2017, 07:01:04 PM
ummm yes. what i posted is fact. like i have always said here im not here to argue or name call or make shit up just to post. if i post something its the truth. not hearsay not what i read or thought.  except when i said i think mike used insulin. my opinion. he got the muscular big gut .  he was the first to show it on stage weather it was cuz he couldnt hold it in or not he still had a gut. if his muscles were strong the gut shouldnt distend when the abs are visable unless its protruding from the inside out causing it. so large intestines will do that plus a huge stomach from over eating. insulin use will cause that. period. im done defending myself.

Just because you say "fact" when posting your opinion doesn't make it so no matter how hard you try.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 15, 2017, 11:27:08 PM
dropping 1/4 of your overall bodyweight is never a good idea.

more like 1/5 or 20%

supposedly 10% is really pushing it


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 11:49:51 PM
both dyke and gaysey were limb guys

good arms and legs but not so great torsos

I was shocked when you said you were in your forties. I thought for sure you were in your twenties. A very immature mid-twenties.

Talk about arrested development.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 11:51:06 PM
I remember this picture from one of MM mail order training programs
It's crazy how big his forearms and triceps look. 

Yup. Remember that pic well. And he didn't have half his ass hanging out like they do today.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 15, 2017, 11:58:03 PM
Pellius. See this is what I mean regarding wide hips in comparison with his waist.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=735537;image)

Hmm. I don't see it. I do see a vary narrow waist. Hips look fine to me. Maybe because he's stretch out with his arms raised that it narrows his waist that it gives the illusion of wide hips.

I see  nothing out of place here in just a normal posture.

(http://broscience.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Mike-Mentzer-Beach-Colour-3.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on July 16, 2017, 12:03:05 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=735537;image)

Hmm. I don't see it. I do see a vary narrow waist. Hips look fine to me. Maybe because he's stretch out with his arms raised that it narrows his waist that it gives the illusion of wide hips.

I see  nothing out of place here in just a normal posture.

(http://broscience.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Mike-Mentzer-Beach-Colour-3.jpg)

Exactly. He had average hips but a very small waist when you analyse it. Probably 30 inches in that top shot considering he was about 5'8".


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 16, 2017, 12:15:59 AM
growth hormone alone doesnt cause a big gut. using alot of it can cause the intestines to grow to. ( growth hormone is not site specific nor muscle specific per se)  insulin doesnt cause it either when used in small amounts. does a bodybuilder ever use ANYTHING in small amounts? you need the carbs( food) to stay alive when using insulin. more food more insulin more storage( size) eating alot distends stomach. insulin stores food. add in growth which increases your blood sugar so now you use more insulin and there you go. a viscious circle. insuline can add some muscle . growth just helps the scales get bigger numbers( and can add some muscle)

What it sounds like is that using slin forces you to eat more so you don't go hypo causing distention. So again it's not the slin per se that causes the distended stomach. And I'm not sure what you mean by insulin storing food. Perhaps the wording is what confuses me. Slin shuttles nutrients into the cells. Excess calories is stored as fat. Perhaps that's what you mean. But, of course, you don't need exo slin for that. Non insulin using fatsos abound in our culture.

So, again, I think it is excess consumption which stretches out the stomach causing distention. And whatever Mike was eating I doubt it was in excess causing distention given it was pre contest and most think he over dieted coming in small.  And I don't think the hgh causes the intestines or organs  to grow. Intestine don't grow anymore than veins grow. I guess it might expand by over eating but that doesn't even make sense. In fact, research and development is done right now trying to use stem cells to make intestines grow for people that have cancer and the like where part of their intestines have to be cut out. If hgh could grow the intestines and other organs (lungs, heart, kidneys) it would be used. I don't think anybody increased their lung capacity or kidney function by using hgh. Kids and AIDS patient use tons of gh, more than most bbers use, without growing their organs or get distended bellies. Millions use just as much insulin as a pro bber without the distended gut.

Not looking for a fight but just presenting views to consider and debate towards a better understanding.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 16, 2017, 12:58:58 AM
I was shocked when you said you were in your forties. I thought for sure you were in your twenties. A very immature mid-twenties.

Talk about arrested development.

a female I dated for bout 4 weeks or so told me she felt like she was with a teenager when with me, and a said you mean like an 18 or 19 year old, and she said no, like a 13 or 14 year old


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 16, 2017, 05:12:38 AM
yes i said food just so as more people would get the understanding without having to write it all down. its a storage hormaone. it stores whats in the bloodstream. now if you could just take insulin and not eat and not die then no you would not get a big gut. but then again you wouldnt get any muscle bigger either. it needs the food to store( nutrients). males have more estrogen receptors sites in our midsection and thats storage for fat. however what insulin does is store fat around the internal  organs causing them to protrude. due to the high amount of carbs( food) people eat. add in the growth hormone and you get a double whammy effect. and no kids and others who use growth hormone do not use more than bodybuilders. diabetics do not use more insulin than bodybuilders. and bodybuilders are already fully grown when they use growth. bones are closed all ready so growth has to work on something. right? it doesnt make organs grow longer etc just adds fat to them basically. growth hormone alone is kinda useless for bodybuilding. insulin added makes it all work better. but nothing looks as good as just steroids hard work and clean eating.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 17, 2017, 05:13:56 AM
also hgh doesnt make organs "grow" like you was hoping they did in your post. thats like saying a man loses his arm so they give him hgh to make it "regrow" lol  doesnt work like that. i know you meant no harm in your post . just trying to explain it with a little humor.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 17, 2017, 05:41:49 AM
Rumour is, you love the sensation of spraying semen all over your fat sweaty face...

Gay response to a perfectly rational one.

I love Getbig.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 17, 2017, 05:46:08 AM
Actually, I saw Mike and had brief convos several times a week over a period of two years.

I didn't question you...unless karasan is your gimmick...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on July 17, 2017, 01:11:56 PM
A lot of 'Expert Facts ' on the use & Effects of HGH & Insulin

I would of though this 'Expert Factual Advice' is Highly needed
In the Camel Club Crew / Pro Bodybuilders in general to Help Reduce The Distended Gut Sydrome
I'm sure they will pay Big $ for this information.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on July 17, 2017, 01:38:07 PM
Curious to know, did Mentzer believe he was better than Arnold's all time best?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 17, 2017, 03:59:59 PM
no mike never said he was better than arnold in arnolds day. mike only said he was better than arnold in 80. he was actually always jealous of arnold and the others from that era. he was upset that he wasnt in pumping iron. ( he is in there for like half a second at the counter. he thought very highly of himself. he really beleieved the hype of himself and thought he was gonna be "the best ever" . so when that didnt happen he lost it. to bad cuz mike could of been mr olympia at least once if he wouldnt of descended into madness like he did.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on July 18, 2017, 02:24:12 AM
no mike never said he was better than arnold in arnolds day. mike only said he was better than arnold in 80. he was actually always jealous of arnold and the others from that era. he was upset that he wasnt in pumping iron. ( he is in there for like half a second at the counter. he thought very highly of himself. he really beleieved the hype of himself and thought he was gonna be "the best ever" . so when that didnt happen he lost it. to bad cuz mike could of been mr olympia at least once if he wouldnt of descended into madness like he did.

Mike vs franco would've been interesting. If he clearly won and didn't, he'd probably would've hung himself.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 18, 2017, 04:31:53 AM
lol thats funny. but no one was gonna beat franco in 1981. he wasnt that good but . . . . . . . .   anyways. they both kinda had the same build. rugged looking. thick too. both small (height but mike was a bit taller)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 18, 2017, 06:49:02 AM
lol thats funny. but no one was gonna beat franco in 1981. he wasnt that good but . . . . . . . .   anyways. they both kinda had the same build. rugged looking. thick too. both small (height but mike was a bit taller)

Nobody was going to beat franco because the contest was rigged just like 1980. Also 1975.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 18, 2017, 08:14:01 AM
spanko

fella had SHIT ARMS

were they even 16 inches lol

AJ said when he first saw him on stage he thought of a live Mr. Potatoe Head doll lolz

big torso and TINY ARMS


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 18, 2017, 09:58:35 AM
yes francos arm was never bigger than 17 . he had some fake measurments at 19 but they were never that big.75 wasnt rigged. 80 wasnt rigged. per se but no way was arnold gonna lose. 81 really wasnt rigged either but franco is arnolds buddy. its not like judges were told who to vote for.  they chose on their own but . . . . . .  and also franco was a former mr olympia. they always get better treatment on stage just because they are a mr olympia already.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 18, 2017, 10:11:23 AM
Mentzers arms were 18 5/8

no way spanko broke the 17 inch barrier

Lee Haney is a good dude but he was also a torso dominant guy

did his arms hit 18? hmmmmmm


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on July 18, 2017, 12:45:08 PM
Mentzers arms were 18 5/8

no way spanko broke the 17 inch barrier

Lee Haney is a good dude but he was also a torso dominant guy

did his arms hit 18? hmmmmmm




And your point being ??

Didn't stop him winning 8 olympias

Big Arms thankfully are not the only judging criteria


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 19, 2017, 06:43:00 AM
yes francos arm was never bigger than 17 . he had some fake measurments at 19 but they were never that big.75 wasnt rigged. 80 wasnt rigged. per se but no way was arnold gonna lose. 81 really wasnt rigged either but franco is arnolds buddy. its not like judges were told who to vote for.  they chose on their own but . . . . . .  and also franco was a former mr olympia. they always get better treatment on stage just because they are a mr olympia already.

Please.................. ...hahaha. The judges chose on their own. Ahahahaha.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 19, 2017, 09:38:01 AM
they DO chose on their own. they are NOT told who to pick. that is up to them. BUT they are influenced on their decisions. people scream fix and set up etc and that judges are told who to pick etc. bill pearl is/was a judge on many pro shows and he has never said he was told who to vote for. judges have their favorites for sure. and they dont always vote fairly. but they are never  told what to do.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 19, 2017, 09:56:11 AM
Wow!! Thanks for clearing that up. So nice to know that the judges have all the power. 😂😂😂

By the way, you just said they are influenced in their picks. No judge in a fair situation should ever be influenced. You are contradicting yourself, a judge whom is influenced may as well be paid off or told to judge according to an outside interest. No two ways about it.




Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 20, 2017, 05:46:26 AM
maybe influenced wasnt the right word. what i meant is they choose who they want but its an unwritten rule ( kinda) if arnold is competing he wins. he is BODYBUILDING. and franco is his buddy. plus the judges go with who was a past mr olympia etc and they get a special treatment sorta. if there are no other mr olympias competing then the one from a few years ago is considered the top guy defending his title. ( technically but not actually) and yes politics play a huge part in judging of anything. can they be bought? sure. are they? maybe . when there is money involved anything happens. would weider of said to anyone "vote for this guy"  no. but if you didnt you may not be a judge any longer. its a silent rule so to speak.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 20, 2017, 07:08:06 AM
maybe influenced wasnt the right word. what i meant is they choose who they want but its an unwritten rule ( kinda) if arnold is competing he wins. he is BODYBUILDING. and franco is his buddy. plus the judges go with who was a past mr olympia etc and they get a special treatment sorta. if there are no other mr olympias competing then the one from a few years ago is considered the top guy defending his title. ( technically but not actually) and yes politics play a huge part in judging of anything. can they be bought? sure. are they? maybe . when there is money involved anything happens. would weider of said to anyone "vote for this guy"  no. but if you didnt you may not be a judge any longer. its a silent rule so to speak.

Nice turn around, this post is what i was talking about. It leaves all doors open for a rigged contest.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 20, 2017, 09:18:28 AM
its not a turn around. i just had to put it in simplier terms for the less intelligent people to understand.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on July 20, 2017, 09:20:36 AM
A real muscular lean 19" arm is amazing. Too bad so many fatsos have 20" arms. Hell my grandma must have had 23" arms.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 20, 2017, 09:33:34 AM
yes a muscular arm looks much bigger than it is. and bodybuilding is ( was ) about creating an illusion. if your hips were wide you made your shoulders wider to make hips look small. big legs? make upper body bigger to balance them out . nowdays guys are just worried about getting big to be big. period. that is NOT bodybuilding. at least not like it should( used) to be. big but functional muscle is what its about. strive for proportions, symmetry size balance etc. not just big and puffy. they look like crap nowdays to us guys from the golden era. but to the younger guys the guys nowdays look awesome. BUT in 30 years the guys will be so sick/gross and stupid looking that even the guys from  today will say they suck but back in their day( current time) the guys were awesome. lol


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 20, 2017, 12:03:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: stuntmovie on July 20, 2017, 12:21:45 PM
BIGBY, Interesting comments made by you above. I'm gonna send you a message which you may find to be of interest.'


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on July 20, 2017, 12:30:08 PM
maybe influenced wasnt the right word. what i meant is they choose who they want but its an unwritten rule ( kinda) if arnold is competing he wins. he is BODYBUILDING. and franco is his buddy. plus the judges go with who was a past mr olympia etc and they get a special treatment sorta. if there are no other mr olympias competing then the one from a few years ago is considered the top guy defending his title. ( technically but not actually) and yes politics play a huge part in judging of anything. can they be bought? sure. are they? maybe . when there is money involved anything happens. would weider of said to anyone "vote for this guy"  no. but if you didnt you may not be a judge any longer. its a silent rule so to speak.

judges dont want to rock the boat, they all vote in a similar way as to keep getting invited on the expenses paid trips around the world.

In reality people have varying opinions, I for instance would lean more towards a complete balanced physique over mass for mass sake, if a guy had no calves then he wouldnt get a first place same as if he had zero arms.

Lots of guys do well with no calves but not that many with sub par arms.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 20, 2017, 12:50:08 PM
yes a muscular arm looks much bigger than it is. and bodybuilding is ( was ) about creating an illusion. if your hips were wide you made your shoulders wider to make hips look small. big legs? make upper body bigger to balance them out . nowdays guys are just worried about getting big to be big. period. that is NOT bodybuilding. at least not like it should( used) to be. big but functional muscle is what its about. strive for proportions, symmetry size balance etc. not just big and puffy. they look like crap nowdays to us guys from the golden era. but to the younger guys the guys nowdays look awesome. BUT in 30 years the guys will be so sick/gross and stupid looking that even the guys from  today will say they suck but back in their day( current time) the guys were awesome. lol

Arnold use to hit that twisting bicep post and his midsection would almost disappear. I am too lazy to post it.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 20, 2017, 12:52:07 PM
Arnold use to hit that twisting bicep post and his midsection would almost disappear. I am too lazy to post it.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 20, 2017, 01:04:12 PM
judges dont want to rock the boat, they all vote in a similar way as to keep getting invited on the expenses paid trips around the world.

In reality people have varying opinions, I for instance would lean more towards a complete balanced physique over mass for mass sake, if a guy had no calves then he wouldnt get a first place same as if he had zero arms.

Lots of guys do well with no calves but not that many with sub par arms.

Quote
judges dont want to rock the boat, they all vote in a similar way as to keep getting invited on the expenses paid trips around the world.

None of the judges know how the other is voting.

and I posted this a long time ago and it still holds true.

The judges simply ranked the competitors on a sheet of paper, awarding the best man one point, the second two and so on. It was a simple method in which the lowest score won. DeMilia had devised a system where the computer randomly selected one judge per round as an alternate, thus eliminating their score. It then removed the three highest and the three lowest scoring judges. From the twelve judges, then, just five papers counted in any one round, and the judges were unaware of which they were, " To fix a contest, definitely beyond a shadow of a doubt, Wayne had told me, somewhat gleefully, ' you gotta buy off nine judges. I figured this out mathematically. You gotta buy off nine judges. In our sport, with all the big mouths and gossips and everything else, you think nine judges could keep their mouths shut? And lets face it, you gotta go to nine judges and one says ' I don't wanna do it, ' you gotta go to number ten...You think that one other guy ain't gonna talk? ' Hey he tried to buy me off, but I didn't take it. He didn't offer me enough money..." how much money is it gonna take.?"


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on July 21, 2017, 07:41:21 AM


Thanks pal.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on July 21, 2017, 07:55:27 AM
1980 MO... Mike vs Arnold


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 21, 2017, 02:58:25 PM
STUNT i never got your message yet


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BEEFYHEAVYWEIGHT on July 21, 2017, 09:06:37 PM
Always found this to be one of the most impressive pics of Mike. Just looks thick. And no fucked up roid face...like todays so called champs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Chidoman on July 21, 2017, 09:15:02 PM
Always found this to be one of the most impressive pics of Mike. Just looks thick. And no fucked up roid face...like todays so called champs.
Fuck Man, That's One impressive shot of Mike in His Prime!..Roids or not Training Made The Man, and His Teachings still prevail to This date, Not His sins, which are another story. The Man Proved that hard work payed, and later on Dorian Yates proved the same thing under his Same Teachings, No Bullshit Training, That's It!!...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 22, 2017, 03:50:48 AM
oh brother back to "his training techniques" made his build again. smh. im dont trying to explain the way he trained is not the way he told people he trained or how he wanted them to train. im done. no more from me about this. i knew mike i knew how he trained. i cant convince anyone who believes all the mags said. smh. good luck if you train "thatway".


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on July 22, 2017, 09:19:09 AM
Why does it matter so much to some people as to whether mike built his physique with one method or the other? Who gives a shit, who gives a shit if you knew him. Who gives a shit if you saw how he trained.
   Mike sold a training system.........end of story. All that really matters is what works for you and that you actually follow through and train. We are all in the iron game mostly for the same reasons. We all have different approaches and training routines to suit our bodies. No one system is right or wrong. People getting their panties in a bunch over one training method or the other  ::)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 22, 2017, 09:42:23 AM
If it works, it works.  If it doesn't, then try something else. Besides, on drugs pretty much anything works. On Conehead levels of drugs you wind up with pussies like the Philsbury Schmoeboy.

He's proof that drugs work.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on July 22, 2017, 09:44:47 AM
Always found this to be one of the most impressive pics of Mike. Just looks thick. And no fucked up roid face...like todays so called champs.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=736759;image)

Mike looks great there.  Way above average build but still athletic looking.  Contrast that with the 'tards of the mAss monster era.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 23, 2017, 01:52:12 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 23, 2017, 11:40:07 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=736946;image)

Cool to see Robin Williams in the background. I did not know he was a bbing fan.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SilverSpoon on July 24, 2017, 07:20:27 AM
Mike looks great there.  Way above average build but still athletic looking.  Contrast that with the 'tards of the mAss monster era.


This picture is of Mentzer and Roger Schwab, former owner of Main Line Health and Fitness, now the Sporting Club of Philadelphia.

Roger is a former employer of mine, while I was finishing my degree(s).  Great guy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 24, 2017, 01:24:41 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 24, 2017, 03:11:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 25, 2017, 11:46:37 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 25, 2017, 12:09:45 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 25, 2017, 02:23:57 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 26, 2017, 01:27:57 AM
:)

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=737213;image >:()

In an era where all the bbers seem to look alike, Mike had a very unique look and being so thickly muscled with ideal proportions (imho) I always thought he looked his best just standing relaxed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 26, 2017, 04:18:36 AM
wrong. in his era NONE looked alike. they each had their own look and body. you could cut off their heads and still tell who was who. starting in the 2000s and now they all look alike cloned. cant tell them apart. ugly inflated bloated fake bodies. to much chemicals. back then most busted their asses in the gym took steroids only ate good did other things and loved to train. now days they are lazy full of chemicals and dont do anything else.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 26, 2017, 11:57:56 PM
wrong. in his era NONE looked alike. they each had their own look and body. you could cut off their heads and still tell who was who. starting in the 2000s and now they all look alike cloned. cant tell them apart. ugly inflated bloated fake bodies. to much chemicals. back then most busted their asses in the gym took steroids only ate good did other things and loved to train. now days they are lazy full of chemicals and dont do anything else.

You misread my post and I wasn't crystal clear with what era I was talking about. When I said, "in an era" I meant this era not Mentzer's time where everyone had their own unique look. That's what made Mentzer stand out. Unique in an era of unique physiques.

I definitely could/should have worded it differently. My bad.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on July 27, 2017, 03:44:34 AM
no harm done. i shouldnt of jumped the gun so to speak. yes in his time he did have a different physique when standing alone. he was thick but lacked a chest. mike only did inclines and pec dec flys for chest.   while i thought he was a good bodybuilder in his day but not as good as he believed he was. compared to what todays bloated puffy cloned look alikes look like mike would beat them hands down. any of the guys from the 70s and 80s and even the 90s would beat these cartoon characters like a rented mule.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 27, 2017, 11:47:40 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on July 27, 2017, 01:16:29 PM
:)

I've use this machine before and loved it. It was a duo pre exhaust machine. Went straight to lat pulldowns from that exercise. Burned like a bitch.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 27, 2017, 01:51:24 PM
I've use this machine before and loved it. It was a duo pre exhaust machine. Went straight to lat pulldowns from that exercise. Burned like a bitch.

I would imagine


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on July 28, 2017, 12:01:39 AM
:)

That was an awesome machine. They use to have it at Gold's Venice late 1980s early 1990s. I don't see that piece anywhere anymore. It mimicked the behind the neck (or front depending how you did it) lat pull down except full range of motion and no grip or biceps. Just isolated the targeted muscle. Full stretch with elbow smashed against your ears and then all the way down until elbows at the hips. Just like the pullover mimicked the front pull down except pure isolation and full range of motion. Pure engineering genius. That's why I never get those that claim his machines were just gimmicks.

Anybody know the official name of that machine?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on July 28, 2017, 02:54:01 AM
^^^ duo-lat pull down machine  ???


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SilverSpoon on July 28, 2017, 06:29:09 AM
That was an awesome machine. They use to have it at Gold's Venice late 1980s early 1990s. I don't see that piece anywhere anymore. It mimicked the behind the neck (or front depending how you did it) lat pull down except full range of motion and no grip or biceps. Just isolated the targeted muscle. Full stretch with elbow smashed against your ears and then all the way down until elbows at the hips. Just like the pullover mimicked the front pull down except pure isolation and full range of motion. Pure engineering genius. That's why I never get those that claim his machines were just gimmicks.

Anybody know the official name of that machine?

Nautilus Behind Neck Torso.

My strength and conditioning coach at Villanova used to call it shoulder abduction.  There are 2 variants on how to perform this machine.  One is pure lat, dare I say even better than pullover; the other incorporates the pectorals as well (laying forearms, not elbow on top of pad).


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 30, 2017, 12:48:47 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 31, 2017, 12:44:10 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on July 31, 2017, 03:52:11 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on July 31, 2017, 06:11:36 PM
:)

Is that George Snyders daughter with Mentzer in that picture?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on August 03, 2017, 08:37:17 AM
8)

:)

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=737843;image)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 03, 2017, 05:17:35 PM
Is that George Snyders daughter with Mentzer in that picture?


Sorry I just saw this. I'm not sure.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on August 05, 2017, 02:09:06 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=736946;image)

"Welcome to the 1st annual IFBB auction, schmoes! Our first item for sale is Chris Dickerson. Starting bid is $1,000. Do I have a $1000?"


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on August 05, 2017, 04:34:32 AM

Hahahahhaa!  Little guy suddenly wondering what the actual F is going on..... :o

(http://s1.postimg.org/drn513lu7/whats_happening.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on August 05, 2017, 05:28:14 AM
Hahahahhaa!  Little guy suddenly wondering what the actual F is going on..... :o

(http://s1.postimg.org/drn513lu7/whats_happening.jpg)

Little guy? That's a young Bernie Sanders schmoe-ing out big time.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on August 05, 2017, 07:37:13 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=736946;image)

Looks like Schmoe Weider is lost in the euphoria that was his never ending pursuit of fappiness.  Back on topic.

Mentzer was one of the best bodybuilders ever.  Looked great on stage and in street clothes. 

Unlike Phildo, who looks exactly like a bloated turd of a carcass floating on the sea of a roiling toilet bowl.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 05, 2017, 11:55:38 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 05, 2017, 03:25:15 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on August 05, 2017, 11:28:35 PM
1979


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on August 05, 2017, 11:37:24 PM
Little guy? That's a young Bernie Sanders schmoe-ing out big time.

Actually, that's Robin Williams. Huge bbing fan back in the day.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on August 06, 2017, 12:12:43 AM
Actually, that's Robin Williams. Huge bbing fan back in the day.

Not sure if serious?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on August 06, 2017, 01:20:12 AM
Not sure if serious?

Nanu, Nanu.

(https://imagemacros.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/notsure-1.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: beakdoctor on August 06, 2017, 03:41:42 AM
Mork from zork. I can believe he lifted. Says so in good will hunting.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on August 07, 2017, 10:58:06 AM
Not sure if serious?

(http://www.dumpaday.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/101.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on August 07, 2017, 11:13:50 AM
^^^ wonder what that arm measures ???

probably 13 inches or so

too bad nd didn't honor my request to find that photo comparing a 14 inch arm to an 18 inch arm, as it isa very Iinteresting comparison

basically the arm looks twice as big even though it's only 1/4 bigger


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 07, 2017, 12:30:14 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 17, 2017, 01:22:59 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 17, 2017, 02:31:09 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on August 18, 2017, 03:40:31 AM
(https://s2.postimg.org/q1qkk0z3t/mustache-glasses.png)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: falco on August 18, 2017, 04:08:25 AM
Thank you guys for the extraordinary compilation of pictures of Mike.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on August 18, 2017, 04:34:45 AM
I was a huge fan of Mike in the 70's. Having said that he had the zealot high intensity ideology fan base that believes he was better than he was. Remember he competed for the Universe and was beaten by Robby Robinson. He tried again and was beaten by Kalman. All just defeats. He didn't deserve to win the 1980 Olympia. Not even close. His 5th place finish was just about right. Remember around this time outside of Arnold he was the most highly paid bodybuilder in the world. His high intensity writings were highly influential on bodybuilding then and today. I still have in a binder with almost everything he wrote about training. His writing at the end of his life was nothing like how he trained or wrote about  when he was competing. I believe his personal training business influenced his writing. Much better to to train a client once a week for 4 or 5 exercises for one set to save time for other paying clients. I do notice almost every high paid personal trainer is all about very short workouts.  


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on August 18, 2017, 05:13:24 AM
Actually, that's Robin Williams. Huge bbing fan back in the day.

is it Tom Deters?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on August 18, 2017, 07:05:19 AM
I was a huge fan of Mike in the 70's. Having said that he had the zealot high intensity ideology fan base that believes he was better than he was. Remember he competed for the Universe and was beaten by Robby Robinson. He tried again and was beaten by Kalman. All just defeats. He didn't deserve to win the 1980 Olympia. Not even close. His 5th place finish was just about right. Remember around this time outside of Arnold he was the most highly paid bodybuilder in the world. His high intensity writings were highly influential on bodybuilding then and today. I still have in a binder with almost everything he wrote about training. His writing at the end of his life was nothing like how he trained or wrote about  when he was competing. I believe his personal training business influenced his writing. Much better to to train a client once a week for 4 or 5 exercises for one set to save time for other paying clients. I do notice almost every high paid personal trainer is all about very short workouts.  

Well, he did win Mr Universe in 1978...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 18, 2017, 04:00:42 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 29, 2017, 10:16:47 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on August 30, 2017, 12:36:32 AM
People forget how jacked George Takai was back in the day. Even back then he's always seemed to have a poodle with him.

Love how Mentzer and Samir, and the rest of the bbers of that generation, looked in normal street clothes. Very in shape and athletic rather than fatsos waddling around in clown outfits.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=739866;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 30, 2017, 07:06:12 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BEEFYHEAVYWEIGHT on August 30, 2017, 10:29:42 AM
People forget how jacked George Takai was back in the day. Even back then he's always seemed to have a poodle with him.

Love how Mentzer and Samir, and the rest of the bbers of that generation, looked in normal street clothes. Very in shape and athletic rather than fatsos waddling around in clown outfits.
That is Katsumi Ishimura....not Takei. Unless you were joking.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=739866;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 30, 2017, 01:27:36 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 30, 2017, 01:43:43 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on August 31, 2017, 12:46:53 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on September 01, 2017, 01:35:11 AM
Was MM a little better in 79 vs. 80 ?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 02, 2017, 03:04:51 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 03, 2017, 06:42:48 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 03, 2017, 11:08:26 AM
Little guy? That's a young Bernie Sanders schmoe-ing out big time.

Jesus! He looks like the ULTIMATE schmoe here. Tom Deters is working hard also. Jesus bros.

Great thread btw. Mentzer was awesome. He did grind around naked did'nt he? He ended up in the crazy house for five years.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 03, 2017, 12:39:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on September 03, 2017, 12:42:24 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=742154;image)

I hope he wiped that bench down, thats where the last guys balls went.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 04, 2017, 03:52:51 AM
Never seen calves like his, i mean the shape. Cool


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 05:39:16 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 04, 2017, 05:51:23 AM
Awesome vary rare pics in this thread. Keep em coming if you find more.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 04, 2017, 06:23:51 AM
Mike Mentzer caused those of us that could think, to actually think.  I was doing up to 25 sets per body part when Mentzer came on the scene.I tried H.I.T. for around a month or so but it didn't work well for me and I went back to high volume.   I spent up to 5 hours a day in the gym.   That sucked.

For the past few weeks I've been training H.I.T as he outlined it in his last book with the exception of the number of rest days.  I don't get stronger every workout but I don't think that at this point in my life that is realistic unless you're on a bunch of AAS or just beginning weight training.

There are days I want to do  a few more sets (and so far I've resisted doing that) and there are days when one working set is enough.  Then there are days when I know I just need to rest.  I warm up well enough for me. Sometimes two or four sets of very light movements and then I do my working set.  I do use pre-exhaust on chest, back and shoulder training.  Mike Mentzer gave bodybuilders a way out of the gym.  Training all the time is just plain ignorant and a waste of one's life.  Exercise should add to your life, not detract from it and Mike was right about that aspect.

I think that drugs (which he freely admitted to using) played a big role in his development but that's true of all "modern" bodybuilders.  He managed to develop a superb physique using a variation on the theme laid down by Arthur Jones.  The key is to find what works best for you. I will keep this up for as long as I find it challenging.  I have thought of giving the original H.I.T. as espoused back in the late 70s another try.  Regardless, I would rather be reasonably well built than an overblown drugger that lives to pose in front of a mirror.

There's more to life than a gym.





Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 06:33:10 AM
Awesome vary rare pics in this thread. Keep em coming if you find more.

Right away sir , right away.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 06:41:50 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 06:48:41 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BEEFYHEAVYWEIGHT on September 04, 2017, 09:10:45 AM
One of his best pics.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 11:11:46 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 11:18:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 11:24:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 11:32:06 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 04, 2017, 11:32:48 AM


I think however strentgh gains are essential to gain mass. I think you will be able to do it with training 3 days a week and a surplus of calories of 500 kcal to your maintenance level. Even small increases is an increase. This is the key. I got to 225 lbs at 5.9 natural and 15% bf doing it this way. Then i added roids and increased it to 4 days a week and got up to 250 lbs and 6 %. I did 900 mg equipoise ew, 500 mg test cyp ew and 25 mg winstrol oral ed at this time. Also 1 h cardio each day before breakfast at non training days or after workout training days. It was however very mentzer like aĺl the time. Sorry if i took away from the pics! Keep it up brother






Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on September 04, 2017, 11:41:53 AM
Mike Mentzer caused those of us that could think, to actually think.  I was doing up to 25 sets per body part when Mentzer came on the scene.I tried H.I.T. for around a month or so but it didn't work well for me and I went back to high volume.   I spent up to 5 hours a day in the gym.   That sucked.

For the past few weeks I've been training H.I.T as he outlined it in his last book with the exception of the number of rest days.  I don't get stronger every workout but I don't think that at this point in my life that is realistic unless you're on a bunch of AAS or just beginning weight training.

There are days I want to do  a few more sets (and so far I've resisted doing that) and there are days when one working set is enough.  Then there are days when I know I just need to rest.  I warm up well enough for me. Sometimes two or four sets of very light movements and then I do my working set.  I do use pre-exhaust on chest, back and shoulder training.  Mike Mentzer gave bodybuilders a way out of the gym.  Training all the time is just plain ignorant and a waste of one's life.  Exercise should add to your life, not detract from it and Mike was right about that aspect.

I think that drugs (which he freely admitted to using) played a big role in his development but that's true of all "modern" bodybuilders.  He managed to develop a superb physique using a variation on the theme laid down by Arthur Jones.  The key is to find what works best for you. I will keep this up for as long as I find it challenging.  I have thought of giving the original H.I.T. as espoused back in the late 70s another try.  Regardless, I would rather be reasonably well built than an overblown drugger that lives to pose in front of a mirror.

There's more to life than a gym.





So how many sets in those 5 hours did you think you did?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 12:17:30 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 12:19:10 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 04, 2017, 12:24:45 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on September 04, 2017, 12:58:04 PM
mentzer looks better in these pics than these bloated clowns competing today


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 04, 2017, 12:58:54 PM
So how many sets in those 5 hours did you think you did?

Arm day was 50 total sets.  That was 2 to 2.5 hours for the second workout of the day which was arms, calves and abs.  Chest and back were much the same.  Some days I would do those crazy fast "giant sets" of five bicep or tricep exercises in a row and then rest/repeat for a total of 25 sets for each.  I thought I would puke.  If memory serves, I think I did a few times. ;D  I pretty much did calves and abs every day.  Stupid, huh?  Shoulders were done in the mornings along with ab and calf work.  I was overdoing it but I thought that was the way it was done and did so for years.

Thighs were done alone except for ab and calf work.  I was so crazy to get as big as I could. I ate tons of food and even drank whipping cream for the calories.  Squats were my favorite and I got quite good at them.  Same with what we all called the "real leg press" (inverted).  I really enjoyed leg pressing on the inverted machines.  Much better than those angled jobs.

I hated doing legs until some of my powerlifting friends introduced me to the 20 rep set routine and from that moment on it was my favorite exercise, bar none.  Was I training hard? On leg day, no doubt.  The other days I now think I trained pretty damn hard but I over trained too. I did get to 250 lbs but  my size was nowhere near my friends on steroids.  Also my bodyfat was probably in the low 20% range.  Again, nothing like a competitive bodybuilder although I did compete a few times.  I was not good enough but I was no Genova,LOL!

Today was a total of 4 sets back and 4 sets of chest.  That would include a couple of warmup sets for each body part before doing the pre-exhaust isolation movement followed by the compound one.  I train at home most of the time but have considered joining a gym.  I fear I would get envious and at my age, I cannot afford a new kidney.  Dammit!  ;D

Sometimes I get out the 2.75" bar for curls but not very often now. It bothers my elbows.  I am far from well built but I am still training and that is what matters.  My ego gets in the way every now and then but that's to be expected.  I watched the Mentzers train in the late 70s at Gold's.  They and Viator trained brutally hard or at least the few times I saw them.  Impressive. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on September 04, 2017, 01:03:29 PM
Arm day was 50 total sets.  That was 2 to 2.5 hours for the second workout of the day which was arms, calves and abs.  Chest and back were much the same.  Some days I would do those crazy fast "giant sets" of five bicep or tricep exercises in a row and then rest/repeat for a total of 25 sets for each.  I thought I would puke.  If memory serves, I think I did a few times. ;D  I pretty much did calves and abs every day.  Stupid, huh?  Shoulders were done in the mornings along with ab and calf work.  I was overdoing it but I thought that was the way it was done and did so for years.

Thighs were done alone except for ab and calf work.  I was so crazy to get as big as I could. I ate tons of food and even drank whipping cream for the calories.  Squats were my favorite and I got quite good at them.  Same with what we all called the "real leg press" (inverted).  I really enjoyed leg pressing on the inverted machines.  Much better than those angled jobs.

I hated doing legs until some of my powerlifting friends introduced me to the 20 rep set routine and from that moment on it was my favorite exercise, bar none.  Was I training hard? On leg day, no doubt.  The other days I now think I trained pretty damn hard but I over trained too. I did get to 250 lbs but  my size was nowhere near my friends on steroids.  Also my bodyfat was probably in the low 20% range.  Again, nothing like a competitive bodybuilder although I did compete a few times.  I was not good enough but I was no Genova,LOL!

Today was a total of 4 sets back and 4 sets of chest.  That would include a couple of warmup sets for each body part before doing the pre-exhaust isolation movement followed by the compound one.  I train at home most of the time but have considered joining a gym.  I fear I would get envious and at my age, I cannot afford a new kidney.  Dammit!  ;D

Sometimes I get out the 2.75" bar for curls but not very often now. It bothers my elbows.  I am far from well built but I am still training and that is what matters.  My ego gets in the way every now and then but that's to be expected.  I watched the Mentzers train in the late 70s at Gold's.  They and Viator trained brutally hard or at least the few times I saw them.  Impressive. 


what an incredible waste of time...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 04, 2017, 01:06:07 PM
what an incredible waste of time...

Yup.  That it was.  I bought into the Weider lie.    Dammit!  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on September 04, 2017, 05:44:34 PM
Still finding rare pictures! Cool stuff.   Yes the weider training system, what a crock. Just as bad as Arnolds encyclopedia of overtraining. Total waste of time.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 05, 2017, 08:30:22 AM
Arm day was 50 total sets.  That was 2 to 2.5 hours for the second workout of the day which was arms, calves and abs.  Chest and back were much the same.  Some days I would do those crazy fast "giant sets" of five bicep or tricep exercises in a row and then rest/repeat for a total of 25 sets for each.  I thought I would puke.  If memory serves, I think I did a few times. ;D  I pretty much did calves and abs every day.  Stupid, huh?  Shoulders were done in the mornings along with ab and calf work.  I was overdoing it but I thought that was the way it was done and did so for years.

Thighs were done alone except for ab and calf work.  I was so crazy to get as big as I could. I ate tons of food and even drank whipping cream for the calories.  Squats were my favorite and I got quite good at them.  Same with what we all called the "real leg press" (inverted).  I really enjoyed leg pressing on the inverted machines.  Much better than those angled jobs.

I hated doing legs until some of my powerlifting friends introduced me to the 20 rep set routine and from that moment on it was my favorite exercise, bar none.  Was I training hard? On leg day, no doubt.  The other days I now think I trained pretty damn hard but I over trained too. I did get to 250 lbs but  my size was nowhere near my friends on steroids.  Also my bodyfat was probably in the low 20% range.  Again, nothing like a competitive bodybuilder although I did compete a few times.  I was not good enough but I was no Genova,LOL!

Today was a total of 4 sets back and 4 sets of chest.  That would include a couple of warmup sets for each body part before doing the pre-exhaust isolation movement followed by the compound one.  I train at home most of the time but have considered joining a gym.  I fear I would get envious and at my age, I cannot afford a new kidney.  Dammit!  ;D

Sometimes I get out the 2.75" bar for curls but not very often now. It bothers my elbows.  I am far from well built but I am still training and that is what matters.  My ego gets in the way every now and then but that's to be expected.  I watched the Mentzers train in the late 70s at Gold's.  They and Viator trained brutally hard or at least the few times I saw them.  Impressive. 


Thanks for sharing! I got to 265 at 5.9 using more dorian oriented training. In good shape 235. But i did use steroids. Eq and test. Still interesting about that enormous amount you did.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 05, 2017, 01:08:49 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on September 05, 2017, 01:44:56 PM
:)

No weak points in that particular photo, great condition and fullness everywhere, superb.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 05, 2017, 02:11:32 PM
After many years of over training I came to the realization that if both H.I.T. and volume training both produced equal results, why would I want to be in the gym up to 5 hours a day, 6 days a week when I could accomplish the same results in less time?

The answer is I would not.  And I no longer do.  And the truth of the matter is that Arthur Jones, Casey Viator and Mike Mentzer didn't blaze a new trail, they just put us back on the right one. 

I have no desire to  be a gym rat ever again.  Even if the gym is in my garage.  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 05, 2017, 02:16:39 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 05, 2017, 04:38:40 PM
:)

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=742503;image)

From left to right  -  Schmoe Weider, Lou Ferrigno, Mike Mentzer, Kent Keuhn, Robbie Robinson, Rick Wayne, Buttslut Sprague ("Sprayed"?).



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 08, 2017, 01:40:29 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: burnout666 on September 08, 2017, 01:41:40 PM
I hear tell he used to drink his own urine and spend bouts in the mental hospital under involuntary commitment.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on September 09, 2017, 05:53:16 AM
I hear tell he used to drink his own urine and spend bouts in the mental hospital under involuntary commitment.

Nuthouse?  Yes.

The piss thing?  No.  He was pissing into a jug to track something for medical purposes.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 09, 2017, 05:57:34 AM
He spent 5 years in the nutter after running naked in the streets of venice beach. He saw ufo:s coming and shit. The urine thing was bullshit though. Atleast from himself.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 12, 2017, 02:34:53 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 12, 2017, 02:58:51 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on September 12, 2017, 04:00:32 PM
I always like Mentzer's physique- it just looked solid. But I wonder what he would really look like, minus steroids or other drugs. Not a knock on people who use- I don't care either way. But it would be interesting to see how he would be totally natural. Or at least what his training method would lead to.

I followed his methods for several years and made little progress. I think it was because it was so frequent- he used to talk about 3 days a week heavy, like Casey Viator did. I switched to one day a week heavy lifting for the whole body and made the fastest muscular gains- about 20-25 pounds over a few years, drug free.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on September 12, 2017, 04:02:23 PM
I always like Mentzer's physique- it just looked solid. But I wonder what he would really look like, minus steroids or other drugs. Not a knock on people who use- I don't care either way. But it would be interesting to see how he would be totally natural. Or at least what his training method would lead to.

I followed his methods for several years and made little progress. I think it was because it was so frequent- he used to talk about 3 days a week heavy, like Casey Viator did. I switched to one day a week heavy lifting for the whole body and made the fastest muscular gains- about 20-25 pounds over a few years, drug free.

are you saying you worked the whole body in one workout - one day per week

or are you saying you switched to training each bodypart 1x per week?



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on September 12, 2017, 04:24:16 PM
are you saying you worked the whole body in one workout - one day per week

or are you saying you switched to training each bodypart 1x per week?



I did (and still do) the whole body in one workout. Pretty basic routine- about 10-12 exercises, one or two warmups, 1 strict heavy set of 8-12 reps or so, till positive failure, periodically altering the movements when I'm getting stale. I found that anything beyond that didn't work; I would just get tired and have joint pains. This works perfectly.

My current routine:

Over head press/pulldowns/incline bench/row/decline bench/incline row/leg press/leg curl/calf raise/curl/triceps pressdown.

I did the single body part routine 1x a week, such as chest day 1, back day 2, legs day 3 but I found I ended up easily over training because I kept  adding extra movements in. Plus I travel a bit on business so I wanted to consolidate gym time.

I'm 5'9" 200 pounds when living the easy life :). When I get super lean (I bicycle a lot), I am about 180 with abs, veins. On the Mentzer routine I was stuck at about 160 forever. I was very much an ectomorph. I then read an article about Dorian doing one day a week heavy and tried it. Boom- I grew so quickly I was amazed. It eventually slowed when I reached the mid 180's  and lean but that is quite a dramatic gain in about 2 years. Now I just maintain my strength.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on September 12, 2017, 05:40:55 PM
I did (and still do) the whole body in one workout. Pretty basic routine- about 10-12 exercises, one or two warmups, 1 strict heavy set of 8-12 reps or so, till positive failure, periodically altering the movements when I'm getting stale. I found that anything beyond that didn't work; I would just get tired and have joint pains. This works perfectly.

My current routine:

Over head press/pulldowns/incline bench/row/decline bench/incline row/leg press/leg curl/calf raise/curl/triceps pressdown.

I did the single body part routine 1x a week, such as chest day 1, back day 2, legs day 3 but I found I ended up easily over training because I kept  adding extra movements in. Plus I travel a bit on business so I wanted to consolidate gym time.

I'm 5'9" 200 pounds when living the easy life :). When I get super lean (I bicycle a lot), I am about 180 with abs, veins. On the Mentzer routine I was stuck at about 160 forever. I was very much an ectomorph. I then read an article about Dorian doing one day a week heavy and tried it. Boom- I grew so quickly I was amazed. It eventually slowed when I reached the mid 180's  and lean but that is quite a dramatic gain in about 2 years. Now I just maintain my strength.

I don't recall ever reading about Dorian training the entire body at one time and only 1 day a week.

Sounds more like one of Mentzer's very abbreviated routines that he promoted at the very end of his life

whatever works for you is all that matters


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on September 12, 2017, 05:54:38 PM
I don't recall ever reading about Dorian training the entire body at one time and only 1 day a week.

Sounds more like one of Mentzer's very abbreviated routines that he promoted at the very end of his life

whatever works for you is all that matters

No- I meant he (Dorian) trained each body part once a week! He had different goals and used far more sets and exercises than I would, or could handle. And yes, it works for me- and has kept my interest for many years.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 13, 2017, 01:04:24 AM
I mentzers look is like the ultimate bodybuilder. It just looks good. Today guys are just to much. Its overkill ever since Dorian hit the scene. What is interesting about Dorian is that he is a very average guys size. I could never been able to tell he was even working out when i met him. So what really good genetics is seems to be quite hard to answer really.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 13, 2017, 01:12:36 AM
No- I meant he (Dorian) trained each body part once a week! He had different goals and used far more sets and exercises than I would, or could handle. And yes, it works for me- and has kept my interest for many years.

curious, did your strength increase on that routine?

If yes, give examples of the increases for example curl went up from 80x6 to 115x9


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on September 13, 2017, 01:40:34 AM
I mentzers look is like the ultimate bodybuilder. It just looks good. Today guys are just to much. Its overkill ever since Dorian hit the scene. What is interesting about Dorian is that he is a very average guys size. I could never been able to tell he was even working out when i met him. So what really good genetics is seems to be quite hard to answer really.

It's a person's response to training and supplements that is a key component to the genetically gifted.
Two people can do the exact same thing but one is going to respond better. Same with talent. It's not like Tiger Woods or Michael Jordan trained harder than their competition. They just had the God given talent that most don't have.

Of course hard work and discipline is required when you are talking about the best of the best but as much as people don't like to hear it, champions are BORN not made, which is the opposite of what we are taught.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 13, 2017, 02:34:23 AM
Well if you meet some blacks they are often extremlly well built from start and look like they can be awesome bbs. But most bodybuilders were not this way. There is something else. That extreme drive from a person is not something you are born with. It commes from within. If you have that + genetics + drugs we have a champ. But we can discuss this all day i think and i dont want the thread to get off topic.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on September 13, 2017, 04:52:37 AM
I did (and still do) the whole body in one workout. Pretty basic routine- about 10-12 exercises, one or two warmups, 1 strict heavy set of 8-12 reps or so, till positive failure, periodically altering the movements when I'm getting stale. I found that anything beyond that didn't work; I would just get tired and have joint pains. This works perfectly.

My current routine:

Over head press/pulldowns/incline bench/row/decline bench/incline row/leg press/leg curl/calf raise/curl/triceps pressdown.

I did the single body part routine 1x a week, such as chest day 1, back day 2, legs day 3 but I found I ended up easily over training because I kept  adding extra movements in. Plus I travel a bit on business so I wanted to consolidate gym time.

I'm 5'9" 200 pounds when living the easy life :). When I get super lean (I bicycle a lot), I am about 180 with abs, veins. On the Mentzer routine I was stuck at about 160 forever. I was very much an ectomorph. I then read an article about Dorian doing one day a week heavy and tried it. Boom- I grew so quickly I was amazed. It eventually slowed when I reached the mid 180's  and lean but that is quite a dramatic gain in about 2 years. Now I just maintain my strength.

Leans toward the adage that all the growth happens outside the gym. Recovery is just as important as the lifting itself, if not more so.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on September 13, 2017, 05:41:06 AM
It's a person's response to training and supplements that is a key component to the genetically gifted.
Two people can do the exact same thing but one is going to respond better. Same with talent. It's not like Tiger Woods or Michael Jordan trained harder than their competition. They just had the God given talent that most don't have.

Of course hard work and discipline is required when you are talking about the best of the best but as much as people don't like to hear it, champions are BORN not made, which is the opposite of what we are taught.

Talent is table salt. It's everywhere. Hard work is what turns talent into success.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on September 13, 2017, 05:57:35 AM
curious, did your strength increase on that routine?

If yes, give examples of the increases for example curl went up from 80x6 to 115x9

On the one day a week routine? Absolutely. And it seems to be permanent, if there is such a thing with training.

An example- with the early Mentzer training (2-3x a week)  I increased my strength on dumbbell rows from a weak  50 pounds to 85 pounds for reps (I generally stick to the 8-12 range or so). Then I was stuck. I'd take a week or two off and then come back again but seemed to be stuck in the 80's.  When I switched to one day a week I worked up to 120's for the same rep range, with good form. This took about a year but I never felt dead like I did with 2 or 3x a week training. I actually went above 120 at times but started to reach the point where I felt like i was chasing the numbers and form started getting sloppy.

Same thing happened with dead lifts, although I only did those for triples. I went from 295  to 405 with one day a week training. I could have gone higher over time but I really don't like dead lifting- it feels like I'm ripping something, lol. The increase in dead lift strength came quickly - well under 6 months. I think something like dead lifting could be done every two weeks and you'd still get stronger.

All training reaches plateaus and you have to change things up. But with this routine I was able to reach a point where I simply felt strong enough. I really don't want to get bigger than 200 at my height, and feel the best around 185. So you could say mission accomplished. I actually got up to 215 (obviously there was extra fat there) when I was at my very strongest but it just didn't feel right. I participate in a number of endurance sports (cycling, nordic skiing, running) and there is a limit to how much weight you can carry and still feel good.

All said and done, my weight training adventure saw my body weight go from 155 to 185, lean, in a span of 2-3 years - after I switched to one day a week training.

I actually was weighed hydrostatically when I was 155 as part of a study at a local university and they said I was 10% body fat. At that level you could see veins everywhere, so I have no idea how people get to numbers like 5%. That's unreal.  But regardless, I  gained  about 30 pounds of muscle, and from what I have read, that's pretty good for natural lifters.

I think Mike Mentzer was definitely correct in his training ideas, but the natural  rate of recovery does vary in individuals quite a bit. This has been proven in countless research studies. I take a week to recover and super-compensate from hard weight training. Others may take only 3 days. A drug user might be able to recover in 24 hours. That is the biggest factor in exercise- how quickly your body rebuilds.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on September 13, 2017, 06:04:02 AM
Leans toward the adage that all the growth happens outside the gym. Recovery is just as important as the lifting itself, if not more so.

Totally agree! Like Dorian and Lee Haney have said, you grow outside the gym.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 13, 2017, 06:24:24 AM
On the one day a week routine? Absolutely. And it seems to be permanent, if there is such a thing with training.

An example- with the early Mentzer training (2-3x a week)  I increased my strength on dumbbell rows from a weak  50 pounds to 85 pounds for reps (I generally stick to the 8-12 range or so). Then I was stuck. I'd take a week or two off and then come back again but seemed to be stuck in the 80's.  When I switched to one day a week I worked up to 120's for the same rep range, with good form. This took about a year but I never felt dead like I did with 2 or 3x a week training. I actually went above 120 at times but started to reach the point where I felt like i was chasing the numbers and form started getting sloppy.

Same thing happened with dead lifts, although I only did those for triples. I went from 295  to 405 with one day a week training. I could have gone higher over time but I really don't like dead lifting- it feels like I'm ripping something, lol. The increase in dead lift strength came quickly - well under 6 months. I think something like dead lifting could be done every two weeks and you'd still get stronger.

All training reaches plateaus and you have to change things up. But with this routine I was able to reach a point where I simply felt strong enough. I really don't want to get bigger than 200 at my height, and feel the best around 185. So you could say mission accomplished. I actually got up to 215 (obviously there was extra fat there) when I was at my very strongest but it just didn't feel right. I participate in a number of endurance sports (cycling, nordic skiing, running) and there is a limit to how much weight you can carry and still feel good.

All said and done, my weight training adventure saw my body weight go from 155 to 185, lean, in a span of 2-3 years - after I switched to one day a week training.

I actually was weighed hydrostatically when I was 155 as part of a study at a local university and they said I was 10% body fat. At that level you could see veins everywhere, so I have no idea how people get to numbers like 5%. That's unreal.  But regardless, I  gained  about 30 pounds of muscle, and from what I have read, that's pretty good for natural lifters.

I think Mike Mentzer was definitely correct in his training ideas, but the natural  rate of recovery does vary in individuals quite a bit. This has been proven in countless research studies. I take a week to recover and super-compensate from hard weight training. Others may take only 3 days. A drug user might be able to recover in 24 hours. That is the biggest factor in exercise- how quickly your body rebuilds.



thanks for the report bro

much appreciated


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 13, 2017, 03:06:06 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Danimal77 on September 13, 2017, 03:45:17 PM
Was MM a little better in 79 vs. 80 ?

Everything was better in '79 than in '80 for him.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on September 14, 2017, 12:10:48 AM
Talent is table salt. It's everywhere. Hard work is what turns talent into success.

So Phil is better and beats everyone else on the O stage because he works harder than the rest? Platz lost to Franco because he didn't work hard enough. BJ Penn won the Mundials (World Championship) training less than five years beating those who grew up training BJJ with the founders. And this was in the most competitive weight division stacked with the best in the world. Not many achieve a black belt in BJJ in less than five years let alone compete at a world class level and win. Tiger Woods at 19 beat out those who were golfing on a top level while he was just a baby. LeBorn James was still a teenager when he was drafted into the pros out performing an already gifted group of athletes that were playing b-ball before he was even born. James hadn't been alive long enough to "train harder" than his competition. And it wasn't his "hard training" alone that made him so much better than other talented athletes. He was gifted. Something you are born with.

Talent is rare. Very rare. You're living proof of that.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on September 14, 2017, 05:03:24 AM
So Phil is better and beats everyone else on the O stage because he works harder than the rest? Platz lost to Franco because he didn't work hard enough. BJ Penn won the Mundials (World Championship) training less than five years beating those who grew up training BJJ with the founders. And this was in the most competitive weight division stacked with the best in the world. Not many achieve a black belt in BJJ in less than five years let alone compete at a world class level and win. Tiger Woods at 19 beat out those who were golfing on a top level while he was just a baby. LeBorn James was still a teenager when he was drafted into the pros out performing an already gifted group of athletes that were playing b-ball before he was even born. James hadn't been alive long enough to "train harder" than his competition. And it wasn't his "hard training" alone that made him so much better than other talented athletes. He was gifted. Something you are born with.

Talent is rare. Very rare. You're living proof of that.

So take all these guys you just mentioned and remove the practice element. Hours in the gym, the court, the mat, whatever. Take away the constant study and these guys don't get to that elite level. These guys may  have come out of the womb with the natural ability but without honing it and crafting it they would be just another guy at the Triple AAA level.

Talent isn't rare. The combination of work ethic, drive and talent is very rare.

I am living proof of what? You can judge a person based on some words on a forum?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 14, 2017, 05:10:21 AM
So take all these guys you just mentioned and remove the practice element. Hours in the gym, the court, the mat, whatever. Take away the constant study and these guys don't get to that elite level. These guys didn't come out of the womb with the ability. It was honed and crafted.

Talent isn't rare. The combination of work ethic, drive and talent is very rare.

I am living proof of what? You can judge a person based on some words on a forum?


theres a fuckload of factors involved in real sports

drive, skill, natural talent, courage, willingness to practice endlessly, ect


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dseiler on September 14, 2017, 05:15:41 AM
theres a fuckload of factors involved in real sports

drive, skill, natural talent, courage, willingness to practice endlessly, ect

Exactly. It's not just innate abilities.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Natural_O on September 14, 2017, 06:47:04 AM
Is that George Snyders daughter with Mentzer in that picture?

Yes, it is.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on September 14, 2017, 08:23:42 AM
Yes, it is.

Always thought it was weird how they had his daughter "draped" all over these bodybuilders for a picture when she was in her early teens.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 14, 2017, 10:07:53 AM
Always thought it was weird how they had his daughter "draped" all over these bodybuilders for a picture when she was in her early teens.

From what I recall, Mentzer said her scent was the best Schmoe repellent around (it was like garlic to a vampire).  The guys all paid to have her hug them and it worked out great for her as she was able to put herself through college later on with the money she saved up.

 ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on September 14, 2017, 11:57:01 PM
So take all these guys you just mentioned and remove the practice element. Hours in the gym, the court, the mat, whatever. Take away the constant study and these guys don't get to that elite level. These guys may  have come out of the womb with the natural ability but without honing it and crafting it they would be just another guy at the Triple AAA level.

Talent isn't rare. The combination of work ethic, drive and talent is very rare.

I am living proof of what? You can judge a person based on some words on a forum?


Millions upon millions work hard. Very few make it to the top of the top. Did Jon "Bones" Jones train harder than Cormier? Jones was destroying the top of the top at a very young age. Why?

Talent. Just like Jordan, Ali, Phelps, Bolt, Armstrong, Coleman and others who were head and tails above the rest. Many very talented and discipline people have tried to beat them but they were special -- even among the chosen few. It's not that they trained harder or took some magic potion. They all do at that level. They had what Quentin Tarantino once described as that certain "something, something."

It may be a bit difficult when it comes to skills but in bbing it's blatantly obvious. Some people train like animals and juice for years and never really become freaks. Others start growing muscles on day one.
Many train just as hard and juice just as much as Coleman, but nobody got to Coleman's level.

I remember JJ Marsh telling me that when he first started weight training he couldn't believe how quickly it changed him. He said it was like time lapse photography. He would get up in the morning and look in the mirror and seemed to grow overnight. Within six months he was already more advanced than other guys in the gym who were training and juicing for over a decade. His response was extraordinary and he did nothing special. But though he competed at a world class level he still didn't have the ultimate gift that put him at the very top. And he devoted his life to bbing and there is nothing he wouldn't have done to make it to the top.

And, yes, I can make some informed judgements about people based on their posts on this board. In your case, either you have some rare talent and are just lazy, a hard worker but no talent, or neither. If you were part of the rarified elite you wouldn't have time for this board. No one knows who you are because you are just like the rest of us. Nothing special. Just ordinary folk doing the best (except shizzo and Josh) with what they have and what they were born with. But I would love it if you could prove me wrong.

Nasser once commented that it is a uniquely American ideal that you can be anything you want if you just want it bad enough. But it was just utter nonsense. I mean there can only be one Mr. O a year, one president every four years, one gold medal... mathematically it was simply impossible for everyone "who really wants it" no matter how bad and how much they sacrifice, for everyone to be number one.

It only goes to those who were born with that "something, something".


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: jwb on September 18, 2017, 11:04:10 PM
On the one day a week routine? Absolutely. And it seems to be permanent, if there is such a thing with training.

An example- with the early Mentzer training (2-3x a week)  I increased my strength on dumbbell rows from a weak  50 pounds to 85 pounds for reps (I generally stick to the 8-12 range or so). Then I was stuck. I'd take a week or two off and then come back again but seemed to be stuck in the 80's.  When I switched to one day a week I worked up to 120's for the same rep range, with good form. This took about a year but I never felt dead like I did with 2 or 3x a week training. I actually went above 120 at times but started to reach the point where I felt like i was chasing the numbers and form started getting sloppy.

Same thing happened with dead lifts, although I only did those for triples. I went from 295  to 405 with one day a week training. I could have gone higher over time but I really don't like dead lifting- it feels like I'm ripping something, lol. The increase in dead lift strength came quickly - well under 6 months. I think something like dead lifting could be done every two weeks and you'd still get stronger.

All training reaches plateaus and you have to change things up. But with this routine I was able to reach a point where I simply felt strong enough. I really don't want to get bigger than 200 at my height, and feel the best around 185. So you could say mission accomplished. I actually got up to 215 (obviously there was extra fat there) when I was at my very strongest but it just didn't feel right. I participate in a number of endurance sports (cycling, nordic skiing, running) and there is a limit to how much weight you can carry and still feel good.

All said and done, my weight training adventure saw my body weight go from 155 to 185, lean, in a span of 2-3 years - after I switched to one day a week training.

I actually was weighed hydrostatically when I was 155 as part of a study at a local university and they said I was 10% body fat. At that level you could see veins everywhere, so I have no idea how people get to numbers like 5%. That's unreal.  But regardless, I  gained  about 30 pounds of muscle, and from what I have read, that's pretty good for natural lifters.

I think Mike Mentzer was definitely correct in his training ideas, but the natural  rate of recovery does vary in individuals quite a bit. This has been proven in countless research studies. I take a week to recover and super-compensate from hard weight training. Others may take only 3 days. A drug user might be able to recover in 24 hours. That is the biggest factor in exercise- how quickly your body rebuilds.


i used to work at a gym when I was a student and I did the Sunday shift. There was a guy who used to come in every single Sunday and do a very thorough full body workout (not mentzer style but heavy weights for lots of sets). It took him 2-2.5 hours and he was spent at the end of it. As the months progressed he seemed to be the only one there who was growing so I asked him about his routine. It turned out that Sunday workout was his only workout of the week since he was self employed with 3 little kids. Once a week training can work for sure.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Parker on September 18, 2017, 11:44:12 PM
:)
"Weider Research Clinic"   ::)  ::)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DooM_ on September 19, 2017, 08:14:55 AM
best thread on getbig , quality posts and pics , keep up the great work guys


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 19, 2017, 08:16:44 AM
some of the best tris ever  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 20, 2017, 12:43:41 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 20, 2017, 01:56:06 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on September 20, 2017, 02:02:00 PM
81?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 20, 2017, 02:12:34 PM
81?

I believe it is


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: FREAKgeek on September 20, 2017, 05:04:59 PM
So take all these guys you just mentioned and remove the practice element. Hours in the gym, the court, the mat, whatever. Take away the constant study and these guys don't get to that elite level. These guys may  have come out of the womb with the natural ability but without honing it and crafting it they would be just another guy at the Triple AAA level.

Talent isn't rare. The combination of work ethic, drive and talent is very rare.

I am living proof of what? You can judge a person based on some words on a forum?


It's understood that you have to put in the work. But it's equally vital that you have the genetics. Dorian Yates said himself that if he wasn't cut out for bodybuilding, he wouldn't have pursued it. It's the fact he noticed he he was improving much mire than his peers.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on September 20, 2017, 06:07:08 PM
I seem to remember that Mike considered a comeback at one point or was it he was training again to get in shape?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 21, 2017, 02:40:19 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 21, 2017, 03:01:53 AM
I have never seen a calf shaped like Mikes before. Awesome knotty shape.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 21, 2017, 03:31:34 AM
I seem to remember that Mike considered a comeback at one point or was it he was training again to get in shape?

and then he would have had to jump on 5 grams of deca, correct dim?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on September 21, 2017, 04:00:39 AM
:)

True mesomorph


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 22, 2017, 02:46:55 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 22, 2017, 06:08:15 PM
Time between training the same body parts is now at 72 to 96 hours.  Example -  I last trained shoulders and arms on Wednesday and will not do so until this Sunday.   

Mentzer was an average man but an above average bodybuilder.  if that's damning him with faint praise, so be it.  I don't think he was a genius for stating the obvious but if common sense is so rare that it's a super power, then Mike was loaded with common sense and shared it with any and all that would listen with more than their ego.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:48:05 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:48:59 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:50:54 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:52:52 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:54:47 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:57:37 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 03:59:02 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 05:55:48 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 05:57:33 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 05:59:54 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:03:26 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:05:40 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:06:39 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:15:25 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:19:53 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:22:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:22:55 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:26:03 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:29:24 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:34:55 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:35:48 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:46:39 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 23, 2017, 06:48:00 AM
It looks like Joanne Sharkey over at MikeMentzer.com is about to retire.  

http://mikementzer.com/importantnews0917.html



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:49:09 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:51:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 06:53:10 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on September 23, 2017, 06:59:59 AM
Well if you meet some blacks they are often extremlly well built from start and look like they can be awesome bbs. But most bodybuilders were not this way. There is something else. That extreme drive from a person is not something you are born with. It commes from within. If you have that + genetics + drugs we have a champ. But we can discuss this all day i think and i dont want the thread to get off topic.


good post


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:05:43 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:10:01 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:15:00 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:16:51 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:19:23 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:21:54 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:24:35 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:26:04 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:26:56 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 23, 2017, 07:27:42 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on September 23, 2017, 07:34:49 AM
Talent is table salt. It's everywhere. Hard work is what turns talent into success.


 8)

A+


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 24, 2017, 01:46:51 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 24, 2017, 03:03:30 PM
heres dyke assisting gay on the nautilus delt machine

scary music  :D

wonder if dim was waiting in the darkness to pin them with 2-3 grams of deca post workout  ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqI6z6g3dXM



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on September 25, 2017, 04:22:55 PM
this is the best thread on getbig, and mike looks better than either phil or the smelly big ramy


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on September 25, 2017, 04:58:14 PM
ND keeping the thread rolling with great pictures. Keep them going, great inspiration for getting jacked!

(https://68.media.tumblr.com/fd56fdf688fc771c4a683bdfdd8b37a4/tumblr_o05fcznIj71siity3o1_500.jpg)

(https://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/images/2012/to-the-extreme-building-the-ultimate-bodybuilder_g.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on September 26, 2017, 06:38:28 AM
mike was an ok bb. but he was sooo wrong about training. if he were right and all you needed to do was go to failure and be done per body part. why reps? say you can bench 300 for 1 rep. put 310 on it try to get it up then have a little help( thats positive failure) then hold it at the top until you cant no  longer ( static failure) then lower it slow as you can( negative failure) and bam. your done for chest. 1 rep! max weights and failure. acccording to mike you dont need a pump. just failure. so one rep per body part and your done.  right?  lmao. he was such a tool.but he says 6-8 reps cuz research shows thats the best for building muscle. but i thought failure was?  lol      heavy weights 6-10 sets per bodypart 4-12 reps with one pump set and your done.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on September 26, 2017, 06:46:44 AM
mike was an ok bb. but he was sooo wrong about training. if he were right and all you needed to do was go to failure and be done per body part. why reps? say you can bench 300 for 1 rep. put 310 on it try to get it up then have a little help( thats positive failure) then hold it at the top until you cant no  longer ( static failure) then lower it slow as you can( negative failure) and bam. your done for chest. 1 rep! max weights and failure. acccording to mike you dont need a pump. just failure. so one rep per body part and your done.  right?  lmao. he was such a tool.but he says 6-8 reps cuz research shows thats the best for building muscle. but i thought failure was?  lol      heavy weights 6-10 sets per bodypart 4-12 reps with one pump set and your done.

hi halo...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 26, 2017, 07:10:41 AM
hi halo...

actually its more about drugs and stressing the muscle

it you got the right drugs and the right genes you can build an 18 inch arm not curling more than 60 pounds with a barbell


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on September 26, 2017, 07:14:14 AM
actually its more about drugs and stressing the muscle

it you got the right drugs and the right genes you can build an 18 inch arm not curling more than 60 pounds with a barbell

correct...
proof is in the pudding..


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 26, 2017, 08:00:35 AM
correct...
proof is in the pudding..

have you seen that study they did with diff doses of test?

it was 25, 50, 125, 300, and 600 mg per week

the first 2 gained fat the middle stayed in homostatis and the 300 and 600 gained lean muscle (no bloat or water weight gain supposedly)

the 300 gained like 8-9 lean pounds no water

the 600 gained 17 fucking lean pounds no water

and get this shit.... NONE of the participants touched a fucking weight or did any training at all

i dont fucking belive that though... ZERO TRAINING and adding 17 pounds of lean dry muscle tissue in 10 weeks?????

do you believe it?

imho you still gotta train amd stress the muscle somewhat, but this study showed all yoi gotta do is inject and you'll add pounds and pounds of dry muscle  :o


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on September 26, 2017, 11:29:12 AM
have you seen that study they did with diff doses of test?

it was 25, 50, 125, 300, and 600 mg per week

the first 2 gained fat the middle stayed in homostatis and the 300 and 600 gained lean muscle (no bloat or water weight gain supposedly)

the 300 gained like 8-9 lean pounds no water

the 600 gained 17 fucking lean pounds no water

and get this shit.... NONE of the participants touched a fucking weight or did any training at all

i dont fucking belive that though... ZERO TRAINING and adding 17 pounds of lean dry muscle tissue in 10 weeks?????

do you believe it?

imho you still gotta train amd stress the muscle somewhat, but this study showed all yoi gotta do is inject and you'll add pounds and pounds of dry muscle  :o


Of course lifting is needed but steroids were developed to build muscle. Give an untrained person steroids and they will build muscle with out lifting a weight. There are limitations of course but there are for people who lift too.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 26, 2017, 11:40:27 AM

Of course lifting is needed but steroids were developed to build muscle. Give an untrained person steroids and they will build muscle with out lifting a weight. There are limitations of course but there are for people who lift too.

thats true, but 17 pounds of real muscle only in 10 weeks?

hell it took me 3 good years to add 5-6 pounds of lean dry tissue and i was on test, tren, deca, dbol, drol lol


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on September 26, 2017, 12:43:15 PM
that's true, but 17 pounds of real muscle only in 10 weeks?

hell it took me 3 good years to add 5-6 pounds of lean dry tissue and i was on test, tren, deca, dbol, drol lol


Perhaps - Have you Ever thought that you don't have very good genetics for building muscle tissue.
you maybe better suited to long distance running / endurance sports


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on September 26, 2017, 12:45:19 PM
thats true, but 17 pounds of real muscle only in 10 weeks?

hell it took me 3 good years to add 5-6 pounds of lean dry tissue and i was on test, tren, deca, dbol, drol lol

Depends on the people they used for this experiment. If they were emaciated from the start and had never touched a weight in their lives I could see it being true. When you first used steroids was it the first time that you ever went to a gym also? I would guess not. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 26, 2017, 12:52:41 PM

Perhaps - Have you Ever thought that you don't have very good genetics for building muscle tissue.
you maybe better suited to long distance running / endurance sports

i dont have good "size" genetics but i do have good "shape" genetics

heres my arm after being off gear for 9 months

id say i have slow twitch in my legs and fast in my shoulders and arms as i can punch very hard, actually i got a strong ass too as i can hip thrust almost 500 pounds @ a current bodyweight of 148  8)

strong ass and shoulders equal strong punch i guess


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on September 26, 2017, 01:11:06 PM
i dont have good "size" genetics but i do have good "shape" genetics

heres my arm after being off gear for 9 months

id say i have slow twitch in my legs and fast in my shoulders and arms as i can punch very hard, actually i got a strong ass too as i can hip thrust almost 500 pounds @ a current bodyweight of 148  8)

strong ass and shoulders equal strong punch i guess


we all have different genetic abilities - Mine Good enough for National & international level Powerlifting & bodybuilding & Not much good for playing Uk football or US basketball to make loads of $. :'(


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 26, 2017, 01:29:00 PM

we all have different genetic abilities - Mine Good enough for National & international level Powerlifting & bodybuilding & Not much good for playing Uk football or US basketball to make loads of $. :'(

that's true

baseball or basketball are better for the $$$ then football though, as the average player only plays 5 years or so before injuries do them in 

basketball players can play til 35 or so and baseball up to even 40

or golf, but that isnt a sport


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 26, 2017, 02:38:26 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 26, 2017, 02:54:16 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on September 27, 2017, 12:48:46 AM
mike was an ok bb. but he was sooo wrong about training. if he were right and all you needed to do was go to failure and be done per body part. why reps? say you can bench 300 for 1 rep. put 310 on it try to get it up then have a little help( thats positive failure) then hold it at the top until you cant no  longer ( static failure) then lower it slow as you can( negative failure) and bam. your done for chest. 1 rep! max weights and failure. acccording to mike you dont need a pump. just failure. so one rep per body part and your done.  right?  lmao. he was such a tool.but he says 6-8 reps cuz research shows thats the best for building muscle. but i thought failure was?  lol      heavy weights 6-10 sets per bodypart 4-12 reps with one pump set and your done.

Opinions about Mike as a bber is of course a very subjective evaluation. He may be "OK" to some but he was in his era part of the top of the top. A huge part of the reason he was so popular and still stirs so much interest is his unique physique.

As far as your take on his training, which you term "so wrong" -- so wrong but yet created a world class physique is more of your profound misunderstanding of his training. He did address the issue you have brought up. He talked about "muscle inroads" which are now often referred to as TUT (time under tension). A one rep max does require maximum intensity but very little "inroads", i.e., digging deeper in the the muscle fibers. You can only use a certain percentage of a muscle even at full exertion and those fibers fire at an all or nothing rate. So a one rep max leaves a certain percentage of that particular muscle group dormant. Only by increasing TUT are you able to recruit those fibers as the other ones drop out due to fatigued. Mike even walked through a typical set done HIT style. For example, say, you picked a weight, say 205 lbs, in which you can do six full reps and unable to complete a seventh rep. That just means you can't move 205 lbs but you still have enough strength to maybe move 195lbs. That's where forced reps come in. Being assisted so that you are still working at max intensity but now making deeper inroads into that particular muscle group. When that positive, concentric part, have been exhausted you still have something left in the negative, concentric, part of the movement continuing until the muscle group has been completely exhausted.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on September 27, 2017, 12:57:09 AM
Mikes training philosophys were actutually totally on the spot! No need to stay in the gym for days. You can get it done 4 times a week while also focusing on getting a education etc. This was a huge gift of him to bb.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on September 27, 2017, 03:14:32 AM
i grew up when mike was at his peak. i didnt like his attitude. period. he thought he was the best. he thought he was right. he put down other bodybuilders always saying they were wrong. etc.  his build was ok. when he was alone he looked good. copared him next to others and he was a swimmer. no chest no shoulders no back. etc. i remmeber something arnold once said( about franco but it applys here) when you lift heavy weight all the time the muscle doesnt "pop" when you flex it. and hes right. people like mike and franco etc have a rugged build but when they flex nothing pops. doesnt change much. and mike was a liar. he did not train the way he preached. end of story. he also took lots of drugs as did everyone else too. but he built himself first using regular workouts then needed a gimmick to sell courses and books. true alot of guys were over training wich is actually when steriods work their best. when there is much trauma to the body . mikes arragance and attitude is what made him a shit bodybuilder and a poor loser. end of story


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on September 27, 2017, 03:31:50 AM
i grew up when mike was at his peak. i didn't like his attitude. period. he thought he was the best. he thought he was right. he put down other bodybuilders always saying they were wrong. etc.  his build was OK. when he was alone he looked good. compared him next to others and he was a swimmer. no chest no shoulders no back. etc. i remember something Arnold once said( about Franco but it applies here) when you lift heavy weight all the time the muscle doesn't "pop" when you flex it. and hes right. people like mike and Franco etc have a rugged build but when they flex nothing pops. doesn't change much. and mike was a liar. he did not train the way he preached. end of story. he also took lots of drugs as did everyone else too. but he built himself first using regular workouts then needed a gimmick to sell courses and books. true a lot of guys were over training which is actually when steroids work their best. when there is much trauma to the body . mikes arrogance and attitude is what made him a shit bodybuilder and a poor loser. end of story


Yep -- Well summed up.

Didn't do his education or mental health a lot of good all that extra free time away from the gym.. ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on September 27, 2017, 05:28:46 AM
i grew up when mike was at his peak. i didnt like his attitude. period. he thought he was the best. he thought he was right. he put down other bodybuilders always saying they were wrong. etc.  his build was ok. when he was alone he looked good. copared him next to others and he was a swimmer. no chest no shoulders no back. etc. i remmeber something arnold once said( about franco but it applys here) when you lift heavy weight all the time the muscle doesnt "pop" when you flex it. and hes right. people like mike and franco etc have a rugged build but when they flex nothing pops. doesnt change much. and mike was a liar. he did not train the way he preached. end of story. he also took lots of drugs as did everyone else too. but he built himself first using regular workouts then needed a gimmick to sell courses and books. true alot of guys were over training wich is actually when steriods work their best. when there is much trauma to the body . mikes arragance and attitude is what made him a shit bodybuilder and a poor loser. end of story

However, Mike and Franco actually looked strong and powerful, their muscles didn't have a puffed up look to them or 'pop' as you might say. It is a bodybuilding, but I think many admired the powerful look and wanted to do whatever he was apparently doing to get that look to their physique.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 27, 2017, 02:42:15 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on September 27, 2017, 07:39:00 PM
i grew up when mike was at his peak. i didnt like his attitude. period. he thought he was the best. he thought he was right. he put down other bodybuilders always saying they were wrong. etc.  his build was ok. when he was alone he looked good. copared him next to others and he was a swimmer. no chest no shoulders no back. etc. i remmeber something arnold once said( about franco but it applys here) when you lift heavy weight all the time the muscle doesnt "pop" when you flex it. and hes right. people like mike and franco etc have a rugged build but when they flex nothing pops. doesnt change much. and mike was a liar. he did not train the way he preached. end of story. he also took lots of drugs as did everyone else too. but he built himself first using regular workouts then needed a gimmick to sell courses and books. true alot of guys were over training wich is actually when steriods work their best. when there is much trauma to the body . mikes arragance and attitude is what made him a shit bodybuilder and a poor loser. end of story

Arnold did the same thing but took it a lot further.  But then, he is Arnold and when he wants the food, it's there.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BEEFYHEAVYWEIGHT on September 28, 2017, 11:26:17 AM
i grew up when mike was at his peak. i didnt like his attitude. period. he thought he was the best. he thought he was right. he put down other bodybuilders always saying they were wrong. etc.  his build was ok. when he was alone he looked good. copared him next to others and he was a swimmer. no chest no shoulders no back. etc. i remmeber something arnold once said( about franco but it applys here) when you lift heavy weight all the time the muscle doesnt "pop" when you flex it. and hes right. people like mike and franco etc have a rugged build but when they flex nothing pops. doesnt change much. and mike was a liar. he did not train the way he preached. end of story. he also took lots of drugs as did everyone else too. but he built himself first using regular workouts then needed a gimmick to sell courses and books. true alot of guys were over training wich is actually when steriods work their best. when there is much trauma to the body . mikes arragance and attitude is what made him a shit bodybuilder and a poor loser. end of story
Well said.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rambone on September 29, 2017, 10:17:59 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=745358;image)

The Mentzer bros really rocked the creepy pedo look and rocked it hard


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 29, 2017, 02:54:50 PM
The Mentzer bros really rocked the creepy pedo look and rocked it hard


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on September 29, 2017, 03:06:17 PM
mike mentzer had a great look anyone on here who think's he was an average bodybuilder is a moron.  the guy could actually write good as well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 29, 2017, 03:10:38 PM
mike mentzer had a great look anyone on here who think's he was an average bodybuilder is a moron.  the guy could actually write good as well.

its best to have both arms and chest like 15 said

but if you could only have one or the other id say arms win

franco had torso mentzer had arms


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 29, 2017, 03:43:42 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on September 29, 2017, 08:42:22 PM
mike mentzer had a great look anyone on here who think's he was an average bodybuilder is a moron.  the guy could actually write good as well.

It is amazing the impact Mike still has on people after nearly forty years since his last competition.
His detractors have become so delusional that they claim he only looks good standing alone despite
competing on the elite level where he has to be compared to others. He did win his class in '79 at the O as well as placing first place 8 times in various high level shows. And then of course calling one of the most thickly muscled bbers of his time as having a "swimmer's build" is just beyond ludicrous.

Quite the twink standing between two legendary bbers.

(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/12135217_393198484209165_1495401935_n.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on September 29, 2017, 08:44:32 PM
It is amazing the impact Mike still has on people after nearly forty years since his last competition.
His detractors have become so delusional that they claim he only looks good standing alone despite
competing on the elite level where he has to be compared to others. He did win his class in '79 at the O as well as placing first place 8 times in various high level shows. And then of course calling one of the most thickly muscled bbers of his time as having a "swimmer's build" is just beyond ludicrous.

Quite the twink standing between two legendary bbers.

(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/12135217_393198484209165_1495401935_n.jpg)

Yeah, Mike's arms are as big as legs there. Looking jacked!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: WalterWhite on September 29, 2017, 09:04:44 PM
It is amazing the impact Mike still has on people after nearly forty years since his last competition.
His detractors have become so delusional that they claim he only looks good standing alone despite
competing on the elite level where he has to be compared to others. He did win his class in '79 at the O as well as placing first place 8 times in various high level shows. And then of course calling one of the most thickly muscled bbers of his time as having a "swimmer's build" is just beyond ludicrous.

Quite the twink standing between two legendary bbers.

(https://scontent.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/12135217_393198484209165_1495401935_n.jpg)

Guy was a beast.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DooM_ on September 30, 2017, 03:25:00 AM
keep up the great work guys , excellent pics in this thread some which I'd never before !


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 30, 2017, 03:26:40 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on September 30, 2017, 04:09:38 AM
^^^^ back when bb arms were actually bigger than thier shoulders


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on September 30, 2017, 06:04:20 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on September 30, 2017, 06:10:43 AM
Mike had very big thick Arms & forearms looking much bigger than what they measured 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on September 30, 2017, 08:33:47 AM
he could pull off the vacume pose as well, and one of the very few bodybuilders besides arnold that made money selling training programs. his peers where jealous. they could never do that.

and that clown bob chick who said mike was overated, bob "who has lost every job he had" chick got tore up so bad in that thread, he had to log in with his gimmick accounts to defend himself.

mike had a great look ill argue that with any clown on here


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 01, 2017, 04:38:40 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 01, 2017, 04:46:22 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on October 01, 2017, 06:39:37 PM
1980


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 04, 2017, 03:14:43 PM

good post

Thanks bro!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on October 04, 2017, 05:14:57 PM
Guy was a beast.

Im still not convinced that that first pic isnt shopped.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 05, 2017, 05:23:25 AM
Is there any exact history as to why he ended up in the crazy house for 5 years? I've heard it's because he ran naked through venice and saw ufo:s. But no exact history matches. Anyone?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on October 05, 2017, 06:50:50 AM
Is there any exact history as to why he ended up in the crazy house for 5 years? I've heard it's because he ran naked through venice and saw ufo:s. But no exact history matches. Anyone?

He did run around naked, supposedly directing traffic ,yammering about aliens landing, declaring the end of the world -- stuff like that.  Some say he also ran into a bank and tried to hide behind the tellers, fearing that Arnold's hitmen were after him.

I don't know if it's related to his time in the looney bin, but Art Jones once turned Mike away from his property for some manner of craziness.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 05, 2017, 02:40:44 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on October 06, 2017, 12:06:55 PM
He did run around naked, supposedly directing traffic ,yammering about aliens landing, declaring the end of the world -- stuff like that.  Some say he also ran into a bank and tried to hide behind the tellers, fearing that Arnold's hitmen were after him.

I don't know if it's related to his time in the looney bin, but Art Jones once turned Mike away from his property for some manner of craziness.

Think most of us have heard various stories about mike's madness
No doubt a good few are false

Never heard the background as to why or what caused this ( other than the 1980 Olympia result )
Any factual diagnosis / information out there..?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on October 06, 2017, 12:11:14 PM
Think most of us have heard various stories about mike's madness
No doubt a good few are false

Never heard the background as to why or what caused this ( other than the 1980 Olympia result )
Any factual diagnosis / information out there..?

I have none but one could make the supposition that a heavy reliance on amphetamines would gradually fuck with your mind.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on October 06, 2017, 03:24:20 PM
I have none but one could make the supposition that a heavy reliance on amphetamines would gradually fuck with your mind.

Possibly -- I have a friend who has drug induced phychosis

It's often caused by amphetamine / cocaine Useage
& Is a good indication of underlying mental disorders


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on October 06, 2017, 03:52:47 PM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=745943;image)

This pic fucking nuts the pic.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on October 06, 2017, 03:54:02 PM
Think most of us have heard various stories about mike's madness
No doubt a good few are false

Never heard the background as to why or what caused this ( other than the 1980 Olympia result )
Any factual diagnosis / information out there..?

he had a magazine (not sure if it even lasted a year) in 1981 or 1982

I would guess he was bi-polar or schitzo (maybe exacerbated by meth)

It would be pathetic to lose your mind over a stupid bodybuilding contest (and he had lost contests before) and seems unlikely to be the cause

Vince B was friends with Ray so maybe he can shed some light on it


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 06, 2017, 04:03:56 PM
he had a magazine (not sure if it even lasted a year) in 1981 or 1982

I would guess he was bi-polar or schitzo (maybe exacerbated by meth)

It would be pathetic to lose your mind over a stupid bodybuilding contest (and he had lost contests before) and seems unlikely to be the cause

Vince B was friends with Ray so maybe he can shed some light on it

he was working for AJ at the naut headquarters in 83-84 so the breakdown must have happened after

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KavhUif7a4


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on October 06, 2017, 05:43:29 PM
Mike wrote that his drug use messed his mind and judgement up. In the end he was a speed junkie who went off the deep end. He also admitted he felt steroids created mental problems for him. He cleaned up toward the end of his life.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on October 06, 2017, 09:31:11 PM
he had a magazine (not sure if it even lasted a year) in 1981 or 1982

I would guess he was bi-polar or schitzo (maybe exacerbated by meth)

It would be pathetic to lose your mind over a stupid bodybuilding contest (and he had lost contests before) and seems unlikely to be the cause

Vince B was friends with Ray so maybe he can shed some light on it

Ray talked about Mike but not in any detail. He said his dad told him to look after Mike. When he put Mike on the staff at his Muscle Mill Gym in Torrance that he lost members because of Mike's hostility to policemen, etc.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on October 06, 2017, 11:00:21 PM
he had a magazine (not sure if it even lasted a year) in 1981 or 1982

I would guess he was bi-polar or schitzo (maybe exacerbated by meth)

It would be pathetic to lose your mind over a stupid bodybuilding contest (and he had lost contests before) and seems unlikely to be the cause

Vince B was friends with Ray so maybe he can shed some light on it

Or just caused by long-term amphetamine use at higher doses.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 07, 2017, 12:40:12 AM
Ray talked about Mike but not in any detail. He said his dad told him to look after Mike. When he put Mike on the staff at his Muscle Mill Gym in Torrance that he lost members because of Mike's hostility to policemen, etc.

Interesting! How was Ray like? Was he into speed too?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on October 07, 2017, 01:14:30 AM
Interesting! How was Ray like? Was he into speed too?

I don't know if he was using anything when he was in Australia. He did take pain killers to cope with the pain in his neck. Remember he squatted with 925 pounds for two reps! The guy was super strong.

When I was at his place in Torrance in 1991 we were going out and I didn't want to go because I had a bad headache. He told me to take two pills and the headache would disappear. Well, I objected because I seldom take even aspirin and definitely no recreation drugs. He assured me they were okay. I reluctantly took them and voila soon enough no more headache. Made me think about how some people might have this experience then ask for more of those pills if another migraine occurred.

He stayed at our place in Sydney for about a year or so. His defacto, Kathy, told us she couldn't live with Ray if he and his friends were preparing for a contest. They would take pills to get hyped up for a hard workout then more pills later to calm down. Add in the steroids and we have a recipe for all sorts of emotional changes.

In 1991 Ray had a good business using Medx machines treating people for sore backs and necks. He had more than one clinic and things were going well. New BMW 535 for a start. When he was in Australia he competed and lost to Sonny Schmidt in Melbourne. Since Mike won Mr Universe and both won Mr America, Ray wanted to also be a Mr Universe. So he tried one last time to compete. He told me that when he and his training partners weighed over 290 pounds they started getting sick so had to give up that quest. He didn't elaborate and I didn't question him further. He was a bit cavalier about steroids and told me they were just gonad stimulators. When he ended up on dialysis I wondered if what he did contributed. I really have no idea. He told me that in 1979 when he was training for the Mr America contest that his mother got sick. He wanted that title so bad that he said, "I would have done anything to win....even train 24 hours a day!"  He did win. One thing that most didn't know is that Ray and Mike were competitors. Seems Ray felt that his dad favoured Mike. So Ray always had a chip on his shoulder. He always looked serious and even like someone you don't mess with. Truth is he was rather nervous and would let off steam over triffles. Or react strongly to minor things. One day we were driving along and came to a roundabout. A gym member saw us and as we slowed on the corner banged on the side of the car. Ray just about shit himself. Another day we were in Sydney outside a gym and I was going to introduce him to the owner so that Ray could put on a seminar and training camp. I had built most of the gym equipment for this club. When we got out of my car a friend who Ray had met on New Year's Eve pulled up on her motorbike. Ray presumed this was a setup and took off running down the street. I followed him to a corner and then gave up. There was Mr Canada chasing Mr America down the street! He took the train back to our place. It was a coincidence that she was there. Yet Ray reacted like that.

All the bodybuilding champions love putting on seminars in gyms, especially overseas, etc. There are always one or two women attending who adore the champion and romance is there for the taking. Ray didn't turn down the friendship of one woman and they spent some time together. Her jealous boyfriend found out and when Ray was at her place the jealous guy and a mate caused a commotion outside and yelled and threw bricks  at the house. Ray was scared that day. The next morning my son alerted Ray that he had a flat tire. Next thing Ray was out there cussing and cursing and blaming these guys. Ray was left handed and took the tire off in no time. When it was off I examined it and found a nail there. Ray felt stupid because now we knew why he had a flat tire. The truth is Ray wasn't a violent man. He detested guys who beat their wives or girlfriends. "All I want is to be left alone."

You should have seen how competitive we were playing table tennis. My son, Zorba, beat both of us. I was number two. Ray could smash that ball like a champion and I would tell him to "hit it hard". One day he told me he would play me but I wasn't allowed to speak. You should have been there. It made things worse! He lost anyway. After that game he explained that the bat was no good. I had the best competition bats. He insisted on using a sandpaper covered bat so I acquired one. When he lost using it he almost broke the bat on the end of the table. Ah, good days. I have a photo of Ray playing and will post it when I find it. Also some other photos taken when he was in Australia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 07, 2017, 01:22:50 AM
I don't know if he was using anything when he was in Australia. He did take pain killers to cope with the pain in his neck. Remember he squatted with 925 pounds for two reps! The guy was super strong.

When I was at his place in Torrance in 1991 we were going out and I didn't want to go because I had a bad headache. He told me to take two pills and the headache would disappear. Well, I objected because I seldom take even aspirin and definitely no recreation drugs. He assured me they were okay. I reluctantly took them and voila soon enough no more headache. Made me think about how some people might have this experience then ask for more of those pills if another migraine occurred.

He stayed at our place in Sydney for about a year or so. His defacto, Kathy, told us she couldn't live with Ray if he and his friends were preparing for a contest. They would take pills to get hyped up for a hard workout then more pills later to calm down. Add in the steroids and we have a recipe for all sorts of emotional changes.

In 1991 Ray had a good business using Medx machines treating people for sore backs and necks. He had more than one clinic and things were going well. New BMW 535 for a start. When he was in Australia he competed and lost to Sonny Schmidt in Melbourne. Since Mike won Mr Universe and both won Mr America, Ray wanted to also be a Mr Universe. So he tried one last time to compete. He told me that when he and his training partners weighed over 290 pounds they started getting sick so had to give up that quest. He didn't elaborate and I didn't question him further. He was a bit cavalier about steroids and told me they were just gonad stimulators. When he ended up on dialysis I wondered if what he did contributed. I really have no idea. He told me that in 1979 when he was training for the Mr America contest that his mother got sick. He wanted that title so bad that he said, "I would have done anything to win....even train 24 hours a day!"  He did win. One thing that most didn't know is that Ray and Mike were competitors. Seems Ray felt that his dad favoured Mike. So Ray always had a chip on his shoulder. He always looked serious and even like someone you don't mess with. Truth is he was rather nervous and would let off steam over triffles. Or react strongly to minor things. One day we were driving along and came to a roundabout. A gym member saw us and as we slowed on the corner banged on the side of the car. Ray just about shit himself. Another day we were in Sydney outside a gym and I was going to introduce him to the owner so that Ray could put on a seminar and training camp. I had built most of the gym equipment for this club. When we got out of my car a friend who Ray had met on New Year's Eve pulled up on her motorbike. Ray presumed this was a setup and took off running down the street. I followed him to a corner and then gave up. There was Mr Canada chasing Mr America down the street! He took the train back to our place. It was a coincidence that she was there. Yet Ray reacted like that.

All the bodybuilding champions love putting on seminars in gyms, especially overseas, etc. There are always one or two women attending who adore the champion and romance is there for the taking. Ray didn't turn down the friendship of one woman and they spent some time together. Her jealous boyfriend found out and when Ray was at her place the jealous guy and a mate caused a commotion outside and yelled and threw bricks  at the house. Ray was scared that day. The next morning my son alerted Ray that he had a flat tire. Next thing Ray was out there cussing and cursing and blaming these guys. Ray was left handed and took the tire off in no time. When it was off I examined it and found a nail there. Ray felt stupid because now we knew why he had a flat tire. The truth is Ray wasn't a violent man. He detested guys who beat their wives or girlfriends. "All I want is to be left alone."

You should have seen how competitive we were playing table tennis. My son, Zorba, beat both of us. I was number two. Ray could smash that ball like a champion and I would tell him to "hit it hard". One day he told me he would play me but I wasn't allowed to speak. You should have been there. It made things worse! He lost anyway. After that game he explained that the bat was no good. I had the best competition bats. He insisted on using a sandpaper covered bat so I acquired one. When he lost using it he almost broke the bat on the end of the table. Ah, good days. I have a photo of Ray playing and will post it when I find it. Also some other photos taken when he was in Australia.

Great post! You make the man come alive again.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 07, 2017, 01:45:40 AM
gay and dyke


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Simple Simon on October 07, 2017, 02:13:50 AM
I don't know if he was using anything when he was in Australia. He did take pain killers to cope with the pain in his neck. Remember he squatted with 925 pounds for two reps! The guy was super strong.

When I was at his place in Torrance in 1991 we were going out and I didn't want to go because I had a bad headache. He told me to take two pills and the headache would disappear. Well, I objected because I seldom take even aspirin and definitely no recreation drugs. He assured me they were okay. I reluctantly took them and voila soon enough no more headache. Made me think about how some people might have this experience then ask for more of those pills if another migraine occurred.

He stayed at our place in Sydney for about a year or so. His defacto, Kathy, told us she couldn't live with Ray if he and his friends were preparing for a contest. They would take pills to get hyped up for a hard workout then more pills later to calm down. Add in the steroids and we have a recipe for all sorts of emotional changes.

In 1991 Ray had a good business using Medx machines treating people for sore backs and necks. He had more than one clinic and things were going well. New BMW 535 for a start. When he was in Australia he competed and lost to Sonny Schmidt in Melbourne. Since Mike won Mr Universe and both won Mr America, Ray wanted to also be a Mr Universe. So he tried one last time to compete. He told me that when he and his training partners weighed over 290 pounds they started getting sick so had to give up that quest. He didn't elaborate and I didn't question him further. He was a bit cavalier about steroids and told me they were just gonad stimulators. When he ended up on dialysis I wondered if what he did contributed. I really have no idea. He told me that in 1979 when he was training for the Mr America contest that his mother got sick. He wanted that title so bad that he said, "I would have done anything to win....even train 24 hours a day!"  He did win. One thing that most didn't know is that Ray and Mike were competitors. Seems Ray felt that his dad favoured Mike. So Ray always had a chip on his shoulder. He always looked serious and even like someone you don't mess with. Truth is he was rather nervous and would let off steam over triffles. Or react strongly to minor things. One day we were driving along and came to a roundabout. A gym member saw us and as we slowed on the corner banged on the side of the car. Ray just about shit himself. Another day we were in Sydney outside a gym and I was going to introduce him to the owner so that Ray could put on a seminar and training camp. I had built most of the gym equipment for this club. When we got out of my car a friend who Ray had met on New Year's Eve pulled up on her motorbike. Ray presumed this was a setup and took off running down the street. I followed him to a corner and then gave up. There was Mr Canada chasing Mr America down the street! He took the train back to our place. It was a coincidence that she was there. Yet Ray reacted like that.

All the bodybuilding champions love putting on seminars in gyms, especially overseas, etc. There are always one or two women attending who adore the champion and romance is there for the taking. Ray didn't turn down the friendship of one woman and they spent some time together. Her jealous boyfriend found out and when Ray was at her place the jealous guy and a mate caused a commotion outside and yelled and threw bricks  at the house. Ray was scared that day. The next morning my son alerted Ray that he had a flat tire. Next thing Ray was out there cussing and cursing and blaming these guys. Ray was left handed and took the tire off in no time. When it was off I examined it and found a nail there. Ray felt stupid because now we knew why he had a flat tire. The truth is Ray wasn't a violent man. He detested guys who beat their wives or girlfriends. "All I want is to be left alone."

You should have seen how competitive we were playing table tennis. My son, Zorba, beat both of us. I was number two. Ray could smash that ball like a champion and I would tell him to "hit it hard". One day he told me he would play me but I wasn't allowed to speak. You should have been there. It made things worse! He lost anyway. After that game he explained that the bat was no good. I had the best competition bats. He insisted on using a sandpaper covered bat so I acquired one. When he lost using it he almost broke the bat on the end of the table. Ah, good days. I have a photo of Ray playing and will post it when I find it. Also some other photos taken when he was in Australia.

see, now thats a great story and totally believable...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 07, 2017, 03:08:51 AM
Ray has kinda fallen between the lines. Mike sure was a very intelligent induvidual both in mind and body. Very cool to get some info on the guy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Rascal full on October 07, 2017, 03:13:59 AM
I don't know if he was using anything when he was in Australia. He did take pain killers to cope with the pain in his neck. Remember he squatted with 925 pounds for two reps! The guy was super strong.

When I was at his place in Torrance in 1991 we were going out and I didn't want to go because I had a bad headache. He told me to take two pills and the headache would disappear. Well, I objected because I seldom take even aspirin and definitely no recreation drugs. He assured me they were okay. I reluctantly took them and voila soon enough no more headache. Made me think about how some people might have this experience then ask for more of those pills if another migraine occurred.

He stayed at our place in Sydney for about a year or so. His defacto, Kathy, told us she couldn't live with Ray if he and his friends were preparing for a contest. They would take pills to get hyped up for a hard workout then more pills later to calm down. Add in the steroids and we have a recipe for all sorts of emotional changes.

In 1991 Ray had a good business using Medx machines treating people for sore backs and necks. He had more than one clinic and things were going well. New BMW 535 for a start. When he was in Australia he competed and lost to Sonny Schmidt in Melbourne. Since Mike won Mr Universe and both won Mr America, Ray wanted to also be a Mr Universe. So he tried one last time to compete. He told me that when he and his training partners weighed over 290 pounds they started getting sick so had to give up that quest. He didn't elaborate and I didn't question him further. He was a bit cavalier about steroids and told me they were just gonad stimulators. When he ended up on dialysis I wondered if what he did contributed. I really have no idea. He told me that in 1979 when he was training for the Mr America contest that his mother got sick. He wanted that title so bad that he said, "I would have done anything to win....even train 24 hours a day!"  He did win. One thing that most didn't know is that Ray and Mike were competitors. Seems Ray felt that his dad favoured Mike. So Ray always had a chip on his shoulder. He always looked serious and even like someone you don't mess with. Truth is he was rather nervous and would let off steam over triffles. Or react strongly to minor things. One day we were driving along and came to a roundabout. A gym member saw us and as we slowed on the corner banged on the side of the car. Ray just about shit himself. Another day we were in Sydney outside a gym and I was going to introduce him to the owner so that Ray could put on a seminar and training camp. I had built most of the gym equipment for this club. When we got out of my car a friend who Ray had met on New Year's Eve pulled up on her motorbike. Ray presumed this was a setup and took off running down the street. I followed him to a corner and then gave up. There was Mr Canada chasing Mr America down the street! He took the train back to our place. It was a coincidence that she was there. Yet Ray reacted like that.

All the bodybuilding champions love putting on seminars in gyms, especially overseas, etc. There are always one or two women attending who adore the champion and romance is there for the taking. Ray didn't turn down the friendship of one woman and they spent some time together. Her jealous boyfriend found out and when Ray was at her place the jealous guy and a mate caused a commotion outside and yelled and threw bricks  at the house. Ray was scared that day. The next morning my son alerted Ray that he had a flat tire. Next thing Ray was out there cussing and cursing and blaming these guys. Ray was left handed and took the tire off in no time. When it was off I examined it and found a nail there. Ray felt stupid because now we knew why he had a flat tire. The truth is Ray wasn't a violent man. He detested guys who beat their wives or girlfriends. "All I want is to be left alone."

You should have seen how competitive we were playing table tennis. My son, Zorba, beat both of us. I was number two. Ray could smash that ball like a champion and I would tell him to "hit it hard". One day he told me he would play me but I wasn't allowed to speak. You should have been there. It made things worse! He lost anyway. After that game he explained that the bat was no good. I had the best competition bats. He insisted on using a sandpaper covered bat so I acquired one. When he lost using it he almost broke the bat on the end of the table. Ah, good days. I have a photo of Ray playing and will post it when I find it. Also some other photos taken when he was in Australia.

Great post Vince, really enjoyed this one. Have you written a book on your experiences over the years?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on October 07, 2017, 07:25:01 AM
Always great to hear about the Mentzer bros, nice one, Vince.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on October 07, 2017, 08:51:32 AM
Ray sounds like a bit of a head case himself

That last video they made with Mike chain smoking and looking like he's in his late sixties and Ray complaining he can't get a woman is just depressing

They were both around 50 at the time, basically what should have been the prime of their life


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 07, 2017, 08:58:19 AM
Ray sounds like a bit of a head case himself

That last video they made with Mike chain smoking and looking like he's in his late sixties and Ray complaining he can't get a woman is just depressing

They were both around 50 at the time, basically what should have been the prime of their life

i believe that gay was close to benny poda

another fucking weirdo nutcase


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on October 07, 2017, 09:22:38 AM
Podda was and is out of his fucking mind.  Hanging himself onstage, blowing blood out of his nose, living in a cave...he makes the Mentzers look like something from Norman Rockwell by comparison.

Oh, just by the by, I reckon Fortress hasn't seen this thread yet; otherwise, he'd be calling bullshit on Ray doubling 925 in anything more than a quarter squat ;)

Also, kudos to Mr. Basile for sharing those stories.  Vince, I think we'd all appreciate more tales about Ray, Dillet and others who've frequented your gym.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on October 07, 2017, 09:47:17 AM
i remember one time reading on here, that ray  and other guys would get high on coke and do all night squatting sessions at his gym in california,


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 07, 2017, 09:58:45 AM
Canon. More Vince stories on the damn subject.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on October 07, 2017, 11:01:07 AM
Both Mentzer brothers sounded like they were unstable drug users.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 07, 2017, 11:02:35 AM
Both Mentzer brothers sounded like they were unstable drug users.

was dyke really an alcoholic  ???


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on October 07, 2017, 11:09:50 AM
Just to add on--Thanks, Vince B., for sharing some personal stories of Ray Mentzer (and Mike too, sorta).  Great stuff! 

I think Ray was slightly more genetically blessed than Mike but maybe Mike was just that much more driven.  Would you agree or disagree?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 08, 2017, 03:09:44 AM
Vince you say he (ray) liked painkillers. But still abit shady answer. Qualudes or tylenol?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on October 08, 2017, 03:35:27 AM
Vince you say he (ray) liked painkillers. But still abit shady answer. Qualudes or tylenol?

Understand that Ray Mentzer was a very private man. He didn't say much about drugs and I never asked. He had to see chiropractors to get neck adjustments. Even did some himself.

I really can't shed any light on any drugs that Ray might have used. He sounded like he knew what he was talking about. He worked with Arthur Jones and Arthur said Ray was one of the

few bodybuilders with genuine 20+ inch arms. Muscle for muscle Ray was huge. Probably had longer muscle bellies than Mike so he was able to develop larger muscles. He never looked that

big in photos for some reason.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 08, 2017, 03:54:01 AM
From what I heard Ray actually devloped a much more impresive body than Mike ever did. But he never really showed it of. Was aparantlly 280 lean in the early 90:es. One of the biggest creatures around Golds with Vic Richards. But this is just a story i've heard.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on October 09, 2017, 12:37:43 PM
Thanks for sharing that great story, Vince!

I use to see Ray around pretty regularly when I lived in the Torrance/Redondo Beach area. We both seemed to be fans of "El Pollo Loco" chicken place. I first saw him in person in the early 1980s when he walked into Barlow's gym in Torrance with Benny Podda.

Ray was huge and had a more traditional bbing look than Mike. I think it was Mike's unique look that
made him stand out more than Ray. Ray was one of those guys, as Vince mentioned, that didn't look as impressive in pics than he did in person.

Last time I saw Ray was in 24hr Fitness on PCH in Torrance around 1998 or so. Nobody knew who he
was. I'm going around telling everybody that that's Ray Mentzer. They just shrugged their shoulders and said, "Who?"

I chatted with him a bit and he was very personable and friendly. He also didn't look too well but I didn't think anything about it. He just looked run down and tired. I wanted to ask about Mike but I figured he
gets that all the time and didn't want an eye rolling moment. He didn't train very hard that day and just
kind of piddled around with the dumbbells. Not like the first time I saw them over ten years ago with Benny where they were repping four plates on the bench.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on October 11, 2017, 11:24:40 AM
Zane and Mentzer's


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 11, 2017, 11:29:44 AM
Zane and Mentzer's

3 fellas of GERMANIC roots

FUCK YEAH😝


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on October 11, 2017, 01:44:37 PM
I don't know if he was using anything when he was in Australia. He did take pain killers to cope with the pain in his neck. Remember he squatted with 925 pounds for two reps! The guy was super strong.

When I was at his place in Torrance in 1991 we were going out and I didn't want to go because I had a bad headache. He told me to take two pills and the headache would disappear. Well, I objected because I seldom take even aspirin and definitely no recreation drugs. He assured me they were okay. I reluctantly took them and voila soon enough no more headache. Made me think about how some people might have this experience then ask for more of those pills if another migraine occurred.

He stayed at our place in Sydney for about a year or so. His defacto, Kathy, told us she couldn't live with Ray if he and his friends were preparing for a contest. They would take pills to get hyped up for a hard workout then more pills later to calm down. Add in the steroids and we have a recipe for all sorts of emotional changes.

In 1991 Ray had a good business using Medx machines treating people for sore backs and necks. He had more than one clinic and things were going well. New BMW 535 for a start. When he was in Australia he competed and lost to Sonny Schmidt in Melbourne. Since Mike won Mr Universe and both won Mr America, Ray wanted to also be a Mr Universe. So he tried one last time to compete. He told me that when he and his training partners weighed over 290 pounds they started getting sick so had to give up that quest. He didn't elaborate and I didn't question him further. He was a bit cavalier about steroids and told me they were just gonad stimulators. When he ended up on dialysis I wondered if what he did contributed. I really have no idea. He told me that in 1979 when he was training for the Mr America contest that his mother got sick. He wanted that title so bad that he said, "I would have done anything to win....even train 24 hours a day!"  He did win. One thing that most didn't know is that Ray and Mike were competitors. Seems Ray felt that his dad favoured Mike. So Ray always had a chip on his shoulder. He always looked serious and even like someone you don't mess with. Truth is he was rather nervous and would let off steam over triffles. Or react strongly to minor things. One day we were driving along and came to a roundabout. A gym member saw us and as we slowed on the corner banged on the side of the car. Ray just about shit himself. Another day we were in Sydney outside a gym and I was going to introduce him to the owner so that Ray could put on a seminar and training camp. I had built most of the gym equipment for this club. When we got out of my car a friend who Ray had met on New Year's Eve pulled up on her motorbike. Ray presumed this was a setup and took off running down the street. I followed him to a corner and then gave up. There was Mr Canada chasing Mr America down the street! He took the train back to our place. It was a coincidence that she was there. Yet Ray reacted like that.

All the bodybuilding champions love putting on seminars in gyms, especially overseas, etc. There are always one or two women attending who adore the champion and romance is there for the taking. Ray didn't turn down the friendship of one woman and they spent some time together. Her jealous boyfriend found out and when Ray was at her place the jealous guy and a mate caused a commotion outside and yelled and threw bricks  at the house. Ray was scared that day. The next morning my son alerted Ray that he had a flat tire. Next thing Ray was out there cussing and cursing and blaming these guys. Ray was left handed and took the tire off in no time. When it was off I examined it and found a nail there. Ray felt stupid because now we knew why he had a flat tire. The truth is Ray wasn't a violent man. He detested guys who beat their wives or girlfriends. "All I want is to be left alone."

You should have seen how competitive we were playing table tennis. My son, Zorba, beat both of us. I was number two. Ray could smash that ball like a champion and I would tell him to "hit it hard". One day he told me he would play me but I wasn't allowed to speak. You should have been there. It made things worse! He lost anyway. After that game he explained that the bat was no good. I had the best competition bats. He insisted on using a sandpaper covered bat so I acquired one. When he lost using it he almost broke the bat on the end of the table. Ah, good days. I have a photo of Ray playing and will post it when I find it. Also some other photos taken when he was in Australia.

Zorba . . . Zorba??? You named your kid Zorba? WTF???

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on October 11, 2017, 01:51:04 PM
Zorba . . . Zorba??? You named your kid Zorba? WTF???

J

It's a name from a 1946 novel titled "Zorba the Greek" which was made into a movie in 1964 starring Anthony Quinn as the title character.  Any literate person would know these things.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: sceagacros on October 11, 2017, 03:04:40 PM
Thanks for sharing that Vince, very cool.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 18, 2017, 11:30:24 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on October 18, 2017, 11:42:15 AM
It's a name from a 1946 novel titled "Zorba the Greek" which was made into a movie in 1964 starring Anthony Quinn as the title character.  Any literate person would know these things.

Man you named your kid Zorba! You realize this guy is gonna grow up and get the shit kicked out of him? Hope this one was a bad joke...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 18, 2017, 02:53:11 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 18, 2017, 03:07:13 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on October 18, 2017, 03:15:43 PM
:)

Sad pic.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on October 19, 2017, 12:34:04 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on October 19, 2017, 01:25:36 PM
Haven't seen those pics in years. What a shame, looking at Mike in street clothes he looks pretty good and kinda normal. No bloat or unhealthy look. Too bad he was a many year chain smoker and  did all those amphetamines.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 01:33:31 PM
Haven't seen those pics in years. What a shame, looking at Mike in street clothes he looks pretty good and kinda normal. No bloat or unhealthy look. Too bad he was a many year chain smoker and  did all those amphetamines.

and on 3 grams of deca 😂


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on October 19, 2017, 01:59:20 PM
and on 3 grams of deca 😂

4


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 02:05:12 PM
4

been reading the deca thread on 15's site and no one is really going over 2

so why is that dim?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on October 19, 2017, 04:36:35 PM
been reading the deca thread on 15's site and no one is really going over 2

so why is that dim?

I guess because they are a bunch a pussies that don't really want to be big like Mr Mike.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 04:43:30 PM
I guess because they are a bunch a pussies that don't really want to be big like Mr Mike.

 ;D

btw, 15 sends his regards and gave you high praise

oh, and he also promoted me to Wizard status


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on October 19, 2017, 04:45:03 PM
;D

btw, 15 sends his regards and gave you high praise

oh, and he also promoted me to Wizard status

He's alright in my book.  ;D  Personally I would go 1500 deca with 1500 tren. Then add in an oral  and you are on your way to Mr O status.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 04:52:38 PM
He's alright in my book.  ;D  Personally I would go 1500 deca with 1500 tren. Then add in an oral  and you are on your way to Mr O status.

for me those 2 are the only compounds that work

but... high dose tren kills any ability to add scale weigh

this is from my own personal experience and the guys on the deca thread are reporting the exact same thing

so... if i can get lean and dry om deca only then there wont even be a need for tren in my case, just deca a.d omly deca

also lots of guys there are blasting eq with deca and keeping test low to moderate



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on October 19, 2017, 05:04:41 PM
His girlfriend Cathy Gelfo dumped Mike and married Clint Beyerle.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on October 19, 2017, 05:41:06 PM
Man you named your kid Zorba! You realize this guy is gonna grow up and get the shit kicked out of him? Hope this one was a bad joke...

Father in law felt the same way. So son has 4 first names. There were never any problems with his name.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on October 19, 2017, 05:50:00 PM
for me those 2 are the only compounds that work

but... high dose tren kills any ability to add scale weigh

this is from my own personal experience and the guys on the deca thread are reporting the exact same thing

so... if i can get lean and dry om deca only then there wont even be a need for tren in my case, just deca a.d omly deca

also lots of guys there are blasting eq with deca and keeping test low to moderate



Running deca so high, what do you use to maintain any semblance of penile function?  Assuming you do fancy the pussy.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 10:06:32 PM
Running deca so high, what do you use to maintain any semblance of penile function?  Assuming you do fancy the pussy.

deca increases my sex drive actually

and i run trt of test with it


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on October 19, 2017, 10:15:37 PM
deca increases my sex drive actually

and i run trt of test with it

That's it?  No proviron?  Cialis?  Nothing? 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 10:20:25 PM
That's it?  No proviron?  Cialis?  Nothing? 

ive always had a brutal high sex drive

when i was a practing drunk id go to the whore house shit faced drunk and still fuck 3 or 4 whores

if you have access to 15s site check this thread

"deca dick" is a myth for some including me

http://www.ripped.com/forum/index.php?topic=20079.930


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on October 19, 2017, 10:23:55 PM
ive always had a brutal high sex drive

when i was a practing drunk id go to the whore house shit faced drunk and still fuck 3 or 4 whores

if you have access to 15s site check this thread

"deca dick" is a myth for some including me

http://www.ripped.com/forum/index.php?topic=20079.930


It fucking kills my dick even at low doses.  I will check out 15's site.  I still get horny and hard on deca but it goes limp on me during the fucking.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on October 19, 2017, 10:29:33 PM
It fucking kills my dick even at low doses.  I will check out 15's site.  I still get horny and hard on deca but it goes limp on me during the fucking.

check it out if you can, its a very good thread

some guys do report about it taking longer than normal to bust a nut, but i dont see no problem with that, as long as your cardio stamina allows you to keep up the banging pace

Im sure your jewish beauties would appreicate it  :)  ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on October 20, 2017, 01:39:47 AM
His girlfriend Cathy Gelfo dumped Mike and married Clint Beyerle.

Obviously Cathy was a fan of the stash . . . She was beautiful and Clint was the man.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 10, 2017, 04:45:07 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on November 10, 2017, 05:19:46 PM

Congratulations on that picture find - I'm pretty sure that is the plainest, cheapest, just thrown-together-in-someone's-kitchen set of sweats I have ever seen!  (Although I'd still have worn them at the time LOL!)

:)

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=749008;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 11, 2017, 05:15:49 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on November 11, 2017, 05:44:21 AM
Epic fall since that is Ray  :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on November 11, 2017, 10:25:25 AM
:)

In the middle pictures, appears Ray M .


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 11, 2017, 02:08:02 PM
In the middle pictures, appears Ray M .

Yeah I lump them both together  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Fallsview on November 11, 2017, 02:40:55 PM
I love how most of you on here run and try to get info on how to build muscles from steroid users...like they have some type of magical gift and know how to lift a heavy weight the right way. Listen, it doesn't matter what you do, if you are skinny, respond well to drugs and take the right amounts or the right one's it doesn't matter if you do 5 sets or 10...you're gonna grow.




STAY POSITIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Kwon on November 11, 2017, 07:34:50 PM
Yeah I lump them both together  ;D

(http://i.giftrunk.com/r1hkt8.gif)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on November 11, 2017, 11:00:35 PM
I love how most of you on here run and try to get info on how to build muscles from steroid users...like they have some type of magical gift and know how to lift a heavy weight the right way. Listen, it doesn't matter what you do, if you are skinny, respond well to drugs and take the right amounts or the right one's it doesn't matter if you do 5 sets or 10...you're gonna grow.




STAY POSITIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

^^^ This. I had a friend who was prescribed a variety of steroids for a medical condition. He called me up one day and said "man, I'm getting muscular and I don't even lift", lol. Yeah, those are powerful drugs.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 07:36:35 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 07:44:57 AM
 Mike and Richard Baldwin at Nautilus in 1970


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 07:45:49 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 08:30:00 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on November 12, 2017, 08:44:21 AM
Mike and Richard Baldwin at Nautilus in 1970

Their arms were both 17 1/4 there but Baldwin arms are better


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 10:53:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 12:55:46 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 12, 2017, 01:17:21 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 13, 2017, 01:39:00 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on November 14, 2017, 07:07:32 AM
:)

great photoshop


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on November 14, 2017, 08:16:20 AM
Triceps  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on November 14, 2017, 09:41:37 AM
great photoshop

Damn! I didn't even catch that until you mentioned it!

And it clearly shows Mentzer was definitely not on Arnold's level.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on November 14, 2017, 10:58:59 AM
Mike and Richard Baldwin at Nautilus in 1970

Wasn't 1970, Mentzer didn't even have a mustache then!  Was in 73-74 when Mike was recovering from a shoulder injury and was just getting back into training after 2 1/2 years off.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on November 14, 2017, 11:12:59 AM
Wasn't 1970, Mentzer didn't even have a mustache then!  Was in 73-74 when Mike was recovering from a shoulder injury and was just getting back into training after 2 1/2 years off.

1973  ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on November 14, 2017, 11:36:37 AM
1973  ;)

So that's a 17 inch arm 😎


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 14, 2017, 01:13:28 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: MAXX on November 14, 2017, 01:47:19 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0o3ZSvm4nmQ


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on November 14, 2017, 03:09:20 PM
If Mentzer was 5' 8" then Baldwin must be around 5' 6".  Regardless they both had great physiques.  I would sooner look like Mentzer did at his best than Phildo at his "best". 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: bigbychoices on November 16, 2017, 10:47:25 AM
mike was 5ft 8  also for the record. yes dan duchaine did start the rumors about mike drinking his own urine. he was making a joke. mike at the time ( and ray too) had to collect their urine in a jug for i believe 24 hours once a week or so( i may be wrong on the duration) it was to check the function of their kidneys.  during an interview dan brought it up and they asked him why mike did that he said im not sure i think he drinks it( or something to that effect)  dan also joked about mike and ray being lovers too. but this was not true either. dan was a jokster. so there you have it. the truth about the urine drinking. but yes mike did go crazy on speed etc.  not "doctor" prescribed either.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 29, 2017, 03:33:47 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on November 29, 2017, 04:18:48 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0o3ZSvm4nmQ

Thought he and his brother drank each others via mainline.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on November 30, 2017, 07:15:56 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on November 30, 2017, 04:25:25 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 03, 2017, 02:44:12 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 04, 2017, 09:53:22 AM
1980


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NotMrAverage on December 04, 2017, 10:16:08 AM
Each time i look at time i cant belive how goog he was. And smart! Spoke to him a few times 20 years ago.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 05, 2017, 05:49:03 AM
I always hear about his intelligence but would an intelligent guy use meth?  Maybe I'm basing it on all the bad decisions he made too. Starting a magazine on fitness instead of bodybuilding when he had zero experience on the distribution of it. Buying outdated expensive commercial video equipment when he had no idea how to produce anything. He also blew through his money which really was substantial for the time but I guess one can blame his drug addiction for clouded judgement. He also dropped out of pre med but that doesn't make him an MD. He did write more than once that he feared what steroids and other drugs were doing to his mind but also threw in that he was too smart to let them influence his behavior. Just a little pompous. He did appear to suffer from depression and attributed it to the death of loved ones but one must speculate on the contributing factor of steroids and speed. When on steroids mentally you feel aggressive and confident. The PDR even made reference back in the day of steroids affecting mood for the better. I don't know the wording today of the PDR regarding steroids. Once off as the steroids completely leave the system many feel depressed, nervous and meek. Combine that with speed and you have problems.

Aside from all the negatives I wrote I really admired his writings during his prime years. Everything he wrote and every interview I would tear out of magazines. To this date I might own the most complete collection of everything he wrote. I did admire his analytical thinking regarding training. Remember back in the day he was making 200k a year. That might be a million a year in today's money.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 05, 2017, 05:53:54 AM
1980
;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 05, 2017, 05:57:00 AM
fdb at the 1980 MrO.. Mike better than Arnold ?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 05, 2017, 06:05:35 AM
Hey oldtimer

Gear and it's effect upon mood depends upon ones reaction to it

For example.deca makes me horny

Ace makes me a bigger douche than i already am lol

Winny does nothing to my mood


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: sculpture on December 05, 2017, 08:42:54 AM
Better quality muscle on Mike there. Arnold's was hurried into place for 1980. No one else would have gotten away with this.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on December 05, 2017, 10:28:45 AM
I always hear about his intelligence but would an intelligent guy use meth?  Maybe I'm basing it on all the bad decisions he made too. Starting a magazine on fitness instead of bodybuilding when he had zero experience on the distribution of it. Buying outdated expensive commercial video equipment when he had no idea how to produce anything. He also blew through his money which really was substantial for the time but I guess one can blame his drug addiction for clouded judgement. He also dropped out of pre med but that doesn't make him an MD. He did write more than once that he feared what steroids and other drugs were doing to his mind but also threw in that he was too smart to let them influence his behavior. Just a little pompous. He did appear to suffer from depression and attributed it to the death of loved ones but one must speculate on the contributing factor of steroids and speed. When on steroids mentally you feel aggressive and confident. The PDR even made reference back in the day of steroids affecting mood for the better. I don't know the wording today of the PDR regarding steroids. Once off as the steroids completely leave the system many feel depressed, nervous and meek. Combine that with speed and you have problems.

Aside from all the negatives I wrote I really admired his writings during his prime years. Everything he wrote and every interview I would tear out of magazines. To this date I might own the most complete collection of everything he wrote. I did admire his analytical thinking regarding training. Remember back in the day he was making 200k a year. That might be a million a year in today's money.
  He had some bad decisions at times,  his "foibles" as he called them. He told me enjoyed them, lol . He was intelligent, I had several three or four hour phone conversations where he went quite deep into philosophy and logic. I had a college degree, was working on a masters and I was behind him intellectually at the time.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 05, 2017, 10:32:46 AM
Mike was a veritable Renaissance Man.  They say there's a fine line between genius and madness and he walked that line.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 05, 2017, 10:46:56 AM
Mike was a veritable Renaissance Man.  They say there's a fine line between genius and madness and he walked that line.

Sometimes I think he snorted it.

He was a fantastic bodybuilder and of above average intelligence.   And yes, a bit of a Renaissance Man. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on December 05, 2017, 02:01:36 PM
fdb at the 1980 MrO.. Mike better than Arnold ?


In that particular picture yes I'd give it to mike.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on December 05, 2017, 02:02:56 PM
Mike was a veritable Renaissance Man.  They say there's a fine line between genius and madness and he walked that line.

He did indeed walk that line & fell off it a good few Times.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on December 05, 2017, 04:18:17 PM
He did indeed walk that line & fell off it a good few Times.
He could be quite Mad. All the Best ones are.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 05, 2017, 06:47:17 PM
  He had some bad decisions at times,  his "foibles" as he called them. He told me enjoyed them, lol . He was intelligent, I had several three or four hour phone conversations where he went quite deep into philosophy and logic. I had a college degree, was working on a masters and I was behind him intellectually at the time.

Having a degree has nothing to do with intelligence. In the US a college degree has replaced the high school diploma. When everyone has a college degree no one has a college degree.  I do believe he was intelligent but he was very pompous in telling everyone he was smart. I will say this about degrees. Having a degree in the liberal arts is not the same as having a degree in the sciences. If someone has a mechanic engineering degree or degree in chemistry I would be the first to say they are intelligent.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on December 05, 2017, 07:06:37 PM
mike had one of the most pleasing  physiques ever in the sport,  i remember when that fourth  tier piece of shit bob chic was on here ragging on mikes build, bob got tore a new asshole by most of the board, and had to log in with his gimmick accounts to back himself up .    mike sold more books and catalogs in one year than bob did in his whole life .



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 05, 2017, 07:20:27 PM
mike had one of the most pleasing  physiques ever in the sport,  i remember when that fourth  tier piece of shit bob chic was on here ragging on mikes build, bob got tore a new asshole by most of the board, and had to log in with his gimmick accounts to back himself up .    mike sold more books and catalogs in one year than bob did in his whole life .



I agree.  Chic is a festering boil that feeds off the scrotum of today's "bpdybuilding" becoming ever more turgid with pus and disease.   Or is that Kai Greene?    Both of them suck schmoe and neither could hold a candle to Mike Mentzer's physique let alone his mind even when it was burning up with amphetamines.    Chic dresses like a Down's clown on the town and Kai?  Kai dresses like a mongoloid in the dark.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on December 05, 2017, 07:23:43 PM
I agree.  Chic is a festering boil that feeds off the scrotum of today's "bpdybuilding" becoming ever more turgid with pus and disease.   Or is that Kai Greene?    Both of them suck schmoe and neither could hold a candle to Mike Mentzer's physique let alone his mind even when it was burning up with amphetamines.    Chic dresses like a Down's clown on the town and Kai?  Kai dresses like a mongoloid in the dark.



bwa ha ha great post and true, bob's clown suits he wears to the olympia are lame as shit


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on December 05, 2017, 07:31:41 PM
Those of us who were contemporaries of these guys never reached the level they were at. Perhaps they were more motivated and perhaps they took more risks.

Ray Mentzer stayed at my place in Sydney for over a year in the late eighties. He was totally serious about training and knew what he was talking about.

Mike was perhaps the only writer in the muscle magazines who was also a philosopher.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on December 07, 2017, 12:29:29 AM
Those of us who were contemporaries of these guys never reached the level they were at. Perhaps they were more motivated and perhaps they took more risks.

Ray Mentzer stayed at my place in Sydney for over a year in the late eighties. He was totally serious about training and knew what he was talking about.

Mike was perhaps the only writer in the muscle magazines who was also a philosopher.

Did you allow them to smoke cigarettes in your apartment? 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on December 07, 2017, 01:41:10 AM
Did you allow them to smoke cigarettes in your apartment? 

Ray didn't smoke. I lived in a house not an apartment. Met Mike at Gold's Venice in 1991. Stayed at Ray's place in Torrance, Ca.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 07, 2017, 07:43:32 AM
Those of us who were contemporaries of these guys never reached the level they were at. Perhaps they were more motivated and perhaps they took more risks.

Ray Mentzer stayed at my place in Sydney for over a year in the late eighties. He was totally serious about training and knew what he was talking about.

Mike was perhaps the only writer in the muscle magazines who was also a philosopher.

He was probably the only writer that could actually write.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 07, 2017, 09:03:26 AM
He was probably the only writer that could actually write.

Rick Wayne could write.  Julian Schmidt used a lot of big words that I had to look up in the dictionary (that was before Google).


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: HonestBob on December 07, 2017, 10:46:19 AM
Rick Wayne could write.  Julian Schmidt used a lot of big words that I had to look up in the dictionary (that was before Google).

Julian Schmidt was unreadable and an abysmal journalist.

Rick Wayne made the protagonists in bodybuilding seem interesting, he left a huge void when he packed it in.

Peter Mcgough was a decent writer with an engaging style back in his UK days.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tommywishbone on December 07, 2017, 11:18:19 AM
Julian Schmidt was unreadable and an abysmal journalist.

Rick Wayne made the protagonists in bodybuilding seem interesting, he left a huge void when he packed it in.

Peter Mcgough was a decent writer with an engaging style back in his UK days.

Knew all three. Read all three.

Agreed.

And every word ever attributed to Don Ross was written by Don Ross. Excellent writer and raconteur.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: HonestBob on December 07, 2017, 11:59:08 AM
Knew all three. Read all three.

Agreed.

And every word ever attributed to Don Ross was written by Don Ross. Excellent writer and raconteur.


I only caught the tail end of Don Ross but I recall thinking he was pretty good.

I also thought Bob Kennedy did a great job with his early books (Hardcore Bodybuilding and Beef It).



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on December 08, 2017, 10:23:18 PM
Rick Wayne could write.  Julian Schmidt used a lot of big words that I had to look up in the dictionary (that was before Google).

Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles. I also thought he had a tremendous physique. Superior to Zane and Corney. Never seem to make a big splash as a competitor.

(https://builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/rick-wayne-040.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 08, 2017, 10:41:48 PM
Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles. I also thought he had a tremendous physique. Superior to Zane and Corney. Never seem to make a big splash as a competitor.

(https://builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/rick-wayne-040.jpg)

Be careful. Some would consider him a bad writer because he dared to write and bad things about the god Arnold.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 08, 2017, 11:30:08 PM
Wonder how big mentzer narcissism was ???


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 09, 2017, 07:16:57 AM
Rick Wayne was pretty good both as a competitor and a writer. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on December 09, 2017, 07:30:57 AM
Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles.
Be careful. Some would consider him a bad writer because he dared to write and bad things about the god Arnold.

Odd. Rick looked to be enjoying himself mightily,here.....

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/7e/34/44/7e3444dd157bf56ee1123f4adced99eb.jpg)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chess315 on December 09, 2017, 07:38:29 AM
Congratulations on that picture find - I'm pretty sure that is the plainest, cheapest, just thrown-together-in-someone's-kitchen set of sweats I have ever seen!  (Although I'd still have worn them at the time LOL!)

I might make some lol good idea


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 09, 2017, 09:33:47 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 09, 2017, 10:10:04 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 09, 2017, 03:33:23 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tommywishbone on December 10, 2017, 12:45:50 AM
I only caught the tail end of Don Ross but I recall thinking he was pretty good.

I also thought Bob Kennedy did a great job with his early books (Hardcore Bodybuilding and Beef It).



Kennedy was under rated in many areas IMO. He was a good dude for the world of bodybuilding. I think bodybuilders would have done much much better financially, PR wise, etc., if Robert Kennedy was the shot caller from 1975-2000 and not Joe Weider.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 10, 2017, 01:17:04 AM
Dyke and gay


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on December 10, 2017, 04:06:32 AM
Those of us who were contemporaries of these guys never reached the level they were at. Perhaps they were more motivated and perhaps they took more risks.

Ray Mentzer stayed at my place in Sydney for over a year in the late eighties. He was totally serious about training and knew what he was talking about.

Mike was perhaps the only writer in the muscle magazines who was also a philosopher.

You weren’t a contemporary of theirs. Because I buy from Amazon does not make me a contemporary of Jeff Bezos.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on December 10, 2017, 04:09:16 AM
:)

I wonder if that was taken in the Hamburger Hamlit.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on December 10, 2017, 04:10:21 AM
Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles. I also thought he had a tremendous physique. Superior to Zane and Corney. Never seem to make a big splash as a competitor.

(https://builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/rick-wayne-040.jpg)

Better than Zane? Laughable, just laughable.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 10, 2017, 04:40:52 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 10, 2017, 12:01:39 PM
Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles. I also thought he had a tremendous physique. Superior to Zane and Corney. Never seem to make a big splash as a competitor.

(https://builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/rick-wayne-040.jpg)

At his peak he could have beaten a lot of top guys including Zane. Realize he competed mainly before Arnold even reached the US. He won the Mr. Universe in 1965. He's not a spring chicken. More like a winter chicken. He's 79 years old. Destroyed Franco in all comparisons in this competition. He made a come back to enter the Olympia but he hurt his neck training.  It was so bad he had trouble putting a shirt on and he stopped training for the contest. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 10, 2017, 12:52:32 PM
At his peak he could have beaten a lot of top guys including Zane. Realize he competed mainly before Arnold even reached the US. He won the Mr. Universe in 1965. He's not a spring chicken. More like a winter chicken. He's 79 years old. Destroyed Franco in all comparisons in this competition. He made a come back to enter the Olympia but he hurt his neck training.  It was so bad he had trouble putting a shirt on and he stopped training for the contest. 

He didn't win the Universe in 65 , he won his class , Earl Maynard won the Mr Universe title , his class and the overall


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 10, 2017, 01:01:53 PM
He didn't win the Universe in 65 , he won his class , Earl Maynard won the Mr Universe title , his class and the overall

I guess it was the 67 Mr. World I was thinking of. Point I was making is that he competed a long time ago.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DarthSidious on December 10, 2017, 02:17:05 PM
Julian Schmidt was unreadable and an abysmal journalist.

Rick Wayne made the protagonists in bodybuilding seem interesting, he left a huge void when he packed it in.

Peter Mcgough was a decent writer with an engaging style back in his UK days.

Bold part is mine, primarily for my thanks:  I'm glad to know I wasn't the only person who saw that!

Schmidt was a pompous blowhard, conflating million-dollar words with good writing.  That's a common mistake...among teenagers and the otherwise uneducated.  I can't help but to be reminded of True Adam Adonis' phase here, shortly after the first Mr. Getbig :)

Adam tried really hard to demonstrate his intellectual superiority by taking some merry romps through the thesaurus, oftentimes back firing, in addition to writing in a very stilted, almost 18th century manner...Schmidt was like that but far, far worse, LOL.  I remember one of his FLEX articles, a feature on that year's ASC.  The first few pages were some noise about Robbie Robinson overlooking a water body in Colombus ... Garbage.

Mentzer, McGough, Wayne and our own often cranky Rob Fortney aka Fortress, were all kick-ass writers.  In his later years, Mike started to succumb to some of that "big words, good writing" fallacy, but then, by that point, he was so wary of overtraining that he literally had some of his clients working out once every two weeks -- and less!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on December 10, 2017, 02:41:21 PM
Having a degree has nothing to do with intelligence. In the US a college degree has replaced the high school diploma. When everyone has a college degree no one has a college degree.  I do believe he was intelligent but he was very pompous in telling everyone he was smart. I will say this about degrees. Having a degree in the liberal arts is not the same as having a degree in the sciences. If someone has a mechanic engineering degree or degree in chemistry I would be the first to say they are intelligent.
  He didnt finish his, so good point, and nowadays your argument has some validity in re bachelors degrees, doctoral programs are  bit  different...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on December 10, 2017, 11:46:17 PM
At his peak he could have beaten a lot of top guys including Zane. Realize he competed mainly before Arnold even reached the US. He won the Mr. Universe in 1965. He's not a spring chicken. More like a winter chicken. He's 79 years old. Destroyed Franco in all comparisons in this competition. He made a come back to enter the Olympia but he hurt his neck training.  It was so bad he had trouble putting a shirt on and he stopped training for the contest. 

No, he could not have. Look at his physique; long waist, short thighs, long neck and no lats. Sorry, but you are wrong.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 11, 2017, 05:02:02 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on December 12, 2017, 08:47:51 AM
Rick Wayne was by far my favorite writer at the time. I still plagiarize his "Sardinian Sidekick" description of Franco in one of his articles. I also thought he had a tremendous physique. Superior to Zane and Corney. Never seem to make a big splash as a competitor.

(https://builtreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/rick-wayne-040.jpg)

Crazy arms for that time...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 12, 2017, 01:11:13 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 12, 2017, 01:53:45 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 12, 2017, 03:40:24 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 12, 2017, 03:55:53 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 12, 2017, 11:41:52 PM
Mike and Frank at the 80 MrO


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 14, 2017, 08:38:14 AM
1980


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 14, 2017, 01:34:38 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on December 14, 2017, 01:51:01 PM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 14, 2017, 02:03:55 PM
.

BAM.  A perfect 300 score at the 1978 Mr. Universe in Acapulco.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=751957;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 14, 2017, 02:17:15 PM
amazing, except his wide hips


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 14, 2017, 03:15:55 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 14, 2017, 04:58:08 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on December 14, 2017, 05:36:50 PM
amazing, except his wide hips

Yep, tiny waist makes them stand out even more, but his trademark front poses are still awesome.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 17, 2017, 04:04:22 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 17, 2017, 05:23:49 PM
BAM.  A perfect 300 score at the 1978 Mr. Universe in Acapulco.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=751957;image)

His arms were biggest in 76 when he trained them 3 times a week


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on December 18, 2017, 10:06:21 PM
Mike and Frank at the 80 MrO
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=751855;image)

Though they look to be about the same height but Mike is just so much more thicker and fuller than
Zane. It may be a case of apples and oranges but I so much more prefer Mike over Zane.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 19, 2017, 08:51:28 AM
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=751855;image)

Though they look to be about the same height but Mike is just so much more thicker and fuller than
Zane. It may be a case of apples and oranges but I so much more prefer Mike over Zane.

I'm the opposite. I think Zane has it all over him in terms of condition.  Zane weighed about 10lbs lighter than he normally competed at for that contest. I also think Dickerson was better than both of them in that contest.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on December 19, 2017, 12:43:39 PM
I'm the opposite. I think Zane has it all over him in terms of condition.  Zane weighed about 10lbs lighter than he normally competed at for that contest. I also think Dickerson was better than both of them in that contest.
Yes, Zane looks more defined here. Mentzer does look MUCH bigger, and his arms look  twice as big as Zanes.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Griffith on December 19, 2017, 01:29:03 PM
I'm the opposite. I think Zane has it all over him in terms of condition.  Zane weighed about 10lbs lighter than he normally competed at for that contest. I also think Dickerson was better than both of them in that contest.

Why did Zane compete lighter?



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 19, 2017, 01:33:35 PM
Why did Zane compete lighter?



He was tanning in a deck chair, the chair collapsed and part of it sliced through his urethra.  He had to have surgery and it set his Olympia prep back quite a bit, as you might imagine.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 19, 2017, 05:23:11 PM
He was tanning in a deck chair, the chair collapsed and part of it sliced through his urethra.  He had to have surgery and it set his Olympia prep back quite a bit, as you might imagine.

That story always sounded a bit sketchy.  I guess anything can happen. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 19, 2017, 05:29:51 PM
I will say this again

Mentzer arms looked best when he trained the 3 times a week ala. 1976


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 19, 2017, 05:42:40 PM
I will say this again

Mentzer arms looked best when he trained the 3 times a week ala. 1976


Can you say it one more time?

 Mentzer first trained his whole body each training day three days a week. He won the Weider version of Mr. America training that way. From there he used a split. Workout A was thighs, chest and triceps. Workout B was back, delts and biceps. He trained four days a week on this split. Then under the influence of Mr. Florida Frank Calta he used a rotation for recuperation split. He used the same A-B split. Except it looked something like this. Monday A, Tuesday off, Wednesday B, Thursday off, and Friday was A.  Next week he reversed it where Monday was now B, Tuesday off, Wednesday was now A, Thursday off, and Friday was now B.  To throw a monkey wrench in this he didn't use days of the week but maintained three workouts with the rotation a week. He did train with the A-B split rotation for the 1980 Olympia.  The crazy routines he came up with after he stopped training was nothing he ever used to compete with.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 19, 2017, 05:47:24 PM
That story always sounded a bit sketchy.  I guess anything can happen. 

Idk.  Have you heard other theories?  Would Zane have made up the deck chair story as an excuse for his 1980 condition?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 19, 2017, 06:15:40 PM
Idk.  Have you heard other theories?  Would Zane have made up the deck chair story as an excuse for his 1980 condition?

I thought his condition for 1980 might have been the best of his life. The only thing anyone could say is that he came in light.  His condition was amazing.

Regarding the lawn chair pool side story I always took what I read in the mags with a grain of salt. It could be completely legit. Jumping face down to tan on a lawn chair that sliced his dick is a story I guess you can't make up.  


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 20, 2017, 04:11:43 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 20, 2017, 04:18:12 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 20, 2017, 04:20:34 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 20, 2017, 04:23:13 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 21, 2017, 01:47:32 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on December 21, 2017, 07:07:41 PM
Mentzer always looked like he was built out of iron.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: AbrahamG on December 21, 2017, 07:17:30 PM
:)

Little sailor boy probably knew his way around a cock.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 22, 2017, 02:43:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 22, 2017, 02:49:32 PM
:)

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=752870;image)

Neve fest.

Pat Neve had a great physique but not quite as excellent as Mike's.  That is Neve, isn't it?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 22, 2017, 03:00:33 PM
Neve fest.

Pat Neve had a great physique but not quite as excellent as Mike's.  That is Neve, isn't it?

Yes sir !!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 22, 2017, 06:51:37 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 22, 2017, 07:49:12 PM
Those photos of the Mentzers are great!  Today's body dopers suck schmoe to look like over inflated Michelin Men.  I hope they continue to drop like McCarvers starting with Phildo.  His drug protocol must be as hideous as his bloated little body.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 08:50:18 AM
Those photos of the Mentzers are great!  Today's body dopers suck schmoe to look like over inflated Michelin Men.  I hope they continue to drop like McCarvers starting with Phildo.  His drug protocol must be as hideous as his bloated little body.



Real Muscle , not that inflated space that most " pros " occupy now


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 24, 2017, 10:40:54 AM
1979


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 24, 2017, 10:43:56 AM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 10:56:27 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:01:11 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:26:38 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:27:35 AM
Some rare shots


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:29:06 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:30:16 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:31:30 AM
LMAO " I'll be as good as Arnold in one year " How'd that work out for you Mike?  ::)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:35:16 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:37:04 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:38:47 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:54:15 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 24, 2017, 11:57:12 AM
1980


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 11:58:56 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 12:01:06 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 12:17:30 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 12:23:18 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Sexybeast777 on December 24, 2017, 12:28:38 PM
I never knew Mike was such a big shot with the ladies


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 12:32:17 PM
Couple of shots of Ray


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 01:47:24 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 01:52:08 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 01:57:34 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on December 24, 2017, 02:10:47 PM
I think that in the '70s bodybuilders attained the perfect combination of mass and conditioning.  The cadaver look of Munzer was not only unhealthy but looked hideously ridiculous. Things got worse when  mAss monsters came along.  Big guts and big butts are turn-ons for schmoes alone.

Many of Mentzer's photos display perfection in both mass and aesthetics, just as Arnold's, Zane's and Padilla's did in their own way.  "Maesthtetics" anyone?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 02:35:52 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 03:43:59 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 24, 2017, 04:20:10 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on December 24, 2017, 06:24:29 PM
Armand Tanny should have double-checked his facts before this article was published--it states that Mike started bodybuilding in 1951, at age 12.  So that would mean he was born in 1939???  Actually, Mike was born in 1951, so assuming he started lifting at age 12 after being inspired by Steve Reeves' movies, he would have started around 1963.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=753173;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 25, 2017, 11:16:02 PM
1980


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dokey111 on December 26, 2017, 04:59:19 AM
LMAO " I'll be as good as Arnold in one year " How'd that work out for you Mike?  ::)

and yet here he is, 49 pages so far.  He's going to last a while don't worry.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on December 26, 2017, 07:55:53 AM
1980

Mike takes that pose easily.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 26, 2017, 05:39:53 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 27, 2017, 12:21:57 AM
1980

Another version of the one from Ironman cover ( Basile photo)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 27, 2017, 12:26:48 AM
Classic picture from Weider magazines. Bodybuilders with a sword.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: sceagacros on December 27, 2017, 12:31:38 AM
It's all fun and games until he stood next to Doug Young, I'll find the pic later but it illustrates how much thicker powerlifters were than bodybuilders right before the insulin/HGH explosion hit the sport.
It's almost like the difference between Mike and Frank Zane only in the other direction, Young was a freak.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on December 27, 2017, 12:44:58 AM
It's all fun and games until he stood next to Doug Young, I'll find the pic later but it illustrates how much thicker powerlifters were than bodybuilders right before the insulin/HGH explosion hit the sport.
It's almost like the difference between Mike and Frank Zane only in the other direction, Young was a freak.

Not seen that pic.

Doug was a big man & great physique
World record bench presser
Died at an early age - cancer IIRC


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 27, 2017, 12:54:33 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on December 27, 2017, 04:45:48 AM

Great shot there - might be well known but I'd certainly never seen it before - thanks for posting.  I've realised that my favorite pics of Mike (and Ray, for that matter) are where he is wearing his spectacles.  I don't wear glasses myself so I have no idea why I think this....

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=753522;image)

:)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on December 27, 2017, 05:12:08 PM
Not seen that pic.

Doug was a big man & great physique
World record bench presser
Died at an early age - cancer IIRC

He died from a heart attack in a restaurant.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: sceagacros on December 27, 2017, 06:35:14 PM
^ His slow bench descent was just crazy to watch and possibly a key component to his ridiculous chest size (slow negatives, wide grip were a major part of his "style"). I've read that Arnold himself consulted with him about bulking / adding mass? But like anything regarding Doug - details are few and far between. He was just a bit too early for much internet detail - I can probably find Eric Lilliebridges favorite color online but good luck finding out what rowing variations Doug favored!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 28, 2017, 01:03:01 AM
..


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on December 28, 2017, 01:36:07 AM
Douglas was a bad mofo 😎

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEvxUzU7FEo


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SilverSpoon on December 28, 2017, 08:28:41 AM
Love the pictures of Mentzer with Roger Schwab.
Back when it was called Main Line Nautilus.
I worked there when it was Main Line Health & Fitness.

Roger was a great boss.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 28, 2017, 04:30:21 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on December 29, 2017, 10:28:33 PM
Mirror, mirror, on the wall …


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 30, 2017, 05:03:35 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 30, 2017, 09:14:21 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 30, 2017, 09:27:44 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on December 30, 2017, 01:35:49 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on December 31, 2017, 01:53:40 PM
mike looked really good here


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on December 31, 2017, 08:59:13 PM
Yes he does.
Though could of been a bit thicker in the upper & middle chest
And little more lower quads.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on January 01, 2018, 06:37:03 AM
....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on January 01, 2018, 06:37:54 AM
1980 again


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 09:47:46 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 09:49:59 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 09:54:30 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 09:57:25 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 10:34:10 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 01, 2018, 10:42:39 AM
Looked his best in '76 with 19 inch arms at a buck 99


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 10:49:24 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:08:53 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:10:18 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Notomorrow on January 01, 2018, 11:15:55 AM
Might as well share my shitty little Mentzer story
 
In 1992 I had just graduated high school and like many, that was when the bodybuilding bug really bit me..was also right when HIT was taking off and on all the mags...

This was before the internet got big so Mentzer was offering phone consultations for training...I called the number and was so excited and pumped to talk to the guru...

Left message and was shocked Mike called me back within 5 minutes...first thing that shocked me was his voice...that little nasal voice..again before internet so no one had heard his voice...

Anyway, he was very gracious with me but with all due repect a little "off"...he started doing his whole ramble about recovery, how everyone is overtraining...he said..."Its like tolerance to sunlight...the negro has a higher tolerance to sunlight...etc"...

He was also very aggressive about wanting me to set up a package of phone consults for some discount price...

I soon realized that with all due respect he sounded kind of broke in the way he was trying to get me to sign up.....looking back now I realize that most bodybuilders are broke but at 18 years old and looking at the magazines I thought Mentzer was a guru god and thought he was probably calling me from some high rise office suite...

But he was just a struggling guy trying to get by...

Still treasure that i talked to him....very influential...RIP



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:16:02 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:21:16 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:23:18 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 01, 2018, 11:23:56 AM
Might as well share my shitty little Mentzer story
 
In 1992 I had just graduated high school and like many, that was when the bodybuilding bug really bit me..was also right when HIT was taking off and on all the mags...

This was before the internet got big so Mentzer was offering phone consultations for training...I called the number and was so excited and pumped to talk to the guru...

Left message and was shocked Mike called me back within 5 minutes...first thing that shocked me was his voice...that little nasal voice..again before internet so no one had heard his voice...

Anyway, he was very gracious with me but with all due repect a little "off"...he started doing his whole ramble about recovery, how everyone is overtraining...he said..."Its like tolerance to sunlight...the negro has a higher tolerance to sunlight...etc"...

He was also very aggressive about wanting me to set up a package of phone consults for some discount price...

I soon realized that with all due respect he sounded kind of broke in the way he was trying to get me to sign up.....looking back now I realize that most bodybuilders are broke but at 18 years old and looking at the magazines I thought Mentzer was a guru god and thought he was probably calling me from some high rise office suite...

But he was just a struggling guy trying to get by...

Still treasure that i talked to him....very influential...RIP



Did his once a wek training gig back in 99 and i told Blakely about it and he said surprisingly  "that routine would only work for heavy gear users"


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:28:30 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:39:30 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:45:26 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:51:21 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 11:58:12 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 12:09:01 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 12:24:38 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 12:26:42 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 01:14:59 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on January 01, 2018, 02:29:04 PM
the older i get, when i see these pics of mike he has one of the best looks ever to compete to bad he quit after 80, he had it all going for him, the look and the charisma


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 01, 2018, 02:33:26 PM
the older i get, when i see these pics of mike he has one of the best looks ever to compete to bad he quit after 80, he had it all going for him, the look and the charisma

I agree.  He would have destroyed  Bannout (who was good) and Dickerson (who just plain sucked).  Sheit.  Everyone should've destroyed Dickerson.  Most undeserving Olympia ever.  Totally subjective opinion, I know but for the life of the Buddha I can't understand how that Curious George gay porn star won the Olympia and the god-like Bob Paris was denied it with a far superior physique.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on January 01, 2018, 03:16:22 PM
I agree.  He would have destroyed  Bannout (who was good) and Dickerson (who just plain sucked).  Sheit.  Everyone should've destroyed Dickerson.  Most undeserving Olympia ever.  Totally subjective opinion, I know but for the life of the Buddha I can't understand how that Curious George gay porn star won the Olympia and the god-like Bob Paris was denied it with a far superior physique.

i still cant figure out how the fuck zane beat him in 79,   or how he finished 5th in 80.   makes no sense considering at the time he was weiders top guy and draw, hell weider liked him


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 01, 2018, 04:12:40 PM
Scott / oldschool Did either of you see him competing.

I agree that Dickerson was / is the most unworthy ‘O’ Winner ever
Also as good as Coe was at the 80 ‘O’ how he was tied with Mike
& award a place higher.

I’m wondering if Mike maybe suffered the reverse of Dorian
Whereas I Never thought Dorian was that Good & Didn’t get the hype
From the Pic’s - until I See him & Competed against him,
Dorian was far better than he looked in photos especially as a Pro.

Likewise this Pete Molnar he looks unreal / cartoon’ish in pics on his own,
Although He is a fantastic physique put him in a line up of other World class
Physiques & He isn’t so outstanding,
Maybe Mike suffered in the same way, Outstanding on his own & in photos
Somehow not the same up against his peers.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 01, 2018, 05:14:01 PM
i still cant figure out how the fuck zane beat him in 79,   or how he finished 5th in 80.   makes no sense considering at the time he was weiders top guy and draw, hell weider liked him

Easy


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on January 01, 2018, 06:57:15 PM
Looked his best in '76 with 19 inch arms at a buck 99

Jesus Fuking Christ! Will you just just STFU already about 1976 and that always lame "buck" something expression.
We get it! We Fuking get it already.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 01, 2018, 07:27:40 PM
Scott / oldschool Did either of you see him competing.

I agree that Dickerson was / is the most unworthy ‘O’ Winner ever
Also as good as Coe was at the 80 ‘O’ how he was tied with Mike
& award a place higher.

I’m wondering if Mike maybe suffered the reverse of Dorian
Whereas I Never thought Dorian was that Good & Didn’t get the hype
From the Pic’s - until I See him & Competed against him,
Dorian was far better than he looked in photos especially as a Pro.

Likewise this Pete Molnar he looks unreal / cartoon’ish in pics on his own,
Although He is a fantastic physique put him in a line up of other World class
Physiques & He isn’t so outstanding,
Maybe Mike suffered in the same way, Outstanding on his own & in photos
Somehow not the same up against his peers.

I never saw him compete in person but I did see him, his brother and Casey train at Gold's Gym.  They trained as they said they did and it was INTENSE!  He looked quite impressive in person and while a gym pump is probably the most dramatic to have, it was still eye opening.

I tried HIT for a month or so back then (failing memory? LOL!) but it just didn't work for me and looking back I suppose the two big reasons were I did not give it enough of a chance by really putting effort into it and I didn't take drugs.    I've said it before but the guys in the 70s at the original Gold's were very honest about taking steroids and I knew that this was what truly seperated me from them.  Yeah, genetics count but to get bigger and stronger than you ever could you needed steroids.  Anyone that thinks otherwise isn't thinking.  Just look at women bodybuilders on drugs and you'll know the truth. 

Genetics dictates shape and to a degree size.  Drugs just amplify the heck out of those two things as shape is more pronounced when the muscle is so much larger.  They won't change your muscle insertions or the shape of those muscles but they will make 'em grow like a weed.  And strength?  The proof was not in the pudding but in the bottle and the results it gave people.  Night and day with those on drugs being the "day".  Talk about seeing the light.

But as was said in the book Pumping Iron, a good tall man will usually beat an equally good shorter man and all because of the not so illusionary "illusion of size".  Alone, Franco was a beast.  Next to the Oak?  A sapling.    There's a reason I think of Padilla as a miniature Arnold and that's not only because he is built in a similar fashion but also because when he's next to Arnold, he looks miniaturized.  Mentzer was what, 5' 8" as was Zane?  Arnold was 6' 1" to 6' 2".  I met him and he was that tall, now not nearly as my daughter saw him in Sacramento and she told me I am much taller than he is now.  But again, the good big man will almost always beat an equally good short man.

Having said that I do think that if Mike had just put his anger into his training like Arnold did after losing to Zane, he would have won the next year and at least two more times.  Franco could not have beaten a spot on Mentzer and Bannout was the more aesthetic but Mike was taller and more impressive and Dickerson just never belonged on the same dais as those men.  Chris is better than me, but that's damning him with very faint praise, LOL!



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 01, 2018, 07:37:37 PM
Jesus Fuking Christ! Will you just just STFU already about 1976 and that always lame "buck" something expression.
We get it! We Fuking get it already.



Lighten up chief, it ain't dat serious


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: pellius on January 02, 2018, 01:33:16 AM
I never saw him compete in person but I did see him, his brother and Casey train at Gold's Gym.  They trained as they said they did and it was INTENSE!  He looked quite impressive in person and while a gym pump is probably the most dramatic to have, it was still eye opening.

I tried HIT for a month or so back then (failing memory? LOL!) but it just didn't work for me and looking back I suppose the two big reasons were I did not give it enough of a chance by really putting effort into it and I didn't take drugs.    I've said it before but the guys in the 70s at the original Gold's were very honest about taking steroids and I knew that this was what truly seperated me from them.  Yeah, genetics count but to get bigger and stronger than you ever could you needed steroids.  Anyone that thinks otherwise isn't thinking.  Just look at women bodybuilders on drugs and you'll know the truth. 

Genetics dictates shape and to a degree size.  Drugs just amplify the heck out of those two things as shape is more pronounced when the muscle is so much larger.  They won't change your muscle insertions or the shape of those muscles but they will make 'em grow like a weed.  And strength?  The proof was not in the pudding but in the bottle and the results it gave people.  Night and day with those on drugs being the "day".  Talk about seeing the light.

But as was said in the book Pumping Iron, a good tall man will usually beat an equally good shorter man and all because of the not so illusionary "illusion of size".  Alone, Franco was a beast.  Next to the Oak?  A sapling.    There's a reason I think of Padilla as a miniature Arnold and that's not only because he is built in a similar fashion but also because when he's next to Arnold, he looks miniaturized.  Mentzer was what, 5' 8" as was Zane?  Arnold was 6' 1" to 6' 2".  I met him and he was that tall, now not nearly as my daughter saw him in Sacramento and she told me I am much taller than he is now.  But again, the good big man will almost always beat an equally good short man.

Having said that I do think that if Mike had just put his anger into his training like Arnold did after losing to Zane, he would have won the next year and at least two more times.  Franco could not have beaten a spot on Mentzer and Bannout was the more aesthetic but Mike was taller and more impressive and Dickerson just never belonged on the same dais as those men.  Chris is better than me, but that's damning him with very faint praise, LOL!



I agree with you. Mike was a thinking man and wasn't just going to go through the motions. He would always examine and reexamine what he was doing in an attempt to advance. I really would like to have known how his training methods and physique would have evolved.

I do disagree with you  that he would have beaten Franco. If Platz or Padilla couldn't do it they wouldn't,
or rather Arnold, would have allowed Mike to win. The fix was in. But he would have beaten Dickerson (lol) and Samir.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: sceagacros on January 02, 2018, 02:54:47 AM
Did his once a wek training gig back in 99 and i told Blakely about it and he said surprisingly  "that routine would only work for heavy gear users"


He was right on the money - while we still might not know enough to posit "THE" way to maximal development, we know more about it than ever before, and we now know that for naturals - frequency is key as it is the way "they" trigger protein synthesis, something artificially elevated 24/7 in the juiced lifter.

For a natural, this means achieving enough overall volume by utilizing  high frequency/ med-high intensity/ low volume bouts is the most efficient approach; at least according to the sum total of scientific knowledge of the process that we have at the moment. While a natural could conceivably make measurable neural gains with slight accompanying hypertrophy for a short while, once a week just doesn't cause enough protein synthesis to even come close to being an optimal approach.

While one can progress anything,  at least for a while, we now know that steroid users and naturals are best served by entirely different approaches to programming when it comes to hypertrophy.

 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 02, 2018, 05:11:23 AM
^^^ pretty much what he thought, plus he said that if you are a natty your training loads and intensity aren't enough to warrant such a long break btw training sessions



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ARNIE1947 on January 02, 2018, 09:48:43 AM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on January 02, 2018, 09:54:18 AM
8)

 I think looking at this makes you realise he sacrificed a lot of muscle when he'd diet down.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on January 02, 2018, 11:57:21 AM
I think looking at this makes you realise he sacrificed a lot of muscle when he'd diet down.

everything I've read about his diet seemed fucking stupid

super low protein, very low calories to the point of starvation and no doubt plenty of amphetamines


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on January 02, 2018, 12:04:06 PM
i still cant figure out how the fuck zane beat him in 79,   or how he finished 5th in 80.   makes no sense considering at the time he was weiders top guy and draw, hell weider liked him

Did you ever look at the contest pictures?

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: rocco-x on January 02, 2018, 12:28:53 PM
I agree.  He would have destroyed  Bannout (who was good) and Dickerson (who just plain sucked).  Sheit.  Everyone should've destroyed Dickerson.  Most undeserving Olympia ever.  Totally subjective opinion, I know but for the life of the Buddha I can't understand how that Curious George gay porn star won the Olympia and the god-like Bob Paris was denied it with a far superior physique.
ive wondered that for years...how Dicklickingson ever placed let alone won an Olympia and Paris never walked away with a Sandow.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 02, 2018, 12:35:18 PM
No so convinced mike would’ve beaten Samir
As he was awesome winning the Mr.O


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on January 02, 2018, 12:55:56 PM
everything I've read about his diet seemed fucking stupid

super low protein, very low calories to the point of starvation and no doubt plenty of amphetamines

Yep. I think he's right fundamentally but took it to the extreme.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 02, 2018, 01:04:20 PM
No so convinced mike would’ve beaten Samir
As he was awesome winning the Mr.O

He had both arms and chest, hard to beat that combo 😎


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 02, 2018, 01:18:04 PM
No so convinced mike would’ve beaten Samir
As he was awesome winning the Mr.O

I'm with you Mike wasn't beating Samir.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SomeKindofMonster on January 02, 2018, 03:15:39 PM

This is an amazing picture. No one today could look this
good in this pose. Seriously, No One.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=754222;image)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Sexybeast777 on January 05, 2018, 07:37:20 AM
good legs and arms


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: PJim on January 06, 2018, 05:32:21 AM
This is an amazing picture. No one today could look this
good in this pose. Seriously, No One.

(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=628065.0;attach=754222;image)

Agreed. To me he is the true definition of a mesomorph. I think what made Mike great also was that he had both an aesthetic and freaky physique all wrapped up into one.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 06, 2018, 08:10:00 AM
Agreed. To me he is the true definition of a mesomorph. I think what made Mike great also was that he had both an aesthetic and freaky physique all wrapped up into one.

Massethtic.   Arnold and Franco both possessed such a physique.   Haney was comparatively worthless and should have lost more than a few times to better developed, shorter men but I think Weider let Lee win 8 to try and teach Arnold a lesson and instead wound up showing the world just how great the Oak was and to be honest, still is. 

With the arrival of Dorian we began the age of Assethetics, especially with the slob of a blob known as Ronnie Coleman who took it so far as to be absurd.  Phildo the Dwarf is filling out nicely as the more midgie version of Assethtics.  In between we had Cutler and the nearly ageless Hobbit Dexter Jackson.

The Golden Age ended around 85 or so.  Now we're stuck in the Moldy Age.  Fat guts and fat asses.  Overbuilt dwarves and calf-less tall(er) guys that all have the carapace gut and bubble butt so admired by the schmoe judges.  Even the so-called "classic" physique division is nothing compared to the likes of Mentzer or Zane, let alone Arnold.

I think this is due to the total reliance on drugs alone.  How else to explain total shitheaps like Kai Greene or Phildo Heath, two manlets that wouldn't weigh more than 165 lbs. sans their dope and without the little helpers they wouldn't dare enter a gym.  Fuck 'em.  Prime  Mentzer rules over those twin turds with ease.  And mentally?  Mike on an off day would show the world just how much a faux philosopher Grapefruit Fucker Greene really is.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on January 07, 2018, 10:58:55 AM
Massethtic.   Arnold and Franco both possessed such a physique.   Haney was comparatively worthless and should have lost more than a few times to better developed, shorter men but I think Weider let Lee win 8 to try and teach Arnold a lesson and instead wound up showing the world just how great the Oak was and to be honest, still is. 

With the arrival of Dorian we began the age of Assethetics, especially with the slob of a blob known as Ronnie Coleman who took it so far as to be absurd.  Phildo the Dwarf is filling out nicely as the more midgie version of Assethtics.  In between we had Cutler and the nearly ageless Hobbit Dexter Jackson.

The Golden Age ended around 85 or so.  Now we're stuck in the Moldy Age.  Fat guts and fat asses.  Overbuilt dwarves and calf-less tall(er) guys that all have the carapace gut and bubble butt so admired by the schmoe judges.  Even the so-called "classic" physique division is nothing compared to the likes of Mentzer or Zane, let alone Arnold.

I think this is due to the total reliance on drugs alone.  How else to explain total shitheaps like Kai Greene or Phildo Heath, two manlets that wouldn't weigh more than 165 lbs. sans their dope and without the little helpers they wouldn't dare enter a gym.  Fuck 'em.  Prime  Mentzer rules over those twin turds with ease.  And mentally?  Mike on an off day would show the world just how much a faux philosopher Grapefruit Fucker Greene really is.

great post and full of truth


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 07, 2018, 11:05:53 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 07, 2018, 06:01:05 PM
Rare shot of Mike


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on January 07, 2018, 06:34:03 PM
Massethtic.   Arnold and Franco both possessed such a physique.   Haney was comparatively worthless and should have lost more than a few times to better developed, shorter men but I think Weider let Lee win 8 to try and teach Arnold a lesson and instead wound up showing the world just how great the Oak was and to be honest, still is. 

With the arrival of Dorian we began the age of Assethetics, especially with the slob of a blob known as Ronnie Coleman who took it so far as to be absurd.  Phildo the Dwarf is filling out nicely as the more midgie version of Assethtics.  In between we had Cutler and the nearly ageless Hobbit Dexter Jackson.

The Golden Age ended around 85 or so.  Now we're stuck in the Moldy Age.  Fat guts and fat asses.  Overbuilt dwarves and calf-less tall(er) guys that all have the carapace gut and bubble butt so admired by the schmoe judges.  Even the so-called "classic" physique division is nothing compared to the likes of Mentzer or Zane, let alone Arnold.

I think this is due to the total reliance on drugs alone.  How else to explain total shitheaps like Kai Greene or Phildo Heath, two manlets that wouldn't weigh more than 165 lbs. sans their dope and without the little helpers they wouldn't dare enter a gym.  Fuck 'em.  Prime  Mentzer rules over those twin turds with ease.  And mentally?  Mike on an off day would show the world just how much a faux philosopher Grapefruit Fucker Greene really is.

X2.  Harsh, but not wrong.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 09, 2018, 02:10:28 PM
Another rare shot


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on January 09, 2018, 02:42:34 PM
Love that picture.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 09, 2018, 03:27:58 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on January 09, 2018, 08:25:43 PM
did he ever beat dickerson? LoL


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 09, 2018, 08:37:50 PM
did he ever beat dickerson? LoL


Not in the way Dickerson wanted but in 1979 Mike was first in the over 200 lb. class at the Olympia and Zane was first in the under 200 lb. class with Chris "Curious George" Dickerson coming in at 4th in the under 200 lb. class.  So yes, Mike defeated him.

But again, Dickerson didn't belong on the stage let alone the dais with any of those men.  His pointy elbows and chimpish ears were his most outstanding body parts.  It's one thing to be out-massed and another to be out-classed.

In 1980 he sucked even more.  Which probably explains his 2nd place overall.  The most undeserving Olympia winner of all time, including Franco's win in '81.  That should've been Padilla's win.  But since Padilla was rumored to have turned down donning  a Buster Brown outfit for a bunch of Schmoes at the '75 Universe soiree, he was probably consider a no-blow no-go winner against Dickerson.  It's well known that Dickerson made homosexual porno flicks.  That makes him a man-ho.  Disgusting creature without honor.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: SGT BARNES on January 10, 2018, 01:45:48 PM
correct, dickerson was a terrible and undeserving O winner, and yet he beat mike. LoL

So...zane and dickerson both won O's and are both alive. mike continues to be the ultimate loser.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 10, 2018, 02:12:46 PM
correct, dickerson was a terrible and undeserving O winner, and yet he beat mike. LoL

So...zane and dickerson both won O's and are both alive. mike continues to be the ultimate loser.

In some ways, yuppers!  More people (outside of gay porn conosewers) know of Mike Mentzer than they do Chris Dickerson.  But being dead that does little to help Mike out.  I still think he should have taken a year off and returned in 82 with a fire in his heart to win.  I think he could have but the past is in the pat.

Hindsight is 20/20 unless you've got your head shoved so far up your butt you can't see anything but shit.  I doubt Mike was a Democrat but that pretty much describes most libtards I know.  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 10, 2018, 02:42:38 PM
Mike had a great physique
Shame he wasn’t prepared to compete again after 1980
I highly doubt places 1-4 were a fix Though I don’t see
Mike in 5th place - The judging was a little odd to say the least
Possibly Arnold getting back on stage skewered the perception of the judges.

Mike should of took the Placing & Gone away trained hard
& competed a few more times.

Sadly instead he went into a mental breakdown caused primarily
From a non victory at a bodybuilding contest.
That doesn’t Indicate he had a sound strong mind.

The other 3 who placed ahead of him likely also thought they were
Missed judged & placed wrongly.
They didn’t have meltdowns & they all returned to compete again
At The Mr Olympia.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 10, 2018, 05:55:50 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 11, 2018, 03:40:10 PM
Louie on H.I.T


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 11, 2018, 05:24:36 PM
You want rare Mike Mentzer?  ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on January 11, 2018, 05:39:53 PM
I guess I'm the only one here that believes his 5th place was the proper placing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 11, 2018, 05:43:32 PM
I guess I'm the only one here that believes his 5th place was the proper placing.

The reality was that Arnold was first and everyone else was second.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 11, 2018, 05:58:59 PM
I guess I'm the only one here that believes his 5th place was the proper placing.


No you’re not, Though do
You see Dickerson & Coe as clearly better than mike that day

I struggle the most with Dickerson in 2nd place
Possibly because I dislike him & his awful physique

Do you have Arnold as the winner ?

He wasn’t outstanding & to light in body weight & in the legs especially
Though I think he was still the winner - only just !!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 11, 2018, 06:24:38 PM

No you’re not, Though do
You see Dickerson & Coe as clearly better than mike that day

I struggle the most with Dickerson in 2nd place
Possibly because I dislike him & his awful physique

Do you have Arnold as the winner ?

He wasn’t outstanding & to light in body weight & in the legs especially
Though I think he was still the winner - only just !!

I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!

Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on January 11, 2018, 07:44:50 PM
I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!

Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.

Cool report on what you saw. From pics Roger Walker always looked like a top contender- same with Tinerino. I always wondered why they never placed high. As for Padilla, I saw him in person in Rochester NY when he was guest posing along side Pete Grymkowski at a local show. As huge as Pete was, Danny awed everyone. He may be short but he had the most perfect physique I have ever seen. Not one thing was flawed with him- nothing!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: IRON CROSS on January 12, 2018, 12:43:40 AM
The reality was that Arnold was first and everyone else was second.

 :o :o :o :o :o

U A contradicting yourself  ::) ::) ::), C.Dickerson was yours Mr.Olympia '80 (remember that recycled PLASTIC TROPHY  ::) )

Your memory sucks  :P


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 12, 2018, 03:51:42 AM
:o :o :o :o :o

U A contradicting yourself  ::) ::) ::), C.Dickerson was yours Mr.Olympia '80 (remember that recycled PLASTIC TROPHY  ::) )

Your memory sucks  :P


You are a nuisance and asshole. We had a meeting at my gym and formed an organisation. That organisation decided to send a trophy to Dickerson. He wasn’t my choice.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Las Vegas on January 12, 2018, 08:10:12 AM
I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!


Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.

 ;D ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 12, 2018, 12:23:16 PM
I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!

Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.


Thanks Vince
Clearly you have the advantage of actually being there & watching the show live.

As good as pics & videos are sometimes they just don’t convey the physique’s
As you see them when at the show.

Yes Padilla looked very good & so did Roy calendar.

I’m glad you pointed out mike looked great on his own
Just not so good when others stood next to him
As I had previously asked if this was the case & the reverse
Of Dorian as he didn’t look so imposing on his own
But put him in a line up & he was the winner.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on January 12, 2018, 12:38:36 PM
:o :o :o :o :o

U A contradicting yourself  ::) ::) ::), C.Dickerson was yours Mr.Olympia '80 (remember that recycled PLASTIC TROPHY  ::) )

Your memory sucks  :P


Clainms to have seen the prejudging "through the lens of his camera" - Where the fuck are all the pictures?

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: IRON CROSS on January 12, 2018, 12:40:35 PM
You are a nuisance and asshole. We had a meeting at my gym and formed an organisation. That organisation decided to send a trophy to Dickerson. He wasn’t my choice.


 SENILE OLD FATSO  ;D

That shitty 'organization' was Ubba , long ,long, long  time dead 'organization' ( B.K. told me a lot)  :D

Must be bloody hot in that NO A/C warehouse  ;D ;D ;D



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: IRON CROSS on January 12, 2018, 12:53:56 PM



 Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!


 Roger was lucky to make the top 6. 




Only Frank Zane throw away his trophy  & U could not see that  ::)

Roger Walker destroyed U on Mr.Paul Grahams IFBB Mr.Australia '75 (Basile was THE LAST in that contest) , ah JELOUSY  ::)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Tarantula157 on January 12, 2018, 02:11:10 PM
I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!

Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.
On pics and videos Padilla appears a bit soft that year,unlike 81. How did you see him conditioning wise?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on January 12, 2018, 03:21:44 PM
I watched the judging and evening contest through my camera lens.

After the contest I talked to several of the top bodybuilders from my gym. They supported Chris Dickerson which surprised me.

Several guys could have won that night but Arnold had the edge re posing and knowing the judges. He didn't impress standing in the

lineup and wasn't called out in the first call out which left him looking shocked and defeated. When he was called out he was his

old self and his confidence grew. He would do those quick front and back 3/4 poses which blew everyone else away. Big arms

and chest still help win contests today.

Mike looked great on his own but suffered when standing next to Arnold and the others. Several of the top guys smashed their

trophies but to this day not a single bodybuilder has ripped up his check!

Boyer had the best posing routine but didn't have the best physique there. Chris gave a performance that amazed the crowd.

Zane looked small and reddish. Posed way too long as well. Roger was lucky to make the top 6. Roy wasn't as good as he was

the year before when he won in Sydney. Dennis was in the best condition and best abs but looked awkward in some poses.

Danny Padilla was the best, pound for pound, but never compared so completely overlooked.

 The picture contradicts a some of the words.  Mentzer looks the best in the call out,, Walker matches his back or a bit better, but head to toe Mike is the thickest most balanced competitor in the call out. In the background, Coe and Padilla both look better than Arnold standing there, Roy probably too. not seeing how, so dissagree with half of what you said.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 12, 2018, 04:31:53 PM
The picture contradicts a some of the words.  Mentzer looks the best in the call out,, Walker matches his back or a bit better, but head to toe Mike is the thickest most balanced competitor in the call out. In the background, Coe and Padilla both look better than Arnold standing there, Roy probably too. not seeing how, so dissagree with half of what you said.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 12, 2018, 06:26:12 PM

Only Frank Zane throw away his trophy  & U could not see that  ::)


We heard that Mentzer didn’t take his trophy. Last year they presented trophies to people not winning.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 12, 2018, 06:30:02 PM

 SENILE OLD FATSO  ;D

That shitty 'organization' was Ubba , long ,long, long  time dead 'organization' ( B.K. told me a lot)  :D




What a dope you are. We formed ABBA. UBBA was formed by Helmut, Gaye, and Billy Knight.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 12, 2018, 06:48:55 PM
Arnold 1st and either Mentzer or Zane as second/third.  Padilla was fantastic and relegated to the shadows.  He should've won in '81 and maybe '82.

To have won the Olympia Dickerson must've sucked even more backstage than he did on stage. Given his status as a professional fagstag-film man-ho, he shouldn't have any problem with that statement.  A total buttslutt and a horrid physique when compared to someone as good as Padilla, Zane and Mentzer let alone the Oak.   

Makes me wonder why no one complained when ol' "Curious George" Dickerson won.  Plenty bitched about Arnold and probably even more about Franco's '81 travesty, but I don't recall a peep about Dickerson's victory.  Probably gave one hell of a Schmoetivational pre-contest "speech" to the Weiders. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: IRON CROSS on January 12, 2018, 07:29:47 PM
What a dope you are. We formed ABBA. UBBA was formed by Helmut, Gaye, and Billy Knight.





So where is gone that 'abba' , aka basils mob   ??? ::) :P


 ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: IRON CROSS on January 12, 2018, 07:37:28 PM
We heard that Mentzer didn’t take his trophy. Last year they presented trophies to people not winning.


a) STOP lying about Olympia '80

b) So U a still expecting trophy 4 the last place on Mr.Aussie '75



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Joe Valentino on January 12, 2018, 07:57:13 PM
This topic will never end....


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 13, 2018, 03:38:05 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: JAGO on January 13, 2018, 06:35:57 PM
No, Boyer Coe left his trophy.

J


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 14, 2018, 04:26:24 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on January 14, 2018, 07:18:30 PM
:)

I always liked Ray’s physique better. He seemed more aesthetic.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on January 16, 2018, 10:53:41 AM
.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 16, 2018, 06:09:22 PM

Two of my all-time favourites ,in the same pic.  8)


(http://bundles.sfd.pl/SFD/2017/10/11/302e1abb4a374e28a7f32897ec9b94e9-small.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 16, 2018, 06:23:16 PM
Two of my all-time favourites ,in the same pic.  8)


(http://bundles.sfd.pl/SFD/2017/10/11/302e1abb4a374e28a7f32897ec9b94e9-small.jpg)

Cool shot


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on January 16, 2018, 08:35:42 PM
Is Tim Belknap still alive? I know he was a diabetic. Wonder if he was the first to see insulin was anabolic?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on January 16, 2018, 09:18:34 PM
Is Tim Belknap still alive? I know he was a diabetic. Wonder if he was the first to see insulin was anabolic?

I think he lives in West Hills, CA. Could be wrong though.  Later, man!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 17, 2018, 04:02:54 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chess315 on January 18, 2018, 07:39:12 PM
So how much meth did mike mentzer actually do a day like a gram or 8ball or what did he smoke it , pills, Lines what


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on January 18, 2018, 10:03:40 PM
1980 M Olympia


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: johnny1 on January 18, 2018, 10:57:51 PM
1980 M Olympia
Mentzer looks outstanding in that pose one of the very best of his generation in that shot


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: ARNIE1947 on January 19, 2018, 06:16:13 PM
 8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 19, 2018, 06:22:04 PM
8)

Not a very flattering shot , but cool pic nonetheless


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 19, 2018, 06:23:43 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Taffin on January 20, 2018, 05:31:05 PM
So how much meth did mike mentzer actually do a day like a gram or 8ball or what did he smoke it , pills, Lines what

Would have been pharmacy stuff in pill form like dexedrine or something similar, surely?  Can't see him snorting lines of powder - wouldn't seem scientific (to him)...

(Cue someone saying that's exactly what he did LOL)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 20, 2018, 05:39:59 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 20, 2018, 06:55:51 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 20, 2018, 07:01:05 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chess315 on January 21, 2018, 03:32:10 PM
Would have been pharmacy stuff in pill form like dexedrine or something similar, surely?  Can't see him snorting lines of powder - wouldn't seem scientific (to him)...

(Cue someone saying that's exactly what he did LOL)


I'm just curious about the rumors . Them pills back then we're way better than the ones now


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on January 21, 2018, 03:46:04 PM
:)

awesome pic


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 22, 2018, 03:38:18 PM
awesome pic
Another one , Rare shot of Mike 210lbs!!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 22, 2018, 04:03:06 PM
Another one , Rare shot of Mike 210lbs!!

A good pic of mike
Though his waist/ obliques look a bit funky - has it been shopped
Or just me being overly critical.

It does make his hips look wide.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on January 22, 2018, 04:44:20 PM
The waist is shopped.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 22, 2018, 05:00:48 PM
A good pic of mike
Though his waist/ obliques look a bit funky - has it been shopped
Or just me being overly critical.

It does make his hips look wide.

His hips were always wide but I have NOT touched that picture


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on January 22, 2018, 05:32:56 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on January 22, 2018, 10:24:41 PM
:)

I only got to use this machine once in my life and it was awesome. I would by one if it were available. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 23, 2018, 02:14:21 AM
I only got to use this machine once in my life and it was awesome. I would by one if it were available. 

Hi dim, how's tricks?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 23, 2018, 09:13:56 AM
.......

(https://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/k46.jpg&key=7b14f00540582bdb1992f9fcc1679511b685e9839bec4ee56d42b65b4f8db72c)







(https://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=493793.0;attach=535617;image)







(http://www.highintensitybodybuilding.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/menter-pose.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 24, 2018, 06:17:54 AM
 :)


(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/299876_545523125482373_683578362_n.jpg?oh=33c3e45179c2ce072e034109295fd669&oe=5AE31CDA)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 24, 2018, 06:20:32 AM
.........


(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/403004_310119082356113_2115019431_n.jpg?oh=2adf1edf325b6a94bac4b753d58eb1e2&oe=5AECDC09)






(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/400738_576133772421308_1796710123_n.jpg?oh=2062b76ffaae1a09328a1eeb91f85595&oe=5B21559B)



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 24, 2018, 06:22:35 AM
 8)

(http://s019.radikal.ru/i616/1303/bb/c1cdff7884e0.jpg)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 24, 2018, 06:23:36 AM
.......


(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/30/71/39/3071394e6bd357f7031ee9eecad0be6c.jpg)









(https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/11707628_1001027569931924_5505964437637922756_n.jpg?oh=27c3e6f9287d578f9b7467a3b27ae29c&oe=5B252E57)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: fredrollon on January 24, 2018, 07:35:35 AM

Should've just bothered to read the thread. Seems most of these pics have been posted by ND already.  ;D


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DooM_ on January 24, 2018, 02:10:33 PM
how were mentzer's joints in his later years . . . ?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: be back on January 24, 2018, 02:19:24 PM
how were mentzer's joints in his later years . . . ?

he preferred amphetamine...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on January 24, 2018, 02:21:28 PM
how were mentzer's joints in his later years . . . ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dzGjHc0IEY


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: DooM_ on January 24, 2018, 10:25:07 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dzGjHc0IEY

at the end of the video , mentzer looks in pain when he gets up and moves


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on January 25, 2018, 09:03:58 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dzGjHc0IEY

Nice odour of cigarette smoke emanating from mike when he walks back into the gym.

On a more serious note wasn’t this one of the last video’s he recorded
Both mike & ray died far too young - shame they were both in such poor health.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Dan-O on January 25, 2018, 04:07:22 PM
Nice odour of cigarette smoke emanating from mike when he walks back into the gym.

On a more serious note wasn’t this one of the last video’s he recorded
Both mike & ray died far too young - shame they were both in such poor health.

"The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long."

--Eldon Tyrell (CEO, Tyrell Corporation)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on January 25, 2018, 05:03:22 PM
Ray kept his dignity to the end. Mike still had his vocabulary. Sad to hear Ray couldn't get a woman. The ones in the gyms were too young he said.

Ray was 47 and Mike 49. Ray was hoping Mike could donate one of his kidneys but Mike's health was too poor to allow an operation. When Mike died

Ray gave up on life as his routine tied to that dialysis machine and being alone would have depressed him deeply. He died two days after Mike.

Very sad for both of them. Smart guys who ended up like that sure is ironical because Ray was rather cavalier about steroids. He took pain killers

because his neck gave him trouble. All those super heavy weights impacted on his health. He told me he once squatted 925 pounds for two reps.



Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on January 25, 2018, 07:19:42 PM
Ray was very underrated. More classic lines than Mike, but great in his own way.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on January 25, 2018, 08:56:30 PM
Ray kept his dignity to the end. Mike still had his vocabulary. Sad to hear Ray couldn't get a woman. The ones in the gyms were too young he said.

Ray was 47 and Mike 49. Ray was hoping Mike could donate one of his kidneys but Mike's health was too poor to allow an operation. When Mike died

Ray gave up on life as his routine tied to that dialysis machine and being alone would have depressed him deeply. He died two days after Mike.

Very sad for both of them. Smart guys who ended up like that sure is ironical because Ray was rather cavalier about steroids. He took pain killers

because his neck gave him trouble. All those super heavy weights impacted on his health. He told me he once squatted 925 pounds for two reps.




So what the heck did Ray die of?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on January 26, 2018, 04:17:44 AM
autopsy reports showed potentially lethal levels of opiates if i recall. maybe not the cod in mikes case, but with ray i get more suspicious due to the timing.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 26, 2018, 04:24:55 AM
Squatting 925 for a double?

Hmmmmmmmmmm..... Must have been quarter squats

And why the fuck train that heavy? AJ said "one can get fill muscle building benefits from squats and deads by not using more than 400 pounds for 15-20 reps and in most cases 300 pounds is enough"


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on January 26, 2018, 04:29:35 AM
Squatting 925 for a double?

Hmmmmmmmmmm..... Must have been quarter squats

And why the fuck train that heavy? AJ said "one can get fill muscle building benefits from squats and deads by not using more than 400 pounds for 15-20 reps and in most cases 300 pounds is enough"
no need to squat with stupid weights.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on January 26, 2018, 05:34:16 AM
no need to squat with stupid weights.

Or any exercise for that matter, but I do believe you should have a decent level of base strength to maximize gains

AJ Also said that if you can curl a 200 pound barbell for 10 or so reps yours arms will be as big as they can get

Doubt there are many people who can do that


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on January 26, 2018, 05:52:10 AM
Or any exercise for that matter, but I do believe you should have a decent level of base strength to maximize gains

AJ Also said that if you can curl a 200 pound barbell for 10 or so reps yours arms will be as big as they can get

Doubt there are many people who can do that
very true


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on February 03, 2018, 05:26:40 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on February 03, 2018, 05:30:27 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on February 03, 2018, 05:36:14 PM
It's sad how weak and sickly the Mentzer brothers were at a relatively young age.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: tres_taco_combo on February 03, 2018, 05:37:54 PM
Ray kept his dignity to the end. Mike still had his vocabulary. Sad to hear Ray couldn't get a woman. The ones in the gyms were too young he said.

Ray was 47 and Mike 49. Ray was hoping Mike could donate one of his kidneys but Mike's health was too poor to allow an operation. When Mike died

Ray gave up on life as his routine tied to that dialysis machine and being alone would have depressed him deeply. He died two days after Mike.

Very sad for both of them. Smart guys who ended up like that sure is ironical because Ray was rather cavalier about steroids. He took pain killers

because his neck gave him trouble. All those super heavy weights impacted on his health. He told me he once squatted 925 pounds for two reps.



interesting shit


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on February 04, 2018, 02:44:50 AM
It's sad how weak and sickly the Mentzer brothers were at a relatively young age.
Live life in the fast lane then soon or later the Grim Reaper comes calling. A shame. A lot of these guys just lived for the moment they never thought about a few years down the road.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 04, 2018, 03:00:58 AM
Live life in the fast lane then soon or later the Grim Reaper comes calling. A shame. A lot of these guys just lived for the moment they never thought about a few years down the road.

they had heart disease genetics in thier family

dad died in his 40's of heart failure

HEALTH IS DETERMINED BY...... GENETICS

"diet" plays a tiny tiny role


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on February 04, 2018, 03:24:38 AM
they had heart disease genetics in thier family

dad died in his 40's of heart failure

HEALTH IS DETERMINED BY...... GENETICS

"diet" plays a tiny tiny role
OK but they did not live very Healthy towards the End.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 04, 2018, 04:14:51 AM
OK but they did not live very Healthy towards the End.

True

Wonder how much damage narcotics and gear caused?

According to 15 gear doesn't hurt health like narcotics do


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on February 04, 2018, 04:39:26 AM
True

Wonder how much damage narcotics and gear caused?

According to 15 gear doesn't hurt health like narcotics do
would agree. as long as you know what you're doing gear should not be a problem.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 04, 2018, 04:42:41 AM
would agree. as long as you know what you're doing gear should not be a problem.

Is kinda funny though how guys try to convince themselves that tren is less toxic than deca😆😄


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on February 04, 2018, 05:03:08 AM
they had heart disease genetics in thier family

dad died in his 40's of heart failure

HEALTH IS DETERMINED BY...... GENETICS

"diet" plays a tiny tiny role

It's genetics and the risks you take in life. Smoking, steroids, recreational drugs, poor aerobic health, high body weight are among the risks to health you can change. It's both incredulous and disingenuous when fans of bodybuilding drugs rationalize away the risks to health by saying genetics is the reason they were both weak and sickly as they hit their late 40's.  It was their life style. Their dad was an over weight smoker. Sure genetics plays a major role. There are smokers that live to by 80 but is it a mathematical risk to health for the majority? Of course it is.   


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 04, 2018, 05:28:36 AM
It's genetics and the risks you take in life. Smoking, steroids, recreational drugs, poor aerobic health, high body weight are among the risks to health you can change. It's both incredulous and disingenuous when fans of bodybuilding drugs rationalize away the risks to health by saying genetics is the reason they were both weak and sickly as they hit their late 40's.  It was their life style. Their dad was an over weight smoker. Sure genetics plays a major role. There are smokers that live to by 80 but is it a mathematical risk to health for the majority? Of course it is.   

good point

being overweight, even if it is muscle IS NOT HEALTHY


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: illuminati on February 04, 2018, 06:29:52 AM
good point

being overweight, even if it is muscle IS NOT HEALTHY

Being alive / Living isn’t healthy the risk of death is everywhere
We are fragile beings & can die or be killed for umpteen different reasons.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 04, 2018, 06:33:46 AM
Being alive / Living isn’t healthy the risk of death is everywhere
We are fragile beings & can die or be killed for umpteen different reasons.

ok tune from sting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB6a-iD6ZOY

but.... this one is MUCH BETTER, more MASCULINE  8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TM291wFFpwE


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on February 05, 2018, 09:32:20 AM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on February 05, 2018, 01:33:33 PM
It's genetics and the risks you take in life. Smoking, steroids, recreational drugs, poor aerobic health, high body weight are among the risks to health you can change. It's both incredulous and disingenuous when fans of bodybuilding drugs rationalize away the risks to health by saying genetics is the reason they were both weak and sickly as they hit their late 40's.  It was their life style. Their dad was an over weight smoker. Sure genetics plays a major role. There are smokers that live to by 80 but is it a mathematical risk to health for the majority? Of course it is.   

If you spent any time around Mike the last decade of his life, you would have a different view. Yes, he smoke , and a lot the last q5 years of his life, but I never saw him take drugs, and he didnt seem to drink much, even on New Years, though he was sick when I was there. He ate pretty healthy, lunch would be a large turkey sandwich, no chip, dinner chinese. that sort of thing. i think the damage was already done, and yes smoking is bad for you, and the amphetamines were a tragic mistake. Now he even had taken acid when he was younger, never got to hear the whole story on how that went lol.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on February 05, 2018, 04:17:14 PM
Sibling rivalry and motivation between Mike and Ray.

Ray told me a story about Mike not picking him up on the way to high school one morning. Mike had mates with him but drove right past Ray. That really bothered Ray, even in his adult life decades later.

In 1991 I got Ray to set up an interview for me with Mike. I was training at Gold's Gym, Venice, where Ray got me a free 2 week pass. I discussed hypertrophy theory with Mike but neither of us changed

what we believed. I also gave Mike an article I wrote about the judging at the 1980 Mr Olympia. No magazine would publish that article. Now it is lost because I doubt Mike would have saved it because

I did not write that Mike was the winner. Then I asked him about the time he drove past Ray on the way to school. Mike couldn't remember that moment and said he wouldn't have done that. Well, Ray

was adamant that was what happened. So I had to conclude that Mike didn't see Ray that morning. I have no idea if Mike discussed that morning with Ray.

When Ray was training for the Mr America contest that he won he told me that his Mom was sick and that he would have trained 24 hours a day if that was what it took to win the title. Mike had already

won Mr America so now it was Ray's turn and yes, he did win that contest.

Ray told me a few times that his Dad favoured Mike. So there was Ray always trying to win the praise from his father. Mike did better academically and also won bigger titles. That sure motivated Ray to

try harder. Perhaps he also took risks that he should have avoided. When Mike turned to drugs after his loss in 1980 Ray told me his Dad urged Ray to give Mike a job at his Muscle Mill Gym in Torrance, Ca.

Ray did give Mike a job for a while but found out Mike would be nasty to several policemen training there so Ray lost customers. In the end it was Mike who looked after Ray. That seemed odd to me

because when I lived at Ray's place in April 1991 he had a successful rehab business using expensive Medx lower back and neck machines. He drove a red BMW 535 car and had plenty of money coming in.

He flew up to San Francisco to see someone about opening a second clinic up there. Somehow his marriage and businesses fell apart because Ray ended up alone and living with Mike in an apartment.

No doubt Mike was highly educated and intelligent. Those who knew Ray saw an earnest fellow who was also quite intelligent. So it is rather sad that two intelligent guys who won major bodybuilding

titles and were experts in hypertrophy and training didn't make it to 50 years old. Mike was 49 and Ray was 47.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on February 06, 2018, 02:34:36 AM
some great stories here  8)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on February 06, 2018, 03:29:23 AM
some great stories here  8)
as long as Vince is telling the truth..yes. He did seem to know them.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on February 06, 2018, 04:19:24 AM
Mike Mentzer repeatedly said how smart he was and people repeated the same. Dropping out of pre med is not proof of his intelligence. He referred to him self as a genius on numerous occasions.  An intelligent person doesn't use speed, writing he thought he was too smart to suffer the mental side effects of the drug. An intelligent person doesn't blow all his money on out dated commercial video equipment that he barely knew how to operate. In his prime he was making 200K a year and that's the equivalent of making over a million a year  today. Think he would have invested that in some matter instead of using it to launch a fitness magazine?

I know some would say you have to excuse his choices in life and behavior because he suffered from mental illness bought on from drug abuse.  Maybe a valid point. Then again in order to become that "victim" you first have to make that choice of using speed.

I still find him the most influential person on my training philosophy. Everything he wrote back in the day I tore out of magazines and put into a binder. He had a distinct writing style. I might own the most complete selection of his writings in his prime competitive years.  Look at his incredible popularity. It's 2018 and look at the length of this thread. He is still the most influential bodybuilder outside of Arnold.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: be back on February 06, 2018, 05:01:02 AM
Sibling rivalry and motivation between Mike and Ray.

Ray told me a story about Mike not picking him up on the way to high school one morning. Mike had mates with him but drove right past Ray. That really bothered Ray, even in his adult life decades later.

In 1991 I got Ray to set up an interview for me with Mike. I was training at Gold's Gym, Venice, where Ray got me a free 2 week pass. I discussed hypertrophy theory with Mike but neither of us changed

what we believed. I also gave Mike an article I wrote about the judging at the 1980 Mr Olympia. No magazine would publish that article. Now it is lost because I doubt Mike would have saved it because

I did not write that Mike was the winner. Then I asked him about the time he drove past Ray on the way to school. Mike couldn't remember that moment and said he wouldn't have done that. Well, Ray

was adamant that was what happened. So I had to conclude that Mike didn't see Ray that morning. I have no idea if Mike discussed that morning with Ray.

When Ray was training for the Mr America contest that he won he told me that his Mom was sick and that he would have trained 24 hours a day if that was what it took to win the title. Mike had already

won Mr America so now it was Ray's turn and yes, he did win that contest.

Ray told me a few times that his Dad favoured Mike. So there was Ray always trying to win the praise from his father. Mike did better academically and also won bigger titles. That sure motivated Ray to

try harder. Perhaps he also took risks that he should have avoided. When Mike turned to drugs after his loss in 1980 Ray told me his Dad urged Ray to give Mike a job at his Muscle Mill Gym in Torrance, Ca.

Ray did give Mike a job for a while but found out Mike would be nasty to several policemen training there so Ray lost customers. In the end it was Mike who looked after Ray. That seemed odd to me

because when I lived at Ray's place in April 1991 he had a successful rehab business using expensive Medx lower back and neck machines. He drove a red BMW 535 car and had plenty of money coming in.

He flew up to San Francisco to see someone about opening a second clinic up there. Somehow his marriage and businesses fell apart because Ray ended up alone and living with Mike in an apartment.

No doubt Mike was highly educated and intelligent. Those who knew Ray saw an earnest fellow who was also quite intelligent. So it is rather sad that two intelligent guys who won major bodybuilding

titles and were experts in hypertrophy and training didn't make it to 50 years old. Mike was 49 and Ray was 47.

believable stories of peace

other posters take note...


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on February 06, 2018, 05:06:24 AM
Mike Mentzer repeatedly said how smart he was and people repeated the same. Dropping out of pre med is not proof of his intelligence. He referred to him self as a genius on numerous occasions.  An intelligent person doesn't use speed writing he thought he was too smart to suffer the mental side effects of the drug. An intelligent person doesn't blow all his money on out dated commercial video equipment that he barely knew how to operate. In his prime he was making 200K a year and that's the equivalent of making over a million a year  today. Think he would have invested that in some matter instead of using it to launch a fitness magazine?

I know some would say you have to excuse his choices in life and behavior because he suffered from mental illness bought on from drug abuse.  Maybe a valid point. Then again in order to become that "victim" you first have to make that choice of using speed.

I still find him the most influential person on my training philosophy. Everything he wrote back in the day I tore out of magazines and put into a binder. He had a distinct writing style. I might own the most complete selection of his writings in his prime competitive years.  Look at his incredible popularity. It's 2018 and look at the length of this thread. He is still the most influential bodybuilder outside of Arnold.

Well stated. 

I like Mentzer and he was quite intelligent.  For a bodybuilder.  But the whole amphetamine thing just ruined his life but that doesn't discredit his writing and being intelligent for a bodybuilder may sound like damning him with faint praise but he was probably above average compared to the typical man on the street.  He just dumbed himself down with dope.  Too bad.   

Again, well stated and I agree with you, brother!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: be back on February 06, 2018, 05:08:55 AM
Well stated. 

I like Mentzer and he was quite intelligent.  For a bodybuilder.  But the whole amphetamine thing just ruined his life but that doesn't discredit his writing and being intelligent for a bodybuilder may sound like damning him with faint praise but he was probably above average compared to the typical man on the street.  He just dumbed himself down with dope.  Too bad.   

Again, well stated and I agree with you, brother!

if he had just used 6gms of heroin a day instead of the amphetamine he would have been able to function normally


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on February 06, 2018, 05:09:05 AM
boyer coe, said mike was making good money before he died, markus reinhardt said this as well.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldschoolfan on February 06, 2018, 05:10:39 AM
Well stated. 

I like Mentzer and he was quite intelligent.  For a bodybuilder.  But the whole amphetamine thing just ruined his life but that doesn't discredit his writing and being intelligent for a bodybuilder may sound like damning him with faint praise but he was probably above average compared to the typical man on the street.  He just dumbed himself down with dope.  Too bad.   

Again, well stated and I agree with you, brother!

hey scott as a long time mentzer thread, i think the amphetamines are what led to him completely quitting bodybuilding and leaving weider,   mike still could have went on, and weider always liked him,  joe even let him advertise for free in his magazines in the early 90's when mike was getting back on his feet. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on February 06, 2018, 05:14:42 AM
hey scott as a long time mentzer thread, i think the amphetamines are what led to him completely quitting bodybuilding and leaving weider,   mike still could have went on, and weider always liked him,  joe even let him advertise for free in his magazines in the early 90's when mike was getting back on his feet. 

I agree.  He could have been so much more in the world of bodybuilding.  He just quit and the drugs were probably a big part of that attitude.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Eric2 on February 06, 2018, 06:56:09 AM
Nice odour of cigarette smoke emanating from mike when he walks back into the gym.

On a more serious note wasn’t this one of the last video’s he recorded
Both mike & ray died far too young - shame they were both in such poor health.

This video is telling in a way to me. The Mentzer brothers are still a unit, Ray talking about his kidney dialysis. Mike sitting there chain smoking........kind of a sad scene really. Seems like the only real relationship these two had was with themselves. Mike for such a young man looks and moves like a senior citizen. Actually like a very old senior citizen. Too bad Mikes narsisscm vot the best of him. The drugs and smoking.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince G, CSN MFT on February 06, 2018, 07:19:04 AM
at the end of the video , mentzer looks in pain when he gets up and moves


Congestive heart failure, blood clots, etc.....along with Ray's suffering from Berger's Disease, they knew that they didn't have much time.  Both were dead not too long after the video was complete


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on February 06, 2018, 08:28:43 PM
Mike was a long time smoker even when he competed.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 07, 2018, 04:12:33 AM
Mike was a long time smoker even when he competed.

Do you smoke dim?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chess315 on February 07, 2018, 06:09:29 PM
Do you smoke dim?
you ever trained like mentzer dj it works I think because you never over train you always make slow steady progress


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: dj181 on February 08, 2018, 12:41:12 AM
you ever trained like mentzer dj it works I think because you never over train you always make slow steady progress

I actually had phone consults with him back in 2000

He wamted me to train once a week dip/dead and squat/pulldowm

Couldnt do it as i had to train more often, he called me a "Wild Horse" 😎

He 1st one training 4 times a week was/is gold i bet

I am tooooo complusive to train any less than at least one time a day

Blakely said tis one time a week comppund lift training would only work for heavy gear users

Blakely is very intelligent and prób right


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on February 11, 2018, 07:12:55 AM
:)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on February 11, 2018, 08:04:38 AM
I think that Mentzer's early 4 day routine was his best for pretty much everyone.  It is unreasonable to expect results every workout unless you include the one thing that truly separates us from them.  Drugs.  There is what is known as an "effective dose" for pretty much every drug made but it could be said that there's "effective" and then there's "ridiculously effective".

The latter one is probably based upon an individual's response and given the recent death of the idiot known as Dallas McCarver, more often than not exceeded a thousand times over by the idiots from the era of Dorian Yates on.  Arnold obviously knew his.  Mentzer too.  The guys in the 70s at the top of the game each knew what worked best for them and not to exceed it because not only the diminishing returns factor but also because they didn't want to mess with their future because no  one really knew what to expect down that road.  To know that just look at Coleman.  What a fucking retard.

The thing is to get the most from not so much the least, but rather what's best for each of us.  Mentzer's 4 day split probably does that for more people than anything else out there, especially natural trainers.  You may have to tailor it to your body with sets/reps being the key, but once you find the combination that opens your door you're on the way.  Having said that, don't fixate on just one path but shakes things up every once in a while. The mind controls the body.  Use less weight and more reps or more weight and less reps.  Take a week off or train an extra day.   

It's just training and there's more to life outside the gym than in it.  Mentzer showed us that truth.  Too bad he didn't stick to that road.   He might have lived not only a longer life, but a happier and healthier one.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: oldtimer1 on February 11, 2018, 10:02:09 AM
Mike looked his best when he was using his rotation for recuperation that he took from Mr. Florida Frank Calta. Monday he did legs-chest-triceps. Wednesday he did back, delt and biceps. Friday he was back to legs-chest-triceps. Next Monday he rotated back to doing back-delt and biceps with Wednesday being leg-chest and triceps. The rotation kept going. He trained like this for the 1980 Olympia. 


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: The Scott on February 11, 2018, 10:10:05 AM
Mike looked his best when he was using his rotation for recuperation that he took from Mr. Florida Frank Calta. Monday he did legs-chest-triceps. Wednesday he did back, delt and biceps. Friday he was back to legs-chest-triceps. Next Monday he rotated back to doing back-delt and biceps with Wednesday being leg-chest and triceps. The rotation kept going. He trained like this for the 1980 Olympia. 

Sounds good to me!  Thanks, brother!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: chuckles on February 14, 2018, 03:27:07 AM
I actually had phone consults with him back in 2000

He wamted me to train once a week dip/dead and squat/pulldowm

Couldnt do it as i had to train more often, he called me a "Wild Horse" 😎

He 1st one training 4 times a week was/is gold i bet

I am tooooo complusive to train any less than at least one time a day

Blakely said tis one time a week comppund lift training would only work for heavy gear users

Blakely is very intelligent and prób right
Squat 2x a week & you will be as big as a house.  ;)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Nether Animal on February 14, 2018, 03:33:20 AM
Squat 2x a week & you will be as big as a house.  ;)

 ::)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on February 14, 2018, 11:35:06 AM
Mike was a long time smoker even when he competed.
Where did you get that from?  He started smoking in the mid 80s when he got heavily into Ayn Rand.. she smoked, he figured emulate the master lol.. told me that to my face. I used to smoke , so I can't judge. Lent him a cigarette more than once after training outside Gold's after training. god we were stupid.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on February 14, 2018, 11:38:38 AM
boyer coe, said mike was making good money before he died, markus reinhardt said this as well.
He was,  as early as 1991 he was making $4000 a month just from training,  he showed me his notebook. Said the before he was only making $ 90 on some days, was going to give up, then made $2000 in a month so kept going. After 91 his rates went way up but he still let pay $40 a session, because he liked me and I wasn't making a lot then.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on February 14, 2018, 11:39:45 AM
I actually had phone consults with him back in 2000

He wamted me to train once a week dip/dead and squat/pulldowm

Couldnt do it as i had to train more often, he called me a "Wild Horse" 😎

He 1st one training 4 times a week was/is gold i bet

I am tooooo complusive to train any less than at least one time a day

Blakely said tis one time a week comppund lift training would only work for heavy gear users

Blakely is very intelligent and prób right
  HAHA, that sounds EXACTLY like something he would say. Nice!


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Straw Man on February 14, 2018, 11:41:36 AM
Mike looked his best when he was using his rotation for recuperation that he took from Mr. Florida Frank Calta. Monday he did legs-chest-triceps. Wednesday he did back, delt and biceps. Friday he was back to legs-chest-triceps. Next Monday he rotated back to doing back-delt and biceps with Wednesday being leg-chest and triceps. The rotation kept going. He trained like this for the 1980 Olympia. 

I made my first really good progress using that routine which I had read about in a mag (I'm pretty sure it was Muscle Mag International).  It was easy to follow and fit my schedule (was in high school at the time)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Viking11 on February 14, 2018, 11:48:21 AM
Sounds good to me!  Thanks, brother!

This works great, I never made great gains until I made this switch. It's also a fun way to train, doesn't feel like you get stuck in a rut.  This was the germination of his later approach too.. so he did practice what he preached. It was only when working with clients- genetically average or less  and not on steroids that he realized that most people couldnt handle the number of sets he used while also going to full positive and negative failure on every set.and training 2 on 1 off 2 on 2 off. they just weren't progressing.. I went backwards for a bit, then when he cut the volume back, and inserting more rest days.. I jumped from 240 ish where I had been stuck to over 260.  Added creatine and HMB for a month, and ate more- was always fucking hungry, and his 285= not lean at all, but 53' chest and 43' waist at 6'2, was a tank lol.  Later I learned how to meal plan better, which he was not big on teaching at all :(


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on February 27, 2018, 05:48:15 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Disgusted on February 27, 2018, 05:50:25 PM
Where did you get that from?  He started smoking in the mid 80s when he got heavily into Ayn Rand.. she smoked, he figured emulate the master lol.. told me that to my face. I used to smoke , so I can't judge. Lent him a cigarette more than once after training outside Gold's after training. god we were stupid.

From a guy that I know that knew him.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Hypertrophy on February 27, 2018, 06:53:21 PM
Mike looked his best when he was using his rotation for recuperation that he took from Mr. Florida Frank Calta. Monday he did legs-chest-triceps. Wednesday he did back, delt and biceps. Friday he was back to legs-chest-triceps. Next Monday he rotated back to doing back-delt and biceps with Wednesday being leg-chest and triceps. The rotation kept going. He trained like this for the 1980 Olympia. 

That’s a program I started doing in the 90’s and led to most  of my gains! I put on about 20 pounds in 3 years that way and then plateaued. It is probably the best routine out there for natural bodybuilders.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Vince B on February 27, 2018, 07:30:40 PM
That’s a program I started doing in the 90’s and led to most  of my gains! I put on about 20 pounds in 3 years that way and then plateaued. It is probably the best routine out there for natural bodybuilders.

Either an hypertrophy theory is correct or it is not. I recognize that drugs impact on results but the basic theory remains the same.

Mike and Ray developed great physiques and trained hard for many years. Exactly what they did to produce the most gains is now somewhat unclear.

Both gave talks and training camps so clung to various theories that were different from what so-called conventional training was in those days.

Essentially they recommended shorter, more intense workouts over longer ones with more sets. 3 to 5 sets versus 15 to 20 volume sets.

What is true is that muscles can be retained using protocols they recommended. I doubt maximum hypertrophy will be achieved using Heavy Duty or HIT.

I don't think they were correct re their theory of hypertrophy and volume plus intensity is more what is required.


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on March 01, 2018, 03:07:00 AM
1979 MO


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: BSN on March 01, 2018, 03:09:06 AM
1981 Mr. America.. Mike and Tim


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: NarcissisticDeity on March 01, 2018, 04:54:34 PM
 :)


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Sexybeast777 on March 05, 2018, 05:40:54 PM
pure motivation


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: Equalizer on March 11, 2018, 05:32:50 PM
I thought u said most of ur gains were made doing one full body workout each week?


Title: Re: Mike Mentzer - Discussion
Post by: karasan on March 12, 2018, 02:01:01 AM
In Netflix TV Series GLOW, I saw the ultimate Mike Mentzer Reincarnation (washed up Director Sam Sylvia played by Marc Maron)
He's a chain smoker, coke snorter grumpy type, what can I say, they may be inspired by Late Mentzer