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13226  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 16, 2008, 02:31:43 PM
The potential you speak of applies to many things and to many people, including people who do not believe in the Bible, or don't even believe in God for that matter.  There is just as much, if not more, potential for anybody who does not believe in "divine inspiration/guidance" to be vulnerable to manipulations by politicians and leaders.  Evidence of this is Nationalism, Social Darwinism, The Great Leap Forward, The Great Purge, just to name a few secular ideals which have claimed far more lives in modern times than any "alleged divine inspiration/guidance" justified actions by any religious group.

I've heard the saying that Stalin killed more people in one year than the Crusaders did in a decade. Bascially, that amount to the "god" in question being the state/government. And since he ran the state/government, the "god" was, in effect, Stalin himself.
13227  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 16, 2008, 12:44:23 PM
No, I meant why would soldiers be interested in raping old virgins?  The passage simply specifies virgins, but nothing about rape, the virgin's age, body weight, body shape or looks. 

That was actually an honest question.

How old were these virgins?  How old were the Israelli soldiers?

What you're forgetting, Loco, is that this whole issue revolves around Israel's idolatry and sexual misconduct. Again, the virgins females were spared, because they weren't part of Balak's plan (as guided by the rogue prophet, Balaam) to get Israel to backsliding.

13228  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 16, 2008, 12:19:31 PM
Didn't Sisera later get a woman's touch w/a tent peg  Shocked


Yep, and an iron one at that!!!

However, I was referring the judge and prophetess, Deborah, who declared that Israel would be delivered from the king of Canaan and his captain of the guard, Sisera (iron chariots and all)  Cool
13229  Getbig Bodybuilding Boards / Nutrition, Products & Supplements / Re: Travelling with Sups on: April 16, 2008, 10:48:47 AM
When you folks travel with your OTC supps ( pills, tabs etc) do you put them in your check in luggage?

Ever been questioned about what they are etc etc? Things are soo stringent nowadays, I am wondering if I should just send them to my destination via mail...

Nope. I just keep them in my bag. Most of the time, they just run the bag through the machine and they don't bother you, unless you have liquids like RTDs. Those you have to put in your checked baggage.
13230  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 01:11:23 PM
Hiya Loco, missed you!  Smiley

The bible is written by the hand of God, therefore he condones/approves of its contents. If you are saying that parts of it, or the bible in its entirety, is man-created, then that throws everything out the window doesn't it? We can discard what we don't like since man's perception is open to fallacy.

Here are a few examples Loco.  There are many but I don't want to spam the board.  Smiley  I can post a link with the full list of atrocities (by modern human standards).

Numbers

31:17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.           
31:18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

31:35 And thirty and two thousand persons in all, of women that had not known man by lying with him.


They got 32,000 virgins  Shocked  - after watching their children, babies, husbands, fathers, mothers butchered, these women were then raped, and kidnapped, by order of God.

Where does this alleged raping occur? More importantly, why the emphasis on sparing females who "have not known a man by lying with him", as opposed to not sparing those who had known a man?

The answer lies in the scenario. These were the Moabites, whose king wanted to conquer the Israelites, because their numbers were increasing and he fear a hostile takeover. Initially, he hired a prophet, Balaam, to curse Israel, in hopes that would stop them.

Numbers 22:

And the children of Israel set forward, and pitched in the plains of Moab on this side Jordan [by] Jericho. And Balak the son of Zippor saw all that Israel had done to the Amorites. And Moab was sore afraid of the people, because they were many: and Moab was distressed because of the children of Israel. And Moab said unto the elders of Midian, Now shall this company lick up all that are round about us, as the ox licketh up the grass of the field. And Balak the son of Zippor was king of the Moabites at that time.

He sent messengers therefore unto Balaam the son of Beor to Pethor, which is by the river of the land of the children of his people, to call him, saying, Behold, there is a people come out from Egypt: behold, they cover the face of the earth, and they abide over against me: Come now therefore, I pray thee, curse me this people; for they are too mighty for me: peradventure I shall prevail, that]we may smite them, and that I may drive them out of the land: for I wot that he whom thou blessest is blessed, and he whom thou cursest is cursed.



Keep in mind that word had spread about what went down, during the Exodus from Egypt and Israel's tangle with the Amorites. The Moabite king knew that (as long as God was with Israel) if he went head up with the Israelites, his troops would get beat down. Balaam couldn't curse Israel, as Balak had wanted. However, to avoid the wrath of the Moabite ruler and to keep all that loot he got, Balaam came up with a Plan B, to get Israel out of favor with God.


What's the one thing that would get God's protection taken from Israel? IDOLATRY (worshipping other gods).

And what was THE most effective way to get Israel's men to practice idolatry? Seduce them with their WOMEN, to engage in sex rituals as acts of pagan worship.

Moses explains that in verses 15 and 16:

And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?  Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD.

John (quoting an angel he sees in a vision) also makes reference to this in Revelation, when describing false prophets, "But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balak to cast a stumbling block before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication."

This was mentioned earlier in Numbers (and, apparently, the Midianites got in on the act, too).

Chapter 25, verses 1-3:

And Israel abode in Shittim, and the people began to commit whoredom with the daughters of Moab. And they called the people unto the sacrifices of their gods: and the people did eat, and bowed down to their gods. And Israel joined himself unto Baalpeor: and the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel.

So, if any "raping" was being done, it was during this period, NOT when Moses gave the order to clean house.

The virgins weren't spared for the purposes of being "fresh meat" for Israel. On the contrary, they were spared, because they weren't enticing Israel into sin and idolatry. If the Israelite males were really on a raping rampage, I'd doubt they'd be making any distinction, between virgins and non-virgins.

13231  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 11:17:24 AM
One thing is for sure: if you ever got in a fight with Yahweh, you could beat him senseless with a rod of iron; it's his one weakness.

Apparently, you missed Judges 4. Iron chariots didn't help this guy, Sisera:

Verses 2-4:

And the LORD sold them into the hand of Jabin king of Canaan, that reigned in Hazor; the captain of whose host was Sisera, which dwelt in Harosheth of the Gentiles. And the children of Israel cried unto the LORD: for he had nine hundred chariots of iron; and twenty years he mightily oppressed the children of Israel. And Deborah, a prophetess, the wife of Lapidoth, she judged Israel at that time.

Verses 13-16:

And Sisera gathered together all his chariots, even nine hundred chariots of iron, and all the people that were with him, from Harosheth of the Gentiles unto the river of Kishon. And Deborah said unto Barak, Up; for this is the day in which the LORD hath delivered Sisera into thine hand: is not the LORD gone out before thee? So Barak went down from mount Tabor, and ten thousand men after him. And the LORD discomfited Sisera, and all his chariots, and all his host, with the edge of the sword before Barak; so that Sisera lighted down off his chariot, and fled away on his feet. But Barak pursued after the chariots, and after the host, unto Harosheth of the Gentiles: and all the host of Sisera fell upon the edge of the sword; and there was not a man left.

Maybe, all the situation needed was a woman's touch. Can I get an "AMEN", STella?


13232  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Was the O.T. God forgiving and merciful? on: April 15, 2008, 10:34:56 AM
Apparently, much like Superman has a weakness to Kryptonite, Yahweh the raging one has a weakness to Iron:

And the LORD was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron. — Judges 1:19  

Hardly. Ask that dude, named Sisera, from Judges 4, how much the possession of iron chariots helped him against God's judgment.

Verses 13-16:

And Sisera gathered together all his chariots, even nine hundred chariots of iron, and all the people that were with him, from Harosheth of the Gentiles unto the river of Kishon. And Deborah said unto Barak, Up; for this is the day in which the LORD hath delivered Sisera into thine hand: is not the LORD gone out before thee? So Barak went down from mount Tabor, and ten thousand men after him.

And the LORD discomfited Sisera, and all his chariots, and all his host, with the edge of the sword before Barak; so that Sisera lighted down off his chariot, and fled away on his feet. But Barak pursued after the chariots, and after the host, unto Harosheth of the Gentiles: and all the host of Sisera fell upon the edge of the sword; and there was not a man left.



As far as Judges 1 is concerned, simply put, the people of Judah were intimidated because of the iron chariots of their enemies, even though they were told that they could overcome them. That's not unlike the spies who checked out Caanan, most of them trembled in fear, referring to themselves as grasshoppers.

We see something similar in Joshua 17. The children of Joseph are scared of the Canaanites, because of those chariots, even though Joshua tells them that they will beat Canaan.

But, as shown in Judges 4, once the people heeded God's instructions, as given by the judge/prophetess Deborah, Sisera and all NINE HUNDRED iron chariots were no match for the Israelites.
13233  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 10:12:43 AM
One thing is for sure: if you ever got in a fight with Yahweh, you could beat him senseless with a rod of iron; it's his one weakness.

Iron sure helped the Amalekites, didn’t they?
13234  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 07:55:53 AM
The very existence of this thread is a testament to the fact that homo sapiens has not advanced nearly as much as he is inclined to believe. Isn't it 2008?! Shocked

It's a testament to the fact that, much to the chagrin of certain atheists, belief in God is still relevant and active.


As for you deists; I don't get you, you may as well be atheists.

Not quite. atheism is the belief that there is NO supreme being or supernatural entity. As long as you believe that such exists, you are not an atheist.
13235  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 07:20:11 AM
The mathematical elegance of the universe coupled with the idea that something exists instead of nothing leaves me inclined to believe God exists.

He is not a personal God b/c that is the creation of people afraid of the dark--the avuncular benevolent ruler watching over us always.

The Bible was written by men to codify a way to live.  God was the enforcer in the OT--a killer of monstrous proportions for those not living according to the rules set out.

For the most part, the only codifying in the Bible occurs in the Pentateuch (the 5 books of Moses: Genesis-Deuteronomy). All the other instructions are offshoots of these law, based on the Ten Commandments.
13236  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Was the O.T. God forgiving and merciful? on: April 15, 2008, 07:14:32 AM
And when God has mercy on the one who deserves just punishment, then "that is the essence of slavery".   You can't win with skeptics.

Perhaps, we should call it the "Jonah" complex.  Grin


And they forget that Pharaoh and his father before him ordered the killing of, not just the first born, but all male babies of Israel.

Haven't you heard? The Egyptians, Amalekites, etc. were just relaxing, sipping cocoa and singing "Kum-bay-Yah", when mean ol' Jehovah and crew just whacked them unprovoked and unwarranted.
13237  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Is God Cruel? on: April 15, 2008, 06:31:11 AM
You post a quote from a site.

I have to assume you believe in it, since you leave the quote without comments.

When God caused the Red Sea to close, drowning Pharaoh’s entire army, He was punishing Pharaoh’s rebellion against Him and preserving His chosen people from certain slaughter and annihilation (Exodus 14).


God is almighty, and could easily have chosen to find a way to stop the rebellion without the slaughtering of thousands of Egyptians.

Of course, you forget the whole "free will" factor, specifically that of Pharoah using the other NINE chances he had to release Israel, before that tenth plague hit. When the firstborn (including his own son) died, it finally hit home and Pharoah submitted.

And, there's also the matter that the Egyptians, who followed Israel's lead and did the Passover thing, were spared.




Wrongdoing that does not result in punishment inevitably results in greater and greater wrongdoing, which benefits no one and is detrimental to the common good.


Jesus seems to disagree. He says to turn the other cheek and to give the cloak. Is this website you believe in more right than Jesus?

He also said, "Vengeance is Mine. I will repay".


Even when God told the Israelites to completely destroy the enemies of God, including women and children, He knew that to let them live would ensure the existence of future generations devoted to evil idolatrous practices—including in some cases child sacrifices on the altars of false gods.


STella, how can you even begin to defend the murdering of children?

I gotta say that I'm quite surprised.


Here's how some of how the defense goes:

-  They would have grown up to be evil like their parents
-  They would have starved to death
-  A parents sin will affect those whose are innocent


Yep!!! The last sentence pretty much covers the rest. As I've stated numerous times, the worst part about sinful behavior is that those who commit aren't the only ones who pay the price for it.

I'll go out on a limb and say that EVERYONE ON THIS THREAD (Christian or not) has been hurt (adversely affected) by someone else's wrongdoing. And EVERYONE ON THIS THREAD had done something wrong that has hurt (adversely affected) someone else.
13238  Getbig Misc Discussion Boards / Religious Debates & Threads / Re: Was the O.T. God forgiving and merciful? on: April 15, 2008, 06:12:46 AM
Don't forget David and Solomon. Solomon slipped into idolatry and worshipped other gods, despite the Lord's instructions. God could have stripped him of the throne. However, for David's sake, He allowed Solomon to remain king. However, Solomon's son, Rehoboam, would lose the throne of Israel (except for one tribe).

Define mercy then.

I'd define it as a reduction in punishment.

Some people have the "God can do no right" mentality. If people commit sin and God seemingly does nothing, you get the old snide remark, "Where is (your) God now?"

Yet, when the Lord has had enough and renders judgment on people, all of a sudden, He's mean, cruel, and heartless.

Non-believers have said that about the Exodus account, specifically the slaying of Egypt's firstborn. Often, they forget that Pharoah had nine chances to release Israel, before the tenth (and most devastating) plague hit.
13239  Getbig Bodybuilding Boards / Nutrition, Products & Supplements / Re: Alpha Lipoic Acid on: April 15, 2008, 04:07:12 AM
is that the part of celltech that makes your throat burn.and does the pills cause that effect..

I think it does. However, that only happens to me when I use the Orange and Fruit Punch kinds. Grape and Lemon-Lime doesn't do that. I've yet to try the Blue Raspberry.

I've never used plain ALA pills. The ALA-ALC caplets from GNC don't bother my throat.
13240  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Freaking out: potential university has NO SQUAT rack.... on: April 14, 2008, 09:04:59 AM
It seems crazy as I should base my decisions for graduate studies soley on academic criteria but I called to ask about the socalled sports centre and I asked if there was a squat rack, to which the man replied no. Am I crazy or should I just eliminate said university from my list because I won't be able to do squats (they don't even have a smith machine)....freaking out...is it legimitate?

What would you do?

If this school has the academic quality you desire, I'd hardly consider eliminating it, simply due to their lack of gym equipment. I went through something similar my freshman year of college. I had to drag my old cement weights to my dorm room, because the gym equipment was lacking and the big weight room was reserved for the football players. Fortunately, I got a great Christmas present: A Bally membership (Premiere Plus), which allowed me to train at any Bally fitness center or club affiliated with Bally in the country.

I still have and use that membership.

From what you've described, the dumbbells go up to about 80 lb (37 kg) and the "fixed barbells" (presumably for curls, mainly) max at 120 lb (55 kg). You may be better served getting a gym membership. This school appears to be outside the USA; so, I'm not all that familiar with the franchises you could join at a fairly cheap price.

13241  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Ben White BACKS DOWN to Johnny Jackson in strength challenge on: April 14, 2008, 08:39:18 AM
joj isnt humble didnt he think he was stronger than coleman?

he's a weak ass pussy

it's a good thing for him coleman and cutler dont destroy him and that he only gets to train with pussies like branch warren

I'd hardly call Jackson weak. He has an official deadlift of 804 in competition. I believe that was in 2004, held on the same weekend as the Orlando (Florida) Xtreme Pro show, won by Darrem Charles.
13242  Getbig Bodybuilding Boards / Nutrition, Products & Supplements / Re: Alpha Lipoic Acid on: April 14, 2008, 07:22:58 AM
Most of my ALA intake occurs when I use CELL-TECH.

Another supplement you might want to try is  Acetyl-L-Carntine 500 & Alpha Lipoic Acid 200. It comes in yellow caplets and retails for $22 for 60 caplets ($17.60 with the Gold Card).
13243  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: WHAT IS REQUIRED TO RESTORE 'CREDIBILITY' TO PRO BODYBUILDING? on: April 11, 2008, 05:41:13 AM


In my view, it isn't about judging, mass vs. aesthetics, or even anabolics.

The perception that bodybuilding has to overcome is that bodybuilders are just "mirror athletes" (i.e. they do NOTHING with their big muscles).

Training doesn't count, as virtually every major sport/athletic endeavor (baseball, football, basketball, pro wrestling, etc.) trains with weights. Bodybuilders must do something with those massive physiques, BESIDES pose and flex.

13244  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Arnold talks about Pumping Iron being FAKE. I think he's lying. on: April 09, 2008, 12:59:29 PM
The IFBB does not do amateur competitions. In the USA it is the NPC.

The NPC is the official amateur feeder for the IFBB. And, the IFBB has its own show, the IFBB North American.


The World Championships/Universe is a competition that is ONLY OPEN to qualified competitors who are trying to turn pro.

Those competitors would be amateurs. And, the IFBB runs the Universe.


The winner of the World Championships/Universe has not been an automatic qualifier for the O for years.

And for the record ALL Universe winners, in every class were eleigible to compete in the O when they allowed that-it was not limited to an overall winner.

I beg to differ. Back when the Olympia was the only pro show, the Mr. Universe winners qualified for the Olympia. The weight class winners did all qualify, especially after 1991, when they stopped crowning an overall winner. However, when they reinstated the overall title (I believe that was 1994 or 1995), only that winner from the Universe got a spot at the Olympia.

13245  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Arnold talks about Pumping Iron being FAKE. I think he's lying. on: April 09, 2008, 12:42:01 PM
#1- Arnold did not revel the bullshit about his Dad not really dying while he trained for the Olympia-he was OUTED by Wendy Leigh in her unauthorized biography of him. So the notion that he came out with it on his own is bullshit.

#2- Steroids were illegal in the 60's, they always have been, UNLESS you had it prescribed by a doctor. Arnold, nor any other BBers of that time, had their steroids prescribed by doctors.  So they were illegal for him to use.

#3- The IFBB is a professional BBing organization, they have nothing to do with amateur competitions.

The IFBB has amateur organizations, among them are the IFBB North American and, of course the World Amateur Bodybuilding Championships (aka the Mr. Universe).

In fact, until a few years ago, the winner of the Universe qualified for the Olympia. During the years, where there was no overall winner, all the weight-class winners qualified for the next year's Olympia (i.e. Ronnie Coleman, who won the heavweight class in 1991, earning him a slot in the 1992 Olympia).

13246  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Arnold talks about Pumping Iron being FAKE. I think he's lying. on: April 09, 2008, 12:36:18 PM
OK. Let me see if I can break this down for your peanut brain...It was suggested to Arnold that for the re-releasing of Pumping Iron, he omit the weed scene, but he chose otherwise for the purity of the film and did not want to deny that he did in fact inhale, blah blah blah...

IF, now this is a big IF, are you understand this? IF Arnold was to deny any portion of the film, it would've been the weed scene simply because no other scene stood out as controversial as that one.

Get it? Got it? Goooooood...

Not too bright in putting two and two together, are ya?

"Are you understand this?"

What were you staing about not being to bright, again?



13247  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: MUSCLEPHONE SAYS: Lee Priest out of the IFBB until the Olympia? on: April 09, 2008, 11:27:11 AM
why doesnt Lee just retire hes not getting any younger, i suppose with a tatooed face his future work oppurtunites may be limited, just looks so stupid to make such a stance and then beg and wait,to be let back in, dont get me wrong im a fan of the little guy but whats he got left to give does he really want to be up there past his best like the Sonbatys, Cormiers etc,

Retire? Priest is only in his early/mid 30s, still with plenty of years left to compete.

And, it was just a mere two years ago (and change) that he won the IronMan Invitational. Unless, he's sustained some major injuries between then and now, he's still got the goods to get it done.
13248  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Arnold talks about Pumping Iron being FAKE. I think he's lying. on: April 09, 2008, 11:13:37 AM
I know you moron.  Roll Eyes

I said if there WAS anything he was to deny, it would be smokin' that joint.

What for? He didn't deny his steroid use. Why would he deny his weed-smoking, especially if such isn't an offense in South Africa, genius?
13249  Getbig Main Boards / Gossip & Opinions / Re: Arnold talks about Pumping Iron being FAKE. I think he's lying. on: April 09, 2008, 10:17:36 AM
I think if there's anything he'd deny doing was smoking that joint!  Grin

Nope. Schwarzenegger said that he did indeed smoke the joint, during the post-Olympia/Lou Ferrigno-birthday party. It was weed, indeed; and HE DID INHALE!!!!
13250  Getbig Misc Too Board / 2009 IFBB Contests Info & Threads / Re: 2008 IFBB N.Y. Pro Show on: April 08, 2008, 12:17:29 PM
Updated Competitor List as of April 2nd:

Arntz Jason (202)
USA

Brown, Elvis
England

Canyon, Jimmy (202)
USA

Catapano, Gianluca
Italy

Chamberlain, Brian (202)
USA

Del Rio, Alfonso
Spain

Dixon,, Charles (202)
USA

Ducasse, Guy
USA

Elsetouhi, Tarek
Germany

Feliz, Abiu
USA

Henry II, David (202)
USA

Huff, Roland (202)
USA

Icli, Neset
Netherlands

Ingram, Leo (Open)
USA

Jackson, Tricky (202)
USA

Jones, Ken (202)
USA

Joseph, Louis (Open)
Canada

Karaduzovic, Emro
USA

Kjellstrom, Martin
Sweden

Long, Don (Open)
USA

Lytle, Daron (202)
USA

Mishin, Evgeny (Open)
USA

Ogorodnikov, Sergey (Open)
Russia

Ojex, Bola (Open)
Nigeria

Rockel, Ronny (Open)
Germany

Shabazz, Roc
USA

Stubbs ,Joel (Open)
Bahamas

Thorne, Henderson (Open)
Canada

White, Ben (Open)
USA

Wonsley, Nathan (Open)
USA

Looking at this lineup, White might win it after alll. then again, if Stubbs has built up his legs to match his upper body......LOOK OUT!!!
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