Author Topic: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare  (Read 968 times)

James

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Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« on: July 19, 2009, 06:55:24 PM »
n the back-and-forth frenzy of debate concerning Barack Obama's proposals to dismantle our healthcare system in order to impose socialized medicine on a resistant public, one little fact is prone to be overlooked as we focus on the programs' mammoth costs and insurmountable problems.

That fact is the Obama-Democrat proposal to gradually de-fund Medicare.

In order to help pay for the 8 million or so uninsured citizens and 20 million or so illegal aliens who will benefit most from this draconian plan, Obama wishes to cut 50 billion dollars from Medicare--the single largest source of medical benefits for the nation's Senior Adults.

This is being proposed at the very time that the nation faces the retirement avalanche of 'the baby boomers,' who will comprise the single largest retirement block in U.S. history.  How can the nation expect to pay for their retirement and Medicare when cuts are being proposed?

And that is precisely the point.

You can be assured that this cut of 50 billion to Medicare is only the first step.

The plan is to gradually phase out Medicare entirely, placing ALL of the nation's Seniors onto the rolls of the new multi-trillion dollar plan, where those who are deemed too old or sick to justify being given care are simply 'allowed to die.'

Inherent within that plan is to provide 'end of life counseling' for such persons in an attempt to convince them to stop being a burden on society by expecting continued top-notched healthcare.  They should simply 'do their duty' and die.

The elderly and the severely ill will be placed in institutions or programs designed for 'the last year of life,' where instead of being given medical treatment that could improve and prolong both the quality and quantity of life, they are merely given 'comfort measures,' counting down the days when, at last, society can finally be rid of the 'parasites' who raise the costs of care for all citizens.


A harsh assessment, you say?  No more harsh, cold, and heartless than the demented minds who envision these components of a 'brave new world' that are conceived in the barbaric brains of 'medical ethicists and social engineers' who believe in centralized government control of all of life, from birth until death.

As more and more Seniors gradually get their Medicare benefits cut, more and more will be forced onto the roles of the government-run-and-provided healthcare reformation corporation, which will then make all ultimate medical decisions for you and your doctor.  This corporation will serve as the final judge and jury.  All decisions will be final, with no recourse but to accept whatever they are willing to dole out.

And if that means your death, then so be it.  What else can you do, and where else can you go?

Let me be quite specific in my charge that I will level, here and now, against Obama, his administration, and Democrats on the Hill.  This is a scheme to from top to bottom to rid society of its least productive members, although at one point they were the MOST productive.  Instead of honoring these stalwarts of wisdom and fortitude in their elderly years, the 'powers that be' in government are now deciding that they are simply too great a burden on the economy.

What better way to pave the way for their grand scheme of a new economy with a low amount of 'overhead' for caring for the elderly than to implement a program that will have the net effect of weeding them out?

Socialized, government-run healthcare ALWAYS, I repeat, ALWAYS involves rationing.  The nature and amount of healthcare you receive will be limited according to the nature of your life and illness.  This is the ONLY way such a plan can be paid for by tax dollars once the capitalistic, free-market system of investment and profit is gone.

http://www.examiner.com/x-3704-Columbia-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d19-Beware-the-Obama-defunding-of-medicare

Hedgehog

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2009, 11:46:58 PM »
I don't understand your problem with reforming the health care system. ???

USA spends most dollars per citizen in the world on healthcare.

Yet it is no better than what you find in most European countries.

And lots of people are without an insurance. Something that is very costly for the nation as a whole, since these people get incapacitated due to not getting treatment early.

Why keep something that obviously isn't working that well?


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Hugo Chavez

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2009, 12:11:40 AM »
USA spends most dollars per citizen in the world on healthcare.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2009, 04:32:38 AM »


Yes we do but why?

1.  Illegals cost billions.
2.  Doctors practice defensive medicine and ordcer tons of unnecessary tests to practice CYA testing from lawsuits.
3.  People do not pay for health care and go to the doctor for every sneeze.
   

   

Hugo Chavez

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2009, 04:37:01 AM »
Yes we do but why?

1.  Illegals cost billions.
2.  Doctors practice defensive medicine and ordcer tons of unnecessary tests to practice CYA testing from lawsuits.
3.  People do not pay for health care and go to the doctor for every sneeze.
   

   
1.  Proof please
2.  Proof please
3.  Proof Please

Soul Crusher

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2009, 04:40:31 AM »
1.  Proof please
2.  Proof please
3.  Proof Please

Hugo - I am starting work, and these are not even debatable.  Even Obama accused doctors of ordering unneccesary testing but refused to acknowledge that they were doing it for CYA against lawsuits. 

________________________ ________________________ ______________________
One Year Of Illegal Alien Health Care Costs Would Pay For Border Barrier
Non-citizens cost billions per year in uninsured health care.

Non-citizens are putting the hurt on our hospitals. A study by the Florida Hospital Association estimates that uninsured non-citizens cost the state's hospitals an average of $63,612 per patient last year.

The tab is rising as the number of immigrants continues to swell from coast to coast. The American Hospital Association reported that its member facilities provided $21 billion in uncompensated health-care services last year.

While not all those costs can be attributed to undocumented aliens, new Census data show that non-citizens are, by far, this country's largest group of uninsured residents — 43 percent of the total.

The costs of health care are just one way that low skilled low wage immigrant non-citizens cost the US economy and citizens money. Keep in mind that these figures above underestimate even the medical costs of low skilled immigrants because millions of illegals were granted citizenship thru amnesties and a large portion of them are uninsured. Also, the costs above do not include costs at government clinics and private practices or the costs of the US citizen children who are born in the United States to illegal aliens whose parents use Medicaid and other government programs to pay their health care. Even with this narrow definition on the costs of low skilled immigrants for health care the cost for less than a single year of paying the health care of non-citizens would pay for a barrier to keep illegal aliens from crossing into the United States from Mexico. Various cost estimates (see here and here and here) for the West Bank-Israel fence structure , if extrapolated to the longer US border with Mexico, suggest that the US could stop the flow of illegal aliens from Mexico for a cost of between $2 billion and $8 billion dollars. The range of cost estimates reflects the fact that the Israelis are building more and less formidable barriers in different sections depending on perceived risk. If we go for the more deluxe barrier structure for the entire border it would still cost less than a single year of uninsured and unpaid health care bills run up by non-citizens living within the US borders.

By Randall Parker at 2003 October 23 11:06 AM  Immigration Economics


Hugo Chavez

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2009, 05:02:06 AM »
Ok, so what you're saying is we should nix free healthcare for illegals, which I'm for totally, and we can then totally afford universal healthcare?

Minus those costs you listed where does that place us on spending in the world?

You only covered proof for option 1 so that's all I'm talking about ;)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2009, 05:06:42 AM »
Ok, so what you're saying is we should nix free healthcare for illegals, which I'm for totally, and we can then totally afford universal healthcare?

Minus those costs you listed where does that place us on spending in the world?

You only covered proof for option 1 so that's all I'm talking about ;)


What I am saying is that we should see who exactly are the uninsured and see if their needs can be met before we upset the plans of the other 85%. 

If illegals get nothing, we are left with 30 million. 

From what I read, about a 1/3 of that are young people who make decent money but down want health insurance.  When I started my own business, I went without insurance for a few years because of the cost.  In NY, they dont offer a high deductible plan.  Those people should be helped with high deductible low premiuim plans. 

If we are left with 10-15 million, surely we can do something for them without destroying the entire system. 

   

   

James

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2009, 05:33:15 AM »
Quote
1.  Proof please
2.  Proof please
3.  Proof Please

Texas
"In Texas, where the state comptroller estimates illegal immigrants cost hospitals $1.3 billion in 2006, the University of Texas Medical Branch in Galveston is considering denying cancer care to such immigrants."
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2008-01-21-immigrant-healthcare_N.htm

California
U.S. Taxpayer to Pay $71 Million for California Illegals
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/us_to_help_cover_health_costs_of_illegals_providers_in_state_to_divvy_up_71_million_for_emergency_care/

Nevada
Health care costs of illegal immigration
http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20060702/OPINION/107020067
Which brings us back to my original question. According to a well-researched article by Appeal business writer Becky Bosshart, the local hospital spent nearly $20 million on medical care for indigent

Why Health Care Is So Costly
A study made by the U.S.-Mexico Border Counties Coalition, an American lobbying group, found that U.S. hospitals in border states provide at least $200 million a year in uncompensated emergency care to illegal aliens. In the four border states, 77 hospitals now face a medical emergency.

Uncompensated care to illegal aliens in Arizona cost the Cochise County Health Department 30% of its annual budget, the Copper Queen Hospital in Bisbee $200,000 out of a net operating income of $300,000, the University Medical Center in Tucson $10 million, and the Good Samaritan Regional Medical Center in Tucson $1 million in only the first quarter of last year. The Southeast Arizona Medical Center in Douglas is on the verge of bankruptcy. Some emergency rooms and pre-natal units have closed because they can't afford to stay open.
http://www.eagleforum.org/psr/2003/feb03/psrfeb03.shtml

Houston
During the last three years, Houston's Harris County Hospital District spent $330 million to treat and immunize illegal aliens

San Antonio
In San Antonio, University Health System officials have proposed a statewide quarter-cent sales tax to help hospitals pay for uninsured persons who show up at the door.

California
deliveries to illegal alien mothers, at a total cost of $215.2 million

Colorado
Similar studies in Colorado and Minnesota in 2005 came up with much smaller estimates: $31 million and $17 million, respective

Minnesota
Similar studies in Colorado and Minnesota in 2005 came up with much smaller estimates: $31 million and $17 million, respective
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2008-01-21-immigrant-healthcare_N.htm

Undocumented adults account for about $6.4 billion a year in national health care expenses

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2006/11/15/BUGPGMCI3E1.DTL&type=business#ixzz0LnwcnUDL


Soul Crusher

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2009, 05:41:37 AM »
Texas
"In Texas, where the state comptroller estimates illegal immigrants cost hospitals $1.3 billion in 2006, the University of Texas Medical Branch in Galveston is considering denying cancer care to such immigrants."
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2008-01-21-immigrant-healthcare_N.htm

California
U.S. Taxpayer to Pay $71 Million for California Illegals
http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/us_to_help_cover_health_costs_of_illegals_providers_in_state_to_divvy_up_71_million_for_emergency_care/

Nevada
Health care costs of illegal immigration
http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20060702/OPINION/107020067
Which brings us back to my original question. According to a well-researched article by Appeal business writer Becky Bosshart, the local hospital spent nearly $20 million on medical care for indigent

James

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2009, 06:11:15 AM »
Quote
Ok, so what you're saying is we should nix free healthcare for illegals, which I'm for totally, and we can then totally afford universal healthcare?

Minus those costs you listed where does that place us on spending in the world?

You only covered proof for option 1 so that's all I'm talking about Wink

But what happens when Obama pushes through his Amnesty Bill, and now all of these illegals are now legal ?


Undocumented adults account for about $6.4 billion a year in national health care expenses

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2006/11/15/BUGPGMCI3E1.DTL&type=business#ixzz0LnwcnUDL

Soul Crusher

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Re: Beware the Obama de-funding of medicare
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2009, 06:57:39 AM »
But what happens when Obama pushes through his Amnesty Bill, and now all of these illegals are now legal ?


Undocumented adults account for about $6.4 billion a year in national health care expenses

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2006/11/15/BUGPGMCI3E1.DTL&type=business#ixzz0LnwcnUDL