Author Topic: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen  (Read 3690 times)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #25 on: December 09, 2009, 06:38:21 PM »
What I want to know is how the EPA can get away with classifying CO2 as a pollutant :o I mean WTF is that, they have just classified every organism that inhales oxygen and exhales CO2 an organic polluting machine. And I guess just fuck vegitation as well, those little bastards actually use CO2 and turn it into oxygen, I demand an investigation!

Actually, I read that the EPA got this authority via a court decision some years ago based on one study that a SC Justice gave a lot of credence to.  I think it was Justice Kennedy if I m not mistaken. 

Kazan

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #26 on: December 09, 2009, 06:44:15 PM »
Actually, I read that the EPA got this authority via a court decision some years ago based on one study that a SC Justice gave a lot of credence to.  I think it was Justice Kennedy if I m not mistaken. 

The supreme court gave an unelected body government like powers to impose regualtions? Hmmm I though they were supposed to uphold the constitution :o
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #27 on: December 09, 2009, 06:48:51 PM »
I was right.
________________________ ________________________ _____

Justice Anthony Kennedy Puts The Country Between A Rock And A Hard Place     
Written by Vincent Gioia     
Wednesday, 02 September 2009 17:39 
 
In 2007 Justice Anthony Kennedy decided that what we exhale every second of our lives, carbon dioxide (CO2), is a pollutant. As a result of this one man's opinion, Americans will be subjected to government regulations that will change their world.

In a 5-4 decision written by Justice John Paul Stevens the U.S. Supreme Court said the language of the Clean Air Act, defining "air pollutant" is a "sweeping definition, and the greenhouse gases", namely carbon dioxide, "fit well within the definition of air pollutant." It was the vote of Anthony Kennedy, who joined with the liberal block that decided the issue; all four sensible Justices, Roberts, Alito, Scalia and Thomas, dissented.

The case concerned the refusal of the EPA in the Bush administration to use its powers under the US Clean Air Act to regulate emissions from new motor vehicles by establishing greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions standards, with a view to tackling the issue of climate change.

The EPA's grounds for refusal were that the Act did not authorize it to issue mandatory regulations to address global climate change, as it does not pose a direct health risk and, even if it had the authority to regulate, it would be neither effective nor appropriate for it to do so. The EPA's decision was challenged by various US states, nongovernmental organizations and others before the US Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit, which, by a majority, agreed that the EPA had properly exercised its discretion in denying the petition.

The petitioners then appealed to the US Supreme Court, where a majority (five to four, as said) upheld their appeal. The Supreme Court judgment deals with three important issues: (i) the standing of petitioners to challenge the EPA's decision; (ii) whether carbon dioxide (CO2) and other GHGs are air pollutants under the Act and can be regulated by the EPA; and (iii) the adequacy of the EPA's reasons for determining not to regulate GHG emissions.

Unfortunately the dissenters made there case on procedural grounds regarding whether states could legislate regarding air pollution without addressing the important matter of whether carbon dioxide is a pollutant. By deciding that states have a right to address air pollution, the majority of the Court gave the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) authority to determine if CO2 is a pollutant. The courts said that EPA has to come up with reasons that form a scientific judgment, and the reasons it gave were not in that category. So EPA acted arbitrarily and capriciously and against the Clean Air Act.

The resulting determination by the EPA was a foregone conclusion since Obama had announced during his campaign for the presidency what he would do about this issue if elected president. On October 16, 2008, Bloomberg reported that through his energy advisor, Jason Grumet, Barack Obama will classify carbon dioxide as a dangerous pollutant that can be regulated should he win the presidential election, opening the way for new rules on greenhouse gas emissions and that Obama will tell the Environmental Protection Agency that it may use the 1990 Clean Air Act to set emissions limits on power plants and manufacturers. Obama would initiate those rulemakings,'' Grumet also said in an interview in Boston. This action will halt construction plans on virtually all of the 130 proposed new U.S. coal plants.

States where coal-fired plants will be affected include Nevada, Utah, New Mexico, Texas, Montana, Minnesota, Illinois, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia, Georgia and Florida.

William Kovacs, Vice President of the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and the National Association of Manufacturers said "Once carbon dioxide is regulated, they can no longer contain the Clean Air Act...and it would completely shut the country down."

In April this year, the EPA released its finding that man-made pollution is a cause of global warming. The EPA issued its determination based on the Supreme Court's ruling that greenhouse gases, e.g. carbon dioxide, are pollutants under the Clean Air Act and must be regulated if found to be a human health danger. However there was no actual finding or evidence that carbon dioxide is a health risk. In this respect, the EPA did not follow the Supreme Court ruling, it merely made an arbitrary ruling based on the false notion that carbon dioxide causes global warming.

It is becoming increasingly clear that scientists disagree with the idea that CO2 has anything to do with global temperature changes. For example, MIT scientist, Professor Richard Lindzen, has published a paper which proves that IPCC models are overstating by 6 times, the relevance of CO2 in Earth's Atmosphere. Dr. Lindzen has found that heat is radiated out in to space at a far higher rate than any modeling system to date can account for. Professor Richard Lindzen's peer reviewed work states "we now know that the effect of CO2 on temperature is small, we know why it is small, and we know that it is having very little effect on the climate."

"The global surface temperature record, which we update and publish every month, has shown no statistically-significant "global warming" for almost 15 years. Statistically-significant global cooling has now persisted for very nearly eight years. Even a strong el Nino - expected in the coming months - will be unlikely to reverse the cooling trend."

"More significantly, the ARGO bathythermographs deployed throughout the world's oceans since 2003 show that the top 400 fathoms of the oceans, where it is agreed between all parties that at least 80% of all heat caused by manmade 'global warming' must accumulate, have been cooling over the past six years. That now prolonged ocean cooling is fatal to the 'official' theory that 'global warming' will happen on anything other than a minute scale."

In addition to carbon dioxide, the EPA said five other emissions are believed to cause warming when they concentrate in the atmosphere: methane, which is emitted by gassy cows, as well as steam boilers; nitrous oxide, found in cooking sprays and used as anesthesia by dentists, better known as laughing gas; hydro fluorocarbons, which are used in refrigerators and aerosols; per fluorocarbons, a gas permeated by fire extinguishers, refrigerators and high end ski waxes; and sulfur hexafluoride, more commonly known for its use in circuit breakers, switchgear and other electrical equipment.

This leaves Americans between the proverbial "rock and a hard place"; the EPA rule making can be circumvented by Democrats desire to enact "Cap and Trade" legislation which would itself place draconian restrictions on Americans and the economy, or let the EPA do it by simply issuing regulations.

Vincent Gioia is a retired patent attorney living in Palm Desert, California. His articles may be read at www.vincentgioia.com and he may be contacted at gioia@gte.net This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it

 

 

Kazan

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #28 on: December 09, 2009, 06:57:43 PM »
How can people that fucking stupid get appointed to the supreme court?

Hey enviro-crazies how long until there is a breathing tax? Or maybe the government will just decide there are to many of us
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #29 on: December 09, 2009, 07:00:41 PM »
How can people that fucking stupid get appointed to the supreme court?

Sotomayor? 

This is why Fedzilla needs to cut to pieces.  Its like a monster that just keeps growing and destroying everything in its wake.

Kazan

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #30 on: December 09, 2009, 07:02:10 PM »
Sotomayor? 

This is why Fedzilla needs to cut to pieces.  Its like a monster that just keeps growing and destroying everything in its wake.

America is finished, unless we the people start electing people with our and Americas best interest at heart.
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #31 on: December 09, 2009, 07:09:21 PM »
Check out this gem from today.  And people here call me paranoid and crazy?
________________________ ________________________ ________________________ -

EPA chief: U.S. making up for lost time
updated 11:30 a.m.
By Juliet Eilperin


COPENHAGEN--The United States has been "fighting to make up for lost time" in the fight against global warming since President Obama took office, Environmental Protection Agency administrator Lisa P. Jackson said Wednesday.

In the Obama administration's keynote speech at the U.N.-sponsored climate talks here, Jackson said more progress has been made in the last 11 months than what "happened in the last eight years prior" under former president George W. Bush.

Making a pitch to an international community that has demanded bolder action from Washington on climate change, Jackson detailed a list of measures ranging from stricter fuel economy standards to the promotion of renewable offshore energy projects.

But Jackson's biggest applause line came when we said she was "proud" of the EPA's declaration Monday that greenhouse gases endanger public health and welfare. "That is a decision that has been a long time coming," she said to a packed crowd in the U.S. Pavillion.

Jackson wouldn't comment publicly on the state of the U.N.-sponsored climate talks. But she has made the case for the U.S. position in a series of closed-door briefings over the last 24 hours, including meetings with Connie Hedegaard, the Danish chair of the climate conference, and Xie Zhenhua, vice-chairman of China's National Development and Reform Commision.

Jackson said she discussed with Hedegaard, who is guiding negotiations here, the significance of the greenhouse gas declaration. "No one can say we are a nation that is...a climate denier," Jackson told The Washington Post. "We are finally leading the world for us to have a united solution" to global warming.

In her session with Xie, Jackson said, she discussed how the two countries could collaborate on a new memorandum of understanding in which the U.S. has agreed to help China track its greenhouse gas emissions. "We think that's very important," she said.

Jackson said she has emphasized in her meetings that while the Obama administration will push Congress to enact legislation next year curbing greenhouse gas emissions, it will move ahead with plans to both finalize greenhouse gas rules for vehicles in March, and then curb the carbon output from large emitters like coal-fired power plants.

"We will continue to think about how the Clean Air Act applies," she said.

It's unclear whether Jackson--who also met with youth activists and African women affected by climate change, and joined deputy special envoy for climate change Jonathan Pershing in addressing more than 250 non-governmental group representatives--succeeding in convincing delegates here that the U.S. has done what it takes to help secure a global climate pact.

On Wednesday morning, Xie told Reuters the U.S. needs to lay out a more ambitious reduction target than its current proposal to cut America's emissions "in the range of 17 percent" below 2005 levels.

"I do hope that President Obama can bring a concrete contribution to Copenhagen," Xie said.

In her speech, Jackson said that in light of the scientific finding, the EPA is obligated "to take reasonable efforts to reduce greenhouse pollutants under the Clean Air Act."

In a sign of how intensely people are watching the Obama administration's actions at this conference, dozens of people gathered at the door of the small pavilion long before Jackson started speaking--only to be turned away because the room was full.

While Jackson deflected questions about the ongoing state of negotiations, she fielded several queries about Monday's endangerment decision, which she said opens the door to regulate greenhouse gas pollution under the Clean Air Act. At the same time, she said, the White House still will push Congress to produce a U.S. climate bill.
"This is not an either/or moment," Jackson said. "This is a both/and moment."
By Juliet Eilperin |  December 9, 2009; 8:05 AM ET

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THEY ARE PURPOSELY KILLING THE ECONOMY AND KILLING COAL.  I POSTED THE CLIP FROM ***** HIMSELF ADMITTING THIS AS HIS INTENTION ALL ALONG. 

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2009, 07:15:28 PM »
This just great, can't wait for my heating bill after this shit takes effect, colder than a witches tit here. On the bright side Obama will have about a snowballs chance in hell for re-election, and maybe we can get someone in there who will repeal all this bullshit.
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #33 on: December 09, 2009, 07:21:06 PM »
This just great, can't wait for my heating bill after this shit takes effect, colder than a witches tit here. On the bright side Obama will have about a snowballs chance in hell for re-election, and maybe we can get someone in there who will repeal all this bullshit.

Kazan, I get a ton of heat for some of my posts, but am I wrong?  What other conclusion can anything person come away with after reading this?

THEY WANT TO KILL THE ECONOMY AND KNOW FULL WELL WHAT THEY ARE DOING. 

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #34 on: December 09, 2009, 07:24:40 PM »
Kazan, I get a ton of heat for some of my posts, but am I wrong?  What other conclusion can anything person come away with after reading this?

THEY WANT TO KILL THE ECONOMY AND KNOW FULL WELL WHAT THEY ARE DOING. 

I know exactly what they are doing and it ain't doing what is best for America. The problem you are running into here is that people don't want to believe that their govenment would willfully try to destory their way of life. There is this attitude of it could never happen here, well America is in a handbasket and hell is right around the corner.
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2009, 07:30:01 PM »
I know exactly what they are doing and it ain't doing what is best for America. The problem you are running into here is that people don't want to believe that their govenment would willfully try to destory their way of life. There is this attitude of it could never happen here, well America is in a handbasket and hell is right around the corner.

I think you are right.  They are simply in denial that they voted for a guy who hates them and wants to lower their standard of living to that of the third world. 

Its in black and white, the only issue left is how late to the game they are.  Some of us realized from day 1 what Obama was all about.  Others are slowly cominhg around.  There are others, evidenced by this board, who are just clueless.

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2009, 07:33:18 PM »
I think you are right.  They are simply in denial that they voted for a guy who hates them and wants to lower their standard of living to that of the third world. 

Its in black and white, the only issue left is how late to the game they are.  Some of us realized from day 1 what Obama was all about.  Others are slowly cominhg around.  There are others, evidenced by this board, who are just clueless.

We would love to have OBama as president of France. We already have the Best healthcare in the world..However, he could help us in many other ways.


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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2009, 07:34:14 PM »
I think you are right.  They are simply in denial that they voted for a guy who hates them and wants to lower their standard of living to that of the third world. 

Its in black and white, the only issue left is how late to the game they are.  Some of us realized from day 1 what Obama was all about.  Others are slowly cominhg around.  There are others, evidenced by this board, who are just clueless.

I am from Illinois and I know exactly how these worthless fuckers operate in this state, Obama is an media created image. He wasn't worth shit when he was in Illinois and has proven to be just as capable as POTUS. All the crooked shit he was involved in would have destoryed anyother candidate, but somehow it all just slid off of him. I think I will start calling him the teflon President.
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2009, 07:36:08 PM »
We would love to have OBama as president of France. We already have the Best healthcare in the world..However, he could help us in many other ways.



Well if you want your economy destroyed he's your man
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Tito24

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #39 on: December 09, 2009, 07:39:17 PM »
Well if you want your economy destroyed he's your man

Our economy is worse than yours any way you slice it. However, our lifestyle is a lot better here in france. I'm glad i got out of the states, when i saw the place i work at crumble down in front of my eyes.

i don't expect American to ever recover from that event.

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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #40 on: December 09, 2009, 07:40:35 PM »
Well 33 when things really go to hell I'm in Illinois your in New York, I'll meet you half way and we can begin restoring  order starting in Columbus Ohio ;D
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Re: Obama's "Treason" At Copenhagen
« Reply #41 on: December 09, 2009, 07:41:18 PM »
Well 33 when things really go to hell I'm in Illinois your in New York, I'll meet you half way and we can begin restoring  order starting in Columbus Ohio ;D

deal