Author Topic: Why does God permit problems in your life?  (Read 4500 times)

Mr. Magoo

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2010, 06:07:04 PM »
I'm atheist, and i'm not a sinner.

All people are good to me until proven otherwise.. :-*



Ever heard of the millgram experiment or the zimbardo experiment?

I know i didnt spell it right, I just don't care enough to look up the guy's name, but it sounds like Millgram lol.

Migs

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2010, 06:24:15 PM »
According to Charles Stanley regarding problems in the lives of believers:

"..........Why did God allow th[e thorn in the flesh] issue to assail Paul, and why does He permit problems in your life?  

First, it is because He wants you to remain close to Him-and this is the manner by which He keeps you dependent upon His strength, wisdom, love and power.  

Second, this is how He maintains your freedom from pride and other destructive sins.

And third, this is the best way for Him to reveal His loving character to you-by sustaining you when all else fails."


my sister works at his cash house, er i mean  ministry.  First pride to a degree is a good thing.  Second, why cause pain to make one have to be attached to someone else.?

IrishMuscle84

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #27 on: November 07, 2010, 09:55:50 PM »
there is something, science can't explain everything religion can't either

but there is something
AGREED. GOD is just the MAN-MADE TERM for a " higher-power".

Butterbean

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2010, 06:27:27 AM »
I was referring to the path of Jesus's life. God sent Jesus to earth to preach to the world that whosoever believe in him can be saved. Let me rephrase and give an example to try to clear my point. As Jesus was speaking John 3:16, lets say that it is possible for me and you to go back in time and be there. After he said "whosoever believeth in him (Jesus) shalt have everlasting life", if we stopped him and said "Theres a guy on getbig in the year 2010 named 225for70, will he believe in you?". Jesus, if he wanted to answer, would have to say "No, he will not believe in me, he will type a post on getbig forum on whatever day in 2010 saying that I don't exist." Then my point, the puzzle that arises is, Why didn't God or Jesus do it differently where 225for70 will end up believing? The path that Jesus was on during the time he was here on earth, it follows from that path that 225for70 will NOT believe in God, because that is exactly what happened. I'm saying, is that why didn't God go along a different path, why did Jesus do everything exactly like he did knowing that 225for70 will NOT be saved? Assuming that free will exists and assuming God is all knowing and all powerful. God had the capability to create and shape the world differently where 225for70 will believe, but God didn't choose that path. Why not?

And yes, me and you can't predict whether 225for70 will believe in God before he dies, but lets assume he doesn't. I think its a safe assumption since so many people before/after 225for70 will not believe. Insert whatever non-saved person's name there.

So what your saying is that Jesus should have done separate other things for people that would not believe in Him as savior otherwise?

This parable comes to mind:

Luke 16:19-31

 "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day.  At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores  and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.  In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.  So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony.  And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

 "He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house,  for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

 "Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'

 "He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

R

Butterbean

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2010, 06:38:36 AM »
my sister works at his cash house, er i mean  ministry.  First pride to a degree is a good thing.  Second, why cause pain to make one have to be attached to someone else.?

I think he is talking about pride as a sin when it becomes destructive...not like "taking pride in doing a good job" or something like that.

Not sure why it's done that way if it is, maybe because it helps to show people they are not in full control or themselves all powerful and able to do whatever they want w/o consequences.  It seems as though the majority of people have a tendency, if not put in check occasionally, to become jagoffs which can result in them hurting themselves and others.   And once we get "spanked" He is there to receive and restore us :)
R

Mr. Magoo

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #30 on: November 08, 2010, 08:26:38 AM »
So what your saying is that Jesus should have done separate other things for people that would not believe in Him as savior otherwise?

This parable comes to mind:

Luke 16:19-31

 "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day.  At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores  and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.  In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.  So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony.  And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

 "He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house,  for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

 "Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'

 "He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "



I'm not saying he should. I'm saying by definition of him being God he could. For example, take the story about lazarus, which Ive known for a while. God knew when he sent the prophets and Moses that Lazarus's family would not believe as a result of him sending the prophets. God knew that his family would not believe. So why didn't he do different. Let's say for example that God chose not to know whether or not Lazarus's family would believe when he was sending Moses and the prophets...why would he choose not to know? If we were to ask God 10 Billion years before Moses was born, whether or not Lazrus's family would believe, God would have to say "No". The tricky part, is finding out why wouldn't they believe.

Let me put this into another context. Both examples make the same point I think. If Adam was perfect, why was he capable of disobeying God. If he was capable of committing a sin, then he wasn't perfect, right?

Butterbean

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #31 on: November 08, 2010, 10:08:28 AM »
I'm not saying he should. I'm saying by definition of him being God he could. For example, take the story about lazarus, which Ive known for a while. God knew when he sent the prophets and Moses that Lazarus's family would not believe as a result of him sending the prophets. God knew that his family would not believe. So why didn't he do different. Let's say for example that God chose not to know whether or not Lazarus's family would believe when he was sending Moses and the prophets...why would he choose not to know? If we were to ask God 10 Billion years before Moses was born, whether or not Lazrus's family would believe, God would have to say "No". The tricky part, is finding out why wouldn't they believe.


I think we agree that God could "make" someone believe if He wanted to.  As to why He doesn't...I guess that's where the free will comes into play.


Let me put this into another context. Both examples make the same point I think. If Adam was perfect, why was he capable of disobeying God. If he was capable of committing a sin, then he wasn't perfect, right?

He was "good" until he purposely chose to disobey God.  Why didn't God limit our choices to not allow us to sin?  I guess in some way having all choices available makes us more free personally.  Do I wish we hadn't had the choice to sin?  Sure!  But God is God...an omniscient being.  He knows everything and I don't. 
R

Butterbean

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #32 on: November 08, 2010, 10:15:25 AM »
Magoo I finally found that one thread I said I'd look for..sorry it took so long!

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=169238.0

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Mr. Magoo

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #33 on: November 08, 2010, 10:17:20 AM »
I think we agree that God could "make" someone believe if He wanted to.  As to why He doesn't...I guess that's where the free will comes into play.

He was "good" until he purposely chose to disobey God.  Why didn't God limit our choices to not allow us to sin?  I guess in some way having all choices available makes us more free personally.  Do I wish we hadn't had the choice to sin?  Sure!  But God is God...an omniscient being.  He knows everything and I don't.  

If free will causes people to go to hell, then why should we have it?

We could discuss how much of a "choice" it was of Adams to disobey God.

 If all choices are available to us, including bad ones, and we (as humans) choose bad ones, and are damned to eternity, then what's the good of being "free"?

Yes God would know why evil exists since he created it (I disagree with common christians that attribute evil to other forces besides God, I find that pathway undermines the almighty power of God and puts creation powers into another being separate from God, don't you?). Why did he create us with the capability to question the point of evil if it causes some to disbelieve?

I think all we can resort to, is admitting that we don't know, and despite not knowing, still continue.

Mr. Magoo

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Re: Why does God permit problems in your life?
« Reply #34 on: November 08, 2010, 10:20:19 AM »
Magoo I finally found that one thread I said I'd look for..sorry it took so long!

http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=169238.0



thanks for the link, It's a little long and I don't have time to read it now, I'll read it later and respond